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View Full Version : Rick Barnes Named Big 12 COY



GrapevineSooner
3/6/2007, 05:43 PM
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No offense to Rick, but having a dominant player like Durant makes it a little easier to 'coach'.

Personally, I would have voted Bob Huggins from K-State ahead of Barnes.

Ash
3/6/2007, 05:52 PM
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No offense to Rick, but having a dominant player like Durant makes it a little easier to 'coach'.

Personally, I would have voted Bob Huggins from K-State ahead of Barnes.

I agree.

soonerdave79
3/6/2007, 06:19 PM
Or Gillespie even. But Rick Barnes? That's crazy.

GoState
3/6/2007, 06:26 PM
I'd have to go with Huggins as well. I can't stand him, but he led a very big turnaround. From 15-13 (6-10) last year to 21-10 (10-6) this year is impressive.

King Crimson
3/6/2007, 06:48 PM
i would have voted for Barnes, then Huggy (7 of KSU's 10 conference wins were against teams with an rpi over 100, and they were 1-5 against rpi top 50 teams, crappy SOS--but even with an rpi of 60 they'll probably get in the Dance because of the Huggy factor--better teams will get left out). Barnes was a 3 pointer away from a share of the conference crown with a young team. Sure he's got Durant, but Augustine is a heckuva player too. Gillespie, i don't think so. he had Law and Joseph Jones coming back....they were supposed to be good.

Soonerus
3/6/2007, 10:14 PM
Barnes would have been at least my 4th choice...bad pick...

Sooner_Bob
3/6/2007, 10:19 PM
Gillespie or Huggins . . .

JohnnyMack
3/6/2007, 10:33 PM
I have no problem with that selection. For a team that wasn't supposed to be in the top 3 of the conference to finish as strong as it did is impressive. I think BH did a good job at KSU as well. Regardless of who he had on the floor, to totally turn a team over the way Barnes did and still come within a basket of a Big XII Title is impressive.

I get the feeling some people wouldn't give Saxet credit if they cured cancer.

Soonerus
3/6/2007, 10:36 PM
Why vote Barnes as COY just because Durant decided to spend one year in college ???

royalfan5
3/6/2007, 10:38 PM
Why vote Barnes as COY just because Durant decided to spend one year in college ???
Well he did get Durant to spend that year with him.

Soonerus
3/6/2007, 10:40 PM
Well he did get Durant to spend that year with him.

That could be evidence of other talents Barnes has, but not coaching...

royalfan5
3/6/2007, 10:50 PM
That could be evidence of other talents Barnes has, but not coaching...
Is coach of the year awarded on in game management, or overall performance of the program?

Soonerus
3/6/2007, 10:53 PM
Is coach of the year awarded on in game management, or overall performance of the program?

Votes are given based upon the subjective belief of each voter, generalizations are not proper...

royalfan5
3/6/2007, 10:55 PM
Votes are given based upon the subjective belief of each voter, generalizations are not proper...
Then what qualities do you think should matter in the Coach of the Year voting.

Soonerus
3/6/2007, 10:56 PM
No psycho-analysis please...

badger
3/6/2007, 11:07 PM
it is... um... good recruiting?

didn't mack daddy win an award for not coaching vince?

Soonerus
3/6/2007, 11:11 PM
IMO Barnes does not deserve it this year, you are entitled to yours...I think it is a no-brainer...

colleyvillesooner
3/6/2007, 11:26 PM
I have no problem with that selection. For a team that wasn't supposed to be in the top 3 of the conference to finish as strong as it did is impressive. I think BH did a good job at KSU as well. Regardless of who he had on the floor, to totally turn a team over the way Barnes did and still come within a basket of a Big XII Title is impressive.

I get the feeling some people wouldn't give Saxet credit if they cured cancer.

They were picked 4th (barely) by the Big 12 writers and as high as 3 in others. Not that big a jump.

I personally would have gone with BH or BG.

OSUAggie
3/7/2007, 01:06 AM
It's pretty remarkable that Texas put together a season like they had with pretty much only Abrams returning from the previous year, and even he is just a 2nd year guy.... Not 1 starter, but 1 player (2 if you count Atchley, which most don't). Rick Barnes deserves all the praise in the world.

King Crimson
3/7/2007, 01:07 AM
They were picked 4th (barely) by the Big 12 writers and as high as 3 in others. Not that big a jump.

I personally would have gone with BH or BG.

then your pick of BG makes even less sense. ATM was picked 2nd and returned Law and Jones. not a jump at all.

goingoneight
3/7/2007, 01:26 AM
Gillespie would have been my choice.

Barnes and Huggns are up there, Self is meh... about like Barnes. Talent defines his coachign career.

I'm still impressed with Capel's system, but it's a no-brainer that W's will win you awards faster than moral victories will. If we could have continued that winning streak just a little longer, Capel might have gotten the nod, simply because of the strength of the conference, his first season, his defensive philosophy and the fact that no offense to OUr guys, but he didn't exactly have a lot to work with. Kelvin's backups and a few young guns.

OSUAggie
3/7/2007, 01:38 AM
Self was pretty decent at the two Tulsa schools, without all the blue-chippers.. And he does manage to recruit some of that talent that he now has. I'm not really sure how your coaching gets downgraded because you're able to fulfill your recruiting duties... If a team is predicted to go 34-0 and they manage to do that, is that less of an accomplishment than a team that was picked to go 10-20 but won 20 games just because the undefeated team had more talent?

Octavian
3/7/2007, 01:46 AM
If a team is predicted to go 34-0 and they manage to do that, is that less of an accomplishment than a team that was picked to go 10-20 but won 20 games just because the undefeated team had more talent?


yes...if the criteria is simply "coaching" as in "game-day coaching."


if the criteria of "coaching" is "leader of the program in all facets," then no


COY honors are sort've like MVP awards.


Anyways, I would've voted for Barnes too

OSUAggie
3/7/2007, 01:49 AM
So.. Mike Montgomery is better than John Wooden, or at the very least should have more COY trophies.

Octavian
3/7/2007, 01:56 AM
So.. Mike Montgomery is better than John Wooden, or at the very least should have more COY trophies.


well, it's just a fact that many championship level coaches haven't received as much credit as they should simply because they're perceived as recruiting titans (Mack Brown, Roy Williams, Barry Switzer, etc)


Was Eddie a better coach than Roy? Schematically, probably so. But in all facets of the job? Well, one has a ring and one doesn't

OSUAggie
3/7/2007, 01:58 AM
1 has 798 wins and 1 doesn't... A nat'l championship shouldn't make or break a legacy of a coach.... 11.. maybe.

goingoneight
3/7/2007, 02:00 AM
How many arrests does Roy have?

Octavian
3/7/2007, 02:06 AM
1 has 798 wins and 1 doesn't... A nat'l championship shouldn't make or break a legacy of a coach.... 11.. maybe.


true, but which one was the better coach?


It depends on how you define coach.


Let's say, hypothetically, you're betting your life savings on a game. The two teams playing are exactly equal in talent. Who would you want to coach your team in that game? Roy or Eddie? I'd pick Sutton.


But if I was T-Boone'in it up and had my own collegiate athletic program...and I could pick between the two to lead my basketball program....I'd pick Roy.


Just depends on how you define "coach."

OSUAggie
3/7/2007, 02:08 AM
I'll take Roy over Eddie with equal talent any day. Roy owned Eddie. And wouldn't you be Gaylord'n it up?

goingoneight
3/7/2007, 02:10 AM
I love stirring fights up on a message board. :D Kick his ***, Sea Bass! Err, I mean... Octavian. :)

Octavian
3/7/2007, 02:11 AM
Roy owned Eddie.


but they usually didn't have equal talent....Roy outrecruited him and brought more talent into Phog than Eddie did to GIA

tommieharris91
3/7/2007, 02:16 AM
I'll take Tar Heel Roy Williams over anyone in coaching right now. Think about it. Roy always owned Eddie along with the rest of the league (Sampson started getting him in LNC towards the end.) Roy really should have gotten the job done at Kansas at least once. He finally did it at UNC. He may do it this year, and he's won 4 straight (I think, I know at least 3 straight) against K and Duke.

OSUAggie
3/7/2007, 02:26 AM
but they usually didn't have equal talent....Roy outrecruited him and brought more talent into Phog than Eddie did to GIA

k... We'll go with equal talent games, then.. I consider '91-'95 as equal. '96 and '97 we were terrible and they were great, '98 we were decent but they were great, as was the case in '99... '00 we were better... They were better the rest of the way....... This is memory, so correct me if I'm off in the "level playing fieldability" of those years..

So..

'91 - Split the home games .. we won by 5, they won by 10
'92 - Split the home games (OSU by 8, KU by 13) and KU won in KC
'93 - Roy swept (by 12 and 1)
'94 - Split the home games (KU by 1 (****ing Woodberry... err... maybe Adonis, can't remember), OSU by 4), OSU by 1 in KC
'95 - Split (OSU by 10, KU by 16)

So, what's that 7-5 for Roy? I guess it's not that glaring, but I'll still take Roy in a 1-game matchup vs. Eddie.

Octavian
3/7/2007, 02:36 AM
k... We'll go with equal talent games, then.. I consider '91-'95 as equal. '96 and '97 we were terrible and they were great, '98 we were decent but they were great, as was the case in '99... '00 we were better... They were better the rest of the way....... This is memory, so correct me if I'm off in the "level playing fieldability" of those years..

So..

'91 - Split the home games .. we won by 5, they won by 10
'92 - Split the home games (OSU by 8, KU by 13) and KU won in KC
'93 - Roy swept (by 12 and 1)
'94 - Split the home games (KU by 1 (****ing Woodberry), OSU by 4), OSU by 1 in KC
'95 - Split (OSU by 10, KU by 16)

So, what's that 7-5 for Roy? I guess it's not that glaring, but I'll still take Roy in a 1-game matchup vs. Eddie.


okay, well I'd still take Eddie if we were only talkin' about one game.


A couple years in the late '90s, I thought Roy had assembled the best talent of any team in America and they Rawk Choked. Rarely did they lose in March to a squad with more talent than them.


For the same talent-assembling reasons, I'd take Roy as the long-term leader of my program.

OSUAggie
3/7/2007, 02:41 AM
It takes guards that can consistently score to win in March and Roy never had that premier lead guard (Jacque was great, but was pretty woeful shooting) during his late-90s run. When he did have that guard (Hinrich), they didn't choke, but got beat by a hot team (or player).

KsSooner
3/7/2007, 08:13 AM
Uh, they choked, 12 out of 30 from FT line...

colleyvillesooner
3/7/2007, 08:42 AM
then your pick of BG makes even less sense. ATM was picked 2nd and returned Law and Jones. not a jump at all.

I'm not using that logic. He was.

I was just saying I thought those two did the best job, not compared to how people thought they would do.

OSUAggie
3/7/2007, 09:39 AM
Uh, they choked, 12 out of 30 from FT line...

Ah, I forgot Roy shot free throws that night...

CobraKai
3/7/2007, 10:34 AM
I would vote for Bobby Knight. He is the only coach in the league that was able to wear the conference commissioner on his hand like a little hand puppet.

Cam
3/8/2007, 10:22 PM
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No offense to Rick, but having a dominant player like Durant makes it a little easier to 'coach'.

Personally, I would have voted Bob Huggins from K-State ahead of Barnes.
I'd have voted Gillespie with Huggins a very close second. Barnes wasn't in the top 3 as far as I'm concerned.