Bush won't stand up to Putin

[Widescreen]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20070214/pl_afp/usbushpoliticsrussia_070214185950


The Russian leader on Saturday castigated the United States as a reckless "unipolar" power that had "imposed itself on other states" and that US dominance in the world was "ruinous."

The Kremlin leader delivered the scathing remarks at a high-level international security conference in Germany, saying that the United States had dangerously "overstepped its borders in all spheres."

Putin attacked NATO expansion into the former Soviet Union and was scathing about a plan to set up US missile-defense systems in Poland and the Czech Republic. He suggested these weapons were aimed at Russia.

"It's a complicated relationship," Bush said of Washington's ties with Moscow.

"It's a relationship in which there are disagreements, but there's also a relationship in which we can find common ground to solve problems. And that's the spirit -- that's the spirit I'll continue to work with Vladimir Putin."

It sure would be nice for the US President to say "Putin is wrong and I intend to discuss these issues with him at the earliest possible time." Instead of "He can say whatever he wants about us and I won't respond other than to say we should continue to work together."

I'd make a terrible diplomat and I freely admit it.

[OhU1]

I agree with the way you would have put it. Bush is a poor diplomat.

[Czar Soonerov]

Why don't you people support our commander-in-chief? Love it or leave it.

[mdklatt]

But Bush gazed into Putin's eyes and felt his soul or whatever. Their relationship is beyond mere words.

Why can't I quit you?

[Scott D]

seriously, Bush like him or not he's in a no win situation with pretty much everything. Such is the way of the lame duck portion of a second term.

[SoonerProphet]

What is he wrong about? Putin is going to look out for Russia's national interest and challenge Washington when they feel it is being threatened.

[Widescreen]

What is he wrong about?
That's certainly a predictable comment from you.


Putin is going to look out for Russia's national interest and challenge Washington when they feel it is being threatened.
And our President will just wink and nod in response. Not cool.

[KABOOKIE]

Wow. I'm convinced Bush could cure cancer and people would still bitch.

[Widescreen]

You're missing the point. I voted for Bush twice. And I now don't like him much because of his abandonment of conservatism (assuming he ever really was a conservative). My current method is to point out when he's screwing up but defend him when he's being unfairly criticized (which happens a lot from the left). In this case, I think he's screwing up by not defending the US - although like I said, I'm not a diplomat.

[Scott D]

Widescreen, I bet you never looked to see if Putin was up for re-election soon did you.

[Ike]

Widescreen, I bet you never looked to see if Putin was up for re-election soon did you.

Doesn't he pretty much fix the elections these days?

[royalfan5]

Doesn't he pretty much fix the elections these days?
Not as much as some of the other former S.S.R's. Also he has given no indication that he isn't planning not to stand down at the end of his term.

[SoonerProphet]

That's certainly a predictable comment from you.

Do you have a response to this question?

[Octavian]

Doesn't he pretty much fix the elections these days?


...and controls state-run media....and has twisted the legislative body into granting him Tsar-like powers.


Russia is as about as democratic and open now as it was in 1916. Unfortunately.

[Widescreen]

Do you have a response to this question?
:rolleyes:


The Russian leader on Saturday castigated the United States as a reckless "unipolar" power that had "imposed itself on other states" and that US dominance in the world was "ruinous."
Reckless? Yeah, right.
Ruinous? I guess it depends on your definition but I would strongly disagree.


The Kremlin leader delivered the scathing remarks at a high-level international security conference in Germany, saying that the United States had dangerously "overstepped its borders in all spheres."
All spheres? That's about as intelligent as saying all Russians are commies.


Putin attacked NATO expansion into the former Soviet Union and was scathing about a plan to set up US missile-defense systems in Poland and the Czech Republic. He suggested these weapons were aimed at Russia.
Maybe they are pointed at Russia and maybe not. What about the missiles still pointed at the US? He's guessing and we know. So who has the stronger right to complain? And yet we don't.

SP, I'm curious about your worldview. Whenever someone says something negative about the US, you're typically the first to agree - even when it's an enemy of the US saying it (not specifically talking about Russia although I would say they aren't our friends). Are you so desperate to appear even-handed and enlightened that you'll agree that we suck every chance you get? When was the last time you defended the US against criticism? Or is all US criticism warranted?

[Jimminy Crimson]

I giggled at the subject line. :O

[n8v_ndn]

It's not the President's fault, it's his handlers. He wanted to reply 'All your bases are belong to us' in Russian, but they convinced him that Ivan Drago was alive and well and Chuck Norris was AWOL.

[SoonerProphet]

:rolleyes:


Reckless? Yeah, right.
Ruinous? I guess it depends on your definition but I would strongly disagree.


All spheres? That's about as intelligent as saying all Russians are commies.


Maybe they are pointed at Russia and maybe not. What about the missiles still pointed at the US? He's guessing and we know. So who has the stronger right to complain? And yet we don't.

SP, I'm curious about your worldview. Whenever someone says something negative about the US, you're typically the first to agree - even when it's an enemy of the US saying it (not specifically talking about Russia although I would say they aren't our friends). Are you so desperate to appear even-handed and enlightened that you'll agree that we suck every chance you get? When was the last time you defended the US against criticism? Or is all US criticism warranted?


Dude, I realize it is hard for you to wrap your brain around the idea that other nations and peoples have different cultural sets and values than your own. I also realize that it is hard for you to fathom the idea that other nations might actually act in their own interests irrespective of what the United States thinks or wants. But guess what, it happens. India has relations with Iran and we have relations with India. China is going to loan us money out the wazzoo for our childrens children to pay back...and the Russian are going to voice concerns about their near abroad.

Criticism and skepticism about those in powerful places is warranted always...Putin or Bush. Not defending or anything of the like, just sayin'.

http://www.takimag.com/site/article/persecuting_putin/

[Hamhock]

I wish Abraham Lincoln was still president.

[MojoRisen]

We will defend our American interest and we don't need Nato too let us do it either.

[Widescreen]

You didn't answer any of my questions, but whatever.


Dude, I realize it is hard for you to wrap your brain around the idea that other nations and peoples have different cultural sets and values than your own. I also realize that it is hard for you to fathom the idea that other nations might actually act in their own interests irrespective of what the United States thinks or wants.
No, it's not difficult at all. All nations act first in their own interests. The whole point of this thread was that Putin shot off his mouth about all the ways he thinks we suck and Bush just took it. Then you took off on the whole "Putin's right" thing.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Putin is just ****ed that Russia ia no longer a super power. Putin should just close his mouth and let the oil money roll in for a while and then Russia will be back. Oh, wait, Putin probably won't be in power then...Nevermind, Putin needs some relevance.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Hmm. We help the Poles and Czechs get missles to defend themselves...and Russia somehow feels threatened by this? What has all of that got to do with Bush? I'm sure Bush laughed his arse off when he saw Putin's remarks.

NATO: Well, Putin and Commies, how does it feel to have Poland and the Czech Republic talking steps to ensure you won't invade them again and rule them with an iron fist for decades like you did in the Cold War?

Putin and Commies: America is bad! B-A-D Bad!

F'n morons. The U.S. gives boxing gloves to the countries the Soviets used to keep under their thumb. Hooray! The tables are turned!

Eat my corn filled crap, Putin. You're getting what you deserve for decades of tyranny. Russia can suck it.

[Scott D]

Eat my corn filled crap, Putin. You're getting what you deserve for decades of tyranny. Russia can suck it.

decades? more like centuries. The Czars were no saints.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Agreed. Corn filled crap for the Czars as well. The gall of Russians to be upset when someone else has missles. I hope Poland and the Czech Republic knee Russia in the nuts.

[Vaevictis]

Dude's posturing. Do we actually care?

Until he backs it up with more than a stern remark, I don't think I do.

[SicEmBaylor]

Hmm. We help the Poles and Czechs get missles to defend themselves...and Russia somehow feels threatened by this? What has all of that got to do with Bush? I'm sure Bush laughed his arse off when he saw Putin's remarks.

Because the Russians are a very historically aware group of people especially when it comes to national security. They have a very very long memory. They perceive us getting involved in Pole and Czech national defense in any way as a threat. They're especially sensitive about Poland since they consider it to be a buffer between themselves and Western Europe.

Missile defense decreases the potency of their missile deterrent and is thus viewed as a national security threat.

[OhU1]

Damn that Sic Em and his liberal clap trap. Russia is evil dude. We like fought them in World War II and stuff.

[Widescreen]

They're especially sensitive about Poland since they consider it to be a buffer between themselves and Western Europe.
One of these days maybe they'll realize the Soviet Union broke up and Poland is no longer in their sphere of influence. That would be allsome.

[OCUDad]

What would be the advantage of calling Putin out in public, other than to start a p***ing contest neither man can win? I thought Bush's response was just fine. When next they talk in private, the response can be tougher. But for now a soft answer turneth away wrath. That's what diplomacy is all about. I think Bush looks like the bigger man in this particular exchange.

[SoonerTerry]

Damn that Sic Em and his liberal clap trap. Russia is evil dude. We like fought them in World War II and stuff.


heh..:twinkies:

[MojoRisen]

Because the Russians are a very historically aware group of people especially when it comes to national security. They have a very very long memory. They perceive us getting involved in Pole and Czech national defense in any way as a threat. They're especially sensitive about Poland since they consider it to be a buffer between themselves and Western Europe.

Missile defense decreases the potency of their missile deterrent and is thus viewed as a national security threat.

Kind of like CUBA