** The Talladega Thread **

[VeeJay]

This race always makes SportsCenter and the highight segments. The Big One usually takes out up to half the field. This is by far the most deadly, vicious and destructive of races. Kenny Wallace just said that's why 200,000 people come to these events - they love to see wrecks.

I used to go to check out all the hot chicks and drink an ice chest full of beer. :)

I'm guessing Jeff Gordon has the best chances, but I'd like to see Junior (#8) win one.

[Newbomb Turk]

sweet. I just finished mowing the lawn. I need to go get some beer before the race starts.

[royalfan5]

DEI's plate program has fallen off too much for Junior to win. Watch for the 43, they were fast in practice, and Bobby slingshoted past Tony yesterday to win the Busch race.

[OUHOMER]

Gordon, is doing great this year, I hope he stays out front and misses the BIG ONE

[bluedogok]

I am watching the other France series, the GrandAm Daytona Prototype race from VIR.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Hey. I'm Ricky Bobby. When you're workin' on your mysterious lady parts and stuff, you should have the right tools too. That's why you should use... MayPax. The oficial tampon of NASCAR.

[Newbomb Turk]

Hey Fox - your 3-D cartoon thingy looks stupid.

[Okla-homey]

NASCAR, like pro-rasslin, is rigged.

them "debris cautions" are used to tighten the race.

[Newbomb Turk]

stupid move by Bowyer not coming to the pits.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

You spilled my macchiato!

[royalfan5]

NASCAR, like pro-rasslin, is rigged.

them "debris cautions" are used to tighten the race.
Everything is rigged, if it isn't how do you explain Texas winning a national title?

[Blue]

Tony's gonna win this race, finally.

[Newbomb Turk]

them "debris cautions" are used to tighten the race.

just what plate racing needs - more tightening up.

[Okla-homey]

just what plate racing needs - more tightening up.

plate racing + debris cautions=WWE;)

[Newbomb Turk]

man - what a great pre-finish. Those 8 laps were something.
gonna be tough to hold off that damn Jeff Gordon.

[Newbomb Turk]

I don't understand what takes so damn long during these cautions.

yeah, safety...blah, blah, blah. Get the damn race underway!

[royalfan5]

There's 77.

[Newbomb Turk]

what could have been a great finish, ended up being a bad one.

[Newbomb Turk]

I hate Jeff Gordon, but the people throwing crap on the track are idiots.

[royalfan5]

I'll take a 12th place run for the 45 today.

[Blue]

Dear Santa,

All I want for Christmas is for an earthquake to swallow Hendrick Motorsports into the ground.

How did Tony finish 28th? That's wrong and will be changed.

[OUHOMER]

Gordon is the man.:D

[SleestakSooner]

Watching idiot DE worshipping redneck pukes throwing their $8 beers on to the track at the #24 car gives me great pleasure :D Hearing that a great deal of them were arrested for their jackass antics... PRICELESS!

[Okla-homey]

Dear Santa,

All I want for Christmas is for an earthquake to swallow Hendrick Motorsports into the ground.

How did Tony finish 28th? That's wrong and will be changed.

You realize you sound like a rasslin' fan right bro? ;) I hate to sound like a shrew, but I'm telling ya, it's rigged. Every race is "fixed." NASCAR enables the guys who NASCAR wants to win. Almost without exception. Good guys, bad guys, colorful outfits, red-hot smoking wimmen, etc..

This is also why there is no betting on these "races" in Vegas or or other places. No big-time handicapper will bother with it anymore than one would bother handicapping a pro-rasslin' match.

Alternatively, you can bet on open-wheel racers at Indy and whatnot.

Think about it.

[Sooner in Tampa]

Homey...I respect a great deal of what you post, but that one is just too far out there. There is entirely too much much money involved for NASCAR to be "fixin" races. Multi-million dollar companies are not going to be wasting money on "scripted" events.

Did Oliver Stone get your password??

[Okla-homey]

Homey...I respect a great deal of what you post, but that one is just too far out there. There is entirely too much much money involved for NASCAR to be "fixin" races. Multi-million dollar companies are not going to be wasting money on "scripted" events.

Did Oliver Stone get your password??

I'm not the only guy who understands it bro. I also firmly believe, given people will bet on just about any contest they don't think is rigged, the fact that there is no large-scale organized betting on NASCAR events tells me something is amiss.

"Multi-million dollar companies" invest in NASCAR-based advertising because millions of people watch it. No other reason really. Heck, if millions of people watched dog shows, there would be little STP and Coors Light patches on the handler's clothing. This is America, it's what companies do.

Besides, the monkey may be out of the box because others with far more cred than moi are saying it publicly now. Another question. How else do you explain "Little E's" successes right after his pop died tragically? Luck? Skill? Or did NASCAR execs figure it was a good idea to make it happen, especially that "storybook" victory on the same track on which his dad died? I rather believe it was the latter.

Do you really think Tony Stewart would have gotten in as much trouble if what he said was groundless and easily dismissed by most people as ridiculous "Oliver Stone-ish-ness?" Instead, they woodshedded him, made him retract the statement and someone also made sure he get slammed into the wall yesterday.

Finally, I don't buy that bogus restrictor plate justification that it is intended to make the "sport" safer, more exciting and to ensure driver skill remains more important than the car's performance. It's designed to level the field so the outcomes can be better controlled. period.

Watch if you want. The crashes are cool, but don't delude yourself into thinking it's not all very controlled and the outcomes are virtually scripted.


Commentary: NASCAR starts damage control

By JENNA FRYER Associated Press
4/29/2007

TALLADEGA, Ala. -- The season opened with a cheating scandal that threatened the integrity of NASCAR's biggest race of the year. A mere two months later, its credibility is again under scrutiny because Tony Stewart likened the sport to professional wrestling.

Even though the two-time champion retracted his comments, the damage was already done.

At a time when NASCAR is fighting sagging television ratings, flat attendance and a court challenge over sponsorship that could shake the entire sport, Stewart's rant was the last thing it needed.

"There's no question that comments like those made by Tony are bad for the sport," NASCAR president Mike Helton said. "The amount of Fortune 500 companies, the promoters, most of the stakeholders, they look at those comments and say 'Oh my gosh,' and that's not good for anyone."

Now it's up to NASCAR to fix it, starting with Sunday's race at Talladega Superspeedway.

At the heart of Stewart's rant were allegations that NASCAR manipulates its events by using bogus debris cautions to orchestrate closer racing. The races are fake, he indicated, just like wrestling.

"I don't know that they've run a fair race all year," he said on his weekly radio show.

An hourlong meeting with NASCAR as the sun came up at Talladega on Friday changed Stewart's mind, and the outspoken driver humbly admitted he was wrong. [of course, he's done in the "sport" if he refused]

But his initial assessment struck a chord, particularly because those very debris cautions are so often debated throughout the garage, in the grandstands and even the television booth. Sometimes the debris can be spotted by everyone, but other times the drivers on the track can't even find it.

There were four debris cautions in Phoenix last weekend that fed Stewart's rage about the issue. A debris caution at Atlanta last month cost him a victory, and Jimmie Johnson lost a race at California in February because of one.

Darrell Waltrip, a three-time NASCAR champion turned television analyst, has repeatedly told viewers this season that if the Fox cameras can find the debris, the network will show it. So when the debris isn't shown, the perception that it doesn't exist is perpetuated.

NASCAR maintains that it informs its television partners what every caution is for and where the debris can be located.

"Now whether they choose to show it or not is their call to make," Helton said.

Artie Kemper, lead director for Fox's race coverage, said the network tries on every occasion to locate the debris.

"As soon as we're told where the debris is, our camera is there," Kemper said. "Sometimes we don't find it. Sometimes the tracks are big and the camera angle might be wrong or the lens might not be long enough."

[Sooner in Tampa]

Stewart planted the seed of doubt about this crap. Do I think that NASCAR gets a little willy nilly with caution flags...sure, they will try to edge someone into the winners circle. Nothing more...nothing less.

Does anyone actually think NASCAR gives two $h!ts about Gordon breaking Earnhardt's record @ Talledega??? NOT...I would venture to say that they would have prefered that he do it somewhere else.

Like I said...Stewart started this $h!tstorm and now the conspiracy theorists are everywhere.

[Blue]

Stewart planted the seed of doubt about this crap. Do I think that NASCAR gets a little willy nilly with caution flags...sure, they will try to edge someone into the winners circle. Nothing more...nothing less.

Does anyone actually think NASCAR gives two $h!ts about Gordon breaking Earnhardt's record @ Talledega??? NOT...I would venture to say that they would have prefered that he do it somewhere else.

Like I said...Stewart started this $h!tstorm and now the conspiracy theorists are everywhere.

Agree.

Homey. You sound like someone who has never watched a race. The WWE comparison was due to debris cautions at the end of the race. Do I mind them...no. The fastest car usually wins and bunching them at the end usually makes it more exciting.


If we're gonna say it's rigged, it's rigged towards the big money teams...Henrick, Childress, Gibbs, and Roush-Fenway. Teams with less money can't compete.

[Boarder]

Who told you there was not betting on Nascar? Every time I go to Vegas it's on the big board. I have bet on them personally several times. Futures, individual races, everything.


Yeah, I really want to go to Talladega and be around people like that. I don't care if they were throwing things at Stewart, it's one of the stupidest things I've ever seen.

[royalfan5]

I'm not the only guy who understands it bro. I also firmly believe, given people will bet on just about any contest they don't think is rigged, the fact that there is no large-scale organized betting on NASCAR events tells me something is amiss.

"Multi-million dollar companies" invest in NASCAR-based advertising because millions of people watch it. No other reason really. Heck, if millions of people watched dog shows, there would be little STP and Coors Light patches on the handler's clothing. This is America, it's what companies do.

Besides, the monkey may be out of the box because others with far more cred than moi are saying it publicly now. Another question. How else do you explain "Little E's" successes right after his pop died tragically? Luck? Skill? Or did NASCAR execs figure it was a good idea to make it happen, especially that "storybook" victory on the same track on which his dad died? I rather believe it was the latter.

Do you really think Tony Stewart would have gotten in as much trouble if what he said was groundless and easily dismissed by most people as ridiculous "Oliver Stone-ish-ness?" Instead, they woodshedded him, made him retract the statement and someone also made sure he get slammed into the wall yesterday.

Finally, I don't buy that bogus restrictor plate justification that it is intended to make the "sport" safer, more exciting and to ensure driver skill remains more important than the car's performance. It's designed to level the field so the outcomes can be better controlled. period.

Watch if you want. The crashes are cool, but don't delude yourself into thinking it's not all very controlled and the outcomes are virtually scripted.
There's plenty of gambling on NASCAR. And the plates are there to keep spectators from dying, because Davey Allison damn near clear the catch fence and 1987 and the insurance companies won't let NASCAR take that risk.

[KC//CRIMSON]

Watching idiot DE worshipping redneck pukes throwing their $8 beers on to the track at the #24 car gives me great pleasure :D Hearing that a great deal of them were arrested for their jackass antics... PRICELESS!


They should perma-ban those idiots from the track. Now that would be priceless.

[Osce0la]

Stewart planted the seed of doubt about this crap. Do I think that NASCAR gets a little willy nilly with caution flags...sure, they will try to edge someone into the winners circle. Nothing more...nothing less.

Does anyone actually think NASCAR gives two $h!ts about Gordon breaking Earnhardt's record @ Talledega??? NOT...I would venture to say that they would have prefered that he do it somewhere else.

Like I said...Stewart started this $h!tstorm and now the conspiracy theorists are everywhere.
My wife and I both noticed late last season that there was a lot of cautions coming out when Gordon and Johnson were having trouble or were in a position where a caution would greatly help them. This past Sunday is no different. Had the caution come out when the guys engine blew they would have frozen the field when they were in the tri-oval and Gordon would have been in third behind McMurray and Earnhardt Jr. Instead, they wait until they are coming out of turn 2 to throw the yellow (by this time Gordon is now in the lead). 99% of the time when an engine goes and there is smoke pouring out of a car, the caution comes out then - in this case it took them half a lap to throw the caution. Gordon likely could have still won the race, who knows? But had the caution come out when they were in the tri-oval he would've had only half a lap to get in front of Junior and McMurray before the crash in turn 2 ended the race...

just sayin...

[Osce0la]

There's plenty of gambling on NASCAR. And the plates are there to keep spectators from dying, because Davey Allison damn near clear the catch fence and 1987 and the insurance companies won't let NASCAR take that risk.
Wasn't Davey, I believe it was Bobby Allison.

[royalfan5]

Wasn't Davey, I believe it was Bobby Allison.
I knew it was one of the Allison's. Talledega is where Davey died though isn't it?

[Osce0la]

Here (http://youtube.com/watch?v=j0xhNsGJGLA) is the reason we have restrictor plates now...

[Osce0la]

I knew it was one of the Allison's. Talledega is where Davey died though isn't it?
yes, Davey died in a helicopter crash in Talladega's infield...

[Sooner in Tampa]

My wife and I both noticed late last season that there was a lot of cautions coming out when Gordon and Johnson were having trouble or were in a position where a caution would greatly help them. This past Sunday is no different. Had the caution come out when the guys engine blew they would have frozen the field when they were in the tri-oval and Gordon would have been in third behind McMurray and Earnhardt Jr. Instead, they wait until they are coming out of turn 2 to throw the yellow (by this time Gordon is now in the lead). 99% of the time when an engine goes and there is smoke pouring out of a car, the caution comes out then - in this case it took them half a lap to throw the caution. Gordon likely could have still won the race, who knows? But had the caution come out when they were in the tri-oval he would've had only half a lap to get in front of Junior and McMurray before the crash in turn 2 ended the race...

just sayin...
Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion, but I watched yestedays race as well and came away with a different perspective. Reiuterman(sp?) blew up...it was had to tell what exactly gave out. In my personal opinion NASCAR wanted to hear what on the radio what the driver and his crew thought blew up. I THINK that NASCAR wanted the race to end without another caution...BUT, they were forced to throw the caution to err on the side of safety. Talledega is not a place to be rolling the dice and hoping that nothing was on the track...it could lead to a very bad ending for a driver.

BUT...thanks to Stewart, every caution that comes out for something other than a full fledged wreck will cause speculation.

[Osce0la]

Everyone is entitled to his/her opinion, but I watched yestedays race as well and came away with a different perspective. Reiuterman(sp?) blew up...it was had to tell what exactly gave out. In my personal opinion NASCAR wanted to hear what on the radio what the driver and his crew thought blew up. I THINK that NASCAR wanted the race to end without another caution...BUT, they were forced to throw the caution to err on the side of safety. Talledega is not a place to be rolling the dice and hoping that nothing was on the track...it could lead to a very bad ending for a driver.

BUT...thanks to Stewart, every caution that comes out for something other than a full fledged wreck will cause speculation.
NASCAR was right in throwing the yellow, I just feel they threw it a little late. If an engine goes up in smoke like that at Richmond, California, Bristol (or anywhere with lower speeds than Talladega) that caution comes out immediately because there is a good chance liquid is being spilled onto the track. If you'll throw the caution immediately on a slower track, why hesitate when you are on a track where the speeds are much higher? IMO, the caution should have come out as soon as his engine went and smoke was pouring out from under his hood. They shouldn't have been given an extra half lap before the caution came out...

[JohnnyMack]

Tin.

Foil.

[Sooner in Tampa]

Tin.

Foil.
@$$.

H@T.

[Madd Dawg]

Dear Santa,

All I want for Christmas is for an earthquake to swallow Hendrick Motorsports into the ground.

How did Tony finish 28th? That's wrong and will be changed.

He got pushed into the wall and spun out during that last crash.

[Okla-homey]

Why don't the rabble like Gordon anyway? Is it because he's articulate and the guy NASCAR makes win, or is it because he's from Indiana and came from open-wheel racing?

[KC//CRIMSON]

Why don't the rabble like Gordon anyway? Is it because he's articulate and the guy NASCAR makes win, or is it because he's from Indiana and came from open-wheel racing?


Because he still has all of his teeth and can speak in complete sentences.

[GrapevineSooner]

I guess it's because most Nascar fans couldn't handle the fact the he won in the sport almost immediately.

I particularly don't understand the hatred from Dale Sr./Dale Jr. fans. Sr. took Gordon under his wings and showed him how to do things on and off the track. Gordon's reciprocated this respect by showing humility anytime his name gets mentioned in the same sentence as Sr's,

Some of his haters will claim Gordon's a crybaby. Which is ironic given how they like to shower any Hendrick car with debris anytime their boy doesn't win.

[VeeJay]

Why don't the rabble like Gordon anyway? Is it because he's articulate and the guy NASCAR makes win, or is it because he's from Indiana and came from open-wheel racing?

Homey - a true hillbilly would ne'er compare NASCAR with rasslin.'

I think you're losing your edge.

[bluedogok]

BUT...thanks to Stewart, every caution that comes out for something other than a full fledged wreck will cause speculation.
Stewart wasn't the first to bring it up and this year isn't the first time for it to be brought up either. The phantom debris cautions have been happening ever since they got their big money TV deals. I will say it is more to create an exciting finish but they really like it if one of their better known drivers can take advantage of it. I don't think they do it specifically for a Jeff Gordon or Dale Jr. but they do it for the stars, just like the NBA had/has with the "Jordan rules" for its stars. That way the big time advertisers stay happy since they are front and center on the TV.


Some of his haters will claim Gordon's a crybaby. Which is ironic given how they like to shower any Hendrick car with debris anytime their boy doesn't win.
It is because a bunch of Dale Sr. fans are imbecilic moron whiners, just like their man. That guy was one of the biggest whiners ever, they just conveniently forget that fact. The fact that he drove through everyone instead of passing should have got him kicked out of the sport.

[Blue]

He got pushed into the wall and spun out during that last crash.


They freeze the field every damn time now except for the finish. They showed him 2 laps down because he didn't take the caution at the finish line. Dumbass rules.

[JohnnyMack]

It is because a bunch of Dale Sr. fans are imbecilic moron whiners, just like their man. That guy was one of the biggest whiners ever, they just conveniently forget that fact. The fact that he drove through everyone instead of passing should have got him kicked out of the sport.

Why do you hate the #3 sticker I have on the back of my car?

[Cam]

NASCAR was right in throwing the yellow, I just feel they threw it a little late. If an engine goes up in smoke like that at Richmond, California, Bristol (or anywhere with lower speeds than Talladega) that caution comes out immediately because there is a good chance liquid is being spilled onto the track. If you'll throw the caution immediately on a slower track, why hesitate when you are on a track where the speeds are much higher? IMO, the caution should have come out as soon as his engine went and smoke was pouring out from under his hood. They shouldn't have been given an extra half lap before the caution came out...
I thought they brought the yellow quicker at the other tracks because they're smaller tracks? Isn't Talladega the largest track?

[KC//CRIMSON]

Why do you hate the #3 sticker I have on the back of my car?


I always thought those #3 and #8 stickers were ACT scores. :D

[orangekaje]

If NASCAR were rigged, I'd be expecting Jr. to win more races. Stewart is always getting ****ed about something. I'm glad though cause I find smoke to be hilarious when he does!

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070429/capt.3202e2ebbcd44f579543a266e1302bb8.nascar_talla dega__auto_racing_alrc120.jpg

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/ap/20070429/capt.2cee84a8498f4b6782b7a3766347ca78.nascar_talla dega_auto_racing_alrc126.jpg

[Sooner in Tampa]

I guess it's because most Nascar fans couldn't handle the fact the he won in the sport almost immediately.
That was the biggest complaint I heard from Big E fans when Gordon started winning..."he didn't pay any dues" :rolleyes: Hendrick just handed him everything.

[KC//CRIMSON]

They should perma-ban those idiots from the track. Now that would be priceless.


Call me Nostradamus!

http://msn.foxsports.com/nascar/story/6764394?MSNHPHMA