OU's band is so bad; Oklahoma States band is better

[oumartin]

that is all

[Jackal]

You may be right, but why is a poster with 11,000 posts.....double posting this?

[oumartin]

cuz it needs to be said

[GottaHavePride]

Upside: I like the new drum major. He's doing a pretty good job. And the tubas are prodding serious arse. Holy cow, those guys are loud.

[mdklatt]

cuz it needs to be said

The n00b is just jealous that he can't start a thread. :D

[mdklatt]

I really liked the "Mr Roboto" drill tonight. Lots of movement and interesting formations. The "precision" marching? Eh, not so precise. And boring. The diagonals looked awesome at first, but had gone to hell after just 5 yards. 22.5 inches people--it ain't that hard.

Of course everybody in the stands loved it. :rolleyes:

[GottaHavePride]

I really liked the "Mr Roboto" drill tonight. Lots of movement and interesting formations. The "precision" marching? Eh, not so precise. And boring. The diagonals looked awesome at first, but had gone to hell after just 5 yards. 22.5 inches people--it ain't that hard.

Of course everybody in the stands loved it. :rolleyes:

The big difference between the Pride marching like that and A&M marching like that? A&M marches 6 to 5 so they're moving faster.

[mdklatt]

The big difference between the Pride marching like that and A&M marching like that? A&M marches 6 to 5 so they're moving faster.

It's boring when they do it, too. ;)

[12]

There is NOTHING worse than an ethical carney.

[Jimminy Crimson]

There was a halftime show at the game tonight? :confused:

[12]

http://www.snapperheadzydeco.com/packet/images/022703zydeco-wayne.jpg

Actually, whenever I hear the Pokie band do their theme song, I smell cotton candy and have the sincere need to buy cotton candy.

http://www.beatcircus.net/images/HG_titlecard_medium.jpg

[Okla-homey]

I liked the Sousa stuff. So do most fans. IMHO, the Pride should play less Styx and more Sousa.

That's what real people (non-band geeks) wanna hear anyway. If the Prides' gameday repertoire consisted entirely of the various traditional Sooner tunes, marches by Sousa and a handful of movie themes...that would be plenty...and people would enjoy listening more.

[12]

Uh oh... here come the anti Aggie band folks...

[PrideTrombone]

I liked the Sousa stuff. So do most fans. IMHO, the Pride should play less Styx and more Sousa.

That's what real people (non-band geeks) wanna hear anyway. If the Prides' gameday repertoire consisted entirely of the various traditional Sooner tunes, marches by Sousa and a handful of movie themes...that would be plenty...and people would enjoy listening more.

Here's the problem with that. You'd have no people in the band.

I'm a trombone player AND a band director, and here's a little secret... I hate Sousa marches. If you went out and told the kids in the band that you were limiting the repertoire to Sousa and the occasional movie theme, people would quit. I know I would have.

[12]

So, it's more about what the band wants to play than what the people want to hear... that's cool.

[PrideTrombone]

So, it's more about what the band wants to play than what the people want to here... that's cool.

You have to try and balance it. Not that I think the show selection is all that great, but you have to do enough stuff that the students will enjoy playing that you don't lose people, and you also have to try and appeal to the crowd, who's going to be pretty diverse.

Now for high school, the answer to your statement is "yes." I'm going to select music that I think is most educationally effective for my band, and I hope you'll enjoy listening to it. But your wishes as an audience member will not factor into my programming.

In a big-time college setting, however, my opinion is that the crowd is now the overriding factor that you've got to deal with. The flipside to that is that a lot of the crowd may just want to see the Pride to a Texas A&M style Sousa march show, which would result in a drastic drop in numbers, because a lot of people really just don't like performing Sousa marches. This would then cause the people on this board to say "Why can't that Britt fella keep people in the band?" Like I said, I think the show selection could be better, but it's definitely a balancing act.

For me, I'd like to see the pop/rock selections get into this decade or the later 90s. Bands have been stuck on playing the same tunes from the 50s, 60s, and 70s since the 50s, 60s, and 70s. The movie tunes are fine as long as they're recognizable, and you've got to do something for the blue-hairs once in a while.

[oumartin]

so, cant the director find something that will make the band members wanna be in the band.. have some fun,, get the house rockin'
I mean c'mon. When i was a band geek all i wanted to do is play loud and have fun and keep the fans entertained and on their feet.....

[Okla-homey]

Here's the problem with that. You'd have no people in the band.

I'm a trombone player AND a band director, and here's a little secret... I hate Sousa marches. If you went out and told the kids in the band that you were limiting the repertoire to Sousa and the occasional movie theme, people would quit. I know I would have.

Let me get this straight, the band would rather play the stuff it digs but the fans find...to be kind, less than inspiring?

Seems to me that's kinda selfish. Aren't there other venues for them to play the stuff they like? If its not about the fans, then they could play the stuff they like somehwere else and it shouldn't matter if anyone listens and digs it or not.

Look, all I know is this: College marching bands evolved from military bands which in turn evolved to inspire courage and sacrifice on the battlefield.

Therefore, if the crowd (and even the team) aren't inspired by the band's performances, then maybe the band needs to take off the military-inspired uniforms and just play concerts. Otherwise, they are sorta making a mockery of what the people expect and are paying for.

When they played The Stars and Stripes Forever last night, people around me last night stopped what they were doing, payed attention and really enjoyed it.

[PrideTrombone]

so, cant the director find something that will make the band members wanna be in the band.. have some fun,, get the house rockin'
I mean c'mon. When i was a band geek all i wanted to do is play loud and have fun and keep the fans entertained and on their feet.....

Oh, there's definitely stuff out there that would fit the bill. I have to admit I would've liked Mr. Roboto just for the nostalgic 80s campy angle, but I don't know how it went over at the game yesterday. With my band, I've turned Crazy by Gnarls Barkley, the Numa song, and Mr. Brightside by The Killers into stand tunes, and reactions have been pretty positive all the way around. I had a custodian at our school tell me he liked the addition of Crazy the other day.

I think it's a matter of staying current and keeping with recognizable tunes, and then letting the volume happen. I do think the band is putting out more sound than last year, FWIW.

[OklahomaTuba]

Awe, no more Strike Up The Band? No doubt that was a band and crowd pleaser!

I still can't believe that was played at two home games.

[PrideTrombone]

Let me get this straight, the band would rather play the stuff it digs but the fans find...to be kind, less than inspiring?

Seems to me that's kinda selfish. Aren't there other venues for them to play the stuff they like? If its not about the fans, then they could play the stuff they like somehwere else and it shouldn't matter if anyone listens and digs it or not.

It may be selfish, but that's how I felt when I was in the Pride. The now-annual countermarch show was something we had to do because the crowd happens to like it. Most of the performers don't, from my experience. The Pride doesn't really perform at any venues other than the OU games, though. The time demand to be in Pride (4 days a week rehearsal, gamedays, and more Joe C/Boren **** gigs than you can imagine) is already high enough without trying to seek out other venues and then designing shows solely for those places as opposed to an OU game.


Look, all I know is this: College marching bands evolved from military bands which in turn evolved to inspire courage and sacrifice on the battlefield.

Therefore, if the crowd (and even the team) aren't inspired by the band's performances, then maybe the band needs to take off the military-inspired uniforms and just play concerts. Otherwise, they are sorta making a mockery of what the people expect and are paying for.

In most cases, you are right about the militaristic origins of marching bands. However, OU's band evolved from a pep band that was formed to play at football games.
http://bands.ou.edu/history/

Homey, you've got to admit in this case that your idea of what a marching band should be is VERY old-fashioned, and really hasn't been the case at anywhere except Texas A&M since about the 1960s or earlier. Not saying you don't have a right to that opinion, but you're railing against a general trend in marching band in general, not just at OU.


When they played The Stars and Stripes Forever last night, people around me last night stopped what they were doing, payed attention and really enjoyed it.

I don't doubt it.

[Okla-homey]

Homey, you've got to admit in this case that your idea of what a marching band should be is VERY old-fashioned, and really hasn't been the case at anywhere except Texas A&M since about the 1960s or earlier. Not saying you don't have a right to that opinion, but you're railing against a general trend in marching band in general, not just at OU.


Anachronistic preferences on my part? Maybe, but I still believe marching bands should play mostly marches.

Whether marching band directors choose to buck the traditional notion of why a marching band exists is their business, but as an observer and listener, it seemes rather paternalistic to take the position that the musicians know best.

Heck, even my boy Mozart understood his most commercially successful stuff would be the stuff people liked to hear. I know you understand that and I'm not implying you don't. I also acknowledge it must be tough to balance the stuff the fans like with the stuff the kids want to play.

Here's the thing. The band is a creature of the university. As such, it has an obligation to perform the stuff the people who finance said university want to hear. Members should join knowing up front they will be called upon to play stuff they may personally dislike to help ensure the folks paying the bills are happy.

That's not to say the band needs to send out questionnaires and accept requests or anything ridiculous like that, but audience/fan appeal should be the overriding factor in composing the playlist.

[hurricane'bone]

nevermind

[GottaHavePride]

Let me get this straight, the band would rather play the stuff it digs but the fans find...to be kind, less than inspiring?

**Preface: this somehow turned into a long one, but in no way should anyone take this as me being critical of the members of the band themselves. Heck, I think the band is light-years ahead of last year.**

I would say that, if done correctly, the stuff the band likes and the stuff the crowd likes should be the same thing. The trick is to pick stuff the band enjoys playing and then pull it off in such a way that the crowd says "hey, that was cool!" Even if they don't like that particular tune, you can do it so a listener can, if nothing else, appreciate the enthusiasm and energy with which the band is performing. I'll let you draw your own conclusions as to why the Pride is not quite as successful as it could be with this. ;)

Also, in the case of the Pride, you're dealing with a hugely diverse crowd, ranging from people that would listen to "I'm a Ford truck MAAAAN" on a 24/7 continuous loop to people that listen to Slipknot. So the idea with the Pride is to try to present a wide enough variety of shows over the course of the season that there's a little something for everybody out there.

that's the theory, anyway. In reality, aside from any other complaints I may have (which aren't actually all that many - I thought yesterday was a solid effort from the band) this band staff has shown two big flaws to me.

One: predictability. This could also fall under the heading "out of touch with the audience". They don't branch out into unusual types of music very often. For instance, the student section would hate it, but what would the rest of the crowd think of a Johnny Cash show right now in the wake of Walk The Line? It would get a HUGE response, I'm thinking. Missed opportunity by the directors. Another example: the older crowd members would hate it, but what would the response from the student section be if the Pride came out with a hip-hop show? Gnarls Barkley, Outkast, etc.? Heck, that's what 95% of the students listen to on a daily basis. Response would, again, be HUGE. Another missed opportunity. Instead we get, every year, regardless of what's popular, a latin jazz show, an 80s rock show, a 70s rock show, a movie themes show (usually obscure themes from movies no one really saw), a patriotic show, and so on.

Two: I don't think the directors trust the students. And there are a few big indicators of that to me. The big one: why is Mr. Britt on the field to start pre-game? There's a drum major for that. There was never a director in a black suit on the field when Clint Williams started pre-game; he made an entrance from the sideline and was clearly In Charge of pregame. when he stepped on the field, the crowd knew it was all about to start. Now, the drum major stands on the field, waiting for a director in a black suit to give him a green-light to go. Really, if you're going to castrate your drum major like that, just get rid of the position completely.

Another indicator: the increasingly detailed rules for the band about conduct. Again, with Gene Thrailkill you simply were told "in or out of uniform, you represent not just the Pride, but the University ad entire State of Oklahoma. Act that way." He trusted the band members not to do anything too idiotic, and when they screwed up, they were tossed out of the band. And the thing was - despite the lax rules, it worked. A couple of people would get tossed out over the years, and everyone else pretty much stayed in line. Now, every time someone does something that generates a complaint, the band gets a new rule to follow. And I'm pretty sure the band members are well ware of any and all loopholes and - here's the kicker - go OUT OF THEIR WAY to exploit those loopholes. Funny how that works - more rules leads to more effort to get around the rules. ;)

Oh, and the last one is sort of a two-parter: why is the band staff so large, and why are they ALL in black suits? I'm sure the band staff isn't really THAT much larger now than in previous years, but in the past a suit was the exception that made you notice "hey, Dr. Wakefield came to see the Pride" or "Hey look, that's David Boren down there!" The other staff members stayed low key and invisible until they were needed. Now there's a small army of guys in black suits down there that still don't do anything. And it's WAY more obvious when two or three guys in black suits are goofing off and punching each other in the arms than it would be if they were in a Pride polo shirt blending in with the crowd. I guess it's the difference between listening to the staff because they have proven they know what they're doing and are there for the same reasons as every member of that band, and listening to them because they're wearing a suit and have been Given Authority. A seemingly small difference, but a big one in the psychology of the band.


Dammit. Why do you people ask things that make me sit here writing dissertations on the subject when I should be out weedeating my lawn? ;)

[oumartin]

specially when nobody will read it ;)

[mdklatt]

Oh, and the last one is sort of a two-parter: why is the band staff so large, and why are they ALL in black suits?

Speaking of people in black suits, who were the two assistant conductors on either side of the drum major duing the show? They were totally not in sync.

[apusooner]

what i think is funny, is when you arrange a pop tune from recent years, most people either dont know or wont admit, that it's a song from the 50's 60's 70's etc that's been sampled. thats all hip hop is. sampled music from previous artists. alot of "new" songs that have been hits are covers from lesser known bands from decades ago.

[King Crimson]

all i can say is i read Mr. Roboto and didn't read anything else.

[PrideTrombone]

Here's the thing. The band is a creature of the university. As such, it has an obligation to perform the stuff the people who finance said university want to hear. Members should join knowing up front they will be called upon to play stuff they may personally dislike to help ensure the folks paying the bills are happy.

That's not to say the band needs to send out questionnaires and accept requests or anything ridiculous like that, but audience/fan appeal should be the overriding factor in composing the playlist.

I was trying to figure out how to respond to you and then I read GHP's post which basically made any point I would've made plus a few more. :)

I think we agree more on this issue than ether of us realizes, its just that you like Sousa and I don't. :)

[yermom]

it just seems like they choose stuff that is a bit too obscure at times, while that would be ok for a grad school project or something, the football audience isn't going to appreciate it

i'm not exactly a music scholar or huge movie buff, but i haven't heard of it, it's probably too obsure ;)

and i'm glad i haven't heard St. Elmo's Fire lately :)

Crazy Train is pretty cool too

[John Kochtoston]

Would bagpipes be out of line?

[proud gonzo]

i agree with GHP on all points.

And if Mr. Britt had decided to do a marching routine like they did with Stars and Stripes yesterday while I was in the band, I would have quit then and there. I'm not kidding.

[PrideTrombone]

i agree with GHP on all points.

And if Mr. Britt had decided to do a marching routine like they did with Stars and Stripes yesterday while I was in the band, I would have quit then and there. I'm not kidding.

Told you, Homey. ;)

[GottaHavePride]

My reaction to that kind of drill would have been ok, but let's really do it right. Let's not just do an about-face and have lines moving in alternating directions. This stuff is easy if you maintain the correct stride length. Let's do some hard **** and show everyone that anything A&M can do we can do better. We just CHOOSE not to do it every week.

[proud gonzo]

yeah, i don't mind marching in straight lines if you make it really precise and kick *** with the fundamentals. If it was really really sharp i'd be impressed. But the way they did it yesterday was just lame, IMO.

[Scott D]

it just seems like they choose stuff that is a bit too obscure at times, while that would be ok for a grad school project or something, the football audience isn't going to appreciate it

i'm not exactly a music scholar or huge movie buff, but i haven't heard of it, it's probably too obsure ;)

and i'm glad i haven't heard St. Elmo's Fire lately :)

Crazy Train is pretty cool too

good going, now you can expect that show next home game.

[Okla-homey]

i agree with GHP on all points.

And if Mr. Britt had decided to do a marching routine like they did with Stars and Stripes yesterday while I was in the band, I would have quit then and there. I'm not kidding.

But you quit anyway so you obviously were not terribly committed to the notion of being a Pride member to start with.;)

[proud gonzo]

But you quit anyway so you obviously were not terribly committed to the notion of being a Pride member to start with.;) On the contrary, I feel so strongly about The Pride and what it stands for (or stood for) I felt I would be betraying that if I continued my association with the band or in any way endorsed the current band administration.

[oumartin]

i think its an age thing myself.
I love military music and marching. though not difficult it gets me absolutely fired up. and in fact brings a tear to my eye
kids these days

[proud gonzo]

like I said, I don't have a problem with military music, etc. if it is done very well. But as a horn player, i despise playing marches. I wouldn't have been willing to spend 8 hours of rehearsal a week plus gamedays playing nothing but offbeats.

[oumartin]

yeah but you are a bit offbeat yourself so it fits ;)

[Okla-homey]

On the contrary, I feel so strongly about The Pride and what it stands for (or stood for) I felt I would be betraying that if I continued my association with the band or in any way endorsed the current band administration.

riiiiiiiiiiiight.;)

[proud gonzo]

:P

[frankensooner]

As a former french horn player, Sousa blows. He sure as heck didn't write for french horn players pah pah pah pah pah pah pah blah. To this day a Sousa march makes we want to gouge out my eyeballs.

[Okla-homey]

As a former french horn player, Sousa blows. He sure as heck didn't write for french horn players pah pah pah pah pah pah pah blah. To this day a Sousa march makes we want to gouge out my eyeballs.

But he got the Sousaphone named for him which makes him more remembered than all the black suit-wearing band directors in the US (alive or dead.);)

[Scott D]

there is a band director?

[mdklatt]

As a former french horn player, Sousa blows.

Oh yeah? French horn players are the ones that blow.



Get it? Get it? :O