Is Trevor the answer?

[ouhomer123]

I dont think so.:frown:

[Eielson]

BAKER MAYFIELD!!

[ouhomer123]

At one point he was 9 of 26...sheesh!

[Therealsouthsider]

....I don't see Knight as the problem, I think he can do the job....Heuple needs to stop expecting the squirrel to swim and the fish to climb trees

ss

[Eielson]

It really depends on what the question is.

[Mookie91]

He's not a National Championship QB but OU will be 11-2 despite him

[Okie35]

Doesn't matter. If we aren't balanced on offense nobody is. Don't know why the run was abandoned.

[EatLeadCommie]

Trevor is adequate, but probably our most inaccurate passer under Stoops. But honestly, the one INT was just a good play and the other one was barely overthrown. I think something is wrong with his leg.

Be careful what you wish for because we have no serviceable backup and a pretty poor WR corps outside of Shep.

[Okie35]

He's not a National Championship QB but OU will be 11-2 despite him

14-1...

[Snrinhouston]

There are a lot of moving parts.

1. Knight certainly needs to get better
2. The "vaunted" o-line run blocks inconsistently
3. Way too much reliance on Shepard.
4. Still not utilizing the tight end much.
5. Way too many losses or negligible gains on first down

[azheat4u]

After the Alabama game everyone thought he was the answer. Now he has a bad game the world is ending. Last time I looked this was a team game and not one Sooner player or coach was perfect today.
The game is over and it's now Texas week.
#beattexas

[Eielson]

He's not a National Championship QB but OU will be 11-2 despite him

Yeah, TK's only a Sugar Bowl Champ type QB.

[ObiKaTony]

I dont think so.:frown:

If we run the Landry style offense, then he is not the answer. If we run a read option offense then we can win and he will succeed...

[SoonerMarkVA]

Well, he ain't no JFF, whatever the players report from that magical scout team run mimicking him.

My bigger question now is about his durability. I think if they let him play to his strengths, he can be pretty darn good. But tonight they started to do that after we went down 14-0, and he was hurt within 2 quarters. He's been hurt a lot for his limited playing time.

[aurorasooner]

Just watching TK when he doesn't have any accuracy from the pocket, he doesn't stride into his throws like when he makes on-the-money throws, and I think it's all with his left leg. It looks like it starts too far forward (legs are too far apart) on his bad throws. Sort of like a right handed golfer who keeps all the weight on left side thru his swing.

Not a QB guru, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night, fwiw.

Not sure about when he scrambles or throws on the run, but he's no Fran Tarkington, that's for sure.

[IGotNoTiming]

It apppeared Trev's game went in the crapper after that series when he was gimpy coming off the field in the 3rd quarter. Someone else posted about his leg.... If he was indeed injured then it is what it is... Hope he gets better. If that isn't the case it could be a long frustrating season.

[Mookie91]

Not one game, Knight has 5 TDs and 5 Ints, at this point in the season he should have 20 TDs and 5 Ints.

[BoulderSooner79]

It really depends on what the question is.

Who did Katy Perry ask to call her at the end of college gameday, Alex?

[Okie35]

It apppeared Trev's game went in the crapper after that series when he was gimpy coming off the field in the 3rd quarter. Someone else posted about his leg.... If he was indeed injured then it is what it is... Hope he gets better. If that isn't the case it could be a long frustrating season.

Yup, after a few hits he wasn't himself. Josh shouldn't have tried to pass heavy especially when we had the ball and it was 31-31.

[azheat4u]

He wasn't injured he was cramping up. He was guzzling Gatorade on the sidelines.

[Okie35]

He wasn't injured he was cramping up. He was guzzling Gatorade on the sidelines.

He was still getting hit A LOT. There will be blood after this loss. Which will be for the better.

[BoulderSooner79]

He was still getting hit A LOT. There will be blood after this loss. Which will be for the better.

Whose blood?

[Eielson]

Who did Katy Perry ask to call her at the end of college gameday, Alex?

What is Trevor Knight?

[BoulderSooner79]

What is Trevor Knight?

The data has been updated. She reneged in that offer, and changed it to Boykin. :concern:

[jkjsooner]

Doesn't matter. If we aren't balanced on offense nobody is. Don't know why the run was abandoned.

I agree 100% but let's put another perspective on it.

You can't run the ball on first down every series. We tried to mix it up. Unfortunately for several possessions in a row we didn't complete it on first down and put us in passing situations.

If you run on first down every time and the defense starts selling out to stop it, we'll question the offensive coordinator. If we pass on first down, don't complete it, we'll start questioning why we passed on three straight plays and abandoned the run.

These things are inevitable. I'm not sure there's ever been and offensive coordinator who hasn't taken this criticism because it's so easy to do when you fail on first down.

All that said, we didn't have to abandon the run on three straight possessions or (worse) try to establish the run with Ross. I can't wait to get Ford back and forget about Ross as a main RB. The guy just isn't getting it done.

[Eielson]

The data has been updated. She reneged in that offer, and changed it to Boykin. :concern:

Alright, well the answer is Boykin. Nothing more to discuss here. I'm glad we could come together and solve this.

[ouhomer123]

I know he is not fully to blame but he sure seemed rattled any time he was in the pocket and made bad throws. It did not help the O line let everything through!

[nighttrain12]

He's not a National Championship QB but OU will be 11-2 despite him

Sounds like Landry Jones!

[Snrinhouston]

I agree 100% but let's put another perspective on it.

You can't run the ball on first down every series. We tried to mix it up. Unfortunately for several possessions in a row we didn't complete it on first down and put us in passing situations.

If you run on first down every time and the defense starts selling out to stop it, we'll question the offensive coordinator. If we pass on first down, don't complete it, we'll start questioning why we passed on three straight plays and abandoned the run.

These things are inevitable. I'm not sure there's ever been and offensive coordinator who hasn't taken this criticism because it's so easy to do when you fail on first down.

All that said, we didn't have to abandon the run on three straight possessions or (worse) try to establish the run with Ross. I can't wait to get Ford back and forget about Ross as a main RB. The guy just isn't getting it done.

Yep, that is THE reason this game could not be won by the offense. I'm sure TCU's median gain on first down was significantly better than OUs.

[okiewaker]

Apparently the coaches do,,,so,,that's good enuff with me.

[beached_sooner]

Where's the let's dump Trevor thread? He couldn't hit the broadside of a barn in the second half. I could care less about his running ability. Get someone who can complete passes. Cody Thomas, you're up.

[PhiDeltBeers]

Fire TK!

[Statalyzer]

After the Alabama game everyone thought he was the answer. Now he has a bad game the world is ending.

So the question is, which one of those was a statistical outlier, and which was the more typical performance?

[TrophyCollector]

Not if we need a QB who is accurate enough to put a Hail Mary pass in the field of play. All you have to do is land the ball somewhere in the giant 10 yard rectangle. Putting the proper touch on the ball does not seem to be a strong suit.

[BoulderSooner79]

Not if we need a QB who is accurate enough to put a Hail Mary pass in the field of play. All you have to do is land the ball somewhere in the giant 10 yard rectangle. Putting the proper touch on the ball does not seem to be a strong suit.

Yeah, that was disappointing. The Hail Mary isn't going to work very often, but at least give us the drama.

[Sooner91ATL]

TK had a great sugar bowl, no doubt about it. He also had Bester, Shepard, and most importantly, Jalen Saunders to throw to. With only Shepard this year playing at a high level among the receivers, and TK unable to throw consistently well, we find ourselves in a catch-22. Unable to convert 3rd downs consistently, and unable to gain solid yardage on first and second down consistently. When Shepard gets open and TK can get it in the neighborhood, we have some big plays (Shepard usually needing to adjust significantly to the throw, as he did for all 3 of his big plays yesterday). Fine, it happens a few times a game and Shep gets his 100 yards. So the answer to "is TK the answer" has to be yes, because he is the only answer. We have no other QB on board who can play, unless we revert Bell and get him game ready. At best, the answer of "yes he is the answer" gets only partial credit, since he is the default answer. Stoops' rare public display of annoyance at Mayfield's ineligibility ruling provides a clue as to what the coaches think about our QB situation. Take away the Sugar Bowl and TKs passing portfolio looks to be worse than any other QB in the Stoops era, over the first 10 games of their career.

How many defenses left on the schedule can crowd the box and force us to throw, and have the athleticism to be effective in slowing the run game? Outside of KU, and sometimes-pesky ISU, I don't see any team who can't use the TCU formula to cause our O some big issues. Tech's D is suspect but it's a home game for them so I will call them neutral in this logic for the moment. We've got to get better in the passing game or we will see a repeat of yesterday again in the near future.

[sendbaht]

He will be fine if not outstanding...

[cherokeebrewer]

Don't know if he's the answer but he's our best option. If not TK then who?...rhetorical question.

[Jason White's Third Knee]

He's not a National Championship QB but OU will be 11-2 despite him

Sounds like Landry Jones!

Aside from Landry's first year, he had no where near the o-line that Trevor has. TK is wildly inconsistent. I would like to know why.

[Tear Down This Wall]

We talk about this in the stands, Knight's lack of accuracy. He still throws behind guys. Receivers wide open have to wait for balls because he doesn't have great arm strength.

Unless Stoops is a complete idiot - and, he may be with his real QB now starting at TE - Baker Mayfield challenges Knight for the job in 2015.

[Sooner Schemer]

He could sure use a full-time quarterback coach on the sideline.

[ashley]

He can talk to the OC on the phone, he doesn't need to stand beside him.

[stoopified]

....I don't see Knight as the problem, I think he can do the job....Heuple needs to stop expecting the squirrel to swim and the fish to climb trees

ss Exactly,we need to adapt the offense to fit hi strengths ,he isn't Sa,Jason, or Landry and we need to quit throwing so many long balls .More running,option,qb run game and short passes with limited vertical passing. The insistence on throwing so many vertical routes to wr s and ignoring slants,screens,ceosing patterns has led to a marked decrease in execution in our pass game.

[#8soon]

Where's the let's let's dump Trevor thread? He couldn't hit the broadside of a barn in the second half. I could care less about his running ability. Get someone who can complete passes. Cody Thomas, you're up.

^^^
THIS

[okiewaker]

Where's the let's let's dump Trevor thread? He couldn't hit the broadside of a barn in the second half. I could care less about his running ability. Get someone who can complete passes. Cody Thomas, you're up.

^^^
THIS

Extremely Homosexual ^^^^

[BoulderSooner79]

Extremely Homosexual ^^^^

NTTAWWT

[#8soon]

Extremely Homosexual ^^^^

Because I agree with beached sooner?

[okiewaker]

Extremely Homosexual ^^^^

NTTAWWT
^^^^
Oops,,PC police! Better tone it down.

[tulsaoilerfan]

U guys know that Stoops will never pull a QB unless he's injured; the last one I remember is Thompson being yanked for Bomar in 05 after the TCU Game. QB seems to be the one position at OU that will never be pulled for performance issues

[Curly Bill]

I haven't read this entire thread, but to answer the initial question: No, Trevor is not the answer.

...and how in the hell do you miss the entire endzone on a Hail Mary pass?

[okiewaker]

I believe he could be an effective QB if they utilize him differently. Right now they are trying to make him something he isn't. So yes to your question.

[olevetonahill]

Answer to WHAT?

[Curly Bill]

Answer to WHAT?

College quarterback that sucked the hardest on Saturday

[olevetonahill]

College quarterback that sucked the hardest on Saturday

I see, Love ya Jeff, But just who would you have replaced him with?

[Curly Bill]

I see, Love ya Jeff, But just who would you have replaced him with?

Someone that could hit the MFing end zone for one thing! How in the hell do you miss the entire end zone for Christ's sake?????????

Missing the end zone being in addition to damn near every other pass he threw being off target!

[IamBigRed]

This . . .
....I don't see Knight as the problem, I think he can do the job....Heuple needs to stop expecting the squirrel to swim and the fish to climb trees

ss

This. . .
If we run the Landry style offense, then he is not the answer. If we run a read option offense then we can win and he will succeed...{/QUOTE]

and this . . . [QUOTE=okiewaker;4861505]I believe he could be an effective QB if they utilize him differently. Right now they are trying to make him something he isn't. So yes to your question.

He was successful in the Sugar Bowl cause they played to his strengths. He isn't a drop back passer. Design the offense for what he can do.

[olevetonahill]

Someone that could hit the MFing end zone for one thing! How in the hell do you miss the entire end zone for Christ's sake?????????

Missing the end zone being in addition to damn near every other pass he threw being off target!

He was spot on the 1st 1/2/
Came up Gimp in the 2nd and dint hit shat!
I still say he was hurt. But the best we had at the time.

[Curly Bill]

He was spot on the 1st 1/2/
Came up Gimp in the 2nd and dint hit shat!
I still say he was hurt. But the best we had at the time.

Other than the Bama game I don't know that he's ever been spot on? Shepard makes him look a lot better than he is. Knight is not an accurate passer - even many of the passes that are caught are not especially accurate, passes being thrown behind receivers seeming to be the most common problem.

[olevetonahill]

Other than the Bama game I don't know that he's ever been spot on? Shepard makes him look a lot better than he is. Knight is not an accurate passer - even many of the passes that are caught are not especially accurate, passes being thrown behind receivers seeming to be the most common problem.

Hes Better than Bell But lets drop back to Last spring a Year ago! Thompson was the Man. Had he not got injured and gotten the snaps he would be the starter.
But Hes Gone BB is a Tight End Who will be better than TK?

[#8soon]

[QUOTE=olevetonahill;4861557]Hes Better than Bell But lets drop back to Last spring a Year ago! Thompson was the Man. Had he not got injured and gotten the snaps he would be the starter.
But Hes Gone BB is a Tight End Who will be better than TK?

[Eielson]

Other than the Bama game I don't know that he's ever been spot on? Shepard makes him look a lot better than he is. Knight is not an accurate passer - even many of the passes that are caught are not especially accurate, passes being thrown behind receivers seeming to be the most common problem.

If you say that, then the rest of his targets make him look worse than he is. Neal is the only decent one, and he sucked against WVU. Bell should not be our TE.

[olevetonahill]

The Best QB is the one before Or the Next one.
TK is a great Kid.

I quit., Ima Sooner Fan . Not a Sooner Critic.
I aint a 6 million dollar a year coach nor am I a High Paid ESPN analyst, Ima a FAN
Let me enjoy that ok?

[BoulderSooner79]

This . . .

This. . . [QUOTE]If we run the Landry style offense, then he is not the answer. If we run a read option offense then we can win and he will succeed...{/QUOTE]

and this . . .

He was successful in the Sugar Bowl cause they played to his strengths. He isn't a drop back passer. Design the offense for what he can do.

In the Sugar Bowl almost all his big plays were as a drop back passer, so there's that.

[Eielson]

This . . .

This. . .

In the Sugar Bowl almost all his big plays were as a drop back passer, so there's that.

In both his freshman and sophomore years, there is a clear correlation between his running attempts and his inaccuracy. He just can't take hits well.

[SoonerForLife92]

If you say that, then the rest of his targets make him look worse than he is. Neal is the only decent one, and he sucked against WVU. Bell should not be our TE.

Blake was WIDE open in the endzone on the play where Trevor threw the pick. Trevor lobs it a bit over the defender and we most likely win the game.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Knight was inaccurate in high school and has simply carried that over to this level. His accuracy is likely to never get better. Unfortunately with the way this coaching staff works, he will be the starting QB the next two seasons as well barring injury, so another 4 year career QB that will not take the Sooners to the NC game.

[oudanny]

You could ask that question about any of the players on Saturday. They all need to play better. Our vaunted defense gave up 31 points. Our coaches seemed totally lost at times. It was a total team loss.

[yankee]

We talk about this in the stands, Knight's lack of accuracy. He still throws behind guys. Receivers wide open have to wait for balls because he doesn't have great arm strength.

Unless Stoops is a complete idiot - and, he may be with his real QB now starting at TE - Baker Mayfield challenges Knight for the job in 2015.

Hahaha...Just spit out my coffee.

OK then.

[Pride1Mom]

Offense scored 31 points! That should be enough to win any game. BLAME the defense and the kicking game.......

[Tear Down This Wall]

Bell's QB stats:
150 of 253, 59.3% completion percentage, 1763 yards, 12 TD passes, 6 INTs thrown; Bell, 24 rushing TDs

Knight's QB stats:
169 of 299, 56.5% completion percentage, 2193 yards, 14 TD passes, 10 INTs thrown; Knight, 4 rushing TDs

So, go lick up your coffee.

[BoulderSooner79]

Go look up Bell's stats for the game in Dallas last year.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Go look up Knight's stats for any game not named Sugar Bowl from last year.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

The Best QB is the one before Or the Next one.
TK is a great Kid.

I quit., Ima Sooner Fan . Not a Sooner Critic.
I aint a 6 million dollar a year coach nor am I a High Paid ESPN analyst, Ima a FAN
Let me enjoy that ok?

That's not OK!! If you're not calling for everybody to be fired and the qb to be hanged, then you are not a real fan!!!

[BoulderSooner79]

Understood, but just saying that Bell looked just as lost against the horns as Knight did against TCU. And in both cases, the defense was stacking the box and playing press coverage just daring us to throw. That's what we're going to see from every team capable of playing that way.

[sooner13f]

This is a strange topic given we scored 33 points. I was not able to watch the game until Sunday but I wouldnt hang this on TK neck. He did seem winded at times and possibly camping after several scrambles.

[olevetonahill]

That's not OK!! If you're not calling for everybody to be fired and the qb to be hanged, then you are not a real fan!!!

Dayum, Ima need to go to skool and larn how to be a fan LOL

[Tear Down This Wall]

This is a strange topic given we scored 33 points. I was not able to watch the game until Sunday but I wouldnt hang this on TK neck. He did seem winded at times and possibly camping after several scrambles.

If he's winded/cramping on a 70-75 degree day...? Why is he running then? It's taken them this long to discover that their "running" QB gets winded and cramps up in 70 degree weather?

That's a cop out. Oklahoma practices in temperatures much hotter than the temperature was in Fort Worth on Saturday. If we are to believe all the hype coming out of OU about the voluntary off-season strength and conditioning, the players are all happily putting themselves through hell in 95-105 degree weather all summer long.

If he's dehydrated/cramping, that's on the staff. Get Schmidt off the sideline and back near the benches where he can help the players stay ready if it's an issue.

Cramping on a 70 degree day. Baloney. That's poor preparation if it's true.

Sounds like a Mack Brown/"I'll answer that one for Chris" type of response.

[beached_sooner]

This is a strange topic given we scored 33 points. I was not able to watch the game until Sunday but I wouldnt hang this on TK neck. He did seem winded at times and possibly camping after several scrambles.

Well yeah, it's not completely his fault, but when the opposing team is stacking the box negating the run, and yer QB can't hardly make a single completion in the second half... how can you not place a significant amount of blame on him ??

[Eielson]

Bell's QB stats:
150 of 253, 59.3% completion percentage, 1763 yards, 12 TD passes, 6 INTs thrown; Bell, 24 rushing TDs

Knight's QB stats:
169 of 299, 56.5% completion percentage, 2193 yards, 14 TD passes, 10 INTs thrown; Knight, 4 rushing TDs

So, go lick up your coffee.

I could not care less that Bell torched Tulsa. He threw for 152 yards against TCU, 133 yards against Texas, 131 yards against Kansas, and 150 yards against Baylor...and that was with a really good group of receivers. Even on Trevor's bad days (Saturday) he throws for 300 yards.

Here are some fun facts...

TK's passer rating against TCU yesterday: 112.2

That's pretty bad, right?

Bell's passer ratings against Texas, Baylor: 73.7, 76.9

[FaninAma]

Your QB shouldn't have to win every game by himself but TK contributed more than his share to the loss. He looked like the collegiate version of Tony Romo.

[EatLeadCommie]

TK would look better if anybody besides Shep would catch some balls. Neal and Young have looked good at times, and both were absent against TCU. If the guys we brought in with the last class can't crack the starting lineup, that has me concerned when Shep leaves.

[SoonerorLater]

Sounds like everybody wants a running QB that throws the ball like Sam Bradford.

[birddog]

Or within 5 yards of the receivers would work for me. It's a receiver problem. Nobody got open last Sat, and if they did the pocket had collapses already.

[EatLeadCommie]

Part of TK's problem is also that he is short and has balls batted down quite a bit. Nothing he can do about that, though, except maybe play with platform shoes.

[BoulderSooner79]

Or within 5 yards of the receivers would work for me. It's a receiver problem. Nobody got open last Sat, and if they did the pocket had collapses already.

I saw several instances where that wasn't true. He had time and open receiver(s), but didn't see them. On one play, he had Shep uncovered on a short route and Neal double covered on a longer route right behind him. He threw it into double coverage and it was broken up. I don't know the percentage of plays like this since the camera doesn't often show what's going on downfield, but this was at least 4 of incompletions I saw. There certainly were plays where no one was open and TK had little time, but it doesn't account for all the stats. Everyone needs to step up to make the passing game effective because that is going to be the game plan against us - stop the run and dare the pass.

[Tear Down This Wall]

I could not care less that Bell torched Tulsa. He threw for 152 yards against TCU, 133 yards against Texas, 131 yards against Kansas, and 150 yards against Baylor...and that was with a really good group of receivers. Even on Trevor's bad days (Saturday) he throws for 300 yards.

Here are some fun facts...

TK's passer rating against TCU yesterday: 112.2

That's pretty bad, right?

Bell's passer ratings against Texas, Baylor: 73.7, 76.9

You forgot Blake Bell 232 yards passing with 2 TD/0 INT at Notre Dame...

...but, I mean, most fans of college football forget when their schools beat Notre Dame in South Bend.

Can't remember if Bell cramped against the Golden Domers; so, Knight has that on him.

Also, you seem to like the QB rating, so we may as well throw both career QB ratings into the mix as well:
Bell = 128.7
Knight = 126.9

Bell in 2013 = 132.2
Knight in 2013 = 125.0

So, again...for review...the better quarterback is playing tight end because the current starter looked good against our scout team in bowl prep for Johnny Manziel and he had one good game last season against Alabama.

You'll have to simply face facts - any way you dice it, Bell's numbers are a bit on the more positive side that Knight's. What's the shame in just admitting that? It's all right there.

Also, if you want to dig deeper into the physical nature of the position, you can already begin building a case that Knight is injury-prone in addition to not being able to put up better numbers than Bell.

Either way, we are stuck with Knight this year - until he is injured again because our brain trust on the offense side of the ledger has designed it that way. Then, we will be piloted by a freshman or redshirt freshman. That is the position Stoops allowed his offensive coaches to put the team in. Pretty short sighted.

[birddog]

I'm sure it was a little of everything. I was leaning more towards the receivers were blanketed for those first couple of seconds after the snap. When knight finally saw em he couldn't hit em most of the time. Honestly we haven't gone without a great slot guy in years and that is a big problem for us. Young, and quick will be good options for the offense in time but it hurt us last Sat.

[Tear Down This Wall]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wK0s9VHkX4s

Would have been neat to have Bell in the same backfield as Perine. Imagine Bell as a somewhat heavier Collin Klein, the former K-State QB who, like Bell, is 6-5 and could run. That type of running paired up with the likes of Perine.

It's not as sexy as throwing the ball four yards behind the line of scrimmage...or, having telegraphed slant passes being picked off by opposing linebackers-type of sexy. But, you can picture it nonetheless.

[Tear Down This Wall]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9K684YZeynw

Do we know why our offensive brain trust removed this play that resulted in 24 TDs over a two-year span? It was pretty effective in short yardage. Blake and Perine lined up in the Belldozer?

Would that be too much of a sin these days, two years down the road? Ripkowski is still on the roster, right? What's the drawback?

[BoulderSooner79]

A horizontal passing game with WR screens and outlets to the RBs is not sexy. But it is a necessary part of the game to help loosen up the defense for longer passes *AND* more holes in the running game. It's like anything else - it can be over-used or under-used and right now, we are under-using it.

[Tear Down This Wall]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OU9QsIaGEKQ

Passing. Running. Jet sweeps. Handing to the fullback. All from the Belldozer package in 2011-12.

It's coaching cliche' to say 'we are going to design an offense based on the abilities of our personnel.' I think you can look back at what they used to do with Blake Bell and say that they simply gave up on it.

[Tear Down This Wall]

A horizontal passing game with WR screens and outlets to the RBs is not sexy. But it is a necessary part of the game to help loosen up the defense for longer passes *AND* more holes in the running game. It's like anything else - it can be over-used or under-used and right now, we are under-using it.

And, here is something I think we can agree on for the day! That and fish-gutting people who say TCU is a Big Game!

Our problem, as I see it, is Knight isn't too accurate long. Bell wasn't White/Bradford/Landry-like with it either (and, let's admit something here: we were spoiled enough by White and Bradford to complain about Landry...a crazy thought these days). But, Bell does have a stronger arm than Knight.

Kudos to Bell for being unselfish. But, if the TCU game is an indication of how the rest of the season goes - QB gimpy/cramped from running and unable to release quickly enough to hit open targets...we are certainly going to be rehashing these discussions two or three more times before the season is done.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

Holy sh!t! Somebody's pining away for the Belldozer? All I remember is people bitching about it for the past year and a half. Nostalgia's a funny thing.

[Eielson]

You forgot Blake Bell 232 yards passing with 2 TD/0 INT at Notre Dame...

He had a decent game against ND. Cool. That's no reason to ignore the atrocious 5 game stretch in conference that proceeded it. You claim that the Alabama game isn't a good reason to play TK, but yet you think Bell should start forever because he threw for 232 yards against ND? Yikes.


Also, you seem to like the QB rating, so we may as well throw both career QB ratings into the mix as well:
Bell = 128.7
Knight = 126.9

Are you seriously already back to bragging about how Bell torched Tulsa in the non-conference? You did watch the UT and Baylor games right? It seems this point didn't stick with you the first time, so I'll try it again; Bell averaged 163 yards per game in his 5 conference starts (excluding ISU, because he got hurt).


Also, if you want to dig deeper into the physical nature of the position, you can already begin building a case that Knight is injury-prone

You think we should bench a healthy player because he is injury prone? That's a good one!


Then, we will be piloted by a freshman or redshirt freshman. That is the position Stoops allowed his offensive coaches to put the team in. Pretty short sighted.

Huh? We're going to be starting a Junior next year. If not, it will probably be a sophomore.

[Eielson]

Holy sh!t! Somebody's pining away for the Belldozer? All I remember is people bitching about it for the past year and a half. Nostalgia's a funny thing.

It worked brilliantly for a while, but it repeatedly gets stuffed at or behind the line of scrimmage now. Nobody wants to ever see that formation again.

[Okie35]

We played vanilla ... Watch us pull out everything against Texas and KSU. We didn't motion the receivers much as decoys... Didn't use the tight end... Flowers was non existent. I hate how it always takes one loss to get it together but it is what it is. We will win out. It wouldn't matter if TCU only has one loss because if we won out we'd still be ahead in the polls. Just be a top 4 team and you make it in.

[8timechamps]

TK would look better if anybody besides Shep would catch some balls. Neal and Young have looked good at times, and both were absent against TCU. If the guys we brought in with the last class can't crack the starting lineup, that has me concerned when Shep leaves.

Neal showed up against TCU, he caught every catch-able ball that was thrown to him.

Young never got a pass he could catch, Bell caught the only catch-able ball thrown his way and it was offset by a bad offensive PI call (my opinion of course). Quick was in the game too, but the only time he was targeted, the ball was tipped at the line. Mead made one appearance in the game, and caught the Hail Mary pass...that was about 5 yards out of the endzone.

I don't think Saturday had anything to do with the receiving unit. For whatever reason, TK fell apart. Hopefully, that isn't something that continues and he'll grow from it.

I think there's plenty of young talent, but who are you going to take out to put one of those guys in? Not Shepard or Neal. Young is the only other guy, and he's played pretty good when targeted. Since Mead and Quick have both burned their redshirt, I'm sure they will see more time...but Stoops made it fairly clear that the 'young' guys have to be consistent in practice if they want to see the field. We'll see how things develop...hopefully, they got the message and clean up any practice issues.

[BoulderSooner79]

And, here is something I think we can agree on for the day! That and fish-gutting people who say TCU is a Big Game!

Our problem, as I see it, is Knight isn't too accurate long. Bell wasn't White/Bradford/Landry-like with it either (and, let's admit something here: we were spoiled enough by White and Bradford to complain about Landry...a crazy thought these days). But, Bell does have a stronger arm than Knight.

Kudos to Bell for being unselfish. But, if the TCU game is an indication of how the rest of the season goes - QB gimpy/cramped from running and unable to release quickly enough to hit open targets...we are certainly going to be rehashing these discussions two or three more times before the season is done.

I have to disagree with most of this (except the fish gutting). Knight has the stronger arm than Bell, especially on the deep ball. That quacker Bell threw on that almost (maybe was) intercepted ball against OSU should have ended game. That was typical of his long throws last year. He doesn't have the zip on intermediate throws that TK does either.

If you watch the first few games this year, TK was throwing beautiful passes to the RBs. Leading them perfectly with enough touch to make them easy for catch and run. This was a huge improvement of last year when he couldn't hit those easy ones. We stopped throwing them the last couple of games - why? When you see other QBs completing 65% it includes drops, INTs, forced throw aways and inaccurate passes, so you can't blame those on TKs stats. But those other QBs have a lot of those easy passes in there as well. It's a lot better to get 3-4yards from a play than incomplete and it helps the QBs confidence too.

[#8soon]

I have to disagree with most of this (except the fish gutting). Knight has the stronger arm than Bell, especially on the deep ball. That quacker Bell threw on that almost (maybe was) intercepted ball against OSU should have ended game. That was typical of his long throws last year. He doesn't have the zip on intermediate throws that TK does either.

If you watch the first few games this year, TK was throwing beautiful passes to the RBs. Leading them perfectly with enough touch to make them easy for catch and run. This was a huge improvement of last year when he couldn't hit those easy ones. We stopped throwing them the last couple of games - why? When you see other QBs completing 65% it includes drops, INTs, forced throw aways and inaccurate passes, so you can't blame those on TKs stats. But those other QBs have a lot of those easy passes in there as well. It's a lot better to get 3-4yards from a play than incomplete and it helps the QBs confidence too.

Our passing game is not going to improve until we put a good passer in there. That's how receivers get better. By catching good balls.

[Okie35]

I have to disagree with most of this (except the fish gutting). Knight has the stronger arm than Bell, especially on the deep ball. That quacker Bell threw on that almost (maybe was) intercepted ball against OSU should have ended game. That was typical of his long throws last year. He doesn't have the zip on intermediate throws that TK does either.

If you watch the first few games this year, TK was throwing beautiful passes to the RBs. Leading them perfectly with enough touch to make them easy for catch and run. This was a huge improvement of last year when he couldn't hit those easy ones. We stopped throwing them the last couple of games - why? When you see other QBs completing 65% it includes drops, INTs, forced throw aways and inaccurate passes, so you can't blame those on TKs stats. But those other QBs have a lot of those easy passes in there as well. It's a lot better to get 3-4yards from a play than incomplete and it helps the QBs confidence too.

Exactly why I said it seemed vanilla. We didn't throw to any RBs. We didn't motion receivers like against Tennessee or Alabama. No tight ends used we didn't even have Flowers out as a wide out like against Tulsa and Tennessee. I don't know if we just thiugh we could line up and beat them but they were not a cupcake. Watch us all say where was this and this during the Texas game. The only thing that amazed me offensively during the TCu game was the screen pass to Perine.

[Okie35]

Our passing game is not going to improve until we put a good passer in there. That's how receivers get better. By catching good balls.

No they get better by being open. Young was never open and he should usually be given he's a mismatch at slot most of the time. The only horrible pass was the one when the TCU dbs fell and Neal was wide open. Other than that TCU played zone well.

[#8soon]

No they get better by being open. Young was never open and he should usually be given he's a mismatch at slot most of the time. The only horrible pass was the one when the TCU dbs fell and Neal was wide open. Other than that TCU played zone well.

The type of routes our receivers needed to run to get open can't be run because those are the passes our QB struggles with. Patterson knew this and we got exposed. To be honest I didn't pay attention to Young so I'll take your word.

[Eielson]

Our passing game is not going to improve until we put a good passer in there. That's how receivers get better. By catching good balls.

Anybody can catch the good ones. Being a good receiver means you can catch the bad ones.

[8timechamps]

No they get better by being open. Young was never open and he should usually be given he's a mismatch at slot most of the time. The only horrible pass was the one when the TCU dbs fell and Neal was wide open. Other than that TCU played zone well.

Young was actually open more than once. He was open both times Knight under-threw him, and at least one other time during the third quarter that I saw. The receivers were open more than I think you realize. I give TCU credit for playing a good game, but there were plenty of opportunities left on the field.

[Okie35]

Young was actually open more than once. He was open both times Knight under-threw him, and at least one other time during the third quarter that I saw. The receivers were open more than I think you realize. I give TCU credit for playing a good game, but there were plenty of opportunities left on the field.

You may be right but you will have to show me because there were times when Neal looked open but wasn't when TCU ran zone there were 4 TCu players in the area. basically after the first quarter they blanketed all our receiver. I do think Trevor stared down receivers once he started getting hit.

Anyway the sky isn't falling we are still projected to make the playoff.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/playoff

http://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2014/10/5/6910243/bowl-projections-2014-college-football-playoff-predictions

We just can't lose again obviously and the harder road games are done. I don't think we will ever play flat like that again this season. Byes are overrated unless you have injuries in my opinion.

[8timechamps]

You may be right but you will have to show me because there were times when Neal looked open but wasn't when TCU ran zone there were 4 TCu players in the area. basically after the first quarter they blanketed all our receiver. I do think Trevor stared down receivers once he started getting hit.

Anyway the sky isn't falling we are still projected to make the playoff.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/playoff

http://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2014/10/5/6910243/bowl-projections-2014-college-football-playoff-predictions

We just can't lose again obviously and the harder road games are done. I don't think we will ever play flat like that again this season. Byes are overrated unless you have injuries in my opinion.

If I get a chance, I'll do some screen grabs. There weren't any times (with the exception of the long TD pass to Shep) that our guys were running free, but there were times that there was separation. I feel like Knight became gun-shy late in the 3rd, and throughout the 4th...not wanting to make any mistakes...but sometimes putting that pressure on yourself leads to making different mistakes.

I agree, the sky is definitely not falling, we just need better play all the way around. And I think we'll see it.

Sometimes a loss jolts the system and everyone steps up, that could certainly be the case this year.

[BoulderSooner79]

You may be right but you will have to show me because there were times when Neal looked open but wasn't when TCU ran zone there were 4 TCu players in the area. basically after the first quarter they blanketed all our receiver. I do think Trevor stared down receivers once he started getting hit.

Anyway the sky isn't falling we are still projected to make the playoff.

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/playoff

http://www.sbnation.com/college-football/2014/10/5/6910243/bowl-projections-2014-college-football-playoff-predictions

We just can't lose again obviously and the harder road games are done. I don't think we will ever play flat like that again this season. Byes are overrated unless you have injuries in my opinion.

This shows how going to 4 playoff seeds has already changed things. Had the BCS still been in play, we would have been looking at a high probability of the the final being FSU vs. SEC champ after what happened last weekend. I certainly wouldn't pencil us in right now, but our chances are pretty decent if we recover and play well from here.

[Okie35]

This shows how going to 4 playoff seeds has already changed things. Had the BCS still been in play, we would have been looking at a high probability of the the final being FSU vs. SEC champ after what happened last weekend. I certainly wouldn't pencil us in right now, but our chances are pretty decent if we recover and play well from here.

The SEC teams will beat each other up. If we beat everyone and Baylor was still undefeated. We will easily be a top 4 team at years end. I mean I know it's one game at a time even after this weekend we may be in the top 8. Ole Miss has A&M, auburn has Mississippi State, Baylor vs TCU. I wouldn't count us out.

[BoulderSooner79]

The SEC teams will beat each other up. If we beat everyone and Baylor was still undefeated. We will easily be a top 4 team at years end. I mean I know it's one game at a time even after this weekend we may be in the top 8. Ole Miss has A&M, auburn has Mississippi State, Baylor vs TCU. I wouldn't count us out.

I still think that FSU and SEC champ have high probability of taking 2 slots which would have been pretty discouraging this early in the season under the BCS. With 2 more slots, a lot more names are still in play such as OU, BU, UO, MSU, tOSU, ND and maybe a couple of others. Should be able to maintain buzz until late in the season.

[oubreakdown]

It's possible, but he needs another year. The problem is in his nerves. When he's confident and comfortable he's really good. Next year the QB battle will be very interesting!!

[IslandSooner]

I think Trevor and our offense is good enough to win if our defense was performing as expected.... But the offense is not capable of overcoming the defensive play that we have witnessed the last two games. If the defense can turn it around, we win out..... If they choose to continue to let receivers run down the field wide *** open, then we probably don't win the conference... JMHO

[Bourbon St Sooner]

You forgot Blake Bell 232 yards passing with 2 TD/0 INT at Notre Dame...

...but, I mean, most fans of college football forget when their schools beat Notre Dame in South Bend.

Can't remember if Bell cramped against the Golden Domers; so, Knight has that on him.

Also, you seem to like the QB rating, so we may as well throw both career QB ratings into the mix as well:
Bell = 128.7
Knight = 126.9

Bell in 2013 = 132.2
Knight in 2013 = 125.0

So, again...for review...the better quarterback is playing tight end because the current starter looked good against our scout team in bowl prep for Johnny Manziel and he had one good game last season against Alabama.

You'll have to simply face facts - any way you dice it, Bell's numbers are a bit on the more positive side that Knight's. What's the shame in just admitting that? It's all right there.

Also, if you want to dig deeper into the physical nature of the position, you can already begin building a case that Knight is injury-prone in addition to not being able to put up better numbers than Bell.

Either way, we are stuck with Knight this year - until he is injured again because our brain trust on the offense side of the ledger has designed it that way. Then, we will be piloted by a freshman or redshirt freshman. That is the position Stoops allowed his offensive coaches to put the team in. Pretty short sighted.

Bro, there's a reason why you're the only one that thinks BB is a better QB than TK. If you look at our offensive PPG for the games that each started and finished, here's your stats.

BB - 7 games, 30 ppg
TK - 8 games, 41.5 ppg

If you include only games against P5 schools, you get the following

BB - 6 games, 26.5 ppg
TK - 5 games, 39.6 ppg

TK had a bad half against TCU but he put up 24 on them in the first half. The last 2 years we only put up 24 and 20 on them in the entire game.

[Eielson]

The thing about Trevor...he really shouldn't even be playing yet. Ideally we bring in a new QB every year, and we only have upperclassmen playing QB for us. I know that's not how it often works, seeing as we started Sam (one of the greatest of all-time...yet still made mistakes that cost us in games like Colorado) and Landry (albeit he really friggin' sucked) as redshirt freshmen. We were thrust into less than ideal situations both times, though. The real issue isn't that TK isn't performing...it's that the upperclassman dropped the ball (Bell). You can criticize TK all you want, and he may not be a pure passer like Sam or Landry, but he's FAR from the worst QB in this conference, and he's still improving. Don't pretend like we haven't seen considerable improvement since his first start, or that he doesn't have the work ethic to continue improving.

The sky is NOT falling. We're just not the dominant champion-form team (yet) that ESPN made us out to be...and let's be honest, deep down we all knew we weren't. Our issues go much deeper than TK.

[BoulderSooner79]

In general, I agree the ideal situation is to have upper class QBs (I'd rather have a new one every 2 years). I disagree about Sam as he excelled in most games his FR year and was far superior to most upper classman that would have been playing. Many things led to that Colorado loss and Sam was the least of the problems. The only other loss that year was due to Sam being absent (not counting the bowl where half the team's stars were absent). But I agree Sam was the exception and LJ was no where close to ready when forced into action. But that seems to be the way CFB goes these days.

[yankee]

TDTW has got to be Blake Bell's uncle or something.

We were so impotent at times on offense with Bell last year, I would change the channel so I wouldn't throw the remote at the TV. Misguided nostalgia sure is a funny thing.

[Eielson]

I disagree about Sam as he excelled in most games his FR year and was far superior to most upper classman that would have been playing. Many things led to that Colorado loss and Sam was the least of the problems.

I may not have clarified this, but I felt Sam was great as a Freshman. I only mentioned the Colorado game to say that even though he was one of the greatest of all-time, he still made mistakes his freshman year that he wasn't making later in his career. I expect that we'll see improvements from TK similar to what we saw with Landry. You guys remember his game against Nebraska?

[BoulderSooner79]

I may not have clarified this, but I felt Sam was great as a Freshman. I only mentioned the Colorado game to say that even though he was one of the greatest of all-time, he still made mistakes his freshman year that he wasn't making later in his career. I expect that we'll see improvements from TK similar to what we saw with Landry. You guys remember his game against Nebraska?

Yes, but as you said, LJ was forced to play due to injury and clearly wasn't ready. TK came in last year winning the job in camp. Maybe that's a statement on our QB pipeline right now. I hope TK improves a lot, but he probably came in higher on his potential curve than LJ did. Normally, players make the biggest jump between 1st and 2nd year starting, but that's not always true. Since TK only started part-time last year, maybe we see it next season. And sometimes players make that sudden Gestalt ah-ha! leap and have a breakout game and don't look back from there. If that happened for TK this Saturday in Dallas, I wouldn't be angry.

[Eielson]

Yes, but as you said, LJ was forced to play due to injury and clearly wasn't ready. TK came in last year winning the job in camp. Maybe that's a statement on our QB pipeline right now. I hope TK improves a lot, but he probably came in higher on his potential curve than LJ did. Normally, players make the biggest jump between 1st and 2nd year starting, but that's not always true. Since TK only started part-time last year, maybe we see it next season. And sometimes players make that sudden Gestalt ah-ha! leap and have a breakout game and don't look back from there. If that happened for TK this Saturday in Dallas, I wouldn't be angry.

If Sam wasn't here, Landry would have won the position outright, and I think we would have seen a lot of the same struggles. I know he was thrust in there against TCU, but I believe it was pretty deep into the season when he laid that egg against Nebraska. Trevor really shouldn't have won the starting position, but we didn't have other options. Bell should be starting, but he clearly couldn't handle it.

[BoulderSooner79]

If Sam wasn't here, Landry would have won the position outright, and I think we would have seen a lot of the same struggles. I know he was thrust in there against TCU, but I believe it was pretty deep into the season when he laid that egg against Nebraska. Trevor really shouldn't have won the starting position, but we didn't have other options. Bell should be starting, but he clearly couldn't handle it.

We can never know what would have happened had Sam not been there. His presence certainly had an impact on recruiting after his what he did his FR year. And as I recall, LJ got the backup by default because we wanted to redshirt someone that would have completed for it. For sure, LJ never got many real 1st unit reps in either spring or fall that year as Sam was entrenched. Also recall, that NU defense was the best in the country and made Colt McCoy and a very powerful horn offense look inept right before they went to the BCS final. LJ didn't have a prayer against them with our make shift line.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

And, here is something I think we can agree on for the day! That and fish-gutting people who say TCU is a Big Game!

Our problem, as I see it, is Knight isn't too accurate long. Bell wasn't White/Bradford/Landry-like with it either (and, let's admit something here: we were spoiled enough by White and Bradford to complain about Landry...a crazy thought these days). But, Bell does have a stronger arm than Knight.

Kudos to Bell for being unselfish. But, if the TCU game is an indication of how the rest of the season goes - QB gimpy/cramped from running and unable to release quickly enough to hit open targets...we are certainly going to be rehashing these discussions two or three more times before the season is done.

Just want to correct one thing here. Knight is incredibly accurate on the fade to the sidelines. Most QBs are lucky to complete 15% of those and his completion percentage is well over 60% there. The problem is that he can't hit anything over the middle to save his life. As I said several times earlier this season, he is the reincarnation of Nate Hybl (who had the exact same strengths/weaknesses in the passing game).

The question is can you design an attack where your QB can only throw it accurately sideways and down the sidelines? Defenses look like a giant U against us.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

TDTW has got to be Blake Bell's uncle or something.

We were so impotent at times on offense with Bell last year, I would change the channel so I wouldn't throw the remote at the TV. Misguided nostalgia sure is a funny thing.

Bell's problem was accuracy on 3rd down. He'd get happy feet and who knew where the ball was going to go. It is a legit question as to whether it would have been solved his senior year - Hybl suffered from the same thing in 2001 and then fixed it in 2002.

[BoulderSooner79]

I feel bad for Bell. I certainly agree he had no shot to make the NFL as a QB, the switch to TE doesn't seem to be helping that cause. I hope he is at least happier at TE since he is on the field a lot.

[8timechamps]

I feel bad for Bell. I certainly agree he had no shot to make the NFL as a QB, the switch to TE doesn't seem to be helping that cause. I hope he is at least happier at TE since he is on the field a lot.

At least he'll have some experience there when the opportunity comes. I have no doubt he'll get looks at pro-day (between his size/speed and what is sure to be a Stoops endorsement), the question is whether or not a team will take a chance on a relatively unproven TE.

[Since71ASooner4Life]

I dont think so.:frown:


He's definitely not the answer. He had a bad game against a well coached team with a good defense. He should be kicked off the team and expelled from school. Maybe even put in jail

[BoulderSooner79]

At least he'll have some experience there when the opportunity comes. I have no doubt he'll get looks at pro-day (between his size/speed and what is sure to be a Stoops endorsement), the question is whether or not a team will take a chance on a relatively unproven TE.

It probably doesn't hurt that Bell is an NFL legacy player too. We just haven't managed to get him involved in the passing game and I've seen many plays where he is struggling as a run blocker. But there many NFL teams the heavily utilize that hybrid TE/H-back type of player and they don't ask them to do much blocking. Hope he gets his shot.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

Just want to correct one thing here. Knight is incredibly accurate on the fade to the sidelines. Most QBs are lucky to complete 15% of those and his completion percentage is well over 60% there. The problem is that he can't hit anything over the middle to save his life. As I said several times earlier this season, he is the reincarnation of Nate Hybl (who had the exact same strengths/weaknesses in the passing game).

The question is can you design an attack where your QB can only throw it accurately sideways and down the sidelines? Defenses look like a giant U against us.

He has one huge advantage over Nate Hybl - he's as quick as a cheetah. This is my biggest problem with the coaches, they are afraid to utilize his entire skill set. Now that we've lost a game and have no margin for error, it's time to say F it and let him run a true read option offense. Auburn's not afraid to let Nick Marshall run, so why are we afraid to let TK run?

[stoops the eternal pimp]

If we run the Landry style offense, then he is not the answer. If we run a read option offense then we can win and he will succeed...

Late to the Party.. but Yes.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Where's the let's dump Trevor thread? He couldn't hit the broadside of a barn in the second half. I could care less about his running ability. Get someone who can complete passes. Cody Thomas, you're up.

Sweet Jesus, I should have stayed away..

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Or within 5 yards of the receivers would work for me. It's a receiver problem. Nobody got open last Sat, and if they did the pocket had collapses already.

This

[olevetonahill]

Sweet Jesus, I should have stayed away..

I pretty much have Bro.

[Eielson]

Sweet Jesus, I should have stayed away..

Since you're here, you might as well answer a question for me. How good is Bell at TE? I don't watch him that often, but when I do, I often wonder why he's out there.

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Since you're here, you might as well answer a question for me. How good is Bell at TE? I don't watch him that often, but when I do, I often wonder why he's out there.

Hey my friend! Hope you are well..

It's the stuff I worried about from when they announced the move...Good hands, slow as molasses, lots of the technical stuff not there that he can learn..I guess the other guys are lousy? His run blocking against inferior opponents was decent.

[Eielson]

Hey my friend! Hope you are well..

It's the stuff I worried about from when they announced the move...Good hands, slow as molasses, lots of the technical stuff not there that he can learn..I guess the other guys are lousy? His run blocking against inferior opponents was decent.

Good to see you back!

I'm especially concerned that we line him up as a WR on some plays. I think we'd be better off with somebody like Andrews, even if he is only a freshman, and I'm shocked we're still not seeing McNamara. I worry that we might have struck some kind of agreement with him in order for him not to transfer (in case Knight goes down).

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Do something to keep him involved..I can see that.

Look at the 3rd down play from jkm's thread with a TE option route..Just terrible.

[PhiDeltBeers]

Bump.

:pop: