Scum of the Earth

[Sooner in Tampa]

:mad: Nice to see so many @$$holes taking advantage of a horrible situation and turning into their own little spending spree/vacation/porn fest :mad:

These fuggers need to get their @$$es thrown in jail...for a good while.

Article (http://www.nytimes.com/2006/06/14/us/nationalspecial/14katrina.html)


In one case, a man stayed more than two months on the government tab at a hotel in Hawaii that cost more than $100 a night. At the same time, he was getting $2,358 in government rent assistance, even though he had not been living in the property he claimed was damaged in the storm. Emergency aid was used to pay for football tickets, the bill at a Hooters in San Antonio, a $200 bottle of Dom Perignon, "Girls Gone Wild" videos, even an all-inclusive weeklong Caribbean vacation, the report says. More than $5 million went to people who had provided cemeteries or post office boxes as the addresses of their damaged property.



FEMA also provided cash or housing assistance to more than 1,000 prison inmates, totaling millions of dollars; one inmate used a post office box to collect $20,000. Some of the inmates may in fact have owned property that was damaged, but most should not have been eligible for the aid.
In another case, 24 payments, totaling $109,708, were sent to a single apartment, where eight people each submitted requests for aid eight times, each time using their own Social Security numbers.
Another person collected 26 payments using 13 different Social Security numbers — a total of $139,000 — even though public records show the individual did not live at any of the addresses reported as damaged.

[etouffee]

It's Bush's fault. If he hadn't blown up the levees, none of this would be happening.:rolleyes:

[Sooner in Tampa]

It's Bush's fault. If he hadn't blown up the levees, none of this would be happening.:rolleyes:I know...right.

[Harry Beanbag]

I thought this was going to be another horn thread.

[Sooner in Tampa]

I thought this was going to be another horn thread.or aggie :eddie:

[tbl]

Here's a full article on it. They should all do time in prison... and I'm not sure if I'm talking about FEMA and the people that authorized this horrible system or the people that actually did it.


FEMA funds spent on divorce, sex change

By LARRY MARGASAK, Associated Press Writer Wed Jun 14, 3:38 AM ET

WASHINGTON - Houston divorce lawyer Mark Lipkin says he can't recall anyone paying for his services with a FEMA debit card, but congressional investigators say one of his clients did just that.

The $1,000 payment was just one example cited in an audit that concluded that up to $1.4 billion — perhaps as much as 16 percent of the billions of dollars in assistance expended after Hurricanes Katrina and Rita — was spent for bogus reasons.

The Federal Emergency Management Agency also was hoodwinked to pay for season football tickets, a tropical vacation and a sex change operation, the audit found. Prison inmates, a supposed victim who used a New Orleans cemetery for a home address and a person who spent 70 days at a Hawaiian hotel all were able to get taxpayer help, according to evidence that gives a new black eye to the nation's disaster relief agency.

"I do Katrina victims all the time," Lipkin, the divorce attorney, told The Associated Press. "I didn't know anybody did that with me. I don't think it's right, obviously."

Government Accountability Office officials were testifying before a House committee Wednesday on their findings.

Rep. Michael McCaul, R-Texas, chairman of the subcommittee overseeing an investigation of post-hurricane aid, called the bogus spending "an assault on the American taxpayer."

"Prosecutors from the federal level down should be looking at prosecuting these crimes and putting the criminals who committed them in jail for a long time," he said.

To dramatize the problem, investigators provided lawmakers with a copy of a $2,358 U.S. Treasury check for rental assistance that an undercover agent received using a bogus address. The money was paid even after FEMA learned from its inspector that the undercover applicant did not live at the address.

FEMA spokesman Aaron Walker said Tuesday that the agency, already criticized for a poor response to Katrina, makes its highest priority during a disaster "to get help quickly to those in desperate need of our assistance."

"Even as we put victims first, we take very seriously our responsibility to be outstanding stewards of taxpayer dollars, and we are careful to make sure that funds are distributed appropriately," Walker said.

FEMA said it has identified more than 1,500 cases of potential fraud after Katrina and Rita and has referred those cases to the
Homeland Security Department's inspector general. The agency said it has identified $16.8 million in improperly awarded disaster relief money and has started efforts to collect the money.

The GAO said it was 95 percent confident that improper and potentially fraudulent payments were much higher — between $600 million and $1.4 billion.

The investigative agency said it found people lodged in hotels often were paid twice, since FEMA gave them individual rental assistance and paid hotels directly. FEMA paid California hotels $8,000 to house one individual — the same person who received three rental assistance payments for both disasters.

In another instance, FEMA paid an individual $2,358 in rental assistance, while at the same time paying about $8,000 for the same person to stay 70 nights at more than $100 per night in a Hawaii hotel.

FEMA also could not establish that 750 debit cards worth $1.5 million even went to Katrina victims, the auditors said.

Among the items purchased with the cards:

_An all-inclusive, one-week Caribbean vacation in the Punta Cana resort in the Dominican Republic.

_Five season tickets to New Orleans Saints professional football games.

_Adult erotica products in Houston and "Girls Gone Wild" videos in Santa Monica, Calif.

_Dom Perignon champagne and other alcoholic beverages in San Antonio.

"Our forensic audit and investigative work showed that improper and potentially fraudulent payments occurred mainly because FEMA did not validate the identity of the registrant, the physical location of the damaged address, and ownership and occupancy of all registrants at the time of registration," GAO officials said.

FEMA paid millions of dollars to more than 1,000 registrants who used names and
Social Security numbers belonging to state and federal prisoners for expedited housing assistance. The inmates were in Louisiana, Texas, Alabama, Mississippi, Georgia and Florida.

FEMA made about $5.3 million in payments to registrants who provided a post office box as their damaged residence, including one who got $2,748 for listing an Alabama post office box as the damaged property.

The GAO told of an individual who used 13 different Social Security numbers — including the person's own — to receive $139,000 in payments on 13 separate registrations for aid. All the payments were sent to a single address.

[Sooner in Tampa]

Here's a full article on it. They should all do time in prison... and I'm not sure if I'm talking about FEMA and the people that authorized this horrible system or the people that actually did it.FEMA is not a good organization by a long shot, but these dickcheeses who took advantage of the situation are the real problem. This whole "entitlement" argument.

Did the folks in OKC get handouts when the tornado kicked it's ***?
Did the people in Punta Gorda FLA get handouts when Hurricane Charlie erased most of their town ?
What about all of the people up north who suffered from mad flooding this spring ?

Some people pull up their bootstraps and help themselves...others stand around and blame the fugging government for their miserable existance and wait for a handout.

[OUinFLA]

Although I do agree with your statement CSF, but, Punta Gorda residents did get FEMA rental assistance funds. As well as FEMA sponsored trailer housing located east of I-75.
The magnitude was not as much as NOLA though. They did put in 600 mobile home units for displaced persons to live in.
Frighteningly, those people all were living in that housing during the 05 cane season.
The difference may be a difference of scale, but most of those in Punta Gorda either rebuilt asap, or sold their remaining structure and left the area. Many moved inland away from the water. But there was no shortage of buyers for their canal front/bay front property.

NOLA just seems to be so overwhelming due to the numbers of homes damaged. Punta Gorda had less than 3000 (? could be wrong here) homes damaged. And only a fewl hundred were damaged beyond repair.

Also, Punta Gorda is above sea level, and the new building codes requre new structures to be built up even more than the older homes were. Insurance is still available for PG homes, not so for NOLA homes.

Going back to your statement, PG residents did overwhelmingly seem to be involved with rebuilding and restructuring their community to make it better and functional again. Those not interested in staying found ready buyers for their property. No, they didnt sit on their butts waiting for a handout to support them. Most were glad they got some assistance, but all were willing to work to make it improve to a liveable situation again. I cant say there was no taking advantage of the government, but certainly not of the volumn we are hearing about in NOLA. Then again, the population of NOLA is not near as affluent as the population of Punta Gorda.

[rebmus]

FEMA is not a good organization by a long shot, but these dickcheeses who took advantage of the situation are the real problem. This whole "entitlement" argument.

.
add in all the media coverage and people screaming "hurry up! we need help!" bush was (and still is) blasted endlessly b/c response wasn't fast enough. so... FEMA goes in, hands out money without doing some verifying... honestly, they had no choice left at the time.

i agree though, the MAIN problem is the scumbags taking advantage of the system. the press didn't help matters. our govt didn't exactly handle things perfectly either.

[Sooner in Tampa]

I wasn't saying that PG didn't get FEMA...we all know they did.

Punta Gorda may have been different on the scale of disaster, but I think we agree on the main point of my statement. People shamelessy ROBBED the government.

We can use Miami after Andrew...that would be a better example.

[JohnnyMack]

Since we know humans are well, human and prone to do stupid **** like this, why weren't there more checks & balances in place at FEMA? Did a computer not notice it had sent 24 checks to the same address? Why were checks issued to P.O. boxes?

I'm not saying these people aren't scumbags, 'cause they are, but it seems like FEMA is a little too embroiled in red tape.

[soonerjoker]

folks on the "public dole" all their lives, don't know any better.

[Sooner in Tampa]

Since we know humans are well, human and prone to do stupid **** like this, why weren't there more checks & balances in place at FEMA? Did a computer not notice it had sent 24 checks to the same address? Why were checks issued to P.O. boxes?

I'm not saying these people aren't scumbags, 'cause they are, but it seems like FEMA is a little too embroiled in red tape.
Two words....














Government Agency.:eddie:

[rebmus]

Since we know humans are well, human and prone to do stupid **** like this, why weren't there more checks & balances in place at FEMA? Did a computer not notice it had sent 24 checks to the same address? Why were checks issued to P.O. boxes?

I'm not saying these people aren't scumbags, 'cause they are, but it seems like FEMA is a little too embroiled in red tape.
FEMA is a govt program... what do you expect??? :mad:

edit: you just beat me to that CSF! lol

[MamaMia]

One good secretary would have prevented all that fraud.

[rebmus]

One good secretary would have prevented all that fraud.
true... but we're talking govt agency here.

they only hire office assistants that blew money on a boob job instead of an education.

[soonerjoker]

no problem with that.

[Osce0la]

One good secretary would have prevented all that fraud.
Slick's secretary lady is close to there, why wasn't she working on this?

[Sooner in Tampa]

One good secretary would have prevented all that fraud.That may be a bit oversimplified. The magnitude of this task should not be understated...I think that most of us can also expect and accept a certain amount of fraud, but this far exceeds that.

[BeetDigger]

Since we know humans are well, human and prone to do stupid **** like this, why weren't there more checks & balances in place at FEMA? Did a computer not notice it had sent 24 checks to the same address? Why were checks issued to P.O. boxes?

I'm not saying these people aren't scumbags, 'cause they are, but it seems like FEMA is a little too embroiled in red tape.


It's not too different from what Welfare did for years.

[JohnnyMack]

That may be a bit oversimplified. The magnitude of this task should not be understated...I think that most of us can also expect and accept a certain amount of fraud, but this far exceeds that.

I agree, but 24 checks to the same address? Shouldn't some sort of simple computer program pick up on that?

[slickdawg]

I say abolish the GAO. What good is it to point out waste, fraud, and abuse
when nobody has the balls to take punitive and compensatory actions
against those that commit crimes?

Duke Cunningham, had he not screwed up on the sale of his house,
would still be in office today.

William Jefferson out of NOLA is as dirty of a congressman as you will
find. The FBI raids his DC office, and republicans and democrats go
apesh*t "you can't investigate us!"


The slickdawg in 08 policy for waste, fraud and abuse:

Any government official, from a civil service desk clerk to the president,
that is under investigation for any crime WILL BE SUSPENDED WITH PAY
UNTIL THEIR CASE IS ADJUDICATED. They will have all access to their
offices and computers suspended. If guilty, they will serve a minimum
of 30 days without pay and 3 times damages due to the US Government.
The maximum would be termination of employment, retirement benefits,
health insurance, and be disbarred from ever working for the US government
or any contractor or subcontractor(s) for the US government.

[rebmus]

I say abolish the GAO. What good is it to point out waste, fraud, and abuse
when nobody has the balls to take punitive and compensatory actions
against those that commit crimes?

Duke Cunningham, had he not screwed up on the sale of his house,
would still be in office today.

William Jefferson out of NOLA is as dirty of a congressman as you will
find. The FBI raids his DC office, and republicans and democrats go
apesh*t "you can't investigate us!"


The slickdawg in 08 policy for waste, fraud and abuse:

Any government official, from a civil service desk clerk to the president,
that is under investigation for any crime WILL BE SUSPENDED WITH PAY
UNTIL THEIR CASE IS ADJUDICATED. They will have all access to their
offices and computers suspended. If guilty, they will serve a minimum
of 30 days without pay and 3 times damages due to the US Government.
The maximum would be termination of employment, retirement benefits,
health insurance, and be disbarred from ever working for the US government
or any contractor or subcontractor(s) for the US government.

you got my vote if you ever run.....

[Sooner in Tampa]

I say abolish the GAO. What good is it to point out waste, fraud, and abuse
when nobody has the balls to take punitive and compensatory actions
against those that commit crimes?

Duke Cunningham, had he not screwed up on the sale of his house,
would still be in office today.

William Jefferson out of NOLA is as dirty of a congressman as you will
find. The FBI raids his DC office, and republicans and democrats go
apesh*t "you can't investigate us!"


The slickdawg in 08 policy for waste, fraud and abuse:

Any government official, from a civil service desk clerk to the president,
that is under investigation for any crime WILL BE SUSPENDED WITH PAY
UNTIL THEIR CASE IS ADJUDICATED. They will have all access to their
offices and computers suspended. If guilty, they will serve a minimum
of 30 days without pay and 3 times damages due to the US Government.
The maximum would be termination of employment, retirement benefits,
health insurance, and be disbarred from ever working for the US government
or any contractor or subcontractor(s) for the US government.

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to slickdawg again.

[slickdawg]

slickdawg in 08 - policy for civilians that defraud the United States government

Anyone convicted of providing false information in a time of crisis, such as
the Hurricane Katrina Disaster, to the United States Government, or any
delegate of the United States Government, shall:

Repay all costs of the investigation, including court costs
Repay 10 times the total amount they defrauded the government
Serve a minimum of 30 days in jail
Lose voting privliges, permanently
Lose firearm privliges, permanently
Lose driving privliges for one year
Be disbarred from ever working for the United States Government,
or and of its contractors or subcontractors
1 hour of community service for each dollar defrauded

A second conviction of this nature would also include permanent loss
of benfits provided by the US Government (social security, etc)

[Sooner in Tampa]

I agree, but 24 checks to the same address? Shouldn't some sort of simple computer program pick up on that?You would think...I get the impression that due to the lack of electricity...or very dimimished capability, there was not an online connection to cross reference something like that.

I guess the best that we can hope for, is that there were VERY valuable lessons learned from Katrina and that the government can really reduce some of these problems.

[Sooner in Tampa]

slickdawg in 08 - policy for civilians that defraud the United States government

Anyone convicted of providing false information in a time of crisis, such as
the Hurricane Katrina Disaster, to the United States Government, or any
delegate of the United States Government, shall:

Repay all costs of the investigation, including court costs
Repay 10 times the total amount they defrauded the government
Serve a minimum of 30 days in jail
Lose voting privliges, permanently
Lose firearm privliges, permanently
Lose driving privliges for one year
Be disbarred from ever working for the United States Government,
or and of its contractors or subcontractors
1 hour of community service for each dollar defraudedKeep going man...you are on a roll.


And...SPEK!!!

[slickdawg]

Well CSF, I look at it this way - it's a privilige to live in this country.
To steal from the government and corruption in the government are
to of the worst crimes out there. If my term was spent only
correcting that I'd feel pretty good.

[rebmus]

Well CSF, I look at it this way - it's a privilige to live in this country.
To steal from the government and corruption in the government are
to of the worst crimes out there. If my term was spent only
correcting that I'd feel pretty good.
that alone... would be more than a full time job.

[slickdawg]

that alone... would be more than a full time job.


Sadly enough, it would be.

But I'll have WHB taking care of the muslim extremists for me.

I think Dean would make a great secretary of state.

[rebmus]

Sadly enough, it would be.


ain't tellin me anything new. for example... certain people have committed crimes and suddenly, the case goes away. the file comes up missing, and the prosecutor suddenly has a new car, or aquires some land, sometimes a house, or suddenly makes a large cash deposit.

yeah... that stuff happens.

(we're getting somewhat off topic... sorry)

[slickdawg]

ain't tellin me anything new. for example... certain people have committed crimes and suddenly, the case goes away. the file comes up missing, and the prosecutor suddenly has a new car, or aquires some land, sometimes a house, or suddenly makes a large cash deposit.

yeah... that stuff happens.

(we're getting somewhat off topic... sorry)


It's all on topic bro.

[rebmus]

btw slickdawg... may i suggest another for your platform?

no more raises for house/senate/justices/vp/pres until the national debt is paid off.

until they can learn to manage money... they dang sure shouldn't get raises!

[sooneron]

I have one question!!!!








Where is a hotel that is just over 100 bucks in Hawaii???

TIA

[slickdawg]

btw slickdawg... may i suggest another for your platform?

no more raises for house/senate/justices/vp/pres until the national debt is paid off.

until they can learn to manage money... they dang sure shouldn't get raises!


I hit that in another thread.

Senators salary = mean annual income for their state
Congressmen salary = mean annual income for their district
VP & Pres = national mean income

and it stays that way forever.

Their retirement benefits would be the same as thre rest of us, no special plans.

I had a great idea for the national debt this morning, it's worth a new thread.

[rebmus]

seriously slick... if you ever run for office, lemme know. i'll gladly vote for ya

[Ike]

I have a few thoughts on this, more of the type that try to illuminate the problem rather than offer solutions, but bear with me...

The problem with FEMA funds and Katrina seems to me to be twofold...A problem of needing to deliver assistance in a timely manner coupled with a drastic increase in the scale of the emergency as compared to what FEMA is used to working with.

In any emergency, the government feels the need to deliver assistance to the victims of the emergency in a timely manner. For your 'normal' emergencies, where less than a few thousand people are affected and in urgent need of assistance to at least get back to a point where they are contributing to society, we typically have no problem. With only a handfull of people, FEMA can identify those people who need assistance and get a decent estimate of how much they need. There are probably cracks in the system that allow some fraud to creep in, but in these 'normal' emergencies, those cracks can be made as small as possible, and fraud can be mostly eliminated, and the people that do need assistance can get it quickly and life can return to normal in somewhat of a timely manner.

However, when you couple this need to get assisance out quickly to a sharp increase in scale as we saw with Katrina, where the number of people in need of some assistance was somewhere in the hundreds of thousands, something has to give. There simply wasn't the manpower, nor the brainpower apparently, to both keep the cracks in the system plugged up AND deliver funds in a timely manner. It seems that they chose to forget about plugging the cracks entirely and decided to simply get the money to NOLA victims as quickly as possible. A computer could have performed some of the most basic checks, but apparently, nobody ever wrote the code to do it, probably because it was never really needed before. Something tells me that such code is either being developed now, or has recently been deployed at FEMA now, but alas, it's probably too late for Katrina.


Anyway, the way I see it, this IS a solvable problem. I believe that there are certainly people that were in NOLA that needed that assistance, and probably put it to good use as well, and those people will most likely continue to make their contributions to our society, and as such, they deserve some assistance when faced with a situation like Katrina. But, there are also plenty of people who will take advantage of any crack in the system they can find. But the way I see it, the cracks are such that with just a modicum of intelligent thought, they can be plugged up and kept tight even in the event of another large scale disaster. The question though is will they?

[NormanPride]

Sadly enough, it would be.

But I'll have WHB taking care of the muslim extremists for me.

I think Dean would make a great secretary of state.

Dean for Surgeon General.

Surgeon General's Warning: "DON'T DO STUPID ****."

[OUinFLA]

slickdawg in 08

get on the bandwagon now while there are still good positions to be filled.


pssst, slick, I want to be in charge of interviewing, secretaries, and campaign workers ......................(oYo) .......... goes a long way is qualifications.

SicEm should be handling campaign contributions, he has experience.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Probably all of the "govt. assistance" programs have considerable fraud at all levels, not just limited to the recipients who use their money for lottery tickets and "Girls Gone Wild" videos.