755

[JohnnyMack]

He tied it.

[Flagstaffsooner]

Roids tied it.

fixed

[Turd_Ferguson]

fixed
Indeed

[OUDoc]

Screw him.

[Newbomb Turk]

I'm so happy for him I could puke.

[SoonerBOI]

************************************************** ************************************************** ****************

[Scott D]

I'm glad Clemens has no shot at Cy Young's record, it'd be a shame for the media to put a roid user on a pedestal.

[tulsaoilerfan]

I will be glad when he breaks it so we won't have to hear anything else about it; i'm sick of all the media coverage for a player that most fans don't give a damn about, myself included.

[tulsaoilerfan]

I'm glad Clemens has no shot at Cy Young's record, it'd be a shame for the media to put a roid user and a whorn on a pedestal.

Fixed. :D

[Turd_Ferguson]

756*

[AllAboutThe'O']

As if this day couldn't get worse, with the Great Satan hitting his 500th homer this afternoon, now BigHead BigMouth Bonds "ties" the great Henry Aaron. Oh well, I'm guessing he's going to try to break it when the Giants get back to S.F. on Monday.

[Mongo]

heh, they just played a steriod PSA during commercials

[AllAboutThe'O']

heh, they just played a steriod PSA during commercials
Yeah, I noticed that one, too. At least it was the one with the "shrinking" balls instead of that stupid crumbling statue one.

[Newbomb Turk]

I'm glad Clemens has no shot at Cy Young's record, it'd be a shame for the media to put a roid user on a pedestal.

you really gotta wonder about him being a user too. I wonder less about Bonds though.

[SoonerDood]

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!

[tulsaoilerfan]

you really gotta wonder about him being a user too. I wonder less about Bonds though.
Yeah, and it makes me wonder why there is almost no speculation about pitchers juicing; surely there are some of them that did it also :pop:

[Newbomb Turk]

he needs to get drilled in the back in this at bat.

damn - they walked him.

[SoonerGirl06]

With all the allegations and suspected use of steroid by Bonds, I really can't take his numbers seriously and don't think the media should as well.

Aaron will always be the best in my because of the times in which he accomplished hitting all those homers.

[JohnnyMack]

you really gotta wonder about him being a user too.

You do?

[Newbomb Turk]

You do?

you don't?

[Turd_Ferguson]

I might?

[hookem31]

http://i10.photobucket.com/albums/a109/hookem31/forum%20pics/coffee2.gif

[Newbomb Turk]

nice shot of him "blowing his nose" in the dugout.

[SoonerGirl06]

ph says "Go Barry!"

:mad:



Needless to say he's gonna get spanked for that.

[SoonerDood]

You do?
you gotta wonder about most of them.

[JohnnyMack]

you don't?

He's a whorn and a Yankee. I can't help but assume the worst.

[Newbomb Turk]

He's a whorn and a Yankee. I can't help but assume the worst.
I can't remember the last time I saw a post I agreed with more.

[Scott D]

you really gotta wonder about him being a user too. I wonder less about Bonds though.

What's to wonder about?

1. hat size has increased just as much as bonds' has.
2. bulked up nearly as much as bonds has
3. conveniently doesn't start playing until 2-3 months into season (can we say cycling?)
4. named on the 'grimsley report'.

media won't roast him though..he's a "good ole boy."

[Turd_Ferguson]

define "good ole boy" please.

[royalfan5]

Clemens is about as clean as the Tour De France. Barry is just keeping the HR mark warm for A-Rod anyway.

[oumartin]

who cares. Baseball is a joke now

[critical_phil]

a special thanks to Bud Selig for making sure that Bonds isn't the biggest bag o' ****** on the telecast tonight...

[Newbomb Turk]

Clemens doesn't have "trainers" in prision because they won't testify. Not saying he's clean, just saying there isn't as much dirt on him as Barry.

[AllAboutThe'O']

Clemens is about as clean as the Tour De France. Barry is just keeping the HR mark warm for A-Rod anyway.
Betcha he doesn't get it. They said the same thing about Ken Griffey Jr. a decade ago.

[royalfan5]

Betcha he doesn't get it. They said the same thing about Ken Griffey Jr. a decade ago.
A-Rod has been way more durable than Griffey ever was though. Plus, if A-Rod stays in the AL, he can preserve himself as a DH for a long time as well.

[jk the sooner fan]

define "good ole boy" please.

white

[Turd_Ferguson]

white
Scott D, Please tell me you were kidding....right?

[Newbomb Turk]

A-Rod has been way more durable than Griffey ever was though.

good point - if Griffey had stayed moderately healthy, he be right there with Bonds.

[Scott D]

define "good ole boy" please.

relatively media friendly, doesn't necessarily take any controversial stands, and yes, the fact that he is caucasian is icing on the cake. Not as easy to control as a latin player, because all you can threaten him with is deportation back to his beloved texas.

[Turd_Ferguson]

Why is caucasian "icing on the cake"?

[Shneeg11]

Yeah, and it makes me wonder why there is almost no speculation about pitchers juicing; surely there are some of them that did it also :pop:

There is more speculation about pitchers actually...more pitchers have been caught juicing than position players

[jk the sooner fan]

Why is caucasian "icing on the cake"?

because this is a race thing to scott...

[Mongo]

mmmm, white icing

[jk the sooner fan]

mmmmmmmmmm, cake

[JohnnyMack]

I think that they both used and/or are still using. I don't think I'd ever want to hang out and drink a beer with either one of them.

[Mongo]

the race card getting played is a tired, and weak argument.

the media always makes a big deal, in a positive way, of black people making milestones in sports. Hell, look at the last Super Bowl. More hype surrounded the fact that the first black head coach has an opportunity to win the SB, than any other aspect of that game.

now, all of a sudden, the media goes from liking the black player and all their great accomplishments, to getting their klan sheets? Maybe everyone is biased in Bonds case, but it aint cause he is black. Everyone is biased over the roids. Plain and simple. They know he juiced. Bonds knows he juiced. It just hasnt been totally proven.

[jk the sooner fan]

agreed

i will say something that i dont quite understand, and thats how racially divided opinions are on the whole michael vick thing

[Scott D]

Why is caucasian "icing on the cake"?

In regards to baseball somewhat looking the other way? Mainly because of previous examples such as Gaylord Perry, and Phil Niekro. Why are they in the HoF? It's widely known and admitted by both players that they cheated while playing to win as many games as they did. If steroids is the thing that keeps Bonds out of the HoF, then shouldn't it keep Clemens out? Shouldn't the HoF rescind Perry and Niekro being in there, afterall they were admitted cheaters who doctored the ball often enough to inflate their win totals far beyond what they should have been.

For that matter would Perry and Niekro even be in if they were Latin players who doctored the ball to inflate their win totals? While this seems like I'm indicting "white america" it's more an indictment of those whom actually vote for entry in the HoF. They're so resentful and backwards they make the idiots that vote for the Oscars seem up to date.

And jk, provided that there is more evidence to prove Vick is guilty beyond a shadow of doubt. And I do mean more than just a guy that the defense can point out could be considered an unreliable witness for the prosecution simply because he can be shown to have a grudge after having a "falling out" with Vick back in 2004 where he was no longer part of Vick's "inner circle". I'm pretty sure the only people that will side with Vick will be the people who see absolutely nothing wrong with dog fighting, and people who only play the race card.

[JohnnyMack]

And jk, provided that there is more evidence to prove Vick is guilty beyond a shadow of doubt. And I do mean more than just a guy that the defense can point out could be considered an unreliable witness for the prosecution simply because he can be shown to have a grudge after having a "falling out" with Vick back in 2004 where he was no longer part of Vick's "inner circle". I'm pretty sure the only people that will side with Vick will be the people who see absolutely nothing wrong with dog fighting, and people who only play the race card.

Surely you don't think the Feds based their ENTIRE case on the hope that they could get one of these cats to roll over do you?

[jk the sooner fan]

i dont doubt that there's a small cloud of suspicion surrounding clemens, but he's not been the subject of a grand jury investigation.....the evidence against Bonds seems much greater than anything against Clemens, which at the time seems to be mere speculation......

as for Vick, all i know is that i've seen alot of blacks defending him - seemingly indirectly saying that dog fighting is ok

sure, he'll get his day in court.....as for the credible witness.......you do realize that people go to prison all the time based on evidence from witnesses such as the one that seems headed to testify against Vick

how on earth do you think police make cases against drug dealers? with altar boys? please.....there's absolutely nothing wrong with a dirty witness testifying against Vick, or anybody......happens all the time.

at least Gaylord, et al actually admitted they cheated......but players have been scuffing balls, etc..for ages........Aaron didnt have the benefit of steroids like Bonds has, ergo the problem most have with his record

only time will tell what the baseball writers do with the fate of Bonds, I have no doubt he'll be elected to the HOF, most likely on the first ballot....only MLB will keep him out, not the writers.....and MLB isnt in any position whatsoever to take that action. Once Bonds is in, your Clemens argument goes poof

they need to put an asterik over the entire steriod period and just call it what it was "the steroid era".....

[Scott D]

Surely you don't think the Feds based their ENTIRE case on the hope that they could get one of these cats to roll over do you?

no, however the court system still says "innocent until proven guilty" and "due process" and all that fun stuff. Nothing is more sad than the people letting the media try every case before it's actually gone to court.

[jk the sooner fan]

no, however the court system still says "innocent until proven guilty" and "due process" and all that fun stuff. Nothing is more sad than the people letting the media try every case before it's actually gone to court.

i'll bet you think OJ didnt do it either.......

[Scott D]

i dont doubt that there's a small cloud of suspicion surrounding clemens, but he's not been the subject of a grand jury investigation.....the evidence against Bonds seems much greater than anything against Clemens, which at the time seems to be mere speculation......

as for Vick, all i know is that i've seen alot of blacks defending him - seemingly indirectly saying that dog fighting is ok

sure, he'll get his day in court.....as for the credible witness.......you do realize that people go to prison all the time based on evidence from witnesses such as the one that seems headed to testify against Vick

how on earth do you think police make cases against drug dealers? with altar boys? please.....there's absolutely nothing wrong with a dirty witness testifying against Vick, or anybody......happens all the time.

at least Gaylord, et al actually admitted they cheated......but players have been scuffing balls, etc..for ages........Aaron didnt have the benefit of steroids like Bonds has, ergo the problem most have with his record

only time will tell what the baseball writers do with the fate of Bonds, I have no doubt he'll be elected to the HOF, most likely on the first ballot....only MLB will keep him out, not the writers.....and MLB isnt in any position whatsoever to take that action. Once Bonds is in, your Clemens argument goes poof

they need to put an asterik over the entire steriod period and just call it what it was "the steroid era".....

you really get no argument from me. and I'll concur that most of the Bonds hate is self inflicted by him. I think the amusing thing with them letting Bonds in (which I think they'll do, and it'll be a very very interesting induction to watch..Willie Mays might be the only one to show up if he's still alive, bless his wonderful soul.) is that they can't use the argument they tried to use against McGwire being in, and it gives Raffy and Sosa an argument as to why they shouldn't be denied either.

as for the comparison between Vick and a drug dealer and the witness. how many drug dealers can get together the kind of legal power that a Vick or hell even an OJ can get behind them?

oh and OJ was guilty as hell. His team totally worked the system.

[jk the sooner fan]

you really get no argument from me. and I'll concur that most of the Bonds hate is self inflicted by him. I think the amusing thing with them letting Bonds in (which I think they'll do, and it'll be a very very interesting induction to watch..Willie Mays might be the only one to show up if he's still alive, bless his wonderful soul.) is that they can't use the argument they tried to use against McGwire being in, and it gives Raffy and Sosa an argument as to why they shouldn't be denied either.

as for the comparison between Vick and a drug dealer and the witness. how many drug dealers can get together the kind of legal power that a Vick or hell even an OJ can get behind them?

oh and OJ was guilty as hell. His team totally worked the system.

depends how high up the dealer scale the guy is! the government will make no promises to that witness until after he's testified.....the defense wont be able to bring up any deals that have been made because they dont exist.....yet

and the prosecution will simply say "this is the type of individual Mr Vick associates himself with"

[Scott D]

depends how high up the dealer scale the guy is! the government will make no promises to that witness until after he's testified.....the defense wont be able to bring up any deals that have been made because they dont exist.....yet

and the prosecution will simply say "this is the type of individual Mr Vick associates himself with"

could the defense not argue that "this is the type of individual that Mr Vick disassociated himself with, and that this individual is seeking some sort of personal retribution against "my client" on the grounds that his agreement to testify for the prosecution isn't based on civic duty or an attempt to save his hide but because this individual has a vendetta against "my client"

[jk the sooner fan]

oh and OJ was guilty as hell. His team totally worked the system.

ok, so you admit that getting your day in court isnt always an indication of whether you're actually guilty or innocent

nobody here is sentencing Vick to anything, merely expressing opinions, as we are with Bonds

Bonds is a great player, one of the greatest......its just sad that he inflated his already great numbers with the help of steroids



the defense can argue many things, but i would guess, based on reading the indictment, they've got a pretty good cache of evidence to link Vick and the witness together

[OCUDad]

There is more speculation about pitchers actually...more pitchers have been caught juicing than position playersNews bulletin from the Department of Irony: Clay Hensley, the pitcher who gave up number 755, was suspended in 2005 for 15 games for using performance-enhancing substances. And the wheel goes round and round.

[tulsaoilerfan]

There is more speculation about pitchers actually...more pitchers have been caught juicing than position players
More pitchers may have been caught, but you almost never hear the media talking about which pitchers might have juiced in the past, unlike all the speculation about hitters like Sosa, McGwire, Bonds, Palmerio, etc.

[OCUDad]

Interesting site... take with a grain of salt.

http://www.baseballssteroidera.com/

[Scott D]

ok, so you admit that getting your day in court isnt always an indication of whether you're actually guilty or innocent

nobody here is sentencing Vick to anything, merely expressing opinions, as we are with Bonds

Bonds is a great player, one of the greatest......its just sad that he inflated his already great numbers with the help of steroids



the defense can argue many things, but i would guess, based on reading the indictment, they've got a pretty good cache of evidence to link Vick and the witness together

I didn't say people here were sentencing him, I said that people are allowing the media to sentence him without his day in court. You'd have to agree that the two are very different things.

[Shneeg11]

More pitchers may have been caught, but you almost never hear the media talking about which pitchers might have juiced in the past, unlike all the speculation about hitters like Sosa, McGwire, Bonds, Palmerio, etc.

I stand corrected, I think something that plays into it is that, you only see pitchers every five days, and they aren't as noticeable as guys who hit the ball a mile

[jk the sooner fan]

is the opinion of the media really much different than the opinion of the general public?

[Frozen Sooner]

Bonds is a cheater.
McGwire was a cheater.
Gaylord Perry was a cheater.

Shoeless Joe Jackson was not a cheater. At least, you'd be hard-pressed to prove it by me based on his numbers in the Series.

The fact that the above three are (or will be) in the Hall of Fame and the last one isn't is sad.

[85Sooner]

who cares. Baseball is a joke now


That about says it all.

[Newbomb Turk]

Bonds is a cheater.
McGwire was a cheater.
Gaylord Perry was a cheater.

Shoeless Joe Jackson was not a cheater. At least, you'd be hard-pressed to prove it by me based on his numbers in the Series.

The fact that the above three are (or will be) in the Hall of Fame and the last one isn't is sad.

I don't know if McGwire will make it.

[jk the sooner fan]

once the door opens for Bonds, i think it will for all the other suspected of cheating......if they find some way to keep Bonds out (grand jury, etc).....then none of them will

it may take McGwire awhile to get there, but i think he will eventually

[SoonerBorn68]

Just a little fark I threw together a while back...

http://geocities.com/soonerborn91/farks/bonds.jpg

[1stTimeCaller]

Doctoring the ball on the mound is a part of baseball.

Steroids should never ever ever have been a part of the game.

Nobody hurt their body trying to keep up with Niekro.

[rufnek05]

is the opinion of the media really much different than the opinion of the general public?

no because the media tells us what they want us to hear. but bonds is on roid's the size of his head proves it.

[VeeJay]

My problem with Bonds is not so much as his boorish behavior throughout the years, or even his use of steroids, when so many other players were doing the same thing.

It's more of his steadfast denial that he knowingly used them.

The man has no integrity.

Someone challenge me on this.

[King Crimson]

Doctoring the ball on the mound is a part of baseball.

Steroids should never ever ever have been a part of the game.

Nobody hurt their body trying to keep up with Niekro.

i agree. i don't think Perry or Niekro scuffling and doctoring the ball is akin to drugging. pushing the on-field rules and stealing signs is part of the game. cheating off the field is different.

[royalfan5]

Drugs to boost performance in baseball have been around for a long time. Am I the only one here who has read Ball Four or read some of Buck O'Neill's memoirs?

[Frozen Sooner]

George Brett is a cheater, too.

[Newbomb Turk]

George Brett is a cheater, too.

that pine tar blow-up at Yankee Stadium is a classic.

[royalfan5]

George Brett is a cheater, too.
along with the rest of MLB.

[1stTimeCaller]

there's a reason the mound doctors are in the Hall and the steroid hitters' entry will be delayed/denied.

It's based on the same principle that fines a person one for speeding and executes another for murder.

[royalfan5]

there's a reason the mound doctors are in the Hall and the steroid hitters' entry will be delayed/denied.

It's based on the same principle that fines a person one for speeding and executes another for murder.
What about all the amphetamine users in the Hall? Will Clemens be delayed because of his links to roids?

[Scott D]

Bonds is a cheater.
McGwire was a cheater.
Gaylord Perry was a cheater.

Shoeless Joe Jackson was not a cheater. At least, you'd be hard-pressed to prove it by me based on his numbers in the Series.

The fact that the above three are (or will be) in the Hall of Fame and the last one isn't is sad.

Proof that ole Chuck Comiskey had way too much power, and Kennesaw Mountain Landis should go down in history as being a bigger a**hole than even Ty Cobb.

[Mixer!]

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c341/legendofronmexico/bonds_asterisks.jpg

[Soonerus]

Double play ball in last at bats....snooze...

[GrapevineSooner]

My problem with Bonds is not so much as his boorish behavior throughout the years, or even his use of steroids, when so many other players were doing the same thing.

It's more of his steadfast denial that he knowingly used them.

The man has no integrity.

Someone challenge me on this.

To be sure, just every big name player that's been accused of using 'roids has either stepped around the question or steadfastly denied using them.

Bonds catches more flak because:

A) He's on the verge of breaking one of the most hallowed records of all-time.

B) He's an a**hole.

Granted, compared to guys like Sosa, Clemens, and Giambi, Bonds catches more than his fair share of flak.

[Soonerus]

agreed Bonds is an *******...

[AllAboutThe'O']

Can we please stop running those stupid anti-steroid PSA's? We know, steroids are bad and the co-all-time HR leader potentially is on the stuff. Don't keep running those ads down our throat. And while we're at it, MLB, the "There's Only One October" ads are starting to become tiresome, too.

[AllAboutThe'O']

Wow, the Nats' rookie southpaw just challenged Bonds there, making him whiff his last two pitches. But the next-to-last pitch was Bonds' best swing, I thought. If he made contact, the kayaks would be swarming the Cove.

[Soonerus]

True but steroid fog made him miss and Bonds is out of tonight's game now...