Mormons vs. Science

[mdklatt]

http://www.slate.com/id/2136042/


DNA evidence is rattling Mormonism.
The church converted millions of Latin Americans and Polynesians with its scriptural story that they came from a lost tribe of Israel. DNA says they came from Asia instead. Old Mormon argument: The scripture is literally true. New arguments: 1) DNA evidence is being twisted by enemies of the church. 2) Maybe the folks who came from the lost tribe were few, and their DNA was "swamped" by immigrants from Asia. Try falsifying that! 3) "The Book of Mormon will never be proved or disproved by science." 4) We're "willing to live in ambiguity."

This should be fun.

[SoonerWood]

heh

[Pieces Hit]

If only Marie Osmond would be mine I'd gladly convert.
Don't tell Carrie pls.

[sooneron]

This reminds me of a South Park episode.


just sayin

[Tear Down This Wall]

I read about this recently and chuckled to myself. Two of my best friends in high school were mormons. I went to their church a couple of times, but was asked not to come back because I kept asking the teacher, "Where in the Bible does it say that?" He got tired of me refering him to Revelation 22:18-19 everytime he referred me to the Book of Mormon:

18I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.

[Pieces Hit]

Don't Mormons have magic underwear they wear?
If so, do they have a special underwear shop they go to?
If not a shop then how do they get it?
I know it's magic but please.

[proud gonzo]

Dum dum dum dum dum....

[Frozen Sooner]

I read about this recently and chuckled to myself. Two of my best friends in high school were mormons. I went to their church a couple of times, but was asked not to come back because I kept asking the teacher, "Where in the Bible does it say that?" He got tired of me refering him to Revelation 22:18-19 everytime he referred me to the Book of Mormon:

18I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.

Yeah, imagine that. They kicked you out because when they tried to extend the love of their faith to you you mocked them and told them they were going to Hell.

[handcrafted]

Yeah, imagine that. They kicked you out because when they tried to extend the love of their faith to you you mocked them and told them they were going to Hell.

For some reason, I don't get "mocked them and told them they were going to hell" out of "where does the Bible say that"?

Maybe it's just me.

[Pieces Hit]

More on the magic underwear pls.

[handcrafted]

More on the magic underwear pls.

I'm not sure if it's "magic" underwear, but it's "special" underwear. They borrow a lot of stuff from Old Testament ceremonial worship, because they consider their "elders" to be the heirs of the old Levitical priesthood. The special undergarments are detailed in the Mosaic law. The Mormons ascribe a somewhat different purpose to them, but I'm not clear on exactly what that is. But the special underwear is only to be worn for temple ceremonies.

As to where they get them, I think they're supposed to be hand made, but I'm sure the Mormon church has some way of producing them in mass quantities.

[Pieces Hit]

You reckon I could join just long enough to get some or would they want them back?

[Frozen Sooner]

For some reason, I don't get "mocked them and told them they were going to hell" out of "where does the Bible say that"?

Maybe it's just me.


Maybe you didn't read the rest of his post after that-sounds to me like the point he was trying to make is that Revelations says that God will punish Mormons.

You don't think it's mocking to go into a Christian class and ask "Where does it say that in the Torah?" Maybe it's just me, but that's an intentionally hostile act. You KNOW the answer, but you're trying to be argumentative.

[Pieces Hit]

Why do you hate Jehovah's Witnesses?

[handcrafted]

Maybe you didn't read the rest of his post after that-sounds to me like the point he was trying to make is that Revelations says that God will punish Mormons.

You don't think it's mocking to go into a Christian class and ask "Where does it say that in the Torah?" Maybe it's just me, but that's an intentionally hostile act. You KNOW the answer, but you're trying to be argumentative.

If it were me teaching, I'd answer the Jewish person's question no matter how it was asked. I suppose it's all in the tone of voice and intention.

Most Bible study/Sunday school teachers I know welcome any kind of questions. There are exceptions, to be sure. But those people don't need to be teaching, if they can't handle a few hard questions. The point is to be trained to teach well, not to just spout doctrine in fancy language and smack down all opposition.

Mormons, OTOH, are taught from the outset not to question the prophet/president, or any of the church leaders, in the same way that Romans are taught not to question the Pope. So it's quite possible that the Mormon teacher would have been offended by any kind of question, no matter how it was asked.

[Pieces Hit]

I practice religious tolerance for all people's beliefs who prescribe to the basic tenents of my faith.

[Frozen Sooner]

More and more, this place reminds me of something my grandfather used to say about wrestling with pigs.

[handcrafted]

You reckon I could join just long enough to get some or would they want them back?

Not sure, but there's a temple up in Yukon. Why don't you go ask them? :D

[handcrafted]

More and more, this place reminds me of something my grandfather used to say about wrestling with pigs.

Post reported. :D

[NormanPride]

If it were me teaching, I'd answer the Jewish person's question no matter how it was asked. I suppose it's all in the tone of voice and intention.

Most Bible study/Sunday school teachers I know welcome any kind of questions. There are exceptions, to be sure. But those people don't need to be teaching, if they can't handle a few hard questions. The point is to be trained to teach well, not to just spout doctrine in fancy language and smack down all opposition.

Mormons, OTOH, are taught from the outset not to question the prophet/president, or any of the church leaders, in the same way that Romans are taught not to question the Pope. So it's quite possible that the Mormon teacher would have been offended by any kind of question, no matter how it was asked.

Dude, you are so full of it. :D TDTW was being a smartass with the LDSers and that's obvious. You can fight the good fight in a lot of areas, but this isn't one. It's not a real defendable position.

Back on topic, I didn't know most LDSers really paid much attention to science in the first place...

[Pieces Hit]

More and more, this place reminds me of something my grandfather used to say about wrestling with pigs.I'd rather rassle a pig than try to get one of those guys off my porch.

[sooner_born_1960]

Uh, the book of Revelations is an LDS scripture.

[Pieces Hit]

Finnally we have an intellijunt diskussion.

[handcrafted]

I'd rather rassle a pig than try to get one of those guys off my porch.

Oddly enough, I've never had to get a Mormon off my porch. Had to get a couple of JWs off a few times, though.

Usually when I tell them I'm a Calvinist, they leave skidmarks. :D

[mdklatt]

18I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.


So not only does the Bible say the Bible is inerrant (one interpretation), but the Bible also says that it is the ultimate authority on the Bible. Man, those guys thought of everything.


FYI, here's an interesting web site that discusses the topic of Biblical inerrancy: http://www.religioustolerance.org/inerrant.htm


EDIT: Here's some seriously scary ****: Reconstructionism (http://www.religioustolerance.org/reconstr.htm)

[Pieces Hit]

If it's good enough for Carrie then count me in too.

[crawfish]

More and more, this place reminds me of something my grandfather used to say about wrestling with pigs.

Don't judge him too harshly, I hear it gets lonely during those long Alaskan winters. :D

[Okieflyer]

Uh, the book of Revelations is an LDS scripture.

I wouldn't know about the book of "Revelations", but the book of "The Revelation of Jesus Christ" isn't.:)

[handcrafted]

Uh, the book of Revelations is an LDS scripture.

Yeah. Funnily enough, if they'd just, well, you know, actually read it.

It blows up their whole religion.

[handcrafted]

I wouldn't know about the book of "Revelations", but the book of "The Revelation of Jesus Christ" isn't.:)

Yes, in fact it is. They claim the whole Bible as scripture (though they might restrict it to the KJV, I'm not sure).

[handcrafted]

So not only does the Bible say the Bible is inerrant (one interpretation), but the Bible also says that it is the ultimate authority on the Bible. Man, those guys thought of everything.


FYI, here's an interesting web site that discusses the topic of Biblical inerrancy: http://www.religioustolerance.org/inerrant.htm

You need to watch out for that site. The people who run it have an agenda to promote homosexuality. I really do not trust their objectivity.

EDIT: I just read most of that URL. Whoever wrote that is most definitely uninformed. Many of the so-called "facts" that person writes about are inaccurate, and his explanation of the doctrine of inerrancy is only partially correct. It's vastly oversimplified and misleading in some places.

[Pieces Hit]

So if Christian Okies had a holy war it wouldn't be called a Jihad but maybe a Yeehawd?
I personally would bear arms for some of that magic underwear.
Especially if C.U. was in them.

[Okieflyer]

Yes, in fact it is. They claim the whole Bible as scripture (though they might restrict it to the KJV, I'm not sure).

I stand corrected! :)

[Okieflyer]

So if Christian Okies had a holy war it wouldn't be called a Jihad but maybe a Yeehawd?
I personally would bear arms for some of that magic underwear.
Especially if C.U. was in them.
In the military that was know as "Bullet Proof" underwear. ;)

[proud gonzo]

More and more, this place reminds me of something my grandfather used to say about wrestling with pigs.

wait, I thought the saying was about teaching pigs to talk. Are you supposed to wrestle them as part of their training or what? :confused: :D

[NormanPride]

I think it's wrestling in the figurative sense... Like wrestling with a difficult issue. Them pigs's turrible good negotiaters.

[mdklatt]

You need to watch out for that site. The people who run it have an agenda to promote homosexuality. I really do not trust their objectivity.

EDIT: I just read most of that URL. Whoever wrote that is most definitely uninformed. Many of the so-called "facts" that person writes about are inaccurate, and his explanation of the doctrine of inerrancy is only partially correct. It's vastly oversimplified and misleading in some places.

Yeah, the deck is definitely stacked in favor of disproving inerrancy. They makes some questionable assumptions about the characteristics of an inerrant Bible. I haven't ready any of the other stuff there, except for the Reconstructionism bit.

P.S. "anon" just informed me that I got owned on this post. I guess agreeing with somebody that a web site isn't entirely objective is getting owned now. We really need to raise the bar for getting owned around here, or else it's going to lose all meaning. :rolleyes:

[Oldnslo]

I thought you had the golden book. Don't tell me you lost it!

[Frozen Sooner]

wait, I thought the saying was about teaching pigs to talk. Are you supposed to wrestle them as part of their training or what? :confused: :D


The entire quote was "Son, never try to wrestle a pig. The pig likes it and you're just going to wind up muddy."

[Hamhock]

This is the least of the issues the mormons should be concerned about.

I heard a guy talk Sunday night about Mormons. They believe some very strange stuff. And like the JW, most of your every day mormons have no idea what their "church" espouses.

[TUSooner]

I'll take Science minus the points

[Stoop Dawg]

I read about this recently and chuckled to myself. Two of my best friends in high school were mormons. I went to their church a couple of times, but was asked not to come back because I kept asking the teacher, "Where in the Bible does it say that?" He got tired of me refering him to Revelation 22:18-19 everytime he referred me to the Book of Mormon:

18I warn everyone who hears the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds anything to them, God will add to him the plagues described in this book. 19And if anyone takes words away from this book of prophecy, God will take away from him his share in the tree of life and in the holy city, which are described in this book.

So all of the other books of the Bible not named "Revelations" are invalid too?

Wow.

[12]

http://nowscape.com/mormon/undrwrmo-couple.jpg

[sooner_born_1960]

I wouldn't know about the book of "Revelations", but the book of "The Revelation of Jesus Christ" isn't.:)
After i posted, I realized I didn't need the "s". I didn't think it was worth editing. I guess I was wrong. :). My point was that since Revelation is considerd scripture by Mormons, the Mormon teacher could reasonably be expected to address questions concerning it's teachings.

[usmc-sooner]

More and more, this place reminds me of something my grandfather used to say about wrestling with pigs.

It's all fun and games until someone get's a hard on:eek:

[Stoop Dawg]

After i posted, I realized I didn't need the "s". I didn't think it was worth editing. I guess I was wrong. :). My point was that since Revelation is considerd scripture by Mormons, the Mormon teacher could reasonably be expected to address questions concerning it's teachings.

But the question is so easily answered. Nothing has been added to nor removed from the book of "Revelation". If one interprets the quoted scripture to mean that no other books can be added to nor removed from "Revelation", then one must also discard the rest of the OT and NT as well.

Unless, of course, one is under the impression that the entire "Bible" was written by one person at one time instead of collected and voted upon by the Council of Carthage. But any Christian knows that's not the case, right?

[handcrafted]

Yeah, the deck is definitely stacked in favor of disproving inerrancy. They makes some questionable assumptions about the characteristics of an inerrant Bible. I haven't ready any of the other stuff there, except for the Reconstructionism bit.

P.S. "anon" just informed me that I got owned on this post. I guess agreeing with somebody that a web site isn't entirely objective is getting owned now. We really need to raise the bar for getting owned around here, or else it's going to lose all meaning. :rolleyes:

I think if "anon" doesn't identify itself, it is automatically pwned. :)

[Pieces Hit]

http://nowscape.com/mormon/undrwrmo-couple.jpgI bow in awe of your Googling prowess.

And what the HECK is "mons" and why do they want "mor" of them?

Are the unfaithful ones Lessmons?

[mdklatt]

http://nowscape.com/mormon/undrwrmo-couple.jpg

Is the sleeve so men can have sex without taking the underwear off? :confused:

[Pieces Hit]

I don't know but her garments are getting me strangely aroused.
I'd pay 20.00 right now to see her face.
Or maybe not.

[12]

:eddie:

I take checks.

[Nab'R]

But the question is so easily answered. Nothing has been added to nor removed from the book of "Revelation". If one interprets the quoted scripture to mean that no other books can be added to nor removed from "Revelation", then one must also discard the rest of the OT and NT as well.

Unless, of course, one is under the impression that the entire "Bible" was written by one person at one time instead of collected and voted upon by the Council of Carthage. But any Christian knows that's not the case, right?
I was about to say that. The "don't take away or add to this book" is (from a Mormon perspective) referring to the book of Revelations only. One slight problem with that is that in Joseph Smith's Clarification translation of the KJV Bible (http://scriptures.lds.org/en/jst/140), he adds several passages to Revelation. Maybe it doesn't count, since he was not a man doing it, God was delivering it to him directly (according to LDS).

I asked some Mormon friends directly about the garments (underwear) and got this. They are like wearing a Cross or something. When you start to do something against the Words of Wisdom (LDS book of rules), they will be seen by you and will remind you not to do it. Like, say, you're about to hook up with some hot babes. You drop trou and see the garments and are reminded you aren't to do such a thing. They aren't magic.

[Nab'R]

Oh, and although a bit rude of TDTW, his question was valid and should have gotten the above explanation from the teacher. They're trained to do that sort of thing. And, they're not supposed to get mad when questioned.

[Pieces Hit]

They aren't magic.I bet they aren't with the chicks anyway.

[mdklatt]

Like, say, you're about to hook up with some hot babes. You drop trou and see the garments and are reminded you aren't to do such a thing.

More like the hot babe sees the undergarments and there's no way you're getting laid. Those things are foolproof birth control.

[Pieces Hit]

I think it was said better in the above post.
But that's just me.

[critical_phil]

http://www.lds.org/newsroom/files/jeff_lindsay_dna.pdf

i've posted this link before on this very topic.

it's very long and full of horse****. you need a pretty good understanding of basic genetics to wade through it. oh, it's also a laugh a minute (if you're a science geek).

mormons are great salesmen. other than that, i don't have much use for 'em.

[Pieces Hit]

They've got a great choir I hear...

[Nab'R]

Like, say, you're about to hook up with some girl of any sort. You drop trou and see the garments and are reminded you aren't to do such a thing.


More likely? :D

[mdklatt]

I think it was said better in the above post.
But that's just me.

Maybe I started my post before you finished yours, Mr. Smarty Mormon Undergarments.

[Nab'R]

mormons are great salesmen. other than that, i don't have much use for 'em.


Christians should admire thier dedication, perseverance, and skill at being a missionary. Even if you don't agree with thier message. Other denominations should aspire to do as good a job. Especially since the other denominations are telling the actual truth! :D ok, don't hate me for the slam....some of my best friends are Mormons

[Oldnslo]

Like, say, you're about to hook up with some girl of any sort. You drop trou and see the garments and are reminded you aren't to do such a thing.


More likely? :D
Let's say I take my undergarments off at the same time as my pants, 'cause I'm, um, FOCUSED or something. And let's further say that I don't care if my Very Special Lady is wearing Mormongerie (tm) or not, 'cause, um, ditto.

That's how I remember it.

[Pieces Hit]

Maybe I started my post before you finished yours, Mr. Smarty Mormon Undergarments.Or maybe you read my cleverer post first and didn't have on your magic drawers to remind you not to steal people's ideas.

[Nab'R]

Let's say I take my undergarments off at the same time as my pants, 'cause I'm, um, FOCUSED or something. And let's further say that I don't care if my Very Special Lady is wearing Mormongerie (tm) or not, 'cause, um, ditto.

That's how I remember it.
Then you're a BAD Mormon!

And, if you do, I'm pretty sure you have to go through some sort of punishment/repentance phase. I don't know any details on that, though.

[mdklatt]

Or maybe you read my cleverer post first and didn't have on your magic drawers to remind you not to steal people's ideas.

But I do have my magic drawers on today.

[soonerscuba]

Fundamentalist Mormons are going to be a problem in this country at some point in the future. Their colonies exists pretty much outside the rule of law, and polygamy with minors and incest are the norm, when law enforcement puts a stop to it, they aren't going out quietly. Oh, and they estimate that there is about 100,000 of them.

[Hamhock]

Fundamentalist Mormons are going to be a problem in this country at some point in the future. Their colonies exists pretty much outside the rule of law, and polygamy with minors and incest are the norm, when law enforcement puts a stop to it, they aren't going out quietly. Oh, and they estimate that there is about 100,000 of them.


Some of that is taking care of itself. These "communities" are beginning to see very high rates of birth defects relating to the incest.

[Nab'R]

Fundamentalist Mormons are going to be a problem in this country at some point in the future. Their colonies exists pretty much outside the rule of law, and polygamy with minors and incest are the norm, when law enforcement puts a stop to it, they aren't going out quietly. Oh, and they estimate that there is about 100,000 of them.
They're harder to racial profile, too.

:D

[Pieces Hit]

But I do have my magic drawers on today.Well then you obviously started your post first as I can't argue with your underwear claim. Because if you are wearing them then you surely couldn't lie and although I don't truly believe you have said garment on, I don't want a pic to support my theory.

[mdklatt]

Well then you obviously started your post first as I can't argue with your underwear claim. Because if you are wearing them then you surely couldn't lie and although I don't truly believe you have said garment on, I don't want a pic to support my theory.

Good, because I don't have a digital camera.

[Pieces Hit]

"Good, because I don't have a digital camera."

Don't make me use it!

Edit:

I thought you said you did.

Ha ha.

I'm dumb.

[Okieflyer]

After i posted, I realized I didn't need the "s". I didn't think it was worth editing. I guess I was wrong. :). My point was that since Revelation is considerd scripture by Mormons, the Mormon teacher could reasonably be expected to address questions concerning it's teachings.

Your probably right with most of this crew.

But I just thought I would give you hard time. :D

I was just givin' you the Business. Because that's what posters do. ;)

http://www.fiftiesweb.com/tv/tony-dow.jpg

[handcrafted]

I don't know but her garments are getting me strangely aroused.
I'd pay 20.00 right now to see her face.
Or maybe not.

I don't think that's Carrie, PH. :D

[proud gonzo]

The entire quote was "Son, never try to wrestle a pig. The pig likes it and you're just going to wind up muddy."
AH, okay. similar to teaching a pig to talk, but slightly more apropos :D

[TUSooner]

Christians should admire thier dedication, perseverance, and skill at being a missionary. Even if you don't agree with thier message. Other denominations should aspire to do as good a job. Especially since the other denominations are telling the actual truth! :D ok, don't hate me for the slam....some of my best friends are Mormons

Holy GO&$@MN S#IT !!! That sort reasoning just stabs me in the brain.

The frikkin Nazi SS had "dedication, perseverance, and skill" so does bleedin' Al Qaeda, so did the Spanish Inquisition. I will not admire them for it.

[Nab'R]

There's a obviously a difference between admiring dedication to killing people or committing crimes and dedication to spreading a gospel. Come on.

[TUSooner]

There's a obviously a difference between admiring dedication to killing people or committing crimes and dedication to spreading a gospel. Come on.
Of course there's a difference; it's an analogy (or something.) But my point is that dedication without regard for the object of the dedication is an illusory virtue. I happen to believe Mormonism is a lamentable fraud. I might admire a Mormon for self-control or honesty; I just can't admire a Mormon for propagating a falsehood, however skilfully or sincerely.

[Stitch Face]

But the special underwear is only to be worn for temple ceremonies.

Nuh-uh. I have some good friends that are Mormons, guys I've had to share military barracks with and stuff, and they wear the magic undies all da time.

[Stitch Face]

The above-mentioned "stuff" entails nothing other than sharing military barracks. And we went to Tijuana once. That's it.

[mdklatt]

Nuh-uh. I have some good friends that are Mormons, guys I've had to share military barracks with and stuff, and they wear the magic undies all da time.

Do you know what the sleeve is for?

[handcrafted]

Nuh-uh. I have some good friends that are Mormons, guys I've had to share military barracks with and stuff, and they wear the magic undies all da time.

I got some bad info then. Maybe it's that only temple-worthy Mormons get to wear the undies?

[Okla-homey]

FWIW, there is not a scintilla of archeological evidence the Hebrews were ever held in bondage in Egypt. Evar.

Just saying.

[sooner_born_1960]

Well, there goes the book of Exoduses.

[Pieces Hit]

FWIW, there is not a scintilla of archeological evidence the Hebrews were ever held in bondage in Egypt. Evar.

Just saying.Prove it. :texan:

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

It's a place to hide their trouser snake....

[Pieces Hit]

Or shy turtle...

[Frozen Sooner]

FWIW, there is not a scintilla of archeological evidence the Hebrews were ever held in bondage in Egypt. Evar.

Just saying.

Dude. Just move to Iran already. ;)

[Gandalf_The_Grey]

Dude. Just move to Iran already. ;)

and take Sean Penn with you too ;)

[OklahomaRed]

Uh?

What is the evidence for the antiquity of Israel?

The earliest mention of Israel outside the Bible, and the only mention of Israel in Egyptian records discovered so far, is a line of the Merneptah Stela (also spelled Merenptah). The stela, discovered in 1896 in Merneptah's mortuary temple in Thebes, is a poetic eulogy to pharaoh Merneptah, who ruled Egypt after Rameses the Great, in the last decades of the 13th Century B.C. Of significance to Biblical studies is a short section at the end of the poem describing a campaign to Canaan by Merneptah in the first few years of his reign, approximately 1210 BC. One line mentions Israel:

Israel is laid waste, its seed is not.
The Merneptah Stela implies Israel was well established by the end of the 13th century BC and could not have come into being later as some scholars have asserted. In the stela, Israel is identified by as a socioethnic unity powerful enough to be mentioned along with other major city-states that were also neutralized by Merneptah.

The first use of Israel in the Old Testament appears as the new name of Jacob after his encounter with God. In Genesis, Chapter 32:8 God says to Jacob:

Your name shall no more be called Jacob, but Israel, for you have striven with God and with men, and have prevailed.
Israel became the name of the whole people, the Israelites, during the Exodus from Egypt. Exodus, Chapter 1:1 reads:

Now these are the names of the children of Israel, which came into Egypt; every man and his household came with Jacob."
The Israelites went on to the Land of Canaan where, under the leadership of Joshua, they overcame the Canaanites who already lived there, and established their nation under Kings Saul, David, and Solomon. The land was then called by the name Eretz Yisrael (Land of Israel), first stated in I Samuel 13:19.

The First Temple was planned by David and erected by Solomon at a commanding position on Mount Moriah, now called the Temple Mount, dedicated in 953 BC. The First Temple stood for 374 years, until it was totally destroyed by the Babylonians led by King Nebuchadnezzar on the 9th day of Av, 586 BC.

After the reign of Solomon (approx. 950 BC), the Israelite kingdom broke up into two states: Israel, with its capital at Samaria, and Judah (origin of the name 'Jew'), under the house of David, with its capital at Jerusalem. The two kingdoms were later conquered by expanding Mesopotamian states, Israel by Assyria (approx. 720 BC) and Judah by Babylonia (586 BC). Jewish government was established again in Judea, but was finally lost until modern times after invasion by the Romans and the destruction of the Second Temple in Jerusalem in 70 AD, not many years after it was constructed by Herod the Great in 19 or 20 BC.

[Shamrock]

I got some bad info then. Maybe it's that only temple-worthy Mormons get to wear the undies?
Don't they have to do the hokey pokey right there in the temple when they get married? And the head Moron watches?

[Okla-homey]

Dude. Just move to Iran already. ;)

Naw, unlike the Biblical Egyptian bondage, there is a great deal of evidence of the 20th century "Holocaust."

[AlbqSooner]

More on the magic underwear pls.
Back in the day, I dated a MOMO girl who had magic IN her underwear.

[Jerk]

Oddly enough, I've never had to get a Mormon off my porch. Had to get a couple of JWs off a few times, though.

Usually when I tell them I'm a Calvinist, they leave skidmarks. :D

ah!! Good ol' Calvinism! God created a few people to go to Heaven, and created billions of people so He could torture them forever and ever "to His good pleasure!"



http://members.aol.com/wrobert777/church.html

[Jerk]

One of my best friends is a mormon. Great guy, would give the shirt off his back to help someone in need. I don't understand their beliefs, tho'