Successionist Website

[Xstnlsooner]

Any of you guys ever heard of these organization and their plans?

Pretty radical and not that that's not necessary but it sure looks
like David and Goliath again to me.

http://christianexodus.org

[royalfan5]

They want to have success at life?

[Mjcpr]

It's easy to confuse this with Howzit's homepage, www.sucksession.com

Try that.

[Ike]

is there talk of a river of freedom?

[Xstnlsooner]

If I understand right, they are moving people from all around the country
to South Carolina in hopes of voting like minded people into office and
trying to find some island of relief from federal oppression and excessive
taxation.

[Ike]

Why south carolina? Why not a much smaller state, like Rhode Island?

[Xstnlsooner]

They say the S C as a state has similar values and a history of standing up for their rights as a state. They have goals up through 2015 and it will be interesting to see if they can achieve those.

[OUinFLA]

They say the S C as a state has similar values and a history of standing up for their rights as a state. They have goals up through 2015 and it will be interesting to see if they can achieve those.


Well, that's just not possible, as the world is going to end on 12-21-2012.
Dont they read the news?

[Flagstaffsooner]

Well, that's just not possible, as the world is going to end on 12-21-2012.
Dont they read the news?You still using that Mayan calandar?

[Ike]

Well, that's just not possible, as the world is going to end on 12-21-2012.
Dont they read the news?

Just means they'll be reaching their ultimate goal a little early

[Okla-homey]

I would like to point out, for the record, Daniel Webster once said of South Carolina; "too small for an independent republic, too large for an insane asylum."

[Penguin]

Do these morons really think that people will drop what they're doing, quit their jobs, and move to SC?

If you want some ultra religious government where it is illegal to even think of pornography, this place already exists. Utah.

[Sam Spade]

I say let 'em have it.

Then build a wall around it so those "illegals" won't be able to enter our country and steal our jobs.

Freakin' Gamecocks.

[bri]

I tried to read their manifesto, but their stupid hurt my brain.

[sooneron]

It's funny that they invoke Constitutionalist into their name. Why don't they take Mississippi?

[Bourbon St Sooner]

If you look at their board members, they're all from texass and kansass. Go figure.

[Ash]

Ohhhh....you meant "secessionist". Here I was thinking they were a group of over-achievers. derrrr

[Penguin]

Well, that's just not possible, as the world is going to end on 12-21-2012.
Dont they read the news?

I'm pretty sure that the end will be Christmas Day in 2012. That's what Jack Van Impe told me.

[homerSimpsonsBrain]

I've been to S.C. They can have it

[KaiserSooner]

I tried to read their manifesto, but their stupid hurt my brain.

lol, yep.

[OUinFLA]

I'm pretty sure that the end will be Christmas Day in 2012. That's what Jack Van Impe told me.

Ha! you think you will have an extra 4 days.
Well, you won't, and I'll be laughing at y.................
Oh, wait, no I won't :eek:

[Xstnlsooner]

Ohhhh....you meant "secessionist". Here I was thinking they were a group of over-achievers. derrrr


Pardon that misspelling bros....

[Jerk]

I like this better

http://www.freestateproject.org/

..just wish they'd do it here in OK

[TUSooner]

I would like to point out, for the record, Daniel Webster once said of South Carolina; "too small for an independent republic, too large for an insane asylum."

Plus SC has, like, a pretty bad record (0-1) when being the first to secede.

[Dio]

I'd rather go to SC- it gets damn cold in NH.

[Vaevictis]

I like this better

http://www.freestateproject.org/

..just wish they'd do it here in OK



while the growth of government and taxes continues unabated?

Heh, hyperbole much?

[Jerk]

Heh, hyperbole much?

Really? When you count local, state, and federal taxes, inlcuding gas taxes, embedded taxes, etc, how much of one person's income do you think that represents?

[Vaevictis]

Really? When you count local, state, and federal taxes, inlcuding gas taxes, embedded taxes, etc, how much of one person's income do you think that represents?

Heh. You ever seen the tax rates from 1932-1986? Top marginal rates were never less than 50%, were usually 70%+, were >=79% for 29 years, and >=90% for 14 years.

Yeah, these are top rates, but nobody pays 90 cents of their top dollar in taxes today.

[Jerk]

Heh. You ever seen the tax rates from 1932-1986? Top marginal rates were never less than 50%, were usually 70%+, were >=79% for 29 years, and >=90% for 14 years.

Yeah, these are top rates, but nobody pays 90 cents of their top dollar in taxes today.

God bless Ronald Reagan!

[Vaevictis]

God bless Ronald Reagan!

In other words, the trend since Reagan is for tax rates to go down, not up.

On top dollar, we've been sitting at 35%+/-5%ish since 1986 -- with the exception of 28% from 1988-1990 -- which is some of the lowest rates we've had since the way early 1900s. It was lower prior to roughly 1915, and the mid-late 20s. Outside of that, it's usually been about double the current rate.

As I said: hyperbole much?

[FaninAma]

In other words, the trend since Reagan is for tax rates to go down, not up.

On top dollar, we've been sitting at 35%+/-5%ish since 1986 -- with the exception of 28% from 1988-1990 -- which is some of the lowest rates we've had since the way early 1900s. It was lower prior to roughly 1915, and the mid-late 20s. Outside of that, it's usually been about double the current rate.

As I said: hyperbole much?

Lets compare apples to apples. Correct me if I'm wrong but there wasn't a federal income tax until the Wilson administration. So, if you count the federal income tax, state income taxes, sales taxes, excise taxes, licensing fees, regulatory fees, payroll taxes(which ar paid by you and me), medicare taxes, etc, etc, et....I don't see how you can claim with a straight face that the tax burden currently is comparable to other periods in US history.

As far as the 90% rate before Reagan.....only very stupid people without accoutants paid a 90, 80, 50 or even 40% rate. Reagan is also responsible for doing away with a lot of the deductions.

[Jerk]

www.fairtax.org

[Vaevictis]

Lets compare apples to apples. Correct me if I'm wrong but there wasn't a federal income tax until the Wilson administration. So, if you count the federal income tax, state income taxes, sales taxes, excise taxes, licensing fees, regulatory fees, payroll taxes(which ar paid by you and me), medicare taxes, etc, etc, et....I don't see how you can claim with a straight face that the tax burden currently is comparable to other periods in US history.

Allow me to clarify: I'm talking within (roughly) the past 100 years or so.

Prior to that, the character of the nation in just about all respects was so fundamentally different that, as you say, comparing the periods is pretty much nonsensical.

In any case, graph it out over the past hundred years or so, and we're sitting on a local minimum right now, and it's not trending up, it's trending down.


As far as the 90% rate before Reagan.....only very stupid people without accoutants paid a 90, 80, 50 or even 40% rate. Reagan is also responsible for doing away with a lot of the deductions.

Heh, I know some pretty smart people who had accountants who would disagree with you on that.

[Penguin]

Tax burden? My federal income tax worked out to about 10.1%.

But if that seems too much, I guess we can all move to SC, the future heaven on Earth.

[FaninAma]

Allow me to clarify: I'm talking within (roughly) the past 100 years or so.

Prior to that, the character of the nation in just about all respects was so fundamentally different that, as you say, comparing the periods is pretty much nonsensical.

In any case, graph it out over the past hundred years or so, and we're sitting on a local minimum right now, and it's not trending up, it's trending down.



Heh, I know some pretty smart people who had accountants who would disagree with you on that.

This study supports your contention that tax rates(especially the effective tax rates) have remained stable for the past 3 decades. It would tend to not support your contention that effective tax rates(not marginal tax rates) were changed much by the Reagan Revolution. The graphs seem to indicate theat the effective tax rate(the rate that is actually paid and collecte) has remained between 15% and 18% since 1979.

Interesting. http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/TaxFacts/papers/progressivity_trends.pdf

[Vaevictis]

This study supports your contention that tax rates(especially the effective tax rates) have remained stable for the past 3 decades. It would tend to not support your contention that effective tax rates(not marginal tax rates) were changed much by the Reagan Revolution. The graphs seem to indicate theat the effective tax rate(the rate that is actually paid and collecte) has remained between 15% and 18% since 1979.

Interesting. http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/TaxFacts/papers/progressivity_trends.pdf

That depends on how you look at it. Take a look at Figure B. From 1981 to 1983, the average tax rate looks like it drops about 2.5% (just eyeballing here). Now, that doesn't seem like much if you look at it from an absolute point of view, but consider it went from (about) 15% to (about) 12.5% -- that's about a 16.6% reduction in the average tax burden.

It looks like it creeps back up to just below 1979 levels by the end of the graph in 1996.

I would also point out that the paper is over 10 years out of date at this point, and doesn't include the 2003 tax cuts.

[Ike]

This study supports your contention that tax rates(especially the effective tax rates) have remained stable for the past 3 decades. It would tend to not support your contention that effective tax rates(not marginal tax rates) were changed much by the Reagan Revolution. The graphs seem to indicate theat the effective tax rate(the rate that is actually paid and collecte) has remained between 15% and 18% since 1979.

Interesting. http://www.taxpolicycenter.org/TaxFacts/papers/progressivity_trends.pdf

I have a hard time taking seriously anyone that uses excel plots in a published paper...

;)