another horn, yet again, finds himself into trouble.

[BASSooner]

UT upcoming freshman DT Andre Jones, has a warrant out for his arrest for an armed robbery with former UT safety, Robert Joseph.


http://texas.rivals.com/barrier_noentry.asp?sid=902&script=showmsg.asp&cid=&fid=500&tid=98043149&mid=98043149&rid=


Guys, be grateful that we are not in UT's position.

[colleyvillesooner]

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/080307dnspoutfblede.d72e5719.html


Second UT football player sought in robbery 3:10 PM CT

03:11 PM CDT on Thursday, August 2, 2007

By CHIP BROWN / The Dallas Morning News
[email protected]

AUSTIN – Highly recruited Texas freshman defensive tackle Andre Jones is being sought in connection with the same aggravated robbery that resulted in charges being filed against former Longhorns safety Robert Joseph, according to Austin police.

Toni Chovanetz, an Austin Police Department spokesperson, said Thursday that Jones has been charged with aggravated robbery with a deadly weapon and was working with his attorney to turn himself in. Bond will be set at $40,000.

Joseph was dismissed from the Texas team and announced plans to transfer after being charged with two misdemeanor counts of burglary of a vehicle last month. He remains in the Travis County Jail on $25,000 bond after being arrested last Friday and charged with aggravated robbery with a deadly weapon.

According to Chovanetz, Joseph and Jones entered an apartment in Southeast Austin around 2:30 p.m. last Friday with Joseph pointing a gun at the occupants, including a 14-year-old. Joseph then asked for things such as cellphones and gaming equipment.

According to Chovanetz, Jones repeated Joseph's demands and reached into his waistband for something chrome and acted as if it was a gun.

Jones, 6-5, 295-pound product of El Paso Andress, enrolled at Texas in January and went through spring drills. Jones was a Parade All-American and one of the top recruits at his position coming out of high school last season.

[snp]

Fulmer Cup Champions ahoy!

[SoonerBOI]

wow...

[reddfoxx]

Talk about a life-changing mistake. What were these two idiots thinking? (Signing to play football for Texas- the armed robbery was a good calculated risk)

[101sooner]

Fulmer Cup Champions ahoy!


They should move in to 4th place:


http://www.everydayshouldbesaturday.com/?p=3672#comment-239333

"Six is a magic number. The DWI for Sergio Kindle of the Longhorns this week pushes Texas into a deadlock for the sixth spot on the big board, jamming four teams into a tie. This is when champions make plays, people. Someone’s got to step up. Sergio certainly did to the tune of two more points for the Longhorns."

[MojoRisen]

Wow, That is really a stupid deal- didn't they wear ski masks????

[jrsooner]

I just wonder where their compliancy department was? Aren't these players supposed to fill out a form before breaking the law? I tried to check to see if "armed robbery" was against NCAA rules, but the NCAA.org site is down right now. :)

According to the Austin Statesmen, he's been upgraded:
Andre Jones has yet to turn himself in and the Austin Police Department is now considering the Longhorn freshman defensive tackle as a “fugitive.”

[WestAustinSooner]

well, the've run the gamut the last few years, with armed robbery, DWI, Possession of controlled substances, weapons charges, rape, theft - you name it. This makes the OU team of the 80's look like a bunch of *****cats.

[MojoRisen]

Mack needs to self impose probation like on the 2008 NCAA EA sports game.

[goingoneight]

Alright, I'm giving them more and more credit so as to not put my foot in my mouth since kids get in trouble everywhere... ONE MORE, though... ONE MORE...

[101sooner]

Police Seek Longhorn Football Player Turned Fugitive

http://keyetv.com/longhornfootball/local_story_214180726.html


Sheesh....

[Harry Beanbag]

Dude was a 4 star, 7th ranked DT coming out of high school. Glad he didn't take Stoops' offer to come to Norman.

[Harry Beanbag]

Police Seek Longhorn Football Player Turned Fugitive

http://keyetv.com/longhornfootball/local_story_214180726.html


Sheesh....


That picture in that link doesn't look like his Rivals profile. :confused:

http://oklahoma.rivals.com/viewprospect.asp?Sport=1&pr_key=43274

[sooner n houston]

Some great quotes from here: http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/austin/longhorns/entries/2007/08/02/arrest_warrant_issued_for_longhorn_freshman.html


By Jim Leach
August 2, 2007 6:21 PM | Link to this
This is terrible! Why can't we be like Oklahoma, A&M, and the masters at SMU and pay our guys enough so they won't have to steal?



By Hoss
August 2, 2007 5:29 PM | Link to this
Mack should run for sheriff, he sure knows how to find the criminals...



By Daryl Royale
August 2, 2007 4:47 PM | Link to this
just pay the players so they don't have to assault their fans for spending cash. thanks mack for recruiting these first class citizens. i'm applying for my concealed weapons license tomorrow. 24 arrests since 2004, see a trend?
just wait till TCU gets to town and whips that asssssssssssssssss!


:D :D

[Louisiana Husker]

To bad he wasn't a running back, that way he could of kept up with the tradition of UTerus Rbs getting in trouble one way or another ala Ricky Williams, Cedric Benson and Ramonce Taylor.

[birddog]

and we get probation for a victimless crime.

[47straight]

I hate to see a kid throw his life away. I laugh at the institution (and the lack of institutional control) but I take no pleasure itself in the kid committing such a violent act.

[Big Red Ron]

I just wonder where their compliancy department was? Aren't these players supposed to fill out a form before breaking the law? I tried to check to see if "armed robbery" was against NCAA rules, but the NCAA.org site is down right now. :)

That's funny! Spek.

[Big Red Ron]

Birddog -

You got probation because your athletic department tried to play stupid when they got busted for their employee referral program to Big Red. ?You're an effing tool. We self reported and self imposed some extremely tough penalties when the violations were discovered. If anyone is playing stupid it's Mack "Butter-Tooth" Brown and his penchant for recruiting thugs and criminals.

[Big Red Ron]

I'm sorry.....I had to laugh when I saw your UN. How appropriate. Keep telling yourself whatever it is you need to tell yourself to try and compare our programs. Bobby kicked off those scabs ONLY to lighten the wrath of the NCAA, which turned out to be a joke anyway. The difference between Bob and Mack is that Mack is going to kick the player off the team (if he's proven to be guilty) because it's the right thing to do. Stoops just did it to help shelter pub away from AH and the Lexus thing. I guess that test drive thing is a lot like the game of 04 that you speak nothing of. :texan:Dude that car was a used and not all that great a car. Anyone with the right credit score and down payment can try any car. I drove a Volvo for two weeks before deciding on the Benz.

If you think kicking off the #1 QB prospect in the Nation and future of OUr program and a starting lineman, losing several scholarships (all self imposed) is a joke then you are just stupid.

Although, I guess I'd be ****ed if I were in your shoes. Watching all that go down, only to see us win another Big XII Championship (BTW another huge difference between Stoops and Brown).

(5>2)

[HTown77095]

And I could give a rat's *** about you guys back-dooring your way into the Big XII championship. Everyone in the country knows how you got there (Colt's injury), but does not erase the fact that you had your *** handed to you by UT again. Your Boise State blunder was enough for me to cap off the season with a big smile on my face. Call me when Bobby can win a meaningful game.


How in the h3ll did OU back into the big 12 championship???? Its not our fault you guys choked!! Its not like its anything new to Mack Brown football. Minus vince Young, you guys have a HISTORY of choking! Its not our fault that your little qb is a w uss and can't take a hit. Its not our fault that A&M pounded you AT HOME. You act like everything is OU's fault!!! Its YOUR FAULT FOR CHOKING.


Armed robberies? Child molesters? Drugs? guns? UT has it all...in my mind thats alot worse than a couple of idiots taking a few free paychecks. It happens everyday in corporate america. I see it happen everyweek with no-one getting in trouble for it. People come to work and don't do squat, and leave early on friday. Nothing is done about it. Perfectly legal as long as the boss doesn't have a problem with it.

Go ahead and get your smack in now before October because you know already you'e been beat!!!!

[Big Red Ron]

Bob, if you don't see that Bomar's only season played was as a RS Freshman and became a damn good QB for being so young and how losing him for the next three seasons has really hurt, you are blind.

Was Chris Simms ever named MVP of a bowl game? Shoot, did he ever even win a bowl game?

The only reason why this OU team isn't #1 or #2 in the preseason polls is that we don't have a starting QB to go with, man for man, the most talented football team in the Big XII.

[Zing]

Birddog -

You got probation because your athletic department tried to play stupid when they got busted for their employee referral program to Big Red. These kids (TX players) that are involved in crimes are just punks, and will be kicked off the team. :texan: And don't tell me Stoops kicked his players off the team BEFORE the heat started coming down. Besides, he kicked off two scrubs that meant nothing to the program. I've said it before and I'll say it again.....you guys getting Bomared was a blessing in disguise. PT was a much better QB. Funny how AD got to stick around after his month long test drive, huh?

Watch the highlights from later in the 2005 season and tell us again that Bomar didn't have a good-looking future. He was a fast, strong runner and had quite an arm. A summer of Stoops and Heupel teaching him the system, and who knows? Look, by contrast, at Thompson's passes. Sure, the guy was a mobile quarterback and stepped up in a big way when we needed some leadership, but he was often off the mark. If I had to guess, I'd say there's a good reason for us dropping so far in the polls when Bomar got the boot.

[birddog]

Big Red -

Big difference between you and I with jobs and credit and an 18 year old test driving a car. Big difference, and clearly you must know this.

I am actually appalled to hear you guys lament over losing Bomar. HE DID NOTHING FOR YOU. Highly overrated, and probably would have not been even half as good as even Chris Simms. Besides, no one on the team liked his arrogant *** from the people I've talked to. Nice attempt to try and convince me that the loss of scholarships were self imposed. I do believe that came from the NCAA, which I still believe only took a half-assed jab with kid's gloves on.

And I could give a rat's *** about you guys back-dooring your way into the Big XII championship. Everyone in the country knows how you got there (Colt's injury), but does not erase the fact that you had your *** handed to you by UT again. Your Boise State blunder was enough for me to cap off the season with a big smile on my face. Call me when Bobby can win a meaningful game.

i'll say it for the last time. you all choked your way to a typical whorn season. backdooring is losing at the end of the year and still getting rewarded because a team in front of you lost too. we won out and you all didn't. go away.

[BASSooner]

Dean...please make it go away...

[Big Red Ron]

Dean...please make it go away...Or maybe even Mr. SoonerBoarder?:)

[goingoneight]

Funny how Bob has won an MNC, four BIG 12 titles, been to all the BCS bowls, beat Texass more times than not and this limp-wristed littleignorant punk thinks he's going to win an argument with that as a Texass fan.

[utex74]

UT upcoming freshman DT Andre Jones, has a warrant out for his arrest for an armed robbery with former UT safety, Robert Joseph.


http://texas.rivals.com/barrier_noentry.asp?sid=902&script=showmsg.asp&cid=&fid=500&tid=98043149&mid=98043149&rid=


Guys, be grateful that we are not in UT's position.

:mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad:

If this is true he needs to be gone yesterday. It makes absolutely no sense whatsoever.

[utex74]

From tomorrow's Austin American-Statesman:

Friday, August 03, 2007

The Texas Longhorns are no longer the fair-haired boys of college football.

"We are Texas"? How about: "Which Texas is this"?


Not the Texas that coach Mack Brown molded into a national power with high-character recruits who rarely ran afoul of the law. Not the Texas that steered clear of serious off-the-field offenses.

The second arrest of former UT safety Robert Joseph, this time on aggravated robbery charges, was a head shaker. For the Longhorn Nation, the allegation that freshman defensive tackle Dre Jones participated in the robbery, too, was like running headfirst into a tackling dummy. Without a helmet.

We can't keep saying "another black eye for the program" because the eyes of Texas are rapidly becoming slits. No amount of makeup can cover up these scars. Hook 'em is fast becoming Book 'em.

Since Mack and Vince Young led the program to a fourth national championship on Wednesday, Jan. 4, 2006, there have been 10 — count 'em, 10 — arrests of players involved with the Texas program. Five have come in the last two months.

What is going on here?

Accountability is everything, and Mack must take the hit here. He won a national title and returned this program to top-five prominence. Now he must re-evaluate his recruiting practices before his program disintegrates into something ugly, or uglier.

Brown has a problem in his football family, and he must face that fact. Instead of taking responsibility, he chided the media this week when he said, "It's very interesting that when you have 130 kids, and 128 of them do everything right, if one gets in trouble, you stir it up about one or two."

I like Mack. He's a good, family man who could charm the rattles off a Texas rattlesnake, but the time has come to take another approach in determining what type of kids he's bringing in here. I know there are background checks conducted on recruits every year. Incoming freshmen in orientation are cautioned to avoid drinking, late nights and to pick their friends wisely.

It's worked for the most part, but changes are obviously needed. What changes are up to Mack. That's why he makes over $2 million a year, to make those tough decisions.

If eight current and/or former players are arrested within an 18-month period, it puts a damper on the clean standing of the other 78 players. Bad news travels fast.

This is not the time for coaches or fans to make excuses. Be angry, not apathetic.

One or two arrests a year? Happens in most every major football program in America. But 10 in a year and a half? Now you're venturing into the seedy era of the camouflage-wearing Miami Hurricanes of yesteryear. We saw what Joe Paterno did when six of his Penn State players were arrested for a fight on campus. In addition to any legal punishment the offenders must face, he ordered the entire team to clean the football stadium after each home game.

Like it or not, it's called accountability. Accountability not only as a football player but as a football program.

Brown can't be everywhere his players go. But they hang out with one another. If a team member knew about guns or robberies, they should have intervened.

In the Texas football media guide, Jones is described as a Parade high school All-American, an honor roll student who graduated from Andress High School in El Paso early so he could join his future college teammates for spring football.

Jones grew up dreaming of being in the UT starting lineup one day, not the photo lineup in which he was identified. Now he will join Joseph in jail, in a different shade of orange uniform.

Which brings us to the easiest decision Mack Brown has faced since he offered Vince Young a scholarship. The lawbreakers must go.

Haven't these kids learned anything from Michael Vick? This dude was a $100 million industry unto himself and now there are sewer rats who wouldn't trade places with him. The lesson is you're only as good as your associations. If you lie down with dogs, you will soon wake up with fleas. So If you want to follow your buddy to the penitentiary, go ahead. But you shouldn't be allowed to do it under the guise of being a law-abiding student-athlete for a college reputed to recruit solid citizens.

How many times have we heard coach Brown say: "He's a good kid from a good family."? Well, it's time to find some better kids. More Kelsons and McCoys. Fewer thugs.

[hookem31]

^
^
^
Cedric Golden article.

I've never seen eye to eye with Golden, but he is dead on this time. At a dinner I attended Monday night, Mack said that Melton and Kindle were being dealt with and they preferred not to embarrass the kids any further. Fine.

But with this latest news, it's time to get tough and drop the hammer. The program doesn't need anymore crap like this and these kids need the coaches to step up and make an example. Period.

[PLaw]

TU = Thug U

Where's the DMN and the national media? Where's ESPN? If OU or OSU had a player(s) in similar situations it would be on every Sports Center and on the front page of the Dallas Morning News.

BOOMER
PLAW

[utex74]

Armed robberies? Child molesters? Drugs? guns? UT has it all...

Child molestors?

[colleyvillesooner]

I think he threw in an aggy offense just for kicks ;)

[47straight]

I think he threw in an aggy offense just for kicks ;)

Was it over when the Germans bombed Pearl Harbor?

[Jacie]

To bad he wasn't a running back, that way he could of kept up with the tradition of UTerus Rbs getting in trouble one way or another ala Ricky Williams, Cedric Benson and Ramonce Taylor.

You left out saxet RB, whose unusual name escapes me at the moment, but who was arrested whilst naked in an Austin backyard (not his own).

[HTown77095]

You left out saxet RB, whose unusual name escapes me at the moment, but who was arrested whilst naked in an Austin backyard (not his own).

I talked to a horn about this and he said there was a very good reason why he was running around naked.....he simply was trying to improve his 40 yard dash time (less weight and less wind drag). ;)

[TexasLidig8r]

You left out saxet RB, whose unusual name escapes me at the moment, but who was arrested whilst naked in an Austin backyard (not his own).

That was Edwin Simmons back in the early 80s before your school's shootin' druggin' rapin' days.

As for the situation in Austin, Mack needs to make a strong example of someone... obviously booting R. Taylor, suspending Tarrell Brown for the Ohio State game, suspending R. Joseph and telling him his playing days in Austin were over isn't enough.

Oh.. and I hope my fellow Horns are smart enough not to try to compare this to any other school's situations.... there's enough fallacious, "well, everyone does it, ... or another school does it worse than us..." crapola that flies around. The issue is not with other schools, or programs. And the situation in Austin has become intolerable and embarrassing.

[FaninAma]

Child molestors?
Does the name Marco Martin ring a bell? Then there was the kicker that Brown booted off the team.(pardon the pun) http://www.kffl.com/player/15443/NFL

Actually Lid, to the credit of UT fans, most have been very objective and seemingly earnest about wanting the problem cleaned up.

I, and most Sooner fans, would have more sympathy, however, if so many horn fans hadn't been so judgemental over the Bomar and DD issues.

[HTown77095]

I, and most Sooner fans, would have more sympathy, however, if so many horn fans hadn't been so judemental over the Bomar and DD issues.

Exactly

He who lives in a glass house should not throw stones

(and also has to buy ALOT of windex) :P

[Statalyzer]

How in the h3ll did OU back into the big 12 championship???? Its not our fault you guys choked!!

I completely agree with you, but most of your fans in 2001 were saying that Texas backed into the Big XII CCG. It's not our fault you lost to a 2-8 team at home.


To bad he wasn't a running back, that way he could of kept up with the tradition of UT Rbs getting in trouble one way or another ala Ricky Williams, Cedric Benson and Ramonce Taylor

Only one of those three guys was a UT RB when he got into trouble. Ricky was in the NFL and Ramonce was not part of the team.

[snp]

Only one of those three guys was a UT RB when he got into trouble. Ricky was in the NFL and Ramonce was not part of the team.

I thought Ramonce was one of the guys that jumped someone a month before the NC game.

[Jacie]

The following post was lifted from another board. As you read insert the name of any coach who may have had problems with players where I have substituted **** *****.


Not a single one of the crimes committed by players on the team has anything to do with **** *****. He doesn't run a loose program, he doesn't recruit questionable players, and he doesn't let off-the-field problems go unpunished.

I'm sick of the bitching and finger pointing. Crime is a problem of society and unavoidable, especially with young people. **** ***** is not to blame in any way whatsoever so none of you have any reason to insinuate that his policies need changing.

So according to this, the head coach is NOT to be held accountable for the actions of young men HE was responsible for bringing to the campus.
Just think, The King didn't have to resign afterall.

[XingTheRubicon]

I completely agree with you, but most of your fans in 2001 were saying that Texas backed into the Big XII CCG. It's not our fault you lost to a 3-7 team at home and then we choked in our home state in the Big 12 CC.



Only one of those three guys was a UT RB when he got into trouble. Ricky was in the NFL and Ramonce was not part of the team.

We choked one game (OSU), losing at ranked #2 Nebbish is hardly choking

UT choked twice when everything was on the line.

[soonerinabilene]

Let me answer this for mack...

It is tough to know exactly how each player is going to act when he gets placed on a d-1 powerhouse football team. Did Stoops know that Bomar and Quinn were going to cheat when he recruited them? No. Did Tressell know that Maurice Clarett was going to prepare for an invasion of Poland? No. Did Mack know that this guy was going to bust into an apartment with a gun and demand a Sega? No. Did Bowden know that Wyatt Sexton was God? No. The truth is that not all teenagers are as mature as others. For every Paul Thompson, there are 10 Bomars. For every Applewhite, there are 10 Taylors. Should Mack try harder to recruit more mature kids? Sure, so should every coach. Is it his fault that a kid doesn't know how to behave? No. Its not. How many Sooner fans(myself included) said that Stoops cannot be expected to know the exact behavior of all his players at all times when the Bomar scandal hit? Its the same thing. Only difference is, Mack just happens to have more immature kids on his roster than Stoops does on his.

[HTown77095]

I completely agree with you, but most of your fans in 2001 were saying that Texas backed into the Big XII CCG. It's not our fault you lost to a 2-8 team at home.

I definitely wasn't one of those fans saying that. Championships are earned and shouldn't be based on one game. Both UT and OU fans should know that. But until they change the rules, thats the way it is and will be.

[Sooner98]

Book 'em, Horns! :texan:

[Big Red Ron]

The following post was lifted from another board. As you read insert the name of any coach who may have had problems with players where I have substituted **** *****.


Not a single one of the crimes committed by players on the team has anything to do with **** *****. He doesn't run a loose program, he doesn't recruit questionable players, and he doesn't let off-the-field problems go unpunished.

I'm sick of the bitching and finger pointing. Crime is a problem of society and unavoidable, especially with young people. **** ***** is not to blame in any way whatsoever so none of you have any reason to insinuate that his policies need changing.

So according to this, the head coach is NOT to be held accountable for the actions of young men HE was responsible for bringing to the campus.
Just think, The King didn't have to resign afterall.Someone's head exploded after they read this. I just wonder if it had an N or a T on it.

[sooner n houston]

Cut and pasted this from hornfans, just wanted to make sure it stayed around where I could look it up later.

there are 23 players that have been arrested since 2002. That said, many of them were either recruits, former players or academically ineligible players.

(1)
4-27-2002
* Cedric Benson is arrested following the discovery of marijuana in an apartment he's in in Midland. Charges were dropped.

[dropped due to illegal search and seizure, illegal entry and the fact that the MJ was discovered in a pair of pants owned by the homeowner which were folded up in a drawer, IIRC. Not sure if any suspensions occurred.

(2)
2002
* Brock Edwards is arrested after knocking a kid out at a fraternity party & kicking him while on the ground. The kid required reconstructive surgery.

I've got no clue why BE was allowed to stay on the team. I don't know the background on this one, but at first glance, he should have been gone. There could have been mitigating circumstances that I'm unaware of though. Not aware of punitive actions

(3,4,5,6)
5-1-2003
* Larry Dibbles, Selvin Young, Aaron Harris & Edorian McCullough are arrested after Dibbles is pulled over by Police for failure to use a turn signal & marijuana was discovered. A UT student (who was not in the vehicle) came forward and claimed the weed as his, and that he'd stashed it in the car when he borrowed it the day before. Marijuana residue was found throught [sic] the vehicle & the smell of weed was strong according to the arresting officer. Charges were dropped.

This incident was widely attributed to DWB. The weed was found in a vent or something like that. Seeds were found under the seat I think. IIRC, several of the guys took drug tests that day and were cleared. Not aware of punitive actions

(7)
10-07-2003
* Cedric Benson is arrested for breaking into an apartment to see if his stolen TV was there
* Charges dropped

no excuses. Apparently El Ced thought that his TV was there and had reported it to APD w/o a bit of recourse.... still, should have hired a PI or something. Community service and suspended for the Baylor game

(8)
5-23-2004
* Recruit, Chris Collins, is arrested for sexual assualt of a minor after receiving a BJ & sex from a 12 year following prom. Collins was 17.
* Currently at trial

Scholly offer was retracted. Frankly, I'm not sure how this makes the list of "Texas Players" as he never signed an LOI. Maybe we should add Fred Rouse and Ryan Perriloux?

(9)
12-14-2004
* Erik Hardeman is arrested for possession of cocaine w/ intent to distribute. Hardeman was, at the time, was academically ineligible and was not on the team.

Obviously, Hardeman was gone forever after this incident, but the rumor is/was that he would never have returned to play for Texas before being busted with coke

(10)
9-6-2005
* Myron Hardy is arrested following a 6th Street fight after the guys he fought told police he threatened them w/ a knife. Police discovered an illegal switchblade on Hardy.

I don't recall this particular incident (they all start to run together) and I'm unaware of punitive actions, although I'm sure there were some.... being a backup, it's a lot easier to not notice a suspension than with a starter.

(11)
5-13-2006
* Ramonce Taylor is arrested for possession of 5 lbs of marijuana. Taylor was academically ineligible at the time and was not on the team.
* A plea deal was struck & Taylor served time in jail.

This is another that I'm not sure should be counted, as there was basically zero chance of RT ever playing for Texas again before this incident. Mack had "indefinitely suspended" RT with the intent of him never returning to Texas (from all sources I've ever read or heard) If we count RT (since he was kicked off of the team before this happened) should we also count Ricky since he was a FORMER Horn?

(12,13,14)
6-04-2006
* Tarell Brown, Tyrell Gatewood & Aaron Harris are arrested after a loaded gun & marijuana were discovered after police stopped Harris' car on Monday night before Texas/tOSU. Brown was charged w/ unlawfully carrying a loaded concealed handgun & marijuana possession. Gatewood & Harris were charged w/ weed. The gun belonged to Gatewood & was legally registerd and the weed belonged to Harris, so the charges were dropped against Brown & Gatewood. Harris, at the time of the arrest, was a former UT player and had graduated the previous season.


Harris = FORMER HORN so again, it shouldn't be counted. Brown and Gatewood were immediately suspended. Brown and Gatewood took drug tests and both came up clean. 2 game suspensions in effect for both Brown and Gatewood, IIRC (could be wrong)

(15)
10-22-2006
* Former Horn & current Washington Huskie, Michael Houston is arrested after stealing a cab.

Again, Mack had let this guy go a long time before this happened, not sure why it's laid at Texas' feet.

(16,17)
2-2007
* Ahmard Howard & Brandon Collins are arrested for drug possession.

I think these guys were recruits at the time. I'm not sure what happened and if either were charged or if punitive actions from the university occurred.

(18)
3-22-2007
* Tarell Brown is arrested after his cousin is pulled over by police & weed is discovered. The charges were later dropped against Brown.

TB took a drug test and came up clean. Also, he didn't have anything on him at the time. Brown was no longer a part of the roster at the time of this incident

(19)
6-1-2007
* Henry Melton is arrested for DWI

Stupid

(20)
6-9-2007
* Robert Joseph is arrested for 2 counts of breaking into cars.

Immediately released/suspended/allowed to transfer

(21,22)
7-27-2007
* Robert Joseph & Andre Jones break into an apartment and rob the occupants at gunpoint. Joseph is arrested immediately and Jones is still at large.

Joseph was no longer a part of the roster when this incident occurred. Jones is still only a suspect, even though this board has crucified him and decided he's guilty. I think it sucks that he's been alleged to have participated, but I'll reserve judgment until more info/court appearance.

(23)
7-28-2007
* Sergio Kindle is arrested for DWI.

Stupid




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Another note, this is since April 27, 2002, NOT the widely reported 2004 date. That doesn't make it any prettier, but at least it's more spread out than people are making it out to be....

[Big Red Ron]

Cut and pasted this from hornfans, just wanted to make sure it stayed around where I could look it up later.

there are 23 players that have been arrested since 2002. That said, many of them were either recruits, former players or academically ineligible players.

(1)
4-27-2002
* Cedric Benson is arrested following the discovery of marijuana in an apartment he's in in Midland. Charges were dropped.

[dropped due to illegal search and seizure, illegal entry and the fact that the MJ was discovered in a pair of pants owned by the homeowner which were folded up in a drawer, IIRC. Not sure if any suspensions occurred.

(2)
2002
* Brock Edwards is arrested after knocking a kid out at a fraternity party & kicking him while on the ground. The kid required reconstructive surgery.

I've got no clue why BE was allowed to stay on the team. I don't know the background on this one, but at first glance, he should have been gone. There could have been mitigating circumstances that I'm unaware of though. Not aware of punitive actions

(3,4,5,6)
5-1-2003
* Larry Dibbles, Selvin Young, Aaron Harris & Edorian McCullough are arrested after Dibbles is pulled over by Police for failure to use a turn signal & marijuana was discovered. A UT student (who was not in the vehicle) came forward and claimed the weed as his, and that he'd stashed it in the car when he borrowed it the day before. Marijuana residue was found throught [sic] the vehicle & the smell of weed was strong according to the arresting officer. Charges were dropped.

This incident was widely attributed to DWB. The weed was found in a vent or something like that. Seeds were found under the seat I think. IIRC, several of the guys took drug tests that day and were cleared. Not aware of punitive actions

(7)
10-07-2003
* Cedric Benson is arrested for breaking into an apartment to see if his stolen TV was there
* Charges dropped

no excuses. Apparently El Ced thought that his TV was there and had reported it to APD w/o a bit of recourse.... still, should have hired a PI or something. Community service and suspended for the Baylor game

(8)
5-23-2004
* Recruit, Chris Collins, is arrested for sexual assualt of a minor after receiving a BJ & sex from a 12 year following prom. Collins was 17.
* Currently at trial

Scholly offer was retracted. Frankly, I'm not sure how this makes the list of "Texas Players" as he never signed an LOI. Maybe we should add Fred Rouse and Ryan Perriloux?

(9)
12-14-2004
* Erik Hardeman is arrested for possession of cocaine w/ intent to distribute. Hardeman was, at the time, was academically ineligible and was not on the team.

Obviously, Hardeman was gone forever after this incident, but the rumor is/was that he would never have returned to play for Texas before being busted with coke

(10)
9-6-2005
* Myron Hardy is arrested following a 6th Street fight after the guys he fought told police he threatened them w/ a knife. Police discovered an illegal switchblade on Hardy.

I don't recall this particular incident (they all start to run together) and I'm unaware of punitive actions, although I'm sure there were some.... being a backup, it's a lot easier to not notice a suspension than with a starter.

(11)
5-13-2006
* Ramonce Taylor is arrested for possession of 5 lbs of marijuana. Taylor was academically ineligible at the time and was not on the team.
* A plea deal was struck & Taylor served time in jail.

This is another that I'm not sure should be counted, as there was basically zero chance of RT ever playing for Texas again before this incident. Mack had "indefinitely suspended" RT with the intent of him never returning to Texas (from all sources I've ever read or heard) If we count RT (since he was kicked off of the team before this happened) should we also count Ricky since he was a FORMER Horn?

(12,13,14)
6-04-2006
* Tarell Brown, Tyrell Gatewood & Aaron Harris are arrested after a loaded gun & marijuana were discovered after police stopped Harris' car on Monday night before Texas/tOSU. Brown was charged w/ unlawfully carrying a loaded concealed handgun & marijuana possession. Gatewood & Harris were charged w/ weed. The gun belonged to Gatewood & was legally registerd and the weed belonged to Harris, so the charges were dropped against Brown & Gatewood. Harris, at the time of the arrest, was a former UT player and had graduated the previous season.


Harris = FORMER HORN so again, it shouldn't be counted. Brown and Gatewood were immediately suspended. Brown and Gatewood took drug tests and both came up clean. 2 game suspensions in effect for both Brown and Gatewood, IIRC (could be wrong)

(15)
10-22-2006
* Former Horn & current Washington Huskie, Michael Houston is arrested after stealing a cab.

Again, Mack had let this guy go a long time before this happened, not sure why it's laid at Texas' feet.

(16,17)
2-2007
* Ahmard Howard & Brandon Collins are arrested for drug possession.

I think these guys were recruits at the time. I'm not sure what happened and if either were charged or if punitive actions from the university occurred.

(18)
3-22-2007
* Tarell Brown is arrested after his cousin is pulled over by police & weed is discovered. The charges were later dropped against Brown.

TB took a drug test and came up clean. Also, he didn't have anything on him at the time. Brown was no longer a part of the roster at the time of this incident

(19)
6-1-2007
* Henry Melton is arrested for DWI

Stupid

(20)
6-9-2007
* Robert Joseph is arrested for 2 counts of breaking into cars.

Immediately released/suspended/allowed to transfer

(21,22)
7-27-2007
* Robert Joseph & Andre Jones break into an apartment and rob the occupants at gunpoint. Joseph is arrested immediately and Jones is still at large.

Joseph was no longer a part of the roster when this incident occurred. Jones is still only a suspect, even though this board has crucified him and decided he's guilty. I think it sucks that he's been alleged to have participated, but I'll reserve judgment until more info/court appearance.

(23)
7-28-2007
* Sergio Kindle is arrested for DWI.

Stupid




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Another note, this is since April 27, 2002, NOT the widely reported 2004 date. That doesn't make it any prettier, but at least it's more spread out than people are making it out to be....Wow, that makes Barry look like a saint.

[hookem31]

Cut and pasted this from hornfans, just wanted to make sure it stayed around where I could look it up later.

there are 23 players that have been arrested since 2002. That said, many of them were either recruits, former players or academically ineligible players.

(1)
4-27-2002
* Cedric Benson is arrested following the discovery of marijuana in an apartment he's in in Midland. Charges were dropped.

[dropped due to illegal search and seizure, illegal entry and the fact that the MJ was discovered in a pair of pants owned by the homeowner which were folded up in a drawer, IIRC. Not sure if any suspensions occurred.

(2)
2002
* Brock Edwards is arrested after knocking a kid out at a fraternity party & kicking him while on the ground. The kid required reconstructive surgery.

I've got no clue why BE was allowed to stay on the team. I don't know the background on this one, but at first glance, he should have been gone. There could have been mitigating circumstances that I'm unaware of though. Not aware of punitive actions

(3,4,5,6)
5-1-2003
* Larry Dibbles, Selvin Young, Aaron Harris & Edorian McCullough are arrested after Dibbles is pulled over by Police for failure to use a turn signal & marijuana was discovered. A UT student (who was not in the vehicle) came forward and claimed the weed as his, and that he'd stashed it in the car when he borrowed it the day before. Marijuana residue was found throught [sic] the vehicle & the smell of weed was strong according to the arresting officer. Charges were dropped.

This incident was widely attributed to DWB. The weed was found in a vent or something like that. Seeds were found under the seat I think. IIRC, several of the guys took drug tests that day and were cleared. Not aware of punitive actions

(7)
10-07-2003
* Cedric Benson is arrested for breaking into an apartment to see if his stolen TV was there
* Charges dropped

no excuses. Apparently El Ced thought that his TV was there and had reported it to APD w/o a bit of recourse.... still, should have hired a PI or something. Community service and suspended for the Baylor game

(8)
5-23-2004
* Recruit, Chris Collins, is arrested for sexual assualt of a minor after receiving a BJ & sex from a 12 year following prom. Collins was 17.
* Currently at trial

Scholly offer was retracted. Frankly, I'm not sure how this makes the list of "Texas Players" as he never signed an LOI. Maybe we should add Fred Rouse and Ryan Perriloux?

(9)
12-14-2004
* Erik Hardeman is arrested for possession of cocaine w/ intent to distribute. Hardeman was, at the time, was academically ineligible and was not on the team.

Obviously, Hardeman was gone forever after this incident, but the rumor is/was that he would never have returned to play for Texas before being busted with coke

(10)
9-6-2005
* Myron Hardy is arrested following a 6th Street fight after the guys he fought told police he threatened them w/ a knife. Police discovered an illegal switchblade on Hardy.

I don't recall this particular incident (they all start to run together) and I'm unaware of punitive actions, although I'm sure there were some.... being a backup, it's a lot easier to not notice a suspension than with a starter.

(11)
5-13-2006
* Ramonce Taylor is arrested for possession of 5 lbs of marijuana. Taylor was academically ineligible at the time and was not on the team.
* A plea deal was struck & Taylor served time in jail.

This is another that I'm not sure should be counted, as there was basically zero chance of RT ever playing for Texas again before this incident. Mack had "indefinitely suspended" RT with the intent of him never returning to Texas (from all sources I've ever read or heard) If we count RT (since he was kicked off of the team before this happened) should we also count Ricky since he was a FORMER Horn?

(12,13,14)
6-04-2006
* Tarell Brown, Tyrell Gatewood & Aaron Harris are arrested after a loaded gun & marijuana were discovered after police stopped Harris' car on Monday night before Texas/tOSU. Brown was charged w/ unlawfully carrying a loaded concealed handgun & marijuana possession. Gatewood & Harris were charged w/ weed. The gun belonged to Gatewood & was legally registerd and the weed belonged to Harris, so the charges were dropped against Brown & Gatewood. Harris, at the time of the arrest, was a former UT player and had graduated the previous season.


Harris = FORMER HORN so again, it shouldn't be counted. Brown and Gatewood were immediately suspended. Brown and Gatewood took drug tests and both came up clean. 2 game suspensions in effect for both Brown and Gatewood, IIRC (could be wrong)

(15)
10-22-2006
* Former Horn & current Washington Huskie, Michael Houston is arrested after stealing a cab.

Again, Mack had let this guy go a long time before this happened, not sure why it's laid at Texas' feet.

(16,17)
2-2007
* Ahmard Howard & Brandon Collins are arrested for drug possession.

I think these guys were recruits at the time. I'm not sure what happened and if either were charged or if punitive actions from the university occurred.

(18)
3-22-2007
* Tarell Brown is arrested after his cousin is pulled over by police & weed is discovered. The charges were later dropped against Brown.

TB took a drug test and came up clean. Also, he didn't have anything on him at the time. Brown was no longer a part of the roster at the time of this incident

(19)
6-1-2007
* Henry Melton is arrested for DWI

Stupid

(20)
6-9-2007
* Robert Joseph is arrested for 2 counts of breaking into cars.

Immediately released/suspended/allowed to transfer

(21,22)
7-27-2007
* Robert Joseph & Andre Jones break into an apartment and rob the occupants at gunpoint. Joseph is arrested immediately and Jones is still at large.

Joseph was no longer a part of the roster when this incident occurred. Jones is still only a suspect, even though this board has crucified him and decided he's guilty. I think it sucks that he's been alleged to have participated, but I'll reserve judgment until more info/court appearance.

(23)
7-28-2007
* Sergio Kindle is arrested for DWI.

Stupid




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



Another note, this is since April 27, 2002, NOT the widely reported 2004 date. That doesn't make it any prettier, but at least it's more spread out than people are making it out to be....


By my count, 13 players, not 23.

Just pointing that out. Obviously this problem is not being fixed and I'm not happy about it. But I'm sure not gonna let recruits who never played for us, players that had already been kicked off for academics, or former players be lumped into that.

[meoveryouxinfinity]

Let me answer this for mack...

It is tough to know exactly how each player is going to act when he gets placed on a d-1 powerhouse football team. Did Stoops know that Bomar and Quinn were going to cheat when he recruited them? No. Did Tressell know that Maurice Clarett was going to prepare for an invasion of Poland? No. Did Mack know that this guy was going to bust into an apartment with a gun and demand a Sega? No. Did Bowden know that Wyatt Sexton was God? No. The truth is that not all teenagers are as mature as others. For every Paul Thompson, there are 10 Bomars. For every Applewhite, there are 10 Taylors. Should Mack try harder to recruit more mature kids? Sure, so should every coach. Is it his fault that a kid doesn't know how to behave? No. Its not. How many Sooner fans(myself included) said that Stoops cannot be expected to know the exact behavior of all his players at all times when the Bomar scandal hit? Its the same thing. Only difference is, Mack just happens to have more immature kids on his roster than Stoops does on his.

Hey! He had lyme disease! (Wyatt Sexton that is)

[Statalyzer]

We choked one game (OSU), losing at ranked #2 Nebbish is hardly choking

UT choked twice when everything was on the line.

That's true but not relevant to what I was saying.

[Big Red Ron]

That's true but not relevant to what I was saying.Which wasn't relevant to this thread anyways.


;)

[utex74]

Exactly

He who lives in a glass house should not throw stones

(and also has to buy ALOT of windex) :P

In all fairness, we threw the rocks first and then foolishly moved into that glass house. Then the windows started getting knocked out.

And we were judgemental regarding Bomar and DD (for me particularly DD) but I have read plenty of posts here characterizing UT as a bunch of druggie, drunk, gun toting, "child molestors" (that one still gets me). We are judgemental of each other, it is what we do. But there are times we need to be judgemental about our own programs and this is one of those times for us.

[utex74]

By my count, 13 players, not 23.

Just pointing that out. Obviously this problem is not being fixed and I'm not happy about it. But I'm sure not gonna let recruits who never played for us, players that had already been kicked off for academics, or former players be lumped into that.

I keep hearing five players this summer but that is only if you count Joseph twice and he was shown the door after the first offense. We have problems that need to be dealt with but we are also not exactly "thug-U".

[hookem31]

True. I was, however, disappointed in Mack's response today.

From the DMN -


"We are disappointed to hear about the recent allegations against Dre Jones," Brown said in a statement. "They are very serious charges. We will cooperate with authorities through the legal process and support Dre any way we can. We've talked with Dre and his family and have decided to suspend him indefinitely. He will not be involved in any team functions at this time, pending the completion of the legal process."

"It's a shame that these recent events have generated a great deal of negative attention because I do think that overall, this is as good of a group of kids that I've ever coached," Brown said. "I think that will show over time."

On another board, I was asked why I felt that what he said wasn't enough and what I would have said. My response?


As the head coach of this university, I feel as though I must accept some responsibility for this. We do the best we can to make sure these kids understand what we expect out of them. Obviously, some just don't seem to understand what that means.

In regards to Kindle and Melton, these are unfortunate incidents that happened, but they should have known better. That being said, they are kids and kids make mistakes. They are currently being punished in-house and both will sit for the first four games of this season. They will both be required, before any court ruling comes down, to attend multiple DWI and alcohol awareness classes.

Now to speak on Jones. He has been informed by myself that he longer is a part of this team and that his scholarship has been pulled. Although he hasn't been convicted, the type of behavior he exhibited will not be acceptable in my program, ever. And we will be doing more to try and get it through these kids' heads that this kind of behavior does nothing but ruin what could possibly be a great career and a good life.


Many of our fans want some of these kids' heads on platters. That's not gonna happen, because whether or not they choose to believe it, it's not the right thing to do. While those that have committed felonious crimes do not have a place here, those who've made mistakes will be allowed to atone for said mistakes.

I have also talked with the entire team about their responsibility as high profile college athletes. Sure, a DWI is not the end of the world and it happens to many. But as representatives of The University of Texas, they are held to a higher standard than others. And, as such, more is expected out of them.

[Big Red Ron]

How old is Mack?

Is it possible that since he finally won a Championship not affiliated with OU, or just in general, he's starting to hit the cruise control?

[hookem31]

Mack will be 56 on the 27th.

[jrsooner]

These are the comments I've been loving...seems like just a few weeks ago all these "people" were saying that Stoops and OU should have known what our players were doing 24/7, but mackie gets a pass. :)


By Dona
August 3, 2007 7:12 PM

COACH BROWN IS A COACH NOT A FULL TIME "BABYSITTER". THESE YOUNG MAN THAT ARE BREAKING THE LAW ARE DOING IT DURING A TIME WHEN THE COACHING STAFF HAS NO CONTROL OVER THEIR ACTIONS. "YOU CAN TAKE A HORSE TO WATER BUT YOU CAN'T MAKE HIM DRINK". SO GOES FOR THESE YOUNG MAN WHO HAVE BEEN TAUGHT RIGHT FROM WRONG BUT CHOOSE THE WRONG PATH ANYWAY.
MAYBE IF THE MEDIA WOULD NOT BE SO EAGER TO REPORT EVERY WRONG AND REPORT ABOUT THOSE WHO ARE WORKING WITH OUR YOUTH OR VISITING THOSE WHO ARE SICK IN AREA HOSPITALS OR WORKING A SUMMER JOB TO HELP OUT WITH FAMILY BILLS. THOSE "BAD SEEDS" WHO ARE LOOKING FOR A QUICK HEADLINE MIGHT FADE AWAY.
BEST WISHES TO THE 2007 UT FOOTBALL TEAM AND THE COACHING STAFF. MAY YOU LIGHT THE TOWER ORANGE EACH AND EVERY SATURDAY THROUGHOUT THE SEASON. HOOK 'EM HORNS!!!Austin Article (http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/austin/longhorns/entries/2007/08/03/jones_suspended_indefinitely.html)

[HTown77095]

Of course Mack gets a pass. What can one expect from the self righteous.

What I want to know and what is probably on alot of other peoples mind is how much is the Hook 'em payoff Hook 'em gonna be to sweep THIS ONE under the rug.

[Big Red Ron]

So, anyone who watches ESPN seen any of this stuff on there?

[HTown77095]

So, anyone who watches ESPN seen any of this stuff on there?

Nah, I gave up on ESPN giving us reliable sports information. I only watch them when I need a good laugh.

[Paperclip]

"child molestors" (that one still gets me).

Marco Martin was wanted for molesting a young boy, but inexplicably the cops couldn't find him to arrest him. Where was he? He was in Austin playing for the Longhorns. Nice detective work there.

[utex74]

These are the comments I've been loving...seems like just a few weeks ago all these "people" were saying that Stoops and OU should have known what our players were doing 24/7, but mackie gets a pass. :)

Austin Article (http://www.statesman.com/blogs/content/shared-gen/blogs/austin/longhorns/entries/2007/08/03/jones_suspended_indefinitely.html)

Neither Mack nor Stoops can know what these players are doing 24/7. (Big Red employing a couple dozen players might have warranted a little attention but I don't know what was or was not done. Can't believe Stoops would have knowingly permitted his QB to take cash so I tend to lean your way on that) What is absolute is both Mack and Stoops are the CEO's of very large businesses. Both make over $2M and like any CEO they are responsible for everything that happens in their programs. Mack has to find a way to control the Texas program as Stoops needs to ensure control of yours. The programs are bigger than the men and neither program will accept anything less. Tough jobs but that is why they make $2 million a year. If it was easy, anyone could do it.

But for either coach, once a player leaves or is removed from the program their responsibility for that player stops. Half of the Texas players listed earlier were out of the program when they committed the listed offense. Coaches take them for 4-5 years. They don't have to nurse them into middle age.

[utex74]

Marco Martin was wanted for molesting a young boy, but inexplicably the cops couldn't find him to arrest him. Where was he? He was in Austin playing for the Longhorns. Nice detective work there.

What happened was before he went to Texas and he was arrested after he left Texas. There was no detective work because it wasn't reported until much later.

[MojoRisen]

This is true but it is a football team - nonetheless of what they are paid these days.


I"ll put a horses head in Mccoy's parents bed Q!!!!

[Paperclip]

What happened was before he went to Texas and he was arrested after he left Texas. There was no detective work because it wasn't reported until much later.

He was arrested after he left Texas, but the complaint was alledged while he was still there. Dallas police stated they didn't know where he was.

[HTown77095]

But for either coach, once a player leaves or is removed from the program their responsibility for that player stops. Half of the Texas players listed earlier were out of the program when they committed the listed offense. Coaches take them for 4-5 years. They don't have to nurse them into middle age.

Listen....you are the very reason why I despise longhorn fans. You go to GREAT LENGTHS to justify your positon as to why your program is "just alittle bit better" than OUrs. And trust me, it is not. WHY.....and let me repeat that...WHY in GODS GREEN EARTH would you say that an EX-LONGHORN not represent UT????!?!?!?!

[utex74]

Listen....you are the very reason why I despise longhorn fans. You go to GREAT LENGTHS to justify your positon as to why your program is "just alittle bit better" than OUrs. And trust me, it is not. WHY.....and let me repeat that...WHY in GODS GREEN EARTH would you say that an EX-LONGHORN not represent UT????!?!?!?!

We're talking athletic programs' responsibility. They can screw up when they leave UT and that does reflect poorly on UT but they are no longer the responsibility of the athletic program. The coaches and tutors and mentors cannot follow them once they leave here. They are grown and they are responsible. By your reasoning I guess when the Boz wrecked his career with 'roids and then made bad movies that it reflects poorly on the Sooner football program? No. You are not responsible for him after he left OU. (while he was AT OU is a whole different topic) People make their own decisions as they go through life and their bad decisions do not reflect on those people or institutions who are in their past.

[101sooner]

Look 'Horn, I can deal with about any amount of trash talking, but when you start taking shots at "Stone Cold", that crosses the line.

[HTown77095]

We're talking athletic programs' responsibility. They can screw up when they leave UT and that does reflect poorly on UT but they are no longer the responsibility of the athletic program. The coaches and tutors and mentors cannot follow them once they leave here. They are grown and they are responsible. By your reasoning I guess when the Boz wrecked his career with 'roids and then made bad movies that it reflects poorly on the Sooner football program? No. You are not responsible for him after he left OU. (while he was AT OU is a whole different topic) People make their own decisions as they go through life and their bad decisions do not reflect on those people or institutions who are in their past.

Well I agree that your institution is not responsible for athletes (or any other student) when they leave UT, but like it or not, people associate those athletes with the school they came from. What is the first thing that comes to mind when the name 'Ricky Williams' comes up? For most people, I would say the three nouns that likely will follow are: UT, Heisman, weed. See how that works?

Hopefully, that 'institution' helped that individual learn the concept of cause and effect. And how to accept responsibility and use good judgement. If the 'institution' did its job right, that individual would come out of college with the tools to be successful in life. You guys brag about how good your school is, but I tell ya, I'm not that impressed based on its products...

[ashley]

I would like to jump on tu but as a former coach I can tell you that when you get 100 guys tough enough to play big time college football and put them at one place there are going to be problems. This is true at any school.
Now about tu, did you know ther are plans in the works to film the third Longest Yard in Austin. Yes the deserve a little being made fun because turn about is fair play.

[soonerloyal]

Friendly CFB rivalry notwithstanding, surely no decent person would celebrate young people's ethical and criminal downfalls, or at least their very bad choices. I extend my sincere prayers and sympathy to the families and friends, as well as the players and the alleged victims. I am sorry for the unfortunate situation Brown's team finds itself in.

I do not blame coaches automatically when players screw up off the field. I do look to see how the head coach and his staff, and the University officials handle things for the future good & integrity of the program. That to me is where the emphasis should be, so that the program's honor remains intact.

How UT handles these transgressions, immediate & longterm is in my view the most vital factor. When any program has to deal with such sad events, it takes away the focus and joy of athletic competition and the sheer fun that is college football.

Although I abhore some of the actions that a few of UT's players have made recently, I derive no pleasure from seeing a University, a football program or a fan base suffer. But, that's just one little old broad's opinion...

[hookem31]

Listen....you are the very reason why I despise longhorn fans. You go to GREAT LENGTHS to justify your positon as to why your program is "just alittle bit better" than OUrs. And trust me, it is not. WHY.....and let me repeat that...WHY in GODS GREEN EARTH would you say that an EX-LONGHORN not represent UT????!?!?!?!

So do we get to make fun of y'all because of Holloway's recent arrest? :D

[SoonerAtKU]

So do we get to make fun of y'all because of Holieway's recent arrest? :D

Only if you spell it right, slick.

[HTown77095]

So do we get to make fun of y'all because of Holloway's recent arrest? :D

Yep, its like water off a ducks back my friend. We are used to it.

[utex74]

What is the first thing that comes to mind when the name 'Ricky Williams' comes up? For most people, I would say the three nouns that likely will follow are: UT, Heisman, weed. See how that works?

I'm thinking it's mostly people from this part of the country who associate Ricky with UT. When I think of Michael Vick I think of Atlanta. I don't associate Virginia Tech with dog fighting, rightly or wrongly.

[cherokeebrewer]

Look 'Horn, I can deal with about any amount of trash talking, but when you start taking shots at "Stone Cold", that crosses the line.
:D:)

[jrsooner]

But for either coach, once a player leaves or is removed from the program their responsibility for that player stops. Half of the Texas players listed earlier were out of the program when they committed the listed offense. Coaches take them for 4-5 years. They don't have to nurse them into middle age.According to the NCAA it doesn't stop there. Once a student-athlete always a student-athlete. :P

[utex74]

According to the NCAA it doesn't stop there. Once a student-athlete always a student-athlete. :P

I'm afraid you'll have to show me that one. So Holieway's and Quinn's recent arrests are going to bring more scrutiny on OU? And when Bomar takes some more money at SHSU they will reopen an investigation in Norman? And you don't even want them to look at Bozworth and have it go back to you.

I gotta throw the bull**** flag on that one.

[birddog]

listen here, you know some people are going to look at all the incidents involving players and stretch it to former players, players who hadn't actually played yet etc., to make it look worse. but only if it's convenient and you don't turn the tables on their program.:D

[47straight]

I'm afraid you'll have to show me that one. So Holieway's and Quinn's recent arrests are going to bring more scrutiny on OU? And when Bomar takes some more money at SHSU they will reopen an investigation in Norman? And you don't even want them to look at Bozworth and have it go back to you.

I gotta throw the bull**** flag on that one.

Actually, whorn, it does bring more scrutiny to the school, because when Quinn gets arrested it is literally on ESPN reported as "Ex-Sooner Arrested." Not "Current Montana State Player" or my personal favorite "Former Longhorn Recruit." So you can take that and just grooove on it for a while.

[47straight]

So do we get to make fun of y'all because of Holloway's recent arrest? :D


You can make fun of us when you learn the player's names. :texan:

[jrsooner]

I'm afraid you'll have to show me that one.
....
I gotta throw the bull**** flag on that one.Nope, it's true. We had the compliancy department down here to talk to the Alumni Group. I was able to get a few extra minutes with them, since I do the same thing but in the IT field.

The NCAA looks at things in two ways...
1. Once a student-athlete always a student-athelete
2. Once a booster always a booster

Whether you like it or not, that's the way it is. The OU Compliancy website has a few misdirected links it appears. Supposedly the pamphlet that was given to us is not on there anymore that explains it. In fact, they said the univesity can be held accountable for any infractions by boosters and student-athletes from 9th+ grade until after they graduate.

If it makes you feel better, I did a quick query on "armed robbery" on the ncaa.org site and this is the only page it came up with...

Coaches' Approval Restrictions

Individuals convicted of violent crimes are prohibited from receiving a coaches' approval number from LexisNexis and will not be permitted to coach at an NCAA certified event. Individuals convicted of a non-violent crime would be eligible to receive a coaches' approval number from LexisNexis if, and only if, the charge is older than seven years. The following guidelines are utilized by LexisNexis to determine whether an individual is approved or denied:

Violent Crimes (violent crime against a person) per NCAA include the following:

Bodily Injury
Drug Delivery or Traffic
Armed
Use of gun
All assaults
Sexual misconduct or assaults
Listed on a sex offenders list
Robbery (armed or unarmed) - taking of another property, from his or her person or immediate presence and against his or her will, by means of force or fear.So it may be that the NCAA doesn't have any problems with felons on your roster so Mack may be okay on this one. :) I may have to call or email the compliancy office this week and see if they know the answer to it.

[trwxxa]

FWIW, Kindle and Melton will sit out the first three games. I guess they are not going to Disney World.

[utex74]

FWIW, Kindle and Melton will sit out the first three games. I guess they are not going to Disney World.

Three games is part of it. There is also community service, they will miss part of the early practices being assigned work with DWI victims, not allowed to participate in any public events or represent the team. Then there are the legal penalties. Sounds about right for a first offense DWI. Sergio was in the mix for a starting LB job this year so he has some decisions to make.

Also Andre Jones (the freshman arrested this week) is not even listed on the team roster anymore.

[47straight]

Also Andre Jones (the freshman arrested this week) is not even listed on the team roster anymore.


Ooo, Mack so rough.



I love how the local media has tried to spin Andre Jones as a "recruit" or "signee." Um, no. He enrolled early, went through spring drills, and was conveniently located on campus when finally tracked down (but we don't know where he was, APD, swear and cross my heart!). That's a player.

[utex74]

Ooo, Mack so rough.



I love how the local media has tried to spin Andre Jones as a "recruit" or "signee." Um, no. He enrolled early, went through spring drills, and was conveniently located on campus when finally tracked down (but we don't know where he was, APD, swear and cross my heart!). That's a player.

I have read every word in the Statesman on this matter and I never saw him referred to as anything other than a "Texas football player". If I missed one stupid reporter's story, so be it, but they have been raked over the coals in the press right down to the Ben Sargent cartoon and Kelso column in today's paper. Finally, in today's press conference Mack discussed the "Player" arrested for armed robbery.

You "local media" must not be too local.

I am one Texas fan who is satisfied with Mack's actions. If you are not, well...no disrespect intended, but that could not possibly be less relevant. But enjoy yourself anyway.

[goingoneight]

I usually give :mack: credit for running a program as legit as he can. Yeah, I'll admit the Sooner in me realizes that it's Texas, and that this has been happening a lot lately. Mack and Bob are constantly getting ribbed for trying to do the right thing... they cannot, will not and should not be expected to know what these kids are doing all hours of the day by the time they've been out recruiting, watching film, doing charity events, coaching at practice, analyzing their own team to find out who to recruit, etc... did I mention that these are both grown men with families, too?
Kids need to grow up and stop screwing up their program's image... end of story. Bomar, Quinn, Rawls, Kindle, R. Taylor... they're all alloweed to live and make mistakes and bad choices since they're human... and they're all allowed to get some form of a second chance, but eventually you have to take notice to what is right and what is wrong. And robbing someone's house is a no-brainer.

[utex74]

I usually give :mack: credit for running a program as legit as he can. Yeah, I'll admit the Sooner in me realizes that it's Texas, and that this has been happening a lot lately. Mack and Bob are constantly getting ribbed for trying to do the right thing... they cannot, will not and should not be expected to know what these kids are doing all hours of the day by the time they've been out recruiting, watching film, doing charity events, coaching at practice, analyzing their own team to find out who to recruit, etc... did I mention that these are both grown men with families, too?
Kids need to grow up and stop screwing up their program's image... end of story. Bomar, Quinn, Rawls, Kindle, R. Taylor... they're all alloweed to live and make mistakes and bad choices since they're human... and they're all allowed to get some form of a second chance, but eventually you have to take notice to what is right and what is wrong. And robbing someone's house is a no-brainer.

I agree with every word you say. Jones is gone unless it is later shown to be a mistake, which it doesn't appear to be. Kindle and Melton's DWI's were their first screw up and I think their punshment is appropriate. I am SO ready for this damn offseason to end. Practice for us starts tomorrow.

[goingoneight]

I think it's pretty weak to sit and point fingers needlessly. It doesn't really help in anyway.

[StoopTroup]

Even if the whorns were completely banned from playing Div I Football...it doesn't really matter....

Hell can't freeze over more than once.

[goingoneight]

Even if the whorns were completely banned from playing Div I Football...it doesn't really matter....

Hell can't freeze over more than once.

:confused:

[47straight]

down to the Ben Sargent cartoon

That Ben Sargent cartoon said absolutely nothing about any particular player, andre jones included. Everyone knew you were a whorn. Now we know you're completely unreliable.


If you are not, well...no disrespect intended, but that could not possibly be less relevant. But enjoy yourself anyway.

No disrespect intended, but you are a delusional, condescending, no-life whorn. Bless you heart!




(see, "bless you heart" works too when you want to be a pompous ******* but want to maintain a fake front of civility.)

[47straight]

You "local media" must not be too local.

You are so right. 1300AM "The Zone" aka "The Longhorn Station" is not too local at all.




Moran.

[TexasLidig8r]

You are so right. 1300AM "The Zone" aka "The Longhorn Station" is not too local at all.

Doesn't knowledge of the Longhorn Station make you ipso facto.. a Longhorn lover?

[utex74]

You are so right. 1300AM "The Zone" aka "The Longhorn Station" is not too local at all.

Moran.

1300 AM is under contract to UT as the Longhorn flagship station. They do not qualify as unbiased media. They will not stray from the official line and everyone in Austin knows it. I don't listen to them unless I need to to catch a game. As far as the cartoon, I was referring to coverage of UT athletes in trouble this summer. Not Jones specifically.

But how can I expect someone who cannot spell "moron" to keep up?

[snp]

But how can I expect someone who cannot spell "moron" to keep up?

That's Soonerfans.com nomenclature.

Try and keep up.

[utex74]

That's Soonerfans.com nomenclature.

Try and keep up.

My bad.

[goingoneight]

My bad.

Yeah... BASTAGE!!! :D

[Big Red Ron]

Mack is running THE renegade, thug program of this decade.

[utex74]

Mack is running THE renegade, thug program of this decade.


:pop:

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

I would rather play for Pete Carroll's The Million Dollar Mansion, and Nice Accomadations Program of the Decade!

[hookem31]

It's still not September, is it? :(