Cotton Bowl Update

[mrowl]

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/012006dnspocottonbowl.1da9cab6.html

UT not playing ball with Dallas, but others might

Dallas: City had expected an answer; OU, Tech may be near pledge

08:38 AM CST on Friday, January 20, 2006

By DAVE LEVINTHAL / The Dallas Morning News

College football's national champions are giving Dallas a localized headache as the city attempts to renovate the deteriorating Cotton Bowl stadium.

While other teams seem primed to play, University of Texas at Austin leaders have declined to tell Dallas government and State Fair of Texas officials whether they'll continue to compete in the annual game with the University of Oklahoma at the city-owned Cotton Bowl.

"UT's holding it up. We were expecting an answer already," said Bill Blaydes, the Dallas City Council's economic development and housing committee chairman.

Texas' hesitation comes as OU and Texas Tech University appear willing to commit to each play a game at the Cotton Bowl, two Dallas officials said this week. UT officials say their internal deliberations about playing OU at the Cotton Bowl beyond 2008, when the teams' contract with Dallas expires, "will take awhile."

It also comes as Dallas and State Fair representatives pursue a nearly $50 million renovation and expansion project for the 76-year-old stadium, which is plagued with a variety of structural issues, including inadequate bathrooms and outdated seating.
[Click image for a larger version] SMILEY N. POOL/DMN
SMILEY N. POOL/DMN
Texas Tech played Alabama in the 2006 Cotton Bowl. Some have speculated that Tech and Texas A&M would eventually play each other in a game at the Cotton Bowl.

Dallas officials hope to have residents vote on the renovation project in November as part of a citywide bond referendum that some politicians say may exceed $1 billion.

OU and Texas Tech have not formally agreed to play, said Paul Dyer, who oversees operations at the city-owned Cotton Bowl as director of the Park and Recreation Department.

At least one additional school – Mr. Blaydes says it's Texas A&M University – is also considering playing a game at the Cotton Bowl and has yet to formally commit.

But "we've heard from several," Mr. Dyer said. "There are several that are very excited about that possibility and seem very willing to make that commitment in writing. UT ... we haven't heard from them yet."

What's also unclear is what team matchups may arise, Mr. Dyer said, though college football boosters have long speculated that Texas Tech and Texas A&M would eventually play each other in a Cotton Bowl game, especially if college teams are allowed to play 12-game seasons.

The city and State Fair continue to pursue other schools, Mr. Dyer said. He said Oklahoma State University was one, and City Manager Mary Suhm described OSU as "still at the table."

Miller still confident

Dallas Mayor Laura Miller expressed general frustration with the negotiations, noting, "Everybody's supposed to give us an answer this week."

Questioned after she had a cellphone conversation about the Cotton Bowl during a City Council retreat Thursday, the mayor said she's still confident all the schools she has approached will eventually sign on – including Texas and OU.

When asked, however, if UT was the school delaying an expected announcement, Ms. Miller shook her head. "That's not accurate," she said.

What's slowing the deal, she said, is that none of the schools seems to want to make the first move.

"Everyone's kind of waiting for each other," she said. "We can't move forward until we know. I've been working hard all week to get this done."

George Shafer, chairman of the State Fair's board of directors, referred questions about game negotiations Thursday to State Fair president Errol McCoy, who could not be reached for comment.

UT's decision about continuing to play OU at the Cotton Bowl "will take awhile," said DeLoss Dodds, UT's athletic director.

"We're still having conversations with the Cotton Bowl folks," he said. "Dallas missed the opportunity to put the new Cowboys stadium out at the state fairgrounds and moved it out to Arlington. That was a disappointment to us because we were prepared to be there for the next 20 years or more with the new stadium there. It's going to be a hard decision, not one we want to make, but one we have to make."

Mr. Dodds added that UT is reviewing a report by a structural engineer, architects and safety officials it commissioned on the Cotton Bowl.

OU officials have expressed interest in keeping their game against Texas in Dallas, and they've said they're intrigued by the proposals city officials have unveiled about possible stadium improvements.

"We're involved with ongoing discussion with the parties included in our agreement," OU spokesman Kenny Mossman said. "But we have not reached any conclusion, nor have we provided any form of acceptance or denial of the proposal. The process is still under way."

Discussing OU's stance

A university source stressed that OU has in no way verbally agreed to keep the game in Dallas.

The source said OU would consider entering into a written agreement provided the city follows through with its stadium improvement plan. However, the contract would have to include some sort of out clause that would allow OU to leave Dallas for a home-and-home series if voters turn down the bond proposal.

OU officials are skeptical the city can make the necessary improvements for the $50 million price tag that's been discussed. A failed bond proposal would be a death knell for the Texas-Oklahoma Red River Rivalry at Fair Park, as far as OU is concerned.

"If the bond doesn't pass, we're outta there," the source said.

The Cotton Bowl renovation project would increase the art deco stadium's capacity to 92,107 spectators and call for construction of new seating areas, restrooms, concession stands, a scoreboard and video board and sound system, according to a 34-page proposal document the city released in December.

An expanded upper deck wrapping around the Cotton Bowl's end zones would constitute the additional seating, the proposal indicates.

A sale of stadium-naming rights would fund most or all of the first of two project phases, the funding for which the State Fair of Texas would front. The initial improvement phase is estimated to cost $19 million.

A less-preferred funding option, the plan states, would involve the city waiving the State Fair's annual rent payment of about $1.2 million. That money, along with an additional $1.2 million annually the State Fair would spend, would fund the first phase.

A second phase would be funded through a city bond program – which would have to be approved by voters – and include the replacement of the Cotton Bowl's seats and installation of new lighting and utilities. New media and VIP facilities would also be included, the plan states.

The Cotton Bowl plays host to three annual college football games – Texas-Oklahoma, Prairie View-Grambling and the AT&T Cotton Bowl Classic – as well as other sporting and entertainment events such as international soccer matches and concerts.

The Cotton Bowl is southeast of downtown in Fair Park, home to the State Fair.

"The first domino is the Texas-OU situation. Anyone involved in college football in the area has to know how important that event is," said Rick Baker, president of the AT&T Cotton Bowl Classic. "For our part, we're going to stay right on top of things as they progress. We're really on the sidelines of this whole discussion, though, outside of whatever we can do to help."

Mr. Dyer says his office is forging ahead with renovation plans regardless of progress in game negotiations. A meeting concerning the renovation plan is scheduled for next week, he said, and "we're going forward with the final design."

What if Texas and OU decided not to play past 2008, and Texas Tech and Texas A&M pull out of negotiations?

"The future of the Cotton Bowl would have to be completely re-examined. We'd have to really think about our return on investment," Mr. Dyer said.

"But I'd be shocked if they want to give up 70 years of tradition and showing their wares in front of that crowd," Mr. Blaydes said, referring to the two schools.

Staff writers Chip Brown in Austin and Brian Davis and Emily Ramshaw in Dallas contributed to this report.

[CatfishSooner]

guess UT is too good now...

[OU-HSV]

After scanning over this article quickly. Am I right to make a long story short in that Texass is the succ and is scared to continue playing us in Dallas?

[mrowl]

After scanning over this article quickly. Am I right to make a long story short in that Texass sucks and is scared to continue playing us in Dallas?

no, I think everyone is ****ed that Dallas didn't want to build Jerry World in the State Fair, and IMO they are negotiating with Jerry now.

BUT, this game going home and home would generate enough revenue to help fund any expansion projects that OU or UT are thinking about doing, and I think UT wants that to happen.

[OUfan7]

Ya win one national championship in the last 35 years and now you think you can part the Red River. C'mon Texass!!!

[NormanPride]

This sucks. Texas sucks. Home and Home sucks. Stupid Texas and their stupid Dallas. Stupid Texas politicians and their stupid egos. I hate Texas.

[stonecoldsoonerfan]

i don't want this to change, but i seriously doubt that the city of dallas is going to make any substantial changes to the cotton bowl stadium until OU & tejas get up and leave. they've been slowplaying the whole deal for years and years. they aren't going to budge until they lose $$$ and that's not going to happen until OU & tejas make it a home and home. i know that everyone (including me) don't want that, but i really feel that is what's going to happen before anything on that changes.

jmho, fwiw.

[OU-HSV]

no, I think everyone is ****ed that Dallas didn't want to build Jerry World in the State Fair, and IMO they are negotiating with Jerry now.

BUT, this game going home and home would generate enough revenue to help fund any expansion projects that OU or UT are thinking about doing, and I think UT wants that to happen.
Oh. Well I guess I'll have to read it thoroughly now. But this will suck if they stop the RRS tradition in Dallas. The only positive thing to come from a change would be that we'd get to beat them in the Fock every other year! Also, some people that can't afford or simply can't make the yearly trip to Dallas will get to attend more games vs. Texass at home.

[NUSooner]

As much as I would love to keep this game in Dallas--it is a tradition and a fun trip and a hell of an atmosphere...the atmosphere at that first home game against Texas would be unrivaled by any game to ever play at Owen (At least that I can remember...2000 Nebraska and 2003 osu spring to mind). I think it would be at least somewhat of a consolation prize.

[Desert Sapper]

This sucks. Texas sucks. Home and Home sucks. Stupid Texas and their stupid Dallas. Stupid Texas politicians and their stupid egos. I hate Texas.

Yes, down with saxet and all their evilness.

[OUstudent4life]

Texas knows that they gain nothing, and we gain everything, from that game being in Dallas. It's actually a smart decision for them not to have us there. Granted the effect on Texas recruiting might be marginal, but any hit to our recruiting would be a gain in a rival's eye.

That being said, I'll still be peeved if it's moved. Of course, Texas isn't really in the mood to appease OU fans.

[soonerlaw]

There has been a lot of conflict the past few years within the Dallas City Council as well as between Laura Miller and the Council. I am still disappointed that the Dallas Cowboys are moving to Arlington (yes yes, I know Irving isn't in Dallas either), but the possibility of having a nice football stadium downtown to compliment Cuban's AAC would have been awesome for many venues, including a future BCS game. It would be a damn shame if Dallas let OU-TX get away.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

As much as I would love to keep this game in Dallas--it is a tradition and a fun trip and a hell of an atmosphere...the atmosphere at that first home game against Texas would be unrivaled by any game to ever play at Owen (At least that I can remember...2000 Nebraska and 2003 osu spring to mind). I think it would be at least somewhat of a consolation prize.This game will be a major financial and otherwise success, no matter where it's played!!!

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Texas knows that they gain nothing, and we gain everything, from that game being in Dallas. It's actually a smart decision for them not to have us there. Granted the effect on Texas recruiting might be marginal, but any hit to our recruiting would be a gain in a rival's eye.

That being said, I'll still be peeved if it's moved. Of course, Texas isn't really in the mood to appease OU fans.This is just plain WRONG. I don't see playing in Dallas as helping our recruiting, since the whole metroplex is OPENLY WHORN!!! Oh, well, we've argued this subject ad nauseum.

[footballfanatic]

It's not about getting a leg up on the competition. BOTH ADs want the game moved, unless Dallas come through with their promises. The schools know that there is a substantial amount of money that is being lost by playing in an out of date stadium. It's laughable that Dallas is laying this back on Texas--they've been stalling on promises for years.

[yermom]

This is just plain WRONG. I don't see playing in Dallas as helping our recruiting, since the whole metroplex is OPENLY WHORN!!! Oh, well, we've argued this subject ad nauseum.

have you ever been to Dallas?

[FaninAma]

Move the game to Ardmore's high school stadium.

[fadada1]

why is it such an issue to move it to cowboy stadium after 2008???

is there some kind of problem with that?

just wondering.

[crawfish]

Well, if saxet's new-found power can get Dallas to rebuild the Cotton Bowl, then perhaps seeing them win the nc was worth it.










Nah.

[stonecoldsoonerfan]

Well, if saxet's new-found power can get Dallas to rebuild the Cotton Bowl, then perhaps seeing them win the nc was worth it.










Nah.

heh. :D

[yermom]

are the Texass fans as ****ed at the thought of this game moving as most of us are?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

have you ever been to Dallas?What's the point in asking a question like that?

[Herr Scholz]

OU hasn't signed off on the deal either. I doubt they get that bond passed anyway.


A university source stressed that OU has in no way verbally agreed to keep the game in Dallas.

It's a shame that this game will move from Dallas, but it's going to happen folks. Accept it. BTW, I sent emails to both Deloss Dodds as well as Joe Castiglione emploring them to not move the game (both actually replied to me). It's gone.

[fadada1]

maybe we coud move it to the "chocolate city".

[yermom]

What's the point in asking a question like that?

i'm just kinda curious as to what the point of saying that the Metrplex was "openly whorn" was.

AD witnessed us whip them unmercifully in 2003 and look where he went.

Dallas is pretty neutral in my experience, lots of people go to OU from the area and lots of people leave OU and go to jobs down there

and i've never felt outnumbered when i was in the West End or whatever that weekend for the game. that's the point of having the game midway between the schools

[TexasLidig8r]

This is just plain WRONG. I don't see playing in Dallas as helping our recruiting, since the whole metroplex is OPENLY WHORN!!! Oh, well, we've argued this subject ad nauseum.

"Son.. come to Texas (or OU) and I can guarantee you once a year, every year, in October, you will be playing before the nation's eyes.. either coast to coast or a damned big part of it... you will play in a game like no other being played here in the United States... you will know that 2 national champions have come from this game in the last 6 years... and no home and home series can ever duplicate what this game means."

Nah.. that wouldn't help recruiting at all.. nope...:rolleyes:

[fadada1]

"Son.. come to Texas (or OU) and I can guarantee you once a year, every year, in October, you will be playing before the nation's eyes.. either coast to coast or a damned big part of it... you will play in a game like no other being played here in the United States... you will know that 2 national champions have come from this game in the last 6 years... and no home and home series can ever duplicate what this game means."

Nah.. that wouldn't help recruiting at all.. nope...:rolleyes:
stop bringing logic into this arguement!!!!!

:texan:

[1stTimeCaller]

Will donations go down? The arms race gets upped every year with how much you have to donate to get tickets and to keep your good seats for OU-TX.

Other than school pride and philanthropy, what is going to keep donors giving the big bucks?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

:D
"Son.. come to Texas (or OU) and I can guarantee you once a year, every year, in October, you will be playing before the nation's eyes.. either coast to coast or a damned big part of it... you will play in a game like no other being played here in the United States... you will know that 2 national champions have come from this game in the last 6 years... and no home and home series can ever duplicate what this game means."

Nah.. that wouldn't help recruiting at all.. nope...:rolleyes:So, you're saying the game being in Dallas helps both schools equally to recruit. How would home and home not do the same, since it is/would be one of the great college rivalries? Hey, you don't have to respond. We(all interested parties) have argued this to death. It's much like why pull for tx over the suc. Most everyone won't change their minds.

[1stTimeCaller]

never mind

[yermom]

Will donations go down? The arms race gets upped every year with how much you have to donate to get tickets and to keep your good seats for OU-TX.

Other than school pride and philanthropy, what is going to keep donors giving the big bucks?

i'd imagine it's similar down there, but i can't imagine it would be good for donations at OU

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

i'd imagine it's similar down there, but i can't imagine it would be good for donations at OU:P you just don't want all those whorns to descend on Norman. (don't blame ya for that one)

[1stTimeCaller]

all 1500 of them?

[OUDoc]

The property value in Norman would plummet the minute bevo sh!t on Oklahoma soil. I won't be a part of that madness! 'Course, they might not actually bring the cow with them, but some damn texan would probably have to sh!t that weekend. I won't stand for it.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

The property value in Norman would plummet the minute bevo sh!t on Oklahoma soil. I won't be a part of that madness! 'Course, they might not actually bring the cow with them, but some damn texan would probably have to sh!t that weekend. I won't stand for it.But,we could throw a "Magic Carpet Ride" party after we stomp the whorns' *ss.:chicken: :mack:

[mrowl]

Will donations go down? The arms race gets upped every year with how much you have to donate to get tickets and to keep your good seats for OU-TX.

Other than school pride and philanthropy, what is going to keep donors giving the big bucks?

I would think that donations would go down... but this would would mean that you could EASILY sell 90,000 seats at either stadium, so expansion would happen.

[soonervegas]

So will Dodds and Castiglione (sp) be remembered for bringing OU and Texas back to the big time or for ruining the OU/Texas game (25 years from now)?

I say the latter.

[OUTromBoNado]

This sucks. Texas sucks. Home and Home sucks. Stupid Texas and their stupid Dallas. Stupid Texas politicians and their stupid egos. I hate Texas.

This coming from a man from Texas. I love it.

This is another example of how the tradition and pagentry of college football is taking a nose dive. It's all about the almighty $$$ now. Watching college football is like watching a professional sports league. Tradition is not upheld to high standards anymore (except for the Rose Bowl, that's why I love that place). While Home-and-Home would provide a huge money bonus in Austin and Norman and would create a great atmosphere, it still just wouldn't be the same.

The thing that is so unique about the game is how it's played in a location "halfway" between the cities and the stadium crowd is split right down the middle at the 50-yd line. You can't go to any other game anywhere in the country and see the split crowd like at the RRS. Unfortunately, it looks like only the fans care about this important aspect of the rivlary. The only way to keep things from changing is for fans to organize and voice thier opinions to the officials at both schools and remind them how important and truly unique this situation is.

[NormanPride]

Being a former Pride member, it would have made me physically ill to set foot in that stadium.

[TexasLidig8r]

'Course, they might not actually bring the cow with them, but some damn texan would probably have to sh!t that weekend. I won't stand for it.

In the spirit of the "Don't Buy Gas In Texas, Don't Give Them Your Money" sing song that seems to work its way into the Oklahoma psyche every October....

We would wait until we got back on sacred Texas soil before emptying our respective bowels... probably at that adult bookstore thingie place just off of exit 1 ! :D

[BASSooner]

Move it to the dallas cowboy stadium

[OU-HSV]

maybe we coud move it to the "chocolate city".
:D spekola

[bluedogok]

This is another example of how the tradition and pagentry of college football is taking a nose dive. It's all about the almighty $$$ now. Watching college football is like watching a professional sports league. Tradition is not upheld to high standards anymore (except for the Rose Bowl, that's why I love that place). While Home-and-Home would provide a huge money bonus in Austin and Norman and would create a great atmosphere, it still just wouldn't be the same.
All of that economic impact that the Dallas area receives would never translate into anywhere near the ecnomic impact on Norman or Austin so whenever those idiots like to claim that a home and home series would bring in those numbers, well they are just on crack. The impact would be nothing more than a Nebraska or aTm home game for either city.

I think both would lose a significant recruiting tool for the sake of another home game which just isn't worth it in my mind. I have had discussions with the Whorn alumni in my office about this game, all but one wanted it to stay in Dallas whether at the Cotton Bowl or the new Jones Dome. The one who wanted it home and home changed her mind once she realized that it would lose its special quality and be nothing more than another home game.

[auto]

As much I want the game to stay, I will not be voting for any bond issue in Dallas.

[Tidefan36854]

I really hate to see that happen for you guys. I went to the Cotton Bowl for the first time this against Tech, and I had great time. I mean sure, the stadium is not as nice or convenient as all the newer ones, but you can just feel history there. I always hoped I would be able able to see RRS game there, being that I consider it one the best rivalries in college football. It was the same way when Bama stopped playing at Legion Field. The place is a dump - BUT - I loved going there. To see UAB playing there filled MAYBE 20,000 seats just hurts to watch. The one advantage I can say has been what has been done to Bryant Denny since we stopped playing there. Next season when the expansion of BDS is completed, it will seat 92,000+ and there are already future plans to expand the other endzone to put it somewhere between 100 - 105K seats.

I still miss ol' Legion Field though!

[josh09]

we should riot if it goes home and home

[josh09]

cuz i know that pretty much all texass fans want it to be neutral still. those damn leaders at texass cant just choose what they want, they have to choose what the fans want.

[josh09]

and then theres the TRADITION.

what FAGS would throw all of that away?

oh ya, the university of texass

[josh09]

Move it to the dallas cowboy stadium


now thats an idea!

[kbsooner]

whatever happened to E.Z. Million?

[Scotty]

josh09, you might want to sit these next couple of plays out.

[OU-HSV]

josh09, you might want to sit these next couple of plays out.
Not nice..funny..but not nice,heh :D

[Sooner24]

Move the game to Ardmore's high school stadium.



I'm there!!! :D

By the way do I get to keep my same seats and parking spot? :confused: ;)

[JohnnyMack]

The Cotton Bowl as it is can't continue to host OU/Saxet. Even with 50mm in renovations you're going to have a stadium that is still behind the times in terms of amenities and facilities.

I'd love to be a fly on the wall of the conference call between Joe C., Dodds and JJ as they discuss how they'll split up the $$$ that they'll be raking in by selling luxury suite after luxury suite to the new Cowboys stadium to Sooner and Whorn fans. <Montgomery Burns> Excellent </Montgomery Burns>.

I for one think moving the game to the new Cowboys stadium makes the most sense for the following reasons:

1. You can't polish a turd. Spending 50mm on the Cotton Bowl will only bring it up to (and just barely) today's standards for amenities and facilities in big time college football. The neighborhood the Cotton Bowl is in succs and isn't likely to improve.

2. I don't think making the game a home and home series is a good idea. Having the game in Dallas is great exposure for the University of Oklahoma. It gets our name in front of more recruits than we realize. Yes OU/Saxet has a life of its own at this point, but having the Sooner Nation live and in living color in the heart of Saxet does in fact help recruiting.

3. Once Jerry World is finished, it will be one of the finest stadiums on the planet. 100,000 people, luxury suites being sold off (how much extra cake will that put in our pockets each year? Could be a significant amount), first class facilities and amenities. A beautiful venue in which to play one of college football's ultimate rivalries.

Here are the counter arguments:

1. The game should be in Oklahoma, stop giving the state of Saxet money.

As I stated in reason #2 for why I want the series to be played at Jerry World, the exposure of being in Dallas for this game each year, combined with the increased revenue (reason #3) we'll see from the extra seats/luxury suites from JJ will in my mind more than offset what cash we'd take in from another home game.

2. The game belongs in the Cotton Bowl.

I agree. Just like I was sad when they levelled Southroads Mall here in Tulsa to put up a movie theater and a Barnes & Noble, I will be sad and a bit nostalgic when OU/Saxet is moved to Jerry World. It won't be the same and I know that, but we have to make the decision that makes the most sense long term. We must put our vision of the future of the series ahead of our nostalgia for the past. A home and home series will be the death knell for one of the finest traditions in college football and I'd much rather sell out to the man (and have a pretty slick place to play the game) and keep the game on a neutral site than to let it die.

[soonerjoker]

i don't think jj world will hold 100k.

the money for lux. seats would probly go to jj & arlington.

[JohnnyMack]

i don't think jj world will hold 100k.

the money for lux. seats would probly go to jj & arlington.

Jerry World is initially slated to hold 75k with a possibility of holding 100k.

No way in hell Joe C. & Dodds agree to have the game at Jerry World if they don't each take cuts of the sale of luxury suites.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

:)
we should rejoice if it goes home and home:) YEAH, BABY!

[josh09]

josh09, you might want to sit these next couple of plays out.


im doin my best buddy

[josh09]

:D

[OUthunder]

Move that ****er!

[bluedogok]

From what I have read, it seems that Joe C. is more on the home-home side and Dodds is very uncommitted to anything. Hopefully the big money donors that want to keep the game in Dallas will speak up because we all know the big money guys are the only ones that both of them listen to. I think donations will fall because the incentive for large donors is to gain the ability to buy OU-Texas tickets, what is going to compell those with stupid money to throw at the game to keep throwing that kind of money at the school if there is no incentive to do so?

I haven't been since 1998 because the tix prices and availability are just ridiculous, but I am going to try and go this year so my wife can experience it before it possibly goes away. If it was home and home I could go on my dad's seasons tix, but I would rather it stay in DFW and watch it on TV than go to a game which has no more meaning than a regular home game.

[KingDavid]

NC game a bit more tough to get tickets than the Cotton Bowl? I think the donors will still give . . .

at this point its almost a matter of principal that Dallas needs to pony up in a real way if it wants to keep the game. it's a freaking windfall.

[soonerjoker]

jj world will never need to be 100k, unless for OU/tx. cowboy fans won't fill
a place that big. not on a regular basis, anyway.

they want a super bowl, but no SBs outside pasadena have ever had crowds of 100k. even rose bowl doesn't hold 100k anymore.

[Jason White's Third Knee]

From what I have read, it seems that Joe C. is more on the home-home side and Dodds is very uncommitted to anything. Hopefully the big money donors that want to keep the game in Dallas will speak up because we all know the big money guys are the only ones that both of them listen to. I think donations will fall because the incentive for large donors is to gain the ability to buy OU-Texas tickets, what is going to compell those with stupid money to throw at the game to keep throwing that kind of money at the school if there is no incentive to do so?

I haven't been since 1998 because the tix prices and availability are just ridiculous, but I am going to try and go this year so my wife can experience it before it possibly goes away. If it was home and home I could go on my dad's seasons tix, but I would rather it stay in DFW and watch it on TV than go to a game which has no more meaning than a regular home game.


I get RRS tickets every year. If big money donates, they will get tickets. There are a ton of people like me that get tickets every year, just because we never turn them down. They will donate. That's not an issue.

And the RRS does mean more than a regular home game, you commie.

[soonerjoker]

all the "regular home games" that i attend, have no more meaning than
"a regulr home game".

does this mean i should have stayed home (now tx) & only attended
the OU/tx game !!! confusion reigns.

[soonerjoker]

i'm a season ticket holder, but i don't donate. thus no more RRS tickets for me.

only once since NC have we had access to RRS tickets.

[bluedogok]

There are home games that mean more than others, a game against OSU, aTm or Nebraska means more than a game against Baylor or Rice. I would rather go to Dallas (even when I lived in OKC) to see the RRS than I would have cared to se the game played in Norman. The RRS will no longer be the RRS if it is not played in DFW, it will devolve into another home game. It will mean more than a game against Baylor only because of what is on the line ala the old games with Nebraska when it was the Big 8, but it will loose that extra special quality if it is played at home. The RRS was still special when both teams were 7-4 every year, if they aren't fighting for the Big XII South title almost every year, the home game will be more like the game against OSU, a nice rival but nothing special.

All of this excessive "giving" has already ticked off those that have been loyal fans and loyal donors who have had tickets forever but are now on the outside looking in because their donation this year doesn't add up to enough points to qualify. I know this has happened since I have bought their RRS tix over the years when they weren't going to use them, they have been season ticket holders and donors for over 20 years but just don't donate "enough" now.

All I say is keep the game in the DFW area even if it means that I don't get to go to it every year since I don't have the stupid (throwaway or disposable income) to give to the level to buy those tickets. But as others have said, money seems to be the only thing any of them care about anymore, that is why all of the games are at 11 [expletive deleted] AM now.

[mrowl]

jj world will never need to be 100k, unless for OU/tx. cowboy fans won't fill
a place that big. not on a regular basis, anyway.

they want a super bowl, but no SBs outside pasadena have ever had crowds of 100k. even rose bowl doesn't hold 100k anymore.

do you live in the DFW area? do you pay attention to the news regarding Jerry World? If you do, you would be saying different things. The stadium is rumored to have 75,000 seats. Thats minus club, suites, and standing room only. With all that, the news has said 100,000.

And the Cowboys are going on around 100 straight sell outs, and you have to scalp tickets to go, they could easily get 85,000 with a decent team, and with a 11-12 win team, could easily get 100,000 IMO

[bluedogok]

at this point its almost a matter of principal that Dallas needs to pony up in a real way if it wants to keep the game. it's a freaking windfall.That is agreed, but Dallas has so many political problems and no real leadership that it made how the city was run when I lived there (91-93) seem like a good time for the city. Everything is way too screwed up to get the City of Dallas's 7 mayors to agree on anything. They really know how to screw up a wet dream anymore by petty political bickering.

It is now up to JJ and Arlington to come up with something to convince the powers that be to keep the game in DFW otherwise it will be going to a home and home unless the alumni demand that it stay in DFW in some form.

[StoopTroup]

I think there was a Corporation that threw 200 million at the Mavericks / Stars new Venue in Dallas.

It doesn't seem to much of a stretch to think that some Corporation wouldn't match funds with a bond vote for repairs of the Cotton Bowl.

However...

We are dealing with :texan: 's.

[Soonerus]

Maybe the big Indian Casino at the Oklahoma/texas border will build a big stadium to host the RRS literally on the banks of the Red River...

[mrowl]

I think there was a Corporation that threw 200 million at the Mavericks / Stars new Venue in Dallas.


kind-of, American Airlines pays $5M a year, for 30 years, $150M, but American can get out of the agreement at anytime.

[OUstud]

This sucks. Texas sucks. Home and Home sucks. Stupid Texas and their stupid Dallas. Stupid Texas politicians and their stupid egos. I hate Texas.

Yeah, (rhymes with duck) them, (sounds like truck) Dallas, and mostly, (rhymes with buck) DeLoss Dodds, aka Black Curtain Around the Tunnel Because Texas Is Soft and a Bunch of Babies Man.

[goingoneight]

Alright, then Sooners... I guess in order to get our way we'll have to beat saxeT again and win another National Championship to get our way... Seems easy enough, right?
Say just for one second that Dallas is neither Texas, nor OU... but America. OU and UT travel damn-near the same distance to the Cotton Bowl and regardless of who is good/favored to win MNC or bad/0-4 going into the game, it will always be a great rival event divided directly down the middle... RED/ORANGE. The people will always scream at the top of their lungs at the opposition, even when down by 33 points. I know, I was there this year. The fair, the game, the tailgating, the chicks... how could we, even as rivals, let this great game go to waste???

If this game goes home and home, it becomes a win-loss-win-loss-win-loss situation. These two teams are powerhouses, and being in a stadium packed full with burnt-orange or crimson and cream will never be the same. The home-team will own the visitor. I've seen great rivalries killed like this before, OU/Texas should not be one of them. Come on Dullass, Texas... Fight for the RRS!

[bluedogok]

The AAC was built for around $400 million and built mainly with City of Dallas bond money, which has effectively ruined the city's credit rating for any kind of new large project that they might want to consider. That is why they don't have any money available for Cotton Bowl renovations. The fact that they have gone to a weak mayor form of government (and one who is not a sports fan at all) have effectively neutered the ability of the city council to be able to govern.

The Ford Center was built for around $112 million and after going to a Stars-Avs playoff game a couple of years ago, I think the Ford Center was a much better buy and building. The AAC has nicer finishes but it doesn't work as well, especially for something costing 4 times as much.

Click here for more info on Dallas politics: Dallas Arena (http://www.dallasarena.com/)

[OU-HSV]

Maybe the big Indian Casino at the Oklahoma/texas border will build a big stadium to host the RRS literally on the banks of thr Red River...
Hey..great idea!

[Abby12]

Are you land thieves that stupid! Don't you relaize what's going on here??? Texas winning the NC in such a dramatic fashion has just killed your recruiting in Texas for the forseeable future. Every blue chip recruit is thinking Texas first and everyone else second. Check out all the top juniors and sophmore's in HS already calling UT for a spot.

Texas doesn't want the RRS game in Dallas anymore, no matter what Dallas does to the Coton Bowl...it's a win win for UO and does nothing for us...we already control North Texas and so why should we give you an opportunity to showcase in Texas?? Let the kids come up to Norman and see the S__it hole it is compared to Austin.

Why do you guys think you're in negotiation with Tech to play in Dallas. Good luck in Dallas... See you in Austin and good luck getting tickets!:texan: :mack:

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Are you land thieves that stupid! Don't you relaize what's going on here??? Texas winning the NC in such a lucky fashion has just killed their recruiting in Texas for the forseeable future. Every blue chip recruit is thinking Texas sucks and everyone else is basically OK. Check out all the top juniors and sophmore's in HS already calling UT lucky they had a freak like VY, and noting they will have normal people at QB again.

Texas doesn't want the RRS game in Dallas anymore, no matter what Dallas does to the Coton Bowl...no matter what happens from here on out, it's a win win for OU and does nothing for us...we already think we control North Texas and so why should we give you an opportunity to showcase in Texas?? Let the kids come up to Norman and see it for themselves. They will be impressed with the Switzer Center, and the commemoratives to your 7 National Titles. So there, take that, you, you land thieves.

Why do you guys think you're in negotiation with Tech to play in Dallas. (couldn't be the officiating in Lubbock, could it?)Good luck in Dallas... See you in Austin and good luck getting tickets!:texan: :mack:Buh-bye. I like home and home, but you are lost, whorn... Tx message boards are elsewhere. Don't you "relaize" that?

[Texas Golfer]

"I'd be shocked if they want to give up 70 years of tradition and showing their wares in front of that crowd," Mr. Blaydes said, referring to the two schools.

It's attitudes like this that will force the opposite reaction than what they want.

[JohnnyMack]

Are you land thieves that stupid! Don't you relaize what's going on here??? Texas winning the NC in such a dramatic fashion has just killed your recruiting in Texas for the forseeable future. Every blue chip recruit is thinking Texas first and everyone else second. Check out all the top juniors and sophmore's in HS already calling UT for a spot.

Texas doesn't want the RRS game in Dallas anymore, no matter what Dallas does to the Coton Bowl...it's a win win for UO and does nothing for us...we already control North Texas and so why should we give you an opportunity to showcase in Texas?? Let the kids come up to Norman and see the S__it hole it is compared to Austin.

Why do you guys think you're in negotiation with Tech to play in Dallas. Good luck in Dallas... See you in Austin and good luck getting tickets!:texan: :mack:


I smell troll.

[mrowl]

It's attitudes like this that will force the opposite reaction than what they want.

agree-ance

[humblesooner]

Let the kids come up to Norman and see the S__it hole it is compared to Austin.

Why do you guys think you're in negotiation with Tech to play in Dallas. Good luck in Dallas... See you in Austin and good luck getting tickets!:texan: :mack:

If you weren't a troll, I would say:

Yeah, we only entertain Texas HS athletes in Dallas. We don't let them come to Norman for visits. They might see waht a S_it hole it is compared to Austin and never come there. That's how half our roster went to HS in Texas. :rolleyes:

We're not in negotiations for a game with Tech in Dallas. The reports are saying that both OU and Tech are agreeable to playing in Dallas. Tech is looking to play ATM and we are only interested in playing Texas.

But since you're a troll, I won't say any of these things.

[caphorns]

How long a commitment does Dallas want to invest the $$$? If it's a 20-year commitment, I'm not in favor. This bond deal is just polishing a turd and that stadium is for sh!t. If a better stadium is being built in the Dallas area, move it there. The rivalry is more than a f'n stadium in Dallas. The best rivalries in college football are pretty much home and home anyway. So, we'd be in the same company with Michigan/OSU, USC/ND, etc. Fine by me. I can find a good corndog somewhere else if that's what it takes. But the f'n cotton bowl is a godforsaken dump and $50MM ain't gonna fix it.

I'm just ready for the decision to be finalized, which I assume it will. Dallas couldn't get it together to get a state of the art facility and this rivalry deserves state of the art.

[TexasBoomer]

San Antonio is still the best answer.
Better than Dallas: eating places, golf hotels etc. Give OU exposure to HS athletes in the area. Great city! They would take the game in a minute and commit to building a new stadium.
Texas will not agree, to close to a major recruiting base.

[TexasLidig8r]

How long a commitment does Dallas want to invest the $$$? If it's a 20-year commitment, I'm not in favor. This bond deal is just polishing a turd and that stadium is for sh!t. If a better stadium is being built in the Dallas area, move it there. The rivalry is more than a f'n stadium in Dallas. The best rivalries in college football are pretty much home and home anyway. So, we'd be in the same company with Michigan/OSU, USC/ND, etc. Fine by me. I can find a good corndog somewhere else if that's what it takes. But the f'n cotton bowl is a godforsaken dump and $50MM ain't gonna fix it.

I'm just ready for the decision to be finalized, which I assume it will. Dallas couldn't get it together to get a state of the art facility and this rivalry deserves state of the art.

You're dead to me... dang whorn... ;)

Have we really reached a point where we have to have a padded seat, and foot massages and someone feeding us grapes as we watch a football game? Once the game starts, how many people truly give even a half of a tinker's dam whether the "bathrooms look pretty" or you have an extra 1/8 of an inch to park your keister. (Oh, that's right, nobody really sits down during the game anyway!)

Cappy.. as you know, the thing that separates Texas - OU from every other rivalry is the uniqueness.. For a three hour time frame every Saturday, it is a BLOODSPORT played at a neutral site.

We are all caught up in the "keep up with Joneses" mentality that is so pervasive in professional sports....

Hell. it's bound to go home and home because Laura Miller is the most pedantic, incompetent mayor Dallas has ever had.. and when it does.. the whining.. and gnashing of teeth will be deafening.

Oh.. the noncompoops who believe the schools will get more money going home and home.. better reconfigure on your trusty abacuses (abacusi?) and calculators... it ain't so.

harrumph...

[Dio]

Are you land thieves that stupid! Don't you relaize what's going on here??? Texas winning the NC in such a dramatic fashion has just killed your recruiting in Texas for the forseeable future. Every blue chip recruit is thinking Texas first and everyone else second. Check out all the top juniors and sophmore's in HS already calling UT for a spot.

Texas doesn't want the RRS game in Dallas anymore, no matter what Dallas does to the Coton Bowl...it's a win win for UO and does nothing for us...we already control North Texas and so why should we give you an opportunity to showcase in Texas?? Let the kids come up to Norman and see the S__it hole it is compared to Austin.

Why do you guys think you're in negotiation with Tech to play in Dallas. Good luck in Dallas... See you in Austin and good luck getting tickets!:texan: :mack:

Tier 1 edducayshun at it's finest!

[caphorns]

You're dead to me... dang whorn... ;)

Have we really reached a point where we have to have a padded seat, and foot massages and someone feeding us grapes as we watch a football game? Once the game starts, how many people truly give even a half of a tinker's dam whether the "bathrooms look pretty" or you have an extra 1/8 of an inch to park your keister. (Oh, that's right, nobody really sits down during the game anyway!)

Cappy.. as you know, the thing that separates Texas - OU from every other rivalry is the uniqueness.. For a three hour time frame every Saturday, it is a BLOODSPORT played at a neutral site.

We are all caught up in the "keep up with Joneses" mentality that is so pervasive in professional sports....

Hell. it's bound to go home and home because Laura Miller is the most pedantic, incompetent mayor Dallas has ever had.. and when it does.. the whining.. and gnashing of teeth will be deafening.

Oh.. the noncompoops who believe the schools will get more money going home and home.. better reconfigure on your trusty abacuses (abacusi?) and calculators... it ain't so.

harrumph...

You're starting to whine like an old Dallas geezer. ;)

What's so great about the Cotton Bowl? It had it's moment in the sun and it needs to be sunsetted at this point. Many real f'n stadiums have been sunsetted but that old crusty thing still stands. You can't tell me that the Cotton Bowl had a greater history than say . . . Three Rivers Stadium? I don't mind discomfort, but why? Because it says Cotton Bowl on the outside and we're supposed to worship it? It's not the Roman Coliseum and even that place was sunsetted ;)

I don't buy into the concept that the neutral site is what makes the RRS special. It's just when you have 2 great programs that have gone after it for so long, it's a big rivalry. That's all. If we both put teams out there that completely blew for the next 20 years, nobody would give a sh!t about the neat-o neutral site game outside of our respective alum base.

I'd support playing this at a bigger, badder, modern Dallas-area facility or going home and home. I am against continuing to breathe life in a dead stadium so Dallas politicians can act like they actually accomplished something.

[Herr Scholz]

It's going to be a sad day when that game moves. That is all.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

It's going to be a glorious day when that game moves, and we have a CHANCE of losing our refs. That is all.:eek: Fixer-upper.

[OUTromBoNado]

You're starting to whine like an old Dallas geezer. ;)

What's so great about the Cotton Bowl? It had it's moment in the sun and it needs to be sunsetted at this point. Many real f'n stadiums have been sunsetted but that old crusty thing still stands. You can't tell me that the Cotton Bowl had a greater history than say . . . Three Rivers Stadium? I don't mind discomfort, but why? Because it says Cotton Bowl on the outside and we're supposed to worship it? It's not the Roman Coliseum and even that place was sunsetted ;)

I don't buy into the concept that the neutral site is what makes the RRS special. It's just when you have 2 great programs that have gone after it for so long, it's a big rivalry. That's all. If we both put teams out there that completely blew for the next 20 years, nobody would give a sh!t about the neat-o neutral site game outside of our respective alum base.

I'd support playing this at a bigger, badder, modern Dallas-area facility or going home and home. I am against continuing to breathe life in a dead stadium so Dallas politicians can act like they actually accomplished something.


Okay, so you don't think that one of the things that makes the game special is how the crowd is split exactly half-and-half? That's something that makes the RRS truly unique from any other game in the country. The only way to keep this part of it is to play it at a "neutral site." It's not the Cotton Bowl itself that makes the game unique. It's playing it a sole-called neutral site because of the things that can be done there. Going home-and-home would ruin this. God knows, I don't want to go to Austin to see a game, and I know fans at UT that would rather shoot themselves than come to OU to see a game. Thus, it ruins the game as far as what kind of fan support is at the game. Fan support is what makes the RRS.

I don't really want to move the game away from the Cotton Bowl. Mainly because it is tradition, the fair, etc. However, the City of Dallas has not kept the stadium up with the times. The Cotton Bowl's deteoriating condition is not a new issue. Dallas could have gone through the process and built a new Cotton Bowl and then demolished this one, but they didn't.

For these reasons, I think it is inevitable that the game is moved from the Cotton Bowl in 2008. Most likley, I think it will be played in Jerry World. Probably playing the game in Jerry World, a "neutral site," where we can keep some of the aspects of playing in the Cotton Bowl (i.e., the split fan base) is probably the best, and most likley solution that's going to come out of all this.

[tbl]

Texas (the state) is great, but Dallas is the worst run city in the entire nation. That city council won't be happy until they sink the entire Dallas city limits into one large ghetto.

[SeattleOUstudent]

Okay, so you don't think that one of the things that makes the game special is how the crowd is split exactly half-and-half? That's something that makes the RRS truly unique from any other game in the country. The only way to keep this part of it is to play it at a "neutral site." It's not the Cotton Bowl itself that makes the game unique. It's playing it a sole-called neutral site because of the things that can be done there. Going home-and-home would ruin this. God knows, I don't want to go to Austin to see a game, and I know fans at UT that would rather shoot themselves than come to OU to see a game. Thus, it ruins the game as far as what kind of fan support is at the game. Fan support is what makes the RRS.

I don't really want to move the game away from the Cotton Bowl. Mainly because it is tradition, the fair, etc. However, the City of Dallas has not kept the stadium up with the times. The Cotton Bowl's deteoriating condition is not a new issue. Dallas could have gone through the process and built a new Cotton Bowl and then demolished this one, but they didn't.

For these reasons, I think it is inevitable that the game is moved from the Cotton Bowl in 2008. Most likley, I think it will be played in Jerry World. Probably playing the game in Jerry World, a "neutral site," where we can keep some of the aspects of playing in the Cotton Bowl (i.e., the split fan base) is probably the best, and most likley solution that's going to come out of all this.

Not to rain on your parade, but doesnt the "World's Largest Outdoor Cocktail Party" have the split down the middle at a neutral site?

[bluedogok]

Not to rain on your parade, but doesnt the "World's Largest Outdoor Cocktail Party" have the split down the middle at a neutral site?
Yes, it is the only one other than the RRS and the Army-Navy game that I know of at this time. Colorado State is still trying to play CU at Invesco but CU doesn't like getting their butts kicked by them in Denver so they went back to home and home.

[OUTromBoNado]

Not to rain on your parade, but doesnt the "World's Largest Outdoor Cocktail Party" have the split down the middle at a neutral site?


Yes, it is the only one other than the RRS and the Army-Navy game that I know of at this time. Colorado State is still trying to play CU at Invesco but CU doesn't like getting their butts kicked by them in Denver so they went back to home and home.

I stand corrected. That's my bad. It still doesn't change the fact that going to home-and-home and taking away the split crowd would ruin one of the biggest parts of the rivalry.