Tony Crocker- Plays great defense I'm told, but couldn't hit space if he fell off of planet Earth.
Or, Cade Davis- plays good defense and can make a jumpshot.
I'm sorry, but Crocker does nothing for me. NOTHING.
Tony Crocker- Plays great defense I'm told, but couldn't hit space if he fell off of planet Earth.
Or, Cade Davis- plays good defense and can make a jumpshot.
I'm sorry, but Crocker does nothing for me. NOTHING.
Davis isn't all that much of a shooter!
And before you use the "well he shut down so and so", we played Morgan State and Michigan...they dont have any GREAT offensive players.
Seriously?Originally Posted by oumartin
Cade plays quite the opposite of good defense. Crocker had 6 assists against 1 turnover today. Turnovers have been a big problem for Crocker lately. He also drew 3 fouls on Michigan's best player. Manny Harris is pretty good averaging 17 points a game. Today he had 11 because of Crocker. Lay off him for tonight.
"If your dream ain't bigger than you, there's a problem with your dream." -Deion Sanders
I'm not happy with either of them.
Behold the pale horse. The man who sat on him was death, and Hell followed with him.
Olevet Posse Pistolero
Winner of the Nobel Peace Prize 2015.
Ok, Crocker held Manny Harris (whoever the hell that is) 6 points below his average. Fine. What about the point in the second half when we start to pull away (and Blake is dominating inside), Crocker pulls up for a three, bricks it all to hell, which in turn gives Meatchicken a run out for an easy layup and then the next defensive trip down the court, Crocker lets his guy drive right past him for a dunk. It was like Crocker just scored 4 points for the opposition....which is more than he scored for us by the way.
It just irritates me because I know (we all know) how well Tony CAN play offensively, and if he could somehow find it magicly by next weekend, we could go to Detroit and do damage. He has just lost ALL confidence in live game shots right now.
Uhh he was 4-4 FTs today.Anyway I don't see how Crocker's brick turning into a dunk was his fault defensively. I also remember Blake passing it out on that possession.
"If your dream ain't bigger than you, there's a problem with your dream." -Deion Sanders
Crockers brick led to a run out layup. NEXT possession his guy beat him straight to the hole for a dunk.
Oh, sorry. Crocker did score 4 points. I forgot about those last 2 free throws.
We've played more teams than Morgan State and Michigan this year. Crocker has been our best guard defensively all season. I don't know if you noticed, but against OSU in our last game of the regular season, James Anderson scored 37 or something like that. He absolutely dominated us. The next game he scored 11 or something like that. What was the difference? Crocker was in foul trouble the first game.
As for the "whoever the hell that is" comment about Manny Harris, it doesn't make you look too smart. Manny Harris was All-Big 10 first team and has a chance to be a top 20 draft pick if he comes out this year.
The best team isn't the team with the most big scorers. A good team is one that knows their role. Not everybody's role is to be a big scorer. Crocker hasn't been doing well lately on offense and he knows it. He took 4 shots. He didn't take hardly any shots away from Warren and Blake (the scorers). That isn't to say he didn't do anything offensively, he had 6 assists and only one turnover. Put that with shutting down Manny Harris and he had one heck of a game.
Yes, seriously. He may possibly be a good shooter but he hasn't ever shown it. He came in with a reputation as a shooter, but he hasn't ever earned it here at OU. Last year he was shooting 32% and 27.5% from 3. This year he is shooting 38.8% and 35.4% from 3. Crocker has him beat in both categories, both years.
Crocker isn't a threat offensively at all right now. He's lost all confidence in his shot, and when he does get the ball, it's the ball thing every time. If he catches with someone on him, he stands in triple threat, swings the ball, and then puts it on the floor going right; but never with the intent of going to the basket. If he's open, he jacks it and misses. With him on the floor, we're playing four vs. five on the offensive end, and teams are starting to realize that. Today, it was often Crocker's man helping double Blake. (Hence so many of their guards in foul trouble... although Crocker was doing an amazing job of moving his feet on D and drawing those offensive fouls...)
But, looking a little deeper... When I say Crocker's not an offensive threat, I'm not saying it lightly... Paraphrasing "Team America: World Police," he's not much better than Ben Affleck.
Today, he averaged one field goal attempt per 7.25 minutes, hitting NONE of them. He averaged one point per 7.25 minutes as well, all of them coming from the field. Now, granted, he passed the ball well, with few turnovers, but, at the same time, the way Blake was scoring in the post today, with quick shots, hitting before the double came to him, Crock just happened to be the beneficiary. Also, on the turnover thing, keep in mind he's FAR from our primary ball handler. His play is a large part of the reason Leary's been seeing extended minutes lately.
As for Davis, he averaged one point every two minutes, so I think he's a no-brainer. (Yes, I'm freakin' kidding...)
On the season, Crocker is shooting less than 40%, and his 3pt percentage is slightly lower. He's also attempting 4.5 three-point shots per game. When he was hitting them, nobody minded it so much. But, the problem now isn't that he's missing them, so much as he's continuing to take them, even though he's missing them. What's irking me is that he's only attempting 2 free throws per game. When a shooter isn't shooting well, they should try to get easy looks... ie - free throws and layups. But, since Crocker seems to refuse to try to finish a drive to the basket, and he's not hitting anything from the outside, he's not an offensive threat at all.
For his career, he's averaged more TO's per game than assists, so his play as of late in that department is somewhat promising, but his shooting continues to degrade. It's been doing so for a while now. He's only shot above 50% from the field 11 times this year, and of those 11, only 6 have come in games in which he's attempted more than 8 shots. It's only happened five times since the new year has begun, and only once since February. He's been shooting more and more poorly, and less and less frequently. Couple that with his inability (or lack of desire) to get to the free throw line, and I'd say that it's a lack of confidence. BUT, seeing as he still has the gumption to play solid defense (at times, no, but overall, yes) and many players in his position would not... I say that he continues to start. Apparently Capel sees it the same way.
As for the pro-Davis crew, you may want to check the stats before you start the pimpin'. He's only scored in double-digits five times this season, and three of those came in November. Also, across the board, he's shooting worse percentages than Crocker, and I don't think that anybody would make an argument that he's a better defender.
That's just my extended $0.02.
the_ouskull
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As is pretty much always the case, I agree with Skull. -- A Sooner in Texas, 11/09
I starting asking myself this question on thursday and I asked it again today. And after really watching Crocker on defense, I would have to say that I will take him over Cade because he is a force against guards on defense, even if he is a liability on offense these days. Cade may be better off the bench, but I don't think he gets in enough to have the number of looks that he needs IMO.
"Winning isn't everything, its the ONLY thing." - Vince Lombardi
Olevet Posse Member and OVJ-aholic
I think that, by Cade sitting right now, especially after getting used to getting minutes, it will benefit him in the future. Right now, he's been playing (and shooting, which is supposed to be his strength) like a liability.
I know it's not easy, what these guys do... But THEY have to know that too, and work at their game constantly. Basically, basketball is more than just shooting... and when you're a shooter who is shooting poorly, you can either sulk, and let it have an effect on your all-around game - or you can suck it up, take open shots when you get them, and play solidly in the other aspects of the game. Crocker was a perfect example of that tonight.
the_ouskull
Skull=the most underrated poster in SoonerFans.com history. -- gdc, 09/05
skull makes people want to go sit in the corner and hang their heads in shame when he responds to their posts. -- birddog, 01/09
skull makes you feel like you are the dumbest motherf*cker on the planet... -- soonerinabilene, 08/09
My staff is getting tired of me making them read your posts. -- birddog, 10/09
As is pretty much always the case, I agree with Skull. -- A Sooner in Texas, 11/09
Which do I perfer?
A W!
A Win!
I liked what I saw out of Crocker today. No, he did not hit any FG, but he was a force on the defensive side.
Cade would not have been so good on defense.
Now then. If getting the win means Cade needs to be in moreso than Crocker, then so be it.
If getting the win means Crocker needs to be in all the time...I can live with that as long as we continue to win!
Skip Bayless, is that you?
Everybody has a role on a team. Blake's the star. Taylor's the enforcer. AJ is the distributor. Willie is the outside threat. The Chupacabra is the bench energy guy. Cade is the shooter off of the bench...AND CROCK IS THE DEFENSIVE STOPPER! Every great team has one. A guy who doesn't fill up the stat sheet, but who shuts down, or slows down, the opposing team's best player. As long as Crock knows this, we will be fine. Remember, he wasn't recruited as a spot-up shooter. He was recruited as a guy who could get to the rim. For him to be effective on the offensive end, he probably needs to get back to that...If we play ASU, he will match up with Harden. If we play SU, it's a bit more of a stretch. I would say that he would match up with Harris, or when they go to 3-guards, Rautins.
"Texas might have made some concessions and they might be in the same conference as Oklahoma, but they're not in the same league."
Rece Davis College Football Final 8 OCT 2011
Here are my post-game thoughts: Figured this was a good place to post it considering the my opening spiel. Apologies if this is thread-hijacking:
I am going to start my thoughts after this game in an odd place:
Tony Crocker.
I wanted to actually give him some props. I'm not sure I've ever seen an athlete in quite a slump as the one Crocker is in offensively right now. I'm not sure if you locked him in a gym by himself for an hour that he'd figure out how to put the ball in the hoop right now. I cringe every time he shoots, and it looks like he does too.
But I will tell you what....that guy played his heart out on Saturday afternoon and he found ways to contribute. He had 6 assists to 1 turnover and he played AWESOME defense on Manny Harris, who was first team all Big 10 this year. Crocker earned his minutes yesterday....and all he can do when he gets wide open looks is to keep shooting and hope he eventually gets back on track.
We played about as well as we've played in a month in the second half yesterday....I LOVED how we took the game over coming out of the break and you need to give Capel some serious credit for that. We made some adjustments and were absolutely ready to roll in the second half.
What can you say about Blake? I'm running out of words. He was simply abusing double and triple teams and he is (no exxageration) the best big man I've ever seen when it comes to running the floor. The Michigan players looked helpless trying to defend him....and like we've been saying all year.....we were able to get into a groove because our guards hit shots when Blake had to kick it out. Willie did EXACTLY what he needs to do yesterday...he picks his spots and makes big plays. Biggest play of the game may have been when Michigan cut the lead to 58-55, Willie calmly drove the lane and hit a floater--- Michigan never got closer after that.
Did Capel even make a substitution in the second half? Our starting 5 were playing so well, that I can't really recall anyone else checking in until the very end of the game.
Taylor is playing like someone who doesn't want his career to end, and AJ finally found his shot.
As I mentioned before the game, Michigan was a good match-up for us...any team that doesn't have a great, penetrating PG is a good match-up for us.
That is why I will be rooting for Arizona St. to beat Syracuse today. Jonny Flynn scares the heck out of me. But either way, it's going to be a tough game and we're going to have to play well. The good news is that whoever we play is going to be shaking in their boots at the prospect of facing Blake...as long as he's out there, we are capable of beating anyone.
While it's not a huge surprise we're in the Sweet 16, I must take my hat off to Capel.....from where this program was when he took over to where it is right now is a major, major accomplishment. Things are looking bright for OU basketball. It's not easy making the Sweet 16 and I don't take it for granted. Excited to see how we perform next Friday night.
suffice it to say, he's a far cry from this:
And that's why boomersooner28 is so frustrated. Tony's not going to get his shot back anytime soon. He knows what he's capable of. It's gotta be demoralizing for him and the team that he has played so poorly.
Not my chair not my problem thats what i say
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