In checking other boards...

[LoyalFan]

...one discovers a fair balance between the rabid OU haters and those who feel we got unfairly hosed...with (so far) one notable exception.
Guess who. Need a hint? Try "77-0".
While there are some fairminded Ags in evidence there are also some mad dogs who are literally foaming at the mouth about the whole dealio and have been since the initial story broke. The few that have attempted to calm the mob have been cursed, damned, and accused of being either Sooner moles or Sand Aggies.
What's even more intriguing are the interspersed "Fran sucks" threads.
What are they smoking over at Sing-Sing West anyway...Collie poop?
Texiz Tek used to be their main obsession but it's become obvious that WE are.
Maybe if we'd been owned by THEM so often I'd have a similar reaction if they had the NCAA on their case (and that's just a matter of time, you wait and watch,) but I hope not.
Hell, are WE circling like vultures over USC? A small minority are, but it's nothing like the feeding frenzy in Collitch Stayshun.
I once had aspirations to be an Aggie...Corps! I guess I've still got that soft spot for them and this won't kill it. It sure makes it feel a bit peaked though.
Thank God my TexAg bassin' buddy (and great friend) is a mature and balanced dude (even if he does run into furniture a lot.) I wish the mob over there would live by his example.
LF

[Sooner in Tampa]

**** Them All !!!

[Mac94]

There is a bit of added reason to why many of my fellow Aggies are upset ... it's called "Gilbertgate" from 1993.

What happened to us back then is very similar to what went on at big Red ... a booster paying players during a summer job for work not performed, all while our basketball team had just been sanctioned a year or so prior.

Our punishment was 1 year TV ban and a bowl ban ... along with 5 or so year probation.

Given the vast similarities, there is bitterness over the perceived NCAA favoritism towards OU after the Sooners received what many think is a much lighter punishment than what we received for similar crimes.

I am not going to say it's right or wrong ... but there is a background to what many Aggies are feeling. Think of how this board will react if (when) USC skates.

[OKLA21FAN]

correct me if I am wrong,
but the OU basketball sanctions had not been put in place by the NCAA when these football violations occurred.

so it is a bit different than A&M's in '93.

[Sooner in Tampa]

Like a dumb@$$ I went to dip$hitpower.com :rolleyes: They are freakin frothing at the mouth over this whole deal



If OU were in TX, their would be charges filed against Stoops and the Atheletic department personel for fraud. They put a product on the field that was sold as legal, but not. I remember several mid-tier schools in Texas had charges brought up on their basketball coaches on fraud for playing players that were not legal. Head in the sand management is no longer an excuse.

What is the amount of jail time these days for making several million per year via fraud?



what a pompous idiot. if ou had been monitering it would have been discovered a lot sooner. its so obvious that they looked the other way and then to appeal this slap on the wrist is extremely arrogant


Instead of just a "slap on the wrist (which they got)", apparently they want a pat on the back. Sooner logic at its best. The funniest thing about this whole deal is that every caller on sports-talk radio is whining about USC, which has absolutely nothing to do with this.

I never thought I would read about aggies and "elite programs" in the same sentence :eek:


It makes me wonder if there is even a point in trying to make OSU become an elite program. It's becoming more and more obvious that there are different rules for different schools. Obvious cheating answered with nothing more than a slap on the wrist. Nothing that the NCAA did today would make OU even think twice about maybe playing by the same rules that MOST everybody else have to play by.

What the hell planet are these people on anyway?

[Mac94]

Not when the occured ... but the basketball sanctions ... as well as mens and womens gymnastics issues were already ruled on when the NCAA deliberate and investigate the football issues.

There some differences, some that favor OU (we had nine players invovled and we had been on football probation in 1988) and some that favored A&M (we had fewer programs on NCAA probation at the time, the money amount per player was much higher at Big Red, and our scandal occured during the summer far away from College Station).

All I am saying is why some of my Aggie brethern are a bit more upset about this. Many feel OU was given a much lighter punishment for similar crimes.

[LoyalFan]

There is a bit of added reason to why many of my fellow Aggies are upset ... it's called "Gilbertgate" from 1993.

What happened to us back then is very similar to what went on at big Red ... a booster paying players during a summer job for work not performed, all while our basketball team had just been sanctioned a year or so prior.

.

Mac,

Re "very similar"; Did A&M SELF-report the offense? What illegal influences, if any, were attributed to Aggie alums, boosters, staff, etc?
What were the dissimilarities, other than the punishment and the timeline re the basketball brouhaha? I remember that I was saddened by it but other than that I simply cannot recall.

BTW, does your nickname refer to your high school days...perhaps Mac HS in SA?
If so....BROTHER! LOL!

LF

[Ag_in_TX]

I think A&M self-reported and kicked the guys off the team the same way OU did - after they'd been outed.

One way it was different was that I believe the NCAA was still ****ed at A&M about not being able to nail us more heavily in 1988 and took it out on us in 1993.

I personally think Bowen ought to just more on instead of appealing, but hey - that's just my opinion.

As an aside (this has probably been discussed here), on the appeal, can the NCAA increase the penalty?

[Mac94]

Did we self report? Yes and no ... the story first broke in the Dallas Morning News and as soon as it did we conducted an internal investigation, dealt our punishment suspending some players, removing others and then reported to the NCAA. Of course, with the Big Red deal, many of the "texag" crowd will say that broke from an internet posting by a poster that had a girlfriend working at Big Red. ;)

As for the findings, the NCAA cleared the athletic department and the findings were that, like in the Big Red gig, it was the act of one lone booster, Warren Gilbert, and a few players. The athletic department had no involvement.

I highlighted a few differences in my last post. Are they important to the differences in the crime? Who knows ... this is the NCAA we're talking about ... they have no real logic ... they just make it up as they go along.

But, there are alot of similarities and because of this and the perceived differecne in punishment ... all I am saying is this is why many of my fellow Ags are a tad more upset than other fan bases.

As for my user name ... nope, nothing to do with SA or Macarthur High ... I gre up in Arlington ... went to Lamer High. Because of our last name, my granddad; a Westpoint alum and career officer, got the nickname "Mac" from his comrades in arms. He was an engineer in the U.S. Army and in WWII he was assigned to England to help construct air bases for the Army Air Corps. After D-Day, because there was a shotage of officers, he was pressed into combat duty and led troops into combat during the hedge row campaign in France. He also served in Korea and served during the Cold War around the world. I use Mac as a tribute to him.

[DalHorn]

The ags should point their anger at SMU rather than the Sooners. NCAA was on a mission in Texas back in those days due to the ponies' blatant cheating in the 80's.

No way a&m would get hit that hard this time around.

and FWIW, I was hoping for a light penalty. Ag can agree we've seen what happens to a conference when the NCAA pulls out it's big whooping stick.

[sooner n houston]

I've been reading the TxAg boards this week as well. Seems to me most of them were hoping we would get nailed so they could pick up more/better recruits! :D

[Mac94]

DalHorn -

Agreed ... the were all over the SWC ... I think Rice and Arkansas were the only schools not hit by the NCAA in the 1980's

As for my personal feelings on this ... I must admit my own bias as I grew up a Sooner fan and still am (save one little saturday each fall). As an Ag I can understand my fellow Aggies being upset by this .... yet, at the same time, I thought the NCAA was very unfair to us at the time .... what happened with OU in terms of the ships and recruting, etc was about what I would have expected for us. So, in that sense, it really wasn't a bad punishment and it would be hypocritical considering my feelings about what happened to us to demand another unfair sentence.

As for the 8 games in 2005 ... that's a bit awkward ... it's kind of like doing something without really doing something. It's not lie OU's win over us in Norman is really erased ... we all know what happened.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Personally, the National Communists Association of Amerika is still ****ed OU and UGA sued and won TV rights. I think that and the fact that they can stick it to us played a big role. "Calvin Simpson" didn't help any either. Screw the U Miami person, they are the biggest thugs around and where is the justice when USC will walk "because no one is cooperating with them".

[sjt]

I got a good laugh while reading one of the 'Bama boards.
When discussing the OU situation, someone remarked that the OU punishment included the loss of 10 Alabama scholarships and an extra month of probation. Not much admiration for the NCAA over there!

[GrapevineSooner]

But at least they got to claim another national title in the process.

[BoonesFarmSooner]

I agree with Mac94 for the most part, but the DMN did uncover this and remember reading it in the paper when it was first discovered. Seems like there were some really high profile names: Greg Hill, Sam Adams, etc. but I could be mistaken.

I think the thing that frustrates most OU fans the most is the inconsistent rulings out of the NCAA... How does the USC administration NOT know there are agents on the sidelines, that Reggie Bush's parents are living in some high dollar house, the Dwayne Jarret deal, etc.

As far as the Tx Aggies are concerned, I think a lot of them are too young to remember what happened in the early 90's or 88...

[soonervegas]

Let there be no doubt A&M's venom is for one reason and one reason only:

The realization that they are the 3rd biggest power in the state of Texas.

If we were 5-6 every year you wouldn't hear a peep from them.

[Mac94]

Boones -

Greg Hill, LB Jessie Cox, and WR Brian Mitchell were the key guys involved ... Dallas area kids that went back home over the summer.

soonervegas -

Would so many around here be so up in arms about Reggie Bush and the Trojans if USC were a 5-6 team? Considering our history with the NCAA and the punishment we received for similar issues, Aggies have more to gripe about regarding OU than Sooners do with USC ... yet I see quite a few USC references around here. Pot ... Kettle ... Black ... and all that stuff.

[soonervegas]

soonervegas -

Would so many around here be so up in arms about Reggie Bush and the Trojans if USC were a 5-6 team? ... yet I see quite a few USC references around here. Pot ... Kettle ... Black ... and all that stuff.

No disagreement here.

[Phil]

I can see, to some degree, why Aggy might see this as disparate treatment for similar crimes. Of course, the thing that they miss is that this isn't 1993. The whole landscape of college football has changed. How long has it been since a big-time college football program got hit with loss of a bowl and/or TV by the NCAA? Who knows, Aggy may have been the last. That stuff isn't going to happen anymore because it doesn't just penalize the school getting hit, but their conference and any team they play. TV money is the sacred cow, and the NCAA isn't going to do anything to anybody that's going to cut down on the green stuff coming in the door. It's got nothing to do with who - the variable is when.

But the whole vacation of wins thing is chicken****. I'm going to send the NCAA a bill for the money I spent on tickets and travel to those eight games, since they have decided they didn't really happen and all.

[sooneron]

I can see, to some degree, why Aggy might see this as disparate treatment for similar crimes. Of course, the thing that they miss is that this isn't 1993. The whole landscape of college football has changed. How long has it been since a big-time college football program got hit with loss of a bowl and/or TV by the NCAA? Who knows, Aggy may have been the last. That stuff isn't going to happen anymore because it doesn't just penalize the school getting hit, but their conference and any team they play. TV money is the sacred cow, and the NCAA isn't going to do anything to anybody that's going to cut down on the green stuff coming in the door. It's got nothing to do with who - the variable is when.

But the whole vacation of wins thing is chicken****. I'm going to send the NCAA a bill for the money I spent on tickets and travel to those eight games, since they have decided they didn't really happen and all.
Didn't bammer lose a bowl game on the last go round a few years ago?

[OSUAggie]

Didn't bammer lose a bowl game on the last go round a few years ago?

2-year postseason ban. No TV ban, though.

A&M was banned from TV for 1 year. A&M's penalty was significantly more harsh because of the "repeat violator" status of their crimes.

[silverwheels]

They think the NCAA shows favoritism towards us? Have they seen our history with that corrupt, worthless organization?

[Mac94]

silver -

Remember, we have only been conference brethern since 1996 ... alot of the past stuff from the 1980's on back to the 1950's will not be immediately known by most Aggies.

What you are seeing is an emotional reaction based on what happened to us last time ... penalties many of us thought unduely harsh.

Phil is right, though, college ball has changed and the TV ban is pretty much gone. It may still be in the books, but because of the money issues and the effects on other teams ... it won't be used again. The last time it was used was 1994 ... it was used on three schools that season, with A&M being one of them.

[silverwheels]

silver -

Remember, we have only been conference brethern since 1996 ... alot of the past stuff from the 1980's on back to the 1950's will not be immediately known by most Aggies.

That is true. It's obvious we got off lightly compared to them, but that's not because of favoritism. As has been pointed out, it's because of the times and the current state of college football.

[gardere_owns_ou]

of course the farmers got hit with a stiffer penalty.. schools like Texas, OU, USC, etc.... are the cream of the crop. the elite. the NCAA can't afford to punish schools that bring in the kind of money we do.

all A&M does is spend money on upgrades and new facilities. they don't make any money. there is no profit. reading the $Bill weeklies about begging aggies to step up and act like aggies by buying season tickets is proof.

my opinion on your sanctions... i don't really care. it's nice to see y'all get busted as much as y'all would like to see us get busted.

[Statalyzer]

^ Don't forget Bill Byrne asking his loyal ags to band together and raise money to cover the concrete track around their field with bacteria resistant material so they can protect players go out of bounds and scrape their skin on the concrete and get germs from the horse manure that Corps Cavalry drops on the track.


Let there be no doubt A&M's venom is for one reason and one reason only:

The realization that they are the 3rd biggest power in the state of Texas.

1. Texas
2. TCU
3. Texas Tech
4. Texas A&M

[Phil]

^ Don't forget Bill Byrne asking his loyal ags to band together and raise money to cover the concrete track around their field with bacteria resistant material so they can protect players go out of bounds and scrape their skin on the concrete and get germs from the horse manure that Corps Cavalry drops on the track.

Heh. That one will never get old.

[wishbonesooner]

I found the pathetic excuse for fans called gopokes.com. Our little brothers have totally stopped talking about OSU and have given in to their fixation for us. I need a shower.
Funny thing is, with all the Boone Pickens money floating around Stillwater, it won't be long before they have another slush fund probation. It will be soooo fun to watch too.

[Common sense ref]

But the whole vacation of wins thing is chicken****. I'm going to send the NCAA a bill for the money I spent on tickets and travel to those eight games, since they have decided they didn't really happen and all.[/QUOTE]




:D Now that's funny!! Can you imagine what they would think when they opened up your letter?

[Crimsontothecore]

I found the pathetic excuse for fans called gopokes.com. Our little brothers have totally stopped talking about OSU and have given in to their fixation for us. I need a shower.
Funny thing is, with all the Boone Pickens money floating around Stillwater, it won't be long before they have another slush fund probation. It will be soooo fun to watch too.
Nothing new about that. They still weren't finished talking about Stoops and the investment thing when the NCAA ruling came down. You would think they would be talking more about the "worlds greatest offense":rolleyes:

[OSUAggie]

I found the pathetic excuse for fans called gopokes.com. Our little brothers have totally stopped talking about OSU and have given in to their fixation for us. I need a shower.
Funny thing is, with all the Boone Pickens money floating around Stillwater, it won't be long before they have another slush fund probation. It will be soooo fun to watch too.

So your "little brothers" are fixated on OU and the probation, yet you're anxious to watch OSU with their next probation (making an assumption that somehow Cowboy Golf, Inc., earmarked for facility improvements, will turn into a slush fund)?

[Brons2]

Think of how this board will react if (when) USC skates.

USC is gonna skate, and nobody is happy about it.

[goingoneight]

Like a dumb@$$ I went to dip$hitpower.com :rolleyes: They are freakin frothing at the mouth over this whole deal







I never thought I would read about aggies and "elite programs" in the same sentence :eek:



What the hell planet are these people on anyway?
They should just feel lucky that PT wasn't playing the 2005 Bedumb game, they'd have lost by a helluva lot more. PT played a better OSU team... on the road, and never turned the ball over. Aggie logic = fart in the wind... no one should ever care.