hypothetical work question (ethical dilemma)

[fadada1]

let's say, for instance, you had a "business supervisor" that wasn't you direct boss. this person still had influence over you working there or not, but not total control and not the final decision.

and let's say this person is running a business that is customer service oriented.

and let's say this person is a bit of a professional when it comes to spirits and the like.

and let's say that your direct boss and you have had MULTIPLE convcersations about this "business supervisor" as his level of professionalism sucks *ss, his spirit intake influences his memory for just about anything relating to the job, has taken more days off in the summer (this customer service job involves a certain outdoor activity) to go fishing, and is basically running a gold mine into the ground financially. additionally, other positions have been filled, and re-filled, and re-filled, and re-filled because of complete chaos and lack of organization in this one department.

here's my question: at what point (and to whom) do you say, "i've had it" and say something directly to that person??? take into account that you enjoy your current job and want to stay because you see the potential in where you are and the future you could have. BUT, you are tired of explaining to people coming in to see this supervisor, that "i'm sorry he's not here to honor your meeting with him. i'd like to tell you that this is an isolated incident, but it's not. in fact, we're suprised when he does show up for a meeting. this is not the type of image we want to promote, and i appologize." AND you've heard your boss say the exact same thing to other people.

would you document all these instances to build a case against the person, and to back your story? remember, you care about the success of the facility, but realize that is is losing revenue, respect, and potential customers because of this individual.

sorry about the length.

just curious is any of you have similar experiences.

[usmc-sooner]

well just how big an ole boy is this guy?

[fadada1]

well just how big an ole boy is this guy?
heh.

let's just say i could take him. besides, he wouldn't be able to hit me anyway... i'm sure he sees double most of the day.

[usmc-sooner]

why doesn't his boss say anything? Or is he like the owner's son?

[Sooner_Bob]

So who in fact is this dudes direct supervisor? Why hasn't your supervisor gone to his?

Since it sounds like you're not a supervisor it might be better if it was handled supervisor to supervisor.

Now I'm not saying you shouldn't provide your info to your guy, but I'm not sure getting too involved would be good at the moment.

So nobody else does this dudes job or picks up for his slacking?

[OU4LIFE]

I'd build the case privately, then when your boss decides to make the play, you can back it with your evidence.

[fadada1]

why doesn't his boss say anything? Or is he like the owner's son?
he and his boss are known for there ability to deflect blame off of each other long enough for the big owner to forget about (or never receive the information). this is not a good combination for success or change.

some of the problem is that the big boss is getting out and selling this particular facility, therefore, doesn't care.

now, there are some plans for a buyout, which will change things dramatically. not with my position, but the facility as a whole.

[fadada1]

So who in fact is this dudes direct supervisor? Why hasn't your supervisor gone to his?

Since it sounds like you're not a supervisor it might be better if it was handled supervisor to supervisor.

Now I'm not saying you shouldn't provide your info to your guy, but I'm not sure getting too involved would be good at the moment.

So nobody else does this dudes job or picks up for his slacking?
it's kind of a difficult situation to explain. my boss came from a place with sound ownership/leadership. he knows what to do, but is having difficulty finding the support from above to make a change. it's very frustrating.

see other reply.

[Sooner_Bob]

Sounds like a rought spot to be in . . . I would think if you had documentation to support your case they couldn't deflect too much without looking really bad.

Good luck.

[Sooner in Tampa]

it's kind of a difficult situation to explain. my boss came from a place with sound ownership/leadership. he knows what to do, but is having difficulty finding the support from above to make a change. it's very frustrating.
This sounds like a rock and a hard place. If there is not help from the higher ups, you are kind of stuck.

You could to urge your boss to talk to this person one on one.

Or you could just hire to Pat to take care of him. :P


:pop: :pop: :pop: :pop: :pop: :pop: :pop: :pop:

[I_SMELL_FEAR]

I worked in almost the exact same situation, except there was no buyout looming. The owner knew what was going on, but when my boss DID show up for work he was the best at what he did. But it kept getting more and more out of hand and the owner eventually fired him....but it got REALLY bad before anything was done...it took a couple of big accounts to leave before anything happened.

I agree with documenting stuff privately. Then if there is a buyout or a move made, you can at least provide information to save peoples jobs, not just your own....because if it goes down like normal, they will look for other people to take the fall.

[OUHOMER]

Just make sure you don’t look like the bad guy when you present it to the new owners, make sure your on good footing. Also don't present it a mean spirited attitude. Don’t let them think you have an axe to grind or a disgruntled employee. Make sure you present FACTS you can back up. Hearsay is not good unless it’s from a client that will back it up. I have seen this blow up in a guys face because of the way he presented it.

[BoogercountySooner]

Don't want to be a Butt Smooch huh?:D

[Mjcpr]

I'd work on my short game and down a couple cold ones.

[OUinFLA]

I'd work on my short game and down a couple cold ones.

I thought all your games were short?
:D

[VeeJay]

When you reference "spirits," is this guy a heavy drinker?

If that's the case, ya gotta cut him some slack.

I could invite him to Drunkytown one night, and you can rip him a new one...anonymously.

[Cam]

would you document all these instances to build a case against the person, and to back your story? remember, you care about the success of the facility, but realize that is is losing revenue, respect, and potential customers because of this individual.
Document like a mofo. It may not seem like it, buy you'll be covering your *** in the process.

[Vaevictis]

Gold mine, but mismanaged? Sounds like it's time to go to work for yourself ;)

[Okla-homey]

Just write "Go F--- yourself San Diego" on his teleprompter...

[Rogue]

I'm not a big fan of "building a case" against someone. I know a few coworkers who keep files on other coworkers. I'll never trust them. They may be very honest and all, but it smacks of them feeling like they need some blackmail material or to cover their own butts for something they have already done or plan to do. Basically this is a management problem and, unless you are management, I would stay away and do your job. For what it's worth.

[Rogue]

Unless your company has an EAP program. Sounds like dood could use a referral.

[Vaevictis]

One thing to remember -- the nail that sticks up gets hammered down. Unless you're really willing to go to bat and put yourself in the line of fire, you probably want to drop it.

In that case, about the best thing you can do is document that you've made management aware of your objections, and document that you've fullfilled your responsibilities. That way, if something ever does go down, and they start looking to smack people who SHOULD have said something, well, you have it documented that you did say something but no action was taken.

If you still want to do something, even at the risk of making yourself a target, your only choice is to politic. If the business is organized such that the boss has complete authority, you probably don't want to do this. But, if the boss has to answer to someone (like say, a Board of Directors), you could build a case and go to them.

Or, as I said earlier, it sounds like it may be a good time to go into business for yourself.

[sooner_born_1960]

You work at a golf course, right?

[fadada1]

there is a buyout in the works, and it's from (how shall i say it) the "customers". and believe me, the "customers" know what is going on. unfortunately, my position means i hear everything. and i mean EVERYTHING!!! i get questions about every other department except my own, because we actually run efficiently and professionally. if this particular buyout offer goes through, there will be some MAJOR changes... just not in my position.

i've documented some of the things that have gone on, just in case something does come up. meaning, i'm covering my butt in case someone else has a problem with me. believe me, the worst thing i've done pales in comparison to some of the things i've seen. i might get a bad look in another company, where some of these other folks would be shown the door immediately.

if i had $10 million, i'd buy the place - HAPPILY!!!!!

[fadada1]

You work at a golf course, right?
yep, private club.

[Mjcpr]

yep, private club.

Does any of this have to do with Hootie Johnson?

[sooner_born_1960]

Does the guy in question happen to be a greenskeeper named Carl?

[fadada1]

Does any of this have to do with Hootie Johnson?
i wish!!! because we all know where i'd be working.

[fadada1]

http://img50.imageshack.us/img50/1822/carlot4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[sooner_born_1960]

It's high time we got Judge Smails to look into the situation. This cannot be tolerated at Bushwood.

[fadada1]

"are you my pal... danny?"