Cheney says his office not an “entity within the executive branch.”

[Hatfield]

this is retarded even by this administration's standards.

Vice President Exempts His Office from the Requirements for Protecting Classified Information

The Oversight Committee has learned that over the objections of the National Archives, Vice President Cheney exempted his office from the presidential order that establishes government-wide procedures for safeguarding classified national security information. The Vice President asserts that his office is not an “entity within the executive branch.”

As described in a letter from Chairman Waxman to the Vice President, the National Archives protested the Vice President's position in letters written in June 2006 and August 2006. When these letters were ignored, the National Archives wrote to Attorney General Alberto Gonzales in January 2007 to seek a resolution of the impasse. The Vice President's staff responded by seeking to abolish the agency within the Archives that is responsible for implementing the President's executive order.

In his letter to the Vice President, Chairman Waxman writes: "I question both the legality and wisdom of your actions. ... [i]t would appear particularly irresponsible to give an office with your history of security breaches an exemption from the safeguards that apply to all other executive branch officials."

A fact sheet prepared by Chairman Waxman describes other instances in which the Vice President's office has sought to avoid oversight and accountability.

here's the fact sheet: http://oversight.house.gov/documents/20070621095118.pdf

[TAFBSooner]

Yiminy!

Why don't you all cut Our Vice President a little slack?

As long as he's out personally torturing and killing those Iraqis that attacked us on the 11th of September, 2001, he should be allowed to leak a few government agents' names to the media if that is What's Best for All of Us.

I mean, it's not like his office was established as part of the Executive Branch by Article II of the Constitution or anything.

[soonerscuba]

I wouldn't talk about Cheney like that. He might crawl from under your bed and crush your windpipe with his mind.

[mdklatt]

The Vice President asserts that his office is not an “entity within the executive branch.”


You need to put the right emPHAsis on the correct sylLAble--the key word is "his". And he's exactly right. His office routinely does things outside of the scope of the exective branch. :D

[Frozen Sooner]

Hey, don't forget-he's got his all-important duties as President of the Senate. Which actually gives his argument some credence from a really niggling standpoint.

[JohnnyMack]

Cheney

Bomb

Terror

Bomb

Terror

President

There. I'm sure the NSA will come take me away now.

[Scott D]

didn't you know that Cheney is the secret overlord of the RLIMC Antelope Pit Fighting Ring. It was in all of those exempt classified documents.

[NormanPride]

You know, I never really paid attention to politics until this administration. Are they all this full of idiots?

[Scott D]

yes

[mdklatt]

You know, I never really paid attention to politics until this administration. Are they all this full of idiots?

Maybe not to this extent, but don't get all excited that things are going to get much better in 2009 regardless of who wins.

[NormanPride]

Oh, I have no illusions of that. I just don't want the next POTUS to do anything, really.

[mdklatt]

Oh, I have no illusions of that. I just don't want the next POTUS to do anything, really.

With any luck we'll get a deadlock government. I'd like a Democrat White House and Republican Congress. Congress could keep spending in check, and the president could veto whatever stupid flag burning ammendments, gay marriage bans, and "Creation science" mandates Congress came up with. I'd really like moderate Republicans to take charge and tell the social conservatives to take a hike, but I don't think that's going to happen any time soon.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

I say the opposite MD. The Republicans suck when holding the purse strings in Congress. They do a lot more to restrain spending as the opposition party. When they're in power, they spend like drunken sailors.

[yermom]

Hey, don't forget-he's got his all-important duties as President of the Senate. Which actually gives his argument some credence from a really niggling standpoint.

kinda what i was thinking... still kinda silly

[mdklatt]

I say the opposite MD. The Republicans suck when holding the purse strings in Congress. They do a lot more to restrain spending as the opposition party. When they're in power, they spend like drunken sailors.

It's the Democrats who have all the high-falutin' ideas. When Clinton was in office, Gingrich and the boys kept themselves busy going after him rather than doing anything substantial. It was great. Unless you stopped getting paid when the government shut down because they couldn't pass a budget.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

It's the Democrats who have all the high-falutin' ideas. When Clinton was in office, Gingrich and the boys kept themselves busy going after him rather than doing anything substantial. It was great. Unless you stopped getting paid when the government shut down because they couldn't pass a budget.

I actually liked Gingrich. When he was there he kept those boys in line and if he didn't have such a crappy personality, he could have actually done something worthwhile, like abolish the DOE. All the weanies that have run the House since he left have allowed the monkeys to run the zoo.

[def_lazer_fc]

absolutely nothing surprises me anymore. i am now officially the most jaded and cynical person ever when it comes to politikin'.

[OklahomaTuba]

Sounds like the VP is taking a page out of Bill & Hillary's old playbook.

[Hatfield]

Sounds like the VP is taking a page out of Bill & Hillary's old playbook.

what the heck does that even mean?

yes or no...do you support the vice president when he says he isn't part of the executive branch?

[OklahomaTuba]

what the heck does that even mean?

yes or no...do you support the vice president when he says he isn't part of the executive branch?

Guess you've forgotten all the **** that the Clinton's tried to pull like this during the Whitewater/travelgate/monicagate/Chinese donors/etc bullshiat?

And no, I think its stupid, if its even true and not some biased BS.

[mdklatt]

Guess you've forgotten all the **** that the Clinton's tried to pull like this during the Whitewater/travelgate/monicagate/Chinese donors/etc bullshiat?


Biggest. Nonsequiter. EVAR.

[Jerk]

It's the Democrats who have all the high-falutin' ideas. When Clinton was in office, Gingrich and the boys kept themselves busy going after him rather than doing anything substantial. It was great. Unless you stopped getting paid when the government shut down because they couldn't pass a budget.
Congress does best when they're in recess or vacation.

I agree 100% with your philosophy.

The less they do, the better off we all are.

Spek.

btw- have you guys seen congress's approval ratings? They're trying to out-do Bush.

[Hatfield]

sorry tuba, i have been away for awhile, i forgot for a moment you like to throw things out there that have zero relevance to the topic at hand.

[Rogue]

Mark Twain, Will Rogers, and now Jerk..


Congress does best when they're in recess or vacation.
:D :D :D


Dick Cheney really must believe that he is above and exempt from the law.
My only solace when "W" was elected the first time was the experienced cabinet he put together. The years since then have shown me how naive I was with that optimism.

[Octavian]

so...Cheney disclosed the info to the Archives in '01 and '02 when he considered his office as part of the Executive Branch....but in the year the Iraq War began he suddenly decided the Vice President was no longer part of the Executive Branch so he didn't need to disclose the same information he'd previously been disclosing?


All the while refusing to disclose other information regarding his Energy Task Force, Gitmo, and a host of other issues because of....Executive Privilege. And he continues to receive daily national security briefings not provided to the Legislative Branch...


But he's not part of the Executive Branch.


Disgraceful.


My only hope is that we can just get through the next year and a half without this administration attempting to do anything else of substance. They've royally botched everything they've touched since Day 1 --I remember in 2000 that I was happy when they "won"....but wow, what a miserable mistake --and I feel sorry for the administration (regardless of party) that has the task of inheriting W's Legacy.

[DalHorn]

ugh. Cheney is a frickin criminal. We have wannabe dictators in the white house. If there's some way these knuckleheads can get an "emergency" 3rd term they will.. i.e. war with Iran.

[mdklatt]

If there's some way these knuckleheads can get an "emergency" 3rd term they will.. i.e. war with Iran.

I wouldn't put it past Bush to issue a signing statment that declares the 22nd Amendment "unconstitutional".

[bellefay1]

If Cheney caught his daughter and Newt's sister in bed...who would he shoot in the face?

[OklahomaTuba]

I wouldn't put it past Bush to issue a signing statment that declares the 22nd Amendment "unconstitutional".

You mean like the dims trying to gut the whole freedom of speech and freedom of the press thingy???

Oh wait, nevermind, it has a nice cute friendly name called the "fairness doctrine", so its cool. As you were.

[OklahomaTuba]

and I feel sorry for the administration (regardless of party) that has the task of inheriting W's Legacy.

Yes, that booming economy, no attacks since 9/11, record unemployment, record wealth accumulation really does suck. Hopefully the libz can "fix" all of those things by hiking up taxes, spending and the white flag.

Assuming the libz can accomplish more than raising their own salaries that is.

[yermom]

i wish i lived in Tubaland, it sounds nice there

[OklahomaTuba]

sorry tuba, i have been away for awhile, i forgot for a moment you like to throw things out there that have zero relevance to the topic at hand.

Yeah, I suppose you're right. I think the fact that Clinton actually claimed execitive privilege in a CIVIL sexual harassment case is MUCH worse than this stupidity, don't you??

[OklahomaTuba]

i wish i lived in Tubaland, it sounds nice there

Chicks and Beer man, Chicks and Beer.

[1stTimeCaller]

This is what happens to career politicians. They forget that they actually work for us and their power comes from us. Then again, none of us actually vote them out of office. See Gene Stipe for example.

* When I say us I am talking about citizens as a whole, not just us in this thread or board.

[OklahomaTuba]

Cheney isn't even close to being a Gene Stipe.

Maybe one day the libz will get lucky and pin something on him like they did with Libby. As of yet, Cheney hasn't done one illegal thing. Something Gore can't even claim.

[Harry Beanbag]

If Cheney caught his daughter and Newt's sister in bed...who would he shoot in the face?

That sounds kinky.

[Scott D]

If Cheney caught his daughter and Newt's sister in bed...who would he shoot in the face?

hopefully himself. But he's such an *** he'd probably end up with a flesh wound. ;)

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Yawn...you guys are good at pumpin' yourselves up. In the '08 election, you'll be good and ready to downsize the military, pay lots more taxes, import lots more illegals, be on a long waiting list for emergency surgery, start real fights with conservatives after destroying the first amendment(Fairness Doctrine for radio), and crash the stock markets with punitive taxes on capital gains. You might want to reconsider the positions you have somehow found yourselves in.

[SleestakSooner]

Moths (Tuba, RLIMC) to flame (anti-BushDick thread)

ANYONE who even remotely tries to defend the actions of the current regime is a tool for a conservative cause and suspect at best.

The sad thing is if there was a person that could unify all those opposed to the current ilk who represent this country, some deluded moron, who thinks a lot like those previously mentioned, would most likely go John Wilkes Booth on him and we'd be back to square none.

[SoonerKnight]

Hook em
You know, I never really paid attention to politics until this administration. Are they all this full of idiots?

Texas Sucks!!! I had to get that off my chest. George Bush is from texas and Cheney is from Wyoming. Could we have expected any better?? Hook 'em Hook 'em Hook 'em TEXAS SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[landrun]

“entity within the executive branch.”

That's Republican speak for 'no controlling authority'.

In either case, the problem with this country isn't cheney or Gore etc..

Its the fact that you and me will allow 'our guy' to get by with this crap.
Truth is these guys are all alike and if WE would demand that they act with integrity rather than trying to justify the criminals in our own party it would come to an end. Repubs and Dems are both guilty. And the people that vote for them are too.

That means ... YOU. :pop:

If you're a democrat and are complaing about Cheney but didn't complain about the Clinton administration, or worse yet, still try to pretend they' were good people who ran an administration with integrity, then YOU are the problem.

If you're a republican trying to justify the Bush Admin. YOU are the problem.

This country will continue to deterioriate as long as 'we the people' let criminals who push our agenda get by with crime. Until we all demand that OUR GUYS behave with integrity, nothing will change.

[OklahomaTuba]

Sounds like it was a stupid everyday political game to me. Didn't hurt anyone except Cheney in the end, and thats ok with me.

Now, had he taken "funds" from the Chinese, or tried to claim he could use executive privilege to stop a sexual harassment lawsuit he was involved in, it might be a different story.

[SoonerKnight]

I wish Bush had only gotton a blow job in the Oval Office what he has done is far worse then making a stain on some intern's dress. He has made a stain on the Constitution. Power, always breeds corruption but you will find it hard to find a more corrupt administration since Grant and he was forgiven because he won the Civil War. As for Bush he doesn't even have any accomplishments in the 6 full years he has been in office and is now a lame duck!!! Please our problem is they impeached Clinton for lying about something that was personal and done nothing to the Bush administration!! We need leaders that will not try to take our rights away while claiming our safety is in danger. Look at the people that he hires i.e. Good Job Brownie WOW he handle Katrina well didn't he? Iraq was Bush's idea! He is losing the war not the Democrats!! He is the Commander Guy!!!



That's Republican speak for 'no controlling authority'.

In either case, the problem with this country isn't cheney or Gore etc..


If you're a democrat and are complaing about Cheney but didn't complain about the Clinton administration, or worse yet, still try to pretend they' were good people who ran an administration with integrity, then YOU are the problem.

If you're a republican trying to justify the Bush Admin. YOU are the problem.

[1stTimeCaller]

that's an awesome and timely response. Keep up the good work!

[SoonerKnight]

Okay so I don't have time to post all the time I usually read and leave but had to post this! Who cares about time it isn't relevant!!!!



that's an awesome and timely response. Keep up the good work!

[OklahomaTuba]

He has made a stain on the Constitution. Power, always breeds corruption but you will find it hard to find a more corrupt administration since Grant and he was forgiven because he won the Civil War.

Actually, Bush has been way less corrupt then the Clinton's ever thought of being.

But don't let basic facts stop your parroting of someone else's talking points. :D

[Harry Beanbag]

:les: He is the Commander Guy!!!


Awesome quote man.

[soonerloyal]

I've been a Republican for years, and I know there's NO comparison to a stupid blow job in the Oval Office, and all the BS brouhaha that ensued, and the bendover job that's happening due to this moronic Administration. I voted for Bush twice, and I deserve to be b****slapped for being so gullible.

"Not a part of the Executive Branch"? I know third graders who know more about the Constitution, and respect it more than YOU do, Dick C. If we Americans were truly as stupid as this Administration thinks we are...we'd be on ventilators, because we'd be too brain damaged to breathe on our own.

When Clinton had his sexcapades, I was disgusted, but it was a matter between he and his wife; not particularly our business. Now, when Clinton LIED UNDER OATH - THAT was OUR BUSINESS. The laws apply to EVERYONE, or they truly apply to no one. Lying under oath was what he should have been gutted for, not being a sexually and morally bent idiot. And to think we're being treated so much worse by people claiming to be the "morally superior" ones just makes me want to spit nails.

The problems I had with Clinton were numerous, including NAFTA, no healthcare, the Telecommunications Act, dubious business dealings, questionable character, etc. But there's no WAY the 'toons are on as subpar a level as Bush, Cheney, Rove, ad nauseum. Look at this from a NON-partisan angle, guys: blatant disregard for basic Constitutional rules. Discarding of governmental respect for Habeas Corpus & the Magna Carta, the wellspring of democracy (even the nasty ol' King of England we separated ourselves from believed in the Magna Carta, and he was a crazy bastige). The top Law Enforcement Fella of The Land, the A.G. Mister Al Gee, commits perjury while holding the A.G. post; before that, as Bush's attorney, he tries to coerce a doped-up Ashcroft (no winner himself mind you) to sign a extension of questionable policy instead of dealing with ACTING A.G. Comey. Harriet "I've Got a Crush on Dubya" Meiers, is only one of many who thumbs her trained nose at official proceedings, too. Cheney - have we ever witnessed a V.P. so "involved" in running this country? If there's any justice in this world, Cheney will go on a hunting trip with Teddy Drunkspin Kennedy at the wheel, and neither one will be heard from again. We could go on for hours at Cheney's many transgressions. And there's not enough room on the Internet to go into the evil machinations of Karl Rove. And Bush? I used to think he was "homey" and "sincere". Now I see he's a sincere cretin. All this twisting of the Constitution under the guise of "We're in a War on Terrrr", all the lying under oath...either the laws apply to all, or they apply to no one. Party affiliation be damned. I decry the commutation (and eventual pardon) of Scooter Libby as much as I did the same for Marc Rich. Same old BS, same stink.

Sure, Lincoln temporarily suspended Habeas Corpus during the Civil War. Yes, Clinton signed into law the Anti-Terrorism Bill after the Murrah Bombing and limited H.C. somewhat for the first time since the War Between the States, but it was again limited & temporary. The changes being made now are frightening in their scope and a crushing blow to longterm freedom and security.

The threat of terrorism is real. Unfortunately, so is the coersion of the public using that real threat as an excuse to twist the Constitution into whatever those in power want it to say. All in the name of corporate profit, longterm tax breaks for the wealthiest, and a "What, Me Worry?" mentality by a powerful few who are setting things up so that they will not have to answer for any wrongdoing.

What a bunch of PUTZES. I want my party back, you SOBs. I want my country back, while you're at it.

What we have here, folks, is a TOTAL BLATANT DISREGARD for the oaths and the offices these people hold. Almost every daily move this Administration makes is a slap in the face not just to Americans in general, but to our troops who swore to uphold, protect and defend the very same Constitution. Jeebus. I'll put up with the world seeing a President get ridiculed for a blowjob over this catastrophe ANY day. I'm not regurgitating ANY party line - I'm grabbing both by the shorthairs and demanding accountability and responsible behavior no matter who sits in the Big Chair. It's what good citizens should do.


I've been a registered Republican, Democrat and Independent. I'm the PROUD mother of two Marines. I love my country and I truly support our troops. I treasure my freedoms and I abhore terrorism. But I'm smart enough to know when we're being lied to, manipulated, and generally mind****** by people who care more about money and power than our future as a free nation.

[SoonerKnight]

WOW! You sound more like a Democrat! If Republicans talked like you I'd have changed parties years ago. You only have to look at the parties canidates to see the difference. Also "I'm not a member of an organized political party. I am a Democrat!" Will Rogers





I've been a registered Republican, Democrat and Independent. I'm the PROUD mother of two Marines. I love my country and I truly support our troops. I treasure my freedoms and I abhore terrorism. But I'm smart enough to know when we're being lied to, manipulated, and generally mind****** by people who care more about money and power than our future as a free nation.

[SoonerKnight]

I want some of what your smoking!!! Damn man Bush less corrupt? Hmmm Clinton was investigated to death and they found nothing. Now he won't get rid of his AG and his AG committed perjury to save Bushes hide. Yeah ok!!!




Actually, Bush has been way less corrupt then the Clinton's ever thought of being.

But don't let basic facts stop your parroting of someone else's talking points. :D

[bluedogok]

I used to be a Republican, until this administration got into power and abused it fully. They haven't bothered to hide their corruption or agenda of feeding the corporate machines that paid their way into office.

To me this version of the Republican party bears little resemblance to the party of 25 years ago.....but then I think both mainstream parties are equally corrupt anymore. It seems their only goal is to prevent meaningful change so they can consolidate their powers.


BTW - I am not a Democrat either.......I really quit being a Republican when I moved to Texas in 2003. The Oklahoma Republican party was not near as bad as these loons down here.

[SoonerKnight]

I am a Democrat but I would vote for the best person just haven't seen that from the otherside. I mean a president's son for christ sake! I said that back in 2000. Geez!! His experience was?


I used to be a Republican, until this administration got into power and abused it fully. They haven't bothered to hide their corruption or agenda of feeding the corporate machines that paid their way into office.

To me this version of the Republican party bears little resemblance to the party of 25 years ago.....but then I think both mainstream parties are equally corrupt anymore. It seems their only goal is to prevent meaningful change so they can consolidate their powers.


BTW - I am not a Democrat either.......I really quit being a Republican when I moved to Texas in 2003. The Oklahoma Republican party was not near as bad as these loons down here.

[soonerloyal]

I haven't seen a candidate from either side yet that I'd cross the street to listen to.

Sweet Jeebus, make me wrong, but I have a baaaaad feelin' that Hilary is gonna be in the White House next time. Great, just what we need - another corporate arse-kisser. Like Bush, but bitchy.

[SoonerKnight]

They are all corporate *** kissers. Bush is just an oil man remember those energy meetings that were "off the record." I mean they are public employees having off the record discussions about PUBLIC policy!!!! Whats next we lock Americans up in Cuba with no lawyer and no trials oh wait!! Hook 'em :les:




I haven't seen a candidate from either side yet that I'd cross the street to listen to.

Sweet Jeebus, make me wrong, but I have a baaaaad feelin' that Hilary is gonna be in the White House next time. Great, just what we need - another corporate arse-kisser. Like Bush, but bitchy.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Dick Cheney is my favorite Republican.

[usmc-sooner]

Bush gets people drunk, removes their kidney, then leaves them in an ice bath and sells their kidney on the black market.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Dick Cheney is my favorite Republican.If they can't topple Bush, Cheney would provide gleeful satisfaction.

[OklahomaTuba]

I am a Democrat but I would vote for the best person just haven't seen that from the otherside. I mean a president's son for christ sake! I said that back in 2000. Geez!! His experience was?

Gov of one of the largest states in the country isn't experience?

That's a hell of a lot more experience than anyone running on the dims side has.

Oh wait, Hussien did write a book, never mind.

[OklahomaTuba]

What we have here, folks, is a TOTAL BLATANT DISREGARD for the oaths and the offices these people hold. Almost every daily move this Administration makes is a slap in the face not just to Americans in general, but to our troops who swore to uphold, protect and defend the very same Constitution. Jeebus. I'll put up with the world seeing a President get ridiculed for a blowjob over this catastrophe ANY day. I'm not regurgitating ANY party line

Heh. That made me laugh.

At least try to use some examples of this "total blatant disregard" when you are regurgitating the 2004 talking points, mmmkay? Thanks! :D

[soonerloyal]

How cute. I pen a well-thought-out political opinion; and since you disagree, all you can come up with as a discussion point is "Oh, yeah, you do too regurgitate! So there! Nyah!" Touched a nerve, did I? That's okay sweetie, nobody made it mandatory for you to bail off the Bush altar.

So you just let your eyeballs roll right past the perjury, ignoring subpoenas, and the like. Just like you obviously stick your fingers in your ears anytime the Administration screams another refusal to follow lawful commitments like oversight of handling critically classified documents, weaseling away from any attempts at checks and balances, obstruction of justice, firing any military commander whose opinion and recommendations don't follow his rainbow...how much bandwidth do we have here? I can go on if you sincerely want to see more examples. I can cite specifics with dates if you haven't heard any of this, like the rest of us.

Take it easy dear, the rest of us will sort it out come 2008. *hug*

[JohnnyMack]

Gov of one of the largest states in the country isn't experience?

That's a hell of a lot more experience than anyone running on the dims side has.

Oh wait, Hussien did write a book, never mind.

That's the problem with our current system. The guys WITH the experience but WITHOUT the name recognition couldn't get the money together to challenge Billary and Obama. W had the luxury of nice warchest behind him because he comes from a wealthy family.

Successful politicians like Evan Bayh and Mark Warner aren't running even though they've done more in terms of managing a Government than either one of the Democrats front runners. Bayh and Warner just didn't think they could get the money together to overcome the top two.

[soonerloyal]

I always got the idea that the Founding Fathers had a vision of the Common Man stepping up to serve, rather than elections to public office becoming a "more money than you" contest. We need campaign finance reform, badly and NOW. We'd be more likely to have a better choice of candidates if the playing field was leveled.

[OCUDad]

Bush gets people drunk, removes their kidney, then leaves them in an ice bath and sells their kidney on the black market.So how come we still have a deficit?

[OklahomaTuba]

So you just let your eyeballs roll right past the perjury, ignoring subpoenas, and the like. Just like you obviously stick your fingers in your ears anytime the Administration screams another refusal to follow lawful commitments like oversight of handling critically classified documents, weaseling away from any attempts at checks and balances, obstruction of justice, firing any military commander whose opinion and recommendations don't follow his rainbow...how much bandwidth do we have here? I can go on if you sincerely want to see more examples. I can cite specifics with dates if you haven't heard any of this, like the rest of us.

Hell, that was all a days work for Bubba and Hillary.

Try citing some actual stuff instead of the ginned up political gotcha crap the donks keep coming up with.

[OklahomaTuba]

I always got the idea that the Founding Fathers had a vision of the Common Man stepping up to serve, rather than elections to public office becoming a "more money than you" contest. We need campaign finance reform, badly and NOW. We'd be more likely to have a better choice of candidates if the playing field was leveled.

No, what we need is a "Fairness Doctrine", so all this speech the libz don't like can be made illegal.

Only that will help save the world from global warming.

[SoonerKnight]

Let's see Texas. Hmmm....They are big but their legislature meets once every two years and only for a few months so in four years that is like what 6 months experience. HAHAHA!!!!!!!:pop:





Gov of one of the largest states in the country isn't experience?

That's a hell of a lot more experience than anyone running on the dims side has.

Oh wait, Hussien did write a book, never mind.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

We need campaign finance reform, badly and NOW. We'd be more likely to have a better choice of candidates if the playing field was leveled.Thou shalt not spend thine own money where thou wantest...Yeah, that's real freedom in the land of the free. Where did you learn this "govt. controlling all aspects of our lives" philosophy?

[SoonerKnight]

Okay so let's not control the corporations and how much they give to the canidates because is sure is working! HAHAHAHA! I feel for you if your that afraid of the government!:pop: :eek:



Thou shalt not spend thine own money where thou wantest...Yeah, that's real freedom in the land of the free. Where did you learn this "govt. controlling all aspects of our lives" philosophy?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Okay so let's not control the corporations and how much they give to the canidates because is sure is working! HAHAHAHA! I feel for you if your that afraid of the government!:pop: :eek:Are you Scuba, Vaevictis, Octavian, etc?, or an entirely "new" progressive?

[soonerloyal]

Why are so many of my fellow Republicans so reluctant to even consider the possibility of mistakes made by sitting Republicans? Not everything the "Right" does is good; not everything the "Left" does is wrong. People of either political bent do have points worthy of consideration. It's not like questioning this Administration is a sin. It's our job as citizens to hold politicians accountable. They're supposed to be working for us.

Calling for reform of dirty campaign funds-getting isn't a call for Big Brother. Paranoid much?


Hell, that was all a days work for Bubba and Hillary.

No dude...it wasn't. Can't you see past hating the other side, and just focus on facts? I'm not glossing over the cesspool that is Clintoonology. I'm refusing to say "Welllll, the Clintons did stuff too, so there." That is Pavlovian and regurgitative.


Try citing some actual stuff instead of the ginned up political gotcha crap the donks keep coming up with.


I can't tell if you're accusing me or Democrats (or both) of being liquored up, or what. I'm perfectly sober, and perfectly serious. Do you comprehend? Do you read? I'm a Republican. One CAN be Conservative and still think for one's self. "Donks" "Dims"...nothing but childish, broad-generalizationed namecalling. Let's stick to discussing facts. Otherwise, the "regurgitation" you so gleefully accuse others of just smacks of irony, and makes you look ridiculous.

Are you watching Alberto Gonzalez, an attorney, THE ATTORNEY GENERAL OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, lie under oath? Are you listening to him perjur himself and contradict his own testimony, over and over? Do you understand that Libby was found guilty (by Bush-appointed judges) of perjury and obstruction of justice? He wasn't convicted of having a bad memory, he was convicted of lying under oath and deliberately interfering & misleading aka obstructing a Federal investigation and its investigating officers. Need a linky? Here's one for ya:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/10/28/AR2005102801086.html

Can you comprehend that Harriet Meiers - ANOTHER ATTORNEY - does not answer, or even acknowledge a subpoena? Are you missing the ability to understand that the sitting Vice President refuses to cooperate with a lawful committee's request that his office show they are handling top-secret documents appropriately? And stupidly trying to dodge it with the inane "Duhhh, I'm not Executive, I'm somethin' else" excuse? Puh-LEEEZE.

And if that ain't enuf to make even a RightWing Marine Mama like me say "WTF?!"...We're arming Sunnis, while the new Iraqi government we're supposedly backing is primarily Shia. THEN, to top it off nicely with a juicy cherry, Bush is preparing to ask Congress to sell Saudi Arabia $20 BILLION DOLLARS in ARMS. Say that slowly until you begin to truly understand its insanity. The SAUDIS ARE THE BIGGEST SUPPORTERS AND SUPPLIERS OF TERRORISTS. ANd we're gonna sell them TWENTY BILLION DOLLARS WORTH M.O.R.E of weapons to KILL OUR CHILDREN?

Have you taken leave of your tiny MIND, BUSH?

We're voluntarily arming the men who kill our sons. On the premise of "Promise you'll use our weapons to kill who we say, not our own children"? We are supplying weapons to people who are killing us, not ten years down the road, not five, not one year. NOW. It's one thing for our government to give weaponry and training to a people who are actively trying to help themselves. It's another thing entirely to deliberately put our sons and daughters in the crosshairs of those same weapons.

There's no other way to look at this for me. I'm not giving my support to a President who does that. It's like being at war with Japan and funding the Kamikazis. Like fighting the Nazis and sending weapons to the SS. Like letting the NVA know the coordinates of our guys trying to take Hill 188; like helping fund the Kmer Rouge's march into Phnom Penh. I'm not just the mother of two OIF-vet Marines -I'm also a proud SAC brat, my dad was a tail gunner on B52s during 'Nam; he helped save Marines at Khe Sanh. I'm no military-hater. I do know incompetence and political interference in military matters when I see it. What the hell are we doing to that powderkeg over there? Not making Iraq safer. Not making America safer, either.

Questioning anything about the war in Iraq or not agreeing with the Administration on points, or even calling for an after-war exit strategy does NOT equal "not wanting it to work". Just like those opinions do not equal "non-support of the troops" and "being unpatriotic".

Can I please get an informed, intelligent discourse to the affirmative or contrary, not just "Nuh-UH!!"
*thumbs down*

[SoonerKnight]

You may think me wrong but I believe that the person getting into the highest office shouldn't when because they were the one's with thew most money! I think the person being elected should get there because of their ability to get things done for the country not the corporations. I mean the Bush Administration gave HUGE tax cuts to the oil industry and when the CEO's of those companies were asked if they needed the money their reply was "No, Senator we do not." The house repealed those cuts the Republicans are blocking it in the Senate. These are mere facts.



Are you Scuba, Vaevictis, Octavian, etc?, or an entirely "new" progressive?

[SoonerKnight]

You can get Ditto from me. LOL. You made your point very well!!!:pop: :hot:



Why are so many of my fellow Republicans so reluctant to even consider the possibility of mistakes made by sitting Republicans? Not everything the "Right" does is good; not everything the "Left" does is wrong. People of either political bent do have points worthy of consideration. It's not like questioning this Administration is a sin. It's our job as citizens to hold politicians accountable. They're supposed to be working for us.

Can I please get an informed, intelligent discourse to the affirmative or contrary, not just "Nuh-UH!!"
*thumbs down*

[usmc-sooner]

George W. Bush invented rock-n-roll and all the non missionary sex positions.

In your face liberals.

[usmc-sooner]

George W. Bush invented rock-n-roll and all the non missionary sex positions.

In your face liberals.

[SoonerKnight]

OK! At least Al Gore invented something useful like the internet!!!!!:D :P



George W. Bush invented rock-n-roll and all the non missionary sex positions.

In your face liberals.

[usmc-sooner]

OK! At least Al Gore invented something useful like the internet!!!!!:D :P

so at least we could watch all the positions George W. Bush gave us.

[SoonerKnight]

Without the internet we couldn't talk about BS during the off season!:pop: :texan:


so at least we could watch all the positions George W. Bush gave us.

[usmc-sooner]

Without the internet we couldn't talk about BS during the off season!:pop: :texan:

do the quote and then do your reply, you're doing all funky and backwards and it's throwing off my game.

[SoonerKnight]

I want you to read my post first then look for the quote!!! I have my reasons!!!:confused:



do the quote and then do your reply, you're doing all funky and backwards and it's throwing off my game.

[SoonerKnight]

do the quote and then do your reply, you're doing all funky and backwards and it's throwing off my game.


OK.Better?:eek: