Let's stir it up a bit

[swardboy]

OU Headed to SEC Rumors

By DHazlewood (http://www.sbnation.com/users/DHazlewood)  @Dn4sty (http://twitter.com/Dn4sty) on Jun 30, 2015, 11:26p + (http://www.crimsonandcreammachine.com/2015/6/30/8875043/ou-headed-to-sec-rumors#comments)

https://cdn2.vox-cdn.com/thumbor/nBTTewLePMcED-r6PFHyj5WAwB8=/0x23:4703x3158/709x473/cdn0.vox-cdn.com/uploads/chorus_image/image/46649156/usa-today-8250606.0.jpg
John David Mercer-USA TODAY Sports

We really like page views, so we will start this rumor train again.

Football news is sparse during the dog days of summer. Recruiting takes a back seat, vacations happen, and we are still over 60 days from kickoff. So what better way to pass the time, than re-kicking the tires on conference realignment.

The man that almost every OU fans loves to hate had this to say on twitter regarding realignment.


Follow

https://pbs.twimg.com/profile_images/423866040292888576/kr0F-i-l_bigger.jpegPaul FinebaumVerified account‏@finebaum (https://twitter.com/finebaum)

According to @ESPN_Colin (https://twitter.com/ESPN_Colin) "The Big 5 in CFB is ready to be the Big 4... BigXII will evaporate, Oklahoma is SEC bound & the Pac12 wants Texas"

So IF this gigantic hypothetical were to happen what would it look like? The SEC currently sets at 14 members. Here they are
Mizzou
Arkansas
Texas A&M
Kentucky
LSU
Alabama
Auburn
Vanderbilt
Tennessee
South Carolina
Georgia
Florida
Ole Miss
Mississippi St.

Adding just one team makes little sense for the conference, so a team like Virginia Tech could also be in play.
Here are some initial thoughts on this crazy scenario

1- The Football Schedule Would Be Incredible

Road games to Tuscaloosa, Athens, Baton Rouge, Gainesville, and Oxford would crush road games in Ames or Lubbock.
How about LSU coming to Norman or hosting the Gators? The college football star power in these match-ups would be amazing.

2- Recruiting

While the Sooners would probably experience a slight uptick in recruiting by joining the SEC, some real concerns would emerge long term. The state of Oklahoma doesn't produce the quality of in-state talent on par with the likes of Alabama or Mississippi. This could be a problem going forward.

3- What About OU-OSU?

Initially I'm inclined to say "eh who cares" as part of me would enjoy watching the Pokes fade into obscurity. However, it would be completely possible to schedule this as an out of conference game each season. Another hypothetical would be for the Pokes to come with the Sooners as the 16th team in the SEC. While I guess anything could happen, the Pokes following the Sooners to the SEC is highly unlikely.

4- Goodbye Kansas State, TTech, TCU, Baylor, Iowa State, and OKState

The Kansas basketball program makes them a team that won't get left out in the reshuffle. Texas will no doubt be fine and land on it's feet. The rest could be left out in the cold. Several would probably get gobbled up by the PAC 12 along with Texas, but this scenario inevitably leaves a couple of these teams out in the cold.

5- Will this ACTUALLY Happen?

Not anytime soon. The Big 12 is already dead, it just hasn't had its funeral yet. Nebraska, Colorado, and Texas A&M combined with the Longhorn Network was the final nail in the coffin. Even though the conference is dead, we will have to wait several years for it to be finally laid rest.

Swardboy note: The Big 10 is all of a sudden a powerhouse conference again. I think Harbaugh will have success at Michigan, and Meyer could build perennial success at Ohio State. The Big 12 has a problem. Does anyone believe Baylor and TCU are going to remain perennial powers?

[SoonerorLater]

We can only hope.

[Eielson]

Sounds like some good off-season trolling.

[Tear Down This Wall]

If this happens, they'll let the Big 12 limp along for a few years, the same way they did the Big East, before they take it out back and put it out of its misery.

[Tear Down This Wall]

I'm inclined to believe the Big 10 would take Kansas, based on basketball and "academic reputation." I'd hope they'd take K-State as well.

Iowa State should go to the MAC, where it belongs.

The ones from Texas can rot away in whatever version of C-USA/Sun Belt/American Athletic they can cobble together. Maybe then they can invite in BYU. The remaining Texas schools are so accustomed to having someone else call the shots for them that they could then invite in BYU to push them around.

[Pride1Mom]

Supposedly, one of the reasons OU didn't leave for the SEC was the "so-called" tie with OSU. They said the same thing to Texas A&M and Texas, like Texas A&M couldn't survive without Texas. Looks like that notion was tossed out. If Alabama is supposed to be the power house, and OU has beaten Alabama three times in a row, wouldn't the other teams be gravy for OU, too? Since the SEC has too many schools, why can't the Big XII get a couple of their teams? Remember when the Big XII was first formed they had the most schools in the National Championship game......

[Eielson]

Cutting conference ties with OSU and Texas, unless under desperate circumstances, would be stupid. We're not currently under desperate circumstances.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Supposedly, one of the reasons OU didn't leave for the SEC was the "so-called" tie with OSU. They said the same thing to Texas A&M and Texas, like Texas A&M couldn't survive without Texas. Looks like that notion was tossed out. If Alabama is supposed to be the power house, and OU has beaten Alabama three times in a row, wouldn't the other teams be gravy for OU, too? Since the SEC has too many schools, why can't the Big XII get a couple of their teams? Remember when the Big XII was first formed they had the most schools in the National Championship game......

I couldn't care less how many times in a row we've beaten Alabama. What I'd like, as a season ticket holder, is the fact that we'd have in schools like Auburn, Bama, Georgia, Florida, LSU, etc. instead of Texas Tech, Iowa State, Baylor, TCU, etc.

The value of the season ticket would be much higher...ever try to sell a spare ticket to an Iowa State game? I couldn't go to the Kansas game last season - the Perine record breaker - so I put the tickets on the Soonersports.com exchange the day before...no one bought them. I had them on for $10 a piece, lower bowl, north end zone where the Ponies and Pride run out, 16 rows up. No takers to watch us beat the snot out of Kansas for 100th time in a row.

Crazy. Replace that garbage we inherited from the failed SWC and Big East with football programs that have followings - win, lose, or draw. It's what I argued four years ago. Please, Boren and Castiglione, make it happen!

[badger]

They said the same thing to Texas A&M and Texas, like Texas A&M couldn't survive without Texas.

A comparable situation would be OSU leaving OU for the SEC. If Texas left Texas A&M behind for the SEC, there would be much Aggie howling, like an inbred collie wearing fake army insignia. :rcmad:

If OU leaves OSU behind? Hell hath no fury. :stunned:

[Tear Down This Wall]

Cutting conference ties with OSU and Texas, unless under desperate circumstances, would be stupid. We're not currently under desperate circumstances.

So, you disagree with Bob Stoops who said in 2011 that we could easily stop playing Texas and it wouldn't be a big deal?

https://oklahoma.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1261455

But with the uncertainty in the Big 12, and with Oklahoma President David Boren seeking stability in the Sooners' conference affiliation, Bob Stoops says he could see the Red River Rivalry coming to an end in the near future.

"I don't think it's necessary," said Stoops of continuing the rivalry if Oklahoma and Texas take up residence in separate conferences. "I know no one wants to hear that, but life changes and you've got to change with it, to whatever degree. If it works, great. I love the game, but if it doesn't, it doesn't. Sometimes that's the way it goes."

[Soonerjeepman]

folks, including myself, hated to see OU/husker rivalry go to the way side...but it did and life went on.

[swardboy]

We've played Alabama tough, we beat Tennessee, we were one incomplete pass away from beating LSU for the national championship...I think we would more than hold our own in the SEC. South Carolina's no worse than traveling to West Virginia...plus we'd get to play the old ball coach. I hear there's nothing better than tail-gating at Ole Miss. Plus having the Razorbacks into Norman to slaughter...great!

Nawwww....it ain't gonna happen.

[Tear Down This Wall]

We've played Alabama tough, we beat Tennessee, we were one incomplete pass away from beating LSU for the national championship...I think we would more than hold our own in the SEC. South Carolina's no worse than traveling to West Virginia...plus we'd get to play the old ball coach. I hear there's nothing better than tail-gating at Ole Miss. Plus having the Razorbacks into Norman to slaughter...great!

Nawwww....it ain't gonna happen.

Man, just think about it though. And ... and, those SOBs at Mizzou have it! That's the thing that just eats at me about the whole thing.

I understand Texas A&M, their big stadium filled with Big Southern Dummies - total SEC appeal. But, Mizzou and their imitation football stadium and program? Come on, man.

[Tear Down This Wall]

folks, including myself, hated to see OU/husker rivalry go to the way side...but it did and life went on.

Amen that. After growing up on the OU-Nebraska/Switzer-Osborne rivalry...if that can be let go, we can surely turn loose of the 'Horns.

[Sabanball]

Oklahoma will not be coming to the sec. That train left the station 3 yrs ago. The sec's next expansion will be eastward, probably into the states of Virginia and North Carolina. More than likely you guys will end up in the PAC 12.

[SoonerorLater]

Oklahoma will not be coming to the sec. That train left the station 3 yrs ago. The sec's next expansion will be eastward, probably into the states of Virginia and North Carolina. More than likely you guys will end up in the PAC 12.

Not really. OU would be as likely to end up in the SEC as anyplace else. Personally I think a 16 team conference is just plain silly but that is where I believe this is heading, four 16 team conferences. The math for an eight team playoff works out perfect. How it all plays out seems to be which conference cracks first, the ACC or the Big 12.

[Eielson]

So, you disagree with Bob Stoops who said in 2011 that we could easily stop playing Texas and it wouldn't be a big deal?

https://oklahoma.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=1261455

But with the uncertainty in the Big 12, and with Oklahoma President David Boren seeking stability in the Sooners' conference affiliation, Bob Stoops says he could see the Red River Rivalry coming to an end in the near future.

"I don't think it's necessary," said Stoops of continuing the rivalry if Oklahoma and Texas take up residence in separate conferences. "I know no one wants to hear that, but life changes and you've got to change with it, to whatever degree. If it works, great. I love the game, but if it doesn't, it doesn't. Sometimes that's the way it goes."

Stoops supports your viewpoint, so his word is Gospel now? What about all the other times you've second-guessed him?

I'm not saying we couldn't survive. I'm saying it's stupid to do it unless we have to.

[Eielson]

Oklahoma will not be coming to the sec. That train left the station 3 yrs ago. The sec's next expansion will be eastward, probably into the states of Virginia and North Carolina.

OU can go wherever they want to go. We're not getting passed on for UVA or UNC.

[Sooner in Tampa]

OU can go wherever they want to go. We're not getting passed on for UVA or UNC.

Yup...it is beyond stupid to suggest otherwise.

The ONLY way the SEC is passes on OU is if they feel it would indeed create a murders row year in and year out. There would/could be a general fear that there is too much of a good thing.

We have years to ponder the scenarios...

[Tear Down This Wall]

OU can go wherever they want to go. We're not getting passed on for UVA or UNC.

Really? Then why did the Pac-12 turn us down in 2011 as a solo deal after Texas jumped ship on the package?

The Pac-12 wanted Texas, first and foremost. They would have taken us along with them. They did not want any other school tagging along. And, they didn't want us solo without Texas.

It's likely still that way for the Pac-12.

SEC was a different story. They would have taken us in a heartbeat had Boren and Castiglione not overplayed the Pac-12 hand that they didn't know would blow up on them. They needed a school to level out taking on Texas A&M, so much so that they took crappy Mizzou when Boren and Castiglione brushed them off.

Stupid. Boren and Castiglione not understanding what the Pac-12 really wanted was horrible. How disconnected from your fellow university presidents and athletic directors do you have to be that not even one will back channel you to warn that it's Texas or no one?

http://collegefootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2011/09/20/hold-up-pac-12-not-expanding/

Awful. Then, to stick us with TCU and West Virginia. You talk about being reactive versus being proactive.

[FaninAma]

Really? Then why did the Pac-12 turn us down in 2011 as a solo deal after Texas jumped ship on the package?

The Pac-12 wanted Texas, first and foremost. They would have taken us along with them. They did not want any other school tagging along. And, they didn't want us solo without Texas.

It's likely still that way for the Pac-12.

SEC was a different story. They would have taken us in a heartbeat had Boren and Castiglione not overplayed the Pac-12 hand that they didn't know would blow up on them. They needed a school to level out taking on Texas A&M, so much so that they took crappy Mizzou when Boren and Castiglione brushed them off.

Stupid. Boren and Castiglione not understanding what the Pac-12 really wanted was horrible. How disconnected from your fellow university presidents and athletic directors do you have to be that not even one will back channel you to warn that it's Texas or no one?

Awful. Then, to stick us with TCU and West Virginia. You talk about being reactive versus being proactive.
The Pac-12 took Utah and Colorado but did not want OU? Ummm, OK. I think Boren nixed the deal when Texas didn't go to the Pac-12. Boren has made some really ignorant decisions regarding conference affiliation recently.

[Tear Down This Wall]

The Pac-12 took Utah and Colorado but did not want OU? Ummm, OK. I think Boren nixed the deal when Texas didn't go to the Pac-12. Boren has made some really ignorant decisions regarding conference affiliation recently.

That's not how it went down, though. When the Pac-12 and Texas couldn't agree on what to do about Longhorn Network, Pac-12 pulled the plug on the deal - which surprised us at the time.

Boren and Castiglione tried to continue to negotiate causing the Pac-12 commissioner to release a public statement saying that the Pac-12 was staying put.

Pac-12 has always been about getting Texas on board, not us. SEC wanted us on board, and we snubbed them. It is as stupid now as it was then.

If we really do have the SEC door opening to us again, we need to quit f*cking around and take it. Adding sh*thole programs like Houston, UCF, or USF is vomit.

[swardboy]

If we really do have the SEC door opening to us again, we need to quit f*cking around and take it. Adding sh*thole programs like Houston, UCF, or USF is vomit.

Yeah.....Diarrhea dog pooo!

[Sabanball]

You guys have a great football product--one of the best, in fact--there's no doubt. But we don't need enhancement in that area, and you have more in common with the Midwest and Far West than you do with the traditional Deep South. Remember too, money from upcoming, yet to be negotiated tv contracts is the driver here--It's all about eyeballs and tv sets, and adding Oklahoma with its just under 4 million population compared to the population centers in NC and Va is what convinces me more than anything that you guys will end up out west. heck, even if you throw in the D/FW area as part of your tv market it's still no comparison.

Personally, I'd love to have you guys, but it ain't gonna happen.

[SoonerorLater]

You guys have a great football product--one of the best, in fact--there's no doubt. But we don't need enhancement in that area, and you have more in common with the Midwest and Far West than you do with the traditional Deep South. Remember too, money from upcoming, yet to be negotiated tv contracts is the driver here--It's all about eyeballs and tv sets, and adding Oklahoma with its just under 4 million population compared to the population centers in NC and Va is what convinces me more than anything that you guys will end up out west. heck, even if you throw in the D/FW area as part of your tv market it's still no comparison.

Personally, I'd love to have you guys, but it ain't gonna happen.

This is why you might be wrong. Large TV markets are great......if people actually turn on the TV and watch. This is the most recent ratings I can find. Notice no VA or NC markets


http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2014/12/birmingham_is_top_tv_market_fo.html

[jiminy]

Err... except for Charlotte, Norfolk, Richmond and Raleigh-Durham. But they are all 4 below both OKC and Tulsa.

[SoonerorLater]

Err... except for Charlotte, Norfolk, Richmond and Raleigh-Durham. But they are all 4 below both OKC and Tulsa.

I guess I should have clarified, the top 10 in the article.

[Sabanball]

3 years ago when the window was open, I thought conditions and circumstances were right for OU to accept an invitation to the sec, and I was enthusiasticly for it. I thought your president was extremely short-sighted in his decision when Mike Slive came with hat in hand to offer you guys membership and even said that here and caught a lot of flack for it. Now, though, circumstances are quite different and I have yet to hear a compelling argument that would convince me that the SEC is revisiting this--especially given Boren's well-documented derogatory comments about sec academics and your own head coach's continued verbal crusade against the sec. Of course, I could be wrong. We will see how it plays out. Sometimes these things pan out like we least expect.
The end game as I see it---we are evolving into 4 super conferences whether we agree with it or not, and I believe the big 12 is on life support, will eventually disband, and that at this time it would behoove OU to make the best deal that it can with the PAC 12.

Besides, we could never meet in the NC game for all the marbles if we were both beating each other's brains out each season in the sec west.

[swardboy]

That's kinda the point with us Sabanball...we always beat Bama. it would be our pleasure to take Bama out of the national conversation every year by beating your brains out in the regular season. Yeah, that's the ticket...

[King Crimson]

this will be unpopular, but i don't see why the SEC is snotty tooth about OSU. they have a top 25 type program as long as turkey neck t. boone has money and Gundy is a good coach. basketball is a NCAA first round type program with Ford. OSU is good if not great at the spring non-revenue sports that are big in the South....golf, baseball.

what Oklahoma doesn't have is population density.....so, that's an issue vis a vis fannies in front of tv's paying ad revenue....which is all about. that was the end of the Big 8. not enough fannies buying dominoes pizzas and wings in OK and NE and Iowa and Kansas...even tho lord knows we got fatasses that try. nebraska and colorado were top 10 programs, winning almost half of the MNC's in the 90's...we sucked but are going to be back.....the big 8 was sending 5 teams to the NCAA tournament....but, there just wasn't tv revenue. athletically, the conference was one of the best across the board....but, money is the game now and that means population density and ad revenues and the epsn tv deal and media markets.

losing MU, CU, and NU were a big hit....i think the Big XII has kinda held the dike thus far. losing ATM is ok with me, buncha wankers and i'm not sure i believe in Sumlin. in the long run, Texas needs to get better under Strong (i'll take a shower now) and we'll need to not screw up replacing Stoops.

and while 5 years ago i thought the SEC was a good move for us.....we aren't a Pac 10 type thing...it was unpopular with fans.....now, i can easily live without that SEC circle jerk.

[SoonerorLater]

this will be unpopular, but i don't see why the SEC is snotty tooth about OSU. they have a top 25 type program as long as turkey neck t. boone has money and Gundy is a good coach. basketball is a NCAA first round type program with Ford. OSU is good if not great at the spring non-revenue sports that are big in the South....golf, baseball.

what Oklahoma doesn't have is population density.....so, that's an issue vis a vis fannies in front of tv's paying ad revenue....which is all about. that was the end of the Big 8. not enough fannies buying dominoes pizzas and wings in OK and NE and Iowa and Kansas...even tho lord knows we got fatasses that try. nebraska and colorado were top 10 programs, winning almost half of the MNC's in the 90's...we sucked but are going to be back.....the big 8 was sending 5 teams to the NCAA tournament....but, there just wasn't tv revenue. athletically, the conference was one of the best across the board....but, money is the game now and that means population density and ad revenues and the epsn tv deal and media markets.

losing MU, CU, and NU were a big hit....i think the Big XII has kinda held the dike thus far. losing ATM is ok with me, buncha wankers and i'm not sure i believe in Sumlin. in the long run, Texas needs to get better under Strong (i'll take a shower now) and we'll need to not screw up replacing Stoops.

and while 5 years ago i thought the SEC was a good move for us.....we aren't a Pac 10 type thing...it was unpopular with fans.....now, i can easily live without that SEC circle jerk.


I think the population thing is way overblown. If that was the largest criteria, everybody conference president would be falling all over themselves to add Northern Illinois and Rice. The product you put on the field is the main component that drives television viewership. It doesn't end at the state border.

[graphster]

Joining the PAC 12 seems like a horrible idea from a travel/time-zone standpoint. As much as 11 AM kickoffs suck, I think 10 PM kickoffs would be even worse. And while they have some strong programs, there are no natural rivalries or anything to get excited about. SEC seems to make more a lot more sense in almost every way possible, but maybe it's harder now to make that work than it was the last time this came up.

Either way, I think it's clear that the Big 12 is not a long-term solution. The worst case scenario would be to end up on the outside looking in when the next round of re-alignment happens.

[Soonerfan88]

Sorry sabanball & other SEC lovers, don't care if I do offend.

I absolutely do not want to join the SEC. I know that the $100 handshakes are impossible to stop but the SEC takes cheating to an entire different level and no argument about lack of findings in NCAA investigation will change my opinion. I don't want to see OU associated with that type of behavior again. Since it's impossible to get the old gang back together, I prefer OU go to the PAC.

[Sabanball]

This is why you might be wrong. Large TV markets are great......if people actually turn on the TV and watch. This is the most recent ratings I can find. Notice no VA or NC markets


http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2014/12/birmingham_is_top_tv_market_fo.html

Not true. It's based on cable subscriptions--not who is watching.

[Eielson]

This is why you might be wrong. Large TV markets are great......if people actually turn on the TV and watch. This is the most recent ratings I can find. Notice no VA or NC markets


http://www.al.com/sports/index.ssf/2014/12/birmingham_is_top_tv_market_fo.html

Orlando and Tampa Bay are on there!

[SoonerorLater]

Orlando and Tampa Bay are on there!

Hey I think you are on to something. According to Sabanball "It's based on cable subscriptions--not who is watching". So what do you think? The Big 12 adds UCF, USF, Northern Illinois, Rice, Eastern Michigan and UC Fullerton and we just wait for that money to start rolling in.

[Eielson]

Hey I think you are on to something. According to Sabanball "It's based on cable subscriptions--not who is watching". So what do you think? The Big 12 adds UCF, USF, Northern Illinois, Rice, Eastern Michigan and UC Fullerton and we just wait for that money to start rolling in.

Why would we want Rice? Silly.

[swardboy]

Why would we want Rice? Silly.

Ladies and gentlemen, place your trays up, fasten your seat belts, and make sure your sarcasm meters are in the "On" position.

[TAFBSooner]

I don't want to join the SEC, hope we never join the SEC, and if, fates forbid, we ever do, I am not going to chant their d@mn initials.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Joining the PAC 12 seems like a horrible idea from a travel/time-zone standpoint. As much as 11 AM kickoffs suck, I think 10 PM kickoffs would be even worse. And while they have some strong programs, there are no natural rivalries or anything to get excited about. SEC seems to make more a lot more sense in almost every way possible, but maybe it's harder now to make that work than it was the last time this came up.

Either way, I think it's clear that the Big 12 is not a long-term solution. The worst case scenario would be to end up on the outside looking in when the next round of re-alignment happens.

Was totally against the Pac-12 in 2011. But, never in my worst nightmares did I imagine we'd be bringing in TCU and West Virginia...or, flirting with the idea of bringing on Houston, Central Florida, or South Florida.

It's tough to imagine the situation getting any better. These days, the Pac-12 as a landing spot looks fine compared to what we'd be leaving behind. At this point, I'd accept an invitation to any of the other four conferences - Pac-12, SEC, Big Ten, or ACC.

[Pride1Mom]

NOT THE PAC 12!! I HATE ALL OF THE TEAMS! DO YOU WANT TO BE SUBJECT TO THE TERRIBLE REFEREES OVER AND OVER AGAIN?

[Tear Down This Wall]

NOT THE PAC 12!! I HATE ALL OF THE TEAMS! DO YOU WANT TO BE SUBJECT TO THE TERRIBLE REFEREES OVER AND OVER AGAIN?

I'll take the chances of terrible referees over being in the same conference with the likes of TCU, West Virginia, Houston, and UCF/USF.

[Eielson]

I'll take the chances of terrible referees over being in the same conference with the likes of TCU, West Virginia

Those teams with BCS bowl victories just grow on trees, don't they?

[Tear Down This Wall]

Those teams with BCS bowl victories just grow on trees, don't they?

What does that have to do with anything? The BCS is gone. And, a victory in one of their old bowl games is no reason to invite Johnny-Come-Lately football programs on board.

[Eielson]

What does that have to do with anything? The BCS is gone. And, a victory in one of their old bowl games is no reason to invite Johnny-Come-Lately football programs on board.

The BCS is gone? I'm surprised you knew that, as you don't seem to be able to keep up with the times.

West Virginia won the Sugar Bowl in 2006 against #7 Georgia, the Fiesta Bowl in 2008 against Oklahoma, and the Orange Bowl in 2012 against Clemson by 37 points. Throw in the fact that TCU won the Rose Bowl, and you've got every major event short of the the MNC covered by these two "embarrassments."

Seven of the mighty twelve that you so desperately yearn for never even won one of these games, so it seems like it's quite an accomplishment. Those 3 wins of WVU's is equal to OSU, KU, NU, KSU, BU, CU, A&M, TT, ISU, and MU combined.

[champions77]

Seems like a lot of OU fans have had a change of heart about the SEC? I know when this came up in 2011, you could nary find an OU fan in favor of joining the SEC.
After the mismanagement that has occurred in the BIG XII since it's inception, and continues to this day (One Champion?) we now more than ever realize that we blew an opportunity that does not come around very often, to very many schools. We decided to remain with a "diminished brand" that schools have been clamoring to leave almost from the very beginning? The BIG XII is neither Big nor 12.

The SEC? Schools don't leave the SEC, they just try and get IN the SEC. Whether or not we will have a second chance to be with the best is unknown today. I spend quite a bit of time on "Tidefans.com" and it seems the prevailing thought over there is they will look to Virginia and North Carolina to fill slots 15 and 16. Much higher populations states mean more cable subscriptions. If I had to guess, I would say that is probably where they will go next.

[SoonerorLater]

Seems like a lot of OU fans have had a change of heart about the SEC? I know when this came up in 2011, you could nary find an OU fan in favor of joining the SEC.
After the mismanagement that has occurred in the BIG XII since it's inception, and continues to this day (One Champion?) we now more than ever realize that we blew an opportunity that does not come around very often, to very many schools. We decided to remain with a "diminished brand" that schools have been clamoring to leave almost from the very beginning? The BIG XII is neither Big nor 12.

The SEC? Schools don't leave the SEC, they just try and get IN the SEC. Whether or not we will have a second chance to be with the best is unknown today. I spend quite a bit of time on "Tidefans.com" and it seems the prevailing thought over there is they will look to Virginia and North Carolina to fill slots 15 and 16. Much higher populations states mean more cable subscriptions. If I had to guess, I would say that is probably where they will go next.

Ah, the cable subscription thing. Like I said in my previous post why doesn't the Big 12 Add Rice, Northern Illinois, USF, UCF, Eastern Michigan and Cal St Fullerton. Now that's a lot of subscriptions.

[champions77]

Ah, the cable subscription thing. Like I said in my previous post why doesn't the Big 12 Add Rice, Northern Illinois, USF, UCF, Eastern Michigan and Cal St Fullerton. Now that's a lot of subscriptions.

Hey it's not everything, but it plays a huge role, i.e. Rutgers to the B1G.

[SoonerorLater]

Hey it's not everything, but it plays a huge role, i.e. Rutgers to the B1G.

If the SEC chose to take NC and VA this would be a net good thing for the Big 12. Actually I would welcome it. If those two schools left it would be the beginning of the end of the ACC as a football conference. At that point the football schools (Clemson, FSU, Miami, Va Tech) would start looking for an exit strategy.

[Eielson]

If the SEC chose to take NC and VA this would be a net good thing for the Big 12. Actually I would welcome it. If those two schools left it would be the beginning of the end of the ACC as a football conference. At that point the football schools (Clemson, FSU, Miami, Va Tech) would start looking for an exit strategy.

Amen! And that's when we pounce.

I think the Big XII is perfectly fine as is, and don't really want us to invite USF and UCF. I mentioned those two schools for if we HAD to expand to 12 teams, and couldn't pluck other P5 schools. I don't think we have to expand, though. Having said that, I do think that if we added ND and UCF that it would improve the conference.

I think it's almost inevitable that the ACC and Big XII will merge at some point. It's just uncertain what the terms are. Will the Big XII engulf the ACC, or will it be the other way around? I'd be happy with some kind of 8+8 agreement where we leave Tech and ISU behind.

[Eielson]

Now you have me thinking about having Miami and FSU in our conference, and I can't help but slobber. Big XII + ACC could really blow everybody else away when it's all said and done.

[Tear Down This Wall]

The BCS is gone? I'm surprised you knew that, as you don't seem to be able to keep up with the times.

West Virginia won the Sugar Bowl in 2006 against #7 Georgia, the Fiesta Bowl in 2008 against Oklahoma, and the Orange Bowl in 2012 against Clemson by 37 points. Throw in the fact that TCU won the Rose Bowl, and you've got every major event short of the the MNC covered by these two "embarrassments."

Seven of the mighty twelve that you so desperately yearn for never even won one of these games, so it seems like it's quite an accomplishment. Those 3 wins of WVU's is equal to OSU, KU, NU, KSU, BU, CU, A&M, TT, ISU, and MU combined.

Again, with the BCS dead, West Virginia sucking, and TCU producing a 7-6 and 4-8 seasons prior to catching lightning in a bottle last year, why am I supposed to care? West Virginia will continue to suck, and the odds of TCU reverting to form are greater than them producing another 12 - or even 10 - win season.

In short, the Big 12 has chosen horribly in "replacing" those schools who have left. Houston, Central Florida, and South Florida would nothing but continue to drive the conference toward C-USA-like competitiveness.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Since joining the Big 12:

West Virginia is 14-20 against FBS schools, 11-16 in Big 12 games.
TCU is 20-15 against FBS schools, 14-13 in Big 12 games.

You go ahead and be impressed with West Virginia and TCU. If and when OU leaves the Big 12, perhaps you can choose one of them as your new favorite school.

[Eielson]

Again, with the BCS dead, West Virginia sucking, and TCU producing a 7-6 and 4-8 seasons prior to catching lightning in a bottle last year, why am I supposed to care? West Virginia will continue to suck, and the odds of TCU reverting to from are greater than them producing another 12 - or even 10 - win season.

The BCS is in the past, yes. You know what else is in the past? Every single game that's ever been played.

Outside of winning a MNC, the biggest accomplishment you can achieve in college football is winning a BCS bowl game. WVU won BCS bowls in 2006, 2008, and 2012 with THREE separate coaches. That's a strong indication of consistent success. The fact that WVU and TCU got smacked in the mouth when they first entered the Big XII only shows the strength of the conference. If this were really C-USA they would have been winning conference championships from day 1 rather than having losing seasons.

[Eielson]

Since joining the Big 12:

West Virginia is 14-20 against FBS schools, 11-16 in Big 12 games.
TCU is 20-15 against FBS schools, 14-13 in Big 12 games.


Damn. The Big XII must be a tough conference. You've convinced me!

[Tear Down This Wall]

Not even close. That either one could produce a 12 win season in short amount of time shows how far it has fallen. Remember, it took Baylor 15 years to have a winning season after joining the Big 12.

In the years that followed that season, we had the exodus of established schools and entrance of the mediocre. Baylor has thrived in the watered down environment. Neither WVU nor TCU has done that.

The Big 12 a pathetic shell of the conference it once was. The sooner we leave it behind, the better. Sticking around and waiting to pick up C-USA/WAC/Big East scrap pile programs is not the answer.

[Eielson]

Not even close. That either one could produce a 12 win season in short amount of time shows how far it has fallen.

Make up your mind! You can't have it both ways. Just a minute ago you were saying that they've been horrible in our conference, which meant that they were terrible schools, and now you're saying that they've had some success, so that means the conference is terrible. That's not how logic works.


In the years that followed that season, we had the exodus of established schools and entrance of the mediocre. Baylor has thrived in the watered down environment. Neither WVU nor TCU has done that.

WHAT?!?!? One sentence ago you were talking about TCU producing a 12 win season in short time, and now you're saying they haven't thrived in this "watered down" environment? A 12 win season isn't thriving? Seriously, dude. Make up your mind.

[FaninAma]

Seems like a lot of OU fans have had a change of heart about the SEC? I know when this came up in 2011, you could nary find an OU fan in favor of joining the SEC.
After the mismanagement that has occurred in the BIG XII since it's inception, and continues to this day (One Champion?) we now more than ever realize that we blew an opportunity that does not come around very often, to very many schools. We decided to remain with a "diminished brand" that schools have been clamoring to leave almost from the very beginning? The BIG XII is neither Big nor 12.

The SEC? Schools don't leave the SEC, they just try and get IN the SEC. Whether or not we will have a second chance to be with the best is unknown today. I spend quite a bit of time on "Tidefans.com" and it seems the prevailing thought over there is they will look to Virginia and North Carolina to fill slots 15 and 16. Much higher populations states mean more cable subscriptions. If I had to guess, I would say that is probably where they will go next.

That's because the Big 12-4+2 is in a very untenable situation. Back when Nebraska, Missouri, Colorado(admittedly not a big loss) and TAMU left it appeared that the Big 12 had a lot of options in replacing them but most of the viable options were snapped up by other conferences. Boren and the other school presidents were able to console themselves with a new television deal but the harsh reality is that the Big 12 is dead in the water and there is zero chance that any decent programs will join the conference to give it a new spark. The worst case scenario is if Texas decides it wants to go it alone or join the Big 10. If that happens OU better have a Come-to-Jesus moment and grab whatever life preserver is thrown them by one of the remaining Power 5 conferences even if OSU isn't offered one.

[FaninAma]

Make up your mind! You can't have it both ways. Just a minute ago you were saying that they've been horrible in our conference, which meant that they were terrible schools, and now you're saying that they've had some success, so that means the conference is terrible. That's not how logic works.



WHAT?!?!? One sentence ago you were talking about TCU producing a 12 win season in short time, and now you're saying they haven't thrived in this "watered down" environment? A 12 win season isn't thriving? Seriously, dude. Make up your mind.
One year of success is thriving? Talk about lowering the bar.

[Eielson]

You chicken-littles crack me up. We're the University of Oklahoma, and there are no bad scenarios for us. Even if no other conferences wanted us (LOLOL!), we'd be just fine as an independent. Just about any team in the country would listen to us if we offered them a home-and-home. Hell, being an independent might be a GREAT scenario! We could have annual games against Texas, OSU, and probably Nebraska, and mix in games against schools like Miami, Alabama, ND, tOSU, Michigan, etc. however we please.

[Eielson]

One year is thriving? Talk about lowering the bar.

You're right. They've only been the best team in the conference once in three years, and they're preseason-projected to make it two out of four. They're definitely riding the struggle-bus.

[Sabanball]

If the SEC chose to take NC and VA this would be a net good thing for the Big 12. Actually I would welcome it. If those two schools left it would be the beginning of the end of the ACC as a football conference. At that point the football schools (Clemson, FSU, Miami, Va Tech) would start looking for an exit strategy.

I don't think the universities of North Carolina or Virginia are in play., though I think we would take Carolina in a heartbeat if they would come. BUT I DO think any future sec expansion will involve some combination of schools from those states. My best bet would be on NC State and Virginia Tech. Lots of upside as I see it--We would be getting a solid enhancer to our basketball portfolio(NCState), add a solid football program( Tech), and expand our footprint into two, fast-growing states that both have traditional ties to the Deep South. Also some very large TV markets in those areas, including the Washington DC market.

You guys have one of the Crown Jewels of college football( OU), but at this time I see no scenario where OU would again be offered membership in our conference. Instead I see your school eventually aligning with the PAC 12.

[champions77]

That's because the Big 12-4+2 is in a very untenable situation. Back when Nebraska, Missouri, Colorado(admittedly not a big loss) and TAMU left it appeared that the Big 12 had a lot of options in replacing them but most of the viable options were snapped up by other conferences. Boren and the other school presidents were able to console themselves with a new television deal but the harsh reality is that the Big 12 is dead in the water and there is zero chance that any decent programs will join the conference to give it a new spark. The worst case scenario is if Texas decides it wants to go it alone or join the Big 10. If that happens OU better have a Come-to-Jesus moment and grab whatever life preserver is thrown them by one of the remaining Power 5 conferences even if OSU isn't offered one.

I agree. Still believe that Boren was given assurances that OU was PAC bound, and when we found out we weren't, Mizzou has already taken our seat at the SEC table. I would hope that Boren would not now reconsider the PAC after what happened before, as it was embarrassing after the bravado Boren had shown about how badly OU was coveted. Now if the SEC things is not going to happen, I guess Boren would "forgive" Larry Scott for misleading OU.

You are right about the scarcity of quality schools left. And let's not just serve as a "life raft" for lesser programs that will do little but elevate them and not the conference so much. Can you imagine if we accepted Houston how much better they would recruit that valuable recruiting area? It would make OU's job that much harder to recruit great players, just like the SEC has helped A&M.

I hope and pray that we don't settle for a lesser conference just because the pukes up the road aren't invited. That would be a dereliction of duty as far as I'm concerned. That is not in President Boren's job description to accept a less desirable option for OU in order to help little brother. That would be cause for a torchlight demonstration at Boyd House demanding Boren's resignation, or at least it should be.

[Sabanball]

I agree. Still believe that Boren was given assurances that OU was PAC bound, and when we found out we weren't, Mizzou has already taken our seat at the SEC table. I would hope that Boren would not now reconsider the PAC after what happened before, as it was embarrassing after the bravado Boren had shown about how badly OU was coveted. Now if the SEC things is not going to happen, I guess Boren would "forgive" Larry Scott for misleading OU.

You are right about the scarcity of quality schools left. And let's not just serve as a "life raft" for lesser programs that will do little but elevate them and not the conference so much. Can you imagine if we accepted Houston how much better they would recruit that valuable recruiting area? It would make OU's job that much harder to recruit great players, just like the SEC has helped A&M.

I hope and pray that we don't settle for a lesser conference just because the pukes up the road aren't invited. That would be a dereliction of duty as far as I'm concerned. That is not in President Boren's job description to accept a less desirable option for OU in order to help little brother. That would be cause for a torchlight demonstration at Boyd House demanding Boren's resignation, or at least it should be.

Agreed, 77. Missouri has actually prospered since making the move, and I think your program would have also. You and I see that, as I think most other fans do. Why is Boren so far off the reservation on this, do you suppose? Was it really disdain for SEC academics? I'm sorry, but I just don't buy that one. Political entanglement with OSU? That one I can see.

[Tear Down This Wall]

One year of success is thriving? Talk about lowering the bar.

He doesn't understand the concept of the bar being lowered. That's why he doesn't look at the exodus of the more established programs and the taking on of the mediocre as becoming less competitive.

Baylor didn't thrive until programs began to leave. A&M handed them their as*s their final three seasons in conference. Nebraska never lost to Baylor in the Big 12, 8-0 against them as conference mates. Mizzou, 7-2 against Baylor. Even rapidly sinking Colorado was 4-3 against Baylor in the Big 12.

These leave and you glom on crappy West Virginia and TCU.

Also, the reason we complain about OU being mediocre is the coaching. The conference is ripe for the taking every year because it has become watered down, and Stoops & Company pi*ss it away in stupid ways. The stupidest is the move away from defense and toward becoming the puke factory that is the Texas Tech football program.

Even as mediocre as OU has become, they still have produced a better overall record in and out of conference than half-as*sed West Virginia and TCU.

It's awful. Adding Houston, Central Florida, and/or South Florida? That those schools are even discussed in the same breath with Oklahoma football shows how far the conference has fallen.

Boren and Castilgione have got to wake up, grab the last parachute for us, and get out before the whole thing crashes.

[champions77]

DB put all of his eggs in the PAC 12 basket, and we were left behind. I wonder if DB had done his due diligence a little better and seen that the commitment to OU was not there as Larry Scott had portrayed, if then Boren would have focused on the SEC more? When you think that you are going west, that becomes the focus, nothing else. Remember we may outwardly state that we are all about the BIG XII, but in 2011 we had no problem leaving the conference and creating the kayos that was sure to occur for the rest of the league.

I have heard from more than one source that DB is hearing it from the big money donors about their unhappiness with the Big XII, so much in fact that it is even having an adverse effect on raising money. That these donors see the BIG XII as a weakened conference, and that perception will have far reaching effects, from recruiting to selection into the Final Four. And there are not any worthy schools left that would strengthen the conference to where it needs to be. And leaving is the most prudent thing for OU to do.

I also can't help but think that the new Texas AD Steve Patterson is maybe up to some shenanigans of some sort or another. I mean don't you have to automatically look to the University of Texas first if there is some discontent in the conference? When you have a track record of running off Arkansas, Nebraska and Texas A&M, then you have quite a resume. Maybe Patterson feels the revenue sharing is not to his liking? Maybe Patterson has been given some signals from ESPN that their relationship with the LHN will not survive the long term, therefore Patterson sees a loss of revenue down the road and is trying to do something about it? If so, is OU now at the breaking point with UT, and coexisting with them is no longer palatable?

[Eielson]

He doesn't understand the concept of the bar being lowered. That's why he doesn't look at the exodus of the more established programs and the taking on of the mediocre as becoming less competitive.

Baylor didn't thrive until programs began to leave. A&M handed them their as*s their final three seasons in conference. Nebraska never lost to Baylor in the Big 12, 8-0 against them as conference mates. Mizzou, 7-2 against Baylor. Even rapidly sinking Colorado was 4-3 against Baylor in the Big 12.


Comparing Baylor under Guy Morriss and Kevin Steele to Baylor under Art Briles is like comparing Oklahoma with John Blake to Oklahoma with Bob Stoops.

You have a hard-on for teams with "tradition," and can't seem to get past the fact that Nebraska, Mizzou, and A&M were all middle-of-the-road Big XII programs. Colorado was a bottom-dweller. Sorry, but Tom Osborne is long gone, and TCU would beat every one of these teams that departed next year by at least two scores.

[Eielson]

I bet TDTW owns a brick and mortar book store.

[KantoSooner]

Why would you presume he reads books?

[Pride1Mom]

Are you going to travel to the away games if OU plays Georgia, Auburn, Florida, etc.? As for last year's Kansas game, the weather was a monsoon, and a lot of people did not go. I was there. Now the BigXII has West Virginia, and everyone complains about the travel expenses. The lesser sports, like softball and baseball and even basketball is really difficult. I can remember the constant flack about how Baylor was too small of a school, but it looks like they have made the competition more interesting......

[Eielson]

Are you going to travel to the away games if OU plays Georgia, Auburn, Florida, etc.?

The odds of me traveling to a game in Florida (UF, FSU, or Miami) are exponentially higher than me traveling to a game somewhere like Ames, IA or Lubbock, TX.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Are you going to travel to the away games if OU plays Georgia, Auburn, Florida, etc.? As for last year's Kansas game, the weather was a monsoon, and a lot of people did not go. I was there. Now the BigXII has West Virginia, and everyone complains about the travel expenses. The lesser sports, like softball and baseball and even basketball is really difficult. I can remember the constant flack about how Baylor was too small of a school, but it looks like they have made the competition more interesting......

Yes. We travel to good away games. We didn't go to the Kansas game for a number of reasons; rain was just one of them. But, mainly, having already lost to TCU, Kansas State, and Baylor, there was nothing on the line.

The Kansas game is always a win anyway. The QB situation was a joke, as was the defense. So, for those of us that travel, it was a question of do we spend money for the whole weekend thing (gas, hotel, food, goodies for the kids, etc.) to watch a game with is rarely any more competitive or compelling that the Red-White game. The answer for us, and thousands of others, was, no - not worth it.

Again, we would for sure travel to SEC road games. OU sold out its allotment of tickets for the roadie with Tennessee this season. It would be the same because the SEC has many traditionally good football programs. It would be great to have those schools for road games. It is football worth watching on campuses with long football traditions.

[champions77]

The odds of me traveling to a game in Florida (UF, FSU, or Miami) are exponentially higher than me traveling to a game somewhere like Ames, IA or Lubbock, TX.

+1. The 2003 game at Tuscaloosa was the best football environment I have ever been to, bar none.

[graphster]

We already added WVU to the conference, and now people are talking about adding BYU, UCF or Cincinnatti. Those aren't exactly short road trips. At this point, we are past the days of having easy travel within the conference, whether we stay in the Big 12, go to the PAC 12, or go to the SEC.

[SoonerorLater]

We already added WVU to the conference, and now people are talking about adding BYU, UCF or Cincinnatti. Those aren't exactly short road trips. At this point, we are past the days of having easy travel within the conference, whether we stay in the Big 12, go to the PAC 12, or go to the SEC.

Exactly. Short of Tulsa or another Texas school the day of adding teams that are an easy drive is over.