A question 'r two about door frames and door locks [Archive]

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Norm In Norman

10/22/2006, 10:29 PM

I had to replace the door knobs and deadbolts on my front and back doors today. Who would believe that both would break on the same day, but they did.

So anyway, I've got a couple of questions. First off, the OLD deadbolts used the same sort of strike plate as the handle (it sticks out), which to me is weird. The new strike plate is a rectangle and is supposed to be recessed into the door jamb by using a chisel. The problem is if I use the new strike plate, the wood is messed up on the inside from how they installed the old strikeplate and it's going to look like crap from the inside. See how in the picture below they chiseled out about a 1/4" in order to use the old crappy strike plate? The old strike plate was put on with two 1/2" screws, and the new one uses four 4" screws, so I'd really like to use the new one. Is there any easy way to fix this? The only two ways I can see to fix this is by replacing the whole board that runs up the door jamb or to cut out a section then replace that section with a short piece of wood. The last way might be sort of hard to get it to match smoothly. Or I could leave it and have a big gap there, butI don't want to.

Second off, I had a preconceived notion - mainly from watching DIY shows - that all doors have a frame around them made out of 2x6s (2x4s), like exhibit b below. See how there are 2 2x6s nailed together all around the frame of the door? Then I guess you put the door with it's frame in that, shim it level, then connect it to the other frame - right? Well, I get my back door done and that's how it is. I had to drill it out a little extra so the new bolt would lock all the way. The front door, on the other hand, is a different story. I look inside the deadbolt hole in the door jamb and I see insulation and sheetrock. There is only about an inch of wood there, which is probably just the wood that the prehung door was hooked to. Is there any way possible this could be up to code? I have a feeling it's not, and if so I might end up contacting the builder and ask him what they are going to do about it. I doubt I can make them do anything though - the house is almost 7 years old.

Anyway, gimme your opinions please.

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/249/deadbolt01td1.jpg

http://www.pacifier.com/~dhendrix/remodel_files/bathroom-door-frame.jpg

jk the sooner fan

10/22/2006, 10:33 PM

lock of the norm......

StoopTroup

10/22/2006, 10:39 PM

We'll need a picture of the keys to be able to help. :D

Norm In Norman

10/22/2006, 10:40 PM

The funny thing is both locks broke right when we were leaving for the game on Saturday. Boy, it made me happy.

StoopTroup

10/22/2006, 10:45 PM

You guys killed a pig on Saturday...

And we got a new dog on Sunday...

Coincidence?

olevetonahill

10/22/2006, 11:18 PM

What your prolly seeing is insulation shoved between the door jam and the cripple that was ruffed in on the framing , do not use dead bolts that do not use a key to lock inside as well as outside :eek:
break a glass reach in and open :eek:
Dead bolts are marginally better than safety chains , you can get em with a longer throw and set em deep into the jamb , buts that prolly to much info for
you ;)

Norm In Norman

10/23/2006, 01:23 AM

That was my back door. I figure if they break in back there they'll break the whole door out anyway, so I'm not too worried about not having a key on the inside. I don't have any wood in the door jamb to set the dead bolt farther. it's just an inch of wood and then insulation and gypsum. I may as well have a 6 inch dead bolt because there is no wood back there to stop it.

olevetonahill

10/23/2006, 02:23 AM

OU4LIFE

10/23/2006, 07:50 AM

do not use dead bolts that do not use a key to lock inside as well as outside

they make osme pretty sweet ones that the locking mechanism on the inside is removable and acts like a key, but looks like a normal deadbolt.

Norm, they also make some very cool clear glass liner stuff that turns your normal glass into safety glass. Makes it near indesructable. It will shatter, but you still can't get through it.

sanantoniosooner

10/23/2006, 08:03 AM

I had to replace the door knobs and deadbolts on my front and back doors today. Who would believe that both would break on the same day, but they did.

If they are kwikset I believe it. The newer kwiksets are better than the old junk, but not on par with schalge and a few other brand.

So anyway, I've got a couple of questions. First off, the OLD deadbolts used the same sort of strike plate as the handle (it sticks out), which to me is weird. The new strike plate is a rectangle and is supposed to be recessed into the door jamb by using a chisel. The problem is if I use the new strike plate, the wood is messed up on the inside from how they installed the old strikeplate and it's going to look like crap from the inside. See how in the picture below they chiseled out about a 1/4" in order to use the old crappy strike plate?

You can put the new plate in and use some filler on the edge. It might or might not hold up in the long run, but if you use a good quality product, the odds are that it will. Famowood or Dap-plastic wood are good products. Put some masking tape over areas you want to protect for a neat job. They offer these products in different colors, sometimes white is available, but you'll probably need to touch up paint either way.

The old strike plate was put on with two 1/2" screws, and the new one uses four 4" screws, so I'd really like to use the new one. Is there any easy way to fix this? The only two ways I can see to fix this is by replacing the whole board that runs up the door jamb or to cut out a section then replace that section with a short piece of wood. The last way might be sort of hard to get it to match smoothly. Or I could leave it and have a big gap there, butI don't want to.

[U]I'm not sure I see your problem. The 4" screws will go through the jamb and into the studs on the other side. You DO have 2 there. It could have a little space before it gets to them, but the 4" should reach.[U]
Anyway, gimme your opinions please.

.

Norm In Norman

10/23/2006, 09:24 AM

If they are kwikset I believe it. The newer kwiksets are better than the old junk, but not on par with schalge and a few other brand.
Well crap, I bought Kwickset "Maximum Security". FWIW, they seem about 50 times as sturdy as the old ones and they lock much smoother. With the old ones I was tightening up the screws all the time. With the new ones it feels like this won't be a problem. I don't think I got the best Kwicksets but didn't get the worst either. I don't know the difference but I didn't really want to spend more than the $50 per set that I spent. It just has to last me until I decide to sell.

You can put the new plate in and use some filler on the edge. It might or might not hold up in the long run, but if you use a good quality product, the odds are that it will. Famowood or Dap-plastic wood are good products. Put some masking tape over areas you want to protect for a neat job. They offer these products in different colors, sometimes white is available, but you'll probably need to touch up paint either way.
OK, so basically you are saying I need to bondo the gap there. I didn't realize there was such a product for wood. I'll look up the products you mentioned. That HAS to be easier than replacing the whole board.

I'm not sure I see your problem. The 4" screws will go through the jamb and into the studs on the other side. You DO have 2 there. It could have a little space before it gets to them, but the 4" should reach.
I'm a little bit confused by what you quoted, but are you saying that even though I can see insulation and sheetrock in the door jamb that somewhere back in there is an actual board to screw into? I guess I need to poke a screwdriver in there and test that theory. I'd feel a little more secure if that was the case.

Hatfield

10/23/2006, 09:55 AM

my opinion is you are lying to us and are attempting to "evict"

:)

skycat

10/23/2006, 10:10 AM

I just replaced my back door last week, and as it turns out, the height of the door knob and deadbolt are a little different than the old door which meant that both strike plates had to move. I did what SAS is telling you to do, and so far so good.

Of course it's only been a few days.

OUHOMER

10/23/2006, 05:15 PM

You can also go to Lowes or Home depote and buy some larger strike plates. my house is so old and has had so many differant locks, I bought some nice over size strike plates. they looked better and were alot stronger as well.

sanantoniosooner

10/23/2006, 05:15 PM

I'm a little bit confused by what you quoted, but are you saying that even though I can see insulation and sheetrock in the door jamb that somewhere back in there is an actual board to screw into? I guess I need to poke a screwdriver in there and test that theory. I'd feel a little more secure if that was the case.
If you are seeing sheetrock, then you are very close to the edge of the jamb. You should easily catch the wood on the two inner screws and the outer screws should catch wood if you ever so slightly angle them towards the center of the wall.

There is a household grade of bondo at Home Depot or Lowes that you can use exactly like the automotive type. For some reason the hardener is white instead of pink, so it's harder to mix it to a shade of pink that you like.

sanantoniosooner

10/23/2006, 05:16 PM

Vaevictis

10/23/2006, 06:15 PM

break a glass reach in and open :eek:

Most thieves don't even bother with this anymore. They just use a bump key. Locks really are only for polite people these days.

soonerboomer93

10/23/2006, 07:05 PM

Locks are just a deterent anyways, if they want in they'll get in.

sanantoniosooner

10/23/2006, 07:37 PM

Locks are just a deterent anyways, if they want in they'll get in.
well yeah, but the more noise they have to make getting in the better.