Airport security at its finest

[nanimonai]

Ok, so we're confiscating liquids from people because they may be explosive and unstable,then mixing them all together in the damned trash can right there in the line!
http://i.a.cnn.net/cnn/interactive/us/0608/gallery.terror.travel/03.ap.jpg

Brilliant!

[jk the sooner fan]

i dont see the electronic devices there to set them off, nor the other liquid that had to be mixed in mid flight

[GottaHavePride]

My question is this: how many terrorist attempts have been stopped because of TSA screening procedures? I'm willing to bet it's a big fat zero, or else it would have been all over the news in a "See? It actually works!" press conference from the White House. All the foiled terrorist plots are either being foiled in other countries before they get here or are being foiled by some sort of intelligence agency.

Now, I'm not trying to say that we don't need security protocols in our airports. I just think idiotic knee-jerk reactions like this are counter-productive, and we'd be better off spending our time to increase intelligence-based efforts to find terrorists before hey even get to the airport.

[StoopTroup]

I can't believe they haven't done this sooner.

The public should get used to it IMO.

There's way to many people in the World that wouldn't blink an eye, killing you or anyone in your family.

The explosion proof cargo containers like Israel has, are also a good idea.

[jk the sooner fan]

intelligence is what supports what the TSA does,

i think alot of people forget what TSA represents

they are a VISIBLE BARRIER

its like a military installation - they have road blocks, etc set up at the gate...but truly if the jihadists want to get an explosive laden 18 wheeler and drive thru the gate.....they can do it

nothing is impenetrable....the TSA is there for a reason and they serve the purpose they are there for, very well i might add

the intelligence community is what feeds information to them ....it comes down in a raw form via message traffic and some head honcho at the TSA says "confiscate ANY liquid"

spend more on intel before they get there? THEY STOPPED THEM...the system worked for crying out loud........you've got to confirm your suspicions before you make an arrest......the british intelligence and police have been watching these folks as closely as can be for weeks, they had every move in sight, every conversation recorded, every purchase noted....

ok, personally i dont want the TSA folks having any discretion whatsoever during a time like this (high alert)....."oh she looks like a sweet old lady, she can carry on hers"

the rules are made for every single traveler, not just those that look or act a certain way

tell you what, how bout we totally get rid of the TSA.....that make you feel better? or better yet.....suggest a better idea/solution

love to hear it

[mrowl]

i dont see the electronic devices there to set them off, nor the other liquid that had to be mixed in mid flight

but his arguement doesn't work when you say this! :D

[jk the sooner fan]

i just dont get all the TSA bashing...sure they're an easy target for jokes, they **** us off.....but truly, they're trying to protect every one of us when we fly or are at the airport

TSA is MUCH more than just the baggage screeners, its an organization that goes way beyond that

[StoopTroup]

love to hear it
Xray people too.

[mrowl]

i just dont get all the TSA bashing...sure they're an easy target for jokes, they **** us off.....but truly, they're trying to protect every one of us when we fly or are at the airport

TSA is MUCH more than just the baggage screeners, its an organization that goes way beyond that

and they have improved the wait times by huge amounts in the airports I frequent. good jorb.

[nanimonai]

It just seems kind of silly to just carelessly toss everyone's liquid into a trash can right there if you honeslty think there's a chance some could be explosive.

They're basically just screaming "this is just for show!"

[jk the sooner fan]

It just seems kind of silly to just carelessly toss everyone's liquid into a trash can right there if you honeslty think there's a chance some could be explosive.

They're basically just screaming "this is just for show!"

no, they're basically just screaming "hey haji, find another way, because we're on to the one you were about to use"

look, they know that 99.9 % of everything they had thrown away today was perfectly safe........but whats the alternative?

can we say for sure that there isnt a US based cell waiting to use the same tactic?

they see this on the news and "well crap, that wont work, back to the drawing board"

[Newbomb Turk]

people will bitch when they are inconvenienced...if it's for their own good or not.

[nanimonai]

I'm not saying they should not be confiscating people's liquids and whatnot. I just found their disposal methods to be humorous.

[Harry Beanbag]

It just seems kind of silly to just carelessly toss everyone's liquid into a trash can right there if you honeslty think there's a chance some could be explosive.

They're basically just screaming "this is just for show!"


They should carefully place every tube of toothpaste and Preparation H in individual 3 foot thick lead boxes then truck each one of them to an isolated area and detonate them. That's the only safe way.

[StoopTroup]

Did you ever think they might be actually watching the people who actually throw out their stuff without making a big deal about it?

They are profiling everyone.

I can't believe we don't have face recognition systems in place too after hearing that the terrorists had flight manifests with passenger names.

These guys are trying everything they can do to mess with us.

If the kill us. They are Kings.

If they cost us money or upset our lives...they win.

I'm getting concerned about the potential number of wackos already in the US. The Brits may have been on to these guys but these folks were living in Britain.

[Harry Beanbag]

I'm getting concerned about the potential number of wackos already in the US. The Brits may have been on to these guys but these folks were living in Britain.


That's why I'm still so incredulous at the total lack of attention to border security. Makes me nervous sitting here a couple of hours from a wide open Mexican border. Who knows how many are already in this country, but I envision a day when 100 McDonald's blow up across the country at the same moment.

[Okla-homey]

Did you ever think they might be actually watching the people who actually throw out their stuff without making a big deal about it?

They are profiling everyone.

I can't believe we don't have face recognition systems in place too after hearing that the terrorists had flight manifests with passenger names.

These guys are trying everything they can do to mess with us.

If the kill us. They are Kings.

If they cost us money or upset our lives...they win.

I'm getting concerned about the potential number of wackos already in the US. The Brits may have been on to these guys but these folks were living in Britain.

There is another more efficient way: No Muslims are allowed to fly on US carriers or in domestic airspace

Unfortunately, I don't think the boys over at the ACLU would take too kindly to that.;)

[Sooner_Bob]

I'm so glad it'll be a while before I have to fly again . . .

[nanimonai]

It's the Canadian border you really have to worry about. An Islamic,Middle Eastern guy would stick out like a sore thumb in Mexico. Canada on the other hand welcomes anyone who wants to come in with unquestioning, open arms.
There are rural places on the US/Canada border with NO checkpoints.
You just drive right on across.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

That's why I'm still so incredulous at the total lack of attention to border security. Makes me nervous sitting here a couple of hours from a wide open Mexican border. Who knows how many are already in this country, but I envision a day when 100 McDonald's blow up across the country at the same moment.

A McSplosion if you will ;)

[12]

You know, that isn't an entirely bad idea. I've often thought a "Smoker's Air" or "Big and Tall Air" might be a money maker.

"Jihad Air"

I like it.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Boy you could make some bank if you opened a "Non-Islamic" Airlines...Hell I wouldn't fly with anyone else :P

[Harry Beanbag]

You know, that isn't an entirely bad idea. I've often thought a "Smoker's Air" or "Big and Tall Air" might be a money maker.

"Jihad Air"

I like it.


I think the costs of buying new planes after every flight may outweigh the benefit. :)

[Sooner Eclipse]

Did you ever think they might be actually watching the people who actually throw out their stuff without making a big deal about it?

They are profiling everyone.

I can't believe we don't have face recognition systems in place too after hearing that the terrorists had flight manifests with passenger names.

These guys are trying everything they can do to mess with us.

If the kill us. They are Kings.

If they cost us money or upset our lives...they win.

I'm getting concerned about the potential number of wackos already in the US. The Brits may have been on to these guys but these folks were living in Britain.

I think you give our TSA far too much credit. Some of these people are lucky to get to work with two shoes that are the same color.:eek:

[12]

Non-Islam Airlines
Keep your shoes on.

[Harry Beanbag]

An Islamic,Middle Eastern guy would stick out like a sore thumb in Mexico.


Um, not really.

[nanimonai]

Um, not really.

There's not exactly a huge Muslim population in Mexico like there is in Canada.
I would even bet that it's tougher for someone from the Mid East to get a tourist visa to Mexico than it is to get a residence visa in Canada.
How many Muslims speak fluent Spanish rather than English or French?

At this point we know of zero terrorists plots thawrted at the Mexican border and about 5 major ones form the Canadian border.

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

The thing is...Islamic guy takes off Turban...doesn't he semi-resemble a Mexican...i think is the implied point ;)

[Harry Beanbag]

There's not exactly a huge Muslim population in Mexico like there is in Canada.
I would even bet that it's tougher for someone from the Mid East to get a tourist visa to Mexico than it is to get a residence visa in Canada.


They're not going to be wrapped in sheets with towels around their heads dude. They'll blend in, black hair and medium brown skin.

[nanimonai]

They're not going to be wrapped in sheets with towels around their heads dude. They'll blend in, black hair and medium brown skin.

And speaking Arabic?

[Harry Beanbag]

And speaking Arabic?


To who? It's not like all these people running around the desert out here came across at Border Patrol stations you know.

Anyway, I'd be willing to bet the guys they send over here to do jobs are at least somewhat capable of speaking English. That doesn't even take into account the sleepers who have been living here for years already that have blended into our culture so as not to raise suspicions.

[nanimonai]

To who? It's not like all these people running around the desert out here came across at Border Patrol stations you know.

Anyway, I'd be willing to bet the guys they send over here to do jobs are at least somewhat capable of speaking English. That doesn't even take into account the sleepers who have been living here for years already that have blended into our culture so as not to raise suspicions.

Yes, they are capable of speaking English or French but typically not Spanish. That's why it makes more sense to come across the Canadian border and that is exactly what we have seen so far.

It's the same reason why I wouldn't make a very good spy over in Russia. I don't speak a lick of Russian and have no clue about their culture. I couldn't accompish a damn thing covertly over there even though I'm white and physically could resemble a Russian.

[Cam]

tell you what, how bout we totally get rid of the TSA.....that make you feel better? or better yet.....suggest a better idea/solution

love to hear it
Step number 1: TSA needs to be consistent from airport to airport. Until they can figure out how to do that, they're not going to have much credability IMO.

[PhilTLL]

They're not going to be wrapped in sheets with towels around their heads dude. They'll blend in, black hair and medium brown skin.

This logic might make sense to you, but I'd be willing to bet that actual Mexicans could tell the pretender in their midst. It's like saying a brown-haired Scot could pass in Moscow...they're both white.

No, the people they'd use would be Spanish Muslims.

[Okla-homey]

I still think the no Muslims allowed aboard US flagged carriers is the way to go.;)

[jk the sooner fan]

Step number 1: TSA needs to be consistent from airport to airport. Until they can figure out how to do that, they're not going to have much credability IMO.


if the intelligence at every airport was the same, then i'd agree with you

but its not, so i dont

[Rusher]

TSA got intelligence? Hm....

[proud gonzo]

medicines and baby formula are still allowed on planes.... could it be THAT hard to get a prescription for something? :confused:

[mdklatt]

could it be THAT hard to get a prescription for something? :confused:


Forget getting a prescription--how hard is it to print up a fake label? They don't have a choice but to let people carry their prescriptions with them.

[Cam]

if the intelligence at every airport was the same, then i'd agree with you

but its not, so i dont
What we as customers see are the people they put in front of us and the processes they use. Based upon both of those, they're a joke. If they're truly serious, they need to be consistent with their messaging and procedures.

It shouldn't matter if I'm flying out of BWI, Sioux Falls, San Jose, the procedures should be the same.

Perception is reality. The perception of TSA is not good.

[jk the sooner fan]

well - just my opinion but i think thats a really unfair perception

explain to me why they suck? explain to me how they arent doing their job (part of which is a visible deterrant)

if its just because they routinely inconvenience you, then thats a lousy excuse

again - simply my own opinion - for the purpose they serve, they do a good job......do they make mistakes? sure .....but dont we all.....

i doubt TSA cares about perception.....just results

[soonercody]

I don't know. I keep hearing that there's lots of neato stuff going on behind the scenes that the gen pub doesn't see. Sounds like so much fluff to me. That said, I don't have a better solution being that I'm not a security professional and all.

[Chuck Bao]

I DO NOT WANT TO SIT NEXT TO A MUSLIM ON A PLANE.

MUTHER FOCKER MUSLIMS ON A PLANE.

I'm sorry that may sound harsh and biased and like I'm a bigot.

In June, I was boarding a flight back to the US and there was this group of men, clean shaven, but speaking a language that I assumed was Arabic. During boarding, they spent most of the time arguing very loudly about who sits where and where to put their shared carry-on luggage which was three very suspicious-looking small hard-cased cosmetic cases.

I was about to leave the plane and call security.

That is until three very beautiful girls arrived, who I could tell spoke Spanish. The guys, apparently were Spanish as well and they were just arguing where the girls were going to sit and where to store their cosmetic cases.

[jk the sooner fan]

its not "fluff"

if every single TSA operation at every single airport ran exactly the same way, 100% of the time.......it would make things alot more simple for a terrorist cell to observe and find a weakness to exploit

however, if things are mixed up and changed on a regular basis, then its more difficult

[Kimberlyz4OU]

To who? It's not like all these people running around the desert out here came across at Border Patrol stations you know.

Anyway, I'd be willing to bet the guys they send over here to do jobs are at least somewhat capable of speaking English. That doesn't even take into account the sleepers who have been living here for years already that have blended into our culture so as not to raise suspicions.

Kind of like the ones who have bought up the a good majority of the quickie mart, hotel chains and cell phone supply kiosk thingies at the mall.

[etouffee]

So um, for those promoting the "no muslims on the plane" concept... how exactly do you propose to identify "Muslims"? Islam is a religion, not a race. So maybe what you really mean is "no brown people on the plane"?Oh, but wait... there are lots of African Muslims and Asian Muslims, too. Better switch that to "no non-whites on teh plane", eh?

[12]

Did you know there are more "dark-skinned" Anglicans than white? You can't judge a gum by its wrapper.

[Cam]

well - just my opinion but i think thats a really unfair perception

explain to me why they suck? explain to me how they arent doing their job (part of which is a visible deterrant)

if its just because they routinely inconvenience you, then thats a lousy excuse

again - simply my own opinion - for the purpose they serve, they do a good job......do they make mistakes? sure .....but dont we all.....

i doubt TSA cares about perception.....just results
First and foremost, feel free to find the word inconvenience in any of my posts concerning TSA. You can't.

You also can't argue against the point of inconsistency, or at least you haven't yet. Their inconsistencies from airport to airport cause confusion with travelers.

Maybe if they cared about their perception, they'd have a better one and would get less complaints. When the largest part of your company is customer facing, it's usually a good idea to hire those that can deal with customers. Too many of TSA's employees don't know how to do that.

[Frozen Sooner]

intelligence is what supports what the TSA does,

i think alot of people forget what TSA represents

they are a VISIBLE BARRIER

its like a military installation - they have road blocks, etc set up at the gate...but truly if the jihadists want to get an explosive laden 18 wheeler and drive thru the gate.....they can do it

nothing is impenetrable....the TSA is there for a reason and they serve the purpose they are there for, very well i might add

the intelligence community is what feeds information to them ....it comes down in a raw form via message traffic and some head honcho at the TSA says "confiscate ANY liquid"

spend more on intel before they get there? THEY STOPPED THEM...the system worked for crying out loud........you've got to confirm your suspicions before you make an arrest......the british intelligence and police have been watching these folks as closely as can be for weeks, they had every move in sight, every conversation recorded, every purchase noted....

ok, personally i dont want the TSA folks having any discretion whatsoever during a time like this (high alert)....."oh she looks like a sweet old lady, she can carry on hers"

the rules are made for every single traveler, not just those that look or act a certain way

tell you what, how bout we totally get rid of the TSA.....that make you feel better? or better yet.....suggest a better idea/solution

love to hear it

This post gets the Frozen Sooner seal of approval. Especially the part about the sweet old lady. Islamic terrorists have a history of figuring out what counter-terror forces are profiling for and getting around it. Israelis used to never search women at checkpoints-the terrorists figured that one out pretty quickly and started finding women suicide bombers. Even if we start profiling only those of Arabic descent, there's still plenty of white or black looking Muslims out there that they can start using.

I'm actually down with EVERYONE getting searched before getting on a plance as well.

[Frozen Sooner]

There is another more efficient way: No Muslims are allowed to fly on US carriers or in domestic airspace

Unfortunately, I don't think the boys over at the ACLU would take too kindly to that.;)

So, how's the invention of the "what religion someone is" detector going?

Or are you proposing forced registration of everyone's religion? What procedures would you have if someone converts or lapses?

Seriously, Homey, this is a really silly idea from a really smart guy.

[OCUDad]

I assumed Homey was joking.

[jk the sooner fan]

First and foremost, feel free to find the word inconvenience in any of my posts concerning TSA. You can't.

You also can't argue against the point of inconsistency, or at least you haven't yet. Their inconsistencies from airport to airport cause confusion with travelers.

Maybe if they cared about their perception, they'd have a better one and would get less complaints. When the largest part of your company is customer facing, it's usually a good idea to hire those that can deal with customers. Too many of TSA's employees don't know how to do that.

ok, so i made an assumption on the inconvenience part, so i'm still scratching my head as to EXACTLY what it is that bothers you about TSA

newsflash - they are NOT a customer service organization - they arent paid to be friendly - thats a bonus if you get a screener who is.......personally i'd rather have a staff of people who are paying more attention to the bags than your feelings as you go thru the line - no offense, but thats just me

what complaints are you aware of that are stacking up and causing problems?
i'd be willing to bet that a large majority of the complaints stem from inconvenience....i could be wrong but you'd have to show me

[jk the sooner fan]

You also can't argue against the point of inconsistency, or at least you haven't yet. Their inconsistencies from airport to airport cause confusion with travelers.



i'd be happy to argue against it if you'd tell me exactly what inconsistencies we're talking about.....and what travelers are confused about?

my guess is that the common traveler has got it figured out pretty well....hell here at DFW, one of the nations busiest and biggest airports, the day AFTER the crack down on liquids, the lines were back to the normal lengths and waits werent any longer than they had been 2 days prior.......that speaks volumes to me, because it took us months to get used to it right after 9/11.....

[Okla-homey]

I assumed Homey was joking.

yeah, he missed the "winky"

I guess we could make all Muslims in America sew little yellow crescents on their clothes...:eek:

[Chuck Bao]

And I wasn't joking.

I'm all for religion and stuff. But, I've found that reading porno on a plane gets my mind off a bumpy ride and onto other things.

Surely, they can't bane good magazines and such.

While I'm on the subject, why does DFW airport magazine selection suck so much?

[mrowl]

would anyone else really care if they banned all carry-on luggage?

it would make loading and unloading the plane 30 minutes faster.

You could just take a small backpack, purse, etc...

[SicEmBaylor]

TSA is just doing their damned jobs. What that job entails is up to policy makers, but don't blame the screeners at the airport.

We ouhgt to be profiling based on race and name.

[jk the sooner fan]

would anyone else really care if they banned all carry-on luggage?

it would make loading and unloading the plane 30 minutes faster.

You could just take a small backpack, purse, etc...

i agree, if i'm checking a bag and have to visit the luggage carousel anyway, why mess with dragging a bag on the plane, its much easier (for me) to walk on empty handed

[Ike]

i'd be happy to argue against it if you'd tell me exactly what inconsistencies we're talking about.....and what travelers are confused about?

my guess is that the common traveler has got it figured out pretty well....hell here at DFW, one of the nations busiest and biggest airports, the day AFTER the crack down on liquids, the lines were back to the normal lengths and waits werent any longer than they had been 2 days prior.......that speaks volumes to me, because it took us months to get used to it right after 9/11.....

as far as inconsistencies go...at some airports you have to put your shoes through the xray machine. at others you don't. At some airports you have to take your laptop out of its bag and send both laptop and bag through the machine seperately (I think this is because the airports that do this have rather ****ty xray machines). Once at O'hare, several months ago, I even had to put my half empty Dr. Pepper on the xray machine, even though the guard saw me take a swig of it 5 seconds before he ordered me to put it on there. At other airports, I've always been able to just walk through the metal detector with a coke or water or whatever....until now of course, but I haven't yet flown since this new ban.

Im somewhat interested to see how this new ban on liquids sits with the stewardesses when my wife and I fly, since she likes to drink a lot of water all the time. even more so now that shes pregnant. I have a feeling the stewardesses are going to get sick of her pushing the call button every 5 minutes for water.

[jk the sooner fan]

ok, so people would complain about having to take their shoes off at one airport but not another?

its pretty simple - just follow their directions...no matter what airport you're in!!

look - the TSA is not trying to stop you and I from getting on the plane with anything we want to carry on (within reason).......they're trying to stop that ONE PERSON who wants to cause harm

as a wise old commander told me once "the terrorists only have to get it right once....those fighting it have to get it right every time"

since 9/11 i've yet to see any hijackings from american airports, or any other problems -........results, thats all that counts in my book.....i could care less whether they smile at me or say hello...i can get that at the mcdonalds counter down in the terminal

there's a reason they do things different at different airports, i've stated it once in this thread already

[OCUDad]

We ouhgt to be profiling based on race and name.How about we profile based on criminal records of second cousins, too? Check everyone. It's either colossally naive (or the product of a Baylor "education") to think terrorists can't, or haven't, enlisted help from sympathizers of all ethnic persuasions.

I have a foreign-sounding name, and I don't mind being hassled in the security line. But it chaps my hide to think you might be the guy in line behind me and get a pass because of your name or your freckles. I've got less of a criminal record than you do, for chrissakes.

[Frozen Sooner]

^^

Yep.

[Stoop Dawg]

Look for fewer travellers, higher ticket prices, and more airline bankruptcies.

And the TSA is completely reactionary. One guy hides a bomb in his shoe - all passengers must take off their shoes. One group hides a bomb in their sports drink - no more sports drinks.

It appears to me that the terrorists are much smarter than the TSA.

[royalfan5]

It has to be pretty hard to stay ahead of terrorist R&D though. They almost have to react soley to intelligence on the subject, because you don't know what methods are going to be used. You can gameplan against it all you want, but unless you have a real gauge on the talent the terrorists have for new delievery methods you have be reactionary. Also, can we start getting some high-speed trains in this country, sure they still can be blown sky high, but you can't fly them into buildings and what not.

[walkoffsooner]

No laptops is next. To easy to put something inside hit a key boom.

[Ike]

No laptops is next. To easy to put something inside hit a key boom.


and soon after that, no clothes either...


trust me, thats not going to be nearly as fun as it sounds....





So since Air travel just got a lot less fun, I think its time for me to start workin on that flying car I've been waiting so long for....I think its time.

[jk the sooner fan]

you should see what a laptop looks like under x-ray......that big battery is all you see, next to a bunch of wires....to the untrained eye, its a little worrisome!

[Okieflyer]

Just face it. The terrorist have already won a huge battle. They have us overreacting to everything thing. Here's the latest...

British airliner turned back over security scare (http://today.reuters.com/news/articlenews.aspx?type=domesticNews&storyid=2006-08-14T044548Z_01_L1481520_RTRUKOC_0_US-SECURITY-BRITAIN.xml&src=rss&rpc=22)

[soonerjoker]

should be, no carry on allowed.

[TexasLidig8r]

This thread epitomizes why this little website neighborhood makes such eclectic, enjoyable reading...

From lucid, logical posts... to blatant racism... to annoyance... to wheels off, out there suggestions.. to sarcasm and attempted sarcasm...

This thread in a microcosm... is the South Oval.

[BeetDigger]

I don't mind if they search everyone and I don't mind if they get rid of all carry-ons too (although all means ALL). My only request is that they design the system around these rules: make the search area more convenient for taking off and putting on your shoes and jackets, etc; make the baggage check, handling and pickup more efficient so that we don't have to wait 30 minutes for our bags.

But as soon as they make an exception for a carry on bag, everyone will try to expand that exception and try to say that the rules are for the OTHER guy. I love the guys who go on with a wheeled carry-on but complain about the other people who go on with wheeled carry-ons, complaining that they should have to check those bags.

[SCOUT]

Look for fewer travellers, higher ticket prices, and more airline bankruptcies.

And the TSA is completely reactionary. One guy hides a bomb in his shoe - all passengers must take off their shoes. One group hides a bomb in their sports drink - no more sports drinks.

It appears to me that the terrorists are much smarter than the TSA.

If you know what the TSA should be looking for in the future, please feel free to share that information.

[homerSimpsonsBrain]

This post gets the Frozen Sooner seal of approval. Especially the part about the sweet old lady. Islamic terrorists have a history of figuring out what counter-terror forces are profiling for and getting around it. .....
I'm actually down with EVERYONE getting searched before getting on a plance as well.

The BBC reported that one of the women arrested in London was planning on taking their new born child on the targeted flight so as to give a more normal appearance. Thats why they banned baby formula in particular.

[mdklatt]

If you know what the TSA should be looking for in the future, please feel free to share that information.

Ingredients for cyanide gas in prescription bottles.

[picasso]

Look for fewer travellers, higher ticket prices, and more airline bankruptcies.

And the TSA is completely reactionary. One guy hides a bomb in his shoe - all passengers must take off their shoes. One group hides a bomb in their sports drink - no more sports drinks.

It appears to me that the terrorists are much smarter than the TSA.
I'm flying Thursday and I flew less than two months after 9/11. we had to do many of these pre-flight things anyway.

[jk the sooner fan]

if the terrorist were all that smarter than the TSA (which is simply an extension of the homeland security folks), we'd have a few planes blown up since 9/11

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

For some reason I get searched whenever I mention I am carrying on my pet goldfish Anthrax!!!

[Stoop Dawg]

If you know what the TSA should be looking for in the future, please feel free to share that information.

Give me a bajillion dollar budget and I'll get right on it.

[Stoop Dawg]

if the terrorist were all that smarter than the TSA (which is simply an extension of the homeland security folks), we'd have a few planes blown up since 9/11

That's a good point. Since the TSA was able to catch all of these security risks prior to disallowing pretty much all carry-on items (i.e. no downed planes), why the change?

[jk the sooner fan]

actually it all speaks volumes for the stupidity of the terrorist...that they're still trying to make statements and instill fear via the airlines and airports

can you imagine how crazy things would get if we started living in the same kind of times that the israelis live in?

some jihadist blowing himself up in a crowded food court at the local shopping mall

there are so many other ways for them to go, but they're deadset on using the airplane

[jk the sooner fan]

That's a good point. Since the TSA was able to catch all of these security risks prior to disallowing pretty much all carry-on items (i.e. no downed planes), why the change?

well, like i said earlier....the folks at the airport are as much a visible deterrant as anything else

its a barrier that make the bad guys stop and think "hmmm, ok we need to try something else"

[1stTimeCaller]

Back to the original post. I do think it weird to let all of the contents pour out and mix together if they have reason to believe that there might be volatile chemicals in there.

Or maybe they really don't think there are chemicals in there and that's why they don't care if they get mixed up together in the trash can.

[Stoop Dawg]

well, like i said earlier....the folks at the airport are as much a visible deterrant as anything else

its a barrier that make the bad guys stop and think "hmmm, ok we need to try something else"

Don't get me wrong, I'm on board with security. But if it was "effective enough" a month ago, why the changes now?

[jk the sooner fan]

they werent precluding boarding with liquids a month ago were they?

[Stoop Dawg]

Give me a bajillion dollar budget and I'll get right on it.

Incidentally, there was guy from the 9/11 commission on TV Sunday morning who made a great point. It's been 5 years since 9/11 and there has been essentially NO progress on development of bomb-detecting equipment. Why?

[jk the sooner fan]

note to homeland security - hire more scientists......

[Stoop Dawg]

word

[mdklatt]

Or maybe they really don't think there are chemicals in there and that's why they don't care if they get mixed up together in the trash can.

I vote for this answer. Most of the "security" rules we see put hastily into effect after a threat or attack are to give a warm fuzzy feeling to people who would otherwise be screaming "why aren't we doing anything!?"

[Stoop Dawg]

word

[Sooner_Bob]

So you can't even take a drink of any kind on board? Even if it's purchase once you're past security?

[mdklatt]

they werent precluding boarding with liquids a month ago were they?

The MO of the 1995 "Bojinka" plot was the same as this latest one. Before the Phillippine police nabbed Ramzi Yousef he successfully carried out a proof-of-concept attack on a Phillippine Airlines (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philippine_Airlines_Flight_434) flight. The small bomb killed one passenger. Yousef used a watch as a detonator and a contact lens case to hold the liquid explosive.

[Ike]

note to homeland security - hire more scientists......


Note to homeland security - I'm graduating soon....

[OCUDad]

Note to homeland security - I'm graduating soon....Note to Homeland Security: if you hire Ike, be sure to make security exceptions for any pregnant wives he may have traveling with him. :D

[Scott D]

I envision a day when 100 McDonald's blow up across the country at the same moment.

would that REALLY be a bad thing? ;)

[Harry Beanbag]

can you imagine how crazy things would get if we started living in the same kind of times that the israelis live in?

some jihadist blowing himself up in a crowded food court at the local shopping mall


I'm torn on this issue. This approach would be by far the simplest form of terror to carry out over here, and part of me wonders why they haven't done it. But another part of me thinks if they started blowing up Sbarros' and Chick-fil-A's, the infighting in this country would end and so would several Middle Eastern countries. So they're not that stupid.

[Harry Beanbag]

would that REALLY be a bad thing? ;)


As long as they leave In-n-Out alone. ;)

[jk the sooner fan]

I'm torn on this issue. This approach would be by far the simplest form of terror to carry out over here, and part of me wonders why they haven't done it. But another part of me thinks if they started blowing up Sbarros' and Chick-fil-A's, the infighting in this country would end and so would several Middle Eastern countries. So they're not that stupid.

i think secretly they enjoy living here.....i think, while they'd never admit it, that this is as close to the 72 virgins they'll ever find

the dudes that flew the planes on 9/11 all went to strip clubs, etc and lived it up the nites leading up to that day....

they'll jack up their own god forsaken land, but they know better than to turn things topsy turvy here, at least on that level

[jk the sooner fan]

they did their job today (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,209042,00.html)

[mdklatt]

they did their job today (http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,209042,00.html)


Are they not allowed to be more specific than "a West Viriginia airport"?



At least one flight was diverted to Charleston's Yeager Airport, about 60 miles away.


Well, that narrows it down. There can't be too many WV airports within 60 miles of Charleston that have airline service. Stupid news writers.

[Harry Beanbag]

Yes, they are capable of speaking English or French but typically not Spanish. That's why it makes more sense to come across the Canadian border and that is exactly what we have seen so far.

It's the same reason why I wouldn't make a very good spy over in Russia. I don't speak a lick of Russian and have no clue about their culture. I couldn't accompish a damn thing covertly over there even though I'm white and physically could resemble a Russian.


This logic might make sense to you, but I'd be willing to bet that actual Mexicans could tell the pretender in their midst. It's like saying a brown-haired Scot could pass in Moscow...they're both white.

No, the people they'd use would be Spanish Muslims.



http://www.cnsnews.com/ViewSpecialReports.asp?Page=/SpecialReports/archive/200608/SPE20060821a.html


Texas Sheriffs Say Terrorists Entering US from Mexico
By Kevin Mooney
CNSNews.com Staff Writer
August 21, 2006

(CNSNews.com) - The chief law enforcement officers of several Texas counties along the southern U.S. border warn that Arabic-speaking individuals are learning Spanish and integrating into Mexican culture before paying smugglers to sneak them into the United States. The Texas Sheriffs' Border Coalition believes those individuals are likely terrorists and that drug cartels and some members of the Mexican military are helping them get across the border.