Since we live in Oklahoma

[Ton Loc]

Should we all realize that our vote doesn't matter?
That most of the **** talked about on here is clearly ridiculous?
Shouldn't we pay more attention to what actually effects us more aka the state and local government?

Just asking because of all the asinine although highly entertaining conversations that take place in this thread - not a single one of them makes a got damn difference. And not a single one of the arguments will ever lead to any noticeable change.

In summation - we're all screwed and stuck with the decisions of the overall ignorant majority of this state.

Carry on :dejection:

[BoulderSooner79]

I live my life pretty much the way you recommend and it serves me well. I can enjoy some of these discussions and I occasionally stir the pot, but I don't get my undies in a bundle. I cast my national vote as I think it's a citizen's obligation, but I walk away knowing full well it has little weight. I spend my limited time on very local issues where a few hours of work can make a difference. I participate in local transportation plans and have helped get bike lane markings installed and a pedestrian overpass funded where a dangerous intersection had cost lives. Small things, but it all adds up if every helps with something.

[okie52]

Should we all realize that our vote doesn't matter?
That most of the **** talked about on here is clearly ridiculous?
Shouldn't we pay more attention to what actually effects us more aka the state and local government?

Just asking because of all the asinine although highly entertaining conversations that take place in this thread - not a single one of them makes a got damn difference. And not a single one of the arguments will ever lead to any noticeable change.

In summation - we're all screwed and stuck with the decisions of the overall ignorant majority of this state.

Carry on :dejection:

I'll just take a wild guess that you are not including yourself in the "ignorant majority".

[champions77]

I'll just take a wild guess that you are not including yourself in the "ignorant majority".

Must be such a burden to have to deal with all of these ignorant folks on a daily basis? I mean why can't we have more folks here like the smartest President in our history? Why???

[okie52]

Must be such a burden to have to deal with all of these ignorant folks on a daily basis? I mean why can't we have more folks here like the smartest President in our history? Why???

I'm sure he's stayed here to help change things for the better...well, I'm sure at one time he thought he'd try to change things for the better until he realized he was dealing with an ignorant majority.

[olevetonahill]

I'll just take a wild guess that you are not including yourself in the "ignorant majority".

If the Folks here in Ok. are the ignorant ones for NOT voting for Obammy ( Not one dayum county,either time) Then I guess Im one of em myself

[BoulderSooner79]

I just consider myself one of the unwashed masses.

[okie52]

If the Folks here in Ok. are the ignorant ones for NOT voting for Obammy ( Not one dayum county,either time) Then I guess Im one of em myself

I do take pride in the fact that not one county went for Obama nor did any county vote for kerry either.

[okie52]

I just consider myself one of the unwashed masses.

They have herbal cleansers in CO now I hear.

[champions77]

May I recommend Detroit, Chicago or even Baltimore as fine communities that are Full of upstanding, like minded folks that share your voting preferences?
They are bastions of Demicratic Party ideas, values and governance. No one has spotted one of those "unenlightened" Republicans around there in decades.

[Eielson]

Just asking because of all the asinine although highly entertaining conversations that take place in this thread - not a single one of them makes a got damn difference. And not a single one of the arguments will ever lead to any noticeable change.

We can't even get Kish fired, so clearly our opinions don't matter on anything. Let's just delete the board.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I'll just take a wild guess that you are not including yourself in the "ignorant majority".Not voting authoritarian socialism is ignorant, my friend. That is a given.

:obama icon:

[yermom]

only if authoritarian theocratic isn't an option, right?

[BigTip]

One national vote has little weight, that is true, but each vote is important.

Also, I think these discussions that we have help the cause, whatever yours might be. If you know how the other side thinks, or someone on your side presents a good way to express a thought, then perhaps you might be able to sway someone else,not on the board, towards the "right" way of thinking and voting.

[BoulderSooner79]

One national vote has little weight, that is true, but each vote is important.

Also, I think these discussions that we have help the cause, whatever yours might be. If you know how the other side thinks, or someone on your side presents a good way to express a thought, then perhaps you might be able to sway someone else,not on the board, towards the "right" way of thinking and voting.

That may be true, but it has to be hugely important in your life to do so. I find people who talk politics all the time to be boorish and I'm not the only one. I have many friends from across the political spectrum and a common trait is that they don't talk politics very often. I've been surprised on several occasions to find out someone is far left or far right after knowing them for years because they never mentioned it. I've also met others where it is the first thing out of their mouth and if the trend continues, I go into avoidance mode.

It's not that I never discuss politics, it just that I find those that live it don't discuss. They rant and are output-only devices. Why talk if no one is listening?

[FaninAma]

It is just the epitomy of laziness that the OP isn't even going to come back and respond after he set out his trolling bait. Pretty damned weak.

[Ton Loc]

I like the board for entertainment.

No one is changing anyone's opinions, thoughts, or ideas on anything remotely important. The constant focus on topics that realistically no one can do a thing about is sometimes perplexing. I just wonder if everyone knows that their long impassioned speeches on Obama, Hilary, Taxes, Benghazi, Voting etc. are all for naught. The people you back, right or left, are going to do whatever they want when in office. The right and left thing is just to throw your focus and con you into joining a "team."

I could probably help instead of bitching, but why not the focus on more local events and politics?

Yes - I think the majority of people that vote in this state are ignorant. Not stupid, they just don't have any idea of what or who they are voting for.

[olevetonahill]

I like the board for entertainment.

No one is changing anyone's opinions, thoughts, or ideas on anything remotely important. The constant focus on topics that realistically no one can do a thing about is sometimes perplexing. I just wonder if everyone knows that their long impassioned speeches on Obama, Hilary, Taxes, Benghazi, Voting etc. are all for naught. The people you back, right or left, are going to do whatever they want when in office. The right and left thing is just to throw your focus and con you into joining a "team."

I could probably help instead of bitching, but why not the focus on more local events and politics?

Yes - I think the majority of people that vote in this state are ignorant. Not stupid, they just don't have any idea of what or who they are voting for.

For the most part I agree with ya Bro. Thats why i just stick my paddle in and stir a bit LOL

[badger]

We are stuck with our senators another 5 years at least, so we're not changing anything in the U.S. Senate, unless, heaven forbid, aging Jim Inhofe is forced into retirement due to health.

Our house reps are held a bit more accountable by virtue of being up for re-election every two years. I would not put it past some of them to try to be the next governor in 3 years.

Thus, the biggest impact Oklahoma can have politically in the next election is the presidential primary. Let's all register Democrat and pick Hillary Clinton again... or better yet, Operation Rescue founder Randall Terry and let him send a delegate to the national party :P

[Turd_Ferguson]

I like the board for entertainment.

No one is changing anyone's opinions, thoughts, or ideas on anything remotely important. The constant focus on topics that realistically no one can do a thing about is sometimes perplexing. I just wonder if everyone knows that their long impassioned speeches on Obama, Hilary, Taxes, Benghazi, Voting etc. are all for naught. The people you back, right or left, are going to do whatever they want when in office. The right and left thing is just to throw your focus and con you into joining a "team."

I could probably help instead of bitching, but why not the focus on more local events and politics?

Yes - I think the majority of people that vote in this state are ignorant. Not stupid, they just don't have any idea of what or who they are voting for.

They're ignorant and have no idea of what or who they are voting for, but you do...right?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

They're ignorant and have no idea of what or who they are voting for, but you do...right?That's right, the dems only elect good people with smart ideas and behavior: FDR, LBJ, Carter, Slick, Bear, and dang it for us all they weren't able to get in Mondale, Dukakis, Algore and Kerry.

[okie52]

I like the board for entertainment.

No one is changing anyone's opinions, thoughts, or ideas on anything remotely important. The constant focus on topics that realistically no one can do a thing about is sometimes perplexing. I just wonder if everyone knows that their long impassioned speeches on Obama, Hilary, Taxes, Benghazi, Voting etc. are all for naught. The people you back, right or left, are going to do whatever they want when in office. The right and left thing is just to throw your focus and con you into joining a "team."

I could probably help instead of bitching, but why not the focus on more local events and politics?

Yes - I think the majority of people that vote in this state are ignorant. Not stupid, they just don't have any idea of what or who they are voting for.

No problem with focusing on more local issues...like passing a ban on texting while driving.

Which states do you believe have the majority that are smart voters?

[champions77]

No problem with focusing on more local issues...like passing a ban on texting while driving.

Which states do you believe have the majority that are smart voters?

Amazing statement by Ton Loc when the last two Presidential elections were won in large part by "low information voters". I would bet that as a percentage, there were a lot more knowledgeable voters voting for Romney than The Messiah. Makes his statement that Oklahoma voters are "ignorant" seem a bit vindictive. I'm sure if Oklahoma voted for BHO he wouldn't have the same opinion.

[Ton Loc]

No problem with focusing on more local issues...like passing a ban on texting while driving.

Which states do you believe have the majority that are smart voters?

Zero - The majority of people who vote have no idea what they're doing.

I don't know why this is a shock to anyone. The people, state questions, etc you vote on like it that way. That way they can make dumb commercials, spread rumors, make large generic statements, and basically make it a choice of "good vs evil" or "left vs right."

[okie52]

Zero - The majority of people who vote have no idea what they're doing.

I don't know why this is a shock to anyone. The people, state questions, etc you vote on like it that way. That way they can make dumb commercials, spread rumors, make large generic statements, and basically make it a choice of "good vs evil" or "left vs right."

So you're just expressing your overall frustration with the "system" rather than just Okies...?

[FaninAma]

I like the board for entertainment.

No one is changing anyone's opinions, thoughts, or ideas on anything remotely important. The constant focus on topics that realistically no one can do a thing about is sometimes perplexing. I just wonder if everyone knows that their long impassioned speeches on Obama, Hilary, Taxes, Benghazi, Voting etc. are all for naught. The people you back, right or left, are going to do whatever they want when in office. The right and left thing is just to throw your focus and con you into joining a "team."

I could probably help instead of bitching, but why not the focus on more local events and politics?

Yes - I think the majority of people that vote in this state are ignorant. Not stupid, they just don't have any idea of what or who they are voting for.

That's all fine and well but don't throw out a statement that the majority of voters in this state are ignorant just because you don't agree with them and then pretend you are neutral on political issues in subsequent posts.

I am of the opinion that doing nothing is not an option especially if my kids are to have any opportunity to reach the goals I know they have for themselves and their own children. The cynicism and dumbing down of the electorate are the problems....not the politicians. We get the type of government and leaders we deserve. Their ****ty leadership is a direct reflection of our own ignorance and laziness.

Hillary Clinton is the consumate inside-the-beltway politician and she is all the great "Party of the People" can offer as their candidagte for the highest office in the land? And you dare to call the people of Oklahoma ignorant? You(and your elitist ,smug superior ilk), not those who vote their conscience and on principles in this state, are the problem.

[badger]

I think I've decided why Hillary won't admit she's a loser: Because Illinois and Arkansas upbringing transplanted to New York then DC= lots of mediocre sports.

Chicago Bears football in your youth can only equal years upon years of disappointment unless you were young in 1985... and Hillary is way to damn old to be young in the 80s.

Arkansas Razorbacks... so mediocre no wonder that state voted Bill Clinton for a decade. They won a few SWCs in the late 80s, but that '64 champion was loooong before Billary took office.

NY sports... hmmmm... take a stab in the dark and you'll probably guess correctly. I'll stab Knicks and let one of you stab Jets and someone else stab Giants post-Super Bowl etc etc etc

I don't know much about DC sports but RACIST MASCOT KD IS NOT A WIZARD YOU STOLE THE EXPOS garble garble garble.

OK, have I successfully derailed the thread? ;)

[Serenity Now]

We get the type of government and leaders we deserve.
Have you seen who WE elect in our state government? Do you see some of the fools that we KEEP sending to Washington to represent us?

I've never been a big Hillary fan but she's 100 times more substantial than Inhofe. The vitriol that people have against her is so strong and irrational.

[Ton Loc]

That's all fine and well but don't throw out a statement that the majority of voters in this state are ignorant just because you don't agree with them and then pretend you are neutral on political issues in subsequent posts.

I am of the opinion that doing nothing is not an option especially if my kids are to have any opportunity to reach the goals I know they have for themselves and their own children. The cynicism and dumbing down of the electorate are the problems....not the politicians. We get the type of government and leaders we deserve. Their ****ty leadership is a direct reflection of our own ignorance and laziness.

Hillary Clinton is the consumate inside-the-beltway politician and she is all the great "Party of the People" can offer as their candidagte for the highest office in the land? And you dare to call the people of Oklahoma ignorant? You(and your elitist ,smug superior ilk), not those who vote their conscience and on principles in this state, are the problem.

I don't know wtf you are talking about. Those are some super crazy parallels to draw from me saying people are ignorant on voting issues. Or the fact that people complain on this board far too much about what they can't change or things that have already passed us by.

Some of you miss the entire point. Your reading comprehension could not overcome the crazy that lives inside of you and you have projected your craziness onto me - somehow turning me into what I guess is a liberal Hilary supporting leftist who looks down his nose at the poor stupid people of this state. Nice work!

Once again in even simpler terms :

1. The large majority of people - state and country wide - are ignorant to who and what they vote on.
2. People need to focus on state and local issues because you have almost no effect on national issues.

These are not new facts.

To the sane(ish) people. Thank you for your contributions and feel free to let this thread derail into yet another left vs right argument where nothing is gained but entertainment. rabble rabble rabble

[Ton Loc]

No problem with focusing on more local issues...like passing a ban on texting while driving.

Which states do you believe have the majority that are smart voters?

The new cellphone/texting ban. Another waste of time in my opinion when distracted driving laws already existed that cover such things. However, I guess in the large scheme of things - maybe the amount of attention it has been given will change some people's behaviors. I highly doubt it because I'm a skeptic and a hypocrite who still uses his cellphone while driving.

[Serenity Now]

The new cellphone/texting ban. Another waste of time in my opinion when distracted driving laws already existed that cover such things. However, I guess in the large scheme of things - maybe the amount of attention it has been given will change some people's behaviors. I highly doubt it because I'm a skeptic and a hypocrite who still uses his cellphone while driving.

Your'e right, mostly. I think it's good to have it so we can tell you, me, all of the other hypocrites and, more importantly, our kids, that there's a law against it.

[champions77]

That's all fine and well but don't throw out a statement that the majority of voters in this state are ignorant just because you don't agree with them and then pretend you are neutral on political issues in subsequent posts.

I am of the opinion that doing nothing is not an option especially if my kids are to have any opportunity to reach the goals I know they have for themselves and their own children. The cynicism and dumbing down of the electorate are the problems....not the politicians. We get the type of government and leaders we deserve. Their ****ty leadership is a direct reflection of our own ignorance and laziness.

Hillary Clinton is the consumate inside-the-beltway politician and she is all the great "Party of the People" can offer as their candidagte for the highest office in the land? And you dare to call the people of Oklahoma ignorant? You(and your elitist ,smug superior ilk), not those who vote their conscience and on principles in this state, are the problem.

+1 Can't agree more. It should not surprise us that he feels this way. Most leftist have similar condescending sentiments. You heard that with The "Great Divider's" off the record disdain about folks "clinging to their guns and religion". Interesting that the self professed smartest people in the world prey upon those with lowest levels of education and wages on the socio-economic scale. It just usually requires the promise of increasing the taxes on those wealthy bastards and creating or expanding the social programs to "buy" the votes necessary to perpetuate themselves in office, paid for by those same successful wealthy sob's they demonize on a daily basis.

[Serenity Now]

+1 Can't agree more. It should not surprise us that he feels this way. Most leftist have similar condescending sentiments. You heard that with The "Great Divider's" off the record disdain about folks "clinging to their guns and religion". Interesting that the self professed smartest people in the world prey upon those with lowest levels of education and wages on the socio-economic scale. It just usually requires the promise of increasing the taxes on those wealthy bastards and creating or expanding the social programs to "buy" the votes necessary to perpetuate themselves in office, paid for by those same successful wealthy sob's they demonize on a daily basis.
That's inaccurate. I live in a subdivision of about 25 homes. I can almost guarantee you that I'm the only Democrat. They're relatively wealthy. They're certainly smart. They cling more to their tax breaks. They also cling to their guns and their religion.

[Ton Loc]

+1 Can't agree more. It should not surprise us that he feels this way. Most leftist have similar condescending sentiments. You heard that with The "Great Divider's" off the record disdain about folks "clinging to their guns and religion". Interesting that the self professed smartest people in the world prey upon those with lowest levels of education and wages on the socio-economic scale. It just usually requires the promise of increasing the taxes on those wealthy bastards and creating or expanding the social programs to "buy" the votes necessary to perpetuate themselves in office, paid for by those same successful wealthy sob's they demonize on a daily basis.

Liar or Stupid

It can't be both. Either you're too stupid to read and comprehend what I wrote or you're a liar who read what I wrote and decided to ignore it and make up your own story.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Have you seen who WE elect in our state government? Do you see some of the fools that we KEEP sending to Washington to represent us?

I've never been a big Hillary fan but she's 100 times more substantial than Inhofe. The vitriol that people have against her is so strong and irrational.LOL...Sad, indeed.

[champions77]

Liar or Stupid

It can't be both. Either you're too stupid to read and comprehend what I wrote or you're a liar who read what I wrote and decided to ignore it and make up your own story.

So now the name calling. A favorite of the left. Must have touched a nerve. What part of; "In summation - we're all screwed and stuck with the decisions of the overall ignorant majority of this state" do you want to retract?

[Serenity Now]

LOL...Sad, indeed.

I'm to take from your commentary that you agree with my comparison of Inhofe and Hillary?

[BoulderSooner79]

Name calling is a bipartisan sport on this forum. I never knew "-tard" was a suffix until I started reading here.

[champions77]

Name calling is a bipartisan sport on this forum. I never knew "-tard" was a suffix until I started reading here.

I agree, that's why I try and avoid it. Counterproductive.

[badger]

i stink at derailing threads :(

[Ton Loc]

So now the name calling. A favorite of the left. Must have touched a nerve. What part of; "In summation - we're all screwed and stuck with the decisions of the overall ignorant majority of this state" do you want to retract?

None of it. People who are ignorant on what they're are voting on will make ignorant decisions on those things. Ignorant aka lacking knowledge.

I'm not calling you a liar or stupid in everyday life. Just on this topic you can decide. I've seen your other posts. They weren't stupid.

[SicEmBaylor]

Have you seen who WE elect in our state government? Do you see some of the fools that we KEEP sending to Washington to represent us?

I've never been a big Hillary fan but she's 100 times more substantial than Inhofe. The vitriol that people have against her is so strong and irrational.

She is more substantial than Inhofe; I'll agree with that. However, that's like saying a 10lbs bucket of fried chicken is more substantial than a garden salad. Yes, it's more substantial but does that make it better?

Most of the anti-Hillary folks are absolutely right but for the wrong reason, and some of it is irrational. A great example, that I mentioned in another thread, is the 'What does it matter?' quote which was taken entirely out of context. If you watch the committee hearing, she was saying that whether the attack was precipitated based on a YouTube video or pre-planned ultimately doesn't matter because x-number of Americans died. IOW, what does the motive of the attackers ultimately matter when so many Americans died? She has been taken well out of context for that quote.

On the other hand, the woman has more skeletons in her closet than a Gambino family foot soldier. A very long list of corruptions both minor and major stretching back to when she was first lady of Arkansas. Her treatment of White House employees is also well documented and, frankly, should give anyone pause before electing such an individual. But putting all of that past aside, there's still the issue of the e-mail servers which was a purposeful violation and circumvention of a very important law. Her explanation has been both lacking and disingenuous. The woman simply has far too much baggage to be trusted as the next President.

And even all of that is putting aside her hawkish views on foreign policy.

[Serenity Now]

"So now the name calling. A favorite of the left."

Have you been paying attention to the climate here?

[Serenity Now]

She is more substantial than Inhofe; I'll agree with that. However, that's like saying a 10lbs bucket of fried chicken is more substantial than a garden salad. Yes, it's more substantial but does that make it better?

Most of the anti-Hillary folks are absolutely right but for the wrong reason, and some of it is irrational. A great example, that I mentioned in another thread, is the 'What does it matter?' quote which was taken entirely out of context. If you watch the committee hearing, she was saying that whether the attack was precipitated based on a YouTube video or pre-planned ultimately doesn't matter because x-number of Americans died. IOW, what does the motive of the attackers ultimately matter when so many Americans died? She has been taken well out of context for that quote.

On the other hand, the woman has more skeletons in her closet than a Gambino family foot soldier. A very long list of corruptions both minor and major stretching back to when she was first lady of Arkansas. Her treatment of White House employees is also well documented and, frankly, should give anyone pause before electing such an individual. But putting all of that past aside, there's still the issue of the e-mail servers which was a purposeful violation and circumvention of a very important law. Her explanation has been both lacking and disingenuous. The woman simply has far too much baggage to be trusted as the next President.

And even all of that is putting aside her hawkish views on foreign policy.

They're turning you into a Hillary apologist. :)

[Turd_Ferguson]

That's inaccurate. I live in a subdivision of about 25 homes. I can almost guarantee you that I'm the only Democrat. They're relatively wealthy. They're certainly smart. They cling more to their tax breaks. They also cling to their guns and their religion.

Do they all have a red headed child caused by the ghey jean?

[SicEmBaylor]

Oklahoma's delegation is absolutely horrible.

Lucas is an empty suit.
Cole is a catamite for the House leadership.
Russell is absolutely dangerous as **** -- his views are a true danger to conservatism.
Mullin is one of the dumbest politicians I've ever encountered. I don't mean that because of his views -- he truly is not a smart man.
Bridenstine is exceptional and the one bright spot.
Inhofe is so-so. His voting record is marginal, but he's strong on climate change issues. The problem is that he could present his arguments in such a way that he does't come across as a bat**** crazy loon.
Lankford is a truly scary combo of the worst traits of both Cole and Russell. He almost never votes against the leadership, his evangelical views are a dangerous threat to liberty, he is a proponent of the national-security state, and his views on foreign policy are as disturbing as Russell's.

...and the state legislature has more than a fair share of crazies. However, I have to admit that this session has surprised me a few times in a number of good ways. There are signs of real improvement there. From the bill that removes government from marriage to legislation making it easier for breweries to operate to the experimental medical treatment bill.....things are improving ever so slightly.

[okie52]

The new cellphone/texting ban. Another waste of time in my opinion when distracted driving laws already existed that cover such things. However, I guess in the large scheme of things - maybe the amount of attention it has been given will change some people's behaviors. I highly doubt it because I'm a skeptic and a hypocrite who still uses his cellphone while driving.

I don't mind this law in the least although you are right that it probably overlaps with the existing distracted driving law. I believe the new law sets the fine at $100...not enough in my opinion but a step in the right direction. Of course if they don't enforce it like our immigration laws then it really won't matter what the fine is.

[olevetonahill]

Name calling is a bipartisan sport on this forum. I never knew "-tard" was a suffix until I started reading here.

You Bouldertard you!

[olevetonahill]

I don't mind this law in the least although you are right that it probably overlaps with the existing distracted driving law. I believe the new law sets the fine at $100...not enough in my opinion but a step in the right direction. Of course if they don't enforce it like our immigration laws then it really won't matter what the fine is.

Yes it does over lap, But quite simply a Lot of people are ignorant as Ton said. This Law specifically states Texting whereas the distracted law they could choose to think they were not doing anything wrong.. I dont drive a lot anymore but just in the last 2 years ive seen folks do some crazy **** while one handing their phone.

[FaninAma]

That's inaccurate. I live in a subdivision of about 25 homes. I can almost guarantee you that I'm the only Democrat. They're relatively wealthy. They're certainly smart. They cling more to their tax breaks. They also cling to their guns and their religion.

They "cling"? Why do they need to cling to these things? People only cling to things when somebody is trying to take them away. Why do you use the same term Obama used? I guess clinging to those things is better than clinging to the worn out ideology that the government can solve all problems.

[FaninAma]

She is more substantial than Inhofe; I'll agree with that. However, that's like saying a 10lbs bucket of fried chicken is more substantial than a garden salad. Yes, it's more substantial but does that make it better?

Most of the anti-Hillary folks are absolutely right but for the wrong reason, and some of it is irrational. A great example, that I mentioned in another thread, is the 'What does it matter?' quote which was taken entirely out of context. If you watch the committee hearing, she was saying that whether the attack was precipitated based on a YouTube video or pre-planned ultimately doesn't matter because x-number of Americans died. IOW, what does the motive of the attackers ultimately matter when so many Americans died? She has been taken well out of context for that quote.

On the other hand, the woman has more skeletons in her closet than a Gambino family foot soldier. A very long list of corruptions both minor and major stretching back to when she was first lady of Arkansas. Her treatment of White House employees is also well documented and, frankly, should give anyone pause before electing such an individual. But putting all of that past aside, there's still the issue of the e-mail servers which was a purposeful violation and circumvention of a very important law. Her explanation has been both lacking and disingenuous. The woman simply has far too much baggage to be trusted as the next President.

And even all of that is putting aside her hawkish views on foreign policy.

Regarding Senator Inhoffe, I have never seen you post something that is so wrong and off-track. Senator Inhoffe is 100 times the statesman Hillary is. In terms of being quality human beings and attitudes toward the proper role of government they are as different as night and day. Hillary is a creature of the DC establishment. Hillary, her bastard child and idiot husband are like ticks that we cannot get removed from the tax payers' hides. Meanwhile Inhoffe's family, for the most part, pursued careers outside of politics. His son Perry(killed in a plane crash a couple of years ago) was an outstanding orthopedic surgeon who I knew while I was in residency. I, as you are fond of saying, have met Senator Inhoffe multiple times and he has always been cordial, friendly and always took the time to answer questions form lots of community groups in the state unlike hillary who is secretive, manipulative and deceptive.

[Ton Loc]

I don't mind this law in the least although you are right that it probably overlaps with the existing distracted driving law. I believe the new law sets the fine at $100...not enough in my opinion but a step in the right direction. Of course if they don't enforce it like our immigration laws then it really won't matter what the fine is.

That fine is so weak when you compare it to $186 for a simple speeding ticket. Also, a distracted driving ticket is more than double the texting while driving fine. Somewhere around $225. I don't mind the law, just the fact that it seems to be a waste when it is just covering what is already out there.

[hawaii 5-0]

Lot of laughs on this thread.

Carry on.


5-0

[SicEmBaylor]

I have never seen you post something that is so wrong and off-track. Senator Inhoffe is 100 times the statesman Hillary is. In terms of being quality human beings and attitudes toward the proper role of government they are as different as night and day in their differences. Hillary is a creature of the DC establishment. Her and her bastard child and idiot husband are like ticks that we cannot get removed from the tax payers hides. Meanwhile Inhoffe's family, for the most part, pursued careers outside of politics. His son Perry(killed in a plane crash a couple of years ago) was an outstanding orthopedic surgeon who I knew while I was in residency. I, as you are fond of saying, have met Senator Inhoffe multiple times and he has always been cordial, friendly and always took the time to answer questions form lots of community groups in the state.

Nothing I said is, in any way, different from what you just stated. I never suggested for a moment that Inhofe wasn't the better statesman, and I even pointed that out with the KFC/salad analogy. When I said that Hillary had more "substance", I was referring to her depth of policy knowledge. Knowing the two, I don't think it's a stretch to point out that Hillary is the bigger policy wonk. She just is. That doesn't mean her judgement or solutions to those policy questions is better than Inhofe's. As I said, it isn't.


Sic'em, your political and intellectual elitism is starting to wear thin. At this point it is hard to discern your stances from the progressives. The only difference I can see is they hate all things Republican and you seem to just hate all things in the realm of politics.

You've been straining to find a reason to argue with me for some time now even when there has been little or no disagreement between the two of us. I honestly don't understand it other than to think that perhaps my *tone* (rather than the substance of what I say) is off-putting for you.

And if you can't tell the difference between my positions and the positions of a progressive then my God...I barely know how to respond to that level of obliviousness. I refuse to believe you're that dense.

[champions77]

"So now the name calling. A favorite of the left."

Have you been paying attention to the climate here?

I agree, much too much of it. But your friend 8th was the absolutely worst that I have seen on any message board. You probably would even agree with that statement.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Regarding Senator Inhoffe, I have never seen you post something that is so wrong and off-track. Senator Inhoffe is 100 times the statesman Hillary is. In terms of being quality human beings and attitudes toward the proper role of government they are as different as night and day. Hillary is a creature of the DC establishment. Hillary, her bastard child and idiot husband are like ticks that we cannot get removed from the tax payers' hides. Meanwhile Inhoffe's family, for the most part, pursued careers outside of politics. His son Perry(killed in a plane crash a couple of years ago) was an outstanding orthopedic surgeon who I knew while I was in residency. I, as you are fond of saying, have met Senator Inhoffe multiple times and he has always been cordial, friendly and always took the time to answer questions form lots of community groups in the state unlike hillary who is secretive, manipulative and deceptive.Inhofe is one of the best peole in national politics. Amazing and sad how many people here don't realize this.

[SicEmBaylor]

Inhofe is one of the best peole in national politics. Amazing and sad how many people here don't realize this.

Like who? I only count 'one.'

[FaninAma]

Nothing I said is, in any way, different from what you just stated. I never suggested for a moment that Inhofe wasn't the better statesman, and I even pointed that out with the KFC/salad analogy. When I said that Hillary had more "substance", I was referring to her depth of policy knowledge. Knowing the two, I don't think it's a stretch to point out that Hillary is the bigger policy wonk. She just is. That doesn't mean her judgement or solutions to those policy questions is better than Inhofe's. As I said, it isn't.



You've been straining to find a reason to argue with me for some time now even when there has been little or no disagreement between the two of us. I honestly don't understand it other than to think that perhaps my *tone* (rather than the substance of what I say) is off-putting for you.

And if you can't tell the difference between my positions and the positions of a progressive then my God...I barely know how to respond to that level of obliviousness. I refuse to believe you're that dense.

I am very similar to you in your dislike of the lack of backbone exhibited by the GOP. However, I do see a lot of progress being made in terms a willingness by the new blood in the party to stand up to the sycophants of the left. Compare that to the creature of the DC estbalishment the Democrats are trotting out. I understand why you criticize the GOP. I am willing to see how things play out with the new guys over this election cycle. I did edit my comments because I do respect your point of view but these are the only horses we have to pull the plow at this point. Hopefully that will change and certainly some crticism is warranted but, IMO, not the amount you heap upon the GOP. I will agree with you though that Cole is worthless.

[hawaii 5-0]

OK, here's another.

"Hey Jim, I don't think that's a runway. I also think there's people on it."


5-0

[FaninAma]

Lot of laughs on this thread.

Carry on.


5-0

The only thing even remotely resembling humor on this thread is Serenity's belief that Hillary is anything other than a walking, talking chariacture of a sleazy, self-serving, self-enriching politician who will say anything or do anything to get elected.

But you have dropped your turd on the thread so I guess there's nothing left to say to you except have a nice day.

[Serenity Now]

I agree, much too much of it. But your friend 8th was the absolutely worst that I have seen on any message board. You probably would even agree with that statement.

I was here for about 2 weeks of 8th. From my vantage point he responded like he was treated. Those deamonizing people don't like that.

[SoonerorLater]

Just asking because of all the asinine although highly entertaining conversations that take place in this thread - not a single one of them makes a got damn difference. And not a single one of the arguments will ever lead to any noticeable change.:

Does anybody see the irony here?

[hawaii 5-0]

Personally I've been very conservative in my smack in name calling, simply because this is a Sooner Board, mostly visited by Sooner fans. The last Board I posted on was inhabited by fans from all areas and schools and the fur flew thick and heavy. There was more than one 8th, ie jackazz and they weren't all Liberal.

This place is pretty tame in comparison.

5-0

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Quote Originally Posted by RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
Inhofe is one of the best people in national politics. Amazing and sad how many people here don't realize this.
Like who? I only count 'one.'several or more who post on Soonerfans. You know that, no?

[Serenity Now]

The only thing even remotely resembling humor on this thread is Serenity's belief that Hillary is anything other than a walking, talking chariacture of a sleazy, self-serving, self-enriching politician who will say anything or do anything to get elected.

But you have dropped your turd on the thread so I guess there's nothing left to say to you except have a nice day.

Maybe Jim can help lead the world in environmental issues. Kind of like putting Mark Mangino in charge of the menus/portion control. He's the most bought and sold politician that we have. And, the best pilot in the field. Honestly, the way he reacted to his "wrong way Newton" fiasco in Dallas/Ft. Worth should have had him removed from office immediately.

Cling to...like "my cold dead hands". That's the saying. Everyone loves the Constitution and the 2nd Amendment but for "a well regulated militia". Cray cray.

[FaninAma]

I was here for about 2 weeks of 8th. From my vantage point he responded like he was treated. Those deamonizing people don't like that.

Oh no he didn't. I didn't know who the hell he was when he first started posting here but in his very first response to me he called me a racist. He didn't imply it, he called me a "racist". He was like that with evereybody right off the bat and that's why a lot of us think he was just a troll.

[hawaii 5-0]

The only thing even remotely resembling humor on this thread is Serenity's belief that Hillary is anything other than a walking, talking chariacture of a sleazy, self-serving, self-enriching politician who will say anything or do anything to get elected.

But you have dropped your turd on the thread so I guess there's nothing left to say to you except have a nice day.

This....... "Senator Inhoffe is 100 times the statesman Hillary is."

Coffee came out my nose when I read it.

5-0

[FaninAma]

Maybe Jim can help lead the world in environmental issues. Kind of like putting Mark Mangino in charge of the menus/portion control. He's the most bought and sold politician that we have. And, the best pilot in the field. Honestly, the way he reacted to his "wrong way Newton" fiasco in Dallas/Ft. Worth should have had him removed from office immediately.

Cling to...like "my cold dead hands". That's the saying. Everyone loves the Constitution and the 2nd Amendment but for "a well regulated militia". Cray cray.

Weak. I would respond with hillary's short comings and public faux pauxs but I really need to be somewhere in 4 hours. So tell me how people "cling" to their religion? You know that word carries a negative connotation and implies the thing they are clinging to is irrational or stupid.

You really don't see why you come off as arrogant and elitist when you say things like that, do you? That is so typical of the left. If you don't believe me go to Realclearpolitics.com, click on any NYT opinion piece and read the comments section. The feeling of superiority by the liberal readers of that liberal echo chamber is palpable. It sustains them in their daily lives even as they ignore the results of their progressive "wisdom" in places like Baltimore, Detroit, California and Chicago.

[FaninAma]

This....... "Senator Inhoffe is 100 times the statesman Hillary is."

Coffee came out my nose when I read it.

5-0

Meanwhile you think hillary is A-OK. So tell me laughing boy, who deserves the most laughter directed his or her way.....the Senator of the state of Oklahoma or the 67 year old lying, cheating, scandal ridden nominee of the Democrat Party? If hillary is the democratic nominee will you vote for her? If so you have no reason to ever laugh at or question anybody's choice of candidates.

[champions77]

I am very similar to you in your dislike of the lack of backbone exhibited by the GOP. However, I do see a lot of progress being made in terms a willingness by the new blood in the party to stand up to the sycophants of the left. Compare that to the creature of the DC estbalishment the Democrats are trotting out. I understand why you criticize the GOP. I am willing to see how things play out with the new guys over this election cycle. I did edit my comments because I do respect your point of view but these are the only horses we have to pull the plow at this point. Hopefully that will change and certainly some crticism is warranted but, IMO, not the amount you heap upon the GOP. I will agree with you though that Cole is worthless.

I am like you, I will continue to vote for the GOP over the Socialist Party. I too am disgusted with the numbers of Republicans that have "gone along" with the attacks on our Constitution, and the expansion of the scope, power and involvement of the Federal Government in the lives of citizens of this once great nation.

For the GOP, a whole bunch of them need to "grow a pair" and stand up for the same beliefs that got them elected in the first place. So many become part of the DC culture, which demands that you assist in the power grab that has been going on now for decades, despite the obvious perils they present to our Republic, and the predictably bad outcome, that is sure will result.

I ask the libs here, do you really believe that if we continue on this path, that the future of this country will be secure, our freedoms will be protected and that our standard of living will not diminish?

[okie52]

This....... "Senator Inhoffe is 100 times the statesman Hillary is."

Coffee came out my nose when I read it.

5-0


100 times might have been overstating it a bit.

[Serenity Now]

Weak. I would respond with hillary's short comings and public faux pauxs but I really need to be somewhere in 4 hours. So tell me how people "cling" to their religion? You know that word carries a negative connotation and implies the thing they are clinging to is irrational or stupid.

You really don't see why you come off as arrogant and elitist when you say things like that, do you? That is so typical of the left. If you don't believe me go to Realclearpolitics.com, click on any NYT opinion piece and read the comments section. The feeling of superiority by the liberal readers of that liberal echo chamber is palpable. It sustains them in their daily lives even as they ignore the results of their progressive "wisdom" in places like Baltimore, Detroit, California and Chicago.

Whatever, Obama is the first Democrat that I voted for. My first presidential election was in 88. I stayed the same. The middle moved. Reagan couldn't win now.

If you're going to paint anything I type off of the usage of the word "cling" then so be it. The state of oklahoma clings to religion via things like Sharia Law (my personal fav), Referendum on Marriage (the change that, I think, removed Common Law Marriage for Okies), the 10 Commandments displays, that preacher trying to get rid of AP history, Sally Kearn (Freedom to Obtain Conversion Therapy Act), James Lankford, et al. I've taught Sunday School in the past and have been involved in the administration of churches. I'm not a heathen. The "persecution" that some of my friends reference of us poor Christians in eastern Oklahoma is laughable. I giggle internally after listening to a prayer over the loudspeaker at my kids' school.

[Serenity Now]

This....... "Senator Inhoffe is 100 times the statesman Hillary is."

Coffee came out my nose when I read it.

5-0

Maybe that was an exaggeration. 10 times is probably more realistic. Could you imagine Wrong Way Jim as our Secretary of State?

[okie52]

Maybe that was an exaggeration. 10 times is probably more realistic. Could you imagine Wrong Way Jim as our Secretary of State?

Yes, yes I could imagine Jim performing some corkscrew landings during sniper fire.

[Serenity Now]

Yes, yes I could imagine Jim performing some corkscrew landings during sniper fire.

This is probably more fitting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlSQAZEp3PA

[Serenity Now]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/07/07/991892/-Sen-Inhofe-bravely-stands-up-to-FAA-on-behalf-of-himself#

Brave guy!

[okie52]

This is probably more fitting: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JlSQAZEp3PA

A great movie moment and probably more in line with Hillary's brave foray into Bosnia.

[okie52]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/07/07/991892/-Sen-Inhofe-bravely-stands-up-to-FAA-on-behalf-of-himself#

Brave guy!

I like it...everybody knows X marks the spot. I don't know why everyone was so upset.

[champions77]

Whatever, Obama is the first Democrat that I voted for. My first presidential election was in 88. I stayed the same. The middle moved. Reagan couldn't win now.

If you're going to paint anything I type off of the usage of the word "cling" then so be it. The state of oklahoma clings to religion via things like Sharia Law (my personal fav), Referendum on Marriage (the change that, I think, removed Common Law Marriage for Okies), the 10 Commandments displays, that preacher trying to get rid of AP history, Sally Kearn (Freedom to Obtain Conversion Therapy Act), James Lankford, et al. I've taught Sunday School in the past and have been involved in the administration of churches. I'm not a heathen. The "persecution" that some of my friends reference of us poor Christians in eastern Oklahoma is laughable. I giggle internally after listening to a prayer over the loudspeaker at my kids' school.

The "middle moved"? Surely you are not of the position that the middle moved to the right are you?
If you want to be honest about "movement" then admit how far left the Democratic party has moved. One of my pet peeves is the insinuation that the GOP has moved far to the right. Only in relation to the Democratic Party could anyone ever feel the GOP has moved to the right. Anything looks to the right when compared to the Democratic Party. Heck if JFK came back today, he would be kicked out of the Democratic Party. His "ask not what your country can do for you, but ask what you can do for your country" is diametrically opposite of the platform of the Democratic Party. And a "TAX CUT"? are you kidding me.

The moniker of "Democratic Lite" fits this Republican Party quite well thank you. And if you want to talk about voter apathy, look no further than it's conservative base staying home in the last few Presidential elections. When there is no remarkable differences in the candidates, why vote? There are more Sic'Ems out there than people may believe.

[okie52]

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2011/07/07/991892/-Sen-Inhofe-bravely-stands-up-to-FAA-on-behalf-of-himself#

Brave guy!

Here ya go...

http://gilligan.wikia.com/wiki/Wrongway_Feldman

[Serenity Now]

The "middle moved"? Surely you are not of the position that the middle moved to the right are you?
If you want to be honest about "movement" then admit how far left the Democratic party has moved. One of my pet peeves is the insinuation that the GOP has moved far to the right. Only in relation to the Democratic Party could anyone ever feel the GOP has moved to the right. Anything looks to the right when compared to the Democratic Party. Heck if JFK came back today, he would be kicked out of the Democratic Party. His "ask not what your country can do for you, but ask what you can do for your country" is diametrically opposite of the platform of the Democratic Party. And a "TAX CUT"? are you kidding me.

The moniker of "Democratic Lite" fits this Republican Party quite well thank you. And if you want to talk about voter apathy, look no further than it's conservative base staying home in the last few Presidential elections. When there is no remarkable differences in the candidates, why vote? There are more Sic'Ems out there than people may believe.

Agree on JFK. He's the last President to truly practice supply side economics.

Clinton was more conservative in some measure than was Bush.

The base has moved to the right on deal breaker issues like the 2nd Amendment. Reagan passed laws supporting gun control (broad term). NO GOP candidate today could do that. Since 9/11 the hawks are running things. The GOP model of diplomacy is based on John Wayne. That's doing nothing but playing wackamole and is a loser in the long term. Say all you want about Bush's Medicare Modernization but his 12 year war in Iraq in the face of tax cuts is the silliest thing I've ever seen.

The issue that I've stated here before is that no one can go far enough right to get the nomination and then get back to the middle to get the moderates to vote for you.

I'd love to see the left get out of the full on welfare but still do things like the ACA, or RomneyCare as I like to call it. :)

[Serenity Now]

Here ya go...

http://gilligan.wikia.com/wiki/Wrongway_Feldman

Well played, sir. Well played.

[Ton Loc]

Does anybody see the irony here?

I knew what I was doing.

Really, I just need Turd to come in here and call me an idiot and this thread will fit right in with the rest of them.

[SicEmBaylor]

Cling to...like "my cold dead hands". That's the saying. Everyone loves the Constitution and the 2nd Amendment but for "a well regulated militia". Cray cray.

The "militia" was the body-politic. The word regulate, in period usage, meant to properly train/muster; therefore, the intent was to have a militia composed of the citizenry properly trained to defend itself, its liberties, and its community. To that end, an individual's right to bear arms must not be infringed.

It was not as liberals suggest that it means a government trained/commanded "militia" in the form of a state national guard. It meant that you, me, and others would own our firearms. It meant that we would properly train ourselves in the use of those firearms. It meant that we would join together and train as a local/community defense force. This was for the purpose of protecting one's self and one's community from forces both foreign and domestic should the need arise. Parity with the opposing force is absolutely necessary to ensure that end. The 2nd Amendment absolutely meant that the individual's right to own firearms was sanctimont. In order for the 2nd Amendment to work, as intended, the individual must have unfettered access to weaponry that can compare (reasonably) to his opposition whether it be a foreign invasion or his own government.

[Serenity Now]

The "militia" was the body-politic. The word regulate, in period usage, meant to properly train/muster; therefore, the intent was to have a militia composed of the citizenry properly trained to defend itself, its liberties, and its community. To that end, an individual's right to bear arms must not be infringed.

It was not as liberals suggest that it means a government trained/commanded "militia" in the form of a state national guard. It meant that you, me, and others would own our firearms. It meant that we would properly train ourselves in the use of those firearms. It meant that we would join together and train as a local/community defense force. This was for the purpose of protecting one's self and one's community from forces both foreign and domestic should the need arise. Parity with the opposing force is absolutely necessary to ensure that end. The 2nd Amendment absolutely meant that the individual's right to own firearms was sanctimont. In order for the 2nd Amendment to work, as intended, the individual must have unfettered access to weaponry that can compare (reasonably) to his opposition whether it be a foreign invasion or his own government.

I don't disagree with you. There is no "local militia" anymore. Ours involves my next door neighbor Federal Marshal and the guy that hunts across the street from him. However, drones, cannons, etc. kind of trumps the meaning now. I have no problem with almost all people owning guns. However, I think it's quasi paranoia to "cling" to background checks and gun registration as tightly as they do. To me "a well regulated militia" would translate in modern terms as a state national guard.

[hawaii 5-0]

100 times might have been overstating it a bit.


Might have been is the correct answer.

If Hillary gets the nomination I might vote for her. Or I might not. As a swing voter I'll vote for the best candidate. Usually it boils down to the lesser of two evils.

5-0

[hawaii 5-0]

Meanwhile you think hillary is A-OK.


I laugh when idiots try to tell me what I think.

Enjoy your AA meeting.

5-0

[SicEmBaylor]

I laugh when idiots try to tell me what I think.

Enjoy your AA meeting.

5-0

You're a pinko commie who probably sleeps with a blow up doll of Lenin every night. ;)

[olevetonahill]

I laugh when idiots try to tell me what I think.

Enjoy your AA meeting.

5-0

They have meetings for folks like us? Really? Areshole anonymous! Who knew?

[Turd_Ferguson]

I knew what I was doing.

Really, I just need Turd to come in here and call me an idiot and this thread will fit right in with the rest of them.


**** off, idiot.

[okie52]

**** off, idiot.

Heh heh

[hawaii 5-0]

You're a pinko commie who probably sleeps with a blow up doll of Lenin every night. ;)

Actually it's Natasha Fatale. She's hot.

5-0

[champions77]

Agree on JFK. He's the last President to truly practice supply side economics.

Clinton was more conservative in some measure than was Bush.

The base has moved to the right on deal breaker issues like the 2nd Amendment. Reagan passed laws supporting gun control (broad term). NO GOP candidate today could do that. Since 9/11 the hawks are running things. The GOP model of diplomacy is based on John Wayne. That's doing nothing but playing wackamole and is a loser in the long term. Say all you want about Bush's Medicare Modernization but his 12 year war in Iraq in the face of tax cuts is the silliest thing I've ever seen.

The issue that I've stated here before is that no one can go far enough right to get the nomination and then get back to the middle to get the moderates to vote for you.

I'd love to see the left get out of the full on welfare but still do things like the ACA, or RomneyCare as I like to call it. :)

The right has "moved" to the right on the second Amendment only in relation to how far to the "left" that the left has moved. Why is it that leftist try and validate their positions by stating that it is the right that has moved their position? In actuality it is the left that has moved radically left in their positions. I can't recall any self described liberals on this forum that has admitted that their positions have moved to the left on any issue, ever. It is always All about the right moving their position.

I dare any leftist on this forum to provide Compelling evidence that the left has NOT moved to the left on most every one of the issues of the day in the last 10-20 years? Please enlighten me.
Hint; do you really believe that an admitted Communist like Obama czar Van Jones would have been allowed a position in any Administration 20 years ago?

[soonergirlNeugene]

Since we live in Oklahoma can we all agree that the supposed Walmart Invasion is like reason #572 that Texas is ridiculous? As a state, it's embarrassing to be seen next to those guys.

[Ton Loc]

**** off, idiot.

Heh, now we're good.

[FaninAma]

I laugh when idiots try to tell me what I think.

Enjoy your AA meeting.

5-0
So you don't think she is okay? Just answer the question instead of acting like you are less partisan than everybody else on the message board. Will you vote for Hillary Clinton if she is the Democrat nominee? Yes or no? The more you dance around the question and try to give a nuanced answer the more you look like a hypocrite.

[FaninAma]

Might have been is the correct answer.

If Hillary gets the nomination I might vote for her. Or I might not. As a swing voter I'll vote for the best candidate. Usually it boils down to the lesser of two evils.

5-0
Everybody who believes this please give me $10.

[yermom]

who is on the other side?

Romney? i'm probably going Hilary

i would have picked McCain over her though

[SoonerorLater]

who is on the other side?

Romney? i'm probably going Hilary

i would have picked McCain over her though

Take two aspirin and if you aren't better in the morning call your doctor.

[SicEmBaylor]

who is on the other side?

Romney? i'm probably going Hilary

i would have picked McCain over her though

I would have picked a cyanide capsule over McCain.

[BoulderSooner79]

I would have picked a cyanide capsule over McCain.

Depends on which McCain you're talking about. There is more than one guy in that body and a couple of them are bat sh.it crazy.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Quote Originally Posted by SicEmBaylor
I would have picked a cyanide capsule over McCain.
Depends on which McCain you're talking about. There is more than one guy in that body and a couple of them are bat sh.it crazy.Even McCain does some things that are good. Bear...not so much.

[FaninAma]

I will never trust establishment GOPers like Jeb, McCain and Graham to avoid getting us involved in foreign military interventionist wars. This branch of the GOP party is every bit as destructive to this country as is the ultra-liberal wing of the Democratic party.

Interventionism in costly wars is one of the things that led to the fall of the Roman Empire. Excessive giveaways to Roamn citizens was another. It seems like we are hell bent on history repeating itself.

[champions77]

I will never trust establishment GOPers like Jeb, McCain and Graham to avoid getting us involved in foreign military interventionist wars. This branch of the GOP party is every bit as destructive to this country as is the ultra-liberal wing of the Democratic party.

Interventionism in costly wars is one of the things that led to the fall of the Roman Empire. Excessive giveaways to Roamn citizens was another. It seems like we are hell bent on history repeating itself.

I cannot agree with you that interventionist wars is as destructive as the ultra liberal plans for this nation. They do increase our debt, but you'll have both with Hillary. A neo-con and a big government liberal who will do everything possible to further their goals of turning us into a democratic-Socialist form of government.
I agree that we have to be much more selective about where we decide to intervene, no question about that. I just think you can go too far in that direction, let a despot build, and then you have three times the mess to deal with versus going in and taking care of the situation in it's infancy. A good example of this is how fast and powerful the JV squad became while dumb dumb looked the other way.

The left is all for building a much bigger government.....except for the US Military. Continued downsizing will attract the attention of our adversaries. Reagan didn't win the Cold War because the US had the perception of being weak, right? In BHO's first few weeks in office, he cancelled the plans to install a missile defense shield in Eastern Europe. Does anyone really think that that did not influence Putin in his plans for invading Ukraine? BHO operates under the false notion that if you make yourself less intimidating, appear less aggressive, and go around apologizing to the World, that your enemies will be less likely to continue their aggressive ways. That diplomacy will be the ticket for peace and prosperity. History has taught us that that is a naïve approach to ones that would do us harm.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I cannot agree with you that interventionist wars is as destructive as the ultra liberal plans for this nation. They do increase our debt, but you'll have both with Hillary. A neo-con and a big government liberal who will do everything possible to further their goals of turning us into a democratic-Socialist form of government.
I agree that we have to be much more selective about where we decide to intervene, no question about that. I just think you can go too far in that direction, let a despot build, and then you have three times the mess to deal with versus going in and taking care of the situation in it's infancy. A good example of this is how fast and powerful the JV squad became while dumb dumb looked the other way.

The left is all for building a much bigger government.....except for the US Military. Continued downsizing will attract the attention of our adversaries. Reagan didn't win the Cold War because the US had the perception of being weak, right? In BHO's first few weeks in office, he cancelled the plans to install a missile defense shield in Eastern Europe. Does anyone really think that that did not influence Putin in his plans for invading Ukraine? BHO operates under the false notion that if you make yourself less intimidating, appear less aggressive, and go around apologizing to the World, that your enemies will be less likely to continue their aggressive ways. That diplomacy will be the ticket for peace and prosperity. History has taught us that that is a naïve approach to ones that would do us harm.HEAR HEAR! That is a most superb post, and points out the major flaw in Libertarian thinking - that having international military presence is usually bad. At least the Libertarians are correct about economics, which admirable, but their thinking on international involvement is damaging, like the entire package of the Left(Democrats and other socialists).

[Serenity Now]

HEAR HEAR! That is a most superb post, and points out the major flaw in Libertarian thinking - that having international military presence is usually bad. At least the Libertarians are correct about economics, which admirable, but their thinking on international involvement is damaging, like the entire package of the Left(Democrats and other socialists).
But, to be GOP in foreign affairs and Libertarian in fiance policy is not possible. It's akin to relying on abstinence only birth control to the cast of Jersey Shore.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

But, to be GOP in foreign affairs and Libertarian in fiance policy is not possible. It's akin to relying on abstinence only birth control to the cast of Jersey Shore.I don't know about any party's fiance policy, but the democrats are GUARANTEED to be wrong on both domestic and foreign governmental policies. At least with the republicans, they will be, even if Lindsay Graham, McCain or Huckabee, considerably better than any democrat running for anything I know about.

People shouldn't even be arguing about it.