View Full Version : Scott's is going to start canning smokers
royalfan5
1/10/2006, 02:52 PM
The CEO of Scott's (the lawn company) annouced on street signs this morning that they will begin firing smokers in one year in the 19 states it is legal for them to do so. In the intervening year they will pay for current smokers efforts to quit. They are doing this to save on health care costs. Scott's also puts a large emphasis on employees health by offering workout facilities to use on the clock. I say good for them.
Harry Beanbag
1/10/2006, 02:53 PM
I still have a hard time believing that is legal in any state, much less 19.
royalfan5
1/10/2006, 02:56 PM
I still have a hard time believing that is legal in any state, much less 19.
It should be legal to run your business as you see fit in all 50.
jk the sooner fan
1/10/2006, 02:57 PM
its legal in texas.....my company has a "if you smoke, we dont hire you" policy, and if they can show you are a smoker......they can fire you for violating company policy
not sure how they do it, but they do
mdklatt
1/10/2006, 02:57 PM
They are doing this to save on health care costs.
Why don't they just raise the premiums/reduce the benefits for smokers?
Harry Beanbag
1/10/2006, 02:58 PM
It should be legal to run your business as you see fit in all 50.
If I owned a business I would fire everybody who ever wore clothes with the color orange. How far would that get me?
1stTimeCaller
1/10/2006, 02:58 PM
smokers are not a protected class of folks. I'm guessing that the 19 states are 'employment at will' states where you can be fired for wearing a pink shirt to work.
Wait one year and a day to hear the uproar about 'they gave me no warning, they just fired me because I smoke' to start.
Out of college I applied to a construction company out of Atlanta I think that wouldn't hire nicotine users. Wouldn't talk to me after I sid 'Yes, I use Copenhagen'. Good for them.
It should be legal to run your business as you see fit in all 50.
Good point. All them coloreds and women folk twern't doin' me no good no how.
royalfan5
1/10/2006, 02:59 PM
Why don't they just raise the premiums/reduce the benefits for smokers?
Because the CEO wants to do it this way. It is probably simpler just to chuck the smokers overboard, than complicate things for the benifits people.
1stTimeCaller
1/10/2006, 03:00 PM
Good point. All them coloreds and women folk twern't doin' me no good no how.
ahhh, but smokers are not a protected class like women and minorities, veterans and handicapable folks are
royalfan5
1/10/2006, 03:00 PM
If I owned a business I would fire everybody who ever wore clothes with the color orange. How far would that get me?
It would probably break you, but it would be your choice to break yourself, not the governments.
Widescreen
1/10/2006, 03:01 PM
Good point. All them coloreds and women folk twern't doin' me no good no how.
You clearly have bigger issues than smoking. :eddie:
JohnnyMack
1/10/2006, 03:02 PM
smokers are not a protected class of folks. I'm guessing that the 19 states are 'employment at will' states where you can be fired for wearing a pink shirt to work.
Wait one year and a day to hear the uproar about 'they gave me no warning, they just fired me because I smoke' to start.
Out of college I applied to a construction company out of Atlanta I think that wouldn't morons. Wouldn't talk to me after they got one look at me. Good for them.
.
jk the sooner fan
1/10/2006, 03:02 PM
If I owned a business I would fire everybody who ever wore clothes with the color orange. How far would that get me?
if you're managing a Hooters, not very far
mdklatt
1/10/2006, 03:02 PM
Because the CEO wants to do it this way. It is probably simpler just to chuck the smokers overboard, than complicate things for the benifits people.
But this is throwing out the baby with the bath water.
You're one of the best employees we have, and even though you personally haven't cost us an extra cent the actuaries say you will one day so we're going to fire your *** now.
I think that just about finishes up the interview...oh, wait couple more questions. Do you or have you ever used alcohol, red food coloring, potato chips, Crisco, salt, heart medications, diet plans, ibuprofen, red meat, soda, charcoal or light from the sun?
TopDaugIn2000
1/10/2006, 03:05 PM
the owner of the last company I worked for offered his employees $1000 cash to quit smoking. I almost started smoking just so I could quit!
don't know of a single person that took him up on that offer either. he even offered to bring in counselors and such to help them quit.
royalfan5
1/10/2006, 03:05 PM
But this is throwing out the baby with the bath water.
You're one of the best employees we have, and even though you personally haven't cost us an extra cent the actuaries say you will one day so we're going to fire your *** now.A good employee would care about what he is doing to the companies cost structure.
yermom
1/10/2006, 03:07 PM
just fire them for taking smoke breaks
that should fix the glitch just fine
Okla-homey
1/10/2006, 03:08 PM
The CEO of Scott's (the lawn company) annouced on street signs this morning that they will begin firing smokers in one year in the 19 states it is legal for them to do so. In the intervening year they will pay for current smokers efforts to quit. They are doing this to save on health care costs. Scott's also puts a large emphasis on employees health by offering workout facilities to use on the clock. I say good for them.
First off, I'm not sure it would survive a serious challenge on constitutional right-to-privacy grounds. Tobacco is a legal product people and adults have a legal right to use it -- off company property and when they're not on the clock. I can see them charging smokers more for their health plan, but thats it.
Secondly, do they plan random nicotine tests? Otherwise, how the heck do they discriminate if a guy says "I just quit?" Could be problematic, especially since dip, chew, nicotine patches and nicotine gum all register similarly on blood tests. Or will there be an outright ban on nicotine?
What about people who live with smokers and ingest enough nicotine during the course of their daily lives to pop hot on a nicotine test?
What about fatties? Are they going to fire them too if they don't lose weight? Its pretty well established that obese people have higher health care costs.
How about women? Their health care costs are higher on average than men. Fire them too?
They actually considered something like this "can the smokers" carp for a nano-second in the AF a few years back but decided it would be too tough to implement for a lot of the above reasons.
I bet if someone got canned over this they could bring a wrongful discharge suit and they could very well win big. It's happened before.
just saying.
mdklatt
1/10/2006, 03:10 PM
A good employee would care about what he is doing to the companies cost structure.
Are fatasses next on the list?
Johnson, we need to talk. The parking lot security guard saw an empty McDonald's french fry container in your car--Biggie Size no less. Start cleaning out your desk immediately.
A good employee would care about what he is doing to the companies cost structure.
Tell that to Fatty McFats in the moo-moo feeding her face with chips and Bon-Bon's on the weekend.
Some company tried this or did this a few years ago. I remember the initial uproar but I don't know what ever happened with it.
yermom
1/10/2006, 03:11 PM
i have a hard time agreeing with firing someone for something they legally do outside of work
what's next? riding a motorcycle? picking up skanks?
mdklatt
1/10/2006, 03:16 PM
Out of college I applied to a construction company out of Atlanta. Wouldn't talk to me after I sid 'Yes, I'm from Copenhagen'.
Discrimination against Danes is illegal.
1stTimeCaller
1/10/2006, 03:16 PM
If you don't like your boss or the company's policies where you currently you can always go work somewhere else.
If the healthcare provider that Scott uses says, 'We're going to raise your premiums due to smoker's costs' why shouldn't they either raise the smoker's rates or help them quit and give them a year to do so?
Don't wanna quit and work somewhere else? Then wait and get fired.
In employment at will states you can be fired for any reason other than your race and other protected classes of people.
royalfan5
1/10/2006, 03:17 PM
Are fatasses next on the list?
Johnson, we need to talk. The parking lot security guard saw an empty McDonald's french fry container in your car--Biggie Size no less. Start cleaning out your desk immediately.
Hopefully. A company should be able to do what it wants in regards to who it employees.
royalfan5
1/10/2006, 03:18 PM
First off, I'm not sure it would survive a serious challenge on constitutional right-to-privacy grounds. Tobacco is a legal product people and adults have a legal right to use it -- off company property and when they're not on the clock. I can see them charging smokers more for their health plan, but thats it.
Secondly, do they plan random nicotine tests? Otherwise, how the heck do they discriminate if a guy says "I just quit?" Could be problematic, especially since dip, chew, nicotine patches and nicotine gum all register similarly on blood tests. Or will there be an outright ban on nicotine?
What about people who live with smokers and ingest enough nicotine during the course of their daily lives to pop hot on a nicotine test?
What about fatties? Are they going to fire them too if they don't lose weight? Its pretty well established that obese people have higher health care costs.
How about women? Their health care costs are higher on average than men. Fire them too?
They actually considered something like this "can the smokers" carp for a nano-second in the AF a few years back but decided it would be too tough to implement for a lot of the above reasons.
I bet if someone got canned over this they could bring a wrongful discharge suit and they could very well win big. It's happened before.
just saying.
Depends on if your in an at-will state. If you can already be fired just because a company feels like it, it won't matter much. Plus smokers aren't a protected class.
1stTimeCaller
1/10/2006, 03:19 PM
Employment-At-Will
This policy explains that employees who do not have an individualized written employment contract or a collective bargaining agreement are employed at the will of the Company and are subject to termination at any time, for any reason, with or without cause or notice. These employees may terminate their employment at any time and for any reason.
mdklatt
1/10/2006, 03:22 PM
Hopefully. A company should be able to do what it wants in regards to who it employees.
I'm not saying what Scott's is doing is illegal, just that it's stupid.
royalfan5
1/10/2006, 03:26 PM
I'm not saying what Scott's is doing is illegal, just that it's stupid.In America, companies should be free to be as stupid as they want. Artifical restraint of stupidy is what the communists want.
Who are the Nazis that come up with this crap.I can understand not letting people smoke in certain buildings because smoke reeks bigtime.
But trying to regulate what people do on thier own time is BS.That is why we use to have unions,so *******s cant push the little guy around.People need to take a stand against this **** before it gets out of hand.
mdklatt
1/10/2006, 03:28 PM
In America, companies should be free to be as stupid as they want.
I don't disagree.
Artifical restraint of stupidy is what the communists want.
In America we make it too easy to be stupid. It's bad for the gene pool.
handcrafted
1/10/2006, 03:29 PM
Illegal, no. Stupid, probably, unless the aforementioned health insurance carrier is going to drop them unless they do this, or increase their rates a bunch. A company has to do a cost-benefit analysis of something like this. It could also be just the CEO's wild hair, but then, ya know, he's the *boss*, he can do that.
Even though it would be legal, IMO any company that goes overboard in disciplining employees for being "unhealthy" will quickly find the situation unworkable. More power to Scott's, if they can make it work, but I have my doubts. Now, *I* wouldn't work for them, y'understand, because my monthly (or so) cigar is something I enjoy, and I'm not into whizzing in a cup just because I choose to enjoy a legal leaf every so often. But like I said, if they can find enough good employees who are not put off by the policy, and they don't get a bad rep from all the firings, then who knows?
1stTimeCaller
1/10/2006, 03:32 PM
Who are the Nazis that come up with this crap.I can understand not letting people smoke in certain buildings because smoke reeks bigtime.
But trying to regulate what people do on thier own time is BS.That is why we use to have unions,so *******s cant push the little guy around.People need to take a stand against this **** before it gets out of hand.
Making employees quit smoking does not equal 18 hour days in a coal mine with no respirator for $1.50/hour.
nice try
C&CDean
1/10/2006, 03:41 PM
Who are the Nazis that come up with this crap.I can understand not letting people smoke in certain buildings because smoke reeks bigtime.
But trying to regulate what people do on thier own time is BS.That is why we use to have unions,so *******s cant push the little guy around.People need to take a stand against this **** before it gets out of hand.
This might possibly be this year's winner for "dumbest post evar." It at least merits honorable mention.
1. Unions suck monkey dong.
2. Smokers suck monkey dong.
3. Business owners should be able to hire/fire/discipline anyone they want, at any time.
If you smoke, quit. Or at least quit whining.
If you wanna be so stupid as to take some dried out weeds, roll them up in chemically saturated paper, light them, and inhale the smoke from this fire deep into your lungs - WITHOUT EVEN THE BENEFIT OF AN ACCOMPANYING BUZZ!!!! - then you really don't deserve an opinion. Quit. Or get fired.
I like it.
Herr Scholz
1/10/2006, 03:41 PM
Are fatasses next on the list?
Johnson, we need to talk. The parking lot security guard saw an empty McDonald's french fry container in your car--Biggie Size no less. Start cleaning out your desk immediately.
The leading cause of death in this country is heart disease. It's been shown that the crap food our country shovels down is more of an economic drain in terms of medical costs than smoking.
Scott's should fire frequent patrons of McDonalds before they fire smokers. And the government should tax the crap out of fast food as well. If they're taxing sin items such as alcohol and cigarettes under the guise of medical costs, they should do the same with Taco Bell.
C&CDean
1/10/2006, 03:44 PM
The leading cause of death in this country is heart disease. It's been shown that the crap food our country shovels down is more of an economic drain in terms of medical costs than smoking.
Scott's should fire frequent patrons of McDonalds before they fire smokers. And the government should tax the crap out of fast food as well. If they're taxing sin items such as alcohol and cigarettes under the guise of medical costs, they should do the same with Taco Bell.
Yeah, that'd be a great argument Herr.........except for that people have to eat. They don't have to smoke.
I am not going to argue that obesity isn't bad/unhealthy/etc., but you can't regulate a neccessary function like caloric intake to sustain life.
1stTimeCaller
1/10/2006, 03:44 PM
Herr, when you become the CEO of the place you work then you can fire people for eating at McD's.
Write your Congressman if you think they should tax fast food.
Herr Scholz
1/10/2006, 03:47 PM
Yeah, that'd be a great argument Herr.........except for that people have to eat. They don't have to smoke.
I am not going to argue that obesity isn't bad/unhealthy/etc., but you can't regulate a neccessary function like caloric intake to sustain life.
People won't starve if you take away McDonalds. It's regulating choice. If someone can be fired for choosing to smoke, they should be able to be fired for choosing a 1,000 calorie Jack in the Box double cheeseburger for lunch.
I love me some hamburgers, don't get me wrong, just playing devil's advocate.
TopDaugIn2000
1/10/2006, 03:50 PM
btw, Chicken Express opened yesterday in Pauls Valley.
This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard of. Even I wouldn't fit in their biggest jars. Morans.
http://www.polsteins.com/images/prod/8/prod-0002758-prod.jpg
C&CDean
1/10/2006, 03:57 PM
You know Pat, you'd be as big as hairy if you didn't suck. On coffin nails. And come out to the ranch. We could easily fit what'd be left of you in a quart cannin' jar.
OUstudent4life
1/10/2006, 03:58 PM
I'm betting most of their smokers wait to get fired instead of trying to quit, based on conversations I and my wife have had with various patients:
Patient: what can I do to get healthy/stop coughing/lower blood pressure/help with my circulation 'cause I'm losing a leg due to my diabetes?
Us: well, you should definitely stop smoking.
Them: well, what else could I do?
I'm just glad the University and OU Medical Center finally stopped all smoking on campus and around the hospitals. Nothing like seeing the throat cancer patients getting pushed around outside by a family member in their wheelchairs just to smoke through their trach holes.
JohnnyMack
1/10/2006, 03:58 PM
This is the stupidest thing I've ever heard of. Even I wouldn't fit in their biggest jars. Morans.
http://www.polsteins.com/images/prod/8/prod-0002758-prod.jpg
Good stuff.
IB4OU2
1/10/2006, 03:59 PM
You know Pat, you'd be as big as hairy if you didn't suck. On coffin nails. And come out to the ranch. We could easily fit what'd be left of you in a quart cannin' jar.
Pickled Pat? Uh, no thanks.........
KABOOKIE
1/10/2006, 03:59 PM
So let me get this striaght. It's OK for a company to fire you if you're doing anything on your own time that isn't esstial to life. Oooook! :D
Tailwind
1/10/2006, 03:59 PM
I wouldn't mind if my company would pay to get me to stop smoking.
Pickled Pat? Uh, no thanks.........
Pat's Pickle, maybe?
You know Pat, you'd be as big as hairy if you didn't suck. On coffin nails. And come out to the ranch. We could easily fit what'd be left of you in a quart cannin' jar.
I doubt it. I'm thinking it's mostly genes and whatnot.
KABOOKIE
1/10/2006, 04:01 PM
Pat's Pickle, maybe?
I thought it was cucumbers? :confused:
Red October
1/10/2006, 04:02 PM
I think I am going to use Scott's from now on. Good for them, I hope other companies follow the idea.
Smoking is a nasty, stinky, filthy, disgusting habit, and I will go out of my way to avoid businesses and people that smoke.
If you smoke, quit, not only are you hurting yourselves, you are hurting others.
yermom
1/10/2006, 04:02 PM
Nothing like seeing the throat cancer patients getting pushed around outside by a family member in their wheelchairs just to smoke through their trach holes.
they should switch to Chewlie's Gum
IB4OU2
1/10/2006, 04:03 PM
I thought it was cucumbers? :confused:
baby gershwin........?
mdklatt
1/10/2006, 04:04 PM
they should switch to Chewlie's Gum
Who do you work for?
:D
baby gershwin........?
Gerkin!!!
I think I am going to use Scott's from now on. Good for them, I hope other companies follow the idea.
Smoking is a nasty, stinky, filthy, disgusting habit, and I will go out of my way to avoid businesses and people that smoke.
I'll kindly thank you to stop enjoying my many hilarious and informative posts.
:D
IB4OU2
1/10/2006, 04:08 PM
Gerkin!!!
Thanks....I knew you could correct me....:D
Octavian
1/10/2006, 04:09 PM
In America, companies should be free to be as stupid as they want. Artifical restraint of stupidy is what the communists want.
take a break from the right-wing radio.
This might possibly be this year's winner for "dumbest post evar." It at least merits honorable mention.
1. Unions suck monkey dong.
2. Smokers suck monkey dong.
3. Business owners should be able to hire/fire/discipline anyone they want, at any time.
If you smoke, quit. Or at least quit whining.
If you wanna be so stupid as to take some dried out weeds, roll them up in chemically saturated paper, light them, and inhale the smoke from this fire deep into your lungs - WITHOUT EVEN THE BENEFIT OF AN ACCOMPANYING BUZZ!!!! - then you really don't deserve an opinion. Quit. Or get fired.
I like it.
Nothing like a little angst to get peoples blood boiling.If everyone agreed with each others opinions,we would still be in the dark ages.
Newbomb Turk
1/10/2006, 04:13 PM
I think I am going to use Scott's from now on. Good for them, I hope other companies follow the idea.
Good - I'll stop using Scotts.
I'm not a smoker either. I just think this is BS.
royalfan5
1/10/2006, 04:13 PM
take a break from the right-wing radio.
I don't listen to the radio, I just believe in capitalism.
silverwheels
1/10/2006, 04:17 PM
I'm not a smoker either. I just think this is BS.
Same here.
Octavian
1/10/2006, 04:23 PM
I don't listen to the radio, I just believe in capitalism.
sounds like you've found religion
C&CDean
1/10/2006, 05:19 PM
Nothing like a little angst to get peoples blood boiling.If everyone agreed with each others opinions,we would still be in the dark ages.
True. But if everyone agreed with me, we'd be damned righteous.
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