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Okla-homey
5/5/2007, 08:05 AM
Provided annually as a service to my homies. You can be the person at your table who knows when someone asks, "WTF is Cinco de Mayo about anyway?" Here's the scoop on Cinco de Mayo -- and it ain't Mexican Independence Day.

May 5, 1862, a Mexican Victory in the Franco-Mexican War

145 years ago on this day during the French-Mexican War, a poorly supplied and outnumbered Mexican army under General Ignacio Zaragoza defeated a French army attempting to capture Puebla de Los Angeles, a small town in east-central Mexico. Victory at the Battle of Puebla represented a great moral victory for the Mexican government, symbolizing the country's ability to defend its sovereignty against a European power.

Here's how the Franco-Mexican War got started in the first place.

In the wake of its disasterous war with the United States a little over 10 years earlier, the Mexican government was still broke. Flat busted. In 1861, the liberal Mexican Benito Juarez became president of the financially ruined country and he was forced to default on Mexican overseas debts to European governments.

http://img137.echo.cx/img137/4170/1862benitojuarez7fs.jpg
President Benito Juarez
Benito Juarez, probably the best and purest presidente the Mex's ever had.

In response, France, Britain, and Spain deployed their "collections departments" -- naval forces that is, to Veracruz to demand reimbursement. Britain and Spain negotiated with Mexico and withdrew, but France, ruled by Napoleon III, decided to use the opportunity to carve a dependent empire out of Mexican territory.

Late in 1861, a well-armed French fleet stormed Veracruz, landing a large French force and driving President Juarez and his panicked government into retreat.

http://img137.echo.cx/img137/9666/1862mapofwarofpuebla9iz.gif

Certain that French victory would come swiftly in Mexico, 6,000 French troops under General Charles Latrille de Lorencez set out to attack Puebla de Los Angeles.

From his new headquarters in the north, the Mexican President Juarez rounded up a rag-tag force of loyal men and sent them to Puebla. Led by Texas-born Mexican General Zaragoza, the 2,000 Mexicans fortified the town and prepared for the French assault.

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/7960/zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz26.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Zaragoza

On the fifth of May, 1862, Lorencez drew his army, well-provisioned and supported by heavy artillery, before the city of Puebla and began their assault from the north. If you've been in the military, you know there is a time-honored piece of doctrine that says you normally need a 3:1 force ratio in order to defeat a fortified enemy. The Froggy General Lorencez had that --6000 Frenchies to 2000 Mexicans. He lost because he was an arrogant French horses ***.

http://img51.imageshack.us/img51/8055/zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz27.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Opening of the battle. The Mexicans under Zaragoza occupied the heights. The French repeatedly hurled themselves at them from below.

Lorencez thought so little of his Mexican "peon" enemy, he ordered repeated direct frontal assaults into the heart of the Mexicans' prepared defenses, which allowed the Mexicans a convenient method of killing a lot of Frenchies. The battle lasted from daybreak to early evening, and when the French finally retreated they had lost nearly 500 soldiers to the fewer than 100 Mexicans killed.

Victory at the Battle of Puebla represented a great moral victory for the Mexican government, symbolizing the country's ability to defend its sovereignty against a European power.

http://img179.echo.cx/img179/772/battle9yy.jpg

Retreating from Puebla, the French were attacked by hundreds of Mexican native people armed mostly with machetes...and suffered many more casualties as they were repeatedly ambushed and hacked to death.

Although not a major strategic victory in the overall war against the French, Zaragoza's victory at Puebla tightened Mexican resistance. Good thing too, because that autumn, the enraged French showed up with 25,000 recently arrived reinforcements and kicked the hell out of the Mexican Army (which had shriveled to only about 6000 dudes by then) for a couple years. The war would continue at total of another six years before France withdrew.

In 1864, two years after the battle, Puebla de Los Angeles, the site of Zaragoza's historic victory, was renamed Puebla de Zaragoza in honor of the general. Today, Mexicans celebrate the anniversary of the Battle of Puebla as Cinco de Mayo, a national holiday in Mexico.

Important contextual sidenote:

As an aside, it is important to remember that the United States was embroiled in its own Civil War during this period. In fact, Lincoln would have liked to help the Juarista government because he knew the French under Napolean III hated the United States.

http://img147.imageshack.us/img147/7540/zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz21.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
Napolean III, nephew of Bonaparte. Emperor of France.

Lincoln knew if the French were succesful in their conquest of Mexico, they would be in a good position to aid the Confederacy in its war with the United States.

Unfortunately for the Mexicans, Lincoln had his hands full with the Civil War and was not able to provide much help to Juarez. Fortunately for the United States, Juarez was able to defend his country, thus making it impossible for the French in Mexico to provide any assistance to Confederate forces.

There you have it. Cinco de Mayo. An Important day in Mexican AND United States history.

BTW, REAL Mexican Independence Day is on September 18.

http://img142.echo.cx/img142/2623/insane7zo.jpg

StoopTroup
5/5/2007, 08:18 AM
So...

If we hadn't been busy fighting amongst ourselves....we could have bought Mexico from France at a later time for what would now be chump change?

Okla-homey
5/5/2007, 08:24 AM
So...

If we hadn't been busy fighting amongst ourselves....we could have bought Mexico from France at a later time for what would now be chump change?

Prolly, but of course, that would mean that Messicans from below the Rio Grande would now be United States citizens, and not just the messicans who were from north of the Rio Grande who became citizens when texass joined the union coupled with the messicans who became Norte Americanos when we acquired New Mexico, Arizona and California after the Mexican War.

See, this is why a lot of our Mexican-American neighbors say, we didn't cross the border, the border crossed us:D

StoopTroup
5/5/2007, 08:27 AM
That's kind of what I was getting at...lol

Now we are all fighting again...

We will never learn.

47straight
5/5/2007, 09:43 AM
The Germans also have a holiday for every time they beat the French. It's called "Tuesday."

royalfan5
5/5/2007, 09:59 AM
Celebration of a moral victory? Does this make Mexico the Aggy of North America?

Vaevictis
5/5/2007, 10:08 AM
No, because Mexico then (eventually) leveraged the moral victory into a real one.

Aggies don't do that. If they're lucky, they follow one moral victory up with another, and that's it. Usually, not even that.

SoonerStormchaser
5/5/2007, 10:26 AM
Thanks Homey...I've been telling all the ignoramus's for the last decade that it's NOT Mexican Independence Day...it's a date they the beat the ***** French (like that's sooooo hard to do)!

Okla-homey
5/5/2007, 10:58 AM
Thanks Homey...I've been telling all the ignoramus's for the last decade that it's NOT Mexican Independence Day...it's a date they the beat the ***** French (like that's sooooo hard to do)!

And if the French general hadn't been such an obnoxious, arrogant a$$-hat, the French might have delivered a beat-down. Direct frontal assaults against a fortified defender in his own country is hardly ever a good idea.

I think this sort of thing is consistent with most of French history in which arrogance has resulted in great loss despite the wherewithall to win -- I do not want to turn this into a political thread, but, the main criticism I have of the current administration is that sometimes it appears to moi that the folks with great influence (e.g. former SECDEF Rumsfield, et al) counseled the President not to worry, we're Americans and we will beat these towel-headed sand goons.

I can almost hear the French general at Puebla telling his captains: don't worry, they're just messicans.

Again, this is why history matters folks.

StoopTroup
5/5/2007, 11:00 AM
I thought it was just a day to drink Coronas.

royalfan5
5/5/2007, 11:02 AM
I thought it was just a day to drink Modelo.
fixed.

StoopTroup
5/5/2007, 11:12 AM
Check out where Modelo comes from....

Modelo (http://www.gmodelo.com.mx/home/home.html)

royalfan5
5/5/2007, 11:15 AM
Check out where Modelo comes from....

Modelo (http://www.gmodelo.com.mx/home/home.html)
All I know is only the gringos drink Corona around here.

StoopTroup
5/5/2007, 11:15 AM
It's all rented anyway. :D

Harry Beanbag
5/5/2007, 11:41 AM
Check out where Modelo comes from....

Modelo (http://www.gmodelo.com.mx/home/home.html)


From Mexico?

PhxSooner
5/5/2007, 11:49 AM
My son's class had a Cinco de Mayo party yesterday. This apparently consisted of eating chips and salsa and breaking a pinata.

Okla-homey
5/5/2007, 11:53 AM
My son's class had a Cinco de Mayo party yesterday. This apparently consisted of eating chips and salsa and breaking a pinata.

It would have been cool if the pinata could have been a papier-mache French soldier!:D

AlbqSooner
5/5/2007, 12:08 PM
Aggies don't do that. If they're lucky, they follow one moral victory up with another, and that's it.
Nahhhh, that's not it. They print up T Shirts.

StoopTroup
5/5/2007, 04:26 PM
and bumper stickers.