No new Coal Plant for OG&E...

[Soonerus]

...very interesting development in Oklahoma....

[Soonerus]

biggest thing to happen in Oklahoma in years and you guys missed it ??? you don't understand it ???

[CatfishSooner]

why such a big deaL?

[Soonerus]

Read the newspapers and watch the news...each side spent about $40-60 million on the deal...when your electric bill rises over the next few years you will feel it...

[JohnnyMack]

We should build some windmills.

And ****.

[JohnnyMack]

Welcome back Rus.

When's your next scheduled meltdown?

I'd like to put a reminder in my Outlook so I can make sure I'm here for it.

[oumartin]

I thought they decided against building it. Am I wrong?

[Soonerus]

I thought they decided against building it. Am I wrong?

"they" did...

[oumartin]

good!

[Soonerus]

good!

lots of pros and cons on this deal...very complex and interest infested...

[oumartin]

I'm a former and future natual gas individual and many are power plants are powered by steam fired or natural gas turbines. Thats good for me.

[Soonerus]

I'm a former and future natual gas individual and many are power plants are powered by steam fired or natural gas turbines. Thats good for me.

Thus, you have an interest in the outcome like most of those involved...

[oumartin]

exactly, think of it this way, what is one of oklahomas greatest natural recources? Natural gas. Keeps people employed drilling, processing and burning

[Soonerus]

exactly, think of it this way, what is one of oklahomas greatest natural recources? Natural gas. Keeps people employed drilling, processing and burning

I am not getting any further into this discussion because it could last for weeks....very passionate positions on each side....

[oumartin]

well I only care about keeping my family fed.

[OklahomaTuba]

Natural gas and Barry are the kings here.

Sounds like Tejass is planning a **** load of those newer coal plants though. Maybe that has something to do with it???

[Soonerus]

Natural gas and Barry are the kings here.

Sounds like Tejass is planning a **** load of those newer coal plants though. Maybe that has something to do with it???

simplistic analysis...

[OklahomaTuba]

And WTF hasn't the state tried to get in on the ETH & Biodiesel boom yet????

[OklahomaTuba]

simplistic analysis...

How so? They have to rail the feedstock in vs. just pipeing the NG out of the ground. Sounds simple enough to me.

Not including the fact that transmission wire from tejass cost a ****load less then a coal plant near a place with little coal.

[Soonerus]

Geez, well informed comment....

[oumartin]

there are two ethanol plants in the works in this state as we speak Tuba.

One in Enid if it went through and working on one near Shattuck to be built

[OklahomaTuba]

And I am not discounting the effect of our traditionally corrupt democratic state leadership as well.

Maybe Gene Stipe was involved? Or the faggish corp. commisioner???

[Soonerus]

I think this issue is too complex for this board....best to let it go...

[oumartin]

enlighten us.

[Soonerus]

Nope, lots of very good arguments on both sides of the issue...

[OklahomaTuba]

there are two ethanol plants in the works in this state as we speak Tuba.

One in Enid if it went through and working on one near Shattuck to be built

What's the feedstock on those? Milo? If so, very cool.

Once the cellulosic things makes the big breakthrough, this could a HUGE thing for OK. I mean just HUUUUUGE.

Oklahoma has all the right stuff for this kind of thing. Hopefully the State doesn't **** it away like it did the energy industry.

[Soonerus]

Theoretically, OG&E was looking out for the best interests rate payers of the state of Oklahoma...no vested interest...

[CatfishSooner]

Russs, were you for the coal plant?

[oumartin]

not sure what all they can use to create methanol. Corn and whatnot.
I just knew that no more than a year ago there were two in the works.

The thing about coal, depending on how they are processing it can be highly dangerous. Its more cost effective than natural gas as from as burning it but you have a controlled explosion basically,
Unless of course they are just using it for a fuel sourse to create the steam to drive the turbines.

[Soonerus]

No, I am not smart enough to know what is right but Howard was for it ...

[Scott D]

What's the feedstock on those? Milo? If so, very cool.

Once the cellulosic things makes the big breakthrough, this could a HUGE thing for OK. I mean just HUUUUUGE.

Oklahoma has all the right stuff for this kind of thing. Hopefully the State doesn't **** it away like it did the energy industry.

when I first read this post I was thinking of how great it would be to make the fat on people good for something...boy am I embarrassed. :D

[oumartin]

is that a 4% interests rate?

or are you saying they are concerned about the consumer?

[Soonerus]

What is certain is OG&E, PSO and others rates will rise noticeably over the next two years...

[royalfan5]

And WTF hasn't the state tried to get in on the ETH & Biodiesel boom yet????
Because you don't have the feedstock or logistics for it.

[royalfan5]

What's the feedstock on those? Milo? If so, very cool.

Once the cellulosic things makes the big breakthrough, this could a HUGE thing for OK. I mean just HUUUUUGE.

Oklahoma has all the right stuff for this kind of thing. Hopefully the State doesn't **** it away like it did the energy industry.
Even if the technology is there for celluose, and it isn't yet, the logistical requirements will prevent it from being a serious source of fuel for at least a couple of decades outside of forest areas.

[OklahomaTuba]

Geez, well informed comment....
It is actually. I talked to some guy with Panda at Powergen about this very thing last year. This is what HE told me.

Plants are trying to move away from coal, as cost for delivery, processing, pollution, etc and new ways to tax it keep coming from the libz on it.

It will be worse than NG, and the industry knows it. This is why the "Coal Boom" seems to be fading away to some degree.

[Scott D]

yeah Tuba, you need to steal more corn from Nebraska...slacker.

[Soonerus]

Here is some of the fallout from this deal: Scott Meacham will likely be the next Governor of Oklahoma and Jeff Cloud and Jim Roth will have no problem filling their campaign coffers for whatever political agenda they seek...

[OklahomaTuba]

Even if the technology is there for celluose, and it isn't yet, the logistical requirements will prevent it from being a serious source of fuel for at least a couple of decades outside of forest areas.

Not so much here. There are many possible sources here and in Texas.

Its a much better future than corn.

I am in Brasil right now, and we are talking about sugar. The coffee is great too, as is the meat on swords.

[oumartin]

but plants are also weighing the cost of paying for the air permits as oppossed to the cost of natual gas. I am a natural gas guy myself but burning coal is way cheaper if its readily available. Now, with the emissions and whatnot it may not be worth it.
I've not worked around Coal but my entire life I have natural gas and baby I dont' want no damn coal fired power plant here

[Soonerus]

Not so much here. There are many possible sources here and in Texas.

Its a much better future than corn.

I am in Brasil right now, and we are talking about sugar. The coffee is great too, as is the meat on swords.

Seems like "pie in the sky" to the novice...

[royalfan5]

Not so much here. There are many possible sources here and in Texas.

Its a much better future than corn.

I am in Brasil right now, and we are talking about sugar. The coffee is great too, as is the meat on swords.
No ****, but the logistical systems of the nation aren't equipped to move the mass quantities of cellousic feed stock around. Cellouse is going to be the oil shale of the 21st century. The only question is what the government does when we realize we don't have enough corn next year.

[Soonerus]

but plants are also weighing the cost of paying for the air permits as oppossed to the cost of natual gas. I am a natural gas guy myself but burning coal is way cheaper if its readily available. Now, with the emissions and whatnot it may not be worth it.
I've not worked around Coal but my entire life I have natural gas and baby I dont' want no damn coal fired power plant here

You are hitting the central issue..

[1stTimeCaller]

I'd heard that the NG plant will cost twice as much to run as the coal plant. That said I think if you factor in all costs involved NG is the cheaper fuel over the long run.

[Soonerus]

I'd heard that the NG plant will cost twice as much to run as the coal plant. That said I think if you factor in all costs involved NG is the cheaper fuel over the long run.

That's one of the central arguments....

[1stTimeCaller]

yeah, that's what I heard............................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ........................................

[oumartin]

we have enuff natural gas now to process for probably the next 40 years..

Heck yeah though. A natural gas fired turbine is not economical at all. But they sure are cool to start ;)

[Scott D]

just hook a pipe up to Mongo's ***, there's enough natural gas there to power the entire southwest on one bowl of chili.

[Soonerus]

yeah, that's what I heard............................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. .................................................. ........................................
.................................................. .................................................. ...

[1stTimeCaller]

I have learned a lot about the various issues regarding each fuel type from Rusty's contributions in this thread.

[Soonerus]

I have learned a lot about the various issues regarding each fuel type from Rusty's contributions in this thread.

Hey, I just said it very complex and very political...I have no real answers, I admit that...You are an oilie you should know all about it...

[critical_phil]

it....is.....com.....plex.

many......issues.on...both....s.i.d.e.s.

[Soonerus]

it....is.....com.....plex.

many......issues.on...both....s.i.d.e.s.

Thanks Phil, you are a good man...

[olevetonahill]

No, I am not smart enough to know what is right but Howard was for it ...
I was NOT !!!
I dint even know about it !:P

[Soonerus]

I was NOT !!!
I dint even know about it !:P


Sorry, different Howard...

[olevetonahill]

just hook a pipe up to Mongo's ***, there's enough natural gas there to power the entire southwest on one bowl of chili.
Kinda what I was thinking. Hell we could serve Mo beans at those free Breakfasts and lunches and stuff
Course hook one to My *** it would make PGs neighborhood smell good !:cool:

[olevetonahill]

Sorry, different Howard...
:P

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Why burn a stinkin', pollutin' old coal plant when you can build a nice new gasified coal plant and reduce emissions and produce electricity more efficiently...?

[Mjcpr]

Anybody know which side Chesapeake was on?

[sooner_born_1960]

Anybody know which side Chesapeake was on?
I saw a couple full-page ads they took out. I can't remember which side they were on. ;)

[JohnnyMack]

So, the windmill idea. We're not going to investigate that?

[mdklatt]

So, the windmill idea. We're not going to investigate that?

It's being investigated.

[r5TPsooner]

Anybody know which side Chesapeake was on?


I read an article on there CEO and I believe he is one of the top paid CEO's in the world if I read the story right.

[Jerk]

I haul fly-ash out of the Red Rock powerplant all the time.

There is no 'odor' from the plant, and the only thing that is visably coming out of the stacks is white steam.

Sounds like Chesapeak paid someone off. What a lousy company. "oh, we're sooo concerned about the environment!" Bullsh*t.

If I were OG&E, I'd cut their power.

[Petro-Sooner]

cheesypeake. The evil empire. They have a bad rep in the industry.

[Jerk]

cheesypeake. The evil empire. They have a bad rep in the industry.

I am related to someone who was a white collar employee there. If half the things she said about that place were true, I'd never want to work there.

[Petro-Sooner]

I am related to someone who was a white collar employee there. If half the things she said about that place were true, I'd never want to work there.

Sounds about right. I get a laugh each time I see an advertisment or commercial from them.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

It's being investigated.

The investigation has shifted to investigating the investigation on how, if well investigated, methane emissions from resident landfills can be investigated as to an alternative investigation toward using it as a legitimately investigated fuel source.


But that's still under investigation. :P

[Petro-Sooner]

The investigation has shifted to investigating the investigation on how, if well investigated, methane emissions from resident landfills can be investigated as to an alternative investigation toward using it as a legitimately investigated fuel source.

Fossil fuels have been investigated and it has been found there is no harm. So use them. :D

[Soonerus]

It is an issue that whatever position you take many good arguments exist against you...

[Tulsa_Fireman]

Fossil fuels have been investigate and it has been found there is no harm. So use them.

But seriously, not to threadjack...

A guy I used to work with did some kind of work laying the piping to take methane off of landfills to meet some kind of EPA regs. The landfills in turn would just burn off the gas. He mentioned that they actually pump quite a bit of methane off of these landfills, enough to "power a small town" to quote him. Granted, he was just a pipe jockey, not a edumacated individual like many of you guys on here. Which leads to my question...

Was he right?

And if so, other than the proverbial thumb of competition and infrastructure issues, why aren't we?

[Petro-Sooner]

I honestly don't know.

[Soonerus]

OKC South landfill burns gas 24/7 year round...right off of I-240...I wondered where the H that came from...

[Tulsa_Fireman]

Yup. Methane from decomposition.

[Mixer!]

not sure what all they can use to create methanol. Corn and whatnot.


Now, with the emissions and whatnot it may not be worth it.

So which side has the "unchained idiots"? ;) :D

[TheHumanAlphabet]

But seriously, not to threadjack...

A guy I used to work with did some kind of work laying the piping to take methane off of landfills to meet some kind of EPA regs. The landfills in turn would just burn off the gas. He mentioned that they actually pump quite a bit of methane off of these landfills, enough to "power a small town" to quote him. Granted, he was just a pipe jockey, not a edumacated individual like many of you guys on here. Which leads to my question...

Was he right?

And if so, other than the proverbial thumb of competition and infrastructure issues, why aren't we?

Yep, he's right. I don't know if people are lazy or if the economics that would be required to pipe, vent and distribute the gas make it unprofitable. You would think that a city would take it and pay as a nod to the environment...