Airplane peeps, a question about the F22 Raptor

[BudSooner]

Perhaps i'm mistaking this aircraft for another, or read this someplace incorrectly.
But isn't the Raptor capable of verticle takeoff and landings??
I was checking out the photos of the plane on this site below and noticed those devices just outboard of the aft landing gear..mounted on the wings underneath. Are those what make the jet take off like a Harrier??
Pics 1/2/3 clearly show them but in each the landmarks change, so it's difficult to tell if he's taking off normally.
http://www.richard-seaman.com/Aircraft/AirShows/Edwards2005/F22/index.html

And some zany photos of Air France landings and takeoffs-
http://www.aviationpics.de/appr/app.htm

[GottaHavePride]

I think those are just the panels that close over the landing gear. To get vertical takeoff you'd need some kind of big vents like on the Harrier.

[Newbomb Turk]

I watched something about the Harrier on The History Channel awhile back. I think they mentioned that the F22 can do short distance takeoffs, but not vertical like the Harrier.

[GottaHavePride]

Well, it probably helps that the F-22 is small, and has crazy powerful jets.

[soonerjoker]

where does the Lockheed f-35 fit in.

lightning 2 ??

[GottaHavePride]

From what I recall (and googled) the F-35 is more conventional-technology fighter, just an upgrade over most of what we're using, and it's being internationally developed - several nations are in on that fighter. The F-22 is stealth technology and US-exclusive. We have to make sure we're one step ahead of what we sell to everyone else... ;)

[afs]

No. The F-22A is not capable of vertical take-off and landings. You're thinking of the Marine / Navy variant of the F-35 Lightening II.

I think in the pictures you're seeing one of the doors that goes over the wheel housing. Just a weird angle.

[NYSooner1355]

The Raptor isn't capable of VTOL but the Osprey (you know - the marine killer) is VTOL and now the Air Force is running an x-plane for the CSAR (Combat Search and Rescue) units - so the Air Force may be getting a version of the Osprey for their inventory

[Okla-homey]

F-22 is capable of relatively short take-offs and landings (STOL) because it is so powerful. The thing that is really cool about it IMHO (besides from its low observable characteristics) is it has vectored thrust which make it as maneuverable as is possible given the limitations of the human flying it to endure the G's.

[slickdawg]

The thing I like about it is that it will ensure US air supremacy for the next 30
years or more.

[reevie]

The Raptor isn't capable of VTOL but the Osprey (you know - the marine killer) is VTOL and now the Air Force is running an x-plane for the CSAR (Combat Search and Rescue) units - so the Air Force may be getting a version of the Osprey for their inventory

Yes, the Air Force is getting Ospreys.

[Okla-homey]

Yes, the Air Force is getting Ospreys.

Those things have an awful lot of moving parts. Too many for my taste.

[walkoffsooner]

Not in the jump jet class.

[Jerk]

I really think they should have put congressmen inside the Osprey during the testing phase, as opposed to Marines.

[BudSooner]

Ah, it was the F35 that I saw.
It was a camera shot from the front, and the two look very similar from that angle.
Both amazing aircraft.

[IronSooner]

Bud, those devices you noted by the aft landing gear are stability fins. Lots of planes have them, the F-14's are painted red in this photo.

As already noted, the F-22 can't take do VTOL, just STOL. It does have thrust vectoring so the engine exhaust can be directed to enhance maneuverability.

The F-35 JSF will have VTOl. It has a turbofan in the middle that can cut on, as well as directed thrust similar to the Harrier. Additionally, about half of the engine can swivel down to direct exhaust downward, so you get both a midship fan and an aft engine pointed down. You can't see the midship fan in the photo below, but you can see the doors that open up just behind the cockpit to allow air into it from above.

F-14:
http://www.spitcrazy.com/F-14%20sundowners-98037.jpg

F-35 JSF:
http://www.4wings.com/des/image/F-35.jpg

[BudSooner]

Bud, those devices you noted by the aft landing gear are stability fins. Lots of planes have them, the F-14's are painted red in this photo.

As already noted, the F-22 can't take do VTOL, just STOL. It does have thrust vectoring so the engine exhaust can be directed to enhance maneuverability.

The F-35 JSF will have VTOl. It has a turbofan in the middle that can cut on, as well as directed thrust similar to the Harrier. Additionally, about half of the engine can swivel down to direct exhaust downward, so you get both a midship fan and an aft engine pointed down. You can't see the midship fan in the photo below, but you can see the doors that open up just behind the cockpit to allow air into it from above.

F-14:
http://www.spitcrazy.com/F-14%20sundowners-98037.jpg

F-35 JSF:
http://www.4wings.com/des/image/F-35.jpg

If I had taken the time to look at the engine configuration on each of them, I would have probably come to that conclusion.
Does the F35 have the same capabilities as the F22, such as the ability to carry it's ordinance enclosed within the airframe?
A good feature to cut down the planes profile on radar, but it somewhat limits what you can carry.
As noted on the page where I found that article on the F22, once you run out of weaponry you are reduced to strong language. :D

[Vaevictis]

As noted on the page where I found that article on the F22, once you run out of weaponry you are reduced to strong language. :D

Well, on the plus side, if the capabilities are everything they're cracked up to be, disengaging and getting out of dodge is likely to be no trouble at all.

(okay, so "no trouble" is an exaggeration, but you take my meaning)

[BudSooner]

(okay, so "no trouble" is an exaggeration, but you take my meaning)

Exactery.

[GottaHavePride]

Well, on the plus side, if the capabilities are everything they're cracked up to be, they can lock on and kill enemy aircraft before they even come in weapons range of the opposition...


Fixed.

[Vaevictis]

Fixed.

Not really, considering that the original premise was that the weapons complement had been exhausted and there were still enemies left over :)

[NYSooner1355]

Yes, the Air Force is getting Ospreys.

I don't know that is definite...

my guard unit is CSAR - and the AF put out a notice saying they were going to send CSAR-X planes to the field - but it would be between the Osprey (or its variant) and an X-helicopter

then they would decide which plane/helicopter to send to the units

maybe you are correct though and the AF has ordered its own Ospreys and are looking into a variant for the CSAR community

[reevie]

I don't know that is definite...

my guard unit is CSAR - and the AF put out a notice saying they were going to send CSAR-X planes to the field - but it would be between the Osprey (or its variant) and an X-helicopter

then they would decide which plane/helicopter to send to the units

maybe you are correct though and the AF has ordered its own Ospreys and are looking into a variant for the CSAR community


According to the AF Fact sheet (http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=3668) looks like they're not assigned a CSAR mission, just Special Ops.

[StoopTroup]

Should we really name a "State of the Art" military jet after an extinct dinosaur?

[NYSooner1355]

According to the AF Fact sheet (http://www.af.mil/factsheets/factsheet.asp?id=3668) looks like they're not assigned a CSAR mission, just Special Ops.

well CSAR is Special Ops until 1 Oct when it goes back to ACC (and that is pretty much a political thing)...

but as of now they aren't out to the CSAR units - they will be sent to units and then they (AF) will decide which aircraft to assign out to CSAR units

[reevie]

Should we really name a "State of the Art" military jet after an extinct dinosaur?

They used the other definition of Raptor....a bird of prey...not the dino

[StoopTroup]

They used the other definition of Raptor....a bird of prey...not the dino
Seriously...we all know birds came from dinosaurs. ;)

[reevie]

Seriously...we all know birds came from dinosaurs. ;)

Just the flying dinos

[reevie]

well CSAR is Special Ops until 1 Oct when it goes back to ACC (and that is pretty much a political thing)...

but as of now they aren't out to the CSAR units - they will be sent to units and then they (AF) will decide which aircraft to assign out to CSAR units


I forgot my ACSC readings....

[Okla-homey]

If I had taken the time to look at the engine configuration on each of them, I would have probably come to that conclusion.
Does the F35 have the same capabilities as the F22, such as the ability to carry it's ordinance enclosed within the airframe?
A good feature to cut down the planes profile on radar, but it somewhat limits what you can carry.
As noted on the page where I found that article on the F22, once you run out of weaponry you are reduced to strong language. :D

Fundamentally different mission. JSF is a fighter-bomber which is hoped to replace both the F-16 (and maybe A-10) and F-18 and AV-8 in USAF/USN/USMC inventories. Frankly, I doubt that will happen.

The last time we tried a tri-service jet was the flippin' F-111 and only the AF bit. Frankly, it was just too big for the carriers, but is was faster than a raped-ape down low.

F-22 is an air-superiority fighter. The Navy and the USMC aren't really allowed to build their own air superiority fighter anymore because that's mostly an AF mission. The F-14 was the last jet the Navy built as an air superiority fighter. They ended up hanging bombs on them towards the end but it was kinda pathetic. They called them "Bombcats":rolleyes:

Oh, just in case someone reads this who knows something about the issues, I acknowledge the purported multi-role uses for the F-22. I also understand why they were tacked-on. Congress doesn't like one-trick ponies.

[Okla-homey]

Should we really name a "State of the Art" military jet after an extinct dinosaur?

Hey foo! Go to the zoo! Birds of prey are called "raptors" as a class. Sheesh.

Besides, it was the only good one left. We've already had Falcons, Hawks and Eagles. I don't think they thought Owl was very scary.

[reevie]

You know, in naming the F-35 the Dutch submitted the Black Mamba. The name made the short list but the un-inspired Lightning II won. I don't think there were any "bird" names on the short list for the 35.

F-35 Black Mamba would have been cool.

[reevie]

You know, in naming the F-35 the Dutch submitted the Black Mamba. The name made the short list but the un-inspired Lightning II won. I don't think there were any "bird" names on the short list for the 35.

F-35 Black Mamba would have been cool.


The short list of names:

Lightning II
Spitfire II
Black Mamba
Piasa
Cyclone
Reaper

[NYSooner1355]

Black Mamba would have been cool...

maybe they ditched it because it is too close to "Black Mama" :eek:

[afs]

As noted on the page where I found that article on the F22, once you run out of weaponry you are reduced to strong language. :D

in any Figher Jet, when you're out of ammo you're reduced to strong language.

Also- I've seen V-22s on the ramp at Kirtland and at Holloman, both with USAF markings.

the F-35 will be extremely similar to the F-22, as stated by Homey - with different roles. Interesting to note that the F-35 is expected to have better avianoics and technology than the F-22 simply b/c it's a newer designed aircraft.

[Vaevictis]

http://times.hankooki.com/lpage/200508/kt2005081519485168040.htm

F-5's for $100. Any takers? :)

[soonerjoker]

Lockheed wanted "lightning 2" as the P-38 was original.

[soonerjoker]

i'd give $100 for an F-5, but i couldn't fly it, nor afford the fuel
& maintenance.

[Okla-homey]

i'd give $100 for an F-5, but i couldn't fly it, nor afford the fuel
& maintenance.

But you put it out in the yard and plant flowers in the cockpit. It would look real purty.

[IronSooner]

Black Mamba would have been cool...

maybe they ditched it because it is too close to "Black Mama" :eek:

It's the PC people trying not to be racist. ;)

[skycat]

Just the flying dinos

There were no flying dinosaurs.

Can I turn this into a dinosaur thread?

Too geeky for a military thread?:O