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View Full Version : New Orleans folk against the Hornets...



kelloggOUballa
4/15/2006, 01:04 AM
http://hornetsreport.com/HRForums/forumdisplay.php?f=2

I was shocked to see the bitterness on the above message board, but to each his own....

suncoastsooner7
4/15/2006, 08:36 AM
That place is sad. I've read it for awhile now. You should have seen their reaction to the OKC boards opening up, after they banned anyone who they even thought was from Oklahoma. It was to the effect that "Hey you're not allowed to post here but you're not supposed to post anywhere else about the Hornets either. :rolleyes:

They flame the h#%% out of the OKC board. After seeing the way the way they have acted about this I really hope they lose the Hornets whether they stay in OKC or go somewhere else but NO didn't support the team even when they had the population and money to do so.

The fact that they are upset about the team wearing an OKC patch so they could auction their jersies off at a higher price, to bennifit New Orleans, speaks volumes.


:twinkies:

I just wanted to finally use the twinkies. :D

Sooner_Bob
4/15/2006, 09:20 AM
Sounds like a jihad might be in order.

sooner518
4/15/2006, 09:23 AM
they all act like they care so much about the Hornets. It's not like anyone ever went to their games in NO. They're just ****ed that OKC has shown more fan support than they ever have.

Dio
4/15/2006, 09:37 AM
Most of the posters on Hitler Report chose to leave NOLA themselves (pre-Katrina), but insist the team should stay there and play in front of 9200 people a game.

NormanPride
4/15/2006, 09:41 AM
at least those know that Jenni Carlson can't write more than three words stringed together.

Or can she?

I don't know.

What will happen?

This is tough.

Sooner_Bob
4/15/2006, 09:42 AM
Well I got banned after 2 posts . . .

Dio
4/15/2006, 09:47 AM
Well I got banned after 2 posts . . .

That's about right.

Sooner_Bob
4/15/2006, 09:50 AM
Apparently if you don't agree with all of the 15 people who post on there you're the bad guy and might bring some common sense into the place.

King Crimson
4/15/2006, 10:03 AM
i love how they are nostalgic for the New Orleans Jazz....the other NBA team they lost.

the_ouskull
4/15/2006, 10:27 AM
I'm pretty sure that I could get banned without even posting, but I'd give it one post, tops. I say screw those delusional freaks... but that's just me.

the_ouskull

walkoffsooner
4/15/2006, 10:57 AM
okc has proved they can support a team short term, maybe long we will get a team someday.Be proud that we done our part and supported the team so that we will be considered in the future.

Soonerus
4/15/2006, 11:05 AM
Did they get computer connections back in New Orleans already ?? A bunch of bitter/scapegoat seeking fans....

King Crimson
4/15/2006, 11:17 AM
okc has proved they can support a team short term, maybe long we will get a team someday.Be proud that we done our part and supported the team so that we will be considered in the future.

i have to agree with the other posters in this thread. those people are pathetic (though they DO realize the Daily Oklahoman is terrible)...what a bunch of pillow biters. how much more bitter can these people be? to the point they pull against the Hornets playing playoff games in OKC....the team they want back? pitiful.

Soonerus
4/15/2006, 02:24 PM
I have registered on their Board to see how long I last....

OU Adonis
4/15/2006, 02:32 PM
I am actually on that site and haven't got banned yet.. but I have actually been pretty nice heh

Soonerus
4/15/2006, 02:33 PM
I am always nice so...not a problem....

jacru
4/15/2006, 05:14 PM
they're like a child that all of a sudden can't live without a toy they didn't want until another child showed an interest in it.
If they get the Hornets back they won't support them long, if ever.

Soonerus
4/15/2006, 05:54 PM
They are absolutely nuts...last night they had a game thread where most posters were openly rooting against the Hornets and relishing in the fact the Hornets appear to be out of the playoffs...weird "fans"

Cam
4/15/2006, 06:09 PM
Those are some very bitter individuals over there.

Looked like there were maybe 10 people who posted on the board.

sitzpinkler
4/15/2006, 07:11 PM
They are absolutely nuts...last night they had a game thread where most posters were openly rooting against the Hornets and relishing in the fact the Hornets appear to be out of the playoffs...weird "fans"


Yeah, they're ****ed because the Hornets wore jerseys that had Oklahoma City on them instead of New Orleans, which is about as pathetic and petty as you can get as a sports fan.

I can understand them having worries about the Hornets not returning, but to root against them because they wore our city name is completely ridiculous.

The whole reason for the Oklahoma City jersey was to show appreciation for the outstanding support we've shown the team all season long, support they never recieved in New Orleans.

I'm not surprised though. That town is full of the most spiteful, arrogant and blatantly ****ty people I've ever had the displeasure of crossing paths with. The behavior displayed on that message board is pretty typical of the locals in NO, except in person they are much, much worse.

Flagstaffsooner
4/15/2006, 07:56 PM
Hey France, what is your return policy on cities? We still have the reciept.

LSUdeek
4/15/2006, 11:32 PM
wow, listen to all of the ****ing bitching on here about "did no get their computer connections back already" and "returning cities back to france" and such. reminds me of this board after the sugar bowl.

God guys! The franchise is being stolen away because of a terrible natural disaster. We have a right to be upset down here.

i love this board and OU but cmon guys. no reason for the kind of smack that you are laying down. from our point of view a team is getting stolen away out from under us. it almost happened with the saints / san antonio...

Big Red Ron
4/16/2006, 12:21 AM
wow, listen to all of the ****ing bitching on here about "did no get their computer connections back already" and "returning cities back to france" and such. reminds me of this board after the sugar bowl.

God guys! The franchise is being stolen away because of a terrible natural disaster. We have a right to be upset down here.

i love this board and OU but cmon guys. no reason for the kind of smack that you are laying down. from our point of view a team is getting stolen away out from under us. it almost happened with the saints / san antonio...Reality is often a fickle whore. Face it, don't you think George Shinn was more than a little disapointed after he moved the team from Charlotte to NO? The lack of Corp. support was pathetic there. He makes quite a bit more money per game in OKC than even compared to the "honeymoon" in NO. The team isn't being stolen away because of a terrible disaster. It was just a matter of time. It has to suck but you have the Aints.

stoopified
4/16/2006, 02:31 PM
they're like a child that all of a sudden can't live without a toy they didn't want until another child showed an interest in it.
If they get the Hornets back they won't support them long, if ever.
Bingo!

kelloggOUballa
4/16/2006, 02:53 PM
LSU, tell your friends to stop cheering against "their" team if they want them back. That is what's pathetic.

badger
4/16/2006, 09:21 PM
Hey, Oklahoma has been far more concerned about the Katrina disaster than most states. We had refuges here, we showed them hospitality and compassion and some of them are still here.

One of our senators tried to get earmarked funds redirected to aid Katrina. We have been donating to help rebuild Katrina through Hornets fundraisers. Our National Guard and soldiers stationed and living here in Oklahoma were some of the first to respond to the disaster.

We have given a lot to the Gulf Coast, and there isn't any place more deserving of the Hornets "on leave from New Orleans" than Oklahoma City. We've had our own disasters. We've seen what happens when natual disasters hit home - we've seen what happens when major buildings get destroyed.

We've seen the Hornets and we like them. We like them so much it would be a harsh move to send them to someplace with a worse situation. If New Orleans really wants them back, they should show it through fan support and working to rebuild facilities and offices, all of which we offer the Hornets here.

SOFSooner
4/17/2006, 08:34 AM
I don't see why the New Orleans people are so upset. You did not see the people from Charlotte write nasty things about New Orleans when the Hornets moved there.

Total_Ignorance_Hour
4/17/2006, 10:09 AM
I think Katrina may have hastened what was inevitable. The New Orleans market (43rd largest) had about the same number of people as the Oklahoma City market (45th largest) before Katrina. In fact, it was the smallest market supporting 2 professional franchises. Within a few years, New Orleans should be able to adequately support one professional franchise, which is what it was capable of pre-Katrina. Oklahoma City is similar, enough people and money to support one, but no more than one franchise.

Pricetag
4/17/2006, 05:12 PM
they're like a child that all of a sudden can't live without a toy they didn't want until another child showed an interest in it.
If they get the Hornets back they won't support them long, if ever.
Conversely, Oklahoma City is acting like a kid who had a toy loaned to him/her and is now trying to claim ownership of said toy under bogard rules.

IMO, Oklahoma City folks have no one but themselves (and Shinn, but they didn't have to swallow the heaping helpings of BS he was offering) to blame for what they're feeling right now.

It seemed pretty clear what was going to happen when this thing was first announced. Oklahoma City was going to have the team on a temporary basis, and they graciously accepted the opportunity to demonstrate that they could support a pro franchise. I don't think anyone can dispute the fact that they have shown themselves worthy.

Attitudes changed fairly quickly after they got a taste, though. I believe it has just as much to do with egos and being able to call Oklahoma City a "major league city" as it has to do with the ability of New Orleans to support the team, should they go back.

Some of you folks are cracking on the New Orleans folks over at the other board for rooting against the Hornets the other night, but I've read/heard plenty of smug satisfaction at the attendance figures from the games played there.

This is a sucky situation, but in the end, it is never right to accept something from someone on a temporary basis and then to decide that you would be a better owner than them and you won't be giving it back after all.

Soonerus
4/17/2006, 09:38 PM
Back-swamp punks banned me from their Board for some even debate...They are bitter, bitter, bitter...to the point I think they hate themselves...

Sooner_Bob
4/17/2006, 09:54 PM
Conversely, Oklahoma City is acting like a kid who had a toy loaned to him/her and is now trying to claim ownership of said toy under bogard rules.

IMO, Oklahoma City folks have no one but themselves (and Shinn, but they didn't have to swallow the heaping helpings of BS he was offering) to blame for what they're feeling right now.

It seemed pretty clear what was going to happen when this thing was first announced. Oklahoma City was going to have the team on a temporary basis, and they graciously accepted the opportunity to demonstrate that they could support a pro franchise. I don't think anyone can dispute the fact that they have shown themselves worthy.

Attitudes changed fairly quickly after they got a taste, though. I believe it has just as much to do with egos and being able to call Oklahoma City a "major league city" as it has to do with the ability of New Orleans to support the team, should they go back.

Some of you folks are cracking on the New Orleans folks over at the other board for rooting against the Hornets the other night, but I've read/heard plenty of smug satisfaction at the attendance figures from the games played there.

This is a sucky situation, but in the end, it is never right to accept something from someone on a temporary basis and then to decide that you would be a better owner than them and you won't be giving it back after all.



I completely see where you're coming from, but don't you think rooting against "your" team and OKC folks discussing the poor attendance at games down there just a tad bit different?

Basketball is the last thing on the people of NOLA's mind right now (well except for the few folks on that board) they should be worried about rebuilding their city rather than an NBA team.

Once the city is ready then maybe things can get back to normal for them.

Big Red Ron
4/17/2006, 10:34 PM
This is a sucky situation, but in the end, it is never right to accept something from someone on a temporary basis and then to decide that you would be a better owner than them and you won't be giving it back after all.I agree but we don't really get to decide. Only George Shinn can.

Soonerus
4/17/2006, 10:39 PM
They are back-swamp rookies...very slow board, more mods than users, the slighest hint of dissent you are banned...they don't realize most of us have 4 or 5 IP addresses....geez...

Soonerus
4/17/2006, 10:41 PM
btw, they claim the Hornets have an OKC board, do they ? or are they paranoid and confused as usual...

suncoastsooner7
4/17/2006, 11:08 PM
btw, they claim the Hornets have an OKC board, do they ? or are they paranoid and confused as usual...


http://www.okchornetscentral.com/forum/index.php

soonerguild
4/17/2006, 11:11 PM
Everyone acts like we are stealing the hornets from NO. That is ridiculous. They conducted a search and chose to come to oklahoma city. Then we out drew NO and showed signs of doing it for a long time. That is not our fault. If they were so concerned about the hornets than why weren't they showing up. sure the circumstances arent the most ideal, but you have to think that shinn would have ended up leaving NO anyway, he was losing a ton of money every year.

Ive heard from many friends of mine from the area that as a whole the saints are their team anyway. they never cared about the hornets, I don't know why they do know. Youd think that the people from NO would be more concearned about rebuilding on of the most tradition and culture rich cities in the world than getting back a bball team. They have so many more important things to worry about getting back that the hornets. It could be just me.

Half a Hundred
4/18/2006, 03:26 AM
Everyone acts like we are stealing the hornets from NO. That is ridiculous. They conducted a search and chose to come to oklahoma city. Then we out drew NO and showed signs of doing it for a long time. That is not our fault. If they were so concerned about the hornets than why weren't they showing up. sure the circumstances arent the most ideal, but you have to think that shinn would have ended up leaving NO anyway, he was losing a ton of money every year.

Ive heard from many friends of mine from the area that as a whole the saints are their team anyway. they never cared about the hornets, I don't know why they do know. Youd think that the people from NO would be more concearned about rebuilding on of the most tradition and culture rich cities in the world than getting back a bball team. They have so many more important things to worry about getting back that the hornets. It could be just me.

Some people just like to bitch.

Sooner in Tampa
4/18/2006, 07:16 AM
I think that the board is a microcosim of NOLA.

SOONER44EVER
4/18/2006, 07:26 AM
http://hornetsreport.com/HRForums/forumdisplay.php?f=2

I was shocked to see the bitterness on the above message board, but to each his own....
If you went to the Sugar Bowl a few years ago nothing those people do should shock you.

TheUnnamedSooner
4/18/2006, 08:16 AM
How would we react if our beloved Sooners moved to a different state b/c of a disaster and ended up wearing that city on their jersey? We would be ****ed too. I'm not condoning what they are doing, i'm just sayin...

Pricetag
4/18/2006, 08:28 AM
I completely see where you're coming from, but don't you think rooting against "your" team and OKC folks discussing the poor attendance at games down there just a tad bit different?

Not really. Both are cheap shots largely motivated by bitterness over the prospect of losing this team. It isn't that the poor attendance has been discussed, it's the manner in which it has been discussed. I expected to see a "Superior Dance," ala the Church Lady, or something along those lines.

Total_Ignorance_Hour
4/18/2006, 08:41 AM
How would we react if our beloved Sooners moved to a different state b/c of a disaster and ended up wearing that city on their jersey? We would be ****ed too. I'm not condoning what they are doing, i'm just sayin...

The Sooner Athletic Department is owned by the people of Oklahoma, not a private individual as the Hornets are. It is a public university. So that makes it different.

The Sooners have deep roots in Oklahoma; the Hornets haven't been in New Orleans long at all. Again, different.

If a disaster caused the Sooners to move for a year or two, I wouldn't have a problem with patches acknowledging that city for hosting the Sooners. I wouldn't have a problem if they wore the city name on their jerseys one time. I'd appreciate the city for cheering on the Sooners while we were unable to do so.

The bottom line is the Hornets are moving back as an act of good will to the New Orleans area. Nationally, public perception with the NBA would be poor if the Gulf lost its team because of Katrina. But at some point down the road, someone is going to have to move out of New Orleans; the market will require it.

LSUdeek
4/18/2006, 09:56 AM
i was ****ed off at the time making that post (new baby, no sleep) but pricetag has it down 100%. as for the rest of you, i can see why hornets fans cracking on their own team down here might look bad but it's really animosity directed at shinn for taking a team away that we had grown to love. there's a lot of hard feelings down here because of the relatively exciting season the hornets had and chris paul, etc.

yes, we have other things to worry about but sports teams and attending events helps us keep our minds off of losing our homes and livelihood. my cousin was executive secretary to a mr. george shinn last spring before she had her baby and they lost everything in the Lakeview subdivision of Metairie.

i still maintain that hurricane smack is lame and juvenile and is uncalled for. sadly it's allowed to continue to go on.

Jimminy Crimson
4/18/2006, 12:58 PM
How would we react if our beloved Sooners moved to a different state b/c of a disaster and ended up wearing that city on their jersey? We would be ****ed too. I'm not condoning what they are doing, i'm just sayin...

It would be more like if the Charlotte Hornets moved here recently and we didn't support them at all, and then a storm came through wiping out everything in town and it was a better business decision to move them elsewhere.

Oh wait, that's exactly what happened! :texan:

I think the Saints should stay though.

SicEmBaylor
4/18/2006, 01:08 PM
**Edited on Account of it being Tuesday**

TheUnnamedSooner
4/18/2006, 02:12 PM
Does Tuesday's not apply over here in basketball land? Maybe this is the loophole I have been looking for :)

SicEmBaylor
4/18/2006, 02:17 PM
Does Tuesday's not apply over here in basketball land? Maybe this is the loophole I have been looking for :)

Oh damn. I'll edit and re-post when appropriate. :D

SoonerBBall
4/18/2006, 03:10 PM
i was ****ed off at the time making that post (new baby, no sleep) but pricetag has it down 100%. as for the rest of you, i can see why hornets fans cracking on their own team down here might look bad but it's really animosity directed at shinn for taking a team away that we had grown to love. there's a lot of hard feelings down here because of the relatively exciting season the hornets had and chris paul, etc.

yes, we have other things to worry about but sports teams and attending events helps us keep our minds off of losing our homes and livelihood. my cousin was executive secretary to a mr. george shinn last spring before she had her baby and they lost everything in the Lakeview subdivision of Metairie.

i still maintain that hurricane smack is lame and juvenile and is uncalled for. sadly it's allowed to continue to go on.

First off, if NO had grown to love the Hornets so much then why did they only draw a league last attendance average of 14,221? And that was on ticket sales. Actual asses in seats were only 9,200 per game. Don't believe me?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/news/story?id=2065632&CMP=OTC-DT9705204233

Second off, the relatively exciting season you are talking about occured BECAUSE the Hornets were in Oklahoma, not in spite of it. Every player that was interviewed said the huge, raucous crowd. Byron Scott said the crowd consistently impressed him in every interview he gave. The Hornets did well because OKC made them feel like they had a real home, which is something NO never did.

And don't try to pull that "it is weak to bag on NO because they got hit by Katrina" **** on me. Almost my entire family lives in or around NO and I lived there for a while. Also, we in OK know a little bit about disaster, so you can take your holier-than-thou attitude and get the **** out.

Collier11
4/18/2006, 03:21 PM
I have no problem with the Hornets fans being sensitive, that is to be expected, but in no way, shape, or form should they hold any anomosity towards the people of Oklahoma. We have done nothing but be genuine and give this team and might I add, plenty of people from the state a place to live. Did they expect us to be bad hosts? IF we have been better at supporting their team than they have been, the they need to take that as a challenge to keep that team in New Olreans and not a knock by us

Big Red Ron
4/18/2006, 04:00 PM
If Oklahomans weren't such awsome fans, George Shinn wouldn't even be thinking about moving permenantly.

Imagine how sick Shinn will be if he has to go back to N.O. and we get the Sonics or Trailbazers...

Sooner_Bob
4/18/2006, 05:35 PM
Not really. Both are cheap shots largely motivated by bitterness over the prospect of losing this team. It isn't that the poor attendance has been discussed, it's the manner in which it has been discussed. I expected to see a "Superior Dance," ala the Church Lady, or something along those lines.


The manner on here or the OKC Hornets board?

badger
4/18/2006, 10:27 PM
at this rate, can we just send NO the Sonics or Trailblazers? I mean, they want an NBA team, we want an NBA team, let's just give them a team and we'll both be happy!

Oh, and a few name changes:

Utah can be the Trailblazers (because they all did a "trail" thing themselves when trying to find a land to settle in back when Mormons were shunned)

Oklahoma City can be the Hornets (because we've already got them here)

New Orleans can be the Jazz (because that's what they were originally)

the Supersonics can do whatever, because they suck and nobody wants them (apparently)

Big Red Ron
4/18/2006, 10:38 PM
You think the owners of the Sonics or Blazers are crazy enough to go to NO?

badger
4/18/2006, 10:39 PM
hmmm... NO.

:D the word, the not the abbrev.

Dio
4/19/2006, 09:43 AM
How would we react if our beloved Sooners moved to a different state b/c of a disaster and ended up wearing that city on their jersey? We would be ****ed too. I'm not condoning what they are doing, i'm just sayin...

Honestly, in terms of fan support and time the Hornets spent in NOLA, it would be more like losing the OU hockey team.

Pricetag
4/19/2006, 10:54 AM
No amount of rationalization about what was going on in New Orleans before the hurricane will make it okay for OKC to feel justified in keeping the team. The fact of the matter is that if it hadn't happened, they'd still be playing in New Orleans. It is their team. Everyone knew the premise of this situation going in, and the only way a wrong will happen to a city or fans is if the team stays in OKC. The number of folks wronged is inconsequential.

I can sympathize with the OKC fans. This was a Catch 22 for you guys. The only way to avoid hurt feelings when the team went back to New Orleans would have been to not get attached, but the only way to prove that you could support an NBA franchise was to sell out and get attached in the face of certain disappointment. It was a noble and determined effort, and something you should be proud of.

So take the high road on this one. If you're as great Oklahoma City and NBA fans as you have demonstrated to this point, you'll be ready to get behind the next team that comes in--Oklahoma City's team.

LSUdeek
4/19/2006, 11:03 AM
And don't try to pull that "it is weak to bag on NO because they got hit by Katrina" **** on me. Almost my entire family lives in or around NO and I lived there for a while. Also, we in OK know a little bit about disaster, so you can take your holier-than-thou attitude and get the **** out.

case in point.

Jimminy Crimson
4/19/2006, 11:53 AM
New Orleans has failed with their three attempts at professional basketball.

Simple. As. That.

LSUdeek
4/19/2006, 02:07 PM
New Orleans has failed with their three attempts at professional basketball.

Simple. As. That.

yeah, darn that katrina for causing us to fail.

these one word sentences seem to be a staple of this board. like they would end the discussion or something.

SoonerBBall
4/19/2006, 02:21 PM
case in point.

You don't get to talk disaster smack on an Oklahoma message board on April 19th. You're high and mighty bull**** is wearing pretty thin, too.

Jimminy Crimson
4/19/2006, 02:22 PM
yeah, darn that katrina for causing us to fail.

these one word sentences seem to be a staple of this board. like they would end the discussion or something.

Kat had nothing to do with it. The city and state, prior to the storm were pretty much in breach of the infamous 'contract' that the nazi.com folk like to talk about so much. No practice facility, scoreboard, etc, etc that were promised by the city, state, Dome&Arena board, and whatever other entities. Rock bottom as far as ticket sales went. No excuses.

Also, Kat didn't have anything to do with the Buccaneers/Pros or Jazz leaving town. As much as people don't want to face it, the team was heading out of New Orleans within the next 3 years before the storm.

At this point, it is just a business decision. Go someplace where a profit can be turned or stay and continue to decline.

SoonerBBall
4/19/2006, 02:23 PM
So take the high road on this one. If you're as great Oklahoma City and NBA fans as you have demonstrated to this point, you'll be ready to get behind the next team that comes in--Oklahoma City's team.

I still don't understand why it is OKC that has to take the high road and give up a very successful franchise.

Why can't NO take the high road and let go of a team that they never truly supported and that will most certainly lose money and move on anyways?

LSUdeek
4/19/2006, 02:27 PM
You don't get to talk disaster smack on an Oklahoma message board on April 19th. You're high and mighty bull**** is wearing pretty thin, too.

listen a.s.shole. i am not referring to or talking about anything that happened to your state, least of all the events of april 19 1995. i was referring to the juvenile paragraph you had previously posted as an example of the juvenile behavior i was discussing.

Jimminy Crimson
4/19/2006, 02:28 PM
New Orleans "looted" the team from Charlotte, anyways! ;)

LSUdeek
4/19/2006, 02:29 PM
Kat had nothing to do with it. The city and state, prior to the storm were pretty much in breach of the infamous 'contract' that the nazi.com folk like to talk about so much. No practice facility, scoreboard, etc, etc that were promised by the city, state, Dome&Arena board, and whatever other entities. Rock bottom as far as ticket sales went. No excuses.

Also, Kat didn't have anything to do with the Buccaneers/Pros or Jazz leaving town. As much as people don't want to face it, the team was heading out of New Orleans within the next 3 years before the storm.

At this point, it is just a business decision. Go someplace where a profit can be turned or stay and continue to decline.

now this is an example of coherent discussion. thank you. i feel that all of those promises will be met here in the next few years by the new new orleans administration provided nagin doesn't get reelected.

SoonerBBall
4/19/2006, 02:41 PM
listen a.s.shole. i am not referring to or talking about anything that happened to your state, least of all the events of april 19 1995. i was referring to the juvenile paragraph you had previously posted as an example of the juvenile behavior i was discussing.

Because I called you out as a whiner? You are playing the same card that is historically played when something bad happens to someone, and it is a silly game. You want to get into a "my disaster makes me more worthy of pity" fight, and I'm not going to play. My former residency in NO and my family there give me plenty of connections to the area to talk about how Kat affected my life, but I'm not going to do it. In the same way, I'm not going to play the OKC bombing card in a debate that has nothing to do with it.

My original post had 2 very valid points that you haven't come close to refuting, so until you do, you are just another crybaby from NO that wants continued sympathy for your plight and no back talk from those who didn't "experience" it.

C&CDean
4/19/2006, 02:42 PM
Deek,

Watch your step. It is April 19, you are a filthy tigahbaytah, the city of New Orleans pretty much blows, and you don't call people names on the bbs.

Total_Ignorance_Hour
4/19/2006, 02:43 PM
No amount of rationalization about what was going on in New Orleans before the hurricane will make it okay for OKC to feel justified in keeping the team. The fact of the matter is that if it hadn't happened, they'd still be playing in New Orleans. It is their team. Everyone knew the premise of this situation going in, and the only way a wrong will happen to a city or fans is if the team stays in OKC. The number of folks wronged is inconsequential.

I can sympathize with the OKC fans. This was a Catch 22 for you guys. The only way to avoid hurt feelings when the team went back to New Orleans would have been to not get attached, but the only way to prove that you could support an NBA franchise was to sell out and get attached in the face of certain disappointment. It was a noble and determined effort, and something you should be proud of.

So take the high road on this one. If you're as great Oklahoma City and NBA fans as you have demonstrated to this point, you'll be ready to get behind the next team that comes in--Oklahoma City's team.

I still don't like the "It is their team" statement. I understand your sentiments, and the Hornets will return as a matter of the NBA not wanting the perception that Katrina caused NO to lose 'their' team. But teams move all the time and this is all a matter of what market will make a team most profitable. I can't buy that New Orleans can be the best market location for TWO professional teams.

SoonerBBall
4/19/2006, 02:43 PM
now this is an example of coherent discussion. thank you. i feel that all of those promises will be met here in the next few years by the new new orleans administration provided nagin doesn't get reelected.
With what money? How in the world are they going to provide those things when the money needs to be used for much more important things, including reinforcing defenses against other hurricanes? If NO didn't want to pony up for the stuff until a lawsuit was brought against them, what will make them do it now?

Total_Ignorance_Hour
4/19/2006, 02:47 PM
With what money?

Probably Uncle Sam's.

LSUdeek
4/19/2006, 02:58 PM
With what money? How in the world are they going to provide those things when the money needs to be used for much more important things, including reinforcing defenses against other hurricanes? If NO didn't want to pony up for the stuff until a lawsuit was brought against them, what will make them do it now?

the city will soon be led by new leadership and the corporations will get involved. the levee boards had plenty of money to handle this except they wasted it.

LSUdeek
4/19/2006, 02:59 PM
Deek,

Watch your step. It is April 19, you are a filthy tigahbaytah, the city of New Orleans pretty much blows, and you don't call people names on the bbs.

fair enough. i disputed his accusation that i was making mcveigh smack... and i'm ****ed.

SoonerBBall
4/19/2006, 03:19 PM
fair enough. i disputed his accusation that i was making mcveigh smack... and i'm ****ed.
First off, I never said anything about McVeigh. I said you were pulling the "weak to ditch on disaster areas" card on an Oklahoma message board. Then when I made a perfectly reasonable reply about how Oklahomans were also affected by Katrina, you came back with a trite, back-handed reply....on April 19th. Learn2read.

Second, your city has new management. Big ****ing deal. Management may get a pretty new scoreboard and practice facility put in, but that doesn't solve the more immediate problem. Namely, when your city was not hurricane ravaged, it could only put 9,200 asses in seats at a Hornet's game. Now your city is out (conservatively) half its population and you think that you can miracle enough people into the place to keep the franchise in your city anyways?

NO people are delusional. They are desperately trying to hold onto thier past without regard to the future of either the city or the franchise. Nobody benefits if the Hornets go back to NO, except for (again, conservatively) 9,200 fans a game that originally supported the team, and it is highly improbably that all of those fans are still in NO.

You claim to love the Hornets, but you don't want what is best for them. You want them to come back to NO and die slowly there until they are forced to leave like every other NBA team that has ever been in NO instead of seeing them prosper in a place that actually wants them there and will support them. You can be mad at the OKC people all you want, but you guys are just being selfish, immature, and strikingly divorced from reality.

jacru
4/19/2006, 04:56 PM
Probably Uncle Sam's.
Bingo! only it ain't Uncle Sam's. He just gets to redistribute it. It's John Q. Public's forced contributions via the IRS.(did you send your contribution on Monday?)

NormanPride
4/19/2006, 05:25 PM
I don't understand this deal about us acting like a kid who doesn't want to give a toy back... It's not ours or NO's toy to begin with. The Hornets are a business, and as such will move where their business does the best. There was little fan support before Katrina, there will be little fan support after Katrina. There was no money before Katrina, there will be even less afterwards. If NO thinks "new management" will magically fix all their problems, they're delusional. "New Management" doesn't fix poor attendance, corporate sponsorship, and federal funding.

Also, doesn't the LA government already owe the Saints a ridiculous amount of money? How are they going to pay off the Saints, fix the city up, and keep the Hornets around? For a city that could barely keep its pants up BEFORE a hurricane, this seems like a really tall order.

Dio
4/19/2006, 05:55 PM
After the May 8th tornado, Motel 6 didn't rebuild in Moore. Cracker Barrel hasn't rebuilt in Midwest City- hell, Integris choose not to rebuild Stroud's hospital after it got leveled by the May 3 tornado. Businesses who have been disrupted by disaster have always been able to re-evaluate whether they want to continue doing business in a given location after it's been wiped out. And guess what? The NBA is a business.

And I'm sure all those businesses had some kind of iron-clad LEASE they had to pay their way out of, too.

Total_Ignorance_Hour
4/19/2006, 06:13 PM
Bingo! only it ain't Uncle Sam's. He just gets to redistribute it. It's John Q. Public's forced contributions via the IRS.(did you send your contribution on Monday?)

Yes sir. I got a good slug in the teeth. As Mark Twain said, no man's liberty or property are secure when the legislature is in session.

badger
4/19/2006, 06:55 PM
Deek,

Chill, man. Oklahoma City has had it tough, New Orleans has had it tough. It is the 11th anniversary of our disaster up here.

If you ever need encouragement, just think of New Orleans on Jan. 4, 2004, but don't remind us what happened in Oklahoma City on April 19, 1995. I think we know better what happened here, just like I'm sure you remember that fateful January day in New Orleans better than any of us will ever claim to.

So anyway, we Sooners welcome fans of all schools, but please show respect for our history as long as you're here.

sitzpinkler
4/19/2006, 07:24 PM
yeah, darn that katrina for causing us to fail.

these one word sentences seem to be a staple of this board. like they would end the discussion or something.


Katrina wasn't the reason your attendance sucked *** for two years and was at the bottom of the league

birddog
4/19/2006, 08:00 PM
listen a.s.shole. i am not referring to or talking about anything that happened to your state, least of all the events of april 19 1995. i was referring to the juvenile paragraph you had previously posted as an example of the juvenile behavior i was discussing.
leave dude. no one calls an ou brother an a-hole unless it's me.

Soonerus
4/19/2006, 09:10 PM
I got banned from the NO Hornets board for much less tha Deek's comments...he should be banned....

LSUdeek
4/19/2006, 09:21 PM
it was a mistake for me to even post in this thread. i apologize.

C&CDean
4/19/2006, 09:22 PM
I got banned from the NO Hornets board for much less tha Deek's comments...he should be banned....

That's because they're insufferable, intolerant, illegitimate *******s. We're not. Why should we be like them? Deek ****ed up. He's made it good. Good enough for me.

Soonerus
4/19/2006, 09:26 PM
I am just pi____ off for being treated so unfairly....

badger
4/19/2006, 11:51 PM
it was a mistake for me to even post in this thread. i apologize.

it probably was... but hey, football's right around the corner. you're gonna get angry with oklahoma eventually for keeping your tigers away from another crystal trophy. it might as well be now.

SOONER44EVER
4/20/2006, 02:34 AM
New Orleans' team was the Jazz not the Hornets. Why did the Jazz leave? Poor attendance? How many chances will NO get to show they can't/won't support an NBA team?

Jason White's Third Knee
4/20/2006, 09:14 AM
What's a Hornet? I am gonna guess it's ut's softball team.

Pricetag
4/20/2006, 09:18 AM
no wonder you're arguing against OKC, you're from Tulsa, jealous much?
I figured I'd see something like this, but in a post. Kudos to all who have refrained from resorting to it.

I've said it before in these discussions, I have no delusions about Tulsa ever having a major pro franchise. If it was going to happen, it was going to happen in Oklahoma City. It's been good for the entire state.

I just have a moral problem with the idea of agreeing to temporarily host the Hornets until New Orleans can get back on its feet and then feeling entitled to keep the team forever after a single season of outstanding support.

SoonerBBall
4/20/2006, 11:00 AM
I figured I'd see something like this, but in a post. Kudos to all who have refrained from resorting to it.

I've said it before in these discussions, I have no delusions about Tulsa ever having a major pro franchise. If it was going to happen, it was going to happen in Oklahoma City. It's been good for the entire state.

I just have a moral problem with the idea of agreeing to temporarily host the Hornets until New Orleans can get back on its feet and then feeling entitled to keep the team forever after a single season of outstanding support.

Pricetag, I'm not trying to be condescending, but have you been watching the news or reading about the situation in NO at all? More than half the population of NO has STILL not returned to the city. A lot of the areas hit very hard by Katrina are still in shambles and clean-up hasn't started yet.

Most of the experts that talk about NO say that there is an overwhelming possiblility that NO will NEVER return to the city it used to be, especially in regards to size. They all agree that, even were the unlikely to happen, that it would take the city at least a decade to return to its former size.

All of that means that all the experts agree that it will take a long, long time for NO to "get back on its feet", if it ever does at all.

The people of NO are still very hurt and angry, and a lot of them are still in denial about the fact that their way of life before Katrina is gone forever. They are clinging to the things that keep them in the past, whether it is good for them or not. Think really hard about it. Would it really be a good thing for the people of NO to send the Hornets back, only to have them fail AGAIN and leave in the 2 years while NO is still rebuilding itself? Hell no. That would just create even more resentment and anger on both sides. It is actually in everyone's best interest to keep the team in OKC. In fact, I think it is wrong to burden a still rebuilding community with a franchise they couldn't support in their heyday, and can't possibly support now. At the same time I think it is wrong to force a business that has found a perfect home (in a capitalist society, I might add) back into ruin for the sake of giving people a false sense of security about their situation after a disaster. Finally, I think it is wrong to punish the people of OKC for being the fans that the people in NO never were and never tried to be before the Hornets moved.

Boarder
4/20/2006, 11:47 AM
We (meaning season ticket holders for the Hornets in OKC) knew what we were getting into when we bought the tickets. They were here for one year. Maybe two.

Now, a lot of people are acting exactly as has been said here. In a desperate attempt to keep the team here, they start running down New Orleans. I hate New Orleans as much or more than anyone. I'd never have gone back regardless of what disaster came there.

But, that disaster did happen. And that changes everything. Whether or not they fail when they go back, having them go back is the right thing to do. That is, if NO wants them back. The option should be thiers, not ours. Doesn't matter if we give them triple the attendance. Doesn't matter if every ticket holder gets a Hugo tattoo. We are just babysitting them.

You just don't treat people or things (cities) the same way after a disaster strikes. That's the way it is.

I hope they stay and I'll continue to buy season tickets. But, if they're taken away from NO by force, that's not the right thing to do. Maybe not financially, but morally.

Boarder
4/20/2006, 11:51 AM
Most of the experts that talk about NO say that there is an overwhelming possiblility that NO will NEVER return to the city it used to be, especially in regards to size. They all agree that, even were the unlikely to happen, that it would take the city at least a decade to return to its former size.

All of that means that all the experts agree that it will take a long, long time for NO to "get back on its feet", if it ever does at all.



Let's say...
you drive everywhere. Drive all the time. One day, you have an accident and break both your legs. It takes a few months, but you are able to drive with your hands. Not as well as with your legs, but you can get around. You go to get a drivers liscense and are denied. They tell you you aren't able to do it and it'd be better for you if your driving priveleges are taken away. How would you feel?

SoonerBBall
4/20/2006, 11:55 AM
We (meaning season ticket holders for the Hornets in OKC) knew what we were getting into when we bought the tickets. They were here for one year. Maybe two.

Now, a lot of people are acting exactly as has been said here. In a desperate attempt to keep the team here, they start running down New Orleans. I hate New Orleans as much or more than anyone. I'd never have gone back regardless of what disaster came there.

But, that disaster did happen. And that changes everything. Whether or not they fail when they go back, having them go back is the right thing to do. That is, if NO wants them back. The option should be thiers, not ours. Doesn't matter if we give them triple the attendance. Doesn't matter if every ticket holder gets a Hugo tattoo. We are just babysitting them.

You just don't treat people or things (cities) the same way after a disaster strikes. That's the way it is.

I hope they stay and I'll continue to buy season tickets. But, if they're taken away from NO by force, that's not the right thing to do. Maybe not financially, but morally.

You honestly think that is the best thing for NO? For them to waste money needed elsewhere on a team they didn't support before the disaster? For them to give the people of NO a false hope that the Hornets are there to stay this time?

To put this in perspective, I haven't attended a single Hornets game, I have watched one on TV at a bar, and I've listened to the end of two games on my way home from work. I have absolutely nothing invested in the Hornets. OU and college basketball is where my heart is. Looking at this problem specifically from a "what is best for NO, OKC, and the people involved" perspective, sending the Hornets back to NO before NO could possibly be ready for them would be wrong in nearly every way.

I ask once again, should we send the Hornets back to NO for no better reason then to make NO feel good about itself for a very short time before the Hornets are forced to leave again? That seems a little more than ridiculous to me.

Boarder
4/20/2006, 12:00 PM
You honestly think that is the best thing for NO? For them to waste money needed elsewhere on a team they didn't support before the disaster? For them to give the people of NO a false hope that the Hornets are there to stay this time?

Doesn't matter. It's not our call. It's thiers. Who wants anyone telling them what they can and can't do? Who on Earth are we to tell them what they can or can't do?


I ask once again, should we send the Hornets back to NO for no better reason then to make NO feel good about itself for a very short time before the Hornets are forced to leave again?

Yes. If they go back and fail, it's thier (NO) own fault, not anyone else's. They may blame someone else, but will have no reason to. They did attend the game in New Orleans Arena pretty well. They may very well fail, but the deserve a shot, if wanted.

They could opt out of it and give up, but have too much pride to do that. I'm sure they want to show they are back. Whether they are or not. And really, how could you blame them?

SoonerBBall
4/20/2006, 12:01 PM
Let's say...
you drive everywhere. Drive all the time. One day, you have an accident and break both your legs. It takes a few months, but you are able to drive with your hands. Not as well as with your legs, but you can get around. You go to get a drivers liscense and are denied. They tell you you aren't able to do it and it'd be better for you if your driving priveleges are taken away. How would you feel?

It would **** me off. Big time. But that isn't the point. The point is whether or not the DMV was correct denying me the license. If they had good reason (such as me being a danger to myself or others) then whether I'm ****ed or not, it was a good thing for me to not be able to drive any longer. If I was still able to drive well enough to not be dangerous, then they would be wrong for denying me the license. In either case, giving me my license back just becuase I had it before the accident would be a mistake, becuase the situation has changed. Was it tragic? Yes. Should I be taken advantage of? No. But I shouldn't be given the chance to ruin my life or someone else's life just because someone wanted to give me back a part of my former life without correctly re-assessing the situation.

Boarder
4/20/2006, 12:04 PM
It would **** me off. Big time. But that isn't the point. The point is whether or not the DMV was correct denying me the license. If they had good reason (such as me being a danger to myself or others) then whether I'm ****ed or not, it was a good thing for me to not be able to drive any longer. If I was still able to drive well enough to not be dangerous, then they would be wrong for denying me the license. In either case, giving me my license back just becuase I had it before the accident would be a mistake, becuase the situation has changed. Was it tragic? Yes. Should I be taken advantage of? No. But I shouldn't be given the chance to ruin my life or someone else's life just because someone wanted to give me back a part of my former life without correctly re-assessing the situation.
Yes. And in the Hornets' case, the authority would be Stern and he seems to be wanting them to go back to NO. That's pretty much that. If he sends them back and they were not able to handle it, it'd be on him. He must asses that, not us.

SoonerBBall
4/20/2006, 12:08 PM
Doesn't matter. It's not our call. It's thiers. Who wants anyone telling them what they can and can't do? Who on Earth are we to tell them what they can or can't do?

That is like letting a person that has just been in a car accident whether they want medical attention or not. They could be in shock and not correctly analzying the situation because of thier condition.

I don't like people telling me what to do, but I have teachers who tell me when I have to turn in homework and a boss telling me when I have to be at work and what to wear while I'm there. Just because we don't want people telling us what to do doesn't mean we get our wish.

Who on Earth are we to tell the Hornets and George Shin that they have to give up a wonderful new home and go back to a place where they were and will continue to lose money and have no fan support just to make some people feel better for a couple years?



Yes. If they go back and fail, it's thier (NO) own fault, not anyone else's. They may blame someone else, but will have no reason to. They did attend the game in New Orleans Arena pretty well. They may very well fail, but the deserve a shot, if wanted.

NO already failed. It couldn't support the Hornets and was being sued for not sticking to the agreements they made. All before Katrina. Katrina shouldn't be blamed for this situation, only for hastening the inevitable.


They could opt out of it and give up, but have too much pride to do that. I'm sure they want to show they are back. Whether they are or not. And really, how could you blame them?

How could I blame them? Quite easily. I know they are just human beings, and human beings who have suffered, but that isn't an excuse for stupidity and pride to get in the way of rational thinking. Unfortunately, that isn't how this world works nowadays, and it is very unpopular to hold people, governments, and business responsible for the ridiculous, irrational decisions.

Boarder
4/20/2006, 12:20 PM
That is like letting a person that has just been in a car accident whether they want medical attention or not. They could be in shock and not correctly analzying the situation because of thier condition.
No, it's not.


Who on Earth are we to tell the Hornets and George Shin that they have to give up a wonderful new home and go back to a place where they were and will continue to lose money and have no fan support just to make some people feel better for a couple years?

We have no right to tell them one thing or the other. They're not ours. We need to act the way we did when it was first announced they'd come here to play. Be happy they're coming and we get to see some NBA. But don't be thinking they're ours. They're not.

Shinn's boss does have the right, though. Shinn has to answer to Stern and the NBA. So, if that's what Stern says, that's what needs to happen.


NO already failed. It couldn't support the Hornets and was being sued for not sticking to the agreements they made. All before Katrina. Katrina shouldn't be blamed for this situation, only for hastening the inevitable.

That's probably true, but Katrina DID happen. And that changes everything. It probably shouldn't, but it does. You know that.


How could I blame them? Quite easily. I know they are just human beings, and human beings who have suffered, but that isn't an excuse for stupidity and pride to get in the way of rational thinking. Unfortunately, that isn't how this world works nowadays, and it is very unpopular to hold people, governments, and business responsible for the ridiculous, irrational decisions.

I of course think they should stay here, but again, it's not our call and we surely shouldn't be telling them what they can and can't do. Leave it up to Stern. And, what he and the NBA says should go.

But for anyone to be telling New Orleans they can't do anything is pretty arrogant.

SoonerBBall
4/20/2006, 12:46 PM
That's probably true, but Katrina DID happen. And that changes everything. It probably shouldn't, but it does. You know that.

No, I don't know that. I know that for the vast majority of people who don't use their brain Katrina makes a difference, but it shouldn't. Katrina happened. It sucked and it was tragic, but it did happen and we have to deal with it intelligently, not emotionally. Dealing with a situation like this out of pure emotion is always a mistake. That is why I was so proud of how we handled the bombing in OKC. We didn't fly off the handle and make lots of rash decision, but banded together and did what was necessary.

Unfortunately, a lot of the decisions made by both the US and NO governments since Katrina have been pretty sketchy and mostly based on emotion and politics, not what is actually best for NO and its people.



But for anyone to be telling New Orleans they can't do anything is pretty arrogant.

No it isn't. NO is not a person with emotions. It is a city whose government has a duty to its people to do the right thing by them. The NO government also has a long, sorid history of absolutely not doing the right thing by its people. There are lots and lots of things NO can't do. There are even more things they can't do now, after Katrina, and it would be morally wrong to allow the people of NO to be taken advantage of by their government.

Jimminy Crimson
4/20/2006, 12:51 PM
Aren't we supposed to be fighting with all 11 of the New Orleans fans? :oink:

Boarder
4/20/2006, 01:17 PM
No, I don't know that.

Really? Go down to Bourbon Street and say, "Whew, looks like a cloud in the sky. Better lock the doors and hide all the Heinekins!"

You jumped down lsu's throat because he wrote something that you thought was bad on April 19th. So don't say that it doesn't matter. It does.


No it isn't. NO is not a person with emotions. It is a city whose government has a duty to its people to do the right thing by them. The NO government also has a long, sorid history of absolutely not doing the right thing by its people. There are lots and lots of things NO can't do. There are even more things they can't do now, after Katrina, and it would be morally wrong to allow the people of NO to be taken advantage of by their government.

So, you're (or we're) the expert on NO, now? Who are you to say that? Did they or did they not well attend the games this year? What about the Aints? Take them away, too? Where do we stop?

And, as said before, I can't stand New Orleans and that was before the hurricane.

Boarder
4/20/2006, 01:18 PM
Aren't we supposed to be fighting with all 11 of the New Orleans fans? :oink:
It's hard to discuss when you're banned after 1 or 2 posts. :D

SoonerBBall
4/20/2006, 01:54 PM
You jumped down lsu's throat because he wrote something that you thought was bad on April 19th. So don't say that it doesn't matter. It does.

I jumped down Deek's throat because he basically said my connections to NO were not solid enough to speak about Katrina. He also was saying that Oklahoman's didn't know about tragedy on the anniversary of the bombing, which was probably just coincidence.


So, you're (or we're) the expert on NO, now? Who are you to say that? Did they or did they not well attend the games this year? What about the Aints? Take them away, too? Where do we stop?

No, but I've listened and read enough expert opinion about it to form my own opinion. I also posted historical attendance data for the Hornets in NO, which is much more representative of what will happen if the Hornets go back then the 2 or 3 games that were thrown to the citizens to make them hate OKC less. Oh, and they didn't sell out all 3 of the games that they were given, so no, they didn't attended the games well given the circumstances.

As far as their football team, I have no idea if they should get them back. Did they support the team? Did they sell the games out? If so, then sure let the Saints go back. But if the Saints were struggling before Katrina and there is no expectation that they could support them if they came back, then no, they shouldn't return. I'm not trying to put different standards on them. Every single returning venture should be evalutated in the same way. Were they supported before Katrina? If so, can NO support them in their current state? If not, they shouldn't be forced to come back to a bad situation. If so, bring them back and help NO rebuild.

We don't stop until NO has exactly as much as it can handle and as they rebuild, more things come back to the city as they can handle it. Better to build off of success then off of continued failure.

badger
4/20/2006, 05:41 PM
Aren't we supposed to be fighting with all 11 of the New Orleans fans? :oink:

Beware when they bring in the 12th man. Woop!

Dio
4/21/2006, 10:13 AM
Beware when they bring in the 12th man. Woop!

'Cept in NOLA, half the people grabbing their nuts are dressed like chicks.

NormanPride
4/21/2006, 10:40 AM
heh