View Full Version : If I were an Episcopal, this would tear it once and for all for me...
Stoop Dawg
6/20/2006, 05:04 PM
And you equate this to changing the definition and meaning of a major civilized institution (marriage)?
If I understand you correctly, yes.
Just remember not to look directly into the fireball, folks, less you be turned into a pillar of salt.
If I understand you correctly, yes.
Well...
You can call the union of two men whatever you want to, but it will never be marriage.
Hatfield
6/20/2006, 06:15 PM
jerk a few questions
are you married?
have you been divorced?
how does anyone getting married (gay or straight) effect the sanctity of your marriage?
jerk a few questions
are you married?
have you been divorced?
how does anyone getting married (gay or straight) effect the sanctity of your marriage?
Yes
No
I think it screws up the English language more than anything.
Marriage = man + woman
Anything else should be called something else. Call it a "union" or whatever, just not marriage.
Marriage is the foundation for a traditional family. 2 dudes banging each other in the arse doesn't belong in the same category.
swardboy
6/20/2006, 07:01 PM
The "moral argument" was a big motivator for C.S. Lewis to turn from skeptic to believer. Basically, if there is no God, there is no "right or wrong." There is no basis for feeling "wronged" if God does not exist. Why should I give a hoot what my actions do to someone else if there is no God....there is no ultimate authority to answer to. It was a cog in the conversion of Lewis.
StoopTroup
6/20/2006, 07:39 PM
So after 13 pages of (very memorizing) discussion ( :D )....
Is it "OK" for all Episcopalians to be ghey?
Sooner_Bob
6/20/2006, 07:46 PM
Why?
Although Hatfield and I are pretty much diametrically opposed on most issues, I have to agree with him here. For the most part, "christians" do pick and choose which Bible verses they feel like living by. That's why the whole organized religion thing is bunk.
For the most part I have to disagree . . . being a Christian is not about doing what we feel like. It's about living a life for Christ and doing your best to show Him and His love through your actions.
Some people are better at that than others and some of them do it to bring glory to themselves rather than God.
Simply put, humans are not capable of interpreting the Bible and what it means.
What? The bible was written for us humans. We are more than capable of interpreting what it says. It's when some folks don't like what it says when the problems start.
So, what do we do? That's right, pull out the verses that we like, and ****can the ones we don't. Then we join a church, and badmouth the other churches who've chosen their favorite verses to live by. We let some charismatic preacher bend and shape us to his will. We send him lots of $$. Or we do the whole Catholic thing and live our life performing meaningless ceremony that we've committed to rote. It's all so hypocritical and phoney.
Anyone who depends on a preacher, a church, or their money to get them to Heaven is nothing short of nieve, and quite frankly very ignorant. And just because some of those nieve people go overboard in their beliefs (again to draw attention to themselves and not God IMO) that doesn't mean the rest of us are hypocritical or phoney.
Stoop Dawg
6/20/2006, 07:52 PM
Well...
You can call the union of two men whatever you want to, but it will never be marriage.
Then we're agreed. We'll call them "civil unions" and give them equal protections and rights under the law.
See how easy that was?
StoopTroup
6/20/2006, 07:52 PM
Anyone who depends on a preacher, a church, or their money to get them to Heaven is nothing short of nieve, and quite frankly very ignorant.
Maybe they are just struggling through Life and believe that their tigthing and attendence will please God as they continue to try and improve their life and the lives of those less fortunate?
Stoop Dawg
6/20/2006, 07:57 PM
Why should I give a hoot what my actions do to someone else if there is no God
Let me ask you this. What is the primary motivation for you to refrain from punching the 250lb idiot that sits in front of you at the football game:
A. You're afraid the 250lb man will kick your ***
B. You're afraid some other person(s) will throw you out of the stadium
C. You're afraid God will disapprove
I think the answer is a combination of A and B for 99% of the people out there.
StoopTroup
6/20/2006, 08:00 PM
Don't fear God because your afraid of getting punished.
C. Isn't a good reason anyway.
Then we're agreed. We'll call them "civil unions" and give them equal protections and rights under the law.
See how easy that was?
Fine. So long as it's not called 'marriage' because it is not. Other than that, I don't care what the gays do.
Scott D
6/20/2006, 09:28 PM
oh and I should probably close this topic out with this. The Episcopal Church has always percieved itself to be very very progressive. From the ordaining of Gene Robinson in New Hampshire as the first openly gay Bishop, to making Bishop Katherine Jefferts Schori the 'head of the Church'. To it's attempts and successes at pushing into 'bad neighborhoods' and spreading their word on the street.
That being said..The Anglican Church for now is maintaining it's stance of not promoting women to Bishophood, so there could be a larger rift between the Anglican Church and the Episcopal branch of it.
The first rifting had to do with the Episcopal Church first trying to go behind the back of the Anglican Church to try and 'make nice' with the Catholic Church. The second was the promotion of Bishop Robinson. The third the elevation of Bishop Schori, next...Schori's first proclamation.
2012 is going to be a vedy vedy interesting year for the Anglican Church.
Okla-homey
6/21/2006, 05:26 AM
So after 13 pages of (very memorizing) discussion ( :D )....
Is it "OK" for all Episcopalians to be ghey?
Apparently their new lady pope thinks so.
Okla-homey
6/21/2006, 05:44 AM
oh and I should probably close this topic out with this. The Episcopal Church has always percieved itself to be very very progressive. From the ordaining of Gene Robinson in New Hampshire as the first openly gay Bishop, to making Bishop Katherine Jefferts Schori the 'head of the Church'. To it's attempts and successes at pushing into 'bad neighborhoods' and spreading their word on the street.
That being said..The Anglican Church for now is maintaining it's stance of not promoting women to Bishophood, so there could be a larger rift between the Anglican Church and the Episcopal branch of it.
The first rifting had to do with the Episcopal Church first trying to go behind the back of the Anglican Church to try and 'make nice' with the Catholic Church. The second was the promotion of Bishop Robinson. The third the elevation of Bishop Schori, next...Schori's first proclamation.
2012 is going to be a vedy vedy interesting year for the Anglican Church.
I must admit, I find a bit of irony in the fact the Anglican Church from which the US Episcopal Church evolved, was begun because Henry VIII insisted on his royal right to get his freak on after the Holy See refused to grant him an annulment from Queen Catherine his first wife. IOW, the king told Rome he'd lay the royal pipe with whomever he wanted and if Rome refused to acknowledge his right, he'd declare independence from it and start his own church.
Now, the worldwide Anglican Communion appears poised to cut loose the the Episcopal Church in the US because its new leader insists on the right of its homosexual clergy and laity to get their freak on.
Hamhock
6/21/2006, 08:14 AM
I must admit, I find a bit of irony in the fact the Anglican Church from which the US Episcopal Church evolved, was begun because Henry VIII insisted on his royal right to get his freak on after the Holy See refused to grant him an annulment from Queen Catherine his first wife. IOW, the king told Rome he'd lay the royal pipe with whomever he wanted and if Rome refused to acknowledge his right, he'd declare independence from it and start his own church.
Now, the worldwide Anglican Communion appears poised to cut loose the the Episcopal Church in the US because its new leader insists on the right of its homosexual clergy and laity to get their freak on.
In my opinion, "get your freak on", is tragically underused in today's language.
Mad props Homey.
Sooner_Bob
6/21/2006, 05:27 PM
Maybe they are just struggling through Life and believe that their tigthing and attendence will please God as they continue to try and improve their life and the lives of those less fortunate?
Nope . . . I'd still call that nieve. ;)
Nope . . . I'd still call that nieve. ;)
OK, but what would you call naive?
Who ever the little fairy is that negged me w/o leaving your name - take your little neggy and stick it up your fairy a$s.
"ohhhhhhh, you're just soo petty"
Whatever, limpwrist.
booo hooo he hurted my feelins!
Hatfield
6/21/2006, 06:47 PM
Who ever the little fairy is that negged me w/o leaving your name - take your little neggy and stick it up your fairy a$s.
"ohhhhhhh, you're just soo petty"
Whatever, limpwrist.
booo hooo he hurted my feelins!
people have been baned for less than that. Over the top and uncalled for in my opinion.
p.s. i don't neg but when you let negs get to you so much where you feel the need to lash out with a biased hate filled tirade....well maybe it is time to take a step back and re-examine things.
PhilTLL
6/21/2006, 06:51 PM
people have been baned for less than that. Over the top and uncalled for in my opinion.
p.s. i don't neg but when you let negs get to you so much where you feel the need to lash out with a biased hate filled tirade....well maybe it is time to take a step back and re-examine things.
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Hatfield again.
swardboy
6/21/2006, 06:52 PM
Let me ask you this. What is the primary motivation for you to refrain from punching the 250lb idiot that sits in front of you at the football game:
A. You're afraid the 250lb man will kick your ***
B. You're afraid some other person(s) will throw you out of the stadium
C. You're afraid God will disapprove
I think the answer is a combination of A and B for 99% of the people out there.
A or B don't make you a "moral" person...just survival instinct kicking in.
people have been baned for less than that. Over the top and uncalled for in my opinion.
p.s. i don't neg but when you let negs get to you so much where you feel the need to lash out with a biased hate filled tirade....well maybe it is time to take a step back and re-examine things.
It's okay, comrad Hatfield. You'll get glad in the same pants you got mad in.
Hatfield
6/21/2006, 07:01 PM
no skin off my back jerk call me what you want if it makes you feel better.
I ain't the one freaking out over a "neg" rep point.
no skin off my back jerk call me what you want if it makes you feel better.
I ain't the one freaking out over a "neg" rep point.
I just got a little irked that they didn't at least leave their name.
Okla-homey
6/21/2006, 07:11 PM
You'll get glad in the same pants you got mad in.
Dude,
My dear departed granny from Okemah used to say that! You are a great American for reminding me.:D
StoopTroup
6/21/2006, 07:15 PM
Not if your a dog...
http://roontoon.com/blog/files/Photo_122205_011.jpg
GhostOfJAS
6/21/2006, 07:20 PM
I just got a little irked that they didn't at least leave their name.
Wasn't me, but you should have seen the hateful neg spek I got (mostly anonymous, of course) for just being honest. Just rolls off my back.
Stoop Dawg
6/21/2006, 07:25 PM
Wasn't me, but you should have seen the hateful neg spek I got (mostly anonymous, of course) for just being honest. Just rolls off my back.
Ever get 6 in a row?
Crying about neg is about as lame as it gets. I used to dish out neg when I thought someone deserved it, but there are so many fragile egos on this board that I stopped for fear of destroying someone's life. :rolleyes:
Okla-homey
6/21/2006, 07:27 PM
Wasn't me, but you should have seen the hateful neg spek I got (mostly anonymous, of course) for just being honest. Just rolls off my back.
For the record. To date, I have never negged a non-wHorn.
Wasn't me, but you should have seen the hateful neg spek I got (mostly anonymous, of course) for just being honest. Just rolls off my back.
Wasn't me. The only time I neg people is if they talk sh** about our troops (which, I don't think I've seen yet) or if they neg me, I like to return the favor, but I can't when they don't leave their name. If you got negged just because you're gay...even I believe that just ain't right.
Hatfield
6/21/2006, 07:42 PM
Who ever the little fairy is that negged me w/o leaving your name - take your little neggy and stick it up your fairy a$s.
"ohhhhhhh, you're just soo petty"
Whatever, limpwrist.
booo hooo he hurted my feelins!
me thinks thou doest protest too much. ;)
Dude,
My dear departed granny from Okemah used to say that! You are a great American for reminding me.:D
It was a trucker friend who told me that. We'd laugh at the car who flipped us off and he'd say that phrase. He also said his grandmother taught him that. Must of been popular back in the day.
me thinks thou doest protest too much. ;)
I just want them to leave their name so I can neg them back. That's all.
How much do I have to contribute to have the feature that lets you see all the authors of your spek?
I am an eye for an eye person. I believe in tit for tat. I am all for getting even. I JUST WANT TO NEG THEM BACK. That's all. Now excuse me while I take my medication and log on to my favorite online first person shooting game.
Scott D
6/21/2006, 08:08 PM
For the record. To date, I have never negged a non-wHorn.
except for that time Homey negged me for calling him a sub sammich eating bug juice drinking no pt having fly girl ;)
Okla-homey
6/21/2006, 09:28 PM
except for that time Homey negged me for calling him a sub sammich eating bug juice drinking no pt having fly girl ;)
I shall not be enticed to neg a Sooner. It would'nt be fittin'.
Okla-homey
6/21/2006, 09:29 PM
I just want them to leave their name so I can neg them back. That's all.
How much do I have to contribute to have the feature that lets you see all the authors of your spek?
I am an eye for an eye person. I believe in tit for tat. I am all for getting even. I JUST WANT TO NEG THEM BACK. That's all. Now excuse me while I take my medication and log on to my favorite online first person shooting game.
Well then get up off that trucker wallet chained to your belt loop and become a sponsor. Sponsorship=no anonymous spek leavers.;)
Octavian
6/21/2006, 09:48 PM
Fine. So long as it's not called 'marriage' because it is not. Other than that, I don't care what the gays do.
I'm okay w/ this.
Marriage should be between the two people involved, their religious institution, and God.
Govt should grant civil unions -gay or straight- exclusively and w/out bias.
Govt certainly shouldn't be allowed to step into the lives of law-abiding adult Americans and forbid them from entering into a consensual, legally binding partnership w/ whomever they choose.
I'll neg any whorn who says different. ;)
olevetonahill
6/21/2006, 09:51 PM
Well then get up off that trucker wallet chained to your belt loop and become a sponsor. Sponsorship=no anonymous spek leavers.;)
:D :D :D :D :D
;)
Sooner_Bob
6/22/2006, 05:49 PM
OK, but what would you call naive?
doh!!
Sooner Born Sooner Bred
6/22/2006, 09:18 PM
I don't think that's true. Personally, I was only conceding that for the sake of argument. I know why most people believe it's a sin, I just think they're wrong. But what I have a problem with more than people thinking it's a sin is the hypocrisy of those people in most cases. They gloss over their own sins, but publicly condemn homosexuality because that's one sin they don't want to commit. Stage an anti-fornication rally and see how much response you get compared to an anti-gay rally. If people are true to their faith you'll have equal attendance at both, because a sin is a sin, right? Good luck with that. People who have trouble following their own religion have no business trying to foist it others.Exactly. Premarital sex is a sin. Divorce is a sin. Gluttony is a sin. The list goes on. It's really easy to call out the sins of others without looking at our own sins.
Sooner Born Sooner Bred
6/22/2006, 09:28 PM
I'm not Chick, but I don't think so, no.
Again, its hard for us to have this debate, b/c I believe in the Bible, and you don't. As such, we'll never agree.
But my stand is that the Bible states that we are all sinners. If man was capable of "not sinning", we wouldn't need to be saved to get to Heaven. Fact is, God created us an imperfect humans, incapable of "not sinning". Again, if you believe in the Bible, you understand the correlation between knowing that something is a sin, and still doing it.
My biggest problem with gays (and others) saying that homosexuality is not a sin, is that most aren't Christians. You'd be hard pressed to be a church-attending Christian and not think being gay is a sin.Went to OBU with a guy who is a gay minister now (not a Baptist one, mind you).
Also, the Bible says not to commit adultery. This is what Jesus has to say about adultery. I'm confident that if Jesus came back today, He wouldn't think any less of a gay person than He does of me~a woman who has committed adultery according to at least one of the following scriptures:
Mat 5:27-28 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. Mat 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery. Mat 19:9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. Mat 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Mark 10:11-12 And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery. Mark 10:19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother. Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery. Luke 18:20 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother.
usmc-sooner
6/22/2006, 11:34 PM
Went to OBU with a guy who is a gay minister now (not a Baptist one, mind you).
Also, the Bible says not to commit adultery. This is what Jesus has to say about adultery. I'm confident that if Jesus came back today, He wouldn't think any less of a gay person than He does of me~a woman who has committed adultery according to at least one of the following scriptures:
Mat 5:27-28 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. Mat 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery. Mat 19:9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. Mat 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Mark 10:11-12 And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery. Mark 10:19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother. Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery. Luke 18:20 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother.
so what your saying is as long as gays can't marry, they can't cheat on each other :D
Okla-homey
6/23/2006, 05:02 AM
Also, the Bible says not to commit adultery. This is what Jesus has to say about adultery. I'm confident that if Jesus came back today, He wouldn't think any less of a gay person than He does of me~a woman who has committed adultery according to at least one of the following scriptures:
Mat 5:27-28 Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery: But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart. Mat 5:32 But I say unto you, That whosoever shall put away his wife, saving for the cause of fornication, causeth her to commit adultery: and whosoever shall marry her that is divorced committeth adultery. Mat 19:9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. Mat 19:18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Mark 10:11-12 And he saith unto them, Whosoever shall put away his wife, and marry another, committeth adultery against her. And if a woman shall put away her husband, and be married to another, she committeth adultery. Mark 10:19 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Defraud not, Honour thy father and mother. Luke 16:18 Whosoever putteth away his wife, and marrieth another, committeth adultery: and whosoever marrieth her that is put away from her husband committeth adultery. Luke 18:20 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother.
SBSB,
I absolutely agree with your comment but would only add one thing. Yes, according to everything we know about Jesus' physical time on Earth, he would certainly not have shied away from ministering and fellowshipping with homosexuals just as he did with lots of other social undesireables like tax collectors, prostitutes, Roman centurions, women convicted of adultery, etc. In fact, our pastor here in Tulsa, (a very good d00d even though he is a wHorn-fan) once said "Jesus was crucified because of the way He ate" because he often sat down and had dinner with them. IOW, He hung out and had dinner with the sort of folks that the Pharisees and Saduccees would not and since He was an extremely popular rabbi with the people, those guys hated Him for it. All that said, He did admonish these types He hung out with to "go and sin no more."
To me, that is central to understanding what His time among us was about. He didn't really care much what a person had done or was doing, but He did expect them to try to knock it off as a condition of His forgiveness. You'll recall when He saved that woman caught in the "act" with a man to whom she wasn't married the townsfolk were about to stone to death (no mention of what they had planned for the guy) He uttered one of His most famous lines; "Let he among you who is without sin cast the first stone." After the crowd broke up and headed home, He told the woman, "Now go and sin no more."
The problem I have with the Episcopal position these days is they accept the "let he among you who is without sin cast the first stone" part, but toss the "go and sin no more" part.
As I understand it.
SicEmBaylor
6/23/2006, 05:04 AM
For the record. To date, I have never negged a non-wHorn.
I think you negged me once.
Okla-homey
6/23/2006, 05:10 AM
I think you negged me once.
Baylor is in wHorn-land. Therefore, Baylorians are wHorny. Close enough for neggage.
ouflak
6/23/2006, 05:27 AM
The problem I have with the Episcopal position these days is they accept the "let he among you who is without sin cast the first stone" part, but toss the "go and sin no more" part.
As I understand it.
No that is not the Episcopal position. That is the position perhaps of some individuals in the church. But that is not the Episcopal position.
Okla-homey
6/23/2006, 06:21 AM
No that is not the Episcopal position. That is the position perhaps of some individuals in the church. But that is not the Episcopal position.
Point taken. My apologies. Unfortunately for many Episcopalians, that is the view held by a lot of folks looking in from outside.
C&CDean
6/23/2006, 08:28 AM
I like beer.
Hamhock
6/23/2006, 08:35 AM
I like beer.
It makes me a jolly good fellow.
Scott D
6/23/2006, 09:42 AM
Point taken. My apologies. Unfortunately for many Episcopalians, that is the view held by a lot of folks looking in from outside.
yes but on the outside looking in Baptists appear to follow a 'do as I say, not as I do' doctrine.
Okla-homey
6/23/2006, 10:01 AM
yes but on the outside looking in Baptists appear to follow a 'do as I say, not as I do' doctrine.
I understand, but we don't have official denominational doctrine which states its okay to be a practicing homosexual in a pulpit. Remember the Tulsa preacher who went cruising for ghey secks in OKC? Gone.
Further, the official denominational position is a pastor must not be divorced. Individual Baptist churches around the convention may not observe that rule, but it is the policy and I've never been a member of a Southern Baptist Church which didn't. In fact, I've a good friend here in Tulsa who had to leave the ministry when his wife left him. He's happily remarried now and he's my Sunday School teacher. He's fine with the rule, understands and supports it and so do I.
Now, the Baptist position on drinking and dancing is rather harsh, and I don't like it, but it is what it is and I won't leave the church over it.
Hamhock
6/23/2006, 10:41 AM
I understand, but we don't have official denominational doctrine which states its okay to be a practicing homosexual in a pulpit. Remember the Tulsa preacher who went cruising for ghey secks in OKC? Gone.
Further, the official denominational position is a pastor must not be divorced. Individual Baptist churches around the convention may not observe that rule, but it is the policy and I've never been a member of a Southern Baptist Church which didn't. In fact, I've a good friend here in Tulsa who had to leave the ministry when his wife left him. He's happily remarried now and he's my Sunday School teacher. He's fine with the rule, understands and supports it and so do I.
Now, the Baptist position on drinking and dancing is rather harsh, and I don't like it, but it is what it is and I won't leave the church over it.
Know a guy named Charles Stanley? FBC Atlanta, head of the convention?
Okla-homey
6/23/2006, 11:15 AM
Know a guy named Charles Stanley? FBC Atlanta, head of the convention?
He's not head of the SBC. They just elected some guy who pastors a church in Mars Hill SC. I understand Dr Stanley was about to leave ministry when he and his wife reconciled. At least that's the last I heard.
mdklatt
6/23/2006, 11:19 AM
Further, the official denominational position is a pastor must not be divorced.
So it's okay for regular folks to get divorced but not pastors? Why not? Either it's okay for everyone or it's not okay for anyone, right? That sounds very un-Protestant to me.
Hamhock
6/23/2006, 01:21 PM
He's not head of the SBC. They just elected some guy who pastors a church in Mars Hill SC. I understand Dr Stanley was about to leave ministry when he and his wife reconciled. At least that's the last I heard.
I should have said former head of the convention. last I heard, he and his wife divorced and he is still pastor.
mdklatt, the Bible spells out qualifications for Elders and Deacons. In the 50s/60s, most Baptists abandoned the Biblical term of Elder and went to pastors.
All who teach, and especially Elders and Deacons are held to a higher standard. Actually, Scripture says that an Elder must be "the husband of one wife". It doesn't specifically say you can't serve as Elder if you've ever been divorced.
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