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    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Okla-homey's Avatar
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    Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    April 12, 1861 Fort Sumter fired upon.



    At 4:30 a.m., 149 years ago this morning, the American Civil War begins when South Carolina secessionist forces fire on Fort Sumter in Charleston Harbor. The United States became a fundamentally different place at the war's end.

    The fort had been the source of tension between the Union and infant Confederacy for several months. After South Carolina seceded, the state demanded the fort be turned over but Union officials refused. A Federal supply ship, "Star of the West," tried to reach Fort Sumter on January 9 to resupply the besieged Sumter garrison, but a shore battery manned by Citadel cadets opened fire and drove it away.

    For both sides, Sumter was a symbol of sovereignty. The Union could not allow it to fall to the Confederates, although throughout the Deep South other federal installations had been seized. For South Carolinians, secession meant little if the hated Yankees still held the stronghold.

    The issue hung in the air when Abraham Lincoln took the oath of office on March 4, putting secessionists on notice in his inauguration address: "You can have no conflict without being yourselves the aggressors."


    US Major Robert Anderson, 2d US Heavy Artillery, commander of the Ft Sumter garrison

    The Confederate Congress meeting at the Confederacy's first capital in Montgomery, Alabama, had decided on February 15 that Sumter and other forts must be acquired "either by negotiation or force." Negotiation, it seemed, had failed. The Confederates demanded surrender of the fort, but the loyal son of the South, US Major Robert Anderson of Kentucky, commander of Fort Sumter, refused.

    At 4:30 a.m. on April 12, the Confederate guns opened fire. For thirty-three hours, the shore batteries lobbed 4,000 shells in the direction of the fort.


    Eight times during the bombardment Sumter's flagpole had been hit without serious injury; but at near 2 P.M. that day the pole was shot off near the peak and the flag fell among the gleaming cinders. Lieutenant Hall rescued the precious bunting before it took fire. Sergeant Peter Hart shinnied up the pole, and nailed it in place it amid deadly shot and shell, where the scarred banner was kept flying defiantly.

    Finally, the garrison inside the battered fort raised the white flag. No one on either side had been killed, although two US soldiers died on April 12th when the departing soldiers fired a gun salute, and some cartridges exploded prematurely. It was a nearly bloodless beginning to America's bloodiest war.


    After the bombardment and departure of US forces, the new Confederate flag waves defiantly over the shattered fort. It would fly there until February 19, 1865 when US forces re-entered the fort after Charleston was evacuated by Confederate forces who were hastily and futiley flung in the path of Sherman's forces moving through the state


    Ft Sumter is administered by the National Park Service. It may be visited by a short boat ride from the city of Charleston. To get a sense of how much damage the fort sustained during the Civil War, realize that in 1861, the brick walls extended to the height of the smaller flagpoles ringing the tall flagpole seen in this photo. The black concrete emplacement in the fort's center is a late 19th century leftover when the fort was reinforced and equippied with modern coast artillery to defend against invasion during the run-up to the Spanish American War.


    One of the coolest things your correspondent has ever done was on 19 Feb. 2005, when he took part in a reenactment of the Federal re-occupation of Ft Sumter. A group of 89 living historians from literally all over the US camped on Morris Island across the channel from Ft Sumter and on the morning of 19 Feb. rowed across the channel in period rowboats to occupy Ft Sumter while portraying the company of the 52d Pennsylvania Volunteer Infantry who did it the first time exactly 140 years earlier.

    Enduring Legacy of the Civil War

    The now deceased Civil War historian and native Mississipian Shelby Foote probably explained the impact of the Civil War in the fewest yet most powerful and accurate terms when he said,
    "Before the Civil War, people referred to the country as 'These United States,' after the war, people began to refer to the newly reformed nation as 'The United States.'"
    IOW, for good or bad, the constitutional debate over the issue of "states rights" was settled once and for all.

    Shortly after conclusion of the war, the XIII - XV amendments to the Constitution were ratified and became the law of the land. Slavery was forever outlawed in the "Land of the Free," newly freed slaves were given the right to vote, and the original "Bill of Rights" Fifth Amendment notion that no American could be denied his life, liberty or property without due process of law was applied to the action of state governments. Further, the XIVth made law the principle that no state could deny its residents the rights enjoyed by all US citizens under the Constitution.

    Finally, citizenship acquired by birth in the United States was made a Constitutional principle (XIVth Amendment) -- a matter which today is a source of friction as we struggle with the immigration issue and what to do about the minor children born of illegal migrants in the US when/if their non-citizen parents face deportation.

    "Discourage litigation. Persuade your neighbors to compromise whenever they can. Point out to them how the nominal winner is often a real loser; in fees, expenses and waste of time." -- Abraham Lincoln, (1809-1865) Lawyer and President who saved the United States.

    "Without opportunities on the part of the poor to obtain expert legal advice, it is idle to talk of equality before the law"-- Justice Chas. Evans Hughes

  2. #2
    Stayatworkdad yermom's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever


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    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Okla-homey's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Quote Originally Posted by yermom View Post
    Yee Haw! The South is Gonna Rise Agin!

    And right here in Oklahoma, Kernel Randy Brogdan is gonna lead our great state out of the Federal wilderness and into the Light by seceding from the US. We'll be the Republic of Oklahoma. Or something.

    Too bad about having to give back Ft. Sill, Tinker AFB, Vance AFB, Altus AFB, and the big Army depot at Muskogee. And the Federal highway dollars. And the Social Security checks and Medicare payments.

    But we'll be FREE! WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!
    "Discourage litigation. Persuade your neighbors to compromise whenever they can. Point out to them how the nominal winner is often a real loser; in fees, expenses and waste of time." -- Abraham Lincoln, (1809-1865) Lawyer and President who saved the United States.

    "Without opportunities on the part of the poor to obtain expert legal advice, it is idle to talk of equality before the law"-- Justice Chas. Evans Hughes

  4. #4
    Stayatworkdad yermom's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    then will Oklahoma be This United State?

  5. #5

    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Quote Originally Posted by Okla-homey View Post
    And right here in Oklahoma, Kernel Randy Brogdan is gonna lead our great state out of the Federal wilderness and into the Light by seceding from the US.
    God willing.
    "They are survivors. Come the apocalypse, the only thing left standing will be a handful of cockroaches and Bob Stoops and his Sooner squad." -hornfans-

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    SoonerFans.com Elite Member TUSooner's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Quote Originally Posted by Okla-homey View Post
    Yee Haw! The South is Gonna Rise Agin!

    And right here in Oklahoma, Kernel Randy Brogdan is gonna lead our great state out of the Federal wilderness and into the Light by seceding from the US. We'll be the Republic of Oklahoma. Or something.

    Too bad about having to give back Ft. Sill, Tinker AFB, Vance AFB, Altus AFB, and the big Army depot at Muskogee. And the Federal highway dollars. And the Social Security checks and Medicare payments.

    But we'll be FREE! WHEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!
    That's the best retort in awhile to the anarcho-libertarian conservatives around here whose sole political thought and guiding principle is "all gub'ment is really bad and marxist and stuff, duh."
    You tell me it's the institution. Well, you know, you'd better free your mind instead.
    (Shoo-bee doo-wah)

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    SoonerFans.com Elite Member delhalew's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Secession is nothing more than a last ditch check against against an oppressive federal government. It is not evil, just sad.
    Brogden should be focusing the state legislature on backing the calls for an article 5 convention if he wants to reinstate states rights, and remind the federal government this is a voluntary union of independent states.
    "Once a country boy's seen the way the steam rises off a man's insides on the sidewalk Tends to change the way he thinks, the way he sees everything when he goes back to where he came from."

    POSSE TRANSPORTATION SPECIALIST. "It Fell Off the Back of a Truck."

  8. #8
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Quote Originally Posted by delhalew View Post
    Secession is nothing more than a last ditch check against against an oppressive federal government. It is not evil, just sad.
    Brogden should be focusing the state legislature on backing the calls for an article 5 convention if he wants to reinstate states rights, and remind the federal government this is a voluntary union of independent states.
    He'll fit that in between mandating Jesus rode a dinosaur and stopping adults from drinking cold beer. STATES RIIIIIIGGGGGGHHHHHHHTTTTTTTTSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!
    Boomer Sooner

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    SoonerFans.com Elite Member delhalew's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Quote Originally Posted by soonerscuba View Post
    He'll fit that in between mandating Jesus rode a dinosaur and stopping adults from drinking cold beer. STATES RIIIIIIGGGGGGHHHHHHHTTTTTTTTSSSSSS!!!!!!!!!!
    That's the thing about states rights. You'd have to get off your *** and force your state legislature to allow for that cold beer. That's the kind off change you have zero chance of affecting in a federal sense.
    "Once a country boy's seen the way the steam rises off a man's insides on the sidewalk Tends to change the way he thinks, the way he sees everything when he goes back to where he came from."

    POSSE TRANSPORTATION SPECIALIST. "It Fell Off the Back of a Truck."

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    SoonerFans.com Elite Member JohnnyMack's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Quote Originally Posted by delhalew View Post
    That's the thing about states rights. You'd have to get off your *** and force your state legislature to allow for that cold beer. That's the kind off change you have zero chance of affecting in a federal sense.
    I don't have enough cash to give my state rep the kind of kickbacks that the liquor lobby can dole out though.

  11. #11
    Yacht Rocker

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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Maybe if we promised Brogdon that we'd shun some heathens...

  12. #12
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Okla-homey's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Quote Originally Posted by TUSooner View Post
    That's the best retort in awhile to the anarcho-libertarian conservatives around here whose sole political thought and guiding principle is "all gub'ment is really bad and marxist and stuff, duh."
    And that's not to mention having to negotiate treaties will all the tribes in Oklahoma who have treaties with the United States and are protected by Federal statutes. In fact, most of the tribes have mutual-defense pacts with the US. Therefore, if the newly-seceded Republic of Oklahoma tried any funny stuff, in come's the cavalry. And this time, it would be to protect the Indians.

    That alone should dim Brogdon-esque delusions
    "Discourage litigation. Persuade your neighbors to compromise whenever they can. Point out to them how the nominal winner is often a real loser; in fees, expenses and waste of time." -- Abraham Lincoln, (1809-1865) Lawyer and President who saved the United States.

    "Without opportunities on the part of the poor to obtain expert legal advice, it is idle to talk of equality before the law"-- Justice Chas. Evans Hughes

  13. #13
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member TopDawg's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    The international student population at OU would sky-rocket. Students could study abroad over the summer by going back home and taking courses at Tarrant County Community College.

  14. #14
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member tommieharris91's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Quote Originally Posted by delhalew View Post
    Secession is nothing more than a last ditch check against against an oppressive federal government. It is not evil, just sad.
    Brogden should be focusing the state legislature on backing the calls for an article 5 convention if he wants to reinstate states rights, and remind the federal government this is a voluntary union of independent states.
    The SCOTUS says "You're wrong."
    "If your dream ain't bigger than you, there's a problem with your dream." -Deion Sanders

  15. #15
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member delhalew's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    Quote Originally Posted by tommieharris91 View Post
    My scrotum knows more about the constitution than SCOTUS.
    They gave that up in favor of case law and precident long ago.
    "Once a country boy's seen the way the steam rises off a man's insides on the sidewalk Tends to change the way he thinks, the way he sees everything when he goes back to where he came from."

    POSSE TRANSPORTATION SPECIALIST. "It Fell Off the Back of a Truck."

  16. #16
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member delhalew's Avatar
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    Re: Good Morning...America Changes Forever

    That was me popping off for fun BTW. I now see you referrenced Texas V White. When I get time to properly address that, I'll get back with you.
    I take it you are saying that Texas v White somehow disallows secession.
    "Once a country boy's seen the way the steam rises off a man's insides on the sidewalk Tends to change the way he thinks, the way he sees everything when he goes back to where he came from."

    POSSE TRANSPORTATION SPECIALIST. "It Fell Off the Back of a Truck."

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