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View Full Version : For all you naysayers and doom and gloom



stoopified
1/30/2006, 12:52 AM
Types,I told you so.This team is far from dead and UT is not a gimme to win the Big 12 title.
Kelvin has once agin rallied the troops thanks to improved health and play of Neal and Johnson.I feel good about this team although I would feel better if Book had two good hands.

ouflak
1/30/2006, 05:27 AM
Well I'm certainly no doom and gloomer, far, far from it actually. But there is a whole lot of season left. Let's just see how this team responds to a bit of real success.

RacerX
1/30/2006, 07:43 AM
Eh. This is every Kelvin season.

Okieflyer
1/30/2006, 08:12 AM
Types,I told you so.This team is far from dead and UT is not a gimme to win the Big 12 title.
Kelvin has once agin rallied the troops thanks to improved health and play of Neal and Johnson.I feel good about this team although I would feel better if Book had two good hands.

I said OU would beat Texas that night. The problem is we're two games behind. Texas will have to lose two more games for the Sooners to win the Big 12. Those two loses killed us. Now I think, correct me if I'm wrong, Texas has to go to Kansas and we have Kansas at home. But that means we would have to beat OSU twice and everyone knows even though the aggies aren't that good this year that will be tough to do.

Having said all that, finishing out in 2nd or winning the Big 12 tourney and getting a high seed in the tourney will be alright.

crawfish
1/30/2006, 09:05 AM
We go to KU next Sunday.

Texas gets 'em at home.

Sorry to say.

Odds are long that we'll win the conf, but we can make a good NCAA tournament run if we keep up the improvement.

CtheB
1/30/2006, 09:35 AM
If your goal is beating Texas, then yes this team has responded well. If your goal is to win a conference title and possibly a national title, there is still a lot of work to do.

As stated, I am extremely excited about the prospects of the team after the performance Saturday (in which Kelvin only called 1 timeout himself), I just am a bit dissatisfied that we are going have to claw our way back into a 2 or 3 seed come tourney time......again.

Rock Hard Corn Frog
1/30/2006, 11:01 AM
The chances of winning the regular season conference title probably went out the door with the 0-2 start. The team though is much stronger since Neal has come back and like a lot of KS teams they are going to make a good late season run. We will probably drop 2-3 road games but we are going to be in good shape for a conference tourney run and maybe an NCAA tourney run.

One thing that Sampson mentioned in an interview was that with Neal back that Everett didn't feel like he had to try to do everything. He also compared Everett to a playmaking QB. He said to get his 4-5 TDs you might have to live with 2-3 INTs. He is starting to get those TDs with 1 INT instead of 2-3.

Jay C. Upchurch
1/30/2006, 11:52 AM
Let's see....

Texas is 5-1 in conference and OU 4-2. By my best calculations, that's a one-game lead, and OU has a leg up on the potential tie-breaker with the win on Saturday.

It's going to come down to Oklahoma, Texas and Kansas.

Have the Sooners ironed out all of their problems from the early portion of the season? Probably not. But they are doing exactly what Kelvin said they would do — come together as the season progresses.

Too many people seem to forget, Michael Neal, Austin Johnson, Nate Carter, Taylor Griffin and Chris Walker had never played a game in a Sooner uniform prior to this season. And Everett and Gray had only one season of D-I experience. That translates into a lot of growing and maturing as a group and as a team.

Anyone who thought this team would just walk out on the court and blow away the competition from November to April was fooling themselves.

It just doesn't work like that, not when your team has so many newcomers and very few "true" veterans.

That said, look out for this team down the stretch. Previously, I thought OU would do well to split at Kansas and at OSU — but now I see both of those games as very winnable even though they are two of the toughest places to play in the country.

Vegas Sooner
1/30/2006, 12:16 PM
That said, look out for this team down the stretch. Previously, I thought OU would do well to split at Kansas and at OSU — but now I see both of those games as very winnable even though they are two of the toughest places to play in the country.[/QUOTE]

..OSU doesn't to look to hot at all. KU will be an interesting match up. I am a believer,..not a gloomer.

CtheB
1/30/2006, 12:18 PM
Jay, I agree. If this team can progress through the end of the season at the same pace they have improved since the holidays, good things are in store.

Rock Hard Corn Frog
1/30/2006, 02:16 PM
KU and OSU are certainly as beatable at home as they have been in several years. I'd still very happily take a split if we could get one because KU does have the talent to go off on a given night and both, especially OSU are in huge trouble making the NCAA tourney if they lose at home. It is always tough to a beat a team in their house when it is a must win for them.

We've got a good shot though.

GDC
1/30/2006, 03:50 PM
Eh. This is every Kelvin season.

Exactly.

OUstud
1/30/2006, 04:29 PM
At least our slump hit earlier than usual this year.

And I think we're only a game behind Saxet.

yermom
1/30/2006, 06:43 PM
right now we are half a game behind Texas

if they lost another game we would have head-to-head on them

Jay C. Upchurch
1/30/2006, 06:46 PM
Texas 5-1
Okla 4-2

That's one full game.

yermom
1/30/2006, 06:57 PM
it's all semantics anyway because the head-to-head won't matter unless we beat them in Austin too

Cam
1/30/2006, 09:26 PM
Anyone who thought this team would just walk out on the court and blow away the competition from November to April was fooling themselves.
Must be a lot of ignorant coaches in this country considering where we started out the season ranked so high.

Jay C. Upchurch
1/30/2006, 10:46 PM
Preseason polls are based on a team's talent, schedule, coach and most of all — potential. It is a reflection of how good the voters feel that team could possibly be.

Polls are not scientific. They are predictions, a lot of times by people who have never seen the teams play or are not that familiar with the circumstances of various programs.

Oklahoma has the parts to be one of the top 5 teams in the country. The key for Sampson is to get those parts playing consistently well together and believing in each other.

Slowly, but surely, that is happening with this team.

Soonerus
1/30/2006, 10:56 PM
OU is definitely getting it together...

Cam
1/30/2006, 11:21 PM
Preseason polls are based on a team's talent, schedule, coach and most of all — potential. It is a reflection of how good the voters feel that team could possibly be.

Polls are not scientific. They are predictions, a lot of times by people who have never seen the teams play or are not that familiar with the circumstances of various programs.

Oklahoma has the parts to be one of the top 5 teams in the country. The key for Sampson is to get those parts playing consistently well together and believing in each other.

Slowly, but surely, that is happening with this team.
You don't say.

Has to make you wonder how other schools have figured out how to beat the chitty teams by 20 from November to February, year in and year out.

These guys start playing together very early in the summer. The "they haven't figured out how to play together" line just doesn't cut it in todays NCAA environment. They play together every single day man.

They've played well for a couple of games. For the first 12-14 games, you could flip a coin and have better odds than figuring out which OU team was going to show up. The season's far from over. I hope they can keep it up.

At the end of the day, poential is like *******s, everybody's got it. Just depends on what you do with it.

CtheB
1/30/2006, 11:42 PM
Jay, I am now ready for one of your "Cam, you need to contribute to the positive vibe of the program" posts. Please, don't disappoint me. :)

Jay C. Upchurch
1/30/2006, 11:45 PM
Geez Cam, give the bitching a rest. If you really think playing a scrimmage against your B-team in October is going to prepare you for the Villanovas and West Virginias of the world, you are sadly mistaken.

Let's just put it in these terms... The best college basketball records since the 1999-2000 season:

1. Duke 196-33 (.856)

2. Gonzaga 176-40 (.815)

3. Illinois 181-45 (.801)

4. Utah State 166-45 (.787)

5. Oklahoma 168-49 (.774)

6. Kansas 172-51 (.771)

7. Stanford 157-47 (.770)

8. Cincinnati 166-50 (.769)

9. Kentucky 169-51 (.768)

10. Arizona 169-52 (.765)

I'd say winning at a 75 percent clip proves the Sooners have won just as much as all of those "other schools" you refer to during the months of Nov. thru Feb.

This team has a chance to do some really good things over the next two months, and yet you are still crying about games that are over and done with.

yermom
1/30/2006, 11:53 PM
if Neal was healthy we are undefeated in conference

jdsooner
1/31/2006, 12:18 AM
We are playing much better. We are improving.

However, losses to Nebraska and Missouri, at home no less, make it almost impossible to repeat as Big 12 champs. We still have to play at Texas and Kansas, our two toughest road games. We also have yet to go to OSU or Texas Tech and we have not played Colorado.

In our next five games we have two easy home wins against A&M and Baylor, but we have to play at Kansas, OSU, and Colorado. Let's see if we can win 3 or 4 of the next five before we start dancing in the streets.

Jay C. Upchurch
1/31/2006, 12:28 AM
No one should be dancing in the streets. If you know basketball, you know it's a long road to March Madness and beyond. OU still has lots of hurdles ahead.

I wouldn't call A&M an "easy" home win. Expect the Aggies to bring it Wednesday nite.

CtheB
1/31/2006, 09:40 AM
if Neal was healthy we are undefeated in conference

And if grasshoppers had machine guns, the world would be an interesting place. {kidding}

I do agree with your statement regarding Neal though.

CtheB
1/31/2006, 09:41 AM
[QUOTE=Jay C. Upchurch]Geez Cam, give the bitching a rest. [QUOTE]

That's what I was hoping to see.

GDC
1/31/2006, 10:51 AM
I say always support the players and coaches.

Vegas Sooner
1/31/2006, 11:40 AM
It is just you retarded "Fans" that dont believe. ..Oh and I am pretty sure most of them are not students or alum.

suncoastsooner7
1/31/2006, 12:58 PM
Texas is 5-1 in conference and OU 4-2. By my best calculations, that's a one-game lead, and OU has a leg up on the potential tie-breaker with the win on Saturday.

With us only having played one game heads up, so far, and Oklahoma winning it, it makes us a 1/2 a game behind. ;)

RacerX
1/31/2006, 04:09 PM
It is just you retarded "Fans" that dont believe. ..Oh and I am pretty sure most of them are not students or alum.


?

RacerX
1/31/2006, 04:12 PM
Geez Cam, give the bitching a rest. If you really think playing a scrimmage against your B-team in October is going to prepare you for the Villanovas and West Virginias of the world, you are sadly mistaken.

It seems to work for the Villanovas and the West Virginias. That is they seem ready for Oklahomas of the world.

yermom
1/31/2006, 04:15 PM
were they as young as us though? we seem to have a lot of new blood

RacerX
1/31/2006, 04:18 PM
None of 'em are older than 22....

NormanPride
1/31/2006, 04:50 PM
heh...

oumartin
1/31/2006, 05:13 PM
yeah, but if we only had a coach. :D
BTW I am pretty sure OU had the highest win % for the entire decade of the eighties. if not percentage they won more games than anyone

Jay C. Upchurch
1/31/2006, 06:06 PM
RacerX,

Guess you forgot West Virginia lost three of its first four games this season?

Five of Nova's top seven players are seniors. I suppose that doesn't matter?

RacerX
1/31/2006, 07:42 PM
Look Jay, we all get to have opinions.

I'm just not a Kelvin sunshine pumper or hater. We get to hear a lot of the same excuses for Kelvin's teams spotty non-con play. Every year.

Save maybe one season (final four) they all pretty much play out the same. The team starts spotty, gains momentum during league play, and then is at the mercy of the NCAA officiating and seeding come tourney time.

No reason for anybody to ever get too down or too up about any of the teams.

They'll get you excited one game and break your heart the next. Year in, year out.

Cam
1/31/2006, 08:32 PM
Look Jay, we all get to have opinions.

I'm just not a Kelvin sunshine pumper or hater. We get to hear a lot of the same excuses for Kelvin's teams spotty non-con play. Every year.

Save maybe one season (final four) they all pretty much play out the same. The team starts spotty, gains momentum during league play, and then is at the mercy of the NCAA officiating and seeding come tourney time.

No reason for anybody to ever get too down or too up about any of the teams.

They'll get you excited one game and break your heart the next. Year in, year out.
There's the crux of it for me.

What do you hear year in and year out? "Typical Kelvin team". It's gotten pretty damn old. That's reality, no matter which way some try to pump the sunshine, it is what it is.

Cam
1/31/2006, 08:45 PM
Geez Cam, give the bitching a rest.
Only if you agree to give the sunshine pumping a rest. The only good thing about the A&M win was Everett and getting the W, nothing else. We were lucky that A&M played worse than we did. And no, they're not a good team.


If you really think playing a scrimmage against your B-team in October is going to prepare you for the Villanovas and West Virginias of the world, you are sadly mistaken.
As Racer said, seems to work well for other schools.

The top schools blow out the directional schools regularly in the early months of the season. If the spread in the early season is double digits, beat on the other team when OU takes the floor.


Let's just put it in these terms... The best college basketball records since the 1999-2000 season:

1. Duke 196-33 (.856)

2. Gonzaga 176-40 (.815)

3. Illinois 181-45 (.801)

4. Utah State 166-45 (.787)

5. Oklahoma 168-49 (.774)

6. Kansas 172-51 (.771)

7. Stanford 157-47 (.770)

8. Cincinnati 166-50 (.769)

9. Kentucky 169-51 (.768)

10. Arizona 169-52 (.765)

I'd say winning at a 75 percent clip proves the Sooners have won just as much as all of those "other schools" you refer to during the months of Nov. thru Feb.

This team has a chance to do some really good things over the next two months, and yet you are still crying about games that are over and done with.
Kelvin is a good coach, no doubt about it. What he isn't is a great coach. Great coaches adjust to the climate and the kids over the years. IMO, it doesn't appear that KS does. Today's kids don't have the same mentality as the ones when he started here. Has Kelvin's style changed over the years? Very little.

What do you want, mediocrity year in and year out? You expect greatness from other sports at OU, why not from basketball? We've got the facilities for it. Every once in a while we have the players. What we don't have is consistency. Other than being a ho hum team till February, tear it up in February, and then flip a coin come March.

Since 1985, we've been to the big dance 17 times. Care to guess how many times we've lost to a lower seeded team? 13 freaking times. We're not talking about 4 seeds here, we're talking 7, 8, 9, 12, 13 seeds...

What does that boil down to? It makes us look like the football version of Texas and the SWC. The same thing we give them tons of crap about.

If you're cool with that, so be it. But get off your freaking high horse every time somebody says different.

Cam
1/31/2006, 08:47 PM
It is just you retarded "Fans" that dont believe. ..Oh and I am pretty sure most of them are not students or alum.
:rolleyes:

Jay C. Upchurch
1/31/2006, 09:55 PM
OU has the fifth-best record of any D-I basketball program in the country. That's a fact. Sorry if I happen to think that's pretty dang impressive.

Call Kelvin a good coach, great coach or bad coach. I can look at his record and what he has done with this program over the last 11 seasons, and feel relatively confident knowing he's one of the 10 best coaches in the country.

OU just went to a Final Four in 2002 — it's first since 1988 and second since 1949 — and an Elite Eight in 2003. And Sampson just signed a national top-5 recruiting class, so I'd say more good things are in store in the not-too-distant, if not sooner.

That's what I know. If that's being a sunshine pumper — then I'm guilty as charged.

JohnnyMack
1/31/2006, 10:45 PM
Earlier this season I dogged the teams' effort, it's heart. I saw little spark beyond the constant hum we seemed to have inside with Bookout and Gray. Now granted with so many new players at the guard position, Everett not having shown much in the way of leadership and no real point guard I suppose it was a matter of time before this team either got in gear or imploded. I think the steady play of Gray and Bookout allowed the guard situation to allow itself time to grow. No more than I expected Bomar, Iglesias, Kelly et. al, to step on the field and look like White, Clayton and Bradley did I expect our guards, with their lack of D-1 playing experience to hit the court and look YOUR CHICAGO BULLS!!!!!!!!

I think this team is progressing nicely and although I'm disappointed with the effort against WVU and the Fighting Pittsnoggles and with our lack of focus/shooting touch against NU and Mizzou I must say I have started to see some real positives in the last 2 weeks from this team. I don't think they're talented enough in the right positions to make a Final 4 run, but I think the Sweet 16 is a realistic end to this season.

CtheB
1/31/2006, 11:51 PM
[QUOTE=Jay C. Upchurch] And Sampson just signed a national top-5 recruiting class, so I'd say more good things are in store in the not-too-distant, if not sooner.QUOTE]

Hopefully, more than 50% of that top 5 recruiting class makes it through boot camp grande to see their junior year. To bring up a very telling statistic, I believe that the mass exodus of Lavender and the Minnesotans last year brought the number of players that have not finished their eligibility at OU up to 18. That's more than one per year, and dog-gone near 2. And most of them were significant contributors the year they left.

I'm just stating facts, Jay. Not opinions detrimental to the program.

CtheB
1/31/2006, 11:57 PM
Jay, I have two questions for you. Seriously.

The other night, against Texas, the offense was flowing. Kelvin, to my recollection, only called one timeout the entire game, the one before halftime to set up his "go to" final shot offense that only works if Hollis Price, Corey Brewer or Nolan Johnson has the ball.

At one point in the first half, Taylor Griffin took a bad shot and Kelvin went nutso on him. My study of the tape of the game read Kelvin's lips to scream "don't shoot" to Griffin.

My questions:
1.) Will Taylor Griffin be allowed to develop some offensive skills during his career as a Sooner? Or will he be molded into Johnnie Gilbert?
2.) Will Taylor Griffin be a Sooner in 2006? Or will he follow Blake to UCLA?

Serious questions.

RacerX
1/31/2006, 11:59 PM
Jay, no sarcasm here, but you should the 3 in a row big12 tourney titles to your list.

Jay C. Upchurch
2/1/2006, 12:13 AM
I do believe Taylor will be allowed to develop his offensive skills. I think Kelvin recognizes his talent and that's one of the reasons he has become a significant contributor this season as a true freshman.

Taylor is much farther along offensively than Johnnie was at this point. And as long as he can avoide the injury bug that seemed to plague Johnnie every season, he's got a bright future ahead of him at OU. I see a little bit of Eduardo in him and that's obviously a good thing, especially if he develops the work ethic Se๑or Najera possessed.

Right now, however, as long as he tries to back down into the lane and force up a low percentage shot, especially against a team like Texas where every possession is critical ... he's going to get an *** chewin'.

Harry Beanbag
2/1/2006, 09:28 AM
It is just you retarded "Fans" that dont believe. ..Oh and I am pretty sure most of them are not students or alum.


Scooter?

JohnnyMack
2/1/2006, 10:09 AM
Scooter?

Little Scootie???

stoopified
2/1/2006, 03:29 PM
Let's see....

Texas is 5-1 in conference and OU 4-2. By my best calculations, that's a one-game lead, and OU has a leg up on the potential tie-breaker with the win on Saturday.

It's going to come down to Oklahoma, Texas and Kansas.

Have the Sooners ironed out all of their problems from the early portion of the season? Probably not. But they are doing exactly what Kelvin said they would do — come together as the season progresses.

Too many people seem to forget, Michael Neal, Austin Johnson, Nate Carter, Taylor Griffin and Chris Walker had never played a game in a Sooner uniform prior to this season. And Everett and Gray had only one season of D-I experience. That translates into a lot of growing and maturing as a group and as a team.

Anyone who thought this team would just walk out on the court and blow away the competition from November to April was fooling themselves.

It just doesn't work like that, not when your team has so many newcomers and very few "true" veterans.

That said, look out for this team down the stretch. Previously, I thought OU would do well to split at Kansas and at OSU — but now I see both of those games as very winnable even though they are two of the toughest places to play in the country.Thanks JAY,you expanded very well on my point,the season is long and the race is NOT decided by any stretch of the imagination.

Yes there is work to be done but that is true of UT and KU as well as our beloved Sooners.What the UT game proved is the Horns are not head-and -shoulders above the league as many(Tramel for instance )claimed.BTW it also proved we are preety daened good after all.

Will we win the Big 12?I don't know.What I do know is IF we win out we are the champions.If we can finish the final 10 at even 8-2 we have a shot with a little help.I seem to recall the same thing happening last year when we were wrote off.

However the year ends I look for it to be exciting and I look forward to it.BOOMER SOONER BABY.

RacerX
2/2/2006, 02:22 PM
BTW - Nice edit on cam.:rolleyes:

MojoRisen
2/2/2006, 03:25 PM
I will hold all opinions until the KU game. This will be a true test to see if we can hang with an up tempo team on the road....

KU absolutey destroyed TT- it was soooooooooo UGLY. I can't say the same for us- but we are playing a lot better since even that game...

This will be a tougher game than Texas at home.... KU is playing very very well and are definitely dangerous...

Sooner04
2/2/2006, 06:02 PM
I didn't know Jay was a mod....

Anyway, we're all a little gunshy about Kelvin. I'm so hot and cold with him it's pitiful, but I've been burned before and it's pushed me to the ideology I now sport with him.

The familiar line, and one that's very hard to argue with, is we peak too early. It happened last year, it happened in 2001 and it happened in 2000. We're peaking in February instead of March and that's got to stop. Are our kids wearing out after four months straight of brutal practices? Maybe. Does ticky-tack officiating in the Dance spell Waterloo?

Those that say this season is like any other Kelvin season have a legitimate point. We've had outstanding Big 12 seasons go down the ****ter once the chips are down way too many times. They've got a right to keep their emotions in check because, more than likely, they've been excited before only to be monumentally let down by a post-season debacle.

All that being said, we're only Nate Carter finding his confidence away from being the motherload.

suncoastsooner7
2/3/2006, 11:13 AM
I didn't know Jay was a mod....

Anyway, we're all a little gunshy about Kelvin. I'm so hot and cold with him it's pitiful, but I've been burned before and it's pushed me to the ideology I now sport with him.

The familiar line, and one that's very hard to argue with, is we peak too early. It happened last year, it happened in 2001 and it happened in 2000. We're peaking in February instead of March and that's got to stop. Are our kids wearing out after four months straight of brutal practices? Maybe. Does ticky-tack officiating in the Dance spell Waterloo?

Those that say this season is like any other Kelvin season have a legitimate point. We've had outstanding Big 12 seasons go down the ****ter once the chips are down way too many times. They've got a right to keep their emotions in check because, more than likely, they've been excited before only to be monumentally let down by a post-season debacle.

All that being said, we're only Nate Carter finding his confidence away from being the motherload.


Who stole 04's password? :)

Collier11
2/4/2006, 03:21 PM
Ive just never been a fan of Coach Sampson, he is a good guy and a really good coach but I just dont think he will ever be a GREAT coach. His style of play is boring and it always seems to take him half of each season to realize that his teams are better when they are scoring in the 70's rather than the 40's or 50's. I may still be proven wrong about him ever being a great coach and some of you may disagree with me but I just dont see it
I atleast can stick up for what I said compared to other OU fans who say this and that about our teams and coaches but when things are going well all the sudden they are super-fans again!

oumartin
2/4/2006, 03:53 PM
I'm with Collier on this. I don't dislike Coach Sampson and he is a very wonderful guy from all I've heard. I just don't think he is the guy thats gonna bring home the big one!

oh, and the George Washington coach is a Jim Calhoun disciple so I say we go after him. Got GW in the top 10

jdsooner
2/6/2006, 02:42 AM
In our next five games we have two easy home wins against A&M and Baylor, but we have to play at Kansas, OSU, and Colorado. Let's see if we can win 3 or 4 of the next five before we start dancing in the streets.

Like I said::rolleyes: Blowing the lead at KU was inexcusable.