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Jay C. Upchurch
2/5/2006, 03:56 PM
You can always find it here after an OU loss. It's a sad, but true fact.

You'd think instead of having a five-game winning streak snapped by Kansas, the Sooners had lost five in a row. That's the mentality of about 10 posters on this board who thrive on finger-pointing and name-calling any time OU loses a game.

Is this loss disappointing? Very much so. Mainly because the Sooners gave it away. That's what should sting the most.

The bottom line was OU missed 18 of its last 22 shots from the field and turned the ball over seven times in the last eight minutes. The guards played well for 32 minutes and then crumbled. Kevin Bookout missed point-blank shot after point-blank shot. Taj Gray was wearing a foul me sign on the back of his jersey (evidently invisible to the officiating crew).

But of course, the Chicken Little theorists are going to blame Kelvin. The sky is falling again because Kelvin didn't make the right adjustments or get his team to make some shots when it needed them most.

And of course, Kelvin had nothing to do with the Sooners getting a 16-point second-half lead. That was all the players' doing.

That's how this thing works...

When OU plays well, the players are doing a great job.

When OU loses, Kelvin is a bad coach.

Sigh...

PrideTrombone
2/5/2006, 03:58 PM
I wondered how long you'd take to post something like this.

oumartin
2/5/2006, 03:58 PM
so, what type $ you get from the university?

SoonerDood
2/5/2006, 04:00 PM
you could substitute Chuck Long for Kelvin Sampson and place it on the football board. If this game is at home we win by at least 20.

Cam
2/5/2006, 04:01 PM
http://www.thefunnypage.com/sunshine/sunshine.gif

Frozen Sooner
2/5/2006, 04:02 PM
Said it before, I'll say it again:

Some people tend to talk when they're happy. These are the ones who typically post a lot when OU is doing well-and they post a lot, because OU is generally doing well.

Some people tend to talk when they're upset. These are the ones we only see after a loss.

It gives the impression that the latter are only around when OU loses-when the reality is many of them just don't have anything to say when OU wins because they're happy.

There are a SMALL minority who seem to be happy when OU loses because it validates their criticisms of Coach Sampson. Eventually, Coach Sampson will leave-which should make that minority doubly happy, as we'll be losing a LOT more and Sampson will be gone.

Jay C. Upchurch
2/5/2006, 04:04 PM
Hey, if it makes people feel better about things to blame Kelvin, then so be it. Obviously, that's how it's always going to be when the Sooners lose a game like that.

I'm just pointing out the predictable knee-jerk reaction several posters on this board have too every hint of adversity.

It's almost humorous.

JohnnyMack
2/5/2006, 04:04 PM
Jay,

I think you'll find my meltdown thread does attempt to blame BOTH the players and the coaching staff.

Although I personally don't give a wet fart if Kelvin is our coach or not. With our AD, our facilites and our money we can and will be a winning program regardless of who's at the helm.

ouradu
2/5/2006, 04:09 PM
I blame the players for not knowing how to finish a game. We've blown a lot of big leads this year, these guys don't know how to play with a big lead.

Cam
2/5/2006, 04:12 PM
There are a SMALL minority who seem to be happy when OU loses because it validates their criticisms of Coach Sampson. Eventually, Coach Sampson will leave-which should make that minority doubly happy, as we'll be losing a LOT more and Sampson will be gone.
Happy at a lose? Not even close.

Completely and utterly gutted? **** yeah.

That game should have been over with 5 minutes left. Our guys went into the dribble at the top of the key while the other 4 stand in a straight line syndrome. How did we get the 16 point lead? By running the ball and pressing their half court game with the extended zone. How did we lose it? By taking the air out of the ball on offense and sagging the zone. Why the change?

william_brasky
2/5/2006, 04:14 PM
Chicken Little reference = ghey

The loss speaks for itsself.

Who catches heat when a company fails? Joe Worker or the HMFIC? The HMFIC does. That's life. This is the internet. In the words of our esteemed leader here, GADOCADWI.

Sooner24
2/5/2006, 04:21 PM
Hey, if it makes people feel better about things to blame Kelvin, then so be it. Obviously, that's how it's always going to be when the Sooners lose a game like that.

I'm just pointing out the predictable knee-jerk reaction several posters on this board have too every hint of adversity.

It's almost humorous.

I don't find it humorous, more like painful. I went to Austin two years ago and watched us score 37 points. It was what I imagine a root canal without Novocain would feel like. How many times this year, and years past, has a Kelvin Sampson coached team had 8-10 minute droughts of not scoring? Too many!!!!

Jay C. Upchurch
2/5/2006, 04:22 PM
Again, OU missed 18 of its last 22 shots.

That's 18 percent.

If they shoot 23 percent — 5 for 22 — they win.

Doesn't get much more simple than that.

BarryBnds
2/5/2006, 04:23 PM
Jay I figured you'd dismiss anything negative said about coach Denim as negative fans being negative fans. When will you recognize that this program has plateaued and will stagnate into the boring crap we keep throwing out there? Is Kelvin a good coach? Sure. But at almost a million a year should we settle for good? Are you happy being mediocre? Are you accepting of the fact that we absolutely suck in one of the worst conferences around this year when we were supposed to have all the pieces to make our glorious run? Are you going to be happy when we lose to Manhattan or Canisius or some other team we should beat? Should we replace Kelvin? I don't know. I just know something HAS to change. Either he coaches in the 21st century or find someone who will.

Sooner24
2/5/2006, 04:26 PM
After the NCAA gets through with OU in April the coaching problem will be fixed.

Cam
2/5/2006, 04:27 PM
For the record, I have no troll handles. Never have, never will.

Any resemblance between BarryBnds' comments and my own is just him/her stating what they feel.

GottaHavePride
2/5/2006, 04:27 PM
Again, OU missed 18 of its last 22 shots.

That's 18 percent.

If they shoot 23 percent — 5 for 22 — they win.

Doesn't get much more simple than that.

Or if, say, we don't start waiting until we only have 8 seconds on the shot clock to force a shot, maybe we get 25 shots off in that span of time instead of 22. just saying...

william_brasky
2/5/2006, 04:29 PM
Hell, if they make 22 of the last 22 shots they win.

I think most people who are criticizing the coaching today are doing so because there was a noticeable change in strategy once we built up a lead. Sit back in the zone on D and run the point guard Isolation on O. Neither worked. Those calls come from the top. So, the top is faulted.

Doesn't get much more simple than that.

Ardmore_Sooner
2/5/2006, 04:30 PM
I don't find it humorous, more like painful. I went to Austin two years ago and watched us score 37 points. It was what I imagine a root canal without Novocain would feel like. How many times this year, and years past, has a Kelvin Sampson coached team had 8-10 minute droughts of not scoring? Too many!!!!

You are exactly right, if this was the first time we had gone on a drought like this it would be a little understandable, but after about the X number of times it gets old. Anyone remember the Big 12 Title game against Mizzou? Or the complete meltdown in Norman against Texas in 2003. Its just gotten to the point that something needs to happen when we get up by more then 15 points. Play the same offense you did the first 30 minutes instead of our "Prevent Offense©*."

*© by Sooner04

Sooner24
2/5/2006, 04:30 PM
Or if, say, we don't start waiting until we only have 8 seconds on the shot clock to force a shot, maybe we get 25 shots off in that span of time instead of 22. just saying...


With 13:30 to go in the game we are standing out at the top of the circle just running clock. We get the ball stolen and the make an easy basket. I am not a basketball coach by any strech but simple math tells me with a 35 second shot clock it is going to be impossible to run 13:30 off the clock and win. :rolleyes:

PrideTrombone
2/5/2006, 04:31 PM
Again, OU missed 18 of its last 22 shots.

That's 18 percent.

If they shoot 23 percent — 5 for 22 — they win.

Doesn't get much more simple than that.

So you're saying that Kelvin can't even coach a team to shoot 23%. It's worse than I feared.

OKC-SLC
2/5/2006, 04:32 PM
shooting percentages are one thing. and missing point blank shots certainly doesn't help a shooting percentage.

but when an offensive strategy gets you into a lead, why change it so that you are often putting up shots that you can't make?

Sooner24
2/5/2006, 04:37 PM
shooting percentages are one thing. and missing point blank shots certainly doesn't help a shooting percentage.

but when an offensive strategy gets you into a lead, why change it so that you are often putting up shots that you can't make?



DING-DING-DING.......WE HAVE ANOTHER WINNER!!!!!

RacerX
2/5/2006, 04:39 PM
The creation of this thread is comical.

Group Hug!

RacerX
2/5/2006, 04:40 PM
http://www.thefunnypage.com/sunshine/sunshine.gif
:eddie:
I love you man!

william_brasky
2/5/2006, 04:40 PM
I would've preferred Ducky Lucky or Turkey Lurkey Syndrome myself. :D

Sooner24
2/5/2006, 04:41 PM
The creation of this thread is comical.

Group Hug!


Kum-bi-ya!!! :D

RacerX
2/5/2006, 04:52 PM
http://www.gameprotv.com/videos/Chicken_Little/GPTV_Chicken_Little.jpg

PrideTrombone
2/5/2006, 04:55 PM
http://sunshine.blogs.sapo.pt/arquivo/cfcdf.JPG
http://images.amazon.com/images/P/B00005017X.01.LZZZZZZZ.jpg

Jay C. Upchurch
2/5/2006, 05:09 PM
Of course, the Chicken Little mainstays gravitate to this post, it's their world and they want to wallow in the agony as much as possible...

RacerX
Sooner24
billy_brasky
CAM
PrideTrombone
oumartin
BarryBnds
Ardmore_Sooner

By the way, that sunshine pumper thing is really starting to bring me down. Stop, oh, please stop.

Cam
2/5/2006, 05:15 PM
Jay, Since you've only been around this board for less than a year, I'll let you in on something.

There are many that have felt this way for the last 3 or 4 years. I'm sure the posts are archived, feel free to look'em up.

BarryBnds
2/5/2006, 05:17 PM
Of course, the Chicken Little mainstays gravitate to this post, it's their world and they want to wallow in the agony as much as possible...

RacerX
Sooner24
billy_brasky
CAM
PrideTrombone
oumartin
BarryBnds
Ardmore_Sooner

By the way, that sunshine pumper thing is really starting to bring me down. Stop, oh, please stop.

So when the majority of this site FULL of true Sooner fans think something should be done what does that tell you?

RacerX
2/5/2006, 05:18 PM
Of course, the Chicken Little mainstays gravitate to this post, it's their world and they want to wallow in the agony as much as possible...

RacerX
Sooner24
billy_brasky
CAM
PrideTrombone
oumartin
BarryBnds
Ardmore_Sooner

By the way, that sunshine pumper thing is really starting to bring me down. Stop, oh, please stop.
You don't know me at all noob.

But you certainly want to force your opinion on everyone while discounting everything else that's said. That's sad because apparently you hold some sort of position of authority on this board.

Jay C. Upchurch
2/5/2006, 05:24 PM
I don't doubt there have been Kelvin haters on this board for as many years as this board has been around. I've said it before — there are always going to be people who will never embrace Kelvin's style of basketball and will take every opportunity to question his ability, despite all of his successes.

Every message board has them.

I've been on the KU boards and seen where there are KU fans who can't stand Bill Self, for whatever ridiculous reason.

I've been on Texas boards and read where Horns fans would like to replace Rick Barnes, for whatever ridiculous reason.

You say there are "many" on this board who don't like Sampson and would rather have someone else as OU's head coach. To that, I say baloney.

Yes, there are some, but for the most part, a great majority of the Kelvin bashing comes from the seven or eight names I listed in my previous post.

BarryBnds
2/5/2006, 05:28 PM
I don't doubt there have been Kelvin haters on this board for as many years as this board has been around. I've said it before — there are always going to be people who will never embrace Kelvin's style of basketball and will take every opportunity to question his ability, despite all of his successes.

Every message board has them.

I've been on the KU boards and seen where there are KU fans who can't stand Bill Self, for whatever ridiculous reason.

I've been on Texas boards and read where Horns fans would like to replace Rick Barnes, for whatever ridiculous reason.

You say there are "many" on this board who don't like Sampson and would rather have someone else as OU's head coach. To that, I say baloney.

Yes, there are some, but for the most part, a great majority of the Kelvin bashing comes from the seven or eight names I listed in my previous post.

Well I'll rephrase it for you. There are many that are not happy with the state of program and it is getting increasingly worse. And there are about 2 posters that want to pump. Those ain't good odds. Honestly do you think the rest of the Sooner brethren are just griping to gripe or are the 2 that are supporters of Kelvin no matter what just blind to the actual problems with his teams.

PrideTrombone
2/5/2006, 05:30 PM
I don't doubt there have been Kelvin haters on this board for as many years as this board has been around. I've said it before — there are always going to be people who will never embrace Kelvin's style of basketball and will take every opportunity to question his ability, despite all of his successes.


I was AT most of Kelvin's successes. I was AT every game during the Final Four year (home and tournaments), and went to every game the Elite 8 year (home and tournaments) except for the ones in Albany. I'll give him all the credit in the world for them, but even then, we'd have inexplicable scoring droughts that we were able to push through for whatever reason. One of those occurred in the Final Four, where we let two redheaded white guys shoot us out of the tournament.

Why is it that you won't question anything about him, despite some of his recent on-court and NCAA compliance failures?

RacerX
2/5/2006, 05:31 PM
Show me where I've bashed Kelvin.

Once again Jay, you're not the only one that gets to have an opinion on here. You shouldn't so easliy discount people/edit the posts of those who don't share your company line.

Sorry guys, you're wrong, Jay is right. He's ordained or something.

Ardmore_Sooner
2/5/2006, 05:32 PM
So Jay is there a problem with the style of our play or not? Give me an honest answer.

Sooner24
2/5/2006, 05:35 PM
I am not a Kelvin hater. But on the other hand I won't praise the man for games like today either.

BarryBnds
2/5/2006, 05:35 PM
I like how anyone who points out anything that the program is doing wrong is Kelvin bashing. Rather than someone pointing out something that should be fixed. I've said a million times I don't care for Kelvin's style of basketball but you can't argue the character of the man (up until this year). I think every Sooner would agree that all we want is the team to get coached up and win. Instead these kids seem to be constantly beaten up either in practice or with lineup changes or whatever. That and the offensive set where we pass and pick around the top of the circle for 30 seconds and then force up a bad shot is inexcusable.

Paperclip
2/5/2006, 05:37 PM
You know Jay, I don't mean to be rude because I always appreciate the stories you copy and paste from soonersports.com since none of us can go and read them there ourselves, but today was crap. It's a flat out embarrassment. I've all but cancelled my plans to go to Austin on March 5 because this team is too painful to watch.

Ardmore_Sooner
2/5/2006, 05:38 PM
If it weren't for Sampson, we would still have Lavender, and you can say what you want but he was a player.

jk the sooner fan
2/5/2006, 05:39 PM
question - how successful a magazine (or how much access to the athletic department would it have) if the editor and writers were highly critical of coaches and the programs?

my guess is not very successful and little to no access......

this game is what it is (or was)......the GREAT/GOOD teams win these games

the so so average teams win some and lose some.....and thats what we are this year...i told crawfish at lunch the other day that i still didnt trust investing my heart into this team after the texas win......and today they proved why.

there is little to no leadership on this team and THAT is the responsibility of the coaching staff

Jay C. Upchurch
2/5/2006, 05:39 PM
First of all, I've edited about three posts the entire year I've been on here. So don't try to make it like I'm roaming around changing anyone's posts. Geez.

Never said I was the only one who has an opinion here. Show me where I said that?

Show me where I discounted anyone's opinion.... all I pointed out was there are certain people on this board who are going to react the same way every time OU loses a basketball game.

If OU was on a 25-game winning streak, they would react the same. It's just the way it is.

Today, I said it was predictable and humorous — did I not?

birddog
2/5/2006, 05:39 PM
Well, it happens every damm game it seems. I can't quite figure out "milking the clock" with over 10 minutes to go! KU couldn't get jack squat in the half court and we immediately go to a half court game with 10 minutes. You could see it coming. Even when we were up 14 you could see we were going to hang on for dear life.

jk the sooner fan
2/5/2006, 05:40 PM
lavender was good.....and then he would suck, and then he was good, and then he would suck

he was as consistent as he was tall.....

birddog
2/5/2006, 05:42 PM
question - how successful a magazine (or how much access to the athletic department would it have) if the editor and writers were highly critical of coaches and the programs?

my guess is not very successful and little to no access......

this game is what it is (or was)......the GREAT/GOOD teams win these games

the so so average teams win some and lose some.....and thats what we are this year...i told crawfish at lunch the other day that i still didnt trust investing my heart into this team after the texas win......and today they proved why.

there is little to no leadership on this team and THAT is the responsibility of the coaching staff
I said that a month ago and it is still true. Not one player has stepped up and provided energy and leadership for the rest of the players. Having said that I will pull for our guys no matter who's on the floor.

CtheB
2/5/2006, 05:42 PM
Show me where I discounted anyone's opinion.... all I pointed out was there are certain people on this board who are going to react the same way every time OU loses a basketball game.

Jay, three weeks ago when we had our battle, you called everyone who did not support Kelvin an "idiot". I don't know where you come from, but to call someone or a group of someones an "idiot" pretty much discounts their opinion.

jk the sooner fan
2/5/2006, 05:43 PM
Having said that I will pull for our guys no matter who's on the floor.

as will I, i just have low expectations.....and with Sampson at the helm, they should be MUCH higher

Sooner24
2/5/2006, 05:45 PM
First of all, I've edited about three posts the entire year I've been on here. So don't try to make it like I'm roaming around changing anyone's posts. Geez.

Never said I was the only one who has an opinion here. Show me where I said that?

Show me where I discounted anyone's opinion.... all I pointed out was there are certain people on this board who are going to react the same way every time OU loses a basketball game.

If OU was on a 25-game winning streak, they would react the same. It's just the way it is.

Today, I said it was predictable and humorous — did I not?


Yourself included Jay. :rolleyes:

BarryBnds
2/5/2006, 05:45 PM
If it weren't for Sampson, we would still have Lavender, and you can say what you want but he was a player.

Thank God we don't have to have that sucka$$ Alexander on our team either. We are alot better off without his 17+ points and 6+ rebounds a game.:rolleyes:

That's another thing I never understood is how he could manage to run off so many kids and get a free pass on this. Knight never ran off that many at Indiana and he was the worst coach in college basketball supposedly. That is unless you consider winning the Dance 3 times and winning more games than any other coach.

william_brasky
2/5/2006, 05:49 PM
Of course, the Chicken Little mainstays gravitate to this post, it's their world and they want to wallow in the agony as much as possible...

RacerX
Sooner24
billy_brasky
CAM
PrideTrombone
oumartin
BarryBnds
Ardmore_Sooner

By the way, that sunshine pumper thing is really starting to bring me down. Stop, oh, please stop.

Oh, Churchy.

Soonerus
2/5/2006, 05:55 PM
I think when you lose a frustrating game like that and play Kelvin-ball then a natural consequence is you are leaving yourself up to lots of criticism...as delivered by this board today...

Jay C. Upchurch
2/5/2006, 05:56 PM
Well, you got me there. The sole reason for anything I would ever say in defense of one of the OU players or coaches is the fact I'm afraid my credential might be revoked...

Get real.

I suppose when I use facts like winning percentages, Big 12 titles, Final Four, Elite Eight, Big 12 Tourney crowns, top-5 national recruiting classes — it just doesn't matter.

Just goes in one eye and out the other.

OU choked today. No one is going to argue that fact. It's a hard loss for Sooner fans to swallow, no doubt. But if OU bounces back to win seven of its last eight conference games, which I believe is a real possiblity, then the KU game will not matter.

Having covered college basketball for almost 20 years, I've learned to never get too caught up in one win or one loss. You have to look at everything as a whole and you can't really do that until the end of the season.

IB4OU2
2/5/2006, 05:57 PM
With the talent we have on this team and losing to Nebraska, Mizzu and today Kansas is just inexcusable. I don't know if it's the players not listening to Kelvin and not performing or there are just poor coaching decisions made.
I think it's a little of both.
It is at times very difficult to watch this team knowing the potential they have and then watching them lose these games in the last few minutes. We don't have the "young team" excuse like others in the Big 12. Hopefully we'll learn and at least make a respectable showing in the Big Dance.

BarryBnds
2/5/2006, 05:59 PM
Well, you got me there. The sole reason for anything I would ever say in defense of one of the OU players or coaches is the fact I'm afraid my credential might be revoked...

Get real.

I suppose when I use facts like winning percentages, Big 12 titles, Final Four, Elite Eight, Big 12 Tourney crowns, top-5 national recruiting classes — it just doesn't matter.

Just goes in one eye and out the other.

OU choked today. No one is going to argue that fact. It's a hard loss for Sooner fans to swallow, no doubt. But if OU bounces back to win seven of its last eight conference games, which I believe is a real possiblity, then the KU game will not matter.

Having covered college basketball for almost 20 years, I've learned to never get too caught up in one win or one loss. You have to look at everything as a whole and you can't really do that until the end of the season.


OK I'll take my frustrations with Kelvin one thing at a time and tell me where I'm being a hater. First off, why do we run off so many of our top players every year? Isn't part of a coaches job to coach them "up" and not coach them "out"?

Ardmore_Sooner
2/5/2006, 06:04 PM
Well, you got me there. The sole reason for anything I would ever say in defense of one of the OU players or coaches is the fact I'm afraid my credential might be revoked...

Get real.

I suppose when I use facts like winning percentages, Big 12 titles, Final Four, Elite Eight, Big 12 Tourney crowns, top-5 national recruiting classes — it just doesn't matter.

Just goes in one eye and out the other.

OU choked today. No one is going to argue that fact. It's a hard loss for Sooner fans to swallow, no doubt. But if OU bounces back to win seven of its last eight conference games, which I believe is a real possiblity, then the KU game will not matter.

Having covered college basketball for almost 20 years, I've learned to never get too caught up in one win or one loss. You have to look at everything as a whole and you can't really do that until the end of the season.

It won't matter unless we are playing on Thursday when the Big 12 Tournament starts.

Cam
2/5/2006, 06:05 PM
One would think that an editor of a magazine dedicated solely to one entity would actually do their best to not **** off those it's trying to pimp the magazine to. Well, at least I would.

Your opinion is your opinion, just as mine is mine. Doesn't mean that I'm right or I'm wrong. It's what I think/feel. If you want to come away from todays game with a warm fuzzy feeling, that's your right. You have zero ****ing right to expect others to, none.

From day one I've loved Kelvin's defensive philosophy. His offensive game plans have been nothing short of head scratching for many years.

Again I say this:
You really need to read what people post, ALL of it. Like Racer said, you don't know me. You have no clue what emotion I'm feeling when I type. It's not hate for Kelvin, it's depression. Depression that we're going thru the same BS again. I don't hate KS at all. Have never said I did. Have I questioned his game time decisions? Bet your *** I have. He's the coach, the teams performance is his responsability. Same thing goes for Stoops and every other HC at OU.

The reality is that the program's stagnate. KS has had more than a fair shake to take it to the next level. It hasn't happened on a consistent basis, period.


I don't doubt there have been Kelvin haters on this board for as many years as this board has been around. I've said it before — there are always going to be people who will never embrace Kelvin's style of basketball and will take every opportunity to question his ability, despite all of his successes.

Every message board has them.

I've been on the KU boards and seen where there are KU fans who can't stand Bill Self, for whatever ridiculous reason.

I've been on Texas boards and read where Horns fans would like to replace Rick Barnes, for whatever ridiculous reason.

You say there are "many" on this board who don't like Sampson and would rather have someone else as OU's head coach. To that, I say baloney.

Yes, there are some, but for the most part, a great majority of the Kelvin bashing comes from the seven or eight names I listed in my previous post.

Cam
2/5/2006, 06:08 PM
i still didnt trust investing my heart into this team after the texas win......and today they proved why.

there is little to no leadership on this team and THAT is the responsibility of the coaching staff
At the end of the day, that's what it comes down to. I'm tired of getting my expectations built up from people who are "in the know" just to get them squashed again, and again, and again, and again....

Ardmore_Sooner
2/5/2006, 06:13 PM
There is an alternative.................







http://www.cnnsi.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/ncaa_women_tourney_2002/news/2002/04/01/womensfinal/3.jpg

Cam
2/5/2006, 06:16 PM
I suppose when I use facts like winning percentages, Big 12 titles, Final Four, Elite Eight, Big 12 Tourney crowns, top-5 national recruiting classes — it just doesn't matter.

Just goes in one eye and out the other.
You're just as guilty of this Jay.


OU choked today. No one is going to argue that fact. It's a hard loss for Sooner fans to swallow, no doubt. But if OU bounces back to win seven of its last eight conference games, which I believe is a real possiblity, then the KU game will not matter.
The KU game does matter because it in effect took us out of the running for the Big 12 crown. Even if we win the rest of our games, we're still behind if the games go the way the rankings are today. So yes, it matters.


Having covered college basketball for almost 20 years, I've learned to never get too caught up in one win or one loss. You have to look at everything as a whole and you can't really do that until the end of the season.
So why do you find it so hard to look at a career and see the trends versus the anomolies? The big picture is the program as a whole, not a year here or a year there.

Jay C. Upchurch
2/5/2006, 06:22 PM
If you want to come away from todays game with a warm fuzzy feeling, that's your right. You have zero ****ing right to expect others to, none.

Where in the world did I ever even come close to suggesting such a thing. You see, it's that kind of quote that has nothing to do with anything I've said that just makes you wonder...

Let me refresh....

I said this was a bad loss. OU choked the game away. Didn't shoot well when it needed to, didn't protect the ball when it had to.

I choose to put that on the shoulders of three seniors — Gray, Bookout and mostly Everett — and not the coach. Mostly because those three players were on the floor with a chance to step up at any point and put a stop to KU's 15-0 run.

As for CtheB, I want to apologize for using the word "idiot" three weeks ago. Seriously, it was a bad choice of words on my part and for that I am sorry.

Cam
2/5/2006, 06:25 PM
It's the attitude that your posts give off. It may not be the intention, but that's what comes across.


Where in the world did I ever even come close to suggesting such a thing. You see, it's that kind of quote that has nothing to do with anything I've said that just makes you wonder...

Let me refresh....

I said this was a bad loss. OU choked the game away. Didn't shoot well when it needed to, didn't protect the ball when it had to.

I choose to put that on the shoulders of three seniors — Gray, Bookout and mostly Everett — and not the coach. Mostly because those three players were on the floor with a chance to step up at any point and put a stop to KU's 15-0 run.

As for CtheB, I want to apologize for using the word "idiot" three weeks ago. Seriously, it was a bad choice of words on my part and for that I am sorry.

william_brasky
2/5/2006, 06:31 PM
I said this was a bad loss. OU choked the game away. Didn't shoot well when it needed to, didn't protect the ball when it had to.

I choose to put that on the shoulders of three seniors — Gray, Bookout and mostly Everett — and not the coach. Mostly because those three players were on the floor with a chance to step up at any point and put a stop to KU's 15-0 run.


So, you're placing none of this loss on the coaching staff's shoulders?

Cam
2/5/2006, 06:35 PM
I said this was a bad loss. OU choked the game away. Didn't shoot well when it needed to, didn't protect the ball when it had to.

I choose to put that on the shoulders of three seniors — Gray, Bookout and mostly Everett — and not the coach. Mostly because those three players were on the floor with a chance to step up at any point and put a stop to KU's 15-0 run.
The 15-0 run can be attributed to the offense, not the defensive side of things. There were what, 5 or 6 times down the floor where KU didn't score. On the offensive side, we went into a shell. This is not an offensive philosophy that started with this crop of players. Hell, it happened with Hollis' teams as well. Because of that, IMO, there's no way that KS shouldn't get the brunt of the blame.

oumartin
2/5/2006, 07:01 PM
so, is Jay actually Kelvin?
Hey, go coach yer team and stay off the message boards.
or, if you are gonna lurk here take some pointers and learn how to run an offense.

usmc-sooner
2/5/2006, 07:18 PM
C'mon guys Jay is just calling like he sees it. He's been an OU fan and supporter for a long time, he does an excellent job on the spectator, written a book. He's probably seen more OU sporting events than I've forgotten. I appreciate his insight on the boards and I'm glad he posts when he has time.
Give him a break.
I'm dissapointed but we gotta move on. You know the refs didn't appear to be fair and balanced either but that's life on the road in the Big 12

I'm not taking sides you guys just seem a little harsh on the guy who does a lot for Soonerfans especially for us guys who aren't close enough to watch all the games.

jk the sooner fan
2/5/2006, 07:22 PM
Well, you got me there. The sole reason for anything I would ever say in defense of one of the OU players or coaches is the fact I'm afraid my credential might be revoked...

Get real.



i'm assuming you're familiar with the concept of keeping your credentials but still being "shut out"

Soonerus
2/5/2006, 07:59 PM
C'mon guys Jay is just calling like he sees it. He's been an OU fan and supporter for a long time, he does an excellent job on the spectator, written a book. He's probably seen more OU sporting events than I've forgotten. I appreciate his insight on the boards and I'm glad he posts when he has time.
Give him a break.
I'm dissapointed but we gotta move on. You know the refs didn't appear to be fair and balanced either but that's life on the road in the Big 12

I'm not taking sides you guys just seem a little harsh on the guy who does a lot for Soonerfans especially for us guys who aren't close enough to watch all the games.

I agree, Jay is a real asset to this board, you guys go kick your dog or something....

william_brasky
2/5/2006, 08:05 PM
Well he started it. ;)

Soonerus
2/5/2006, 08:08 PM
I mean, I have never got into arguments on this board so I just don't understand......

GrapevineSooner
2/5/2006, 08:13 PM
My .02,

It does seem like we went into 'bleed the clock' mode when if we would have kept the pedal to the metal, we could have won going away.

No doubt, the players shoulder some blame. But if there's one thing we can count in just about any Kelvin Sampson coached big game, it's the patented offensive drought. At some point, you've gotta start looking in the direction of the coaching for answers as to why this keeps happening.

GrapevineSooner
2/5/2006, 08:17 PM
And BTW, is the Big 12 in some kind of financial difficulty?

I ask this because I could sworn both teams played the final two minutes without any refs today.

Especially on what turned out to be KU's eventual game winning shot.

Soonerus
2/5/2006, 08:20 PM
My .02,

It does seem like we went into 'bleed the clock' mode when if we would have kept the pedal to the metal, we could have won going away.

No doubt, the players shoulder some blame. But if there's one thing we can count in just about any Kelvin Sampson coached big game, it's the patented offensive drought. At some point, you've gotta start looking in the direction of the coaching for answers as to why this keeps happening.

Interesting 2%....

GrapevineSooner
2/5/2006, 08:30 PM
From the game story...



Then, in a boneheaded move one might expect of a freshman, Rush threw the ball into the air instead of handing it to the official.
"I thought I was going to get a technical," he said sheepishly.


So why wasn't he whistled for a tech? I mean, this isn't a judgement call.

Soonerborn03
2/5/2006, 08:30 PM
Tough loss today. I'm not too worried about the team, and I'm ready to start another streak. I'm not sure how we found a way to lose today, but whether we shoot like crap or not, we've got to take care of the ball. I didn't get to see most of the 2nd half and was forced to listen to the radio until our lead had shrunk to 1 point. During that time, it seemed like a total collapse with turnover after turnover. Now, I felt great when we had the 15 point lead with around 6 minutes to play. I knew that we were about to go into a scoring drought, but I was confident that all we had to do was take care of the basketball, and we'd win. We didn't take care of the basketball. Turnovers kill you.

Our guys were up 15 with 6 minutes to play at a tough venue. Who wants to fire Kelvin then? There's no excuse for giving up that kind of lead. I don't think it's Kelvin's fault that we gave up our lead that fast. Some of you do. I'm not going to argue about it. Our guards have to be disciplined enough to take care of the ball.

That's my opinon. As someone said earlier, some people post when they're happy and some post when they're upset. I post when I'm happy. I don't like hearing the same old shtick every time we lose. Regardless of whether it's true or not, I don't like to hear it. I'm confident this team is still going to win a lot of games. Our Big XII Championship hopes are hurting pretty bad now, but that's okay. People that hate Kelvin don't care about that anyway. It's how we do in the NCAA Tournament right? I think we can do some damage there. Again.....just my opinion though.

Norm In Norman
2/5/2006, 10:11 PM
Hey uh, let's stop fighting, OK?