Taking Responsibility...

[Temujin]

I've been in the workforce since I was in my early teens. Throughout my various jobs and now career, there is one thing that I've learned that has helped me above all, and that is to take responsibility. The only consistent way to improve yourself, and the only consistent way to gain the respect of your employees, superiors, and peers, is to recognize your faults/mistakes, and work to correct them...or at the very least, make the things you do well so valuable that the faults that you have are irrelevant. You can't blame others and expect to get any respect, or have anyone take you seriously. This particularly extends to those who take the lead. You can't expect your employees to listen to criticism and improve if you refuse to do so yourself.

And that's why this is so disappointing:

http://espn.go.com/blog/big12/post/_/id/90483/bob-stoops-play-calling-wasnt-the-problem-in-loss

Now, the players absolutely bear significant responsibility for the loss. Knight was particularly bad, and you can't blame the coaches for some of the poor throws. It's not the coaches that aren't getting open on routes, and missing assignments. But for several years now we have at least one, and usually two, stinkers like this. Given that players are only eligible for 4 years, you can't entirely put this on the players every time it happens. At the very least, even if the problem is player execution, the responsibility is still on the coaches, because they are responsible for making sure the players understand their roles...and therefore execute. And if they can't do that, then they need different players, or they need to change/simplify the scheme. It can't be entirely on the players when we burn most/all of our timeouts before the 4th quarter every game. It can't be entirely on the players that our scheme completely changes because we fear running QBs.

I'm disappointed that Stoops put this all on the players. Like I said, they absolutely need to improve. The blocking was bad. TK was terrible. Receivers weren't open. But it's hard to respect a man that spews the same tired rhetoric about players not executing every time the team comes up short. But, as this is a recurring pattern of the last 10 years, I've sadly come to expect it.

Anyway, that's the only thing I have to say about the loss. Hopefully they learn from this weekend and go on to crush the burnt bevos.

Boomer

[8timechamps]

I'm disappointed that Stoops put this all on the players.

Huh?

Stoops did not put it all on the players. Watch today's press conference, when he was asked about the TO issues and getting calls in late, he was very clear that the coaches were at fault.

I don't know what people want to hear from him, but Stoops has never thrown an individual player or coach under the bus, and I highly doubt it would start now. Just because we don't hear what is being said behind closed doors doesn't mean it's not being said. Stoops is a great coach, and he saw what everyone else saw Saturday. Regardless of what he says to the media, I think there was some serious conversations being had in the coaching offices.

[Okie35]

He didn't blame the players. He always talks like that and he ended it on a positive note. In another article he also said the team has great chemistry and everyone will bounce back. Maybe the players want to take the responsibility. Some players play better that way.

[Temujin]

Huh?

Stoops did not put it all on the players. Watch today's press conference, when he was asked about the TO issues and getting calls in late, he was very clear that the coaches were at fault.

I don't know what people want to hear from him, but Stoops has never thrown an individual player or coach under the bus, and I highly doubt it would start now. Just because we don't hear what is being said behind closed doors doesn't mean it's not being said. Stoops is a great coach, and he saw what everyone else saw Saturday. Regardless of what he says to the media, I think there was some serious conversations being had in the coaching offices.

My problem is him defending the play-calling and pushing the issue on to the players...which he clearly does here. Maybe he expounded more on the coaching issues in the press conference, but here he actually defends the play-calling over player execution. I don't care what he does behind closed doors because if you're exposing the players' failures publicly but not being honest about the play-calling issues publicly, people are going to take that as blaming the players only. And you're right, he doesn't call out specific players, but he does put the loss on the players in general here.

Play-calling is clearly a problem. For instance, we continue to run the read option...without ever actually running the option. It's a called give every single time. The DE constantly crashes down on the RB leaving TK open to pull the ball out and run - but he never does. And the DE always crashes down on the RB because they know TK isn't going to pull it out. For whatever reason, in every game the offense gets into a rut where we fall in love with the pass and put ourselves in 3rd and long situations that are difficult to convert. And that's not considering the strange changes in defensive schemes when we face running QBs. All year long we make our hay on heavy QB pressure, man/man, and zone blitzes. But when we face Boykin, who's not really an accomplished passer, we abandon what's worked all year long and change everything up.

Just an observation, that's all.

[Therealsouthsider]

...."Watch today's press conference, when he was asked about the TO issues and getting calls in late, he was very clear that the coaches were at fault."

....for just this year specifically or all the years? This has been going on for quite a while


ss

[azheat4u]

Like it was said earlier he's not going to throw the coaches or any of the players under the bus.

As for the defense you can't play man and blitz with an athletic QB, remember the Cotton Bowl with JF? They were trying to make sure they kept him under containment and make him best us with his arm, which he was able to do. Tip your hat to Boykin for playing a near perfect game.

[8timechamps]

My problem is him defending the play-calling and pushing the issue on to the players...which he clearly does here. Maybe he expounded more on the coaching issues in the press conference, but here he actually defends the play-calling over player execution. I don't care what he does behind closed doors because if you're exposing the players' failures publicly but not being honest about the play-calling issues publicly, people are going to take that as blaming the players only. And you're right, he doesn't call out specific players, but he does put the loss on the players in general here.

Play-calling is clearly a problem. For instance, we continue to run the read option...without ever actually running the option. It's a called give every single time. The DE constantly crashes down on the RB leaving TK open to pull the ball out and run - but he never does. And the DE always crashes down on the RB because they know TK isn't going to pull it out. For whatever reason, in every game the offense gets into a rut where we fall in love with the pass and put ourselves in 3rd and long situations that are difficult to convert. And that's not considering the strange changes in defensive schemes when we face running QBs. All year long we make our hay on heavy QB pressure, man/man, and zone blitzes. But when we face Boykin, who's not really an accomplished passer, we abandon what's worked all year long and change everything up.

Just an observation, that's all.

I can only comment on what I (we see/hear). Back when we were having serious issues with D-line production, Stoops never once mentioned an issue with Jackie Shipp. It was always about effort and execution, and getting doing a better job as coaches. When the line was so thin, we literally would have had to move a FB or TE to G or T if one of those guys went down, and we weren't being physical, It was always about effort and execution, and doing a better job as coaches. Everyone was in an uproar over those two areas, and Stoops appeared to be "fine" with things status quo. Then, as soon as the season ended, three coaches were let go. That told me all I needed to know; that Stoops will never call out an individual in the media and that doesn't mean anything as it relates to what is really going on inside the program.

Play calling can be an issue, but against TCU it wasn't the play calling that lost us the game. It was fundamentals and execution, and a lot of that from guys that have played a lot of football at OU. So, placing some blame on the players is justified. Placing blame on the coaches for things that are their control is also justified. Stoops did both.

[Sooner8th]

Like it was said earlier he's not going to throw the coaches or any of the players under the bus.

As for the defense you can't play man and blitz with an athletic QB, remember the Cotton Bowl with JF? They were trying to make sure they kept him under containment and make him best us with his arm, which he was able to do. Tip your hat to Boykin for playing a near perfect game.

I watched sabans press conference and he basically said the same thing stoops said - the coaches have to make our players play better. The replay is just finishing up and I watched the last part of it, it is not doubt that getting two turnovers on our side of the field, the first one at the 21, with six minutes to go being down by 4, we should win. First play after first turnover is a loss by perine then a terrible pass that was picked. On the second it was a pass to the right for 7, then three straight with perine all to the right, then two runs by knight to the left with the second one looking like an option with neal trailing. No imagination, no changing it up. We threw a pass on the first play of the drive gaining 7 and then all runs. I understand why he, heuple, doesn't want knight to throw with how bad he was playing, so not really any complaints there. I do have a huge problem with the time out then not only not having the right guys on the field coming out of it, one ran out late then we ran another one out and the first guy had to rum off - looked like john blake was back in charge. I have a problem with all three of those things and that is coaching, period. The fourth down play with their best defensive linemen out should have been an easy first down, I don't know if perine hit the wrong hole or if there was a missed assignment on the blocking so he had to take that hole. I have a problem with everyone in the country knew who was getting the ball and where he was running. They were slowing perine down and slowing perine down each time each time he ran the ball on that drive. Even before that play I wondered if we should have knight run the ball, but claiming that would have worked would be 20/20 hindsight.

I know I couldn't develop a game plan and call a game at the level of heupel, but that is his job and he needs to improve. It seems to me the playcalling runs hot and cold from the time wilson was the OC, a drive or two with pace and good play calling then all of a sudden the tempo slows down and there seems to be a loss of confidence or running out of ideas. Is it over thinking and/or well if i call perine up the middle, it's the best we got and we gave it our best shot so you cant complain?

[8timechamps]

...."Watch today's press conference, when he was asked about the TO issues and getting calls in late, he was very clear that the coaches were at fault."

....for just this year specifically or all the years? This has been going on for quite a while

ss

What is "this" you're talking about? If it is not throwing individual players/coaches under the bus, then yeah, it has been going on for a while. If it is accepting blame for what the coaches control and mess up, he's also had no problem owning up to that either.

Again, I'd really like to know what people want to hear from Stoops. He's never going to detail injuries, he's never going to go down the list and talk about all of the errors a player and/or coach made during a game. He's never going to be warm and fuzzy to the media. So, with that understood as fact (not my perceptions, just how it's always been), what do people want to hear him say?

[8timechamps]

LETS KEEP THIS ON TRACK -- THIS THREAD IS ABOUT THE RRS

[BoulderSooner79]

LETS KEEP THIS ON TRACK -- THIS THREAD IS ABOUT THE RRS

Well, I would take responsibility for the RRS, but I'm busy this week. Therefore, I nominate 8time to be fully responsible for this year's RRS. Does anyone second the motion?

[birddog]

Hehe.

[Soonerjeepman]

a drive or two with pace and good play calling then all of a sudden the tempo slows down a

This struck me....we are not a hurry up offense anymore (not that you are saying we are). Even though we don't "huddle" we RARELY snap it quickly. How many TO's do we burn because TK is checking off with 5 sec left on play clock...ugh~

[KantoSooner]

Someone would have to prove to me that changing the play with under ten seconds left on the clock EVER makes sense. (I exclude audibles here because they are, in a sense part of a 'decision tree' that is pre-programmed).
The principle holds in any number of activities: Make the job clear and definable and then let the people doing it do their thing. Our offense right now is the opposite: our coaches demand to micromanage and then pile up large and ever shifting responsibilities on the players.

Another little business maxim that is worth thinking about: It's ALWAYS the boss's fault. (even if he has down right evil employees, he should have seen that and gotten rid of them. It's still the boss's fault.)
Bob, if your players are not 'executing', why is that? And what, Bob, are YOU going to do to fix it?

[dwarthog]

Well, I would take responsibility for the RRS, but I'm busy this week. Therefore, I nominate 8time to be fully responsible for this year's RRS. Does anyone second the motion?

I'll throw out a second on the motion. Having someone who's actually on the board to pummel should be much more entertaining...

[Temujin]

Play calling can be an issue, but against TCU it wasn't the play calling that lost us the game. It was fundamentals and execution, and a lot of that from guys that have played a lot of football at OU. So, placing some blame on the players is justified. Placing blame on the coaches for things that are their control is also justified. Stoops did both.

I get what you're saying...and I don't entirely disagree. But what we did on defense in the first half of both WVU and TCU was so fundamentally different from what worked the first three games, it makes me wonder if that's the cause for the lack of execution. If you teach your players to be aggressive, playing up on the WRs and varying blitzes...then suddenly you ask them to play off the WRs and put Striker and Grissom in coverage...it seems counter to our strengths. TCU was very much like Tennessee in their strengths on both sides of the ball. So if it worked against Tennessee, why change it up? I mean, sure, throw in a wrinkle or two, but why play 8 in coverage for much of the game. I know Boykin is a runner, but when we did rush Striker, he got pressure and forced a couple of sacks.

As for the offense, I think what bothered me the most was that TK was clearly struggling, and we kept throwing the same hard slants that he struggles with. Get him on the move and out in space where there's a threat of him running, and guys get open down field. Get him some running yards, build up his confidence a little. And we run the QB draw with him, so we're not entirely scared of him getting hurt...so why does he never pull the ball out on the read option? There was a TD that Perine got on a run up the middle, but had TK pulled the ball on that play, he would've walked in instead of Perine being forced to slam into the line and hope. I love watching Perine run as much as anyone, but it was very clear that TCU had zero respect for the QB run game. And considering that's TK's primary asset, that's not a good thing, IMO.

[Temujin]

Again, I'd really like to know what people want to hear from Stoops. He's never going to detail injuries, he's never going to go down the list and talk about all of the errors a player and/or coach made during a game. He's never going to be warm and fuzzy to the media. So, with that understood as fact (not my perceptions, just how it's always been), what do people want to hear him say?

You remember Tebow's speech? Yeah, I don't like Tebow either, but what he did after that Ole Miss game was take responsibility for the loss and he vowed never to let it happen again. The reality is Tebow wasn't bad in that game. He had a fumble early, but overall he had 3 TDs and got the ball into the hands of his playmakers...exactly what he's supposed to do, since he's not really that great of a QB. But if you're a teammate of Tebow's, and you know you didn't play well, but your leader who didn't really play that poorly is taking the responsibility for the loss publicly, and vowing to work harder than ever...and then he goes out and proves it, it makes you want to work harder, play harder, etc. He was angry at the loss, and he was angry at himself.

During press conferences after a loss, there's a lot of low-talk and hanging of heads. I also hear a lot about what went wrong. I get it, losing is depressing. I remember those days. I guess I want Stoops to recognize that every year we do some really baffling things that lead us into losses. And I want him to be angry about it, not dejected and defiant. I, like everyone else, assumed that the coaching changes were a silent acknowledgment of those issues and an attempt at a fix. But these press conferences bother me in their tone. It just feels wrong.

Anyway, like I said, just an observation.

And Texas still sucks.

[cherokeebrewer]

I entered the work force at 10 yrs old. Just thought I'd throw that in...

[birddog]

I entered the work force at 10 yrs old. Just thought I'd throw that in...

So, you want the keys to the responsibility hotel? Who do you think should check in?

[SoonerorLater]

I'm stepping up and taking personal responsibility for the loss to TCU.

[BoulderSooner79]

I entered the work force at 10 yrs old. Just thought I'd throw that in...

Were you working at that sweatshop that made my Sooner hoodie? Well, that defect in the left sleeves seems to have gotten past inspector 42. I'd like a refund.

[cherokeebrewer]

So, you want the keys to the responsibility hotel? Who do you think should check in?

Any and all involved with that last time out and then came out of it more confused than they were going in is a start...

[cherokeebrewer]

Were you working at that sweatshop that made my Sooner hoodie? Well, that defect in the left sleeves seems to have gotten past inspector 42. I'd like a refund.

Back then we called 'em leather jackets...

[dwarthog]

I'm stepping up and taking personal responsibility for the loss to TCU.

You dirty low down no good skunk, I knew we would find who was responsible for this loss, Sooner or Later.......

[SoonerorLater]

You dirty low down no good skunk, I knew we would find who was responsible for this loss, Sooner or Later.......

I deserved that.

[BoulderSooner79]

You dirty low down no good skunk, I knew we would find who was responsible for this loss, Sooner or Later.......


I deserved that.

Well, turn it around and beat the horns and you get full credit for that.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Go to any message board for any football team (college or pro) in the country and they'll complain about playcalling. They complained about it at TT when Leach was coaching. They probably complained about Switzer running the ball up the middle too much. Playcalling is for the most part a red herring. If you went in and had some method for figuring out right vs wrong playcalling for every coach in the country you'd probably find almost all of them are in the 20-25% range over the season in calling "correct" plays. The top guys are probably in the 30-35% range. That is human nature, we suck at stuff like that and naturally form a pareto.

[BoulderSooner79]

I distinctly recall folks clamoring for Switzer to pass the ball more during the 70's heyday of the wishbone. After all, we got a lot of big plays out of it and it was frustrating to get in 3rd and long and not have a good chance to convert. What folks refused to acknowledge was the O-line on those teams were terrible at pass protection as 90% of practice was the run game. Our passing game only worked when it was a complete surprise and that was only possible if we passed <10 times/game. If our QB dropped back on 3rd and 8, he was immediately running for his life.

[Temujin]

Go to any message board for any football team (college or pro) in the country and they'll complain about playcalling. They complained about it at TT when Leach was coaching. They probably complained about Switzer running the ball up the middle too much. Playcalling is for the most part a red herring. If you went in and had some method for figuring out right vs wrong playcalling for every coach in the country you'd probably find almost all of them are in the 20-25% range over the season in calling "correct" plays. The top guys are probably in the 30-35% range. That is human nature, we suck at stuff like that and naturally form a pareto.

I honestly don't care what kind of scheme we run as long as we win. I do have to admit that I love watching Perine bowl over defenders, but that's just because it's fun to watch. And the attacking defense that we put on display against Tennessee was also fun to watch, even while we gave up a couple of big plays. But as long as we're winning, I couldn't care less. One of my concerns is that what we were doing 3 weeks ago is not the same thing we've done the last 2 games...and it makes me wonder why, especially since the last 2 games haven't had the same result as the previous three. The coaches are highlighting that we made more mistakes, but isn't it possible that it's because we're not executing the same offense/defense that we were running before? And the other concern is the propensity to toss out a real stinker 2 or more times per year for no apparent reason at all.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I honestly don't care what kind of scheme we run as long as we win. I do have to admit that I love watching Perine bowl over defenders, but that's just because it's fun to watch. And the attacking defense that we put on display against Tennessee was also fun to watch, even while we gave up a couple of big plays. But as long as we're winning, I couldn't care less. One of my concerns is that what we were doing 3 weeks ago is not the same thing we've done the last 2 games...and it makes me wonder why, especially since the last 2 games haven't had the same result as the previous three. The coaches are highlighting that we made more mistakes, but isn't it possible that it's because we're not executing the same offense/defense that we were running before? And the other concern is the propensity to toss out a real stinker 2 or more times per year for no apparent reason at all.

We do win. We win more than 90% of the schools in Division 1. We've won more games than 99% of the programs over the last 15 years.

But that isn't what you want, you want to win EVERY game. Or more specifically, you want a 13 game winning streak within a single season. In order to win every game, you have to have consistency on defense to go along with explosion on offense.

[KantoSooner]

I'm a simple soul, I just want OU, this weekend, to do unto Texas what Maximus did unto Titus of Gaul.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

I'm a simple soul, I just want OU, this weekend, to do unto Texas what Maximus did unto Titus of Gaul.

Paint his toe nails

[KantoSooner]

In a sense.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

taking responsibility with co workers and a coach airing out everything to the media is not the same. The coach is not responsible to the public, he is responsible to his team.

[Temujin]

We do win. We win more than 90% of the schools in Division 1. We've won more games than 99% of the programs over the last 15 years.

Ok, now I'm curious where I said that we don't win. Read into the post what you want, but I never said we don't win, or that I don't like a certain scheme. I just said Perine bowling over defenders was fun to watch, and that I'm baffled by the scheme changes we deploy sometimes.


But that isn't what you want, you want to win EVERY game. Or more specifically, you want a 13 game winning streak within a single season. In order to win every game, you have to have consistency on defense to go along with explosion on offense.

And you don't want OU to win every game? I guess I mistakenly thought that was the purpose of rooting for a team.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Ok, now I'm curious where I said that we don't win. Read into the post what you want, but I never said we don't win, or that I don't like a certain scheme. I just said Perine bowling over defenders was fun to watch, and that I'm baffled by the scheme changes we deploy sometimes.

I highlighted it in the post. "I honestly don't care what kind of scheme we run as long as we win." It was just inference, you don't care what we do if we win, but you question it after a loss. As I've said as far back as 2001, Stoops has an Atlanta Braves problem because of the diversity of offenses in the big 12 - if you build it for the postseason you might not get there, but if you build it for the regular season you probably won't win it in the post season.

One thing that people forget about Alabama's MNC runs is that the SEC was pretty uniform in offense during that time. Since they've started diversifying with more spread, they've had a lot tougher time getting through undefeated.

[Temujin]

I highlighted it in the post. "I honestly don't care what kind of scheme we run as long as we win." It was just inference, you don't care what we do if we win, but you question it after a loss. As I've said as far back as 2001, Stoops has an Atlanta Braves problem because of the diversity of offenses in the big 12 - if you build it for the postseason you might not get there, but if you build it for the regular season you probably won't win it in the post season.

One thing that people forget about Alabama's MNC runs is that the SEC was pretty uniform in offense during that time. Since they've started diversifying with more spread, they've had a lot tougher time getting through undefeated.

Well, you clearly misread then. I was responding to your comments regarding play-calling and Switzer. That little thing called context is what helps define the true meaning of my statement, which was distinctly the opposite of what you read into it. I inferred nothing, and merely made a statement that I'm fine with whatever scheme we run "as long as we win". The rest of my post bears that out as well, but it appears that you were too busy firing from the hip at the first sentence to notice.

[Temujin]

One thing that people forget about Alabama's MNC runs is that the SEC was pretty uniform in offense during that time. Since they've started diversifying with more spread, they've had a lot tougher time getting through undefeated.

I agree with that. I think what's particularly stinging about the TCU loss is that they gave us opportunity after opportunity with penalties and turnovers. But we weren't prepared to take advantage because we were busy making our own mistakes. And like the rest of my earlier post stated, what we saw the first 3 games versus what we've seen the last 2, there's a pretty significant difference between then and now, mainly on the defensive side. I think that kind of thing leads to mistakes.

[Soonerjeepman]

Again, I'd really like to know what people want to hear from Stoops. He's never going to detail injuries, he's never going to go down the list and talk about all of the errors a player and/or coach made during a game. He's never going to be warm and fuzzy to the media. So, with that understood as fact (not my perceptions, just how it's always been), what do people want to hear him say?

I would like for once...Stoops to say, "yes, we have a problem managing our time-outs and getting plays in (especially after a crap filled game). We are rectifying that."

That would be good for me~ but like you said, that would mean JH isn't doing a great job at that..and he won't.

[8timechamps]

I would like for once...Stoops to say, "yes, we have a problem managing our time-outs and getting plays in (especially after a crap filled game). We are rectifying that."

That would be good for me~ but like you said, that would mean JH isn't doing a great job at that..and he won't.

About as close as he'll get is what he said on Monday. Something close to "we didn't do a very good job of that".

That's just not his style.