State of the health care legislation

[Okla-homey]

as near as I can tell, both houses have declared the "public option" dead.
For those not down with the current lingo, "public option" is donk-speak for gubmint provided healthcare.

That's right, Harry and Nancy couldn't deliver the goods. Therefore, the remaining controversial sections are those that make not having health insurance a criminal act punishable by a fine of up to $25K and/or a up to a year in the hoosegow.

Methinks that part ain't constitutional anyway, but there it is. For those legal scholars in the crowd, I know, the "commerce" clause in the Constitution has been stretched like a fat lady's sweat pants to make a lot of kooky gubmint meddling legal, but, that don't make it right.

After all, this may be the first instance of the federal gubmint making us pay money just because we are alive. Anyhoo, it's illegal to drive without liability insurance in this state, yet one one in three Okies blow it off. We'll see how it goes. I wonder how they'll enforce it? You show up at the ER without your insurance card and they turn you in to the federal fuzz?

As to the part requiring insurance to cover more pre-existing conditions and making it tough to drop an insured...that part will end up making all our premiums higher, but, we'll have a nice warm feeling knowing fewer people will have to file Ch. 7 when faced with health bills they can't pay. Which is a little pink, if not outright red, but there you have it. You know, that whole collective good chestnut.

[Chuck Bao]

That would be a pity. I somehow thought that the public option was health insurance provided by the government and that would mean that the private insurance companies couldn't get away with raising premiums. I guess I was terribly mistaken. Dang.

[Okla-homey]

That would be a pity. I somehow thought that the public option was health insurance provided by the government and that would mean that the private insurance companies couldn't get away with raising premiums. I guess I was terribly mistaken. Dang.

that was the whole point. Drive folks to the public option until private insurers couldn't remain profitable because their risk pool dried-up.

[Sooner_Havok]

that was the whole point. Drive folks to the public option until private insurers couldn't remain profitable because their risk pool dried-up.

I never got that. If the public option sucked, why would anyone take it? If I have good insurance, and I can get gubment insurance for $100-200 less but it is ****. Why would I take the cheaper, crappier option?

I thought the public option was for people who couldn't get insurance in the first place.

[JLEW1818]

WE DON'T NEED THE ****ING GOVT TO GIVE US ****


errr lol

[Okla-homey]

I never got that. If the public option sucked, why would anyone take it? If I have good insurance, and I can get gubment insurance for $100-200 less but it is ****. Why would I take the cheaper, crappier option?

think about it.

Most people think it "won't happen to them." They're healthy right? So why blow the extra money on insurance they don't need. They roll-over to the gubmint coverage, and with the savings, they can buy stuff. Like that GI Joe with the Kung-Fu grip their kid wants for Christmas.

[Chuck Bao]

I never got that. If the public option sucked, why would anyone take it? If I have good insurance, and I can get gubment insurance for $100-200 less but it is ****. Why would I take the cheaper, crappier option?

I thought the public option was for people who couldn't get insurance in the first place.

Maybe that is it. I am so confused.

I was thinking about people suddenly out of work, or people who are suddenly redesignated as contract workers without employee benefits, or employees who are suddenly told that health insurance is no longer an employee benefit.

Crappy health insurance is probably better than no insurance.

[Chuck Bao]

think about it.

Most people think it "won't happen to them." They're healthy right? So why blow the extra money on insurance they don't need. They roll-over to the gubmint coverage, and with the savings, they can buy stuff. Like that GI Joe with the Kung-Fu grip their kid wants for Christmas.

Or those people suffering from severe pain. Think about it.

[Sooner_Havok]

think about it.

Most people think it "won't happen to them." They're healthy right? So why blow the extra money on insurance they don't need. They roll-over to the gubmint coverage, and with the savings, they can buy stuff. Like that GI Joe with the Kung-Fu grip their kid wants for Christmas.

But if they have the "won't happen to me" mentality why spend money on any insurance in the first place?

[Curly Bill]

But if they have the "won't happen to me" mentality why spend money on any insurance in the first place?

Pay tention! Big Brother is gonna make you buy insurance.

[King Crimson]

homey pretends to be some kind of weird right-leaning moderate for whom "rationality" rules above all else....unless it's time to beat the war drum or predict that Obama can't win.

he's made a million anti-Obama predictions. not based on fact, but more desire. he's lost them all.

i don't think the health care thing will win. it didn't 20 years ago in Clinton's first administration. but all beating your chest in terms of capitalism vs. socialism...is nonsense.

welfare state does not equal socialism or Marxism or the enemy in Red Dawn.

[Sooner_Havok]

Pay tention! Big Brother is gonna make you buy insurance.

Yeah, but if you don't has teh insurance, and you is forced to buy it, then you currently don't have teh insurance presently.

So if you don't currently have insurance presently, and you buy some from teh gubment man, is the insurance mens out?

[JohnnyMack]

The plan that was put forth sucked. Obama campaigned on a platform of not doing things the way they had been done in the past and reaching across the aisle and whatnot. The plan he allowed Congress to put forth was DOA. I'm not sure if he isn't as smart as he acted or if he simply misunderestimated the reaction of the Blue Dogs, but this guy had every opportunity to push forth real reform and he has ended up looking like Tony Romo in the playoff game at Seattle a few years ago. The one where all he had to do was tee it up and let his kicker do the work and he couldn't even pull that off. Instead of rolling up his sleeves and getting his hands dirty, he seemingly thought he was still campaigning for office. Instead of acting like the POTUS, he acted like a guy who was still trying to become POTUS. I'm not sure where this healthcare reform will land, but I'm thinking more and more it'll be with a soft, wet, thud. I really and truly wanted healthcare reform to come to pass. I wanted the insurance companies to be more accountable, I wanted barriers to insurance reduced for hard working people with preexisting conditions who honestly needed help. I wanted our Government to increase the personal repsonsibility of its people by encouraging them to buy insurance and offering tax deductions for it. Now the whole goddamned thing looks like such a mess that I wonder when it's all said and done if anything meaningful will come of it.

[Frozen Sooner]

There's no way a government program can be run more cheaply and efficiently than private industry.

A private insurer can't ever compete on price against a government-run insurance company. It'd drive them all out of business.

We have always been at war with Eastasia.

[King Crimson]

We have always been at war with Eastasia.

it's true. We have always been at war with Eastasia.

[Okla-homey]

he's made a million anti-Obama predictions. not based on fact, but more desire. he's lost them all.

I freely admitted, I didn't think a nation that is, overall, a tad right of center, would elect a rookie senator who happened also to be the most liberal member of said house. I was wrong. I underestimated the effect of the minority and youth vote, and folks' dissatisfaction with the previous administration. That and the mortgage crisis that broke in September 2008, which was laid in W's lap.

Other than that, so far, this presidency has been consistent with my expectations, thus emboldening and reinvigorating the conservative and libertarian movements that were pronounced all but dead in the wake of The One's election. Do you doubt BHO's lackluster performance to date will result in a mid-term correction in 2010?

welfare state does not equal socialism or Marxism or the enemy in Red Dawn.

maybe not, but it scares the crap out of a majority of Americans nevertheless.

[King Crimson]

maybe not, but it scares the crap out of a majority of Americans nevertheless.

a majority of americans voted for Barack Obama the Black Panther Islamo-fascist Commie.

a majority of americans also watch American Idol.

the keen new "Reagan Conservatives" vacillate between populism and Strauss's Noble Lie and Plato's Republic and Cheney's Philospher King plus bennies idea of the executive branch ("the vote of the people is not a mandate") all through the War in Iraq (tm)....so, which is it? Grand Ideas of the Republic? Small Government, Big Military? The New Populism?

you guys need to figure out which majority you want to declaim against and which to valorize. because playing both sides when it suits you is part of the reason the GOP is in the ditch.

[Okla-homey]

a majority of americans voted for Barack Obama the Black Panther Islamo-fascist Commie.

a majority of americans also watch American Idol.

the keen new "Reagan Conservatives" vacillate between populism and Strauss's Noble Lie and Plato's Republic and Cheney's Philospher King plus bennies idea of the executive branch ("the vote of the people is not a mandate") all through the War in Iraq (tm)....so, which is it? Grand Ideas of the Republic? Small Government, Big Military? The New Populism?

you guys need to figure out which majority you want to declaim against and which to valorize. because playing both sides when it suits you is part of the reason the GOP is in the ditch.

Let's just agree, for all their shortcomings, when the 'Pubs control Congress and the White House, they are generally able to advance the agenda de jour. Unlike the current bunch, who, despite controlling both, appear incapable of advancing theirs. Which, in the final analysis, is...pathetic, yet fortunate for the country. Even with a personally popular president appearing on TV to flog same practically daily throughout the month of September. Maybe he'll have more luck bringing the Olympics to Chicago.

[King Crimson]

I made the same point a few months ago about Limbaugh. sometimes he's the leader of an elite minority who aren't the liberal sheep (the free thinker mythology) and sometimes he the leader of a grand populism that is oppressed by elite liberals who have the cushy instruments of power and illicit but pervasive media influence (populism mythology).

you people need to wake the F up.

[Okla-homey]

I made the same point a few months ago about Limbaugh. sometimes he's the leader of an elite minority who aren't the liberal sheep (the free thinker mythology) and sometimes he the leader of a grand populism that is oppressed by elite liberals who have the cushy instruments of power and illicit but pervasive media influence (populism mythology).

you people need to wake the F up.

No, you people need to get out of the way and let the grown-ups resume running this country.