No Child Left Behind

[Mrs. Norm]

I have to give my two cents about this. For the educators out there, please help. I don't understand this. I know that the government's plan is literally "No Child Left Behind". However, my principal does not believe in retention. She has said, "Why would I keep a child in the third grade again? If they didn't learn it the first time, what makes me think they will learn it the second time? If I put them with a good teacher the next year, they will be okay". Doesn't this go against NCLB? I taught 3rd grade last year, but now I'm teaching 6th. Some of my kids SHOULD NOT be passed on. Some of them aren't reading in the 10th percentile! How is this No Child Left Behind?

[Cam]

I've heard the same thing from other teachers. I don't know the specifics of NCLB, so can't comment there. There seems to be some Principals who don't want to hold kids back on "their watch". There are also many parents who refuse to "degrade" their children by holding them back. Can't seem to win for losing on this one.

[Mrs. Norm]

What gets me is that since NCLB, we have to test all students 3-12 every semester for reading levels. We get these tests, but do nothing with them! I have about 6 sixth graders that are reading at a 2nd grade level! I feel that we should keep them until they are at least on grade level. You would think that is what NCLB is all about. I guess, though, it is up to individual principals. I think I'll give GW a call and let him know what's going on in my school.

[bigdsooner]

i told my 15 year old daughter that i didnt care what the school thought, if she failed, i would hold her back myself. i remember several kids being held back when i was in school and it didnt bother them, no one made fun of them, it was necessary, and still is.

[Okla-homey]

IMHO we need to do what the prez mentioned tonight and get some more people into classrooms who have degrees in the disciplines they teach. We also need to loosen up the state teacher certification process so an education degree is not the only way into a classroom or a principals office. This is one of the great strengths of the educational private sector and its time public school kids began to benefit from it as well.

[BajaOklahoma]

We've had a variation of this for years down here.
For instance, our 3rd and 5th have to pass the TAKS test to advance. They get three chances to pass - with tutoring required for each child who doesn't pass on the first try. Our kids are also required to pass the core subjects, but reading is bundled in with spelling, grammar, and writing under language arts. So you could fail reading, but the other grades pull you up enough to pass. According to the state, we have a maximum of 2 retentions for a child during their school career.
Another issue is that the older the child is when they are retained, the more likely they are to drop out of school.
Our kids start taking standarized tests in first grade. Some of those are district assessments (every semester) and some national tests (CoGAT, ITBS, etc). The benefit to those tests is that it lets us know who isn't progressing and the areas at-risk before we get to the TAKS. The district has a mandatory tutoring program in place for the kids at-risk. It must work - 97 to 99% of the kids at our school pass the TAKS every year.
We also are pretty aggressive about looking at our at-risk kids for any possible learning differences. Not to label the kids, but to make sure that we aren't missing something that we can work on.
I hope your principal utilizes some sort of building assessment team to review these decisions - or it could be hard to justify.

[Penguin]

It takes a village.

[BajaOklahoma]

What gets me is that since NCLB, we have to test all students 3-12 every semester for reading levels. We get these tests, but do nothing with them! I have about 6 sixth graders that are reading at a 2nd grade level! I feel that we should keep them until they are at least on grade level. You would think that is what NCLB is all about. I guess, though, it is up to individual principals. I think I'll give GW a call and let him know what's going on in my school.

I'm a slow typer. :O
A child who is within a grade level of where they should be, whether independent or instructional, gets extra help in the classroom from a literacy specialist and tutoring after school.
A child who is two or more grade levels behind usually qualifies for special education, even if it is just the Herman program.

[Soonrboy]

There really is no proof that retaining a child is beneficial to a student, especially after the first couple of years of school. Hopefully with the advent of pre-k becoming more readily available, there will be another year that a child has to grow.

[Mrs. Norm]

We are a Reading First school. Under NCLB, our school was labeled as an "At-Risk School". So we got millions of dollars to start our Reading First program. It really has worked well, and our school did get off the list this past year. However, our students still aren't scoring high individually. I don't see how the principal can have a final say when it doesn't fall under NCLB. I am the Language Arts teacher for 6th grade, and I can't tell you how frustrating it is to try to teach students who aren't on level! Basically I'm getting the students who are 2-3 years behind and being told, "Oh, you're a good teacher. You can get them where they need to be". However, I'm not a miracle worker!

[Hatfield]

no child left behind = rather than teach the child; dumb down the tests.

[PrideTrombone]

no child left behind = rather than teach the child; dumb down the tests.

Thats not what they were going for when they came up with the legislation, but that's been an effect of it.

[GottaHavePride]

Also I would add that Mrs. Norm's scenario is exactly what NCLB means: no matter how dumb they are, you don't leave them behind.

Seriously, the current state of public education in this country makes me think we're headed for some serious train wrecks in 20-30 years when the kids just starting school now get out and are in charge of stuff without knowing a damn thing.

[SoonerInKCMO]

are in charge of stuff without knowing a damn thing.

Ooh - that reminds me... I gotta go find a thread your sister started...