Can we legally fight ISIS?

[jkjsooner]

That question was somewhat tongue-in-cheek. The reason I ask it is that some on here have had a hissy fit because we killed an Al Qaeda leader who happened to be a US Citizen.

Now if we happen to be fighting ISIS and we suspect there may be a US citizen in a truck we're about to bomb, do we have to hold back and attempt to arrest them and make sure they get due process?

I imagine some of you will say it's different because we targeted that one guy. I don't see the difference. Once you join our enemy in an active military conflict you are an enemy combatant and should no longer be given protections as a US citizen. Seems pretty simple to me.

[SoonerorLater]

This is one I having been harping about for a long while. This is something that needs to be addressed by Congress (good luck to us all with that) As is, we are geared around fighting sovereign nations not the non-state sanctioned enemies we face today. We may well need to redefine what war is or define conflict on a tiered system.

[Soonerjeepman]

I agree with jk, they've renounced their citizenship as soon at they joined the other group.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

I agree with jk, they've renounced their citizenship as soon at they joined the other group.

How do we know that? Its not like they are lining up to denounce citizenship and then become affiliated with a non-state entity. This is just odd legally. We have mechanism to declare war on states, not ideological constructs. I am sure the government legal minds are working on this, but I wonder... Can we go to war in another state, that doesn't have a political entity in disagreement with us, but has uncontrolled territory led by the ideological construct?

[dwarthog]

Are there two scenarios in play here?

Drone attacks specifically targeting an American citizen walking down the street so to speak vs American citizens actively engaged in a battle?

[FaninAma]

Yes we can. Especially if Congress authorizes it. Your example of the hit on the US citizen via drone strike is a straw man. The opposition to that was based on the fact it was a star chamber order by the POTUS made unilaterally without any input from the legislative or judicial branches. It sets a dangerous precedent and allows the President to have incredible power over life and death of US citizens. You do know he killed al-Alaqui's 17 year old son in a SEPARATE attack don't you?

[dwarthog]

I'll ask it this way. Are there two different classifications here.

One of a "shoot on sight" terrorist which is ostentsibly the grouping where al-Alaqui fell, and subsequently his son by association since he was with other members of this grouping two weeks later when he got hit vs a different designation which covers the field of combat or are all cases covered under the terrorist classification umbrella?

[rock on sooner]

IMO, if they sign up to train/fight, especially in a foreign country, then
they are fair game. That kid from Minnesota that was killed in a firefight
between ISIS and Al Queda signed up. It is no different in my mind who
he is fighting he is a combatant. Besides, he had a US passport and can
travel to Europe or here...so, it appears to me that there is a clear and
present danger to the Homeland, when US passport holders can sign up
to train and then come back to the US to do who knows what....jus sayin..

[olevetonahill]

If they wanta join the Mooslum arseholes then Kill em all and let God figure it out if he wants to.

[jkjsooner]

Dang. My thread turned into a really good discussion. Might be a first for me. ;)

[BoulderSooner79]

Dang. My thread turned into a really good discussion. Might be a first for me. ;)

Not so fast - I haven't piped in. I doubt you would get many folks to say we should try to pick out US citizens and arrest them while trying to kill the pack of terrorist they are fighting with. Maybe we find their smoking passport after the fact and say "oops".

But I do think the issue could come up for real on US soil. Think of a wanted terrorist spotted by police drone. He's driving a rental truck that was seen at a fertilizer plant. Arrest him or take him out?

[FaninAma]

I have a problem with one individual or government agency being judge, jury and executioner in regards to accused US citizens.

[yermom]

If they are literally fighting that is one thing

Just assassinating people with no trial seems a road we shouldn't go down

[olevetonahill]

If they are literally fighting that is one thing

Just assassinating people with no trial seems a road we shouldn't go down

Kinda agree Bro. But lets throw in that IF they are Helping to Plan and carry out attacks then that be same as Fighting.

[rock on sooner]

I have a problem with one individual or government agency being judge, jury and executioner in regards to accused US citizens.

Welp, if these folks declare themselves to be jihadists, freely and openly,
it seems to me that they have turned their collective backs on the US of A.
In which case, then, ummm, lessee, drones, Seal Team Six, JSOG, F-18's,
U-2's snooping around, fire control at CentCom, cruise missiles locked in
from battle groups and various and sundry a$$ kickin' stuff that ISIS have
not even dreamed about, should rain down and, IMO, NO FRIGGIN' EXCUSES,
mess the bull and get the horn...turn that desert to glass...but, that's JMO...

[rock on sooner]

Welp, if these folks declare themselves to be jihadists, freely and openly,
it seems to me that they have turned their collective backs on the US of A.
In which case, then, ummm, lessee, drones, Seal Team Six, JSOG, F-18's,
U-2's snooping around, fire control at CentCom, cruise missiles locked in
from battle groups and various and sundry a$$ kickin' stuff that ISIS have
not even dreamed about, should rain down and, IMO, NO FRIGGIN' EXCUSES,
mess the bull and get the horn...turn that desert to glass...but, that's JMO...

And, no, my name is NOT McCain or Graham....

[olevetonahill]

And, no, my name is NOT McCain or Graham....

I stole yer password LOL

[rock on sooner]

I stole yer password LOL

Normally, I'm pragmatic and measured in my approach, but, ima jus
sayin, those sob's are fair game!

[Soonerjeepman]

Welp, if these folks declare themselves to be jihadists, freely and openly,
it seems to me that they have turned their collective backs on the US of A.
In which case, then, ummm, lessee, drones, Seal Team Six, JSOG, F-18's,
U-2's snooping around, fire control at CentCom, cruise missiles locked in
from battle groups and various and sundry a$$ kickin' stuff that ISIS have
not even dreamed about, should rain down and, IMO, NO FRIGGIN' EXCUSES,
mess the bull and get the horn...turn that desert to glass...but, that's JMO...
yup

[olevetonahill]

Normally, I'm pragmatic and measured in my approach, but, ima jus
sayin, those sob's are fair game!

I kinda agree bro. Some one who travels to a foreign country breaking the law in the process, to fight for those kind of animals are putting their lives on the line and deserve what they get.

I wouldnt have a Prob if one of em was here and Planning a Bombing of dropping a HellFire in their back pocket. I understand the Fine line of some ******* just sayin they think the Jihadist is going to do something so lets kill him.

It should have some very strict oversight to the Process.