TMZ reporting AD in trouble in Tx?

[wishbonesooner]

Hopefully no truth to it?

[EatLeadCommie]

http://www.tmz.com/2014/09/12/adrian-peterson-indicted-for-child-abuse/

Feels like a shakedown to me.

[rock on sooner]

Espn just reported AD indicted for child endangerment....

[EatLeadCommie]

disciplined a kid with a switch. Oh, the horror!

[cherokeebrewer]

disciplined a kid with a switch. Oh, the horror!

If there's not more to this, then the PC world has gone totally berserko. I can't imagine that Adrian would actually endanger a child...

[BoulderSooner79]

disciplined a kid with a switch. Oh, the horror!

Ah-oh. Mods, please lock this thread for any posters over the age of ~50. Otherwise we'll read every rendition of how stern Dad's were "back in the day".

BTW, my Dad used to beat me with a cat of 9 tails if there was 1 smudge of dirt left on his car after I washed it. And I was happy it wasn't worse than that.

[cherokeebrewer]

BTW, my Dad used to beat me with a cat of 9 tails

My wife has one a those...keeps me in line

[FaninAma]

If there's not more to this, then the PC world has gone totally berserko. I can't imagine that Adrian would actually endanger a child...
You're just now coming to this conclusion? Welcome to modern progessive society. Be sure to thank any Saul Alinsky trained liberal you meet. There are a few on this board.

[freshchris05]

I'm under 30 and have cut my own switch a time or two. My son will too. He's getting closer to it everyday.

[cherokeebrewer]

You're just now coming to this conclusion? Welcome to the modern progessive society. Be sure to thank any Saul Alinsky indoctrinated liberal you are acquainted with. There are several on this board.

I'm not political. As long as my retirement check arrives on time, I'm cool. I do however intensely dislike what PC has become...

[CatfishSooner]

F

[SoonerorLater]

I think we've heard enough. There is never an excuse for this kind of behavior. Obviously the NFL needs to get involved and suspend Peterson.

[EatLeadCommie]

I think where the problem comes in is that it wasn't one of his kids. At least that's what it sounds like. But if you're a guest at somebody's home, and you get out of line, a switch is sometimes warranted. The offense would have to be pretty damn bad, though. Hopefully, it wasn't just a case of the kid whooping him in Madden.

[EatLeadCommie]

https://twitter.com/WCCO/status/510546435809345536/photo/1

[manateepower]

If there's not more to this, then the PC world has gone totally berserko. I can't imagine that Adrian would actually endanger a child...

Except for the multiple kids he had out of wedlock, and one of his sons being murdered by the mothers boyfriend....

Knocking up a bunch of women with no intention of being with them is child endangerment in my opinion, even if it isn't by the letter of the law.

[nighttrain12]

It's one of his kids (a 4 year old) that was visiting him. Pictures on this page:

http://minnesota.cbslocal.com/2014/09/12/adrian-peterson-indicted-for-child-abuse/

[EatLeadCommie]

Would appear to be lowest kind of felony-- state jail felony-- which still gets 180 days to 2 years in jail. Seems a bit absurd for whooping your own kid, even after seeing those pics.

[olevetonahill]

Beat that Kid he wont die!

Proverbs 23:13–14
Embed



13 Do not withhold correction from a child,

For if you beat him with a rod, he will not die.

14 You shall beat him with a rod,

And deliver his soul from 4hell.

[EatLeadCommie]

so they had to seat 2 grand juries to get an indictment? Tom DeLay not withstanding, is that common practice?

edited to add I have been informed that more stringent charges were probably brought up before, dismissed, and lesser charges were accepted.

[EatLeadCommie]

More info, including statement from attorney http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/24706814/adrian-petersons-attorney-adrian-never-intended-to-harm-his-son

Hours after news surfaced that Vikings running back Adrian Peterson had been indicted in Texas for "reckless or negligent injury to a child," his attorney, Rusty Hardin, released the following statement:

“Adrian Peterson has been informed that he was indicted by a grand jury in Montgomery County, Texas for Injury to a Child. The charged conduct involves using a switch to spank his son. This indictment follows Adrian's full cooperation with authorities who have been looking into this matter. Adrian is a loving father who used his judgment as a parent to discipline his son. He used the same kind of discipline with his child that he experienced as a child growing up in east Texas. Adrian has never hidden from what happened. He has cooperated fully with authorities and voluntarily testified before the grand jury for several hours. Adrian will address the charges with the same respect and responsiveness he has brought to this inquiry from its beginning. It is important to remember that Adrian never intended to harm his son and deeply regrets the unintentional injury.”

According to Sports Radio 610, which obtained a copy of the police reports: "Peterson's son had pushed another one of Peterson's children off of a motorbike video game. As punishment, Peterson grabbed a tree branch -- which he consistently referred to as a 'switch' -- removed the leaves and struck the child repeatedly."

Meanwhile, police reports tell a different story. via of Sports Radio 610:

According to police reports, the child, however, had a slightly different story, telling authorities that “Daddy Peterson hit me on my face.” The child also expressed worry that Peterson would punch him in the face if the child reported the incident to authorities. He also said that he had been hit by a belt and that “there are a lot of belts in Daddy's closet.” He added that Peterson put leaves in his mouth when he was being hit with the switch while his pants were down. The child told his mother that Peterson “likes belts and switches” and “has a whooping room.”

[cherokeebrewer]

The pictures are not good...went overboard me thinks. Dang!

[FaninAma]

This whole ordeal should have been handled by now. AD should have already completed the parenting classes and DHS supervision that is the prescribed remedy for this type of offense. I have personally seen dozens of these cases play out and if this is the only injury inflicted parents never serve any jail time.

[FaninAma]

How is the press getting the pictures? If they are from medical files that is a HIPPA violation.

[olevetonahill]

A whoopin Room??? WTF hell we just had the woodshed!

[sendbaht]

I had to pick my switch form the tree...my mom sometimes did not even get it her self..now that is abuse..:)

plus I might add....I picked the smallest one I could find.

[SoonerPride]

And then he stuffed the leaves in the kid's mouth?

This isn't a "spanking"

It's child abuse.

[manateepower]

Not sure if this adds anything more, but I think this article should be posted for the record:

http://houston.cbslocal.com/2014/09/12/exclusive-details-on-adrian-peterson-indictment-charges/

[FaninAma]

And then he stuffed the leaves in the kid's mouth?

This isn't a "spanking"

It's child abuse.
Where did you see this?

[rock on sooner]

A whoopin Room??? WTF hell we just had the woodshed!

He!!, you wuz lucky, I wuz out in tha back yard, goin' in a circle
dancin' when the belt caught up....yeah, yeah, I know, I'm over 50...

[rock on sooner]

Oh, and today, that would be what AD has been charged with...

[nighttrain12]

ESPN.com is now reporting that he won't play this Sunday, a team decision.

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11514522/adrian-peterson-minnesota-vikings-indicted-child-case

[SoonerPride]

And then he stuffed the leaves in the kid's mouth?

This isn't a "spanking"

It's child abuse.
Where did you see this?

On TV so take that for what it's worth.

[SoCalBigRed]

My grandparents old house, when they had it built... my grandfather had them plant a willow tree on the side of the house. It only served one purpose.

My dad... used his belt (on my rear-end).

I don't feel abused.

Edit: Just saw the pics... and for being swatted with a "switch" that's nothing. No real bruising, no real raised welts. Those are scratches. Feel sorry for AD that his business is being dragged thru the airwaves, but that's the price you pay for fame.

[soonergirlNeugene]

Those pictures don't look like anything I didn't get when I was a kid. Hell, my parents described a lot worse than that from their folks. I'm fairly moderate about most social issues, but this seems like more like a dispute between one parent who's old school and the other who's new age.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

I guess my parents should be glad we are 50 year old adults today. I think they would be in jail these days...

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Those pictures don't look like anything I didn't get when I was a kid. Hell, my parents described a lot worse than that from their folks. I'm fairly moderate about most social issues, but this seems like more like a dispute between one parent who's old school and the other who's new age.

I think more like a "enlightened" MN doctor who reported it and a MN mom who doesnt know about TX parenting.

[SoonerPride]

Those pictures don't look like anything I didn't get when I was a kid. Hell, my parents described a lot worse than that from their folks. I'm fairly moderate about most social issues, but this seems like more like a dispute between one parent who's old school and the other who's new age.

I think more like a "enlightened" MN doctor who reported it and a MN mom who doesnt know about TX parenting.

You do realize that a TEXAS grand jury indicted him?

I'm sure that TEXAS is a state with fairly similar attitudes towards corporal punishment as Oklahoma

They saw the evidence and thought he crossed a line.

He'll get his chance to defend himself.

But I wouldn't just excuse him bc it's what you think your daddy did.

If the legal system in TEXAS which is hardly a bleeding heart liberal bastion thought it was abuse I'm inclined to accept that and wait for more information

[Soonerjeepman]

Except for the multiple kids he had out of wedlock, and one of his sons being murdered by the mothers boyfriend....

Knocking up a bunch of women with no intention of being with them is child endangerment in my opinion, even if it isn't by the letter of the law.

amen...I love AD and his football abilities..but his ability to be a dad...mmm, not so much. Go ahead...give me grief...

[Soonerjeepman]

How is the press getting the pictures? If they are from medical files that is a HIPPA violation.

involving a highly paid nfl player and his baby's mama...meh...no hippa violation here~

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

C'mon y'all.

This child is FOUR YEARS OLD. And he was punished like this for the offense of pushing another child off a video game? That probably happens millions of times in this country every day! Really? Y'all really think that offense by a FOUR YEAR OLD warrants physical punishment at all? Much less punishment that leaves the wounds visible in the pictures?

AD said he regretted that the boy didn't cry because then he would have known how bad he was hurting him. Don't any of y'all wonder what worse punishment that FOUR YEAR OLD child thought he might suffer if he cried?

Do you think it's normal for a FOUR YEAR OLD to get any kind of whooping and not cry unless he's already learned at that tender age that crying will only bring on additional punishment?

SMH

PS Yeah I grew up in Oklahoma so I got the switch and the belt myself. As a result I would never, ever advocate or practice them as child-rearing tools. Obviously YMMV.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

involving a highly paid nfl player and his baby's mama...meh...no hippa violation here~

HIPAA applies almost exclusively to healthcare personnel. For the most part, it does not prohibit family members from releasing information.

[olevetonahill]

You do realize that a TEXAS grand jury indicted him?

I'm sure that TEXAS is a state with fairly similar attitudes towards corporal punishment as Oklahoma

They saw the evidence and thought he crossed a line.

He'll get his chance to defend himself.

But I wouldn't just excuse him bc it's what you think your daddy did.

If the legal system in TEXAS which is hardly a bleeding heart liberal bastion thought it was abuse I'm inclined to accept that and wait for more information

You do realize they DID NOT Indict him the 1st time. Right?
Man you appear to be one judgmental person.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

One last thing for tonight:

Show of hands?

How many of y'all can honestly say that you would inflict this level of punishment on your four-year-child for shoving another child off a video game?

Just curious.

[olevetonahill]

One last thing for tonight:

Show of hands?

How many of y'all can honestly say that you would inflict this level of punishment on your four-year-child for shoving another child off a video game?

Just curious.

Just a Point here. Me No I wouldnt. But we dont know the facts.
I 1st heard it was a Vid Game now its reported he pushed another kid off a Bike. How old was the other kid? What else had the 4 year old done?
Like I said I wouldnt have switched a 4 year old. But then agai we aint all the same.
I would Have tied him up Gagged him and tossed him in the closet for a couple hours for time Out.

JK
I would have sat him down tho and chewed him out.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

Vet my friend, as I am reading it, it was a motorbike video game. But even if you are correct and it was an actual motorbike, really? Shoving another kid off a bike of any type warrants a beating like that? For a four-year-old? Still too young to even be in school?

You ask what else had the four-year-old done? WTF? Unless he had proved himself a miniature Dexter serial killer, who cares? He was four. years. old.

So sorry, I'm not yet done.

"Police reports obtained by the Houston station show the 4-year-old boy feared his father would punch him in the face if he reported the beating. He said his father had previously beaten him with belts."

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/vikings-rb-adrian-peterson-accused-child-abuse-article-1.1937998#ixzz3DAg0hYXd

Do you think this four-year-old is lying?

I fanadmire AD as much as anyone. But helpless children are OFF LIMITS. Period. Full stop. No excuses. The end.

[Soonerjeepman]

HIPAA applies almost exclusively to healthcare personnel. For the most part, it does not prohibit family members from releasing information.

it was a joke...my point was, not supporting what AD did...but I'm sure the mom had just a bit of ulterior motives...if the daddy wasn't AD this would be a no big deal...

[olevetonahill]

Vet my friend, as I am reading it, it was a motorbike video game. But even if you are correct and it was an actual motorbike, really? Shoving another kid off a bike of any type warrants a beating like that? For a four-year-old? Still too young to even be in school?

You ask what else had the four-year-old done? WTF? Unless he had proved himself a miniature Dexter serial killer, who cares? He was four. years. old.

So sorry, I'm not yet done.

"Police reports obtained by the Houston station show the 4-year-old boy feared his father would punch him in the face if he reported the beating. He said his father had previously beaten him with belts."

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/vikings-rb-adrian-peterson-accused-child-abuse-article-1.1937998#ixzz3DAg0hYXd

Do you think this four-year-old is lying?

I fanadmire AD as much as anyone. But helpless children are OFF LIMITS. Period. Full stop. No excuses. The end.

Im not defending Him, Just I been dad to wild Boys. My Point is what else had that child done that day or yhe last hour? we never know the whole story. Just waht the reporters slant want us to know.
Like I said I wouldnt have switched him. hell I only used a belt a very few times while My Boys were growing up.

[EatLeadCommie]

One last thing for tonight:

Show of hands?

How many of y'all can honestly say that you would inflict this level of punishment on your four-year-child for shoving another child off a video game?

Just curious.

I would not, but I also never got the switch when I was a kid.

This is a case of old world meeting the new world. AD is a country boy, disciplined by old fashioned means. I think the text messages show that he didn't mean to do what he did-- he didn't think it was as bad as it looked after.

I have some friends who are cool as anything, and man are they short tempered around misbehaving kids. It's because their fathers were too. It shocks me when they blow up because they are not like that in a normal setting. I've never seen any of them whoop their kid, but I'm sure it happens because it happened to them.

There's really no comparison to the Ray Rice thing here except that such behavior in both cases is likely learned. A father needs to be able to discipline his kid. At what age and to what extent and for what offense will always be a matter of debate. I don't see this as a case where he's just smacking his kid around for no reason. He got carried away enough that he expressed some regret. This isn't a case of him getting carried away and beating the crap out of his kid. He whooped him too hard.

[SoonerPride]

I still don't see where stuffing leaves in the kids mouth is defensible.

At all.

And that's now being widely reported.

This isn't discipline.

It's child abuse.

[SoonerPride]

You do realize that a TEXAS grand jury indicted him?

I'm sure that TEXAS is a state with fairly similar attitudes towards corporal punishment as Oklahoma

They saw the evidence and thought he crossed a line.

He'll get his chance to defend himself.

But I wouldn't just excuse him bc it's what you think your daddy did.

If the legal system in TEXAS which is hardly a bleeding heart liberal bastion thought it was abuse I'm inclined to accept that and wait for more information

You do realize they DID NOT Indict him the 1st time. Right?
Man you appear to be one judgmental person.

I guess it's better to be the type of person who thinks it's funny to beat women and children?

[deweydw]

This something similar to what my mom used on me. And it had Nestle's engraved on it.

http://itempics.tigerchef.com/Thunder-Group-WDTHMP048-48--Wooden-Mixing-Paddle-24265_xlarge.jpg

I did, however raise my kids a bit different. But they did get a swat on the hind end from time to time.

[olevetonahill]

I guess it's better to be the type of person who thinks it's funny to beat women and children?

You are weird sir, Who in hell said its Funny? Ive said repeatedly I wouldnt have done the switch Nor have I ever hit a woman But I will take my shots when the come . :drunk:
Also WHAT does that have to do with my statement that The 1st Grand Jury Failed to Charge him?

[freshchris05]

I still don't see where stuffing leaves in the kids mouth is defensible.

At all.

And that's now being widely reported.

This isn't discipline.

It's child abuse.

Lots of things get widely reported. They were reporting Joe Mixon was on the run when that wasn't even close to true. How about we wait to find out more? Anyone ever tell you your posts

resemble

a

Jenny

Carlson

article?

The leaves thing sounds strange but I can tell you proudly that I've seen a switch, flip flop, extension cord, you name it. AD talks about being beaten with an extension cord himself, which he says he wouldn't do to his kids. Switches are old school but in a world that seems more and more doomed everyday, maybe a little old school discipline is in order.

It's obvious Peterson is a hard *** who expects a lot from himself so in turn expects a lot from his kids. It may not be the way many of you would handle things but they are his kids. In this day and age, for a young black male, I consider that kid lucky to have a father who is not only involved in his life but expects something out of that kid.

Flame away.

(This has nothing to do with Adrian Peterson the football player, but everything to do with AD the man. I've met him numerous times and he even dated my sister while in college. He's a humble guy who I have a hard time seeing as a blatant abuser or bully. But we all have our demons and if it turns out he's a monster I will come back and accept that. However I will defend the switch till I die.)

[SoonerorLater]

"He who withholds his rod hates his son, But he who loves him disciplines him diligently"

My mother would still be serving time if this is the kind of discipline that puts you on the wrong side of the law.

[cherokeebrewer]

I was spanked as kid and likely deserved every one of them and have never considered blaming my parents for my own mistakes in life...even got the paddle a couple of times in school. Times have certainly changed. Not excusing Adrian because I don't think violence is the answer, but he has owned up to it and apologized. That's a start...Yo Adrian, wrap that rascal!

[Since71ASooner4Life]

One last thing for tonight:

Show of hands?

How many of y'all can honestly say that you would inflict this level of punishment on your four-year-child for shoving another child off a video game?

Just curious.


Let's be honest here - if this was a story in the local newspaper about some no name hick doing this to his 4 year old, I venture to guess the majority of people on this message board and across society would recommend going up side his head with a 2x4. Attempts to rationalize this kind of heavy handed discipline is only out of fondness for AD the former Sooner's football exploits.

Do I tend to believe some of AD's comments that he didn't see anything wrong with the method he employed - yes. But it doesn't change the fact that it was unreasonable behavior. I think we can agree that the vast majority of sensible people don't advocate violence as the way to get thru to the psyche of a 4 year old.

We all know AD's father wasn't an admirable character and spent time in prison. His lack of presence in AD's life didn't exactly set a good example of parenting and family stability. Anyone care to go out on a limb with me and conclude that AD fathering a bunch of illegitimate children and neglecting them is a reflection of his own upbringing? Doesn't excuse his behavior or make it right, but probably explains why it is what it is.

[SoonerMarkVA]

I was spanked with a belt at home, and with a wooden paddle at school. I have never used either on my kids, so I do not accept the "it was done to me, so I did it to mine" defense. An adult is 3-4 times the size and strength of a 4-yr old, and in AD's case even more so. You can get the point across with an open hand to the butt.

Even still, with belt and paddle, I never sustained any injuries, other than red marks. If your punishment is leaving injuries, whatever you're doing is wrong.

I don't think AD did what he did out of malice, nor do the injuries appear to be anything that won't heal fully, and so he doesn't deserve anything as severe as what the law allows. But he should be required to take some classes and get some training for how to handle his parenting duties in ways that don't injure his kids. If it's a pattern that can't be broken (with anyone, not just AD) then fine, take more stringent measures. But the main thing that appears to need to happen here is for him to learn that what his parents likely did to him wasn't OK, and here are some ways he can discipline his kids that teach them what they need to know but don't injure them or make them fear him.

[nighttrain12]

The smiling mugshot! Was he smiling like this when he was 'disciplining' his 4 year old child?

http://ll-media.tmz.com/2014/09/13/0913-adrian-peterson-mug-shot-6.jpg

[Eielson]

Using a tree branch was pretty stupid. Could easily get an infection considering he broke the skin. I don't even understand the leaves in his mouth thing, so I'm not sure I can condemn or defend it. WTF would you put leaves in somebody's mouth?

If he'd used a belt, I'd be fine with this. I think he crossed the line a little bit here, so I'm fine with him getting reprimanded. Moving forward, I won't think any less of him, though.

[FaninAma]

I still don't see where stuffing leaves in the kids mouth is defensible.

At all.

And that's now being widely reported.

This isn't discipline.

It's child abuse.
Once again, where did you see this? Give us a link or quit asserting he did this.

[Eielson]

Once again, where did you see this? Give us a link or quit asserting he did this.

I think I read it in the link from this thread.

[EatLeadCommie]

Maybe he used bad language and got leaves in the mouth. I got soap in the mouth as a kid and wish it were something like leaves.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

The child also expressed worry that Peterson would punch him in the face if the child reported the incident to authorities. He also said that he had been hit by a belt and that “there are a lot of belts in Daddy’s closet.” He added that Peterson put leaves in his mouth when he was being hit with the switch while his pants were down.

http://houston.cbslocal.com/2014/09/12/exclusive-details-on-adrian-peterson-indictment-charges/

HTH

[Eielson]

Maybe he used bad language and got leaves in the mouth. I got soap in the mouth as a kid and wish it were something like leaves.

That was my first thought, but I'm not sure.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

You do realize they DID NOT Indict him the 1st time. Right?
Man you appear to be one judgmental person.

Oh hi. Apparently this was incorrect info.

He also said the evidence was presented to the grand jury over several weeks and was presented to only one grand jury. "It was not shopped around to multiple grand juries," Grant said.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/vikings/2014/09/13/adrian-peterson-child-abuse-district-attorney-press-conference/15581419/

[Therealsouthsider]

...thank god the kid didn't grow up in my house, a switch would have been a welcome sight

ss

[Sooner91ATL]

I was switched weekly in my NE Oklahoma home as a kid, or so it seemed. I didn't get bloody jesus-lashed or hit in the nutz however. AD has parental anger issues he needs to deal with. It's already been established that he isn't father of the year material. And it sounds like he realized he had gone too far in the pre-emptory texts to his baby momma. He is not the first father to spank in anger, however. What's needed is some contrition, and counseling. Not having any more kids would probably be a good thing as well.

[SoonerPride]

I discipline my kids by punching them in the face three or four times as hard as I can. And if they cry I stick their feet in scalding hot water. But it's okay because that's what was done to me.

Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds? It is absolutely unfathomable. Inappropriate behavior is inappropriate.

[nighttrain12]

After Adrian was deactivated for Sunday's game, the Vikings are losing 30-7 late in the 4th qtr though the Patriots would have likely beat them anyway.

[EatLeadCommie]

I discipline my kids by punching them in the face three or four times as hard as I can. And if they cry I stick their feet in scalding hot water. But it's okay because that's what was done to me.

Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds? It is absolutely unfathomable. Inappropriate behavior is inappropriate.

If AD had done just that, you'd have a better point. Looks like he got a little carried away. It's not worth going to jail over. I bet his other baby mamas are a bit pissed at the prospect of losing their meal ticket over a couple hard whacks.

[SoonerPride]

You are weird sir, Who in hell said its Funny? Ive said repeatedly I wouldnt have done the switch Nor have I ever hit a woman But I will take my shots when the come . :drunk:
Also WHAT does that have to do with my statement that The 1st Grand Jury Failed to Charge him?

No, you just made jokes about beating up women as I recall.

And made light of a "whooping room."

I guess those aren't hilarious so they don't count as funny. So you're right. It's not funny.

And he was indicted by the first grand jury to see the evidence.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

If AD had done just that, you'd have a better point. Looks like he got a little carried away. It's not worth going to jail over. I bet his other baby mamas are a bit pissed at the prospect of losing their meal ticket over a couple hard whacks.

Oh FFS.

This was NOT a couple hard whacks. Did you see the pictures? AD even admitted 10 or 15 whacks (he doesn't remember exactly because he never keeps track of how many times he pops his kids) with the switch that DREW BLOOD. And hit the child in the scrotum.

"The beating allegedly resulted in numerous injuries to the child, including cuts and bruises to the child’s back, buttocks, ankles, legs and scrotum, along with defensive wounds to the child’s hands."

http://houston.cbslocal.com/2014/09/12/exclusive-details-on-adrian-peterson-indictment-charges/

As for the other baby mamas, do you know them? Do you know anything at all about them? Unless you do, you have no idea what they are thinking. Maybe they would prefer to lose their "meal ticket," as you put it (based, I might add, only on your assumption that AD is their meal ticket) in favor of not having their child abused.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

I truly don't get it. Hitting another adult is assault. Hitting a dog is animal cruelty.

Hitting a defenseless child is A-OK.

SMH

[Jason White's Third Knee]

Except for the multiple kids he had out of wedlock, and one of his sons being murdered by the mothers boyfriend....

Knocking up a bunch of women with no intention of being with them is child endangerment in my opinion, even if it isn't by the letter of the law.


What is it with these guys? Pull out for crap's sake!

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

This link has pictures of the child's injuries. Keep in mind, these photos were taken a WEEK after the beating.

Go ahead, defend him some more.

http://sandrarose.com/2014/09/adrian-peterson-suspended-by-vikings-after-his-indictment-for-child-abuse/

[EatLeadCommie]

We don't know when those photos were taken relative to the "whooping." It was reported that they were a week after, but it was also reported that it took two grand juries to indict him (which the DA said is incorrect). I tend to doubt the week after report because 4 year old kids heal quickly. Unless his boy has some kind of iron deficiency, heals like I started to once I hit 40, or had some allergic reaction to the switch, I'm skeptical of those reports.

Here's a report with more details. It's not going to change your mind, but it gives insight into his head and what happened.

http://houston.cbslocal.com/2014/09/12/exclusive-details-on-adrian-peterson-indictment-charges/

Of note...


Peterson, when contacted by police, admitted that he had “whooped” his son on the backside with a switch as a form of punishment, and then, in fact, produced a switch similar to the one with which he hit the child. Peterson also admitted that he administered two different “whoopings” to his son during the visit to Texas, the other being a punishment for the 4-year-old scratching the face of a 5-year-old.

In an interview with Houston police, Peterson was very matter-of-fact and calm about the incident, appearing to believe he had done nothing wrong and reiterating how much he cared about his son and only used “whoopings” or “spankings” as a last resort. He offered up information that the police didn’t have and was incredulous when asked if some of the numerous wounds and marks on the child were from an extension cord, saying, “Oh, no, I’d never hit my child with an extension cord. I remember how it feels to get whooped with an extension cord. I’d never do that.”

Peterson also said, “Anytime I spank my kids, I talk to them before, let them know what they did, and of course after.” Peterson also expressed regret that his son did not cry – because then, Peterson said, he would have known that the switch was doing more damage than intended. He didn’t realize the “tip of the switch and the ridges of the switch were wrapping around [the child’s] legs.” Peterson also acknowledged that this was administered directly to the child’s skin and with the child’s pants pulled down.

Peterson later told police that the marks on his son’s buttocks were similar to the marks any of his other children get when he “spanks them with a switch,” but that the mark on the child’s leg from when the switch “wrapped around his thigh” was more severe than anything he had ever done in the past.

Peterson said he knew that his son had a doctor’s appointment scheduled for when he returned home and that the doctor would discover the injuries. Peterson added that if he felt like he was “really wrong for what I did, or had any ill intent, there’s no way I would have let him get on that plane.” He went on to say, “I have nothing to hide, but I also understand when a child has marks like that on his leg, they have to report that.”

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

What does it really matter when the photos were taken? If they were taken a week later, then the initial damage must have been even more horrific.

If they were taken the day after, that doesn't make them any better.

I already read that article and I don't know what the quotes are supposed to prove. Peterson's logic isn't all that different from that of men who think it's okay to smack their wives around to teach them a lesson because that's what their fathers did to their mothers.

So what if he thought he was administering appropriate punishment but just got carried away? IMO he shouldn't have been inflicting that kind of punishment on a four-year-old in the first place.

[cherokeebrewer]

A good friend told me years ago, I disciplined my kids with an iron hand covered with a velvet glove. I think she meant that as a compliment. I do know this...If you love your children, teaching them violence is not the answer. Kind & gentle are not character flaws.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

A good friend told me years ago, I disciplined my kids with an iron hand covered with a velvet glove. I think she meant that as a compliment. I do know this...If you love your children, teaching them violence is not the answer. Kind & gentle are not character flaws.

No one in their right mind would advocate training a dog by beating it. Yet it's okay if it's a kid.

[soonergirlNeugene]

Nothing good ever starts w/ "TMZ"

[Jason White's Third Knee]

This link has pictures of the child's injuries. Keep in mind, these photos were taken a WEEK after the beating.

Go ahead, defend him some more.

http://sandrarose.com/2014/09/adrian-peterson-suspended-by-vikings-after-his-indictment-for-child-abuse/


The kid was drunk, spitting, taking swings at him, and yelling racial epithets?

[Eielson]

No one in their right mind would advocate training a dog by beating it. Yet it's okay if it's a kid.

I spank my dog when he does something wrong. Seems to work.

[cherokeebrewer]

I spank my dog when he does something wrong. Seems to work.

Spanking & beating are not the same. I'm sure you already know that...

[BoulderSooner79]

I condition both my kid and my dog with positive reinforcement snacks and they are both very well behaved. Of course, they are both morbidly obese now, so I guess it's a trade-off.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

I truly don't get it. Hitting another adult is assault. Hitting a dog is animal cruelty.

Hitting a defenseless child is A-OK.

SMH

Some kids need to get wacked, they also need a Father in their lives... Part of the reason we have wimpy assed people as well as lazy and on the dole today.

I don't necessarily condone woopings that draw blood, but the kid pushed off another kid off what sounds like a Dave and Buster's type arcade game motorcycle. He needs to be disciplined, again, not sure if I would handle the wooping like that, but I am sure Adrian's father was tough on him, he has turned out pretty well to date.

[olevetonahill]

Oh hi. Apparently this was incorrect info.

He also said the evidence was presented to the grand jury over several weeks and was presented to only one grand jury. "It was not shopped around to multiple grand juries," Grant said.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/vikings/2014/09/13/adrian-peterson-child-abuse-district-attorney-press-conference/15581419/

I dint see that. . Like I said Id never spank a 4 year old , I did have to assert my self when My Boys became teenagers tho and wanted to Bow up on me LOL

[olevetonahill]

No, you just made jokes about beating up women as I recall.

And made light of a "whooping room."

I guess those aren't hilarious so they don't count as funny. So you're right. It's not funny.

And he was indicted by the first grand jury to see the evidence.

Oh Bite me, If you dont like my Humor put me on Ignore. Its simple.

Ive never Hit a woman OR switched a Child so Back off Mary Poppins.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

Who's going to be the more productive adult, the kid that was hit with a switch or the one that was coddled and never told 'No'? If you ask me it's the latter parent that we should be throwing in jail.

[SoonerPride]

Oh Bite me, If you dont like my Humor put me on Ignore. Its simple.

Ive never Hit a woman OR switched a Child so Back off Mary Poppins.

When you post something that qualifies as humor I'll let you know.

[olevetonahill]

When you post something that qualifies as humor I'll let you know.

I await your approval with baited breath.
go **** yerself ya self righteous judgemental prick

[Pride1Mom]

The saddest part in all of this, is that our society has not improved in handling behavior and violence.

[SoonerPride]

I await your approval with baited breath.
go **** yerself ya self righteous judgemental prick

Oh Bite me, If you dont like my posts put me on Ignore. Its simple.

[cherokeebrewer]

Who's going to be the more productive adult, the kid that was hit with a switch or the one that was coddled and never told 'No'? If you ask me it's the latter parent that we should be throwing in jail.

In Adrian's case, it was a little more than just being "hit with a switch", but surely there is a middle ground somewhere in between the two extremes...

[dwarthog]

How about a new medical diagnosis for these overly rambunctious younsters and some new drugs to combat it with?

That should work out nicely for everyone....

[olevetonahill]

Oh Bite me, If you dont like my posts put me on Ignore. Its simple.

Great comeback. Wonder how you came up with it LOL

[oudanny]

I believe in discipline but that was excessive.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

Who's going to be the more productive adult, the kid that was hit with a switch or the one that was coddled and never told 'No'? If you ask me it's the latter parent that we should be throwing in jail.

A child can be told No without being hit with a switch. Or with anything else.

[EatLeadCommie]

Yes they can, and if that is how you want to raise your kid that is your business and more power to you. If somebody wants to use a belt or a switch, that's their business as well. I agree that AD went overboard. I don't think he should go to jail for it.

I don't buy the comparison to hitting dogs. Dogs are incapable of comprehending information and instructions like kids are. Hitting a dog is more akin to hitting an infant or a toddler. A child at some point becomes capable of processing information and knowing wrong from right and will test those limits as children often do. How a parent opts to deal with a misbehaving or disobedient child is their business, within reasonable limits, of course.

[FaninAma]

When you post something that qualifies as humor I'll let you know.
It must be very reassuring to be as self-rightous as you.

Excessive corporal punishment cases are referred to CPS. None of the ones I have referred ended up going to a grand jury. If anything they are adjudicated in front of a family court judge who usually agrees with CPS recommendations. If the parent or parents have been cooperative this usually amounts to parenting classes and supervised visitation of the offending parent.

[FaninAma]

A child can be told No without being hit with a switch. Or with anything else.
Please provide us with your parenting resume. I'd like to know the validity of your assertion.

[EatLeadCommie]

It must be very reassuring to be as self-rightous as you.

Excessive corporal punishment cases are referred to CPS. None of the ones I have referred ended up going to a grand jury. If anything they are adjudicated in front of a family court judge who usually agrees with CPS recommendations. If the parent or parents have been cooperative this usually amounts to parenting classes and supervised visitation of the offending parent.

Do you work in Texas or another state? Any ideas as to why this case hasn't already been settled then? Overzealous DA? Is the indictment just part of the process? If this is the strategy by AD's high powered lawyer, I think it may be flawed. There is no way I'd risk jail time taking this to court when it could be settled with counseling.

[FaninAma]

Do you work in Texas or another state? Any ideas as to why this case hasn't already been settled then? Overzealous DA? Is the indictment just part of the process? If this is the strategy by AD's high powered lawyer, I think it may be flawed. There is no way I'd risk jail time taking this to court when it could be settled with counseling.
The only thing I canthink of is that AD truly doesn't think he has done anything wrong and refused the ascribed rehabilitation by CPS. The worst thing you can do as a parent is not to jump through the hoops recommended by CPS. They tend to get offended. If this isn't what happened then, yes, it is an over zelous case worker and DA....IMO.

CPS case workers have a very tough job. I have seen them not be agressive enough and I have seen them be way over-agressive. Of the 2 posibilities they receive far less recrimination for being over-agressive. I have filed reports to CPS but then turned around to help the family deal with CPS by giving evidence that they are good parents but may need education and supervision....not the electeric chair.

In one case I was threatended by an assistant district attorney for trying to help the family. My attorney called her office and threatened to turn her into the state bar if she ever tried to intimidate me again when I was attempting to fulfil my responsibilites as a physician. (I hadn't filed the original report in that case). The doctor who did was caught lying in court but it took 3 years for this family to get out from underneath the heel of this particular CPS office and assistant district attorney. Even this case did not go to a grand jury.

I have seen CPS over-react and destroy entire families. I have seen them treat families very fairly and help them be better parents. I have seen them save children further abuse and injuries. Like I said, they have a hard job and are under a tremendous amount of scrutiny and pressure.

I have practiced in Ok, Tx and Nebraska. Tx, by far, had the most over-agressive case workers.

[EatLeadCommie]

thanks for the info

[cherokeebrewer]

I don't buy the comparison to hitting dogs. Dogs are incapable of comprehending information and instructions like kids are.

I don't know man, our little dog understands everything we say, knows at least a hundred words and can define all of 'em...

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

Please provide us with your parenting resume. I'd like to know the validity of your assertion.

Seriously? You are saying it is impossible to discipline children without hitting them?

[cherokeebrewer]

I don't know what to think about this, but it sure doesn't help Adrian...


http://www.khou.com/story/news/investigations/2014/09/15/new-accusations-peterson-injured-another-son-while-disciplining-4-year-old/15693941/

[manateepower]

I remember everyone getting mad at Colin Cowherd when he said "The apple doesn't fall far from the tree." Looks like he was right. More accusations against Adrian surfacing.

[Since71ASooner4Life]

He needs to be disciplined, again, not sure if I would handle the wooping like that, but I am sure Adrian's father was tough on him, he has turned out pretty well to date.

How well has he turned out with regards anything not football related? Beyond attending the obligatory charity events that most atheletes get drawn into, have we heard of anything admirable that he's done? Dont you suppose that his father being hard on him could we be a factor in him being a guy that abuses his illegitimate children?

[Eielson]

I remember everyone getting mad at Colin Cowherd when he said "The apple doesn't fall far from the tree." Looks like he was right. More accusations against Adrian surfacing.

Yeah...disciplining children and selling cocaine are basically the same thing.

[EatLeadCommie]

I don't know what to think about this, but it sure doesn't help Adrian...


http://www.khou.com/story/news/investigations/2014/09/15/new-accusations-peterson-injured-another-son-while-disciplining-4-year-old/15693941/

Not as damaging as the media seems to think, at least not from that description. AD says the kid did it himself. Whether or not you believe AD or not is another matter entirely. He was dodging a whooping and whacked his head. The one bad thing about that is it indicates he was getting a smack upside the head, because why else would he move his head? I wouldn't be whacking any kid in a car seat either. And I'm not sure what part of a car seat he would hit to cut his head. If there was a CPS investigation as stated, their findings will be more relevant than anything speculated on by the media.

[Eielson]

The one bad thing about that is it indicates he was getting a smack upside the head, because why else would he move his head?

I think he moved his whole body.

[EatLeadCommie]

yeah, could be. Like I said, the CPS investigation should say something, or at least include his story.

[EatLeadCommie]

Here we go... http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/24711291/report-adrian-peterson-injured-another-son-while-disciplining-him

In a statement, Adrian Peterson's lawyer, Rusty Hardin said: "The allegation of another investigation into Adrian Peterson is simply not true. The allegation is more than one year old and authorities took no action. An adult witness admittedly insists Adrian did nothing inappropriate with his son."

According to TMZ, "...the reason the case went nowhere is because Peterson did not strike the boy in the forehead -- but instead the child accidentally hit his head on a carseat while Adrian was punishing him. We're also told the form of discipline was 'not impermissible.' Under Texas law parents are allowed to administer reasonable punishment.

[manateepower]

Yeah...disciplining children and selling cocaine are basically the same thing.

Good point, giving a kid multiple scars is nowhere near as bad as drugs.

[Jason White's Third Knee]

Yeah...disciplining children and selling cocaine are basically the same thing.

Good point, giving a kid multiple scars is nowhere near as bad as drugs.

Actually, I heard that AD was freebasing the kids and they got scars from that, but he was doing that as a punishment for some sort of Ms. PacMan incident. It's complicated.

[Eielson]

Good point, giving a kid multiple scars is nowhere near as bad as drugs.

You do realize what cocaine does, right? I'm sure AD's father never hurt a fly while he was dealing it.

[olevetonahill]

I remember everyone getting mad at Colin Cowherd when he said "The apple doesn't fall far from the tree." Looks like he was right.
More accusations against Adrian surfacing.

Link?

[EatLeadCommie]

Good point, giving a kid multiple scars is nowhere near as bad as drugs.

I assume we're talking emotional scars or something?

[nighttrain12]

His 1 game team suspension is over. Adrian will play this coming Sunday, AT New Orleans. I wonder what kind of welcome he will get in the Big Easy?

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/140664/inside-slant-winning-trumps-all-for-vikings

[Soonerjeepman]

my 2 cents...

#1 the fact he has..multiple kids, with different women, says a lot about his "daddy skills" yes it does. As much as I like him as a fball player totally irresponsible.

#2 dad was in prison..for how much of his time? if I recall he wasn't "raised" much by his dad..

#3 my fiance works in a pre-school...she has a little girl last year, her sister this year....they've been hot-lined MULTIPLE times, mom doesn't GAS, social worker keeps reporting....no food, dirty clothes, dirty house...just horrible conditions...but not a damn thing happens. These girls will end up in a horrible life.

#4 if AD wasn't a pro athlete this would be a non event

[manateepower]

I assume we're talking emotional scars or something?

How about you look at the picture that has been circulating around the internet? How about you look at the texts that were sent back and forth in the aftermath? How about you look at the second accusation of child abuse that has now surfaced against him? How about you look at the fact that he that he has fathered 7 kids out of wedlock, one who ended up being murdered?

Though it doesn't really surprise me that a Texan such as yourself would defend a scum bag like Peterson.

[Eielson]

How about you look at the picture that has been circulating around the internet? How about you look at the texts that were sent back and forth in the aftermath? How about you look at the second accusation of child abuse that has now surfaced against him? How about you look at the fact that he that he has fathered 7 kids out of wedlock, one who ended up being murdered?

Though it doesn't really surprise me that a Texan such as yourself would defend a scum bag like Peterson.

Ban.

[EatLeadCommie]

How about you look at the picture that has been circulating around the internet? How about you look at the texts that were sent back and forth in the aftermath? How about you look at the second accusation of child abuse that has now surfaced against him? How about you look at the fact that he that he has fathered 7 kids out of wedlock, one who ended up being murdered?

Though it doesn't really surprise me that a Texan such as yourself would defend a scum bag like Peterson.

LOL. I'm a Texan, am I? That's news to me. Maybe I should just assume you're a Louisianan and I can go into how jacked up the law is in that state.

I've looked at the photos. Hell, I posted the link to them in this thread. There was nothing in those pictures to indicate scars. The kid had marks. Marks go away. I've also read the texts, which do not do anything to contradict AD's version of the story. I also posted the latest info about the second allegation against him.

[EatLeadCommie]

His 1 game team suspension is over. Adrian will play this coming Sunday, AT New Orleans. I wonder what kind of welcome he will get in the Big Easy?

http://espn.go.com/blog/nflnation/post/_/id/140664/inside-slant-winning-trumps-all-for-vikings

They'll boo him, then all those coonasses will go home and beat their kids.

[EatLeadCommie]

my 2 cents...

#1 the fact he has..multiple kids, with different women, says a lot about his "daddy skills" yes it does. As much as I like him as a fball player totally irresponsible.

#2 dad was in prison..for how much of his time? if I recall he wasn't "raised" much by his dad..

#3 my fiance works in a pre-school...she has a little girl last year, her sister this year....they've been hot-lined MULTIPLE times, mom doesn't GAS, social worker keeps reporting....no food, dirty clothes, dirty house...just horrible conditions...but not a damn thing happens. These girls will end up in a horrible life.

#4 if AD wasn't a pro athlete this would be a non event

Agree on #1. He needs to get snipped.

Peterson was 13 when his dad was arrested. From an article in USA Today...


Nelson Peterson received a call from school officials after Adrian had been disruptive in class. The father waited for the two boys near the school parking lot.

"His dad asked what happened, and Adrian told him," Cummings said. The elder Peterson then removed his belt and whipped Adrian in front of more than 20 students, according to Cummings.

"We still talk about it to this day," Cummings said. "My dad was tough, but his dad was real tough."

"When Adrian showed out or was bad, he got a whupping," his uncle, Greg Peterson told Peter.

Agree with #4 as well.

[FaninAma]

Seriously? You are saying it is impossible to discipline children without hitting them?
I didn't say that at all. Your posts seem to indicate that corporal punishment should never be used. Did I misinterpret your post? If I did I apologize. If I didn't then I would like to know what child rearing expertise or authority you are using to base your opinion on.

[manateepower]

You do realize what cocaine does, right? I'm sure AD's father never hurt a fly while he was dealing it.

I didn't say that cocaine wasn't harmful you dumbass. Thank you for missing my point completely.

[manateepower]

LOL. I'm a Texan, am I? That's news to me. Maybe I should just assume you're a Louisianan and I can go into how jacked up the law is in that state.

I've looked at the photos. Hell, I posted the link to them in this thread. There was nothing in those pictures to indicate scars. The kid had marks. Marks go away. I've also read the texts, which do not do anything to contradict AD's version of the story. I also posted the latest info about the second allegation against him.

Well, considering your location, I do not think it was unreasonable to assume you were from Texas, a state known mainly for bully happy males who get off on beating weaker individuals. I stand corrected if you are.

Won't defend my state, we got more than our own issues.

The fact that you have seen the picture of Adrian's kid with bruises and cuts as a result of what was done to him, and that you still defend him is very disturbing to me, and even more so if you raised/are raising kids of your own.

Even if the evidence in this case isn't as strong as it is, it would still be difficult for me to give him the benefit of the doubt considering his atrocious record as a father.

A scumbag is a scumbag, and it should make no difference if that scumbag wore a Sooner uniform.

Here is to hoping that this will be the last straw that will finally compel Peterson to turn his life around. Or at least to stop having more ****ing kids.

[manateepower]

my 2 cents...

#1 the fact he has..multiple kids, with different women, says a lot about his "daddy skills" yes it does. As much as I like him as a fball player totally irresponsible.

#2 dad was in prison..for how much of his time? if I recall he wasn't "raised" much by his dad..

#3 my fiance works in a pre-school...she has a little girl last year, her sister this year....they've been hot-lined MULTIPLE times, mom doesn't GAS, social worker keeps reporting....no food, dirty clothes, dirty house...just horrible conditions...but not a damn thing happens. These girls will end up in a horrible life.

#4 if AD wasn't a pro athlete this would be a non event

Great point, the apathy towards child abuse in this country is frightening, and the fact that we have people defending peterson is very telling. At least this incident is coming to light.

[bluedogok]

Montgomery County is fairly conservative but CPS in Texas is just another agency running wild over anyone they can, they go whole hog after some and completely ignore other, more pressing cases. My wife has worked in non-profit social services her entire career and has seen the extremes over the 20 years she worked in Texas.

Child Services to Mom Who Did Nothing Wrong: 'Just Don't Let Your Kids Play Outside' (http://reason.com/blog/2014/09/15/child-services-to-mom-who-did-nothing-wr)

I am just sick and tired of immediate conviction by media talking heads instead of legal due process that this country used to be based on. It is to the point that I no longer watch ESPN (or any national media) unless there is an actual game going on, their holier than thou self importance is sickening.

[EatLeadCommie]

Well, considering your location, I do not think it was unreasonable to assume you were from Texas, a state known mainly for bully happy males who get off on beating weaker individuals. I stand corrected if you are.

Won't defend my state, we got more than our own issues.

The fact that you have seen the picture of Adrian's kid with bruises and cuts as a result of what was done to him, and that you still defend him is very disturbing to me, and even more so if you raised/are raising kids of your own.

Even if the evidence in this case isn't as strong as it is, it would still be difficult for me to give him the benefit of the doubt considering his atrocious record as a father.

A scumbag is a scumbag, and it should make no difference if that scumbag wore a Sooner uniform.

Here is to hoping that this will be the last straw that will finally compel Peterson to turn his life around. Or at least to stop having more ****ing kids.

Just because I live in Texas does not make me a Texan.

Texas is known for a lot of things, but I didn't know they were known for having bullies who get off on beating other people. I think that is more a symptom of the human condition than anything relating to Texas.

I saw the pictures and said I think he went too far, which I suspect is easy to do when you're built like Adrian Peterson. There was nothing requiring medical attention and nothing there that made me think he is a dirtbag and should go to jail. I don't know what the legal threshold is in Texas. Visible marks? Hospitalization? All this is relevant, and a doctor in Minnesota likely has a different threshold for what constitutes abuse than a doctor in Texas depending on what state law and case law dictates.

Agree that a scumbag is a scumbag regardless of whose uniform he wears. I don't think a guy is a scumbag if he takes a switch or a belt to his kids and goes a little far. I may question his effectiveness as a father if he is doing this all the time and question why his kids are cussing around him because they likely learned that from him. In addition, I'd question his judgment for having like 20 kids through 20 different baby mamas.

I think that the events of the last few days have most certainly been a wake-up call for him, but the media gets off on excoriating people and it is sickening. Not everybody has the same standards as a bunch of sheltered weenies in the media. You don't have the same standards as me. I don't have the same standards as Adrian Peterson. Let the law figure it out. If you or I don't like the result, too bad. I worry that the media is going to try and sentence him, but fortunately he seems to have a competent lawyer that is on top of things (such as with the other abuse allegation). We know from Ray Rice that Goodell has no backbone. I'm not saying that Rice didn't maybe deserve more than 2 games, but the law dealt with him and 2 games was good enough for Roger after that. It's bad enough that the NFL seems to be arbitrary with their punishments, but once the media is out for blood, you never know what's going to happen. AD should play until his case is resolved.

[Eielson]

I didn't say that cocaine wasn't harmful you dumbass. Thank you for missing my point completely.

You said dealing cocaine isn't much different/worse than going too far when disciplining your child. Going to have to disagree on that one.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Agree on #1. He needs to get snipped.
Agree with #4 as well.

Can you fault him for all those women throwing their bodies at him? I fault him for not wearing protection...

[Tear Down This Wall]

Homos. My dad and I discussed this AD thing today. I'm a grown man, 45, riding in a car with my dad, 72, to have lunch. This is the man who whipped me with a belt, switch, knocked me in the head with a wrench when I damn near burned our house down when I was four, and cut my head open hitting me with the belt end of the belt when a tornado was barreling down on our then-West Texas Panhandle town and I wanted to change out of my jammies and put play clothes on instead of running down to the storm shelter at 3 in the morning.

Every whipping my dad gave me, I deserved. He didn't beat me. He disciplined me. And, when I four years old and put my family in danger of fire and by tornado, he really ramped it up...as he should have!

God knows with a tornado coming, he didn't have time to reason with my four year old brain about the devastation tornadoes could cause. I threw a fit at three in the morning while everyone else was running for their lives to the shelter. My dad did what he had to do to really get my attention - clock me upside the noggin with a belt buckle.

And, it worked. From that point on, when the man said, "Move" by God, I moved...and, as quickly as I could! After the tornado, he and my mom discovered my head was full of dried blood. He'd cut my head open with the belt buckle.

So, off to the hospital we went. The doctors sewed up the cut, and that was that. 1973. No one said a damn thing to my dad about it, nor should they have.

Another time, I almost burned the house down messing with the furnace while he was at work. I took a wrench to the head for that. Just a little knock that left a bump for a couple of days. But, again, after that, I didn't touch an appliance in the house.

The few other belt spankings received along the way for fighting with my brother and sister, talking back, getting into fights at school, and whatnot...that was just a part of growing up. And, no different than anything any of my other friends experienced.

When they you saw a parent yank up a kid in church, you and everyone in the auditorium knew damn well that kid was going to a bathroom for a whipping. And, you'd wait for the shame walk when they came back down the aisle with tears rolling down their cheeks, suppressing more crying.

And, you damn well didn't laugh or giggle because there you were, listening to the preacher peach Jesus while your mom and dad cocked their head towards you, then towards the just-spanked kid being led shamefully back to his or her pew to nurse his or her aching butt and pride. And, no one said a damn thing about it. They didn't have to.

(And, if you really wanted to get a quick whipping in church...goof off down at Granny and Paw Paw's church in Houston. My Granny would pull your *** up out of there faster than lightning and whip you like a pack mule in the ladies room. No one goofed off in Granny and Paw Paw's church. And, Granny and Paw Paw DID have trees in their backyard for switches, unlike our houses in West Texas, then suburban Dallas.)

It was discipline then. And, it's discipline now.

And, if it seems my dad was harsh, at least we knew his punishment was going to be the belt or the hand. My mom - God help us. Anything near that she could wield would do. Wooden spoons. Shoes. Whatever. And, if you sassed my mom, you got the Three-Slaps-Across-The-Mouth: forehand, backhand, then forehand again. No questions asked.

And, if there wasn't anything around for her to grab, she'd grab you by the hair and pull you to the kitchen...where she could then reach the wooden spoons and smack you around. And, unlike my dad, who you knew would smack you in the legs and butt, anywhere was fair game for mom. She generally went for hands, where there isn't a lot of flesh and muscle between the skin and bones to soften the blows.

So you homos talking about AD switching his kid...get a life. The man didn't close his fist and beat the kid or kick him. He spanked him, gave him a whipping like most of us that grew up before the faggy 1990s got. And, he'll be a better man for it, too, when he's older.

[Tear Down This Wall]

And, as for psychological "abuse":

My dad's forewarning were: do whatever it is that is pis-sing me off again and "I'll bust your little butt!" If we were in public, it was revised to, "I'll bust your little butt right here in front of everyone!"

My mom's forewarning were: cease doing whatever it is that is pis-sing me off because "I'm about to fly right in the middle of you!"

"Fly right in the middle of you" was also Granny's forewarning. Although, sometimes Granny just brought the pain with no other warning. Your past experiences with Granny-whippings were supposed to have sufficed as forewarning from then on until Jesus returned.

[Tear Down This Wall]

And, I'll go further.

My parents are Okie to the core, but I grew up in Texas. And, every school I went to, the principals had wooden paddles hanging on the walls of their offices. And, they didn't need to call your mom and dad to pull them off the wall and give you good whipping.

And, you knew when you got a whipping at the principals office, you were also going to get one at home.

I remember, clear as yesterday, in the fifth grade, this kid marked over one of my baseball sticker on my crayon box. And, by God, it was on! By the flag pole after school. So we scuffled and scuffled like rabies-infected badgers surrounded by our friends until his mom came and broke it up.

I ran home. But, I could outrun Southwestern Bell. When I got home, there was my mom, arms folded across here chest asking me if I'd been in a fight after school. Needless to say, dad gave me a whipping when he got home. It was a "you go your room now and wait 'til your dad gets home" whipping. The worst kind because I could hear my brother and friends outside playing while I was sitting in my room waiting for my whipping.

At school, I lucked out. The principal called me and the crayon box graffiti-artist into his office. He said he'd let us out of our whipping there if we'd shake hands and promise not to fight again. Well, we'd both been whipped at home the night before, so we opted for the hand shake and didn't cross each other's paths the rest of the school year.

[BoulderSooner79]

….
FIRST YORKSHIREMAN:
You were lucky, TDTW. We lived for three months in a paper bag in a septic tank. We used to have to get up at six in the morning, clean the paper bag, eat a crust of stale bread, go to work down t' mill, fourteen hours a day, week-in week-out, for sixpence a week, and when we got home our Dad would thrash us to sleep wi' his belt.
SECOND YORKSHIREMAN:
Luxury. We used to have to get out of the lake at six o'clock in the morning, clean the lake, eat a handful of 'ot gravel, work twenty hour day at mill for tuppence a month, come home, and Dad would thrash us to sleep with a broken bottle, if we were lucky!
THIRD YORKSHIREMAN:
Well, of course, we had it tough. We used to 'ave to get up out of shoebox at twelve o'clock at night and lick road clean wit' tongue. We had two bits of cold gravel, worked twenty-four hours a day at mill for sixpence every four years, and when we got home our Dad would slice us in two wit' bread knife.
FOURTH YORKSHIREMAN:
Right. I had to get up in the morning at ten o'clock at night half an hour before I went to bed, drink a cup of sulphuric acid, work twenty-nine hours a day down mill, and pay mill owner for permission to come to work, and when we got home, our Dad and our mother would kill us and dance about on our graves singing Hallelujah.
FIRST YORKSHIREMAN:
And you try and tell the young people of today that ..... they won't believe you.
ALL:
They won't!

(Apologies to Monty Python)

[Tear Down This Wall]

Awesome!

The thing is, now that I'm older, it's not that big a deal. When I needed a whipping, someone was there to give it to me. It didn't happen much, but when it did...it did.

And, thanks to my mom, dad, Granny, principals, and every adult who whipped by butt along the way, I didn't become a maggot-infested dope smoker, liberal, queer - or any combination of the three.

[Tear Down This Wall]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xe1a1wHxTyo

[olevetonahill]

TDTW. I get the feelin ya might have been smacked upside the head ONCE too often:drunk:

[8timechamps]

I think the media is doing it's own major grand-standing with this. After the Ray Rice incident, everyone is in a hurry to look like they are above reproach and this behavior is deplorable.

My favorite so far is the media's use of "tree branch". Yeah, I guess technically a switch is a branch from a tree, but they want the viewers to think he used a large tree branch.

Anyway, I think AD was excessive in his discipline, but I can't believe the people calling for his head. He was raised being disciplined that way, and that's what he knows. Rather than crucifying the guy, how about the folks around him getting him help to become a better parent? To this point, AD has been a very upstanding member of the community and a genuine good guy. He made a mistake, because that's what he knew, and people are quick to call him names and lump him in with people like Ray Rice. It's crazy.

I was hit with a switch more than once, hell, I remember having to go pick it and like the Chris Rock bit, if it wasn't big enough, I'd be in more trouble. It's the way a lot of folks were raised. I never considered myself an abused child, because it didn't happen often and typically was a last resort. Still, I haven't used that approach with my kids, and I like I said, I think AD went overboard, but it's not as uncommon as the TV and radio hosts would like their viewers to believe.

[EatLeadCommie]

^^ Good post. That's exactly how I feel. I watched Barkley nonchalantly say that's the way things are in a lot of places yesterday, and Rome is just badgering him trying to get him to condemn AD in any way. The whole time I'm thinking if there is anybody who didn't get whacked enough as a kid, it's Jim Rome.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

I didn't say that at all. Your posts seem to indicate that corporal punishment should never be used. Did I misinterpret your post? If I did I apologize. If I didn't then I would like to know what child rearing expertise or authority you are using to base your opinion on.

No, you didn't misinterpret me. I don't believe in corporal punishment. I base my opinion on observation. I had plenty of peers growing up who weren't spanked as I was who grew into perfectly normal, successful adults. I have watched my nieces and nephews grow into pleasant, well-behaved, respectful kids without ever being hit even in response to some egregious behavior including nearly setting my living room on fire.

My lot in life has not included children of my own. (If I were so blessed, though, I don't believe I would ever hit them.) I am not a parent, nor do I have any especial child rearing expertise or authority. I don't think being a parent automatically makes one an expert, however, else all parents would be good parents.

Moreover, if the rules of the board (or society at large, come to think of it) required that one voice opinions only in areas in which one has experience, training, or expertise, it'd be mighty quiet.

I was at the Target yesterday behind a woman with several kids including an absolutely preciously cute girl of about 6 or 7. The child was not misbehaving in the least--she wasn't pulling stuff off the shelves as some kids do in the checkout line, or begging her mom to buy her something. All she was doing was prancing around and talking a mile a minute, asking her mom questions while her mom was dealing with some issue over an item she'd bought and trying to pay for her purchases.

Finally the mom grabbed the child to tell her to shut up or some such, and the child immediately cringed as though she was used to being hit and was expecting it. It made my stomach turn. The child was doing nothing wrong. Just being a kid.

I just don't think any child should exhibit that kind of fear of the person most responsible for his or her care and well-being.

[Eielson]

You don't HAVE to spank your children.

[olevetonahill]

No, you didn't misinterpret me. I don't believe in corporal punishment. I base my opinion on observation. I had plenty of peers growing up who weren't spanked as I was who grew into perfectly normal, successful adults. I have watched my nieces and nephews grow into pleasant, well-behaved, respectful kids without ever being hit even in response to some egregious behavior including nearly setting my living room on fire.

My lot in life has not included children of my own. (If I were so blessed, though, I don't believe I would ever hit them.) I am not a parent, nor do I have any especial child rearing expertise or authority. I don't think being a parent automatically makes one an expert, however, else all parents would be good parents.

Moreover, if the rules of the board (or society at large, come to think of it) required that one voice opinions only in areas in which one has experience, training, or expertise, it'd be mighty quiet.

I was at the Target yesterday behind a woman with several kids including an absolutely preciously cute girl of about 6 or 7. The child was not misbehaving in the least--she wasn't pulling stuff off the shelves as some kids do in the checkout line, or begging her mom to buy her something. All she was doing was prancing around and talking a mile a minute, asking her mom questions while her mom was dealing with some issue over an item she'd bought and trying to pay for her purchases.

Finally the mom grabbed the child to tell her to shut up or some such, and the child immediately cringed as though she was used to being hit and was expecting it. It made my stomach turn. The child was doing nothing wrong. Just being a kid.

I just don't think any child should exhibit that kind of fear of the person most responsible for his or her care and well-being.

I make My tasteless Jokes But I agree with you. I was a Dad of 3 Now get to spoil 2 of my Grandsons
Yes I had to resort to corporal punishment a Few times with 2 teenage boys and Me being a single Parent. they had to test me.
Every kid is different
never saw a One come out with an instruction manual :drunk:

I will be serious about this issue ONE time ok?
Then Ima go back to being Tasteless:highly_amused:

My Opinion is AD went to far. Sure I was switched , Hell I was Belted, had a Wire Clothes hanger, Anyone Mention a Razor Strop? Switches , the whole 9 Yards.
But that was the way Our Folks were raised and the way their parents were raised.
Now Remember a few short years ago when Kids didnt Have Car seats?There were No seat belts. we all smoked where ever we wanted?

Things Change .
Like I said AD went to far, That doesnt make him a Bad person, It makes him a Parent in need of a Parenting Class Oh and while hes at it. Make him attend a Sex Ed. Class.

Now beat that Kid LOL

[olevetonahill]

You don't HAVE to spank your children.

You are so Absolute about that statement Are you sayin EVERY kid is the same?

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

OK all y'all. Question.

Stipulation: AD was just disciplining his kid and he went overboard. (Just for argument's sake, we'll ignore his own words "Never do I go overboard!")

Reggie Bush admits disciplining his one-year-old daughter. Says he "definitely will try to, will obviously not leave bruises or anything like that on her. But I definitely will discipline her harshly depending on, again, on what the situation is."

Please discuss. Bush =, <=, >= Peterson? Why or why not?

Also just out of curiosity for a nonparent, how does one discipline a one-year-old?

[olevetonahill]

OK all y'all. Question.

Stipulation: AD was just disciplining his kid and he went overboard. (Just for argument's sake, we'll ignore his own words "Never do I go overboard!")

Reggie Bush admits disciplining his one-year-old daughter. Says he "definitely will try to, will obviously not leave bruises or anything like that on her. But I definitely will discipline her harshly depending on, again, on what the situation is."

Please discuss. Bush =, <=, >= Peterson? Why or why not?

Also just out of curiosity for a nonparent, how does one discipline a one-year-old?

WHAT? I never heard a werd about R bush and a 1 year old.
The only thing I know ya do with a Baby is change their Butts. Not beat em. Feed em if they crying. Now if they tryin to Stick nails er sompun in the lectric outlets Ya gently slap their hands and say NO. then Take yerself out side and Hit you head against a brick wall for Leaving nails around where a Baby can get it.
a 4 year old prolly needs some Firm discipline Not a Beating But a 1 year Old Just needs a Hug and a Fresh Huggy and a Bottle.

[Eielson]

You are so Absolute about that statement Are you sayin EVERY kid is the same?

I think I may not have communicated my point properly. I meant the opposite. Every kid is different, as is every parent, so not every parent needs to spank every kid. I condone parents having the right to spank, but that doesn't mean that I condemn those who choose not to. You don't HAVE to spank your kid, but you should have the right to.

[olevetonahill]

One other Nuther Thing, AD Didnt Go overboard in HIS MInd Nor in a Lot of other peoples minds it seems
But in the general Population He DID in fact go over board
Why I said He needs a Parenting class. I dont think hes a Criminal I think hes just stupid at parenting

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

WHAT? I never heard a werd about R bush and a 1 year old.
The only thing I know ya do with a Baby is change their Butts. Not beat em. Feed em if they crying. Now if they tryin to Stick nails er sompun in the lectric outlets Ya gently slap their hands and say NO. then Take yerself out side and Hit you head against a brick wall for Leaving nails around where a Baby can get it.
a 4 year old prolly needs some Firm discipline Not a Beating But a 1 year Old Just needs a Hug and a Fresh Huggy and a Bottle.

Oh sorry, I forgot to include the link. Bush's hypothetical take on the situation.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/reggie-bush-harshly-discipline-year-daughter/story?id=25537109

[olevetonahill]

I think I may not have communicated my point properly. I meant the opposite. Every kid is different, as is every parent, so not every parent needs to spank every kid. I condone parents having the right to spank, but that doesn't mean that I condemn those who choose not to. You don't HAVE to spank your kid, but you should have the right to.

There ya go.Ive seen Kids a 2x4 upside the head wouldnt get their attention! Hell just Look at TearDownThisWall that boy was beat to hell and gone and hes still stupid :highly_amused:

[olevetonahill]

Oh sorry, I forgot to include the link. Bush's hypothetical take on the situation.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/reggie-bush-harshly-discipline-year-daughter/story?id=25537109

In reading that Link , He seems to be saying he disciplines her . Ok But Not with a switch hes saying he wont rule it out in the Future

[olevetonahill]

Holy Hell The Vikes sat him again!
http://www.nfl.com/news/story/0ap3000000396097/article/vikings-deactivate-adrian-peterson-indefinitely

Cut all this Criminal Crap and send the Boy to Parenting Class. and let him get back to running

[EatLeadCommie]

Disciplining a 1 yr old is absurd beyond telling them no. Their comprehension is akin to a dog at that age, if not less. I'm not sure I'd put much stock in Bush's statement. Professional athletes usually aren't the most articulate bunch.

[aurorasooner]

Geez, AD's kids may come out of this with more money than they know what to do with. I'm not an attorney, but I can't believe that they won't sue somebody over this, and that some kind of minor plea bargain won't be reached so their meal ticket will be back on the field shortly.

Mother of Adrian Peterson's son outraged that photos were released

http://http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/24712270/mother-of-adrian-petersons-son-outraged-that-photos-were-releasedhttp://www.cbssports.com/nfl/eye-on-football/24712270/mother-of-adrian-petersons-son-outraged-that-photos-were-released


Although the photos started a public outcry against Peterson, they were never supposed to be made public. The mother of Peterson's son released a statement Tuesday expressing her outrage that the photos were made public.
My client, on behalf of herself and their son, wishes to express her extreme outrage at the invasion of their privacy that has occurred through the publication of highly confidential and private data obtained regarding them by the press without their permission or consent. My client is hurt and outraged that the press would publish throughout the world pictures of their minor son and publish statements allegedly made as part of the private and confidential criminal investigative file.


The photos were originally published by KILT-AM in Houston, although it's not clear how the station obtained the photos. Because it was against the law to release the photos, Texas police are now looking into who leaked them, according to the Houston Chronicle.

"It is a violation of the law regarding the confidentiality of child abuse investigations," Montgomery County first assistant district attorney Phil Grant said.

[cherokeebrewer]

I think the media is doing it's own major grand-standing with this.

This is so true. I mean most civilized folks and even a few barbarians believe Adrian went too far, but to put him in the same category as Ray Rice is yellow journalism...

[EatLeadCommie]

Whether it is here, other boards, or Facebook, people are pretty divided on this issue. I understand the outcry, particularly from those who were abused, but those who experienced similar discipline growing up or still discipline their kids the same way are obviously not inclined to speak up right now. Basically, there is only one side shouting, and that is bad for Adrian Peterson.

[8timechamps]

OK all y'all. Question.

Stipulation: AD was just disciplining his kid and he went overboard. (Just for argument's sake, we'll ignore his own words "Never do I go overboard!")

Reggie Bush admits disciplining his one-year-old daughter. Says he "definitely will try to, will obviously not leave bruises or anything like that on her. But I definitely will discipline her harshly depending on, again, on what the situation is."

Please discuss. Bush =, <=, >= Peterson? Why or why not?

Also just out of curiosity for a nonparent, how does one discipline a one-year-old?

I can't really speak to the Reggie Bush situation, as I haven't heard much about that...AD, on the other hand, said he had spoken to a psychologist and realized there are alternatives to what he had been doing (that told me enough to believe he felt like he was doing the right thing prior, and may at least realize he needs to change).

It's been a while since my boys were one, but I don't ever remember a situation that required discipline. At that age, they're just trying to figure out how to walk/talk, and everything is so new to them. I don't remember having any issues until well into the second year, but even those were just normal things (like saying "No" consistently).

Honestly, I can't imagine a situation that would ever really call for disciplining a one year old.

[FaninAma]

No, you didn't misinterpret me. I don't believe in corporal punishment. I base my opinion on observation. I had plenty of peers growing up who weren't spanked as I was who grew into perfectly normal, successful adults. I have watched my nieces and nephews grow into pleasant, well-behaved, respectful kids without ever being hit even in response to some egregious behavior including nearly setting my living room on fire.

My lot in life has not included children of my own. (If I were so blessed, though, I don't believe I would ever hit them.) I am not a parent, nor do I have any especial child rearing expertise or authority. I don't think being a parent automatically makes one an expert, however, else all parents would be good parents.

Moreover, if the rules of the board (or society at large, come to think of it) required that one voice opinions only in areas in which one has experience, training, or expertise, it'd be mighty quiet.

I was at the Target yesterday behind a woman with several kids including an absolutely preciously cute girl of about 6 or 7. The child was not misbehaving in the least--she wasn't pulling stuff off the shelves as some kids do in the checkout line, or begging her mom to buy her something. All she was doing was prancing around and talking a mile a minute, asking her mom questions while her mom was dealing with some issue over an item she'd bought and trying to pay for her purchases.

Finally the mom grabbed the child to tell her to shut up or some such, and the child immediately cringed as though she was used to being hit and was expecting it. It made my stomach turn. The child was doing nothing wrong. Just being a kid.

I just don't think any child should exhibit that kind of fear of the person most responsible for his or her care and well-being.

What a keen sense of observation. And you have raised how many children? I've seen 7 year old children who run right over their mothers and who obviously aren't afraid of anything they say and obviously were never spanked. These kids often end up doing the same in school and stay in trouble all of the time. Your anecdotal evidence is just that...anecdotal. You are stepping way over the line in your criticism of all the parents who feel they know what is in the best interest of their child and have decided the judicious use of corporal punishment is best method of disciplining their children.

[Ton Loc]

I don't spank my kids. I spanked my daughter once and immediately felt like a failure.
Corporal punishment, spanking, etc doesn't work. I could use my own anecdotal evidence of my own personal history and seeing those around me who do spank or I could point to almost every study ever done that shows that corporal punishment doesn't work.

Adrian needs some help being a better father and making better choices. You don't father multiple kids to multiple mothers if you have your head on straight. And you don't hit your kid with a switch or shove leaves in his mouth or smack him so hard it leaves a scar on his face.

[FaninAma]

I don't spank my kids. I spanked my daughter once and immediately felt like a failure.
Corporal punishment, spanking, etc doesn't work. I could use my own anecdotal evidence of my own personal history and seeing those around me who do spank or I could point to almost every study ever done that shows that corporal punishment doesn't work.

Adrian needs some help being a better father and making better choices. You don't father multiple kids to multiple mothers if you have your head on straight. And you don't hit your kid with a switch or shove leaves in his mouth or smack him so hard it leaves a scar on his face.

I have looked at many, many of the behavioral studies regarding the use of corporal punishment and they are all poorly designed with obvious political biases. I rarely see more stupid parents than the idiots trying to reason with an unruly 2 or 3 year old in a restaurant. If you are one of these type of parents you and your children have most likely been put on a lot of "do not invite" lists for social gatherings.

[cherokeebrewer]

This thread has been beat to death...

[BoulderSooner79]

This thread has been beat to death...

Which is wrong. Putting this thread in timeout is enough - it's never okay to hit a thread.

[SoonerPride]

This thread has been beat to death...

........................with a switch or a paddle?

[Ton Loc]

I have looked at many, many of the behavioral studies regarding the use of corporal punishment and they are all poorly designed with obvious political biases. I rarely see more stupid parents than the idiots trying to reason with an unruly 2 or 3 year old in a restaurant. If you are one of these type of parents you and your children have most likely been put on a lot of "do not invite" lists for social gatherings.

I guess I'm lucky. My kids are perfect. It's probably my perfect parenting.

If you don't have the patience and maturity to deal with a kid without hitting them then you could use some work as a parent.

And I know this thread has been beat to death. FaninAma is just a dummy who is easily riled up when his opinion isn't considered fact.

[FaninAma]

I guess I'm lucky. My kids are perfect. It's probably my perfect parenting.

If you don't have the patience and maturity to deal with a kid without hitting them then you could use some work as a parent.

And I know this thread has been beat to death. FaninAma is just a dummy who is easily riled up when his opinion isn't considered fact.

No, I just dislike sanctimonious morons like you who want to criticize and belittle people you disagree with. And as far as your children being perfect I sincerely doubt a casual objective observer would agree....especially if your kids got any of their personal interaction skills from you.

[8timechamps]

I would consider FaninAma's input on this subject, he does have a 'few' years experience in the matter...

[FaninAma]

I would consider FaninAma's input on this subject, he does have a 'few' years experience in the matter...

The one thing my experience has taught me is that there is not a one size fits all style of parenting. Some kids need more guidance and discipline. Others are easier to guide in the direction you want them to go. I personally do not spank my kids. But I will not criticize those that do. It is the epitome of arrogance to presume you know what works with other people's children. And like I said in my previous post....if you are that arrogant and superior there is probably a good chance your progeny is, too.

I have seen most forms of discipline termed ineffective or unjustly punitive at some point including time-outs/making children stay in their rooms, using the word no or don't, or even depriving them of privileges. And despite how brilliant some of you think your children are there is not a child in the world that is born with an innate sense of right or wrong or the ability to understand how their actions impact others around them. It is something you teach them through consistency and caring. And yes, corporal punishment can be carried out by a caring parent. Society sure doesn't spare the rod when your kids get past the age of accountability.

[SanDiegoSoonerGal]

What a keen sense of observation. And you have raised how many children? I've seen 7 year old children who run right over their mothers and who obviously aren't afraid of anything they say and obviously were never spanked. These kids often end up doing the same in school and stay in trouble all of the time. Your anecdotal evidence is just that...anecdotal. You are stepping way over the line in your criticism of all the parents who feel they know what is in the best interest of their child and have decided the judicious use of corporal punishment is best method of disciplining their children.

You're funny. You complain about my "anecdotal evidence being just that...anecdotal," right after supporting your own point with...anecdotal evidence.

I'm nothing if not amenable to being educated, however, so if you can point me to any well-designed behavioral studies without obvious political bias--and I'm going to raise the bar a bit by throwing in peer-reviewed--that conclude that corporal punishment is an effective, harmless disciplinary measure, I'd appreciate it. I'd be interested in reading them.

Just for clarity, I recall saying I don't believe in corporal punishment. I don't recall specifically criticizing any parents who have decided that the judicious use of corporal punishment is appropriate for their child. Sort of like I don't believe in eating trans fats, but I don't criticize anyone who does. If anything I said suggested otherwise then I wasn't as clear as I thought I was being.

[olevetonahill]

........................with a switch or a paddle?

What a Tasteless Joke !
yet I laughed!

[FaninAma]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/11/08/living/parents-spanking-p/

Pretty balanced article on the subject. SDSoonergal, as I said if I misinterpreted your remarks I apologize.


74% of mothers think spanking is okay. In 2011 93% of 3 to 4 year olds have been spanked at least once in the past year.

[EatLeadCommie]

Look, I can understand if somebody doesn't want to spank their kids or whatever. I don't dagree with it, but I'm not going to lecture them that their kids are going to grow up to be misbehaving malcontents or gigantic pu$$ies. They may turn out fine. They may turn out awful. It's always a crapshoot. Every kid is different. But for somebody who chooses not to discipline their kids in such a way to say definitively that spanking doesn't work is absurd. There is a reason that it has been done for thousands of years. Spare me some asinine comparison to slavery or wife beating having been done for thousands of years. Some kids need a spanking or whooping, and some offenses are worth it, even if the kid is aged 4. Some kids respond better to spanking. Some kids respond equally as well to time out, but if the offense is particularly egregious and you're inclined to spank your kid, you aren't going to test time out as an alternative.

This is part of the problem that AD is facing. The people screaming the loudest are people who don't appreciate people having the right to physically discipline their kids, even though every state in the union permits such things. You go around the water cooler or talk amongst your friends, and a lot of them will say the same thing about AD-- that they were brought up that way and don't think their parents were criminals. If you're really tight with them, they may even tell you that they employ the same methods on their children, minus maybe the one that hurt them the most. The problem is people aren't going to chime in in public in a debate like this for fear of being labeled a child abuser. They may implicate their parents because it was long ago and won't get them in trouble, but they aren't going to say something in public that may bring CPS to their house.

Raise your kids the way you want to raise them. Discipline them whichever way works. It isn't anybody's business unless you're punching them in the damn face or something excessive. AD is right on the borderline with what he did by today's standards. When he was growing up a mere 15-20 years ago, it was more commonplace than it is now. I'm not comfortable screwing a man out of a job over something so subjective. Goodell has absolutely no stones in this matter and any other recent matters or else he would implement a coherent policy that defers to the legal process first and a coherent and structured NFL discipline process second.

Goodell is of the generation that still didn't frown on corporal punishment, so if you want to argue a case of whoopings that didn't work, it's clearly him. He probably got whooped and still turned into a giant vag.

[Ton Loc]

No, I just dislike sanctimonious morons like you who want to criticize and belittle people you disagree with. And as far as your children being perfect I sincerely doubt a casual objective observer would agree....especially if your kids got any of their personal interaction skills from you.

My kids are perfect. Casual observers approach me constantly and tell me. So with that small shred of anecdotal evidence I've completely proven my point and can rest easy. <-----sarcasm....

I've never seen loving corporal punishment handed out. Wouldn't know what that looks like and quite frankly, if I saw loving corporal punishment it would probably freak me out.

I turned out fine being spanked, slapped, hit, and occasionally beat. I turned out fine in spite of that, not because of it. I think people are trying to link spanking to turning out "okay." That's just crazy talk.

[FaninAma]

Well kudos to your perfect kids. With such an arrogant jerk for a father I'm glad they turned out OK. It must be awesome to be so intelligent and confident in your intellectual, moral and parenting skill superiority. Do you realize how you sound? Are you really that tone deaf? How does it feel knowing in your infinite wisdom that your parents were bad parents and used poor parenting choices? Have you informed them of the error of their ways? You certainly need to lest they continue along their misguided path of thinking they did the best job they could in raising you.

None of my kids and none of the kids I know or take care of are perfect. If they were they wouldn't need me.

My evidence is anecdotal also but it is a hell of a lot more extensive than yours.

And it looks like the lynch mob got another pound of flesh with Peterson being suspended indefinitely. It is obvious AD is in need of some counseling and education on the use of discipline and parenting but it is also evident that he is operating under the moral and cultural values he learned as a kid.


I didn't care a whole lot for the NFL even before the current commissioner lost what little spine he had. Now it is evident that everybody with an agenda will use him as their whipping boy because they now they can intimidate him into doing whatever they want.

Ray Rice needed to be suspended and undergo counseling. Adrian needed counseling and education. Neither needed to be destroyed professionally. The vindictiveness of the "perfect" individuals in our society is very telling.

Meanwhile a lot of these same perfect people continue to support a burgeoning entitlement culture that leads to single parent homes and absentee fathers. That is the true abuse being foisted upon the poor and minority communities in this country.

[Ton Loc]

You gathered a lot from my small sarcastic not serious at all statements about me and my kids being perfect. That's a whole bunch of judging. (Seriously though - we are perfect)
I'm not even sure what we're arguing about. I'm just having fun.

You're out of touch a bit. Which is fine, its just that you won't be happy by what society deems right or wrong all the time.

And I'm finished.

[FaninAma]

The reason I flipped out on you is that I detest judgmental mobs especially when they are cheered on by the idiots in the media and morons in the PC political groups. Your comments seemed to indicate you feel comfortable with the mob mentality currently steamrolling everybody they disagree with and those poor individuals who are unfortunate enough to find themselves on the mob's hit list.

[nighttrain12]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11563542/adrian-peterson-denial-chances-play-season-future-minnesota-vikings

Hey, he passed a lie detector test. That means he is innocent, right?

[SoonerForLife92]

This is so ****ing stupid. Tired of the media dictating what everyone's opinions are supposed to be, and then demonizing people who disagree. If they remove Peterson from the league for this, I will never support the NFL in any way again.

[SoonerPride]

This is so ****ing stupid. Tired of the media dictating what everyone's opinions are supposed to be, and then demonizing people who disagree. If they remove Peterson from the league for this, I will never support the NFL in any way again.\

I'm sure you will be missed.

[SoonerorLater]

http://espn.go.com/nfl/story/_/id/11563542/adrian-peterson-denial-chances-play-season-future-minnesota-vikings

Hey, he passed a lie detector test. That means he is innocent, right?

Well not according to ESPN. They seem to think it just goes to show how lost AD truly is and we know that ESPN has become the arbiter of popular social thought.

[SoonerPride]

Well not according to ESPN. They seem to think it just goes to show how lost AD truly is and we know that ESPN has become the arbiter of popular social thought.

Make no mistake, the team didn't sideline him again because ESPN said anything.

Once sponsors balked and started withdrawing support there goes AD.

The game is about money and he was costing them money.

[SoonerForLife92]

\

I'm sure you will be missed.

Yes because that was completely the point of my statement.

[badger]

When it rains it pours.

Prosecutors seek to revoke bond, re-arrest AD (http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/ousportsextra/prosecutors-want-adrian-peterson-re-arrested-bond-revoked/article_efa18210-7c3c-5f4d-bcec-ea42ac93128c.html)

[rock on sooner]

When it rains it pours.

Prosecutors seek to revoke bond, re-arrest AD (http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/ousportsextra/prosecutors-want-adrian-peterson-re-arrested-bond-revoked/article_efa18210-7c3c-5f4d-bcec-ea42ac93128c.html)

What on earth was he thinking? "A little weed" out on bail...geez, he's got
a death wish!

[BoulderSooner79]

File a change of venue to Colorado.

[EatLeadCommie]

Make no mistake, the team didn't sideline him again because ESPN said anything.

Once sponsors balked and started withdrawing support there goes AD.

The game is about money and he was costing them money.

Sponsors have ADHD along with everybody else. They could've waited a week for it to blow over or simply replaced sponsors. It's not like people are really going to conclude that Nike or Joe Schmo Ford are advocates of child abuse because the Vikings keep playing Peterson. But the pressure combined from sponsors and ESPECIALLY the league itself was too much. The timing (on the heels of Ray Rice) was even worse.

[Since71ASooner4Life]

What on earth was he thinking? "A little weed" out on bail...geez, he's got
a death wish!

No, but a brain the size of a raisin

[8timechamps]

I feel sorry for AD. The guy keeps stepping in his own ****.

I *think* he's a good guy at heart, but man...

[freshchris05]

Stress.

[Ton Loc]

No, but a brain the size of a raisin

Same thing he thought when he had 6 kids with six different women - Nothing.

You can't be a good guy and do this. He has little to no sense of responsibility.

[Since71ASooner4Life]

Same thing he thought when he had 6 kids with six different women - Nothing.

You can't be a good guy and do this. He has little to no sense of responsibility.

I don't think he's a bad guy with ill intent toward others, just as you said no sense of responsibility. His interviews lead me to conclude he's not the sharpest tool in the shed either, and together that doesn't make for such a remarkable human being. If he wasn't the guy in the OU uniform, I'm hard pressed to believe anyone would have much positive to say about him. I can feel compassion for him coming from a broken home with a lot of turmoil around him in his early life - no doubt has a lot to do with who he is today. But the same can be said for many people - it's just an explanation of why it is as it is, but it doesn't make it OK, and his OU history doesn't give him any Mulligans on the scale of being judged for human decency

[EatLeadCommie]

Plea deal in the works... http://fantasynews.cbssports.com/fantasyfootball/update/24783504/report-peterson-will-reach-agreement-tuesday-in-child-abuse-case

[stoops the eternal pimp]

Boy, that'll teach him!

[dwarthog]

This should get him out of Minnesota. Hopefully to a good team.

[badger]

I dunno if he'll be eligible to play this year, but with the remote possibility, I have quietly added him to my fantasy team...'s bench. If he gets suspended the rest of the season injured, whatever, I can just drop him again, no big deal.

But, if there's a remote chance that AD returns... he is going to run like a mad man.

:D Plus, that would make my team's two running backs AD and Demarco. :D

[stoops the eternal pimp]

I feel sorry for AD. The guy keeps stepping in his own ****.

I *think* he's a good guy at heart, but man...

I did feel this way when it started but my thinking has changed.

[Eielson]

I did feel this way when it started but my thinking has changed.

What makes you think that? Some things he's done has made me question his intelligence, but let's be honest, that's always been questionable (at best).

[badger]

Suspended till at least April 15 without pay. (http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/ousportsextra/adrian-peterson-suspended-for-at-least-the-remainder-of-/article_5637ef12-083a-5f6e-9827-fb5c6a556ea7.html)

NFLPA and Adrian both appealing.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Suspended till at least April 15 without pay. (http://www.tulsaworld.com/sportsextra/ousportsextra/adrian-peterson-suspended-for-at-least-the-remainder-of-/article_5637ef12-083a-5f6e-9827-fb5c6a556ea7.html)

NFLPA and Adrian both appealing.

Here is why this is stupid: the baby mamas.

After the department down there illegally released the photos of Adrian's son and it became a national story, the mama came out of the woodwork to say she didn't want him to be suspended, never intended for him to be in trouble with the NFL, etc.

Basically, she realized her gravy train check was in jeopardy. So, here's the question: If the baby mamas of the NFL now see that the gravy train can be cut off or halted if these incidents go public, will it prevent them from coming forward in future domestic abuse situations. My guess is, it probably is already that way.

Baby mama, Adrian behind on child support: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2465031/Mother-Adrian-Petersons-son-sued-52k-unpaid-child-support.html

Baby mama, Adrian's child who died last year: http://larrybrownsports.com/football/adrian-peterson-seven-kids-baby-mamas-stripper-erica-syion/207440

Adrian won't be making $12 million a year forever, and he's got a lot of little hungry mouths to feed...in the ghetto, as Mac Davis or Elvis Presley would sing.

Stupid. Adrian. The League. The baby mamas. All stupid, all the time.

(Adrian better hope he has a more honest uncle managing his money than Vince Young had.)

[BoulderSooner79]

Goodell stating that AD showed no remorse in his statements. Lesson: Say what your lawyer tells you to say, not whatever is really on your mind.

[badger]

Stupid. Adrian. The League. The baby mamas. All stupid, all the time.

(Adrian better hope he has a more honest uncle managing his money than Vince Young had.)

It really makes it difficult to consistently discipline your children if you're not around most (if not all) of the time, which is the situation when you have multiple kids with multiple mommies, in addition to be a pro football player on the road for half the year.

I do not know who Adrian's money manager is, but it was reported that he turned down a vast majority of endorsement deal opportunities and just seemed to have a few national ones. This and all else suggests to me that Adrian listens to Adrian more than anyone else, not iffy (or sound) advisers.

Sadly, Adrian probably could have used other's help in situations like this.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Sadly, he's not the only one.

Here's another overarching problem: education.

These guys get their education paid for, but are shuttled into crap degree programs where they learn nothing valuable for three to five years, and then are cut loose to the real world.

And, again, that is why it is always laughable that some school's fans brag about their academics. They know full well the entrance standards are lowered for many athletes; and, that the degree programs the athletes are shuttled to are complete garbage.

So, Vince Young, Adrian Peterson, (fill in the blank with the name of most any superstar football player) are as stupid when they leave college as they were when they entered it. But, worse, they are then surrounded by hangers on and leeches who help them flush their finances down the drain.

Stupid.

[EatLeadCommie]

Sadly, he's not the only one.

Here's another overarching problem: education.

These guys get their education paid for, but are shuttled into crap degree programs where they learn nothing valuable for three to five years, and then are cut loose to the real world.

And, again, that is why it is always laughable that some school's fans brag about their academics. They know full well the entrance standards are lowered for many athletes; and, that the degree programs the athletes are shuttled to are complete garbage.

So, Vince Young, Adrian Peterson, (fill in the blank with the name of most any superstar football player) are as stupid when they leave college as they were when they entered it. But, worse, they are then surrounded by hangers on and leeches who help them flush their finances down the drain.

Stupid.

Fair point, but what college degree is helpful in the real world? Even studying business, law, medicine, or teaching is only going to get you set up for those occupations upon furthering your education to the graduate level. I went to a really good school, and the best class I ever had at either the college or high school level was typing in high school. What college gave me was 4 years to grow up and mold my thinking around other folks my same age who had the same issues. It got me out of the shell that so many of us have when growing up within our family units or small towns. But still, most of what we knew that made us the people we are today was in place before we took off for college. They shouldn't be signing up for joke classes, but college is what you make of it. And college athletes, particularly big time college athletes, are going to tend to stay with the same type of friends (in this case, football players) that they hung out with their 4 years in HS and growing up. That is going to mold their behavior more than what their major is.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Fair point, but what college degree is helpful in the real world? Even studying business, law, medicine, or teaching is only going to get you set up for those occupations upon furthering your education to the graduate level. I went to a really good school, and the best class I ever had at either the college or high school level was typing in high school. What college gave me was 4 years to grow up and mold my thinking around other folks my same age who had the same issues. It got me out of the shell that so many of us have when growing up within our family units or small towns. But still, most of what we knew that made us the people we are today was in place before we took off for college. They shouldn't be signing up for joke classes, but college is what you make of it. And college athletes, particularly big time college athletes, are going to tend to stay with the same type of friends (in this case, football players) that they hung out with their 4 years in HS and growing up. That is going to mold their behavior more than what their major is.

There are too many stupid things in there to untangle them all. The reason for college is to learn, not stay the same as you were in high school because of your friends.

These kids are getting out of college with worthless degrees in trade for their play. They are ignorant financially because they have wasted their time in African American studies, Communications, Sociology, and the full range of "Recreation/Kinesiology" degree programs.

With Adrian, it's already happening with the one stripper baby mama having to take him to court for child support payments last year. He's not even out of his NFL career yet, and he already cannot keep a grasp on where the money is going.

[EatLeadCommie]

There are too many stupid things in there to untangle them all. The reason for college is to learn, not stay the same as you were in high school because of your friends.

These kids are getting out of college with worthless degrees in trade for their play. They are ignorant financially because they have wasted their time in African American studies, Communications, Sociology, and the full range of "Recreation/Kinesiology" degree programs.

With Adrian, it's already happening with the one stripper baby mama having to take him to court for child support payments last year. He's not even out of his NFL career yet, and he already cannot keep a grasp on where the money is going.

Fine. Then if the reason is to learn, then how does one learn if they don't get a degree that relates to their job skill, which in this case is NFL Player. If they get a degree in business for after their NFL career is over, how much of that are they going to retain while making tackles in the NFL and not applying that knowledge? No, they shouldn't just major in basket weaving, but the amount of degrees available that are going to have a practical application outside of football is highly limited. What good is a history or political science degree outside of the teaching profession? The value of such degrees is decreasing, and really only looks nice-- or nicer than the degrees you listed-- on a resume. In terms of actual practical learning value, there is very little. You're likely to learn more practical information during bong-fueled discussions with friends in college than you are in the classroom.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Fine. Then if the reason is to learn, then how does one learn if they don't get a degree that relates to their job skill, which in this case is NFL Player. If they get a degree in business for after their NFL career is over, how much of that are they going to retain while making tackles in the NFL and not applying that knowledge? No, they shouldn't just major in basket weaving, but the amount of degrees available that are going to have a practical application outside of football is highly limited. What good is a history or political science degree outside of the teaching profession? The value of such degrees is decreasing, and really only looks nice-- or nicer than the degrees you listed-- on a resume. In terms of actual practical learning value, there is very little. You're likely to learn more practical information during bong-fueled discussions with friends in college than you are in the classroom.

A business degree would be the most valuable asset they could have going into an NFL career. The ability to do cash flow statements, understand the time value of money, the 4 Ps, and supply and demand is crazy powerful when you have the kind of cash infusion and brand creation opportunities that they are going to get when they enter into the NFL. Heck, look at Peterson turning down endorsement deals. Had he taken finance and marketing and learned about concepts like "Opportunity Cost and Price Elasticity of Demand" he would have realized that you need to leverage those opportunities today because tomorrow they probably won't be there.

[jkjsooner]

Goodell stating that AD showed no remorse in his statements. Lesson: Say what your lawyer tells you to say, not whatever is really on your mind.


Peterson showed "no meaningful remorse" and publicly said he would not "eliminate whooping my kids."

As anyone who has been on the Obama board knows, I'm more liberal than conservative but I have a problem with Goodell making a judgement on Peterson based on his refusal to abandon a perfectly acceptable form of discipline. (Whooping in general not what Peterson did.)

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

As anyone who has been on the Obama board knows, I'm more liberal than conservative but I have a problem with Goodell making a judgement on Peterson based on his refusal to abandon a perfectly acceptable form of discipline. (Whooping in general not what Peterson did.)

He made the judgement because it is easily consumed by the media NOW. When it gets overturned later in the appeal by the NFL Players Union, it will be back page news. Politics at its finest.

[EatLeadCommie]

A business degree would be the most valuable asset they could have going into an NFL career. The ability to do cash flow statements, understand the time value of money, the 4 Ps, and supply and demand is crazy powerful when you have the kind of cash infusion and brand creation opportunities that they are going to get when they enter into the NFL. Heck, look at Peterson turning down endorsement deals. Had he taken finance and marketing and learned about concepts like "Opportunity Cost and Price Elasticity of Demand" he would have realized that you need to leverage those opportunities today because tomorrow they probably won't be there.

And how many star football players do you think are capable of grasping such intricacies? The Boz was an exception to the rule.

[cvsooner]

And how many star football players do you think are capable of grasping such intricacies? The Boz was an exception to the rule.

I'm not too worried about Sam Bradford's financial future either. Doesn't he have a business degree, or finance or something?

[jkjsooner]

Fine. Then if the reason is to learn, then how does one learn if they don't get a degree that relates to their job skill, which in this case is NFL Player. If they get a degree in business for after their NFL career is over, how much of that are they going to retain while making tackles in the NFL and not applying that knowledge? No, they shouldn't just major in basket weaving, but the amount of degrees available that are going to have a practical application outside of football is highly limited. What good is a history or political science degree outside of the teaching profession? The value of such degrees is decreasing, and really only looks nice-- or nicer than the degrees you listed-- on a resume. In terms of actual practical learning value, there is very little. You're likely to learn more practical information during bong-fueled discussions with friends in college than you are in the classroom.

I would say a business degree is certainly applicable not only after the NFL but during their playing days. I don't have a business/finance/economics degree but I walked away from engineering with a strong sense of the the value of money, the time value of money, and how exponential growth can work for or against you.

Someone who knows he's going to be making millions could certainly learn a lot more and pick some type of business degree. It doesn't take a lot to know whether or not your financial adviser is screwing you over.

[jkjsooner]

Heck, look at Peterson turning down endorsement deals. Had he taken finance and marketing and learned about concepts like "Opportunity Cost and Price Elasticity of Demand" he would have realized that you need to leverage those opportunities today because tomorrow they probably won't be there.

I don't know the specifics of these deals he turned down but there is more than just money. Maybe he didn't want to spend all of his time pimping for 100 different companies. Maybe some of the deals would not have been good for his reputation.

And, frankly, I'm sure if you start signing too many deals the value of your endorsement may be compromised.

[BoulderSooner79]

A business degree would be the most valuable asset they could have going into an NFL career. The ability to do cash flow statements, understand the time value of money, the 4 Ps, and supply and demand is crazy powerful when you have the kind of cash infusion and brand creation opportunities that they are going to get when they enter into the NFL. Heck, look at Peterson turning down endorsement deals. Had he taken finance and marketing and learned about concepts like "Opportunity Cost and Price Elasticity of Demand" he would have realized that you need to leverage those opportunities today because tomorrow they probably won't be there.

Keep in mind that the great majority of these players will never make it to the NFL or will have a very brief visit that will not sustain them for long. A business degree is valuable for just about anyone. But there are also many players that are not college material and are only there because football allows them to be there. If they could just be taught how to keep budget and some general wealth management principals to go along with their basket weaving skills, it would come in handy.

[cvsooner]

Keep in mind that the great majority of these players will never make it to the NFL or will have a very brief visit that will not sustain them for long. A business degree is valuable for just about anyone. But there are also many players that are not college material and are only there because football allows them to be there. If they could just be taught how to keep budget and some general wealth management principals to go along with their basket weaving skills, it would come in handy.

Not principals, but principles. Contrary to some on this board, a communications degree from OU can be pretty helpful. :welcoming:

[BoulderSooner79]

Not principals, but principles. Contrary to some on this board, a communications degree from OU can be pretty helpful. :welcoming:

I agree and I disagree that all those "easy" degrees are worthless in general. Sociology is certainly applicable to many professions. But I do agree that many of the high profile athletes taking them are not taking them seriously - just a ticket to get onto the field/court.

[cvsooner]

I agree and I disagree that all those "easy" degrees are worthless in general. Sociology is certainly applicable to many professions. But I do agree that many of the high profile athletes taking them are not taking them seriously - just a ticket to get onto the field/court.

That's really the issue, isn't it? It's not so much the degree, as much as a. how much of the course material do you really learn, and b. what the heck do you do with it?

[Tear Down This Wall]

Fine. Then if the reason is to learn, then how does one learn if they don't get a degree that relates to their job skill, which in this case is NFL Player. If they get a degree in business for after their NFL career is over, how much of that are they going to retain while making tackles in the NFL and not applying that knowledge? No, they shouldn't just major in basket weaving, but the amount of degrees available that are going to have a practical application outside of football is highly limited. What good is a history or political science degree outside of the teaching profession? The value of such degrees is decreasing, and really only looks nice-- or nicer than the degrees you listed-- on a resume. In terms of actual practical learning value, there is very little. You're likely to learn more practical information during bong-fueled discussions with friends in college than you are in the classroom.

I agree that History and Poli Sci degrees are a huge waste of time. I know this from experience - I minored in Poli Sci back when I was young and naive enough to believe in politicians and political parties.

The value of the degree is decreasing because the vast majority of them are worthless in the real world. I think 50% or more of college students today would be better off just getting a job and an associates degree in business, especially finance or accounting.

Consider this, college students are required to take courses their first two years that, supposedly, make them "more well rounded." It's utter and complete bullsh*t, of course. I have not, in 21 years of business ever had to quote Shakespeare, regurgitate the Pythagorean theorem, or dissect a cat.

What colleges and universities need to do is be realistic about the world we live in - The 21st Century.

Skill sets needed today are vastly different than they were in the past century. And, now, more than ever, kids need to real life skills.

If I were designing a college curriculum, I would stop the nonsense of:

-English requirements: though this pains me to say because one on my degrees is in Literature, except for grammar and writing, which are still essential business skill.
-History/Government requirements: you learn state, national, world history and government concepts in junior high and high school. This is repetitive.
-Biology/Chemistry/Physics: so few people use these on a daily basis that these studies are simply (1) a repetition of junior high and high school courses which have already provided the basics of those subjects, and, therefore, (2) two a huge waste of time and money for those who are not entering major fields of study that require them.
-Any, any, any Art/Music requirement: I personally love to visit museums, enjoy going to the ballet, liked the Boradway production of Cats!, played the piano as a child, and continue to play the guitar today...HOWEVER, none of those things pay the bills or are in any way related to my every day life in business.

[Tear Down This Wall]

Those subject - English beyond grammar and writing, History/Government, Biology/Chemistry/Physics, and Arts - should be electives for any student who wants to take them, but not requirements.

Requirements should take more the shape of the world:
-Budgeting concepts: which everyone should do to keep from going into debt.
-Credit and financing concepts: something everyone will do if they ever purchase a car or buy a house...or, buy a business.
-Contracting concepts: at some point or another, everyone will sign some sort of contract; and, the vast majority will not understands any of what they sign, large print or small.

I do think Psychology is essential because you have to deal with your fellow man, and needs to be able to spot the psychopaths along life's long and winding road.

I think these concepts can be taught, along with whatever major area of study is chosen, in three years as well, instead of four. I think all college degrees have at least a year's worth of useless crap packed into them.

So, again, I say, a kid working and earning an associates degree or going to vocational school and learning a trade is every bit as valuable in the marketplace these days as some kids who sat through all of the pointless bullsh*t you sit through your first two years of school...and, for some degree plans, a complete waste of four years.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

-History/Government requirements: you learn state, national, world history and government concepts in junior high and high school. This is repetitive.
-Biology/Chemistry/Physics: so few people use these on a daily basis that these studies are simply (1) a repetition of junior high and high school courses which have already provided the basics of those subjects, and, therefore, (2) two a huge waste of time and money for those who are not entering major fields of study that require them.


From my experience:

History is useful since most college courses don't go the whitewashed politically correct route. I took 2 history classes (colonial american and colonial latin american) that went into vivid detail about the brutality that happened on a daily basis. Most high school textbooks made it sound like they were sitting around campfires roasting smores.

Botany is by far the most useful science class I ever took in college. You'll use that class on your yard for the rest of your life.

Chemistry/Physics/Engin Math -> All of these are classes that teach you how to apply math. The biggest advantage to them is understanding the chaining logic for complicated programming in Excel (which is the most useful program around for 99% of the people in the world). You can use Excel for pretty much anything from complicated crafting in MMOs to determining resistance points for stocks.

Classes that I would advocate everyone take -> Speech, Listening, Statistics, Botany, Networking, Spreadsheets and Databases, a Foreign Language, IO Economics, Organizational Behavior, Logic, Sociology, and whatever the psychology class that is about human interaction.