Is Obama The Worst Crony Capitalist In DC?

[FaninAma]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/07/29/documents-show-white-house-intervened-on-obamacare-bailout/

It appears so. Guaranteeing Big Insurance big profits at the expense of the tax payers.

[Sooner8th]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/07/29/documents-show-white-house-intervened-on-obamacare-bailout/

It appears so. Guaranteeing Big Insurance big profits at the expense of the tax payers.

So what happened to fox calling him a socialist? They and you can't seem to keep your insults straight.

[REDREX]

Just another part of the big Obamacare lie that was sold-----Why does this surprise anyone

[Sooner8th]

Just another part of the big Obamacare lie that was sold-----Why does this surprise anyone

Even the republicans used words like could and potentially, but you guys just ran to your front closet and got your pickforks and torches out and took to the streets.

https://feefawfum.files.wordpress.com/2012/10/frankenstein-mob.jpg

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/07/29/documents-show-white-house-intervened-on-obamacare-bailout/

It appears so. Guaranteeing Big Insurance big profits at the expense of the tax payers.He's just proving his genius rating in economics.

[FaninAma]

So what happened to fox calling him a socialist? They and you can't seem to keep your insults straight.

Not inconsistent at all. Some of the world's biggest socialists are also some of the world's biggest crony capitalists. See Putin and his oligarchy of Russian billionaires. China is the same. Hitler was a huge socialist and a huge crony capitalist. The term for that style of government is corporate fascism.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Not inconsistent at all. Some of the world's biggest socialists are also some of the world's biggest crony capitalists. See Putin and his oligarchy of Russian billionaires. China is the same. Hitler was a huge socialist and a huge crony capitalist. The term for that style of government is corporate fascism.Fascism and Socialism are alike in that they need authoritarian government to perform their objectionable and unfair acts.

[FaninAma]

Fascism and Socialism are alike in that they need authoritarian government to perform their objectionable and unfair acts.

Exactly. But there is always a favored small oligarchic class that becomes very wealthy at the expense of the tax payers and peasants like us.

Sooner8th is so blinded by his partisan vitriol and dislike of small-government conservatives that he fails to see that big-government socialistic policies enable a massive wealth transfer from the middle class to the favored corporations via crony capitalism. It amazes me how the left fails to see that the biggest beneficiaries from massive government spending are the large banks and large corporations. The base of the GOP is at least starting to wake up and see what organizations like the national Chamber of Commerce are really all about.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Exactly. But there is always a favored small oligarchic class that becomes very wealthy at the expense of the tax payers and peasants like us.

Sooner8th is so blinded by his partisan vitriol and dislike of small-government conservatives that he fails to see that big-government socialistic policies enable a massive wealth transfer from the middle class to the favored corporations via crony capitalism. It amazes me how the left fails to see that the biggest beneficiaries from massive government spending are the large banks and large corporations. The base of the GOP is at least starting to wake up and see what organizations like the national Chamber of Commerce are really all about.There are so many similarities between socialism and fascism/crony capitalism, especially the need for out of control, outlaw authoritarian government, to take effect.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

The Media and their like minded help in academia and entertainment have got conservatives so beaten down and scared sh*tless that they are afraid to defend themselves against baseless and intentionally misleading attacks. The democrats own and control the country now.

[Sooner8th]

Not inconsistent at all. Some of the world's biggest socialists are also some of the world's biggest crony capitalists. See Putin and his oligarchy of Russian billionaires. China is the same. Hitler was a huge socialist and a huge crony capitalist. The term for that style of government is corporate fascism.

Hitler was a huge socialist? Just because the word socialist was in the party name? This is proof how ignorant you are. Hitler was a FASCIST. Claiming hitler was a socialist totally destroys what little credibility you had.

[Sooner8th]

Exactly. But there is always a favored small oligarchic class that becomes very wealthy at the expense of the tax payers and peasants like us.

Sooner8th is so blinded by his partisan vitriol and dislike of small-government conservatives that he fails to see that big-government socialistic policies enable a massive wealth transfer from the middle class to the favored corporations via crony capitalism. It amazes me how the left fails to see that the biggest beneficiaries from massive government spending are the large banks and large corporations. The base of the GOP is at least starting to wake up and see what organizations like the national Chamber of Commerce are really all about.


HAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA TOO ****ING FUNNY!!!

Your dumbass doesn't even know who completely owns the chamber of commerce! c of c is doing their bidding for them. I don't dislike "small-government conservatives" it's that you people are ignorant and stupid lemmings who jumped on board with something you don't understand. Then when anyone calls you out on the lies you guys buy into hook line and sinker you all get all belligerent and call me names and say i'm blowing obama. No facts or data can show you how you are wrong.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Such Theater! BRAVISIMO, 8th!

[dwarthog]

8th = Turing test, albeit a bad one....

[Sooner8th]

8th = Turing test, albeit a bad one....

You guys don't even know the basic differences between socialism and fascism and you are just embarrassing yourselves and you don't even know it.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

You guys don't even know the basic differences between socialism and fascism and you are just embarrassing yourselves and you don't even know it.You could give us your definitions of both, in order to allow us to enter the enlightened world.

[FaninAma]

Hitler was a huge socialist? Just because the word socialist was in the party name? This is proof how ignorant you are. Hitler was a FASCIST. Claiming hitler was a socialist totally destroys what little credibility you had.

Whatever you say Bob!
http://www2.lawrence.edu/sorg/OBJECTIVISM/SOCFASC.HTML


The reason for which the Social Democrats were so passive was not a mere inability to practice their principles consistently. It was, instead, a matter of the logical import of their principles. As Dr. Peikoff notes: "The republicans in every political party and group were in the same position: more and more, the contradictions involved in their views were leaving these men lifeless, and even speechless. They could hardly praise freedom very eloquently, not while they themselves, like everyone else, were insisting on further statist measures to cope with the economic crisis" (222-223).
To the extent that any of these political groups did clash in Weimar Germany, the clashes were not over matters of principle. They were of the variety of conflict seen most often in inner city America, where rival gangs fight over turf, over such trivial difference as the color of clothing worn by the other gang. In the end, whoever happens to win is a pointless consideration. The result is the same: blood in the streets.
As for the conflict between the Nazis and the USSR, one need only recall the Hitler-Stalin pact of 1937, in which the two powers agreed to divide up Eastern Europe together. Hitler and Stalin apparently had no problem in principle with working together to exterminate freedom in peaceful nations.
In case anyone still doubts the fact that there was no difference in princple between the fascists and the socialists, consider the following revealing quotations from various infamous Nazis and other fascists:

We ask that the government undertake the obligation above all of providing citizens with adequate opportunities for employment and earning a living.
The activities of the individual must not be allowed to clash with the interests of the community, but must take place within its confines and for the good of all. Therefore, we demand:...an end to the power of the financial interests.
We demand profit sharing in big business.
We demand a broad extension of care for the aged.
We demand...the greatest possible consideration of small business in the purchases of the national, state and municipal governments.
In order to make possible to every capable and industrious [citizen] the attainment of higher education and thus the achievement of a post of leadership, the government must provide an all-around enlargement of our entire system of public education...We demand the education at government expense of gifted children of poor parents...
The government must undertake the improvement of public health -- by the greatest possible support for all clubs concerned with the physical education of youth.
[We] combat the...materialistic spirit withn and without us, and are convinced that a permanent recovery of our people can only proceed from within on the foundation of The Common Good Before the Individual Good .
(Nazi party platform adopted at Munich, February 24, 1920;Der Nationalsozialismus Dokumente 1933-1945, edited by Walther Hofer, Frankfurt am Main: Fischer Bucherei, 1957, pp. 29-31).
It is thus necessary that the individual should finally come to realize that his own ego is of no importance in comparison with the existence of his nation; that the position of the individual ego is conditioned solely by the interests of the nation as a whole...that above all the unity of a nation's spirit and will are worth far more than the freedom of the spirit and will of an individual....This state of mind, which subordinates the interests of the ego to the conservation of the community, is really the first premise for every truly human culture....The basic attitude form which such activity arises, we call -- to distinguish it from egoism and selfishness -- idealism. By this we understand only the individual's capacity to make sacrifices for the community, for his fellow men.
(Adolf Hitler speaking at Bueckeburg, Oct. 7, 1933; The Speeches of Adolf Hitler, 1922-39, ed. N.H. Baynes (2 vols., Oxford, 1942), I, 871-72; translation Professor George Reisman.)

[dwarthog]

You guys don't even know the basic differences between socialism and fascism and you are just embarrassing yourselves and you don't even know it.


Yep, a very bad attempt at a turing test...

[Sooner8th]

Whatever you say Bob!
http://www2.lawrence.edu/sorg/OBJECTIVISM/SOCFASC.HTML

[/B]
[/INDENT]

Still a fascist. You just don't get it.

[Sooner8th]

You could give us your definitions of both, in order to allow us to enter the enlightened world.

You asked for it.....so here it is.

socialism and fascism are very similar, but there are key differences. The primary one is private ownership. In socialism there is none, it all belongs to the state and the government dictates with is produced at all times. In fascism there is private ownership. But the government can dictate what they produce - which doesn't mean they do at all times. See Nazi Germany - fascist and USSR - socialist. Fascists are ultra nationalists, socialists are not.

fascism: "A governmental system with strong centralized power, permitting no opposition or criticism, controlling all affairs of the nation (industrial, commercial, etc.)" (American College Dictionary, New York: Random House, 1957)

socialism: "a theory or system of social organization which advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means or production, capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole" (American College Dictionary)

Now you can't vacillate between calling obama a socialist and a fascist. You just pick the one that fits the argument of the day. One day he is a socailist then when it is convenient his is a "crony" capitalist. Make up your mind which he is.

[FaninAma]

You asked for it.....so here it is.

socialism and fascism are very similar, but there are key differences. The primary one is private ownership. In socialism there is none, it all belongs to the state and the government dictates with is produced at all times. In fascism there is private ownership. But the government can dictate what they produce - which doesn't mean they do at all times. See Nazi Germany - fascist and USSR - socialist. Fascists are ultra nationalists, socialists are not.

fascism: "A governmental system with strong centralized power, permitting no opposition or criticism, controlling all affairs of the nation (industrial, commercial, etc.)" (American College Dictionary, New York: Random House, 1957)

socialism: "a theory or system of social organization which advocates the vesting of the ownership and control of the means or production, capital, land, etc., in the community as a whole" (American College Dictionary)

Now you can't vacillate between calling obama a socialist and a fascist. You just pick the one that fits the argument of the day. One day he is a socialist then when it is convenient his is a "crony" capitalist. Make up your mind which he is.

I think that there are significant areas of overlap between the 2 political philosophies. Sure there were privately held corporations in Germany under the Nazis but they were told what they were going to produce in accordance with the goals and plans of the government in return they could keep some of the profit. Surely you don't deny that the Nazis held many of the same core principles that the socialists of the time did (as outlined in the essay I provided)?

Do most of the countries in the European Union operate under a socialist philosophy or a capitalist philosophy?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

In your referenced definition of socialism, you are calling government ownership of economic means "the community as a whole", instead of what it is, government ownership. This definition ignores or refutes the reality that means of production in socialism is owned by the government. It also ignores the possibility that a socialist country or entity can wield power in the same way that a fascist state can do.

So, should a socialist state admit they control means of production, at least in their economies that are socialist, and would they have a military or police, as would a fascist state?

[Soonerjeepman]

okay,
so 8th....you say you are from Ks...where? just curious. Trying to figure your angle out...you jump up and just defend all of obama's bull$hit.

What do you do for a living as well? if ya don't care to answer I really don't GAS just curious.

[TAFBSooner]

Not inconsistent at all. Some of the world's biggest socialists are also some of the world's biggest crony capitalists. See Putin and his oligarchy of Russian billionaires. China is the same. Hitler was a huge socialist and a huge crony capitalist. The term for that style of government is corporate fascism.

OK, look at Putin. I think Russia today is a pretty good example of fascism. The government owns a large part of the means of production, but by no means all, and the govt ownership is concentrated in a few industries, obviously oil and gas production. They are certainly nationalist, and totalitarian.

Other than the fact their leaders all grew up in the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics, defend the idea that Russia is socialist.

Also, you threw in crony capitalism. How do you relate that to socialism vs fascism? Not attacking, just curious.

[Sooner8th]

I think that there are significant areas of overlap between the 2 political philosophies. Sure there were privately held corporations in Germany under the Nazis but they were told what they were going to produce in accordance with the goals and plans of the government in return they could keep some of the profit. Surely you don't deny that the Nazis held many of the same core principles that the socialists of the time did (as outlined in the essay I provided)?

Do most of the countries in the European Union operate under a socialist philosophy or a capitalist philosophy?

Of course there are significant areas of overlap between the two. This is a good explanation.

Unlike socialism, fascism is not opposed to private ownership of capital, provided that business owners are co-operative and do not resist state control. In fascist economic systems, such as Mussolini’s Italy, economics is considered a partnership between the state and private-owned corporations. Fascism is, however, hostile to unions, contending that workers should put the interests of the state before their own petty needs. Fascism also tends to encourage autarky (economic self sufficiency) rather than foreign trade.


http://alphahistory.com/nazigermany/nazi-economic-recovery/#sthash.hgRQoI8w.dpuf

But the bottom line here is you guys are screaming socialist or fascist about obama depending on what article you read that day, when he is neither.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

8th, if Obear is neither fascist nor socialist to you, what is he?

[Sooner8th]

8th, if Obear is neither fascist nor socialist to you, what is he?

You have been so thoroughly indoctrinated that you think the only two choices you have are fascist nor socialist. He is a CAPITALIST.

dumbass lemming.

Do you not understand the guy who called him a socialist and started this whole thing doesn't think he is? and he works for fox "news".

4% gpd 2nd qrt 218k jobs in july - worlds lousiest socialist/fascist.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

[QUOTE=Sooner8th;4729296] He(Obear) is a CAPITALIST.

dumbass lemming.

QUOTE]why do you waste your time? You are kind of amusing, in a way that really doesn't make much sense. Oh, well. We are here to waste our time and stuff, so, it's as good as anything, I suppose.

[Sooner8th]

okay,
so 8th....you say you are from Ks...where? just curious. Trying to figure your angle out...you jump up and just defend all of obama's bull$hit.

What do you do for a living as well? if ya don't care to answer I really don't GAS just curious.

I am from kansas and we are seeing true fascism here. ANYONE who disagrees with the ultra conservative republican governor, even if you are a high school kid tweeting the rally she was forced to go to for him was boring was forced to WRITE an apology. They, meaning having state employees, check social media and the papers and track to see if anyone who says anything negative about him has any state contracts and if they do, those contracts are lost. Taxpayer money being used to check on taxpayers. We had a surplus now a huge deficit caused by massive tax cuts benefiting the wealth, the kochs no longer pay income taxes in kansas, company or personal.

I work in the private sector, I deal with asset management, which is new to me my background and my career up till now was in finance. I deal with supply and demand every single day at work.

As for defending obama, i really don't, most of the time I am just pointing out your, meaning those on the right, hypocrisy. You guys really don't want to have a rational conversation about him or what is going on, fox "news" calls him a socialist and you guys get into a circle jerk about where he is a socialist or a fascist when he is neither. Then it's worst crony capitalist ever, never once thinking about all of the no bid BILLIONS of dollars of contracts Halliburton got when bush was in office. I point out he is kicking dubya's *** on the economy and you say i'm defending him. You guys just regurgitate talking points then try to morph his behavior to met the talking point.

My angle is this, stopping the blatant lies about what is going on. A great example is the opinion piece on kansas from heritage foundation, when i posted the rebuttal to it, all i got was - you believe some liberal lamestream media "opinion" writer? Where is the facts and data to back it up? Never once asking about the facts and data from the first piece and not realizing the original piece as an option piece too, since it came from the right you guys were just going to buy it cause it backed and reinforced your beliefs. (i'm using you as a generic term to mean all righties)

[dwarthog]

I am from kansas and we are seeing true fascism here. ANYONE who disagrees with the ultra conservative republican governor, even if you are a high school kid tweeting the rally she was forced to go to for him was boring was forced to WRITE an apology. They, meaning having state employees, check social media and the papers and track to see if anyone who says anything negative about him has any state contracts and if they do, those contracts are lost. Taxpayer money being used to check on taxpayers. We had a surplus now a huge deficit caused by massive tax cuts benefiting the wealth, the kochs no longer pay income taxes in kansas, company or personal.

I work in the private sector, I deal with asset management, which is new to me my background and my career up till now was in finance. I deal with supply and demand every single day at work.

As for defending obama, i really don't, most of the time I am just pointing out your, meaning those on the right, hypocrisy. You guys really don't want to have a rational conversation about him or what is going on, fox "news" calls him a socialist and you guys get into a circle jerk about where he is a socialist or a fascist when he is neither. Then it's worst crony capitalist ever, never once thinking about all of the no bid BILLIONS of dollars of contracts Halliburton got when bush was in office. I point out he is kicking dubya's *** on the economy and you say i'm defending him. You guys just regurgitate talking points then try to morph his behavior to met the talking point.

My angle is this, stopping the blatant lies about what is going on. A great example is the opinion piece on kansas from heritage foundation, when i posted the rebuttal to it, all i got was - you believe some liberal lamestream media "opinion" writer? Where is the facts and data to back it up? Never once asking about the facts and data from the first piece and not realizing the original piece as an option piece too, since it came from the right you guys were just going to buy it cause it backed and reinforced your beliefs. (i'm using you as a generic term to mean all righties)

Forced to write an apology huh...

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/11/tweeting-kansas-teen-wont-apologize-to-gov-her-following-soars/

You just can't help yourself can you..

[Sooner8th]

Forced to write an apology huh...

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/11/tweeting-kansas-teen-wont-apologize-to-gov-her-following-soars/

You just can't help yourself can you..

I should have been clearer, they tried. You are over looking the most important point.

An unpleasant tweet by Emma Sullivan, 18, was flagged by Brownback’s staff last week. The teen was told by her principal at Shawnee Mission East High School to apologize, but she refused.

When it came out it was reported the principal was trying to get her to do it in writing.

[Sooner8th]

Forced to write an apology huh...

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2011/11/tweeting-kansas-teen-wont-apologize-to-gov-her-following-soars/

You just can't help yourself can you..

Out of all that - you pulled this out? Nothing about taxpayer money being used to quell descent? Nothing about the kochs no longer paying taxes? Nothing about a surplus to a deficit? Nothing about pay for play? I didn't even mention the open meeting investigation where lobbyists were "invited" to the governors mansion and told point blank by brownbacks staff including giving them a list of the candidates and amounts of campaign contributions or they would not have any influence.

[dwarthog]

Out of all that - you pulled this out? Nothing about taxpayer money being used to quell descent? Nothing about the kochs no longer paying taxes? Nothing about a surplus to a deficit? Nothing about pay for play? I didn't even mention the open meeting investigation where lobbyists were "invited" to the governors mansion and told point blank by brownbacks staff including giving them a list of the candidates and amounts of campaign contributions or they would not have any influence.

Sorry, I just cherry picked the 1st lie....

[FaninAma]

You have been so thoroughly indoctrinated that you think the only two choices you have are fascist nor socialist. He is a CAPITALIST.

dumbass lemming.

Do you not understand the guy who called him a socialist and started this whole thing doesn't think he is? and he works for fox "news".

4% gpd 2nd qrt 218k jobs in july - worlds lousiest socialist/fascist.

What makes you think this? What has he ever done in his life that could be considered a capitalistic endeavor? All he has ever done is drawn a salary from the government and government funded organizations. He has never ran a business. He has never worked for a private company except for the short time he was at a private law firm for which he never even tried a case.

So Obama's approval is at 39%. It is hard to imagine that 39% of the US population are as unwilling to look objectively at Obama's and the Democrat's policies as Sooner8th is. That buy a vote scam the Democrats started in 1965 has paid huge dividends.

[Sooner8th]

Sorry, I just cherry picked the 1st lie....

call it a lie, but they did try to make her apologize.

answer to the rest.

[Sooner8th]

What makes you think this? What has he ever done in his life that could be considered a capitalistic endeavor? All he has ever done is drawn a salary from the government and government funded organizations. He has never ran a business. He has never worked for a private company except for the short time he was at a private law firm for which he never even tried a case.

So Obama's approval is at 39%. It is hard to imagine that 39% of the US population are as unwilling to look objectively at Obama's and the Democrat's policies as Sooner8th is. That buy a vote scam the Democrats started in 1965 has paid huge dividends.

He has never worked for a private company except for the short time he was at a private law firm for which he never even tried a case.

Where do you get this at? I like how the short time at a private law firm doesn't count.

4 years, short time? two years after he got out of college?

Never tried a case?

Obama arrived in Chicago in 1993 with a degree from Harvard Law School and was hired as a junior lawyer at the firm then known as Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Gallard. He helped represent clients in civil and voting rights matters and wrongful firings, argued a case before a federal appellate court, and took the lead in writing a suit to expand voter registration.

But the firm also handled routine legal matters and real estate. Obama spent about 70% of his time on voting rights, civil rights and employment, generally as a junior associate. The rest of his time was spent on matters related to real estate transactions, filing incorporation papers and defending clients against minor lawsuits.

In one instance, Obama defended a nonprofit corporation that owns low-income housing projects against a lawsuit in which a man alleged that he slipped and fell because of poor maintenance. Obama got the suit dismissed.

In another case, Obama appeared on behalf of a nonprofit corporation that provided healthcare for poor people. A woman who claimed income of less than $8,000 a year had sued Obama's client to obtain a $336 payment for baby-sitting services; Obama's client paid up, and the case was settled.

In 1994, Obama appeared in Cook County court on behalf of Woodlawn Preservation & Investment Corp., defending it against a suit by the city, which alleged that the company failed to provide heat for low-income tenants on the South Side during the winter.

I found three cases he tried in seconds.

Is writing and selling books capitalism or socialism?

I'd rather vote for someone who was successful at a law firm and at a not for profit than vote for a total failure in the private sector. You know who i'm talking about......

[dwarthog]

He has never worked for a private company except for the short time he was at a private law firm for which he never even tried a case.

Where do you get this at? I like how the short time at a private law firm doesn't count.

4 years, short time? two years after he got out of college?

Never tried a case?

Obama arrived in Chicago in 1993 with a degree from Harvard Law School and was hired as a junior lawyer at the firm then known as Davis, Miner, Barnhill & Gallard. He helped represent clients in civil and voting rights matters and wrongful firings, argued a case before a federal appellate court, and took the lead in writing a suit to expand voter registration.

But the firm also handled routine legal matters and real estate. Obama spent about 70% of his time on voting rights, civil rights and employment, generally as a junior associate. The rest of his time was spent on matters related to real estate transactions, filing incorporation papers and defending clients against minor lawsuits.

In one instance, Obama defended a nonprofit corporation that owns low-income housing projects against a lawsuit in which a man alleged that he slipped and fell because of poor maintenance. Obama got the suit dismissed.

In another case, Obama appeared on behalf of a nonprofit corporation that provided healthcare for poor people. A woman who claimed income of less than $8,000 a year had sued Obama's client to obtain a $336 payment for baby-sitting services; Obama's client paid up, and the case was settled.

In 1994, Obama appeared in Cook County court on behalf of Woodlawn Preservation & Investment Corp., defending it against a suit by the city, which alleged that the company failed to provide heat for low-income tenants on the South Side during the winter.

I found three cases he tried in seconds.

Is writing and selling books capitalism or socialism?

I'd rather vote for someone who was successful at a law firm and at a not for profit than vote for a total failure in the private sector. You know who i'm talking about......

So, where do you weigh in on voting for pathological liars like Al "I fought these wildfires myself" Gore or John "I didn't really throw my medals over the fence" Kerry"?

[Sooner8th]

So, where do you weigh in on voting for pathological liars like Al "I fought these wildfires myself" Gore or John "I didn't really throw my medals over the fence" Kerry"?


pathological liars? too funny. I DID vote for them! You are going to have to show me - fought these wildfires myself quote. As for kerry - the idiot you voted for who ran against him sure as hell didn't have any medals to do anything with. He earned them he can do with them what he wants.

Those small lies do not affect my life in any way, shape or form. Telling people cuttin' taxes won't cause deficits then changing his tune to it will but only for a couple of years, DOES affect me. I'm sure you voted for him twice.

[dwarthog]

pathological liars? too funny. I DID vote for them! You are going to have to show me - fought these wildfires myself quote. As for kerry - the idiot you voted for who ran against him sure as hell didn't have any medals to do anything with. He earned them he can do with them what he wants.

Those small lies do not affect my life in any way, shape or form. Telling people cuttin' taxes won't cause deficits then changing his tune to it will but only for a couple of years, DOES affect me. I'm sure you voted for him twice.

Al Gore fightin' fires... http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=122765

I don't care what Kerry did or didn't do with his medals. They are his.

At minimum he lied once. Either in 1971 when he said he threw them over or later when he said he didn't.

Point is, both were prepared to say anything to get into office and they pretty much did.

[Sooner8th]

Al Gore fightin' fires... http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/story?id=122765

I don't care what Kerry did or didn't do with his medals. They are his.

At minimum he lied once. Either in 1971 when he said he threw them over or later when he said he didn't.

Point is, both were prepared to say anything to get into office and they pretty much did.

but bush lying didn't bother you?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

OK 8th, some of us will grant you that Bear does capitalism...CRONY CRAPITALISM(fascism)! and, nobody in Washington does it better/more, so the question in the title of the thread IS ANSWERED. It can now be closed.

[Sooner8th]

OK 8th, some of us will grant you that Bear does capitalism...CRONY CRAPITALISM(fascism)! and, nobody in Washington does it better/more, so the question in the title of the thread IS ANSWERED. It can now be closed.

Yep, just keep regurgitating rightwing talking points and let us adults talk in peace.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

2 stupid accusations in one sentence. You're picking up the pace.

[Curly Bill]

Yep, just keep regurgitating rightwing talking points and let us adults talk in peace.

Might be the funniest damn thing you've said!

[olevetonahill]

Might be the funniest damn thing you've said!

Jeff, I wouldnt know, Hell I barely if ever even SKIM over his posts. The dude is just too ****ing stupid.

[Sooner8th]

2 stupid accusations in one sentence. You're picking up the pace.

both true.........well I do seem to be the only adult in here, so maybe you have a point.

[Curly Bill]

both true.........well I do seem to be the only adult in here, so maybe you have a point.

You're one hell of a troll; I'll give ya that!

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

You're one hell of a troll; I'll give ya that!What's in it for being a hell of a troll?

[Curly Bill]

What's in it for being a hell of a troll?

I don't know what he gets out of it. Maybe he's into S&M so he gets off on coming on here and acting like an ignorant buffoon and being laughed at???

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

I don't know what he gets out of it. Maybe he's into S&M so he gets off on coming on here and acting like an ignorant buffoon and being laughed at???well, if you point out what his political party believes in, he denies it and calls you stupid for saying it. Is that a type of enjoyment?

[Sooner8th]

well, if you point out what his political party believes in, he denies it and calls you stupid for saying it. Is that a type of enjoyment?

What you think we believe in is just regurgitating rightwingnut talking points. lemming

[Curly Bill]

What you think we believe in is just regurgitating rightwingnut talking points. lemming

Seriously, when are you going to come out and admit who you used to post on here as?

[CK Sooner]

What you think we believe in is just regurgitating rightwingnut talking points. lemming

You remind me of a middle school kid who learns a new word in school and then starts using it 24/7. (regurgitating)

Small vocab, eyyy?

[Sooner8th]

You remind me of a middle school kid who learns a new word in school and then starts using it 24/7. (regurgitating)

Small vocab, eyyy?

When the shoe fits......................

[CK Sooner]

When the shoe fits......................

I just regurgitated my food

[Curly Bill]

I just regurgitated my food

You probably unwittingly just turned him on. He seems like the kinda "fella" that would have a fetish for food other men have regurgitated.

[CK Sooner]

Wow, thats pretty gross Sooner8th, keep that **** to yourself.

[olevetonahill]

If being stupid were Painful Sooner8th would be on a Morphine pump set to the Max.

[Curly Bill]

He is indeed a gross and pathetic bastage!

[olevetonahill]

He is indeed a gross and pathetic bastage!

Whats really ****ing pathetic about him is he thinks People READ all his "Proof" he post's

[Sooner8th]

Whats really ****ing pathetic about him is he thinks People READ all his "Proof" he post's

Of course I know most of you don't read it. You sure wouldn't want to read anything that doesn't come from fox "news".

[Curly Bill]

RAWR!!! I'm an angry troll and I like to make myself look stupid!

Hey, you said it.

[Sooner8th]

Quote Originally Posted by Sooner8th View Post
RAWR!!! I'm an angry troll and I like to make myself look stupid!


Hey, you said it.

Typical conservitive - just making **** up. Keep proving my point for me.

[Curly Bill]

Typical conservative. Too smart for me, so I'm just gonna yell really loud, and act like I'm winning at innerweb

Keep up the good work.

[Sooner8th]

Quote Originally Posted by Sooner8th View Post
Typical conservative. Too smart for me, so I'm just gonna yell really loud, and act like I'm winning at innerweb


Keep up the good work.

Which makes you a LOSER - keep making **** up.

[Curly Bill]

As a liberal I know I'm a loser. I try to make up for it with my fierce innerwebs persona. I bow down to conservatives who are much smarter and self-sufficient than losers like me.

Well said.

[Sooner8th]

Quote Originally Posted by Sooner8th View Post
As a liberal I know I'm a loser. I try to make up for it with my fierce innerwebs persona. I bow down to conservatives who are much smarter and self-sufficient than losers like me.


Well said.

You just keep making my point for me..........................you people just make **** up, tax cut raise revenues.

[Curly Bill]

I already know I'm a loser, so quit pickin on me and leave me alone. Ima tell my lord and master Obama that you're callin me names!

Knock yourself out.

[dwarthog]

but bush lying didn't bother you?

So please share how Bush stole the jam out of your dounut...

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Originally Posted by Sooner8th
but bush lying didn't bother you?
So please share how Bush stole the jam out of your dounut...Whatever Bush lies the Left wants to declare(Mission Accomplished?) they are child's play compared to the many whoppers Obear utters regularly. One would/should think they would bother ANYBODY!

[Sooner8th]

Originally Posted by Sooner8th
but bush lying didn't bother you?Whatever Bush lies the Left wants to declare(Mission Accomplished?) they are child's play compared to the many whoppers Obear utters regularly. One would/should think they would bother ANYBODY!


So you really think obama is telling bigger lies than iraq had wmd's and terroriests and Mission Accomplished? List them.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

So you really think obama is telling bigger lies than iraq had wmd's and terroriests and Mission Accomplished? List them.1) wtf is terroriests? 2) you should know as well as anyone that Iraq did have wmd's. 3) what silliness is it to continue to call the Mission Accomplished statement a lie?

You should move on and start another time-wasing thread. This one is dragging its hind legs.

[dwarthog]

So you really think obama is telling bigger lies than iraq had wmd's and terroriests and Mission Accomplished? List them.

I'm going take a play out your pedantic handbook on stating of facts.

Iraq/Saddam did have WMD's it was verified and he used them against Iran and against the Kurds in his own country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Iraq_War


By 29 February, the Iranians had reached the outskirts of Qurna and were closing in on the Baghdad–Basra highway.[36] They had broken out of the marshes and returned to open terrain, where they were confronted by conventional Iraqi weapons, including artillery, tanks, air power, and mustard gas. 1,200 Iranian soldiers were killed in the counter-attack. The Iranians retreated back to the marshes, though they still held onto them along with Majnoon Island.[36][44]:44


On 28 June, Iraqi fighter bombers attacked the Iranian town of Sardasht near the border, using chemical mustard gas bombs. While many towns and cities had been bombed before, and troops attacked with gas, this was the first time that the Iraqis had attacked a civilian area with poison gas.[133]


On 17 April 1988, Iraq launched Operation Ramadan Mubarak (Blessed Ramadan), a surprise attack against the 15,000 Basij troops on the peninsula.[68] The attack on al-Faw was preceded by Iraqi diversionary attacks in northern Iraq, with a massive artillery and air barrage of Iranian front lines. Key areas, such as supply lines, command posts, and ammunition depots, were hit by a storm of mustard gas and nerve gas, as well as by conventional explosives.


One of the most successful Iraqi tactics was the "one-two punch" attack using chemical weapons. Using artillery, they would saturate the Iranian front line with rapidly dispersing cyanide and nerve gas, while longer-lasting mustard gas was launched via fighter-bombers and rockets against the Iranian rear, creating a "chemical wall" that blocked reinforcement.[36]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halabja_chemical_attack


The Halabja chemical attack (Kurdish: Kîmyabarana Helebce کیمیابارانی ھەڵەبجە), also known as the Halabja Massacre or Bloody Friday,[1] was a genocidal massacre against the Kurdish people that took place on March 16, 1988, during the closing days of the Iran–Iraq War in the Kurdish city of Halabja in Southern Kurdistan. The attack was part of the Al-Anfal campaign in northern Iraq, as well as part of the Iraqi attempt to repel the Iranian Operation Zafar 7. It took place 48 hours after the fall of the town to Iranian army and Kurdish guerrillas.

The attack killed between 3,200 and 5,000 people and injured 7,000 to 10,000 more, most of them civilians.[1][2] Thousands more died of complications, diseases, and birth defects in the years after the attack.[3] The incident, which has been officially defined as an act of genocide against the Kurdish people in Iraq,[4] was and still remains the largest chemical weapons attack directed against a civilian-populated area in history.[5]


So yeah, Iraq/Saddam had WMD's.

[yermom]

1) wtf is terroriests? 2) you should know as well as anyone that Iraq did have wmd's. 3) what silliness is it to continue to call the Mission Accomplished statement a lie?

You should move on and start another time-wasing thread. This one is dragging its hind legs.

what is time-wasing?

[Turd_Ferguson]

what is time-wasing?

It's just like time-wasting, but different.

[Sooner8th]

I'm going take a play out your pedantic handbook on stating of facts.

Iraq/Saddam did have WMD's it was verified and he used them against Iran and against the Kurds in his own country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iran%E2%80%93Iraq_War

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Halabja_chemical_attack




So yeah, Iraq/Saddam had WMD's.

We didn't attack Iraq in 1988. So the logic here is if they had them in 1988 then they had them in 2003? Fifteen years later.

[Sooner8th]

1) wtf is terroriests? 2) you should know as well as anyone that Iraq did have wmd's. 3) what silliness is it to continue to call the Mission Accomplished statement a lie?

You should move on and start another time-wasing thread. This one is dragging its hind legs.

Mission accomplished was a lie. We were not CLOSE to being done.

terrorists - spell check sorry.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Mission accomplished was a lie. We were not CLOSE to being done.

terrorists - spell check sorry.Bush was talking about the immediate mission that the USA had just accomplished, and we ALL know that. It was no lie. It did, however, drive the MSM absolutely BONKERS when they viewed the video of W in semi miltary attire announcing Mission Accomplished. They went absolutely loonier than even their normal state. Unfortunately, their normal state now is probably even further advanced than the cuckooness of that day. Witness your own behavior.

[Sooner8th]

Bush was talking about the immediate mission that the USA had just acoomplished, and we ALL know that. It was no lie. It did, however, drive the MSM absolutely BONKERS when they viewed the video of W in semi miltary attire announcing Mission Accomplished. They went absolutely loonier than even their normal state. Unfortunately, their normal state now is probably even further advanced than the cuckooness of that day. Witness your own behavior.

Don't make me laugh. You have really shown you are just a rightwing lemming - do you really believe that spin?

Even bush knew it wasn't true -

Bush's speech noted:
"We have difficult work to do in Iraq. We are bringing order to parts of that country that remain dangerous."[10]
"Our mission continues...The War on Terror continues, yet it is not endless. We do not know the day of final victory, but we have seen the turning of the tide."

[rock on sooner]

Bush was talking about the immediate mission that the USA had just acoomplished, and we ALL know that. It was no lie. It did, however, drive the MSM absolutely BONKERS when they viewed the video of W in semi miltary attire announcing Mission Accomplished. They went absolutely loonier than even their normal state. Unfortunately, their normal state now is probably even further advanced than the cuckooness of that day. Witness your own behavior.

Umm, this is nutz, but, W will tell ya his biggest regret is his "Mission
Accomplished BS". I'm usually pretty even keel in these arguments!
RLIMC, this is way off base for you! Sure hope you had a grin on your
face when you typed that garbage. W was just a strutting Banty rooster
with his walk across the flight line, in his flight suit. The ENTIRE WMD
argument was a sham, Powell will tell you that if you'd ask. In absolute
reality, Cheney, Rumsfeld and Wolfowitz should be brought up on charges
for war crimes, at least. It's a shame on America's face that we went to war
in Iraq, when we should have stayed in Afghanistan and corralled UBL when
the 10th Mountain Division, plus 800 SF's and 1600 Marines had him bottled! What
happened? W said, No, gonna git Hussein 'cause he tried to kill my daddy!
A full and complete pivot of forces and a ten year war followed...4400 of our
finest lost, who knows how many injured...never mind the Iraqi citizenry...

(Look it up, the CIA had the blueprints for Tora Bora).we KNEW where the
hell that SOB was but the CIC said, No, let the war lords handle him, so UBL
simply bought his way into Pakistan and walked away, for a five or six year
vacation in Abbotabad...finally, SEAL Team Six got the mofo.

As an aside, I flew Old Glory on the front of my house, properly lighted, from
9/12/01 until the day after they got him. I took down that flag, folded it as it
should be and and have stored it, with proper notes. I will pass it on to my
grand kids when I go. I have strong feelings about the injustice of that whole
piece of garbage. It has absolutely nothing to do about right or left, it has every
thing to do with what is/was correct and the USA was dead wrong.!

[Turd_Ferguson]

Rock, what you just typed is nothing but typical hand wringing liberal bull****.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

The media skeewered W for saying Mission Accomplished, as I said. He didn't have the cajones to call them out , like Reagan would have done. Bush feared the Media. They ARE, unfortunately, usually America's greatest enemy.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Rock, what you just typed is nothing but typical hand wringing liberal bull****.Don't expect any better/different.

[rock on sooner]

Rock, what you just typed is nothing but typical hand wringing liberal bull****.

Naw, TF, what I typed was based on fact and my opinion about the
war crimes. The fact part you can, as I said, look it up! My opinion?
Well, call it BS, if ya want! My skin is pretty thick!!!

[rock on sooner]

Don't expect any better/different.

Not sure here about better? Just hate to see so much one sided
stuff, especially when accuracy is in question...jus sayin'..:playful:

[BoulderSooner79]

Rock, what you just typed is nothing but typical hand wringing liberal bull****.

So you think the war in Iraq was justified, morale or even a good idea? Even with 20/20 hindsight? I can't even wrap my mind around that one.

[Turd_Ferguson]

So you think the war in Iraq was justified, morale or even a good idea? Even with 20/20 hindsight? I can't even wrap my mind around that one.

Is that what I said? I'll wager there's a lot of things you can't wrap your mind around.

[Sooner8th]

Rock, what you just typed is nothing but typical hand wringing liberal bull****.

Turd, what you guys are typing is nothing but typical rightwing revisionist bull****.

[BoulderSooner79]

Is that what I said? I'll wager there's a lot of things you can't wrap your mind around.

Rock was a bit on the wordy side, but he basically said the whole Iraq thing was a big mistake. You're kind of terse, but your respond led me to believe you disagree. Maybe you should add more detail than just calling BS and throwing derogatory adjectives.

[Curly Bill]

Rock was a bit on the wordy side, but he basically said the whole Iraq thing was a big mistake. You're kind of terse, but your respond led me to believe you disagree. Maybe you should add more detail than just calling BS and throwing derogatory adjectives.

You mean throw out as much bullsh*t as possible like you guys tend to do, so even if you don't convince the other of your point, you still have a decent chance of killing them of boredom?

[Sooner8th]

You mean throw out as much bullsh*t as possible like you guys tend to do, so even if you don't convince the other of your point, you still have a decent chance of killing them of boredom?

The most boring thing on here is watching you guys defend rightwing talking points that are either obviously wrong or just plain made up - most of the time both.

Tell us again how reagan immediately left his 25 day vacation and came back to Washington when the Russians shot a Korean jetliner was out of the air.

[Curly Bill]

The most boring thing on here is watching you guys defend rightwing talking points that are either obviously wrong or just plain made up - most of the time both.

Tell us again how reagan immediately left his 25 day vacation and came back to Washington when the Russians shot a Korean jetliner was out of the air.

Do you get a $1 from your lord, master, and lover Obammy every time you can work "rightwing talking points" into a post. Boring!!!

and I don't care what Reagan, or Bush, or Nixon, or Washington, or Jefferson, or Harding, or Taft, or any other president did. Unlike you losers on the left no sense of my self-worth is tied up in what any of them did. But then I'm not some loser from the left whose support of Obammy is the only thing that gives me value.

And this is really just an exercise, because we all know you're a troll, but even a troll should have more sense than you do.

[Curly Bill]

Turd, I love me some obamadong, and for you to have exposed me makes me all tingly, because finally I can come out of the closet and openly express my intense burning man-love for Barrack Hussein Obama. He may be the president of the country, but he's the keeper of the key to my heart (and other places...tee-hee-hee)

You go girl!

[Sooner8th]

Do you get a $1 from your lord, master, and lover Obammy every time you can work "rightwing talking points" into a post. Boring!!!

and I don't care what Reagan, or Bush, or Nixon, or Washington, or Jefferson, or Harding, or Taft, or any other president did. Unlike you losers on the left no sense of my self-worth is tied up in what any of them did. But then I'm not some loser from the left whose support of Obammy is the only thing that gives me value.

And this is really just an exercise, because we all know you're a troll, but even a troll should have more sense than you do.

Struck a nerve did I?

[Curly Bill]

Struck a nerve did I?

LOL....Yeah, because your self-worth is wrapped up in the success of your lover Obama, you really got under my skin!

Just stay away from my dong!

[dwarthog]

We didn't attack Iraq in 1988. So the logic here is if they had them in 1988 then they had them in 2003? Fifteen years later.

After displaying a steady supply of WMD's to last through several "conflicts" as well as a willingness to use them and a strategy to effectively deploy them on the battle field, what exactly makes you think he didn't have them?

Let me guess, Saddam had some sort of epiphany that caused him to realize how vile and evil those weapons are?

[Sooner8th]

After displaying a steady supply of WMD's to last through several "conflicts" as well as a willingness to use them and a strategy to effectively deploy them on the battle field, what exactly makes you think he didn't have them?

Let me guess, Saddam had some sort of epiphany that caused him to realize how vile and evil those weapons are?

The fifth president of Iraq, Saddam Hussein,[1] was internationally known for his use of chemical weapons in the 1980s against Iranian and Kurdish civilians during and after the Iran–Iraq War. In the 1980s he pursued an extensive biological weapons program and a nuclear weapons program, though no nuclear bomb was built.
After the 1990-1991 Persian Gulf War, the United Nations located and destroyed large quantities of Iraqi chemical weapons and related equipment and materials throughout the early 1990s, with varying degrees of Iraqi cooperation and obstruction.[2] In response to diminishing Iraqi cooperation with UNSCOM, the United States called for withdrawal of all UN and IAEA inspectors in 1998, resulting in Operation Desert Fox. The United States and the UK asserted that Saddam Hussein still possessed large hidden stockpiles of WMD in 2003, and that he was clandestinely procuring and producing more. Inspections by the UN to resolve the status of unresolved disarmament questions restarted from November 2002 until March 2003,[3] under UN Security Council Resolution 1441, which demanded Saddam give "immediate, unconditional and active cooperation" with UN and IAEA inspections, shortly before his country was attacked.[4]
During the lead-up to war in March 2003, United Nations weapons inspector Hans Blix said that Iraq made significant progress toward resolving open issues of disarmament noting the "proactive" but not always "immediate" cooperation as called for by UN Security Council Resolution 1441. He concluded that it would take “but months” to resolve the key remaining disarmament tasks.[5] The United States asserted this was a breach of Resolution 1441 but failed to convince the UN Security Council to pass a new resolution authorizing the use of force due to lack of evidence.[6][7][8]
Despite being unable to get a new resolution authorizing force and citing section 3 of the Joint Resolution passed by the U.S. Congress,[9] President George W. Bush asserted peaceful measures could not disarm Iraq of the weapons he alleged it to have and launched a second Gulf War,[10] despite multiple dissenting opinions[11] and questions of integrity[12][13][14] about the underlying intelligence.[15] Later U.S.-led inspections agreed that Iraq had earlier abandoned its WMD programs, but asserted Iraq had an intention to pursue those programs if UN sanctions were ever lifted.[16]
Bush later said that the biggest regret of his presidency was "the intelligence failure" in Iraq,[17] while the Senate Intelligence Committee found in 2008 that his administration "misrepresented the intelligence and the threat from Iraq".[18] A key CIA informant in Iraq admitted that he lied about his allegations, "then watched in shock as it was used to justify the war".[19]

Read and learn.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

After displaying a steady supply of WMD's to last through several "conflicts" as well as a willingness to use them and a strategy to effectively deploy them on the battle field, what exactly makes you think he didn't have them?

Let me guess, Saddam had some sort of epiphany that caused him to realize how vile and evil those weapons are?Duh! even(some of) the Leftists in congress admitted thinking this.

[dwarthog]

I'll give Obama credit for "deftly" avoiding the WMD issue in Syria, (don't cross that redline), even after they did use WMD's on their own citizens.

The old Democratic strategy of not doing anything but talking loudly paid off.

[Sooner8th]

After displaying a steady supply of WMD's to last through several "conflicts" as well as a willingness to use them and a strategy to effectively deploy them on the battle field, what exactly makes you think he didn't have them?

Let me guess, Saddam had some sort of epiphany that caused him to realize how vile and evil those weapons are?

Us invading Iraq in 1990 had nothing to do with it? How convenient you forget that.

[Sooner8th]

Duh! even(some of) the Leftists in congress admitted thinking this.

Of course they did after being lied to about it from bush and cheney.

[dwarthog]

Of course they did after being lied to about it from bush and cheney.

Whoa, wait a minute.

How could the self proclaimed "High information" party be duped by a couple of simpletons like Bush and Cheney?

[pphilfran]

Whoa, wait a minute.

How could the self proclaimed "High information" party be duped by a couple of simpletons like Bush and Cheney?

lol