Finally, somebody is doing something about OUr kooky beer/wine laws

[Okla-homey]

The liquor store lobby in OK is too powerful to get this done any other way. The Constitutional amendment by referendum just might work. Hooray for these guys!


Petition on wine sales in works
By LEIGH WOOSLEY Tulsa World Staff Writer
1/7/2007

A group wants to permit grocery and convenience stores to sell wine and strong beer.

A group is planning a petition campaign to allow the sale of wine and strong beer in every Oklahoma grocery and convenience store that is licensed to sell weak beer. :D :D :D

The group, Oklahomans for Modern Laws, will try this year to collect the signatures of about 220,000 registered voters. That's the number of signatures needed before the proposed amendment to the Oklahoma Constitution could be presented to voters in the 2008 general election.

The petition is gaining strength as its supporters, mostly Oklahoma City business people who remain virtually anonymous, say they have had friendly talks with grocers, convenience-store owners and winemakers.

"All the groups that support the petition will be asked to fund it," said Larry Wood, the group's campaign manager.

Wood was key in the 1984 voter approval of the county option for liquor-by-the-drink, which allowed wine, liquor and strong beer to be served in bars and restaurants for the first time since Prohibition.

He thinks Oklahoma is ready to loosen its Bible belt another notch regarding liquor.

"The people (who support this) think that a rising tide lifts all ships," Wood said.

"When people come here from other states to set up business, they want the amenities that other states have. They don't want to come to a state where the laws are not updated and modernized."

Thirty-four states allow the sale of wine in grocery and convenience stores. Such businesses in Oklahoma can sell nothing stronger than 3.2 beer.

State law restricts the sale of wine and strong beer to liquor stores and limits their business hours to 10 a.m. to 9 p.m. Monday through Saturday. The stores must close on Sundays and major holidays.

These restrictions make Oklahoma one of the more conservative states on liquor. But since the liquor-by-the-drink vote, 43 of Oklahoma's 77 counties have gone "wet" by passing the option.

Most of those counties did so in the last decade, said Marta Patton, the deputy director of the state Alcoholic Beverage Laws Enforcement Commission.

The petition faces a battle, mostly from many western counties that want to remain dry, she said.

But she pointed to a vote last November that surprised many Oklahomans, especially conservatives.

Voters decided in a close contest to allow liquor stores to be open at the same time as election polls, indicating that some people found the state's liquor laws too restrictive.

Oklahomans for Modern Laws hope that vote portends success for its petition. Grocers and convenience store owners can't help but see the opportunity.

Wood said most products in those stores are sold at a 5 percent markup, but wine and some strong beer are often sold at a 30 percent markup. :eek:

"People travel to other states and realize this is an important stimulant to economic development," he said.

"I think there's a real trend in Oklahoma to support these laws as long as they are adequately regulated."

Regulation would be up to the Legislature if voters approve the proposal.

Major retail chains that shoulder local economies, such as QuikTrip and Reasor's, are ready to stock their shelves with wine and strong beer. QuikTrip already sells them at its convenience stores in seven states that allow it.

QuikTrip is neutral on the Oklahoma proposal.

Texas recently lightened its liquor laws to make some dry counties wet, and QuikTrip is booming there because of it, the company's spokesman Mike Thornbrugh said.

Proponents say the proposed change would attract higher-end grocery stores, such as Trader Joe's and Whole Foods Market. [and the greatest grocery store chain on the planet, "Publix" which won't open anywhere it can't sell wine.]

Whole Foods' spokeswoman Kate Lowery said the ability to sell wine and strong beer is an attraction when the company is deciding where to build new stores.

"It's really something that our shoppers are very interested in," she said, adding that other criteria for new store locations include population density and education levels.

Trader Joe's did not return calls seeking comment.

Predictably, liquor store owners are lining up against the petition. :mad: :mad: :mad:

"We're prepared to challenge the signatures (on the petition), and we're going to fight this tooth and nail," said J.P. Richard, the president of the Retail Liquor Association of Oklahoma and owner of Cache Road Discount Liquor & Wine in Lawton. :mad: :mad: :mad:

"It's not for them to come in and disrupt the system that we have become accustomed to, a system that the Legislature and everyone seems to think works just fine," Richard said of the people behind the move. [For the record, I don't think it works just fine. It succs, but I guess I don't count to Mr. "Fleece the 6.0 Beerdrinker" here.]

Fred Parkhill, the owner of Fikes-Parkhill Liquor & Wines in Tulsa, said having wine and strong beer in grocery stores would force him to raise his prices on liquor and better wine.

He'd have to do that to offset the cheaper prices he would have to put on more common wines, which big stores can buy in bulk and sell at a discount, he said.

"To put wines in grocery stores -- it's up to the people, but it would be a mistake," he said. "I am biased about it, but people would be madder than hell if we raised our liquor prices. All the (liquor) stores would have to do that. It's just a matter of economics."

He also cited safety reasons, as do many other opponents of the petition, but alcohol-related incidents do not necessarily increase when wine is available in grocery stores.

Bill Kerr, a scientist with the National Alcohol Research Center in Berkeley, Calif., said the danger increases when stronger alcohol is available in a greater number of outlets and at later hours.

"The effects aren't as great as people think they are, but they are there," he said.

Leigh Woosley 581-8465
[email protected]

[1stTimeCaller]

In Missouri you can pick up your groceries, wine, strong beer and liquor in one fell swoop.

[Okla-homey]

In Missouri you can pick up your groceries, wine, strong beer and liquor in one fell swoop.

Of course! But here in Oklahoma, it's about protecting a particular retail industry which has had its way with us Okies for far too long.

[1stTimeCaller]

Will this mean that our Budweiser and Coors light etc will be available at higher than 3.2% ?

[royalfan5]

In Missouri you can pick up your groceries, wine, strong beer and liquor in one fell swoop.
Nebraska too, and it's pretty handy.

[Okla-homey]

Will this mean that our Budweiser and Coors light etc will be available at higher than 3.2% ?

I see no reason why not. The proposed change to the law doesn't seem to be about changing that part. Just making 6.0 available wherever 3.2 is sold. I do hope they can sell it cold though.

[Viking Kitten]

Predictably, liquor store owners are lining up against the petition.

No ****. Wasn't Al Capone against repealing Prohibition?

Where do I go to sign the dang thing? Especially if we get a Whole Foods out of the deal. That place rocks.

[Okla-homey]

I love how the liquor store guys says they'll have to raise the price of spirits to make up for the money they'll lose if they can't continue to rip people off by selling the 6.0 beer at a flippin' 30% mark-up.

F-him and his liquor store cronies. If they raise the price of spirits to make up their loss on beer, I bet the market will adjust somehow. Its a lot easier to shoot over the border to get a case of whiskey than he may think. The dillwood should take the long view and try to get the law changed to allow sale of cold 6.0 beer in liquor stores, then people would be more inclined to go to his place for one-stop beverage shopping.

A pox on him.

[1stTimeCaller]

I love how the liquor store guys says they'll have to raise the price of spirits to make up for the money they'll lose if they can't continue to rip people off by selling the 6.0 beer at a flippin' 30% mark-up.

F-him and his liquor store cronies. If they raise the price of spirits to make up their loss on beer, I bet the market will adjust somehow. Its a lot easier to shoot over the border to get a case of whiskey than he may think. The dillwood should take the long view and try to get the law changed to allow sale of cold 6.0 beer in liquor stores, then people would be more inclined to go to his place for one-stop beverage shopping.

A pox on him.

now that's just silly. Even if Budweiser or Coors or Miller would provide the beer coolers, he's going to have to pay for the 'lectricity to run them. That might cut into their profits.

:D

[GottaHavePride]

now that's just silly. Even if Budweiser or Coors or Miller would provide the beer coolers, he's going to have to pay for the 'lectricity to run them. That might cut into their profits.

:D

It seems to work ok up here in Kansas - no wine or liquor in the grocery stores, but refrigerated high-point beer at the liquor stores AND the stores are open until 11 pm on Friday and Saturday.

[royalfan5]

It seems to work ok up here in Kansas - no wine or liquor in the grocery stores, but refrigerated high-point beer at the liquor stores AND the stores are open until 11 pm on Friday and Saturday.
You know what works better though, being able to buy cold 6.0 beer almost anywhere like you can in Nebraska. I've seen flower shops that sell beer too. Grocery and convience stores can sell what ever, and as a result we get some great liquor stores out of the deal because they have to go above and beyond to attract customers when you can go to the Wal-Marts and buy the basics.

[GottaHavePride]

True. I was just pointing out that Oklahoma is so far behind even Kansas is ahead of them in some respects. ;)

[Frozen Sooner]

Can't buy alcohol at all at the grocery store here.

Which may explain our plethora of liquor stores.

[Boomer.....]

I hope this happens sometime in my lifetime.

[sitzpinkler]

This would mean Fat Tire at the grocery store. Somebody call New Belgium!

[OklahomaTuba]

There is no reason this shouldn't happen. Special interests are really hard to overcome in this state though.

[OUAndy1807]

JP Richard is a ******. Tell him to go back to throwing bottles off the top of his liquor stores and "smashing prices" in his commercials.

Also, he wants you to pronounce his name Reshard, not Richard like he's some kind of fancy frenchman, not a liquor store owner from Lawton.

[Cam]

Just tell me where I need to go to sign.

[hurricane'bone]

This would mean Fat Tire at the grocery store. Somebody call New Belgium!


Only if they allowed refrigeration.

[Czar Soonerov]

We bought Fat Tire in Texas unrefrigerated. The guy told us that once you put it on ice, not to let it get warm up again. It tasted great when when we finally drank it.

[MamaMia]

Thats a step in the right direction, but I wont be happy until I can walk into Albertsons and get me a bottle of Bacardi 151. :P

[Viking Kitten]

I want to live next door to MamaMia and have awesome neighborhood parties that people still talk about 20 years after they happened.

[AlbqSooner]

Beer, Wine and Bacardi 151 in the grocery stores here in New Mex. Does the Oklahoma Statute still refer to 3.2 as a "nonintoxicating alcoholic beverage"?

I used to get really non-intoxicated when I lived in Oklahoma - that and belch a lot.

[GottaHavePride]

We bought Fat Tire in Texas unrefrigerated. The guy told us that once you put it on ice, not to let it get warm up again. It tasted great when when we finally drank it.
That's funny, because New Belgium's website used to say they only ship on refrigerated rail cars and trucks. So the guy in Texas ALREADY let the beer get warm again.

More to the point, at one point New Belgium's website was explaining that they were already running at full capacity and didn't want to expand unless they could do it without sacrificing quality. However, considering Utah and Oklahoma are about the only places in the western US you CAN'T get their beer, I'd bet we'd start getting shipments as soon as OK passes a non-retarded liquor law.

[1stTimeCaller]

Coors Light puts out the same myth about their product being cold from the factory to your house.

[OUHOMER]

i think thats why you can not get Bud, Coors,in a strong beer in OKLA. it must be kept cold. thats why you can not buy it at liqure stores

[bluedogok]

Every state has its goofy liquor laws, Dallas and its "wet areas" by voting district is a joke along with the Unicard system. In this part of the state everything seems to be open.

The 3.2 beer nonsense is a holdover from prohibition and the "non-intoxicating beverage" and is from that era as well. During the Coors brewery tour they stated that they (and A-B) were able to stay in business during prohibition due to 3.2 beer and other products, 3.2 was considered low enough of an alcohol level to be legal. It was legal for sale in Colorado, Kansas, Missouri and Oklahoma. The "non-intoxicating beverage" and was originally regulated as food outside the old ABC agency although I think licensing and such is now under the ABLE commission.

At least that was what I was told was the "reason" behind 3.2 being in Oklahoma.

[trey]

welcome to 2007

[soonerloyal]

I went to Seattle a few years ago for a Young Marines Staff seminar. I got a real hard time in a restaurant about being from the state that 1) doesn't have wine & etc. available in grocery stores, 2) still looks the other way about cockfighting, 3) doesn't allow tattoos (THANK GAWD that's changed). One gal also told me "You can't be from Oklahoma...you're not indian-looking!"

Pacifist peckerheads.

[BigRedJed]

Bud and Coors could sell strong beer in Oklahoma right now if they wanted to. The problem for them is that they only want to sell their beer cold. According to Oklahoma law, 3.2 beer is considered to not be an intoxicating beverage, so it can be sold cold. The original intent was to keep people from walking into a store, buying cold, strong beer, hopping in the car and tooling down the road drinking it.

The reality is that we all know you can get drunk on 3.2, it just sucks to drink. But Coors, Bud, et al aren't really concerned about the discriminating drinker. Selling strong beer warm in stores would not increase their sales appreciably, and would require an entirely separate level of enforcement, so they just supply the weak stuff here.

Why anyone would drink that swill is beyond me, anyway. You can get all sorts of great strong beer in Oklahoma at liquor stores and in restaurants, the same strong (or the incorrectly-termed "six point") beer you can get in Texas or anywhere else. A notable exception is New Belgium and others who also refuse to sell their beer unrefrigerated.

As for the new law, I'm all for it. The main reason I'm for it is one of the main reasons it's being pushed; so that the Oklahoma market looks appealing to a chain such as Whole Foods. OKC has been working for some time to bring a Whole Foods to downtown (they're one of the best fits for that type of market), but can't get over the hump without this law change. This is one of the main reasons the law is now being considered.

[BigRedJed]

And 3.2 licensing in Oklahoma is still outside of ABLE. From ABLE you get mixed beverage licensing, which entitles you to sell strong beer, wine and liquor. You have to get different licensing for 3.2, and it's not from ABLE but controlled by your municipality/county laws.

[GottaHavePride]

Why anyone would drink that swill is beyond me, anyway. You can get all sorts of great strong beer in Oklahoma at liquor stores and in restaurants, the same strong (or the incorrectly-termed "six point") beer you can get in Texas or anywhere else. A notable exception is New Belgium and others who also refuse to sell their beer unrefrigerated.

Yeah, even "six-point" bud and coors is usually only about 4.5% alcohol - not even close to actual 6% alcohol. And Guinness - which most people mistakenly think is a "strong" beer (confusing flavor for alcohol content) is only 3.8% alcohol.

[MamaMia]

I want to live next door to MamaMia and have awesome neighborhood parties that people still talk about 20 years after they happened.I wish you did live next door. You aren't into hanging twirlies, plastic and plaster of paris lawn ornaments are you? :D

[Viking Kitten]

I wish you did live next door. You aren't into hanging twirlies, plastic and plaster of paris lawn ornaments are you? :D

Just a couple of pink flamingos, but we keep those for religious reasons.

[Rhino]

Just tell me where I need to go to sign. http://www.modernlawsok.org/node/5

[MamaMia]

Just a couple of pink flamingos, but we keep those for religious reasons.
I completely understand. My husband and I are Parrot Heads ourselves. :D

[Flagstaffsooner]

Beer, Wine and Bacardi 151 in the grocery stores here in New Mex. Does the Oklahoma Statute still refer to 3.2 as a "nonintoxicating alcoholic beverage"?

I used to get really non-intoxicated when I lived in Oklahoma - that and belch a lot.Somebody tell Olevet that he is sober.:D

[SoonerStormchaser]

Thank God for the class six stores on base! No tax and it's open 7 days a week!

[olevetonahill]

Somebody tell Olevet that he is sober.:D
Hell Ive got that stuff figured out . I just drink 2 at the same time , That way Im gettin 6.4 ;)

[sitzpinkler]

Only if they allowed refrigeration.

I would assume this would allow for refrigeration of high point beer if they sell it in grocery stores, right? Wouldn't this effectively be getting rid of 3.2 altogether?

[Flagstaffsooner]

Hell Ive got that stuff figured out . I just drink 2 at the same time , That way Im gettin 6.4 ;)Leave it to you to figure something like that out.:D

[Ike]

Here in Illinois, I can take care of all my food and beverage related needs in one fell swoop. Our grocery stores carry all 5 food groups: meat, bread, beer, wine, liquor. They carry other stuff too, but the rest isn't that important.

[Boarder]

Iwould support it just to get a Whole Foods.

[KC//CRIMSON]

In Missouri you can pick up your groceries, wine, strong beer, porn, lottery and liquor in one fell swoop.

:cool:

[NormanPride]

I want a freaking Whole Foods/Trader Joe's in Tulsa. I went to the Whole Foods down in San Antonio over the Christmas season and almost cried.

[SoonerInKCMO]

I see no reason why not. The proposed change to the law doesn't seem to be about changing that part. Just making 6.0 available wherever 3.2 is sold. I do hope they can sell it cold though.

:les: IT'S NOT 6.0!

[Okla-homey]

:les: IT'S NOT 6.0!

what-evar...every Okie knows WTF I'm talking about Mr Alcohol Content Nazi.;)

[olevetonahill]

Yeah , What Homey said .

[Cam]

http://www.modernlawsok.org/node/5
Done

[BigRedJed]

Like the signature of sombody from Joga Bonito is really going to work on an Oklahoma petition. Pffft.

[royalfan5]

I looked at the modern laws thing. You guys didn't get liquor by the drink until the 80's? We got that back when they did away with prohibition.

[BigRedJed]

Heck, around here, we didn't even do away with prohibition when they did away with prohibition. We kept it around until 1959. :eek:

[Frozen Sooner]

Heh. I remember the president of our housing corporation telling us stories of how he put himself through school in the 50s as a bootlegger.

[Okla-homey]

I looked at the modern laws thing. You guys didn't get liquor by the drink until the 80's? We got that back when they did away with prohibition.

FWIW, Liquor By The Drink just went into effect in Murray County OK on Dec 1, 2006. IOW, last month.:eek:

[Stoop Dawg]

I went to Seattle a few years ago for a Young Marines Staff seminar. I got a real hard time in a restaurant about being from the state that 1) doesn't have wine & etc. available in grocery stores, 2) still looks the other way about cockfighting, 3) doesn't allow tattoos (THANK GAWD that's changed). One gal also told me "You can't be from Oklahoma...you're not indian-looking!"

Pacifist peckerheads.

I hope you gave this gal an infinitely condescending look and asked her if she had ever left Seattle. People who make such remarks are only showing their own lack of education. They should feel stupid, not you.

Oh, and this "new law" is a no-brainer.

[Frozen Sooner]

I hope you gave this gal an infinitely condescending look and asked her if she had ever left Seattle. People who make such remarks are only showing their own lack of education. They should feel stupid, not you.

Oh, and this "new law" is a no-brainer.

You mean like all the people who ask me what it's like to live in an igloo?

[Stoop Dawg]

You mean like all the people who ask me what it's like to live in an igloo?

That's different. Alaskans really do live in igloos. Or so I'm told.

[OhU1]

J.P. Richard is protecting his own special interest. His argument for the status quo is weak. If he wants to protect his business interest he can start by addressing the decline in the quality of his store. I used to spend $40 a week at his store hauling beer back to Norman for the weekend for myself and friends. He had great selection and prices. Not anymore.

Let's remove the artificial barriers to competion J.P. wants to protect.

[Frozen Sooner]

That's different. Alaskans really do live in igloos. Or so I'm told.

Good point. I had an infestation of ice worms last night that was a bitch.

[1stTimeCaller]

hey Mike, how many baby seals would you say that you club in a given week?


;)

[Okla-homey]

hey Mike, how many baby seals would you say that you club in a given week?


;)

more importantly, does Froze have any whale blubber recipes worth sharing?

[Frozen Sooner]

hey Mike, how many baby seals would you say that you club in a given week?


;)

Average of three.

[Fraggle145]

Newest development in this story.... from the hub.

http://hub.ou.edu/articles/article.php?item_id=1923720992&section_id=1774511018


Royce Sharp is a beer connoisseur.

He prefers brews from small, quality-focused companies. His favorite beer, Full Sail Pale Ale, is made by an independent brewer in Hood River, Ore.

But Sharp, film and video studies senior, can’t get his favorite drink in Oklahoma. He blames the state’s convoluted assortment of alcohol regulations, especially its restriction of high-point beers like Full Sail to liquor stores, for his problem.

“It’s outrageous to think that I can go around to literally every liquor store in Oklahoma City and not be able to find what I can find at a Homeland in Seattle,” he said. “Companies don’t want to ship their beer to Oklahoma only to have it sold back to them because it’s not fresh.”

Oklahoma’s beer, wine and liquor laws are an often confusing assortment of constitutional amendments, state statutes and court cases that govern how people of legal age buy and sell alcohol. These laws can be sensitive subjects given alcohol’s relationship with accidents and crime. Oklahoma’s alcohol regulations are also economic flash points with manufacturers, wholesalers, retailers, pro-development groups and consumer organizations all trying to protect and advance their interests.

Alcohol laws have been amended many times in Oklahoma’s history, and more changes may be on the horizon. As Oklahomans decide how to control the state’s alcohol industries over the next 100 years, the social, political, economic and public-health elements of this debate will become more important.

http://hub.ou.edu/articles/images/1168359277/News/031407-Alcohol-Timeline-sto.jpg

Drinking in Oklahoma

Oklahoma entered the union in 1907 as a dry state 11 years before the 18th Amendment made Prohibition the law of the land. But the state’s constitution included a loophole, said Marta Patton, deputy director of Oklahoma’s Alcoholic Beverage Laws Enforcement Commission.

“They did exclude malt beverages whose liquor content was less than 3.2 (percent by weight),” Patton said.

Such beverages, known today as low-point beer, were then considered “non-intoxicating,” Patton said, and were therefore allowed in Oklahoma through the Prohibition years and afterward, when Oklahoma remained dry.

Higher-point beverages were not allowed until 1959, Patton said. That year, lawmakers created the Alcoholic Beverage Control Board, the ABLE Commission’s predecessor, to regulate beverages in excess of 3.2 percent alcohol by weight.

That change allowed liquor stores in Oklahoma, but serving liquor at restaurants or bars was still illegal until 1984, when individual counties were allowed to decide whether they could serve alcohol by the drink.

The 1984 constitutional question addressed a practice that was already widespread, albeit illegal, Patton said.

“Pre-’84, a lot of the violations in restaurants had to do with the serving of alcoholic beverages,” she said. Some customers brought their own drinks, known as “liquor by the wink.”

Of the state’s 77 counties, 46 are now “wet,” meaning the sale of alcohol by the drink is allowed. Wet counties are concentrated around cities and recreational areas, Patton said.

Beer

Laws governing the sale of beer in Oklahoma are perhaps the most contentious. Oklahoma, Colorado, Kansas, Missouri, Utah and Minnesota are the only states in which beer that contains 3.2 percent alcohol by weight is still sold, according to the Beer Institute, a Washington-based trade association.

Oklahoma is the U.S. leader in 3.2 beer sales, according to the Beer Institute. High-point beer is sold only at room temperature in package liquor stores here, while grocery and convenience stores may only sell low-point beer.

The state’s neighbors to the north and south provide a study in contrast. Like Oklahoma, Kansas mandates beverages above 3.2 percent alcohol may only be sold in liquor stores, while in Texas, anything up to 15.5 percent alcohol does not require an additional license. That difference has created the myth of the 6-point beer.

Oliver Delaney, former president of the Oklahoma Malt Beverage Association, said students who complain about Oklahoma’s “watery” beer and look forward to trips to Texas just for the “6-point” beer are often mistaken.

“The difference between a Texas Bud and an Oklahoma Bud is less than 1 percent,” Delaney said. A 3.2 beer by weight contains about 4 percent alcohol by volume, not much different from the 5 percent alcohol by volume in most national breweries’ drinks.

J.P. Richard, president of the Oklahoma Retail Liquor Association and owner of Cache Road Liquor in Lawton, said the high-point and low-point distinction is all but meaningless for common domestics.

“Beer is beer, quite frankly,” Richard said. “It’s all in that 3 ½ to 4 ½ percent range.”

Wine

Gene Clifton, general manager and owner of Canadian River Winery in Slaughterville, described Oklahoma’s wine business as growing. The Oklahoma Grape Growers and Wine Makers Association counts 35 wineries as members, according to its Web site.

“The wine industry in Oklahoma is a viable business,” Clifton said. “It’s a new industry, and I think it needs all the help it can get.”

Some of the most important areas in evolving wine laws are direct shipment from wineries to out-of-state consumers and purchase of wine on the Internet. Last June, a district judge directed legislators to address wine shipments during this session, writing that he would clarify the law if lawmakers didn’t, said state Rep. Al McAffrey (D-Oklahoma City). McAffrey introduced a bill this session that would make such shipments and orders legal.

Liquor

Laws governing liquor may be the most static and uncontroversial in Oklahoma’s pantheon of alcohol regulations.

Sales of hard liquor are restricted to licensed liquor stores and have been since 1959. Liquor may be sold from 10 a.m. to 9 p.m., Monday through Saturday, with the exception of a few major holidays. Stores that sell liquor may not sell anything else, according to the state constitution, and beverages sold at package liquor stores must be at room temperature.
Changing with the Times

Oklahoma’s beer and wine laws are controversial. A number of efforts, including a resolution in the Oklahoma House of Representatives and a petition circulated by a group called Oklahomans for Modern Laws, are under way to allow high-point beer and wine to be sold in grocery and convenience stores. The efforts face stiff opposition from liquor stores and bring up questions about how such a law would be implemented within Oklahoma’s framework of licensing requirements.

“Oklahoma’s really moving along, and it’s time to modernize our liquor laws,” said Brian Howe, spokesman for Oklahomans for Modern Laws.

Howe’s group believes new laws would improve Oklahoma’s image with young professionals, help expand the state’s wine industry’s market and possibly encourage economic development.

Kelly Conner, political science graduate student and research assistant with Oklahomans for Modern Laws, said the sale of wine and beer in grocery and convenience stores could create more state revenue in the form of additional alcohol taxes and licensing fees. Allowing grocery stores to get into the high-profit beer and wine market could help attract retailers like Whole Foods and Costco to Oklahoma, she said.

Conner said the change would also help Oklahoma’s wine industry. Clifton, the winery owner, said he supports OML’s petition.

“Any new market for us is good,” Clifton said. “We are limited to where we could sell, and that would open up new markets for us.”

Richard, however, said the changes would hurt local liquor stores by allowing big-box grocers like Wal-Mart to cut into their customer base. He disputes the idea that changing alcohol regulations would succeed in bringing large retailers into the state.

“There’s all this hoopla that Oklahomans for Modern Laws has made,” Richard said. “They promise that all these great food stores would come rushing into Oklahoma if they could just sell wine. That is the biggest bunch of poppycock.”

Richard said some major retailers avoid Oklahoma because the state’s demographics can’t support large, costly stores like Whole Foods outlets.

Additionally, Richard said the petition’s success would not necessarily mean winemakers would see new markets. He said major food retailers standardize the products that hit their shelves and make suppliers buy shelf space through a process called “slotting,” which is often too expensive for small businesses like local wineries.

“If these Oklahoma winemakers think that they can afford the slotting process, then more power to them,” he said. “They need specialty stores and creative retailers to provide an outlet for them.”

Richard said the initiative petition brings up other constitutional and statutory questions, such as how national grocery chains would meet the Oklahoma residency requirements for a liquor license.

Howe said his group’s proposal is straightforward and would leave knotty legal questions to the legislature. The petition proposes a constitutional amendment. If enough voters sign the petition to get it on the ballot and then vote it into effect, anyone licensed to sell 3.2 beverages would also be allowed to sell high-point beer and wine.

“Our petition only addresses that particular law. Anything that is in the constitution or the statutes that conflicts with it would be nullified,” he said.

McAffrey, who authored the resolution that mirrors OML’s petition, said lawmakers may add a provision allowing package liquor stores to sell items other than alcoholic beverages, which is currently prohibited, to the resolution to help shop owners offset losses to grocery and convenience store alcohol sales. That provision, like the other language in the resolution, would have to be approved in a statewide vote before it could take effect.

“We’re not trying to put any mom-and-pop business out of business,” he said.
Alcohol, Crime and Death

While alcohol is the basis for several thriving industries and is an enjoyable part of life for many, it has a dark side. Its connection to accidents and crime make it a unique product that must be carefully regulated.

The National Highway Traffic Safety Association reported that 16,885 Americans were killed in alcohol-related accidents in 2005, about 30 percent of that year’s total fatalities. A 1998 Justice Department study found that victims report nearly four in 10 violent crimes involve alcohol and about the same proportion of criminals reported using alcohol at the time of their offense.

Although Oklahoma’s rules about access to alcohol are closer to Kansas’s strict regulations – high-point beverages are restricted to liquor stores, which are open just three more hours each day than in Oklahoma – than to Texas’s more lax rules – liquor stores are open six hours a day more than in Oklahoma and high-point beer and wine are allowed in grocery and convenience stores – Oklahoma’s alcohol-related accident and crime statistics more closely resemble Texas’ than Kansas’.

In 2005, the Oklahoma Highway Safety office reported 149 alcohol-related traffic fatalities, or about 4.7 per 100,000 members of the population. That year, Kansas Department of Transportation reported 93 alcohol-related fatalities, or 3.4 per 100,000 members of the population. In 2001, the latest year from which figures are available, Texas reported 1,005 alcohol-related fatalities, or 4.7 per 100,000 members of the population, equal to Oklahoma.

The Oklahoma State Bureau of Investigation reported that arrests for alcohol-related crimes, including drunkenness, driving under the influence and violations of liquor laws, totaled 47,693 in 2004. That counted for 29 percent of total arrests. Texas, with 259,949 arrests on alcohol offenses in 2004, saw about 23 percent of total arrests come from those crimes. By contrast, in the same year, the Kansas Bureau of Investigations reported that 23,904 arrests, or 18 percent of the total, came from alcohol violations.

Alcohol also plays a part in other types of crimes, as the Justice Department report showed. While Oklahoma doesn’t keep statewide track of alcohol’s relationship with other crimes – Rodney Eaton of the OSBI said a system to do that is now in testing – certain curious facts do emerge from the state’s Uniform Crime Reports. For example, in 2004, 11 murders were listed as caused by brawls due to the influence of alcohol.

Opponents of the movement to allow high-point beer and wine in grocery and convenience stores say greater access might mean more abuse of alcohol. Richard said alcohol can be better controlled in a liquor store, which faces higher penalties than grocery or convenience stores for selling alcohol to minors.

“From a retailer’s point of view, if the legislature really wanted all alcohol to be controlled, we should be selling all of it through the liquor stores,” he said.

Howe said OML has met with the ABLE Commission about ways to prevent abuse of alcohol. He said studies he has seen, especially one conducted in Massachusetts by a group similar to OML when that state was considering expanding its liquor licensing, indicate that underage drinkers are unlikely to try to buy wine wherever it is sold and that they are more likely to try to buy alcohol at liquor stores anyway.

Conner said that while OML does not condone abuse of alcohol, modernizing the state’s alcohol laws would not exacerbate the underlying problems that cause alcohol abuse.

“If people are going to drink and drive, they’re going to drink and drive, no matter what,” she said.

http://hub.ou.edu/articles/images/1168359277/News/031407-Norman-Alcohol-story.jpg

http://hub.ou.edu/articles/images/1168359277/News/031407-Alcohol-By-State-sto.jpg

[rufnek05]

if they need signitures just stop outside of dale hall from about 10-3. get plenty of people to sign that sheet

[Stoop Dawg]

Richard said some major retailers avoid Oklahoma because the state’s demographics can’t support large, costly stores like Whole Foods outlets.

Additionally, Richard said the petition’s success would not necessarily mean winemakers would see new markets. He said major food retailers standardize the products that hit their shelves and make suppliers buy shelf space through a process called “slotting,” which is often too expensive for small businesses like local wineries.

“If these Oklahoma winemakers think that they can afford the slotting process, then more power to them,” he said. “They need specialty stores and creative retailers to provide an outlet for them.”


Well, I guess he doesn't oppose changing the law then. Since economics will prevent any "real" change from occuring anyway. Right?

[Pricetag]

There was a big story in the Tulsa World a few weeks back about the ABLE commission complaining about how they don't have jurisdiction over beer because it's classified as non-intoxicating. It sounded an awful lot like they wanted to expand their power there to cover it, but it seemed to me like a simple solution would be to get rid of the 3.2 beer along with its ridiculous classification, thus giving them jurisdiction over beer without expanding their power.

[GottaHavePride]

Wait, liquor stores have to sell stuff at room temperature?

I'd insulate the whole store, set the thermostat at 35 degrees and declare it "room temperature".

EDIT: and have a stand of coats for customers to borrow as they're shopping.

[OhU1]

"Royce Sharp is a beer connoisseur. His favorite beer, Full Sail Pale Ale, is made by an independent brewer in Hood River, Ore. But Sharp, film and video studies senior, can’t get his favorite drink in Oklahoma."

Can't get Full Sail Pale Ale in Oklahoma? Funny, I just had it last weekend. And, oh yeah, it's in just about every liquor store in the state. Mr. Sharp needs to look past the corner 7-11. But I agree it's a shame he can't find FSPA there.

[royalfan5]

If Nebraska can support a Whole Foods + Similar Stores, why the hell would Oklahoma not be able to? You guys should burn down Stillwater(except for Bob's house) if you don't get rational liquor laws.

[Mixer!]

:mad: :mad: :mad:

[Cam]

Seeing that our stats are similar to Texas', I'd say the current laws are doing a hell of a job. :rolleyes:

People are going to drink to excess, regardless of where they have to buy it from.