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  1. #1
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Sooner in Tampa's Avatar
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    Post Obama is off the rails

    I found this on our 'liberal' paper's site (Tampa Bay Times)...it comes from the NY Times.

    I am sure 8th will dispute every thing in the article, but even the libs are fed up with his sh!t

    They say failure can be a good teacher, but, so far, the Obama administration is opting out of the course. The postmidterm period has been one of the most bizarre of the Obama presidency. President Barack Obama has racked up some impressive foreign policy accomplishments, but, domestically and politically, things are off the rails.
    Usually presidents use midterm defeats as a chance to rethink and refocus. That's what Obama did four years ago. Voters like to feel the president is listening to them.

    But Obama's done no public rethinking. In his postelection news conference, the president tried to reframe the defeat by saying the turnout was low, as if it was the Republicans' fault that the Democrats could only mobilize their core base. Throughout that conference, the president seemed to detach himself from his own party, as if the Democrats who lost their jobs because of him were a bunch of far-off victims of some ethereal malaise.

    Usually presidents at the end of their terms get less partisan, not more. But with his implied veto threat of the Keystone XL oil pipeline, Obama seems intent on showing that Democrats, too, can put partisanship above science. Keystone XL has been studied to the point of exhaustion, and the evidence overwhelmingly suggests that it's a modest but good idea. The latest State Department study found that it would not significantly worsen the environment. The oil's going to come out anyway, and it's greener to transport it by pipeline than by train. The economic impact isn't huge, but at least there'd be a $5.3 billion infrastructure project.


    Usually presidents with a new congressional majority try to figure out if there is anything that the two branches can do together. The governing Republicans have a strong incentive to pass legislation. The obvious thing is to start out with the easiest things, if only to show that Washington can function on some elemental level.

    But the White House has not privately engaged with Congress on the legislative areas where there could be agreement. Instead, the president has been superaggressive on the one topic sure to blow everything up: the executive order to rewrite the nation's immigration laws.

    The president was in no rush to issue this order through 2014, when it might have been politically risky. He questioned whether had the constitutional authority to do this through most of his first term, when he said that an executive order of this sort would probably be illegal.

    But now the president is in a rush and is convinced he has authority. I sympathize with what Obama is trying to do substantively, but the process of how it's being done is ruinous.
    Republicans would rightly take it as a calculated insult and yet more political ineptitude. Everybody would go into warfare mode. We'll get two more years of dysfunction that will further arouse public disgust and antigovernment fervor (making a Republican presidency more likely).

    This move would also make it much less likely that we'll have immigration reform anytime soon. White House officials are often misinformed on what Republicans are privately discussing, so they don't understand that many in the Republican Party are trying to find a way to get immigration reform out of the way. This executive order would destroy their efforts.
    The move would further destabilize the legitimacy of government. Redefining the legal status of 5 million or 6 million human beings is a big deal. This is the sort of change we have a legislative process for. To do something this seismic with the stroke of one man's pen is dangerous.

    Instead of a nation of laws, we could slowly devolve into a nation of diktats, with each president relying on and revoking different measures on the basis of unilateral power — creating unstable swings from one presidency to the next. If Obama enacts this order on the transparently flimsy basis of "prosecutorial discretion," he's inviting future presidents to use similarly flimsy criteria. Talk about defining constitutional deviancy down.


    I'm not sure why the Obama administration has been behaving so strangely since the midterms. Maybe various people in the White House are angry in defeat and want to show that they can be as obstructionist as anyone. Maybe, in moments of stress, they are only really sensitive to criticism from the left flank. Maybe it's Gruberism: the belief that everybody else is slightly dumber and less well-motivated than oneself and, therefore, politics is more about manipulation than conversation.

    Whatever it is, it's been a long journey from the Iowa caucuses in early 2008 to the pre-emptive obstruction of today. I wonder if, postpresidency, Obama will look back and regret that he got sucked into the very emotional maelstrom he set out to destroy.

    © 2014 New York Times


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  2. #2
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    I'm curious as to the author of that piece's name. There are more than a few
    of his points that I'd argue about....I'm not sure that he listened to the same
    prez presser that I did.

    The immigration issue, probably, Obama should not press. He really should give
    the Pubs a chance to show they can govern. Keystone....pluses...$5.6 billion
    infrastructure project and about 2000 construction jobs...minuses....only about
    50 or so permanent jobs...a 1170 mile blight on the landscape...the potential for
    big time environmental damages...nearly all the oil transported will go elsewhere...
    When the tar sand oil plays out, we'll still have the 1170 mile blight on the landscape.
    At least, if rail/truck transport were used, we wouldn't have that. Short term, I can
    see the advantages...long term, not so much.

    One area I'm not certain of, does anyone know if the property taxes generated when
    the pipleline is in use carries forward when it no longer is active?

  3. #3
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member FaninAma's Avatar
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    At the current rate of production the oil from the Tar Sands will last 170 years. 25% of the oil transported will be from US production. If the pipeline becomes obsolete or is no longer used I suspect the same thing will happen to it that happened to thousands of miles of railroad line no longer being used....it will be disassembled and recycled for the metal.

    I am in favor of any measure that will make us less dependent on foreign sources of oil....especially oil from the Middle East and Russia. I don't care how many jobs it will directly produce. If it lowers the priice of oil then it will produce an imeasurable number of jobs indirectly through increased economic activity.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athabasca_oil_sands
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  4. #4
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 Skysooner's Avatar
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Quote Originally Posted by FaninAma View Post
    At the current rate of production the oil from the Tar Sands will last 170 years. 25% of the oil transported will be from US production. If the pipeline becomes obsolete or is no longer used I suspect the same thing will happen to it that happened to thousands of miles of railroad line no longer being used....it will be disassembled and recycled for the metal.

    I am in favor of any measure that will make us less dependent on foreign sources of oil....especially oil from the Middle East and Russia. I don't care how many jobs it will directly produce. If it lowers the priice of oil then it will produce an imeasurable number of jobs indirectly through increased economic activity.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Athabasca_oil_sands
    Absolutely agree and Rock On, truck and rail is quite a bit more dangerous to the environment. My company deals with it every day getting oil out of Colorado.
    Metaphors be with you!

  5. #5
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    But the pipeline will cost Barack's buddy Warren Buffet a bunch of money----BNSF will lose the rail movement---How is a pipeline a blight on the landscape?

  6. #6
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Landrieu's trying to save her fat *** on cspan right now.

    http://www.c-span.org/video/?322766-...ne-debate&live


    It will be funny of Obama vetoes keystone and further sinks her azz.

  7. #7
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Maybe construction is different that it was when I was younger. Every major
    line I saw then was a wide swath through farm/ranch land taken, in many cases,
    through eminent domain and later abandoned, with no effort to reclaim the land.
    The pix I've seen of construction now looks even more destructive. The pipelines
    run by this group have multiple leaks every year. Is the new route for Keystone
    still over the Ogallala Aquafier(sp?) or has it been rerouted? I'm ambivalent on
    the issue....I really have environmental concerns, but I can see the other side,
    as well.

    I'm all for getting free of oil imports, too. I didn't know the Tar Sands had a 170
    year life expectancy, but that oil is not going to the U.S., as I understand it. And,
    I doubt that Buffet is concerned...he just bought Duracell Batteries to add to his
    diversification. Hell, it's a big conundrum...don't know the answer....

  8. #8
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Quote Originally Posted by rock on sooner View Post
    Maybe construction is different that it was when I was younger. Every major
    line I saw then was a wide swath through farm/ranch land taken, in many cases,
    through eminent domain and later abandoned, with no effort to reclaim the land.
    The pix I've seen of construction now looks even more destructive. The pipelines
    run by this group have multiple leaks every year. Is the new route for Keystone
    still over the Ogallala Aquafier(sp?) or has it been rerouted? I'm ambivalent on
    the issue....I really have environmental concerns, but I can see the other side,
    as well.

    I'm all for getting free of oil imports, too. I didn't know the Tar Sands had a 170
    year life expectancy, but that oil is not going to the U.S., as I understand it. And,
    I doubt that Buffet is concerned...he just bought Duracell Batteries to add to his
    diversification. Hell, it's a big conundrum...don't know the answer....
    ---There are tens of thousands of miles of pipeline over the aquifer and have been for 50-70 years. For the most part you cannot tell a pipeline is even in a field---The farmers will just keep on farming

  9. #9
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Fellows, The Keystone pipeline is a minor part of that op-ed piece.
    The meat of it is how the president is considering pardoning millions of criminals.

    I personally think he has lost it. Did you see him walking into the Asian conference chewing gum? I couldn't believe it. Doesn't he have any handlers at all?

  10. #10
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Keystone bill fails. Adios landrieu.

  11. #11
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    She was gone anyway----probably be some help keeping the price of oil up

  12. #12
    Sooner All-World olevetonahill's Avatar
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Quote Originally Posted by okie52 View Post
    Keystone bill fails. Adios landrieu.
    Needed ONE vote.
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  13. #13
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREX View Post
    She was gone anyway----probably be some help keeping the price of oil up
    Yeah...she was probably toast once it got to a runoff....glad to see her fat azz gone ( I hope).

  14. #14
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Quote Originally Posted by olevetonahill View Post
    Needed ONE vote.
    Obama was probably going to veto it anyway...keystone has been under consideration for 6 years but he hasn't moved on it even after the EPA said it will have no environmental impact...yet he says he has waited long enough on immigration ( 6 years) so he's going it alone.

  15. #15
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Quote Originally Posted by okie52 View Post
    Obama was probably going to veto it anyway...keystone has been under consideration for 6 years but he hasn't moved on it even after the EPA said it will have no environmental impact...yet he says he has waited long enough on immigration ( 6 years) so he's going it alone.
    ---Its a joke---It will have no impact on the environment and lower gasoline prices. Lets see that would have helped the poorer people in the country----Wonder why Barack hates poor people?

  16. #16
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Quote Originally Posted by REDREX View Post
    ---Its a joke---It will have no impact on the environment and lower gasoline prices. Lets see that would have helped the poorer people in the country----Wonder why Barack hates poor people?
    He even hates poor members of his own family.

  17. #17
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Quote Originally Posted by BigTip View Post
    Fellows, The Keystone pipeline is a minor part of that op-ed piece.
    The meat of it is how the president is considering pardoning millions of criminals.

    I personally think he has lost it. Did you see him walking into the Asian conference chewing gum? I couldn't believe it. Doesn't he have any handlers at all?
    Just like REAGAN and HW BUSH did....just sayin'. Chewing gum again, WOW. Hey, are you going to bitch about the color of his suit?

  18. #18
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    I hope Barack does it----It will do nothing but **** off a lot of voters---And then he will lose in court

  19. #19
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    I do too. Just push the public behind the new congress

  20. #20
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    Re: Obama is off the rails

    Quote Originally Posted by olevetonahill View Post
    Needed ONE vote.
    Now, fellas, as I sit here, bored out of my skull, watching, for the 87th
    time, Roadhouse, I want y'all to keep in mind that havin' yer own way
    in Congress, (till it gets to the WH) is a recipe for disaster. Obama may
    be stubborn and hell bent for "back atcha", you need to remember that,
    many, many times what goes around comes around! Jus sayin' from an
    ol' f...ella....heh...

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