View Full Version : Aren't these lovely people?
Geekboy
8/10/2006, 06:14 PM
http://www.truthnet.org/islam/Islamic-Justice/index.htm
mdklatt
8/10/2006, 06:20 PM
We knowingly engage in activities that we know will result in the loss of innocent life, so are we any better?
We knowingly engage in activities that we know will result in the loss of innocent life, so are we any better?
Give me a ****ing break. Apples and oranges...
if you can't do the time, don't do the crime.
mdklatt
8/10/2006, 06:23 PM
Give me a ****ing break. Apples and oranges...
I agree. One kid losing an arm is better than an errant bomb falling on a hospital, or a wrongly-convicted person getting executed.
I agree. One kid losing an arm is better than an errant bomb falling on a hospital, or a wrongly-convicted person getting executed.
Yes, it is better, but they have nothing to do with each other in the point he was trying to make.
BlackShirtBeast
8/10/2006, 06:52 PM
WTF!! thats messed up.
BlackShirtBeast
8/10/2006, 06:55 PM
if you can't do the time, don't do the crime.
Gotta be kiddin me right:confused:
StoopTroup
8/10/2006, 06:57 PM
if you can't do the time, don't do the crime.
Heh...
http://198.170.120.117/rblake_n.gif
Gotta be kiddin me right:confused:
do Muslim countries have to deal with over crowding prisons?
what works for one doesn't always work for the other.
I agree. One kid losing an arm is better than an errant bomb falling on a hospital, or a wrongly-convicted person getting executed.
So, should Hezbollah be able to bomb Israeli civilians at will, then fall back and hide behind Lebanese civilians and get away with it? And please name one person who was wrongly executed using the current death penalty system-not looking for Jim Crow era lynchings, etc.
nanimonai
8/10/2006, 07:05 PM
It's extremely confusing why the neoliberals have taken up the cause of fundamentalist Islam.
StoopTroup
8/10/2006, 07:07 PM
How do you know that child was hurt?
Maybe it was their idea of Islam's Funniest Home Videos.
Gandalf_The_Grey
8/10/2006, 07:25 PM
There is basically two types of Non-Islamic people in my opinion. Those that think all Islamic people should die(Ann Coulter). And those that think all Islamic people should be watched very closely. ;)
mdklatt
8/10/2006, 07:46 PM
Yes, it is better, but they have nothing to do with each other in the point he was trying to make.
They've got everything to do with each other. First of all, there's about a 10% chance those photos aren't fake, but let's assume that they're real. If Al Jazeera had shown pictures of the body of that same kid being carried by his screaming mother out of a smoking building hit by a missile from a Predator, the reaction would be at best a shrug and at worst a "good riddance". For the record, my reaction would fall somewhere in that range depending on my mood. Given the big doings in London today it would be pretty close to "good riddance".
As far as crime and punishment goes, if that kid had been stealing bread from a New Orleans grocery story post-Katrina some of the same people crying crocodile tears for him now would have advocated that he be shot by the National Guard.
Geekboy
8/10/2006, 07:54 PM
As far as crime and punishment goes, if that kid had been stealing bread from a New Orleans grocery story post-Katrina some of the same people crying crocodile tears for him now would have advocated that he be shot by the National Guard.
That's the oddest piece of supposed logic I've heard in a long time.
I don't think I could advocate anybody being shot for stealing food and for trying to eat and survive.
Crashing into a store to steal televisions and stereo is another thing.
mdklatt
8/10/2006, 07:58 PM
So, should Hezbollah be able to bomb Israeli civilians at will, then fall back and hide behind Lebanese civilians and get away with it?
Israel should be able to kill Lebanese civillians all day long in the interest of protecting Israeli civillians. That's what being a nation state is all about. They'd better not try to claim moral superiority, though. I'm pretty sure that God doesn't distinguish between little Yakob getting blown up on the way to temple and little Habib getting blown up on the way to mosque.
I have zero problem with our military being sent to kill people before they kill me, even if it means innocent people get killed by mistake. But I don't live in Pub Fantasyland, so I don't have to delude myself into thinking that we're doing God's work or something. I'm pretty sure God doesn't pump his fist every time we call in a fire mission on some Ay-rab village. In fact, he's probably looking down at all this and shaking his head at what a bunch of focktards the human race is and considering which specied is going to take the reins next.
Dolphins would certainly benefit by a world in which all the ice had melted due to global warming. ;)
And please name one person who was wrongly executed using the current death penalty system-not looking for Jim Crow era lynchings, etc.
Off the top of my head I can't, but I'm certain if it hasn't happened already it will at some point. I wholeheartedly support the death penalty...as long as we're 110% sure we've got the right person. There are many, many death penalty convictions which aren't so cut and dried. There was a story on 60 Minutes or something a few years ago about a man on death row in Texas. He was convicted before the age of DNA evidence, but examination of crime scene evidence showed that his DNA was nowhere to be found. He was not eligible for an appeal because there were no procedural errors during his conviction. The arresting sheriff countered that just because his DNA wasn't on the evidence doesn't mean he wasn't there. He had a point, but are we as a society willing to take that chance with somebody's life? I would hope not.
Geekboy
8/10/2006, 08:05 PM
In fact, he's probably looking down at all this and shaking his head at what a bunch of focktards the human race is and considering which specied is going to take the reins next.
Now this logic I'm on board with!!!
mdklatt
8/10/2006, 08:06 PM
I don't think I could advocate anybody being shot for stealing food and for trying to eat and survive.
At the very least there were people taking a "shoot first, ask questions later" attitude.
sooneron
8/10/2006, 08:09 PM
I wonder what they would have done with Bomar!
Geekboy
8/10/2006, 08:10 PM
I wonder what they would have done with Bomar!
Shot him first. Asked questions later.
whatsername
8/10/2006, 08:14 PM
Snopes.com (http://www.snopes.com/photos/gruesome/crushboy.asp)
Gandalf_The_Grey
8/10/2006, 08:18 PM
Snopwnd!!!!
They've got everything to do with each other. First of all, there's about a 10% chance those photos aren't fake, but let's assume that they're real. If Al Jazeera had shown pictures of the body of that same kid being carried by his screaming mother out of a smoking building hit by a missile from a Predator, the reaction would be at best a shrug and at worst a "good riddance". For the record, my reaction would fall somewhere in that range depending on my mood. Given the big doings in London today it would be pretty close to "good riddance".
As far as crime and punishment goes, if that kid had been stealing bread from a New Orleans grocery story post-Katrina some of the same people crying crocodile tears for him now would have advocated that he be shot by the National Guard.
When I saw this thread and those pictures, I thought, "It looks fake, but I wouldn't doubt it."
You on the other hand connected dots, jumped to conclusions, and basically saw it as an opportunity to rant on (self-righteously, I might add) about how we are no better than them, blah blah blah.
Stop pouncing every time you see something remotely related to what you want to talk about.
Geekboy
8/10/2006, 08:19 PM
Snopes.com (http://www.snopes.com/photos/gruesome/crushboy.asp)
I hope this is true! However the last picture isn't very convincing since we can't see his left arm and he does look somewhat distressed.
But I'm going to hope and pray it was just a stunt and this didn't really happen.
If they wanted to crush his arm, they probably wouldn't have rested it on a large towel.
David Blaine BS.
Gandalf_The_Grey
8/10/2006, 08:31 PM
If they wanted to crush his arm, they probably wouldn't have rested it on a large towel.
David Blaine BS.
You think Islamic Fundamentalist are bad? Wait until some Blainetologist open up a can of jihad on your ***!!!
Geekboy
8/10/2006, 08:38 PM
If they wanted to crush his arm, they probably wouldn't have rested it on a large towel.
David Blaine BS.
Here was my possible twisted logic on the towel. I thought his arm against the concrete would have resulted in it being totally mangled therefore requiring amputation.
http://i80.photobucket.com/albums/j200/zebthethird/eddie-crush-1.jpg
Rusher
8/10/2006, 09:10 PM
That sucks for the kid.
But on the other hand, our criminal justice is a little too easy in comparison. Maybe our crime could be reduced by 90% if every guilty criminal lose a hand or two instead of paying $1000 bail. That should make everybody think twice before committing any stupid act.
nanimonai
8/10/2006, 09:20 PM
That sucks for the kid.
But on the other hand, our criminal justice is a little too easy in comparison. Maybe our crime could be reduced by 90% if every guilty criminal lose a hand or two instead of paying $1000 bail. That should make everybody think twice before committing any stupid act.
Nazi Germany had an extremely low crime rate as did the Soviet Union, Cambodia under Pol Pot, etc. etc.
Maybe you'd feel right at home?
mdklatt
8/10/2006, 09:25 PM
You on the other hand connected dots, jumped to conclusions, and basically saw it as an opportunity to rant on (self-righteously, I might add) about how we are no better than them, blah blah blah.
Stop pouncing every time you see something remotely related to what you want to talk about.
His arm will be crushed and will lose its use permanently.
A religion of peace and love, they say?
How can anyone believe them
when they commit such
inhuman acts?
How did I ever think this thread might take that direction. It's crazy. It's not like we have threads like that every day on here. I am such a fool. Nobody EVAR "pounces" on threads like I do. I am a scourge of the South Oval and must be stopped. Oh the humanity. Won't someone please take away my internet access before I pounce again. It should have been my fingers under the wheels of that truck. Darn me. Darn me all to heck.
Rusher
8/11/2006, 02:33 AM
Nazi Germany had an extremely low crime rate as did the Soviet Union, Cambodia under Pol Pot, etc. etc.
Maybe you'd feel right at home?
I actually feel less safe walking outside at night than encountering terrorist's act, cuz the chances of me getting robbed and killed by some gangstas is much higher than bumping across a suicide bomber. Especially when those mofos carry around concealled weapons and touring around the neighboorhood with their homies. I walked out 3 blocks from my hotel in NYC couple of months ago and I thought I was gonna die by some "friendly fires" by some random dudes.
Maybe educating these focktards that they're gonna lose a limb or two for messing around with the law will make they'll think twice of what they're doing.
Killerbees
8/11/2006, 02:48 AM
Yes these photos werent accurate but its common knowledge that countries that are ruled by sharia law use barbaric methods of punishment like cutting off body parts, genital mutilation, rape, stoning and etc.
mdklatt, if you cant understand the difference between using force for defense and using force to commit genocide then you are beyond any help but Gods.
mdklatt
8/11/2006, 09:28 AM
mdklatt, if you cant understand the difference between using force for defense and using force to commit genocide then you are beyond any help but Gods.
No matter what precautions we take, innocent people are going to get killed in Iraq. It's inevitable. If you support the Iraq war as part of the GWOT, you're implicitly willing to exchange Iraqi lives for American lives. And there's nothing at all wrong with that. That's the way it works. Just don't try to claim that we have moral superiority when we're acting in our own self interests just like everybody else.
handcrafted
8/11/2006, 09:40 AM
No matter what precautions we take, innocent people are going to get killed in Iraq. It's inevitable. If you support the Iraq war as part of the GWOT, you're implicitly willing to exchange Iraqi lives for American lives. And there's nothing at all wrong with that. That's the way it works. Just don't try to claim that we have moral superiority when we're acting in our own self interests just like everybody else.
MD = SO Drama Queen :D
We would not be able to claim moral superiority if we were attacking civilians on purpose just to be killing civilians.
However, in the case of the GWOT, when the jihadis hide behind civilians, place their war materiel in residential neighborhoods, and don't wear uniforms or fight according to the rules of war (both written and unwritten), then the moral blame for the civilian deaths falls squarely on the jihadis. They blow up civilian transport and restaurants, hotels, etc. They fight among the civilian population on purpose. Now tell me, which side doesn't give a rip how many civilians die as long as their political cause is furthered?
mdklatt
8/11/2006, 09:55 AM
However, in the case of the GWOT, when the jihadis hide behind civilians, place their war materiel in residential neighborhoods, and don't wear uniforms or fight according to the rules of war (both written and unwritten), then the moral blame for the civilian deaths falls squarely on the jihadis.
Not all civillian deaths are due to this. It is inevitable that people will die in Iraq solely because somebody ****ed up--not many, but it happens. If we say it's okay for troops to be there (and I do), then we are agreeing that some "collateral damage" is acceptable in the grand scheme of things.
Okieflyer
8/11/2006, 09:57 AM
Comments: The preceding images are apparently authentic -- they were published as such in 2005 on the Iranian news Web site Peyke Iran, at any rate -- but the accompanying caption doesn't jibe with the original report and was clearly fabricated after the fact.
According to a Peyke Iran spokesperson who corrected the record last November in a note posted on Little Green Footballs, the young boy whose arm was run over was not being punished for a crime. He was part of a "Maareke giry" or street magic act and allegedly performed the stunt for money (note the gentleman speaking into a microphone in image #1). The seventh and eighth pictures in the series, which appear to show the child shaken but otherwise unharmed after the ordeal, were omitted from the email flier but can still be viewed on Peykeiran.com (where all the images are attributed to photographer Siamak Yari).
http://urbanlegends.about.com/library/bl_caught_stealing_bread3.htm
I found some info on these pictures.
Which brings us to the really important part:
Why aren't there any "There's a rabbi, a priest and an imam" jokes?????
mdklatt
8/11/2006, 10:25 AM
Which brings us to the really important part:
Why aren't there any "There's a rabbi, a priest and an imam" jokes?????
Let's get that rolling.
A rabbi and and an imam walk into a barbecue pork joint....
Israel should be able to kill Lebanese civillians all day long in the interest of protecting Israeli civillians. That's what being a nation state is all about. They'd better not try to claim moral superiority, though. I'm pretty sure that God doesn't distinguish between little Yakob getting blown up on the way to temple and little Habib getting blown up on the way to mosque.
I have zero problem with our military being sent to kill people before they kill me, even if it means innocent people get killed by mistake. But I don't live in Pub Fantasyland, so I don't have to delude myself into thinking that we're doing God's work or something. I'm pretty sure God doesn't pump his fist every time we call in a fire mission on some Ay-rab village. In fact, he's probably looking down at all this and shaking his head at what a bunch of focktards the human race is and considering which specied is going to take the reins next.
Dolphins would certainly benefit by a world in which all the ice had melted due to global warming. ;)
Off the top of my head I can't, but I'm certain if it hasn't happened already it will at some point. I wholeheartedly support the death penalty...as long as we're 110% sure we've got the right person. There are many, many death penalty convictions which aren't so cut and dried. There was a story on 60 Minutes or something a few years ago about a man on death row in Texas. He was convicted before the age of DNA evidence, but examination of crime scene evidence showed that his DNA was nowhere to be found. He was not eligible for an appeal because there were no procedural errors during his conviction. The arresting sheriff countered that just because his DNA wasn't on the evidence doesn't mean he wasn't there. He had a point, but are we as a society willing to take that chance with somebody's life? I would hope not.
Fair enough, although it seems to me the only ones claiming moral superiority are those who are condemning Israel.
Okieflyer
8/11/2006, 10:41 AM
I agree with both of you on this.
And I'm a "Right-wing religious extremist".;)
mdklatt
8/11/2006, 10:42 AM
Fair enough, although it seems to me the only ones claiming moral superiority are those who are condemning Israel.
Well, they're wrong. Killin' is killin'. Both sides could have stopped that nonsense already. Hezbollah threw the first punch, Israel escalated it, Hezbollah retaliated, yadda, yadda, yadda.
Like I said before, God just shaking his head at all of us.
Okieflyer
8/11/2006, 10:46 AM
Well, they're wrong. Killin' is killin'. Both sides could have stopped that nonsense already. Hezbollah threw the first punch, Israel escalated it, Hezbollah retaliated, yadda, yadda, yadda.
Like I said before, God just shaking his head at all of us.
But I will say that if Israel is trying to get as many of them (Hezbollah) out as possible, then it's got to get a lot worse before it gets better.
Let's get that rolling.
A rabbi and and an imam walk into a barbecue pork joint....
Unfortunately, they all have the same punchline: "...so the imam left and sent a young boy strapped with explosives on a suicide mission to kill the other two." :(
mdklatt
8/11/2006, 10:50 AM
But I will say that if Israel is trying to get as many of them (Hezbollah) out as possible, then it's got to get a lot worse before it gets better.
But they're digging a bigger hole around themselves with every civillian death in Lebanon. Rather than turning the Lebanese people against Hezbollah, won't this have he opposite effect? Hezbollah is the only force in Lebanon capable of striking back. It's a no-win situation for Israel.
Okieflyer
8/11/2006, 10:55 AM
But they're digging a bigger hole around themselves with every civillian death in Lebanon. Rather than turning the Lebanese people against Hezbollah, won't this have he opposite effect? Hezbollah is the only force in Lebanon capable of striking back. It's a no-win situation for Israel.
I agree, but they look at it like "is it better to make the Lebanese people angry at you, or try to destroy Hezbollah". Tough choice I guess.
mdklatt
8/11/2006, 11:04 AM
I agree, but they look at it like "is it better to make the Lebanese people angry at you, or try to destroy Hezbollah". Tough choice I guess.
Not just make them angry, but angry enough to increase the power base of Hezbollah in Lebanon. It's bad enough when you've got terrorist groups on your border, but it gets worse when they start taking over countries--through diplomatic elections, no less.
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