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  1. #61
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Dio's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Good God, Crimson, we get it. You hate any suggestion that OKC could possibly have an advantage over Tulsa in any way shape or form and think we're going to fall on our faces. Enjoy your hills and trees and STFU already.
    "ESPN and Texas are now one and the same." -Stewart Mandel

  2. #62
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 SoonerKnight's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Seattle with their big incomes and 41 year team history found it hard to support a new arena for the Sonics. They didn't want to pay the taxes. Being from Oklahoma I have found that most people believe if you buy something you should use it. I believe that Oklahomans will support their team because there is pride in what the city has accomplished. The ticket price may go up but have you bought a ticket to see the Sooners play football it isn't all that cheap.

    Oklahoma City has changed a lot since I was a kid and downtown was a place to avoid not have a good time at. I mean I remember when the baseball team was the 89ers and had that crappy stadium now they call themselves the red hawks and they have a really nice stadium.

    When the Hornets played in OKC they not only sold out the games but the minor league basketball team also sold out their games on the same night. OKC has the best fan support for it's minor league teams. Why would the tax payers pay for a new arena and approve a tax increase for a practice facility then not support a major team franchise like they have supported the minor teams?
    Last edited by SoonerKnight; 6/5/2008 at 12:55 AM.

  3. #63
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Dio's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Anybody else notice the tard who wrote this piece of crap is named Mike Hunt?
    "ESPN and Texas are now one and the same." -Stewart Mandel

  4. #64
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 Crimsontothecore's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Dio View Post
    Good God, Crimson, we get it. You hate any suggestion that OKC could possibly have an advantage over Tulsa in any way shape or form and think we're going to fall on our faces. Enjoy your hills and trees and STFU already.
    This has nothing to do with one city against the other and I never said it did. I stated my opinion clearly but you're obviously too simple minded to grasp it.
    If you can't contribute anything intelligent then just stick your fingers in your ears and go LA, LA, LA, LA, LA.
    Now, STFU!

  5. #65
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 Crimsontothecore's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by SoonerKnight View Post
    The ticket price may go up but have you bought a ticket to see the Sooners play it isn't all that cheap.
    Well, Sooner b-ball tickets are much cheaper than the average NBA ticket but Lloyd Noble is over half empty for most games, and OU pride goes back generations in this state. Just another reason to question how well an NBA team will do once the new wears off.

  6. #66
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 SoonerKnight's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsontothecore View Post
    Well, Sooner b-ball tickets are much cheaper than the average NBA ticket but Lloyd Noble is over half empty for most games, and OU pride goes back generations in this state. Just another reason to question how well an NBA team will do once the new wears off.
    What about selling out two arena's downtown. OU is a football school and having an actual NBA team will get the love and respect that it deserves.

  7. #67
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Big Red Ron's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Keep up or be consistant newb.
    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsontothecore View Post
    Badger's right. This thread has digressed because I made a comment questioning how much long term support OKC would give an NBA team.

    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsontothecore View Post
    Badger, You are right on about the support thing. My original point (before Big Red Ron turned it into OKC vs Tulsa) was that, given the circumstances, I think it would be smart on the part of OKC to not alienate the rest of the state by making all the "It's OUR team" statements.
    BTW you'r grey spek jihad is just killing me. I love a good laugh.

    BTW it is our team but there'll be pleanty of tulsan's driving down the pike to watch our team. Enjoy.
    Know thy self,
    know thy enemy.
    A thousand battles,
    a thousand victories. - Sun Tzu (500 B.C.)

  8. #68
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Big Red Ron's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsontothecore View Post
    What did Hunt mean by this statement?
    "Stern stood by and did absolutely nothing for a fabulous NBA city like Seattle on what will surely be a disastrous move to Oklahoma City."
    sour grapes?
    Know thy self,
    know thy enemy.
    A thousand battles,
    a thousand victories. - Sun Tzu (500 B.C.)

  9. #69
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Big Red Ron's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsontothecore View Post
    Seattle is four times larger than OKC as is New Orleans.
    New Orleans is smaller than OKC, but don't let facts get in the way of a good lie.
    Know thy self,
    know thy enemy.
    A thousand battles,
    a thousand victories. - Sun Tzu (500 B.C.)

  10. #70
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 SoonerKnight's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Here are some facts:

    The Census Bureau in July 2006 estimated the population of New Orleans to be 223,000; a subsequent study estimated that 32,000 additional residents had moved to the city as of March 2007, bringing the estimated population to 255,000, approximately 56% of the pre-Katrina population level. Another estimate, based on data on utility usage from July 2007, estimated the population to be approximately 274,000, or 60% of the pre-Katrina population. These estimates are somewhat smaller than a third estimate, based on mail delivery records, from the Greater New Orleans Community Data Center in June 2007, which indicated that approximately two-thirds of the pre-Katrina population had returned to the city.[22]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Orleans,_Louisiana


    Oklahoma City is the capital of the U.S. state of Oklahoma. The county seat of Oklahoma County,[3] the city is the 30th largest in the United States[4] The city's estimated population as of 2006 was 537,734[1], with a 2006 estimated population of 1,192,989[2] in the metropolitan area. In 2007, the Oklahoma City-Shawnee Combined Statistical Area had a population of 1,262,027 residents.[5] Besides Oklahoma County, the city extends into Canadian, Cleveland, and Pottawatomie counties.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Oklahoma_City,_Oklahoma

    New Orleans never had the population of OKC!!! They are a major port city!
    Last edited by SoonerKnight; 6/5/2008 at 01:08 AM.

  11. #71
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 Crimsontothecore's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Badger, You need to let Big Red Ron take over with the sonic updates. He just informed me that there are only 10 people alive that know more about the Sonic situation than he does. According to Ron, The fact that he has nearly 10,000 posts on this OU message board impressed Clay Bennett enough that he decided to take Ron into his inner circle. So you see Badger, your measly 6,000+ posts don't qualify you to give us updates.

  12. #72
    Vacuums eat while yelling

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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    well, I'll be back when the dust settles, boys.

  13. #73
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 Crimsontothecore's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Red Ron View Post
    New Orleans is smaller than OKC, but don't let facts get in the way of a good lie.
    Yeah, kinda like your 'Facts" about the crime rate and income statistics of Tulsa vs OKC huh?

  14. #74
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Big Red Ron's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsontothecore View Post
    Yeah, kinda like your 'Facts" about the crime rate and income statistics of Tulsa vs OKC huh?
    Exactly

    Here are some facts:

    The Census Bureau in July 2006 estimated the population of New Orleans to be 223,000; a subsequent study estimated that 32,000 additional residents had moved to the city as of March 2007, bringing the estimated population to 255,000, approximately 56% of the pre-Katrina population level. Another estimate, based on data on utility usage from July 2007, estimated the population to be approximately 274,000, or 60% of the pre-Katrina population. These estimates are somewhat smaller than a third estimate, based on mail delivery records, from the Greater New Orleans Community Data Center in June 2007, which indicated that approximately two-thirds of the pre-Katrina population had returned to the city.[22]

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/New_Orleans,_Louisiana
    BTW, there are a few people on this board that know who I am in real life. I don't brag on message boards. Stop sending pm's and I'll quit straightening you out.

    Badger does a great job, keep up the reports. I enjoy them after reading the local paper.

    Crimson, just stop with the pms and all this crap. You look like an idiot.
    Know thy self,
    know thy enemy.
    A thousand battles,
    a thousand victories. - Sun Tzu (500 B.C.)

  15. #75
    Sooner All-Big XII-2-1+1-1+1 Crimsontothecore's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Big Red Ron View Post
    Exactly



    BTW, there are a few people on this board that know who I am in real life. I don't brag on message boards. Stop sending pm's and I'll quit straightening you out.

    Badger does a great job, keep up the reports. I enjoy them after reading the local paper.

    Crimson, just stop with the pms and all this crap. You look like an idiot.
    Let's talk "facts' again pal. It was YOU who started sending ME pm's. I have only responded to what you initiated.
    Yep, I'm sure you are a really impressive guy in real life.

  16. #76
    SoonerFans.com Elite Member Big Red Ron's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Crimsontothecore View Post
    Let's talk "facts' again pal. It was YOU who started sending ME pm's. I have only responded to what you initiated.
    Yep, I'm sure you are a really impressive guy in real life.
    OK, now that you've just become a total annoyance. I've just added you to my ignore list. I suggest you do the same.

    Back to the updates Badger...I'm sorry I had to straighten out this dipstick. Better yet, how about you start a new one. Promise I won't respond to the new guy.
    Know thy self,
    know thy enemy.
    A thousand battles,
    a thousand victories. - Sun Tzu (500 B.C.)

  17. #77
    Big Pimpin' stoops the eternal pimp's Avatar
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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Nothing to see here people...Move along!

    So Badger, you were saying....
    Bazinga

  18. #78
    Vacuums eat while yelling

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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Oh, fine, Ron (and eternal pimp!). I'm back - since you said you read your local paper and all, and since pimp asked

    Anyways, in this edition of SONICWATCH, we try once again to steer all conversations toward SONICS and not anything else. Need I remind you how many people are out to make sure that there is an NBA team nowhere in the state of Oklahoma in the near future?

    We start with Gus Williams. Who the hell is Gus Williams?!
    Seattle P-I: He's an Ex-Sonics star that doesn't want the Sonics to move.

    The fun thing about ex-stars in leagues like the NBA where EVERYONE is a star (remember Christian Laettner? He was an all-star despite a journeyman's career) and EVERYONE is an overachiever (remember how Dennis Rodman was credited for his awesome defense doing absolutely nothing but go after rebounds?) and EVERYONE is a star even before they're drafted (omg Michael Beasley, Derrick Rose and OJ Mayo! OMG!). If Tim Hardaway's case proves anything, it's that you're a has-been after you're done playing, and you're a P.O.S. if you try to do anything to get back in the headlines.

    Back to Sonics now. The owners, who I remind you, are on Oklahoma's side, have a fun defense against the upcoming lawsuit...

    NewsOK: It's baseless!

    Fortunately, once it really is found "baseless," Seattle will have something to fall back on...

    Seattle Times: SOCCER!

    Once again, here at SONICWATCH, we should deal with facts, facts like "The Sonics ranked 26th and 28th during the past two seasons in attendance, whereas OKC and New Orleans ranked in the top half of the league with at least two thousands more fans than Seattle averaged each game" and not just emotions and opinions like the one this picture conveys:

    Ok, so that picture is actually kind of funny, because it depicts how empty their stands usually are

    But what the city of Seattle is pulling is damaging the business opportunties of the Sonics...
    NewsOK: So dysfunctional.
    and the city and press of Seattle clearly think they have a chance of winning...
    Seattle P-I: Battle plans for trial!

    So, what do neighboring Trailblazers think? Rather than make you read all of this, here's the part you might be interested in:
    Quote Originally Posted by Mile Golub, Portland Trailblazers Chief Operating Officer
    If you asked us at any point in the process, over 40 years of tradition, 40 years of a franchise existing up the road, a great rivalry, a great tradition, a city like Seattle, the caliber of the city, the size of the city, they should be home to an NBA team. Especially given the long legacy that the Sonics have. We voted against the move.

    We're in a special situation vis a vis Seattle. In an ideal world, they would get the arena they feel they need to compete and they would stay. And we would continue our rivalry. But it looks like its unraveling. It looks like a matter of when they will leave.

    On one level that's very sad and disappointing. On another level, we've got to be pragmatists and say, "OK, if they ultimately leave, what does that mean for the Trailblazers?" Can we distribute our games on broadcast? Can the Blazers be to Seattle what the Seahawks and Mariners are to Portlanders? A lot of their audience, especially the Seahawks, because it's less of a commitment. Over time, could we become that? Could we begin to draw from there? Could we take sponsorship deals and make them more regional?

    Yes, yes and yes. It represents some opportunities for us should the Sonics leave and we are looking at that and we would be silly not to. We have mixed emotions about that whole situation.
    This just in: If Oklahoma loses the Sooners, how quickly can we get Poke football across the state via broadcast? Bwahahahahahaha. You expect a "rival" of sorts, THEIR fanbase, to start cheering you guys on?

    Then again, Portland's the only show in town now...
    NewsOK: One-team towns

    But, through all this squabbling (oh, the irony), remember that there's a very important draft coming up. Here, from Warrrrrshington media, is the outlook:
    News-Trib: Sonics look at potential picks

    Once again, your reminder of important dates to keep in mind as you watch the Sonics at SONICWATCH...

    June 16: Last day for silly underclassmen to give up their NBA hoop dreams and return to college drudgery, so long as they haven't signed their con-artist agent and his runner yet.

    June 24: Draft day! The Sonics have six picks out of the 60 total picks - 30 first rounders with a guaranteed money contract, 30 second rounders that will have rights tied to a specific team, but no guaranteed money contract.

    Draft rules:
    1- The first 30 picks , or first round, must be signed to a two-year contract, guaranteed. The team has the option of a third and fourth year. All picks have a sliding scale of how much money they will make, thus ensuring more bucks for veterans and not draft players.

    2- The next 30 picks, or second round, guarantees a team the rights to a player for three years, but they don't have to sign him to a contract.

    3- The Sonics, through the magical ping pong balls, got the No. 4 pick in the "lottery," or first 14 picks of the draft. This denotes the teams that didn't make the playoffs (or traded picks with a team that didn't make the playoffs).

    4- The Sonics also have five other picks of the 60. Overall, they have picks #4, #24, #32, #46, #50 and #56. A complete list can be seen here.

    Draft history:
    2007: Kevin Durant, Carl Landry (Purdue), Glen Davis (LSeaux)
    2005: Johan Petro (No. 25 overall)
    2004: Robert Swift (No. 12)
    2003: Nick Collison (No. 12)
    2003: Luke Ridnour (No. 14)
    2001: Vladimir Radmanovic (No. 12)
    2000: Desmond Mason (No. 17)
    1999: Corey Maggette (No. 13)
    1998: Vladimir Stepania (No. 27)
    1997: Bobby Jackson
    1995: Sherell Ford
    1994: Carlos Rogers
    1993: Ervin Johnson
    1992: Doug Christie
    1991: Rich King
    1990: Gary Payton
    1989: Dana Barros
    1989: Shawn Kemp
    1988: Gary Grant
    1987: Scottie Pippen
    1987: Derrick McKey
    1985: Xavier McDaniel
    ---
    I'll leave analysis of these picks for another day (not saying you can't though). I think there's some significant draft successes in there, but also some abysmal judgment calls. Till next time...
    Last edited by badger; 6/5/2008 at 10:00 AM. Reason: gawwwwwwwwwwd, why you gotta start fighitng everytime I'm in the middle of typing a lengthy SONIC post? ;)

  19. #79
    Soon to be Memphibian

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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Quote Originally Posted by badger View Post
    I believe the first on record was Moses Malone. The more recent pioneer was Kevin Garnett, who couldn't get the scores to get into Michigan. After that came many, many guys who had no business entering early that ended up in D-leagues across the world, LOLZ.

    You're right... that was a headline created to get attention and it got mine. Sorry. Argh. Never trust the media

    EDIT: I take it back, I just looked it up and Malone was the fifth... he was the first of note, probably. Oh, and it was the ABA that he jumped to, not the NBA. Your answer is here:
    http://www.infoplease.com/ipsa/A0765788.html

    Like I said, Malone was the first of note. Kemp enrolled at Kentucky and Trinity Valley CC, so you can count him if you want, or not... but he still wasn't the first.
    Excellent job of research here, and good job pointing out that Kemp enrolled in JC before declaring for the draft. In fact, his pre-game introduction always had him as coming from Trinity Valley Community College.

    This is also a good spot to mention Darryl Dawkins, who left after Moses Malone, but had much cooler nicknames for his dunks and declared himself to be from the planet "Lovetron."
    "The choices we discern as having been made in the Constitutional Convention impose burdens on governmental proceses that often seem clumsy, inefficient, even unworkable, but those hard choices were consciously made by men who had lived under a form of government that permitted arbitrary governmental acts to go unchecked." INS v. Chadha, 462 U.S. 919 (1983) (Burger, C.J.)

  20. #80
    Vacuums eat while yelling

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    Re: "SONICWATCH," official thread

    Ok, let just cut to the chase and get the Draft analysis started to continue steering the conversation away from Oklahoma rivalries, lolz

    To follow along, check ESPN.com's draft home for lengthier team histories on draftin'. I'm just listing top picks, not to discredit the second and later rounds or anything

    Draft history:
    2007: Kevin Durant , Carl Landry (Purdue), Glen Davis (LSeaux)

    Let's just overview all the picks of last year since we have sooooo many picks this year first. Not much else needs to be said about Durant, who was Rookie of the Year for his outstanding play. Landry was traded to the Rockets and (reading of Wiki here) lost a tooth in the first round of the playoffs. Ok, obviously noteable! Glen Davis was known as "Big Baby" and also noteable for preventing his coach from getting fired for a few years at LSU (or perhaps, because of Davis' success at LSU, raised expectations to impossibilities?) but was traded immediately to the Celtics in big huge trade involving Ray Allen and such to get all the picks this year. Davis and Landry really shouldn't be missed. I'm sure Davis would have reconsidered jumping to the draft had he known he would fall to the second round

    2005: Johan Petro (No. 25 overall)
    Ummm... he's a 7' center and he's French?? Not much else to say. He averages six points (wooot.) and a measley five rebounds. He's one of these players that you cut after that guaranteed contract runs out, or after you find a suitable replacement.

    2004: Robert Swift (No. 12)
    Look at his pic:

    Someone needs to beg for a minor role in Semi-Pro's sequel He suffered a Jason White signature ACL in 2006, averages less than a point and less than a rebound and less than a block per game. Did I mention he's a center? He's one of these players that probably should have gone to college but didn't... even if his choice of college was USC.

    2003: Nick Collison (No. 12)
    Dude's a power forward from Kansas. College jumpers take note - he played all four years. He's a solid role player for the Sonics with nearly 10 ppg and 9.4 rpg. What a difference a college career makes Anyway, Collison can be graded a GOOD draft player, so I'm going to put a smiley face next to his name! In fact, I'm gonna go back and do that for Durant.

    2003: Luke Ridnour (No. 14)
    Should be endearing to Oklahoma for shunning the poor University of Oregon fans. They allegedly chanted "ONE MORE YEAR" at the Pac-10 player of the year junior so long the game had to stop... and he left for the NBA anyways. Way to go, Luke! He's a wannabe Steve Nash that doesn't play defense and only scores 6.4 ppg and dishes only 4 apg. I'll give him a frowny because I don't think he's meeting expectations and they'll look to replace him this draft.

    2001: Vladimir Radmanovic (No. 12)
    The Serbian small forward was a solid 11 ppg and 4 rpg, but didn't log as many minutes as he wanted and signed elsewhere when his rookie contract ended. After playing for the Clips, he's now with the Lakers. Good draft choice, but no longer with the team.

    2000: Desmond Mason (No. 17)
    The Sonics have had two blockbuster trades recently - last year's trading away Ray Allen et al, and this one involving Mason and fellow star Gary Payton to the Bucks to acquire Allen in the first place. He also had a little bit of time in OKC when with the Hornets briefly, but is now back with the Bucks. A solid player and draft choice (even if he's a Poke) that became the first Sonic to win the dunkin' contest.

    1999: Corey Maggette (No. 13)
    Maggette was one of the Dookies that forever changed Duke basketball by jumping off the Duke bandwagon and basketball team for the draft after only one year. The Sonics traded him right away to the Magic and he later went to the Clips. The Sonics made the correct draft choice, but made the wrong personnel decision to trade him right away, as he is a solid 20 ppg forward for the Clips now.

    1998: Vladimir Stepania (No. 27)

    I don't think he plays anymore, but his last stop was in Portland. Not much to expect out of a late first rounder, I guess, but still, didn't do much for the four teams he played for. Had a few career days, but every player does.

    1997: Bobby Jackson
    Now with the Rockets, but NBA fans out there would probably remember him better as "the guy they put in around the fourth quarter for the Kings because hotshot Jason 'White Chocolate' Williams shot too many stupid three's and dishes too many off-target behind the back passes." Lolz. Jackson was recently with the Hornets, so OKC fans would remember him. He was a good (and dependable) player, so a good draft choice.

    1995: Sherell Ford

    Played only one season. With the Sonics. And in the NBA. Yes, that bad.

    1994: Carlos Rogers
    I'll leave this guy without a grade because I remember his touching story well - his sister decided she would rather have her brother make the NBA than have his kidney. She died shortly after the Sonics drafted him. On his playing career, he lasted eight years and played for several teams, none of which (if my online sources are correct) were the Sonics.

    1993: Ervin Johnson
    Outstanding player for the Lakers that could play all five positions and will be remembered as one of the 50 Greatest in the NBA's history despite getting the AIDS... that was lame of me. Lolz at Ervin "I'm not Magic" Johnson. I remember seeing him at the NBA Finals versus the Bulls, and he matched up well against their centers... which is not saying anything to his credit at all. The NBA had a time around the 90s where the guards were everything (especially those with initials M and J) and the centers were not ALL THAT GOOD anymore. There were few notable exceptions to this, like Ewing, Hakeem, D-Rob and Shaq. Ervin was not an exception, but he wasn't bad, either. Let's leave him neutral like Rogers.

    1992: Doug Christie
    We'll blame Seattle managment and the ones in charge of drafting on this one that got away. Became a top defender and three point shooter when with the Kings, but never played for the Sonics because of a contract dispute. Those were the days, eh? I still remember when the Bucks tried hard to sign Glenn Robinson for less than $100 million. Fortunately, this is one of the few and far between areas where the NBA is better than the NFL.

    1991: Rich King
    Averaged 1.9 ppg in four seasons with the Sonics. More should be expected out of a No. 14 pick, even if that wasn't a lottery pick back then (there were fewer teams). Well, at least he had a cool name.

    1990: Gary Payton
    I hate this guy's style of play, I hate his arrogance, I hate the way his jaw angles in a cocky smile when on his outstanding defense, I hate the way that fathered Jr. out of wedlock and hate how he named the one from his wife Payton II. I hate how he left the Sonics for the Bucks when his contract was expiring (but again, a very good deal for the Sonics), I hate how he jumped to the Lakers to get a title, I hate how he jumped again to the Heat and got the title. I hate how "The Glove" could be so great because of his height advantage. I hate how your bald head shined off the KeyArena lights, but what I hate most is how Seattle didn't hate you at all, not one bit, for all the success you brought the franchise. And those, Glove, are the 10 Things I Hate About You.

    1989: Dana Barros
    Who? Oh, according to Wiki, he was Payton's backup for the four seasons in Seattle. Not much else to say, except that he played for 15 seasons for many teams.

    1989: Shawn Kemp
    I'll make this short, since you've all heard of him and he's been discussed before. All-star forward, a force to be reckoned with all all. Got fat, got traded, got out of the league. A very strong asset to the Sonics and a very good draft choice - can you believe he was No. 17 overall? Barros (see above) was No. 16 overall, so I guess he doesn't count in that argument, but 15 other non-Sonic picks before him. I bet a lot of teams want a do-over on 1989. His non-college probably hurt his draft stock, but No. 1 was non-all-star Pervis Ellison

    1988: Gary Grant
    Who? Another draft-and-trade move for the Sonics. This No. 15-overal ended up in Europe, where he had a solid career... but not much to say about his time in the league.

    1987: Scottie Pippen
    Dear LORD, what were the Sonics thinking?! The Bulls traded for Pippen and the Sonics got... Olden Polynice. This is another blunder that falls on management, not those responsible for the draft, so we'll give the Sonics a draft smiley here, but this move was ridiculously off-the-charts bad. However, as a Bucks fan, I will remember Pippen as a whiner that pulled his "Sitting Bull" act when he didn't get the game-winning shot called for him. He ended up with the Jail Blazers in that era of signing a bunch of aging high priced stars. But, back with the Bulls to finish his career.

    1987: Derrick McKey
    I'll give him a smiley, but I should note that McKey was drafted before Reggie Miller, Horace Grant and Reggie Lewis. Was immediately a solid player for the Sonics upon arrival, averaging nearly 16 ppg.

    1985: Xavier McDaniel
    I'm not gonna go beyond Xavier, because this is the last guy on that list that is really notable and my hoop knowledge ends about the year I was born (which, btw, was exactly 20 years after MJ himself was born, for the record). He was a solid player for the Sonics and is still cherished in Seattle despite getting traded after six seasons.
    ---
    I might go back and do a few second rounders later. Thoughts?

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