Solution for crime

[slickdawg]

A former coworker has this idea:

The government trains every US citizen in the use of handguns, and
upon completing the training, every trained citizen will be issued a handgun.

There would be a series of killings at first, but then people would realize
that at any time, if you act up, you might get shot because you know
everyone is armed.


discuss

[skycat]

A former coworker has this idea:

The government trains every US citizen in the use of handguns, and
upon completing the training, every trained citizen will be issued a handgun.

There would be a series of killings at first, but then people would realize
that at any time, if you act up, you might get shot because you know
everyone is armed.


discuss

Every person I have ever met is more than responsible enough to carry a handgun at all times.

Really.

[Hamhock]

Every person I have ever met is more than responsible enough to carry a handgun at all times.

Really.


Especially in stressful times like when I hear the punks are plotting to steal my stroller.

[TUSooner]

My wife must NEVER be allowed to carry a firearm, EVAR.

[OCUDad]

I support the idea, but think there should be a minimum age. After all, we don't want 5-year-olds running around with handguns.

I suggest minimum age of 21 for women, 60 for men.

[XingTheRubicon]

That's a great idea.

Let's give everyone a tiny, hand held killing device.

The U.S. should make educational videos on gun safety, you know to help out the rest of the world....even more.

[Hamhock]

I always hid the ammo from my wife. But, I did give her a 7.62 round for her key chain. She used to tell folks that p***ed her off that, "this bullet's for you, a$$ h0le"..."Honey, go get the big bullet"


seven.....six.....two...millimeter...full....metal ...jacket....

[Hamhock]

Let's give everyone a tiny, hand held killing device.




what do microwaves have to do with this discussion?

[OUinFLA]

..... people would realize
that at any time, if you act up, you might get shot because you know
everyone is armed.


and this is different from now?

substitute "suspect" for the word "know" in the above.
and I'll tell you why I dont shoot the finger at Interstate drivers anymore.

[XingTheRubicon]

what do microwaves have to do with this discussion?




FYI, hand held usually means "fits in your hand."











;)

[Hamhock]

FYI, hand held usually means "fits in your hand."











;)


You've never seen my hands. :texan:

[Partial Qualifier]

I think outlawing firearms altogether would be a better idea.

[Hamhock]

I think outlawing firearms altogether would be a better idea.


Best idea EVAR!!!

Just think if owning a gun was illegal!! People would stop using them to commit crimes!!! Brilliant!!!!

[OUinFLA]

Best idea EVAR!!!

Just think if owning a gun was illegal!! People would stop using them to commit crimes!!! Brilliant!!!!

you know, I could "almost" agree with that if..........

you would institute a mandatory "death penalty" if you are convicted of using a gun in the commission of a crime.

Prolly lead to an increase sale of baseball bats though.
Invest in Louiseville Slugger now.

[Partial Qualifier]

Best idea EVAR!!!

Just think if owning a gun was illegal!! People would stop using them to commit crimes!!! Brilliant!!!!

..and allowing anyone & everyone access to a firearm is the answer? :rolleyes:

How do firearm-based crime rates compare between the U.S. and countries who ban firearms?

Sure you'd have that period where the bad guys would still have guns, but realistically: comparatively, how often does a good guy with a firearm actually stop a violent crime involving a bad guy with a firearm? Sure we can list a few notable examples but we're talking about .0001% of all instances of violent crime, if THAT much, eliminated by the good guy w/firearm

[SoonerWood]

Outlawing firearms altogether is ridiculous. Of course, giving one to everyone is ridiculous too.

[XingTheRubicon]

..and allowing anyone & everyone access to a firearm is the answer? :rolleyes:

How do firearm-based crime rates compare between the U.S. and countries who ban firearms?

Sure you'd have that period where the bad guys would still have guns, but realistically: comparatively, how often does a good guy with a firearm actually stop a violent crime involving a bad guy with a firearm? Sure we can list a few notable examples but we're talking about .0001% of all instances of violent crime, if THAT much, eliminated by the good guy w/firearm




Here come the sharpies,


good luck

[1stTimeCaller]

..and allowing anyone & everyone access to a firearm is the answer? :rolleyes:

How do firearm-based crime rates compare between the U.S. and countries who ban firearms?

Sure you'd have that period where the bad guys would still have guns, but realistically: comparatively, how often does a good guy with a firearm actually stop a violent crime involving a bad guy with a firearm? Sure we can list a few notable examples but we're talking about .0001% of all instances of violent crime, if THAT much, eliminated by the good guy w/firearm

According to the National Self Defense Survey conducted by Florida State University criminologists in 1994, the rate of Defensive Gun Uses can be projected nationwide to approximately 2.5 million per year -- one Defensive Gun Use every 13 seconds.
Among 15.7% of gun defenders interviewed nationwide during The National Self Defense Survey, the defender believed that someone "almost certainly" would have died had the gun not been used for protection -- a life saved by a privately held gun about once every 1.3 minutes. (In another 14.2% cases, the defender believed someone "probably" would have died if the gun hadn't been used in defense.)

In 83.5% of these successful gun defenses, the attacker either threatened or used force first -- disproving the myth that having a gun available for defense wouldn't make any difference.

In 91.7% of these incidents the defensive use of a gun did not wound or kill the criminal attacker (and the gun defense wouldn't be called "newsworthy" by newspaper or TV news editors). In 64.2% of these gun-defense cases, the police learned of the defense, which means that the media could also find out and report on them if they chose to.

In 73.4% of these gun-defense incidents, the attacker was a stranger to the intended victim. (Defenses against a family member or intimate were rare -- well under 10%.) This disproves the myth that a gun kept for defense will most likely be used against a family member or someone you love.

In over half of these gun defense incidents, the defender was facing two or more attackers -- and three or more attackers in over a quarter of these cases. (No means of defense other than a firearm -- martial arts, pepper spray, or stun guns -- gives a potential victim a decent chance of getting away uninjured when facing multiple attackers.)

In 79.7% of these gun defenses, the defender used a concealable handgun. A quarter of the gun defenses occured in places away from the defender's home.


Source: "Armed Resistance to Crime: The Prevalence and Nature of Self-Defense with a Gun," by Gary Kleck and Marc Gertz, in The Journal of Criminal Law & Criminology, Northwestern University School of Law, Volume 86, Number 1, Fall, 1995

[Partial Qualifier]

Outlawing firearms altogether is ridiculous. Of course, giving one to everyone is ridiculous too.

And really, the answer to much of our nation's problems on a fundamental level is simply better parenting.

Sounds crazy, I know.

[XingTheRubicon]

Outlawing firearms altogether is ridiculous. Of course, giving one to everyone is ridiculous too.


Please, no common sense posts in the "dummy" gun thread.

[walkoffsooner]

I might be able to carry a handgun now. But my temper used to be way to bad I would of shot people on hiway for cutting me off.

[Hamhock]

cold. dead. hand.

[GottaHavePride]

And really, the answer to much of our nation's problems on a fundamental level is simply better parenting.

Sounds crazy, I know.

Now, THAT I'll agree with.

[Partial Qualifier]

According to the National Self Defense Survey conducted by Florida State University Criminoles in 1994

Well there goes the credibility ;) :D

Seriously those projected numbers sound impressive and all but when stacked up against factual firearm-based crime reports, I'm thinking it's easy to prove that to the average crime victim, it really doesn't matter if you're packing or not unless you're a thug who's at risk of getting shot at every day. Then again, I may be totally off.

I'd really like to see a comparison of firearm-based crime incidents between the U.S. and countries where firearms are banned. Doesn't the UK ban firearms?

[Hamhock]

..and allowing anyone & everyone access to a firearm is the answer? :rolleyes:

How do firearm-based crime rates compare between the U.S. and countries who ban firearms?

Sure you'd have that period where the bad guys would still have guns, but realistically: comparatively, how often does a good guy with a firearm actually stop a violent crime involving a bad guy with a firearm? Sure we can list a few notable examples but we're talking about .0001% of all instances of violent crime, if THAT much, eliminated by the good guy w/firearm


after we ban guns, we should go after cocaine, heroine and other dangerous drugs.

[1stTimeCaller]

I think the UK and Australia ban handguns but allow you to have rifles and shotguns for hunting. I could be wrong.

I think NYC also bans handguns along with Washington DC. Could you get a good comparison using a per capita murder/crime rate of those vs. Noble, OK? Hell if I know.

[Partial Qualifier]

after we ban guns, we should go after cocaine, heroine and other dangerous drugs.

Heh you're thinking I'm some peace-pushing, idealistic utopian. I'm really not. Can you put your personal feelings about guns aside long enough to offer an opinion, or are you just here to passive-aggressively attack mine?

[1stTimeCaller]

PQ is such a bastard for not believing in Utopiaville. ;)

[Hamhock]

Heh you're thinking I'm some peace-pushing, idealistic utopian. I'm really not. Can you put your personal feelings about guns aside long enough to offer an opinion, or are you just here to passive-aggressively attack mine?


What will the outlawing of guns accomplish?

[XingTheRubicon]

Hope this helps.


In 2001, the U.S. had approximately 30,000 gun deaths. The U.K. had 2,200 gun deaths....for a decade.


Think about that as hard as you can.


http://www.harvardmagazine.com/on-line/090433.html

http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF07.htm

[XingTheRubicon]

In 2001, about 30,000 people died from gunfire in the United States.


and



Gun Deaths



Number of deaths from firearms injury -

United Kingdom, 1994 to 2003



Number

1994
341

1995
358

1996
254

1997
201

1998
203

1999
210

2000
204

2001
167

2002
169

2003
163

2,270 total

[SoonerInFla]

..and allowing anyone & everyone access to a firearm is the answer? :rolleyes:

How do firearm-based crime rates compare between the U.S. and countries who ban firearms?

Sure you'd have that period where the bad guys would still have guns, but realistically: comparatively, how often does a good guy with a firearm actually stop a violent crime involving a bad guy with a firearm? Sure we can list a few notable examples but we're talking about .0001% of all instances of violent crime, if THAT much, eliminated by the good guy w/firearm

Countries that ban firearms actually have punishments that make people understand shooting others is unacceptable.

If the majority of the " good guys " carried guns, there would be a lot higher percentage of bad guys shot in the act of these crimes. The average American doesn't haul a gun to work or shopping, unlike the criminals.

[Hamhock]

Hope this helps.


In 2001, the U.S. had approximately 30,000 gun deaths. The U.K. had 2,200 gun deaths....for a decade.


Think about that as hard as you can.


http://www.harvardmagazine.com/on-line/090433.html

http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF07.htm

So, if making something illegal will result in less deaths, it should be made illegal?

[1stTimeCaller]

Hope this helps.


In 2001, the U.S. had approximately 30,000 gun deaths. The U.K. had 2,200 gun deaths....for a decade.


Think about that as hard as you can.


http://www.harvardmagazine.com/on-line/090433.html


http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF07.htm

And your conclusion is?

Why does America have 4.89 times the population that the UK does and has 136.36 times the gun related deaths?

Is it due to our gun culture? The thug culture in innercities? Morons? Are we just more likely to commit crime in the US than folks in the UK are? If we are why is that?

[handcrafted]

A former coworker has this idea:

The government trains every US citizen in the use of handguns, and
upon completing the training, every trained citizen will be issued a handgun.

There would be a series of killings at first, but then people would realize
that at any time, if you act up, you might get shot because you know
everyone is armed.


discuss

:les: SLICKDAWG FOR PRESIDENT!!!!

[handcrafted]

seven.....six.....two...millimeter...full....metal ...jacket....

I AM...IN A WORLD....OF ****

[handcrafted]

you know, I could "almost" agree with that if..........

you would institute a mandatory "death penalty" if you are convicted of using a gun in the commission of a crime.

Prolly lead to an increase sale of baseball bats though.
Invest in Louiseville Slugger now.

Because I'm of the opinion that the death penalty should be mandatory for all murder, I would agree with that.

[handcrafted]

Hope this helps.


In 2001, the U.S. had approximately 30,000 gun deaths. The U.K. had 2,200 gun deaths....for a decade.


Think about that as hard as you can.


http://www.harvardmagazine.com/on-line/090433.html

http://www.gun-control-network.org/GF07.htm

The UK has quite a bit less people in it than the US. Think about that as hard as you can.

[Partial Qualifier]

What will the outlawing of guns accomplish?

It would royally **** you off for starters ;)

I'm just thinking it would be a better solution than arming every single US citizen with a grip, you know?

I don't have some vendetta against guns or gun owners.. the topic was "eliminate crime by arming everyone" and my first thought was "eliminating guns would be a better idea than that" because unfortunately we can't just eliminate the thugs who would shoot innocent peeps for whatever reason.

[1stTimeCaller]

I think legalizing prostitution would lead to a drastic decrease in crime. People would be more relaxed and not nearly as sexually frustrated. And legalize marijuana, everyone would be too busy watching cartoons to go outside and shoot someone.

[XingTheRubicon]

And your conclusion is?

Why does America have 4.89 times the population that the UK does and has 136.36 times the gun related deaths?

Is it due to our gun culture? The thug culture in innercities? Morons? Are we just more likely to commit crime in the US than folks in the UK are? If we are why is that?

Just taking a wild guess that less pistols might be a good thing....and btw, those wankers are violent mf'ers. Go to a Manchester United footer vs anyone, and watch the human race devolve. Their "gooner" squabbles result in a black eye or broken ribs instead of David Caruso spraying luminol.

and to answer your question, my conclusion is that my government doesn't really give a sh*t about gun deaths. We know exactly what other countries do to limit gun deaths, yet this info gets ignored because we want suck that badly compared to the rest of the industrialized nations.

Solution?

Watch what other countries (who don't suck at preventing gun deaths) do during the sentencing phase of a crime that in ANY way involved a hand gun.

[XingTheRubicon]

The UK has quite a bit less people in it than the US. Think about that as hard as you can.


It makes more sense if you got far enough in school to do fractions...

[1stTimeCaller]

I agree 100% with your last sentence. Only in America (Chickasha, OK to be exact) can a person shoot another person twice and get charged with discharging a firearm from a moving vehicle and get 5 years probation.

I love guns. They're fun to go play with. It ****es me off when crap like that happens because it makes all gun owners look bad.

You wanna shoot a stop sign? You get caught you get 2 years in jail. You wanna shoot at other people? 40 year minimum. You shoot at and hit another person? Life.

[Mjcpr]

You wanna shoot a stop sign? You get caught you get 2 years in jail. You wanna shoot at other people? 40 year minimum. You shoot at and hit another person? Life.

Is there an Order of Succession for the Vice-President also?

[1stTimeCaller]

It's a work in progress. Gimme 'till next Tuesday.

[XingTheRubicon]

I love guns. They're fun to go play with. It ****es me off when crap like that happens because it makes all gun owners look bad.


I don't have a problem with U.S. citizens owning guns, I just wish they were taken more seriously, I guess.


and the worst of it is, Jerk is already planning to rob me because he knows I'm not armed. If I see a 18 wheeler coming thru the neighborhood, I'm jumping the back fence.

[Vaevictis]

Keep in mind that if you arm all citizens, you will have armed all the criminals at one point too.

And, I don't know about you guys, but if I'm a criminal in the scenario described, I don't bother with leaving people alive anymore. I shoot them before they can react, then I loot their corpses. It might reduce the *number* of crimes (because not everyone is willing to adopt this attitude), but I expect it will increase the severity of those that continue to occur.

It's good when anyone CAN be armed, but it's bad when everyone IS armed.

[Scott D]

Personally I think sticking all politicians in a building and then napalming that building would go a long way to cutting down crime in this country.

[OUinFLA]

Personally I think sticking all politicians in a building and then napalming that building would go a long way to cutting down crime in this country.

Im voting for you for "dicktater for life" !

:D

[1stTimeCaller]

Im voting for you for "dicktaster for life" !

:D

:eek:

[Hamhock]

It would royally **** you off for starters ;)

I'm just thinking it would be a better solution than arming every single US citizen with a grip, you know?

I don't have some vendetta against guns or gun owners.. the topic was "eliminate crime by arming everyone" and my first thought was "eliminating guns would be a better idea than that" because unfortunately we can't just eliminate the thugs who would shoot innocent peeps for whatever reason.

I actually agree with you. Arming everyone is asinine. Many, many people are too irresponsible to handle a firearm, but aren't evil enough to give the forethought to using one to commit a crime.

However, I honestly can't understand the logic that says if we outlaw guns, gun crimes will go down. None of the statistics provided, pro or con, can quantify the level of deterrence provided to Mr. Thug by not being certain whether a late night visit to my house will be met with a 12 gauge or 3 iron.

Even if the data does support it, that doesn't mean we should outlaw guns rather than deal with the criminal.

[IB4OU2]

Im voting for you for "dicktater for life" !

:D

OK Buckwheat but I don't think he'll like it. ;)

[Partial Qualifier]

I actually agree with you. Arming everyone is asinine. Many, many people are too irresponsible to handle a firearm, but aren't evil enough to give the forethought to using one to commit a crime.

However, I honestly can't understand the logic that says if we outlaw guns, gun crimes will go down. None of the statistics provided, pro or con, can quantify the level of deterrence provided to Mr. Thug by not being certain whether a late night visit to my house will be met with a 12 gauge or 3 iron.

Even if the data does support it, that doesn't mean we should outlaw guns rather than deal with the criminal.

I can't disagree with that at all. Good point.

[Scott D]

:eek:

http://soonerfans.com/forums/images/buttons/report.gif

I expected something a little less 'Stanleyesque' from you.

[Scott D]

OK Buckwheat but I don't think he'll like it. ;)

*cough*Otay*cough* :P

This country would rock under my leadership.

[walkoffsooner]

Personally I think sticking all politicians in a building and then napalming that building would go a long way to cutting down crime in this country.
When I say that kind of stuff they say I'm nuts.But I agree 100%

[Scott D]

When I say that kind of stuff they say I'm nuts.But I agree 100%

I'm a minority...suppossedly being anti-establishment is in my genetic code ;)