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Thread: Go Figure

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    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 I Am Right's Avatar
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    Go Figure

    Here's a new twist to the annual "War on Christmas" debate: Reminders of Christmas can make religious minorities feel ill at ease - even if they don't realize it.

    When people who did not celebrate Christmas or who did not identify as Christian filled out surveys about their moods while in the same room as a small Christmas tree, they reported less self-assurance and fewer positive feelings than if they hadn't been reminded of the holiday, according to a new study.

    The university students didn't know the study was about Christmas, said study researcher Michael Schmitt, a social psychologist at Simon Fraser University in British Columbia, Canada. Nonetheless, he said, the presence of the tree caused non-celebrators and non-Christians to feel subtly excluded.

    "Simply having this 12-inch Christmas tree in the room with them made them feel less included in the university as a whole, which to me is a pretty powerful effect from one 12-inch Christmas tree in one psychology lab," Schmitt told LiveScience.

    The researchers reported their results in November in the Journal of Experimental Social Psychology.

    Oh, Christmas tree...

    Schmitt, who celebrates Christmas, was motivated to do the study by the now-yearly debates over Christmas decorations in public spaces. As a social psychologist, he said, it occurred to him that he could provide data on the effect of decorations, "rather than people just sort of speculating."

    Previous studies have shown that the environment can have significant effects on people's moods and preferences. In one 2009 study published in the Journal of Personality and Social Psychology, researchers found that women report less interest in computer science after being exposed to stereotypically masculine, "geeky" rooms.

    Schmitt and his colleagues took a similar approach to the Christmas study. They asked participants to fill out surveys about themselves while sitting in either a nondescript room or a room with a small Christmas tree. [Read: Christmas Eel Makes Tree Lights Electric]

    In the first study, the researchers recruited student volunteers who had answered questions months earlier about which holidays they celebrated. Thirty Christmas celebrators and 22 non-celebrators took part in the study, which occurred around Christmastime.

    The researchers then repeated the study with 16 Buddhist students, 19 Sikh students and 47 Christian students.

    Most wonderful time of the year?

    In both versions of the study, the Christmas tree failed to spread holiday cheer equally. Non-celebrators reported fewer positive feelings and less self-assurance in the Christmas room. Christians and celebrators, on the other hand, were mostly cheered by the tree, with one exception: Celebrators reported feeling more guilt when they were in the Christmas room. That finding suggests that even for Christmas-lovers, the holiday can be stressful, Schmitt said.

    The religious minorities and non-celebrators weren't looking to be offended by reminders of Christmas, the study found. After the surveys, the researchers explained the goal of the experiment to the volunteers and asked each of them how they thought the presence of the tree might affect their mood. There was no difference between the responses of Christians and non-Christians or celebrators and non-celebrators. All thought Christmas decorations would make them happier.

    "Maybe it's a subtle effect, and they weren't really aware that the tree is affecting them," Schmitt said. They may also be embarrassed or unwilling to admit that a Christmas tree could make them grumpy, he said.

    (Don't) deck the halls

    Schmitt emphasizes that he's not interested in being the Grinch who stole Christmas. Still, he said, the majority should take a closer look at how its symbols affect minorities.

    "I don't think it's really going to undermine anyone's experience of Christmas to tone it down," he said. "We're not suggesting 'no Christmas' or 'no Christmas displays at all,' but in contexts where we really do value respecting and including diversity in terms of religion, the safest option is not to have these kinds of displays."

    Another option is to include other religious traditions in holiday displays, Schmitt said. The researchers didn't investigate the effect of minority religious symbols on people in the majority; however, they wrote, previous research suggests that because these symbols are less frequent and less symbolic of the culture at large, the effect should be minimal.

    Schmitt said he's used to getting negative reactions to the study.

    "I understand why it might feel threatening to people," he said. "But I think if people do care about making a whole range of different kinds of people in our increasingly diverse society feel included and respected, then we can make some small changes... that would go a long way toward creating a more multicultural or inclusive society."

    What is a minority religious symbol?

  2. #2
    Sooner All-World olevetonahill's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    They need to take the 12 inch tree and shove it up the Non celebrating subjects asses Maybe they will feel good then
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    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 AlboSooner's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    In our quest to root out paganism, we Christians made up December 25th as the day of Jesus' birth. We replaced the pagan winter solace with Christmas, when in reality Jesus couldn't have been born in the winter, and only sinners celebrated birthdays in Jesus' time.

    However, a tree should not make anybody feel inadequate. That's just weird.

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    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 soonerchk's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    I don't think I know anyone who doesn't celebrate Christmas whether they happen to be Christian or not. I'll have to make them all uncomfortable over something else.
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    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 soonercruiser's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Quote Originally Posted by olevetonahill View Post
    They need to take the 12 inch tree and shove it up the Non celebrating subjects asses Maybe they will feel good then
    They need to remind the non-celebrants that when they do celebrate their own holidays, it makes the rest of us feel uneasy.
    PSYCHOBABBLE!

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    Sooner Benchwarmer Ctina's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    They can come to my house. I haven't put the tree up the last few years.

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    SoonerFans.com Elite Member KABOOKIE's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Surprisingly though the study found that if the 12" Christmas tree was replaced with a small trophy that said, "WE ARE ALL WINNERS", their self-esteem quadrupled.

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    Sooner All-World olevetonahill's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Quote Originally Posted by KABOOKIE View Post
    Surprisingly though the study found that if the 12" Christmas tree was replaced with a small trophy that said, "WE ARE ALL WINNERS", their self-esteem quadrupled.
    Kinda makes ya think of T-ball dont it
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    Stayatworkdad yermom's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Christmas sucks. Christmas trees are gay pagan symbols repurposed.

    as far as i'm concerned, "the most wonderful time of the year" is Capital One's Bowl Week

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    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 47straight's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Quote Originally Posted by AlboSooner View Post
    In our quest to root out paganism, we Christians made up December 25th as the day of Jesus' birth. We replaced the pagan winter solace with Christmas, when in reality Jesus couldn't have been born in the winter, and only sinners celebrated birthdays in Jesus' time.

    However, a tree should not make anybody feel inadequate. That's just weird.
    If only the winter solstice was on Dec 25.
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    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 47straight's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    If anyone feels that left out, or whatever by the celebration of Christmas, they're more than welcome to go work my job on Dec 25 so I can keep having the day off and won't get behind. Or carry the mail, I sure would like some delivery on Christmas Day.
    “Some people who attend the University of Oklahoma seem to represent different values than some people who attend the University of Texas.” -- Mr. J. Mcfarland

    "[Christian Scott]'s off the team the day of the incident and I guarantee you he won't be back." -- Typical Dallas horn fan

  12. #12

    Re: Go Figure

    These Christmas trees have strange, unfathomable power. I must possess it and bend it to my will.
    Thaumaturge

  13. #13
    Stayatworkdad yermom's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Quote Originally Posted by 47straight View Post
    If only the winter solstice was on Dec 25.
    if only Christmas was contained to Dec. 25

  14. #14
    Soon to be Memphibian

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    Re: Go Figure

    Huh. I'm an atheist and the three christmas trees I have in my place aren't making me feel inadequate in the least. They're small, though. Perhaps if they were bigger they'd make me feel bad.
    "The choices we discern as having been made in the Constitutional Convention impose burdens on governmental proceses that often seem clumsy, inefficient, even unworkable, but those hard choices were consciously made by men who had lived under a form of government that permitted arbitrary governmental acts to go unchecked." INS v. Chadha, 462 U.S. 919 (1983) (Burger, C.J.)

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    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Leroy Lizard's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    If I move to Syria, I would be surrounded by Islamic celebrations. I would accept it and understand it. And it wouldn't make me go psychotic.
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    SoonerFans.com Elite Member The's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Quote Originally Posted by Leroy Lizard View Post
    If I move to Syria, I would be surrounded by Islamic celebrations. I would accept it and understand it. And it wouldn't make me go psychotic.
    I think this is proof of the original post.
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    Stayatworkdad yermom's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Quote Originally Posted by Leroy Lizard View Post
    If I move to Syria, I would be surrounded by Islamic celebrations. I would accept it and understand it. And it wouldn't make me go psychotic.
    would you enjoy having them around though?

    the study is about subtle, unconscious effects, not psychosis, i'm sure you know the difference

    btw, i hated Christmas way before i was an atheist

  18. #18
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Leroy Lizard's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Quote Originally Posted by yermom View Post
    would you enjoy having them around though?
    Wouldn't bother me a bit, as long as I was free to celebrate my own religions in my own way. (That probably wouldn't happen in Syria.)

    Now, if there is something I truly hate about Christmas it's the music. Yet I don't expect people to "tone it down" on my account. My problems with Christmas music are not everyone else's problems.

    I am curious to know the sample size of the study, and whether asking non-Christians to identify their religious preference during the Holiday season had a larger impact on their mood than the presence of the Christmas tree. Was that effect compensated?

    BTW, if you want to see a healthy attitude toward Christmas, check out the story of the electric eel used to power a Christmas tree in Japan.

    http://www.livescience.com/environme...-electric.html
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  19. #19
    Stayatworkdad yermom's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    you can say it wouldn't bother you, but would you enjoy hearing "Happy Ramadan" or whatever every day?

  20. #20
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Leroy Lizard's Avatar
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    Re: Go Figure

    Quote Originally Posted by yermom View Post
    you can say it wouldn't bother you, but would you enjoy hearing "Happy Ramadan" or whatever every day?
    I wouldn't even enjoy hearing "Jingle Bells" every day, but so what? People get bugged about all kinds of crazy ****. Since when did everyone become so concerned about it? No one seems to be overly concerned about my problems with Christmas music. Why should we care about other people's problems with Christmas trees?

    Oh, in this case it's about Christmas. If something is related to CHRISTmas, it's a serious problem that we must study.

    Just as an example, many in my church hate seeing themes related to Halloween because of its pagan roots. You think anyone cares about their misgivings? No, because they're Christians.

    So, as long as we are more than willing to stick jack-o-lanterns in stores near Halloween, I see no problem with raising Christmas trees during Christmas. Kindly explain the difference.
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