SteelClip49
5/24/2007, 01:42 PM
This is a post that started out as just simple cfb trivia but got into teams fielded during the war. This is a convo between me and another fellow Sooner who has seen a lot in his day. His responses are in bold.
Earl, you are one fellow Sooner that I like. For a while I figured you have been around since Bennie Owen but that would make you older older. Don't go back to Bennie. First Sooner game I recall was 19-0 win over Okla A&M (State) in 1941 opening game. Remember several games in next few years, Recall wartime running backs Jack Jacobs and Joe Golding, who came back after the war.. During the war, Tulsa was actually the best team in Oklahoma, and beat the Sooners 23-0 and 20-6 in 1942 and 1943. A&M was good in 44 and 45 with Bob Fenimore. Oklahoma had its struggles under Dewey (Snorter) Luster. First game I attended in Norman was a 21-7 loss to TCU in Bud Wilkinson's second home game as the Sooner head coach. With that loss, his record was 2-2-1. A few years later, it reached 38-3-1 for .917 and then it got to 101-8-3 for .923. I was there when the 47 game winning streak (48 undefeated) ended in 1957 with that new Russian Sputnik circling above.
BTW, do you recall a service team by the name of Norman NAS??? I know there were a lot of service teams back in the day that competed with schools and actually finished in the AP top 20. One that comesto mind is 1944 I believe when Iowa Navy Pre-Flight finished #2 behind Army. The Norman Naval Air Station "Boomers" were ranked #13 in the final AP poll in 1944. Their 1943 team was 4-3-0, with wins over 49th Army 40-0, Oklahoma A&M (State) 20-0, the Oklahoma J. C's 19-0 and Will Rogers Army Air Base (Oklahoma City) 33-6, and losses to Oklahoma 22-6, Fort Riley 33-0, and Lubbock Army Air Base 13-0. Then, their 1944 team went 6-0-0 and was ranked #13 in the final AP. They beat Oklahoma 28-14, Arkansas 27-7, Amarillo Air Field 19-13, Second Air Force (AP #20) 13-6, Oklahoma A & M (State) 15-0 and Lobbock Army Air Base 42-0.
Iowa Pre-Flight finished #2 behind Notre Dame in 1943, not 1944. (My earlier comment about Notre Dame being #1 with Angelo Bertelli, but losing to Great Lakes after he went to the Marines was wrong. It was 1943. And Notre Dame beat Iowa Pre-Flight 14-13 while Bertelli was still playing for them. Army was #11 in 1943 and it wasn't until 1944 until they wiped out the world.
There were many strange and unusual things about football during the war. I could write forever about it. The service teams had both pros and former college players who had entered the service. Some of the strongest in 1944 were AP #3 Randolph (Texas) Field, #5 Bainbridge (Maryland) Naval Training Station, #6 Iowa Pre-Flight, where Wilkinson was an assistant coach, #10 Fourth Air Force (March Field, California), #13 Norman (Oklahoma) Naval Air Station, #16 El Toro (California) Marines, #17 Great Lakes Navy Training Station, #18 Fort Pierce (Florida), #19 St. Mary's (California) Pre-Flight, #20 Second Air Force (Colorado Springs).
The Navy sent many of their enlistees to courses at colleges and they were allowed to play for those colleges while they were there, regardless of their eligibility status (some had already graduated and some had played pro ball). One I remember was Elroy Crazy Legs Hirsch who had already graduated from Wisconsin, but then ended up, with two other former Wisconsin players, playing for Michigan in 1943. One of the problems during the war was that these players could be transferred out at any time during the season - but then other players could be called into the service during the season - as could high school players.
One funny personal memory from the war is that the Big Six (before Seven and Eight and Twelve) Oklahoma had a Junior Varsity team that went around the state beating up on high schools, but if the high school really had a great team, it could beat them. My high school had great seasons in 1942 and 1943, so they scheduled the OU Jr. Varsity for 1944. Just before the 1944 season started, the Big Six (before Seven, Eight and Twelve) ruled that the Naval Trainees wouldn't be eligible, so they all switched to the Junior Varsity. When they showed up to play us in 1944, we had shut out seven straight opponents and had a 12 game winning streak. They killed us. In the first quarter our defensive backs had their first experience of seeing a right- handed tailback run to his left and throw a pass downfield for a TD.
Earl, you are one fellow Sooner that I like. For a while I figured you have been around since Bennie Owen but that would make you older older. Don't go back to Bennie. First Sooner game I recall was 19-0 win over Okla A&M (State) in 1941 opening game. Remember several games in next few years, Recall wartime running backs Jack Jacobs and Joe Golding, who came back after the war.. During the war, Tulsa was actually the best team in Oklahoma, and beat the Sooners 23-0 and 20-6 in 1942 and 1943. A&M was good in 44 and 45 with Bob Fenimore. Oklahoma had its struggles under Dewey (Snorter) Luster. First game I attended in Norman was a 21-7 loss to TCU in Bud Wilkinson's second home game as the Sooner head coach. With that loss, his record was 2-2-1. A few years later, it reached 38-3-1 for .917 and then it got to 101-8-3 for .923. I was there when the 47 game winning streak (48 undefeated) ended in 1957 with that new Russian Sputnik circling above.
BTW, do you recall a service team by the name of Norman NAS??? I know there were a lot of service teams back in the day that competed with schools and actually finished in the AP top 20. One that comesto mind is 1944 I believe when Iowa Navy Pre-Flight finished #2 behind Army. The Norman Naval Air Station "Boomers" were ranked #13 in the final AP poll in 1944. Their 1943 team was 4-3-0, with wins over 49th Army 40-0, Oklahoma A&M (State) 20-0, the Oklahoma J. C's 19-0 and Will Rogers Army Air Base (Oklahoma City) 33-6, and losses to Oklahoma 22-6, Fort Riley 33-0, and Lubbock Army Air Base 13-0. Then, their 1944 team went 6-0-0 and was ranked #13 in the final AP. They beat Oklahoma 28-14, Arkansas 27-7, Amarillo Air Field 19-13, Second Air Force (AP #20) 13-6, Oklahoma A & M (State) 15-0 and Lobbock Army Air Base 42-0.
Iowa Pre-Flight finished #2 behind Notre Dame in 1943, not 1944. (My earlier comment about Notre Dame being #1 with Angelo Bertelli, but losing to Great Lakes after he went to the Marines was wrong. It was 1943. And Notre Dame beat Iowa Pre-Flight 14-13 while Bertelli was still playing for them. Army was #11 in 1943 and it wasn't until 1944 until they wiped out the world.
There were many strange and unusual things about football during the war. I could write forever about it. The service teams had both pros and former college players who had entered the service. Some of the strongest in 1944 were AP #3 Randolph (Texas) Field, #5 Bainbridge (Maryland) Naval Training Station, #6 Iowa Pre-Flight, where Wilkinson was an assistant coach, #10 Fourth Air Force (March Field, California), #13 Norman (Oklahoma) Naval Air Station, #16 El Toro (California) Marines, #17 Great Lakes Navy Training Station, #18 Fort Pierce (Florida), #19 St. Mary's (California) Pre-Flight, #20 Second Air Force (Colorado Springs).
The Navy sent many of their enlistees to courses at colleges and they were allowed to play for those colleges while they were there, regardless of their eligibility status (some had already graduated and some had played pro ball). One I remember was Elroy Crazy Legs Hirsch who had already graduated from Wisconsin, but then ended up, with two other former Wisconsin players, playing for Michigan in 1943. One of the problems during the war was that these players could be transferred out at any time during the season - but then other players could be called into the service during the season - as could high school players.
One funny personal memory from the war is that the Big Six (before Seven and Eight and Twelve) Oklahoma had a Junior Varsity team that went around the state beating up on high schools, but if the high school really had a great team, it could beat them. My high school had great seasons in 1942 and 1943, so they scheduled the OU Jr. Varsity for 1944. Just before the 1944 season started, the Big Six (before Seven, Eight and Twelve) ruled that the Naval Trainees wouldn't be eligible, so they all switched to the Junior Varsity. When they showed up to play us in 1944, we had shut out seven straight opponents and had a 12 game winning streak. They killed us. In the first quarter our defensive backs had their first experience of seeing a right- handed tailback run to his left and throw a pass downfield for a TD.