Fracking

[Skysooner]

I wondered if there would be any interest in receiving information on fracking. This will be studies both for and against including induced seismicity (which is what morons say is happening in Oklahoma). My company has cooperated with Canadian govt interests in this, and there is some interesting information. There is also the idiocy that comes from the greens who are latching onto fracking as the "debil" without any sort of understanding and with the sole intent of making us a green economy (actually for this but it would destroy the economy if we went to it fully now). I am on vacation until tomorrow, so i would anticipate putting together some of the information on Sunday or Monday.

[okie52]

I wondered if there would be any interest in receiving information on fracking. This will be studies both for and against including induced seismicity (which is what morons say is happening in Oklahoma). My company has cooperated with Canadian govt interests in this, and there is some interesting information. There is also the idiocy that comes from the greens who are latching onto fracking as the "debil" without any sort of understanding and with the sole intent of making us a green economy (actually for this but it would destroy the economy if we went to it fully now). I am on vacation until tomorrow, so i would anticipate putting together some of the information on Sunday or Monday.

Look forward to it Sky....also notice some of the Atlantic will be getting new seismic run on it in the next few years.

[Turd_Ferguson]

Wonder could you frac OV's ***? You might find the Mother Load of CNG in there...

[Jacie]

Just for purposes of discussion, does anyone reading this think a 5000% increase in the level of seismicity in 2013 (calculated from Oklahoma historical earthquake data) is a naturally occurring phenomena?

[Skysooner]

Look forward to it Sky....also notice some of the Atlantic will be getting new seismic run on it in the next few years.

He finally opened it up.

[Skysooner]

Just for purposes of discussion, does anyone reading this think a 5000% increase in the level of seismicity in 2013 (calculated from Oklahoma historical earthquake data) is a naturally occurring phenomena?

My background is in rock mechanics and seismicity from school. I helped write at least one of the publications I will share on Monday. Initially my thought is no since the production near Langston is only 1 to 1.5 miles deep from memory. These quakes are occurring much deeper and conductive fractures won't run that far. However I want to bring up the USGS reports and make sure about that.

[Turd_Ferguson]

I thought I had read somewhere that the seismic data recording devices had been upgraded/added in the last year or two. That alone could cover a lot of the eq's OK has seen lately, not to mention we live on a fault.

[rock on sooner]

I'm not smart enough to know one from the other but would
enjoy reading any explanation about the huge increase....

[yermom]

it's not fracking, it's the wastewater injection

you know, huge difference

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/wastewater-injection-caused-oklahoma-earthquakes/

[Turd_Ferguson]

it's not fracking, it's the wastewater injection

you know, huge difference

http://www.scientificamerican.com/article/wastewater-injection-caused-oklahoma-earthquakes/

I thought waste water injection had been going on for decades?

[hawaii 5-0]

We've been told it's safe.

What else is there to discuss ?

Personally I like Swiss cheese.


5-0

[Skysooner]

I thought waste water injection had been going on for decades?

It has been. Biggest difference is the amount of water going into the water disposal wells. As part of this study near Langston, I will be looking at the depth of earthquakes versus water injection well depths.

There have been earthquakes associated with fracking no doubt (I will post a link to a report and some excerpts tomorrow), but they are generally small, limited and not multiple earthquakes.

[Skysooner]

First things first:

Fracking is the act of injection water (thickened up by some chemicals) along with same to prop open a formation that wouldn't normally produce economic hydrocarbons. It was invented in Oklahoma in the late 1940s and early 1950s by Halliburton, and the vast majority of wells since that time have been fracked (we are talking millions of wells worldwide). This is not new technology as people would have you believe. What is new is that this is really the first time in history that horizontal wells have been massively fracked which means that one wellbore acts as many wellbores, and the volumes of water are big.

Earthquakes are caused when faults under pressure slip. This can be small slippage or large slippage. The magnitude of the earthquake is dependent upon the energy released. The damage that an earthquake can do is related to the magnitude and the depth it happens at. There are many faults under pressure that won't move for many years until that pressure increases enough to overcome the frictional resistance. Once they move, this can shake up an area and more earthquakes happen. This is why you get "aftershocks" which are just smaller magnitude earthquakes. We also see earthquake swarms preceding a larger earthquake and/or volcanic activity in areas prone to it.

Some of you may remember the James Bond movie "A View to a Kill". This is where the main evil characters (Christopher Walken) were trying to inject water into the Heyward and San Andres faults. As a rule this is an impossibility, but the science is right. Try putting water or any lubricant on something sitting on a frictional surface and watch it move easier.

Induced seismicity (aka earthquakes caused by water injection or fracking)

http://www.bcogc.ca/node/8046/download?documentID=1270

Long read, but this is part of a study I was involved in. In essence this is in what is called the Horn River region of Canada. Almost nobody lives here. We were fracking, and there were instances of shallow earthquakes with epicenters right in the fracking zone. These were small and only felt directly above on the surface.

Long term data analysis suggests that the regions can be somewhat identified ahead of time, but the real kicker is that no production comes out of zones that were fracked and had earthquakes (the stresses in the earth get all wonky around a fault under pressure). This really means that oil companies want to avoid those areas. While it is impossible to predict all of it, the areas where induced seismicity causing earthquakes directly has been in 2 remote areas of Canada (Horn River and the NW Duvernay region). There was also another reported incident in England a few years back, but I don't know much about that.

The biggest culprits are water injection wells. These can be potentially more dangerous for several reasons. First they are typically drilled deeper than the oil and gas zones. Second they take many more times the water than a well that has been fracked does. Cases of induced seismicity proven to be caused by water injection wells are in Irving, Texas, SW Arkansas and Youngstown, Ohio. In all cases the wells were shut down immediately.

Now let's look at the most recent earthquakes near Langston, OK. The depth of this was 3.8 miles or approximately 20,000'.

I pulled the entire county of wells. The deepest water injection well lands at 8400' in the Arbuckle formation. There are 3 wells that have production zones in the 8000-10000' range and nothing deeper. The Arbuckle pretty much sits above the Pre-Cambrian bedrock which goes back from 500 million to 4.5 billion years old. It isn't productive and isn't targeted. Anybody that tells you that water can leak from 8400' to 20,000' to cause an induced earthquake is patently stupid and knows nothing about geology. When we frack a well, we are lucky to see height growth in the 500' range. Mostly it is 100-200' high.

Glad to answer any questions.

[okie52]

Sky, I've wondered how earthquakes with epicenters 4 miles deep supposedly are triggered by injection wells that are 1-2 miles deep.

[olevetonahill]

Sky Knows his sh*t !

[olevetonahill]

Heh, I had a 23 year old Kid telling me the other day all these Quakes are caused by the Oil patch forcing all the Barrels full of water down in the earth. Like They taking Actuall barrells and ponding em in.
I just looked at him and changed the subject.

[dwarthog]

This is very interesting information. Thanks for sharing.

[Skysooner]

Sky, I've wondered how earthquakes with epicenters 4 miles deep supposedly are triggered by injection wells that are 1-2 miles deep.

They aren't. Just think of pushing a crate across a concrete floor. The lube has to be under the crate. Now supposedly there have been some fracking induced earthquakes in Ohio, but I am hesitant to believe it until I see the epicenter data because these are often badly placed water disposal wells.

[Skysooner]

This is from company business intelligence:

Colorado regulators reported that the disposal of oil and gas wastewater at a well in WeldCounty likely caused a series of small earthquakes this year, in another sign that a U.S. drilling boom is contributing to higher seismic activity.

The issue of wastewater disposal disturbing underground faultlines has become a national issue in the United States where drilling and wastewater disposal have increased sharply in recent years.

The Colorado Oil and Gas Conservation Commission halted activity at a wastewater disposal site owned by NGL Water Solutions DJ LLC on June 23, after a 3.2 magnitude quake on May 31 was followed by other smaller tremblers in the area. COGCC is investigating whether the company exceeded permitted injection volumes.

Since the shutdown, the seismic activity continued but occurred at "lower levels" COGCC said in a statement. "Actions at the location are potentially related to low-level seismic activity nearby," it said.

Limited operations have been allowed to continue at the disposal site after NGL Water Solutions sealed off what the COGCC described as a "preferential pathway" for the wastewater to flow from the bottom of the well into basement rock beneath.

COGCC will continue to monitor the WeldCounty well and will halt work if another seismic event above 2.5 occurs.

This is likely the first time that seismic activity has been linked to wastewater disposal, a COGCC spokesman said last month.

Both fracturing and wastewater disposal have been linked to increased seismic activity in states where energy production is on the rise.

Recent small earthquakes in Ohio were likely triggered by fracturing, state regulators said in April, establishing a new link that went beyond just the impacts of disposal wells.



So basically the Weld County is water disposal wells which we have talked about. If you put too much water down the wells then that is a bad thing as well. Regulators are supposed to monitor this.


Here is a link to an article on the Ohio fracking.

http://www.cbsnews.com/news/fracking-linked-to-ohio-earthquakes-officials-say/

Recall that if you frack and cause earthquakes there is no real production benefit, so I wouldn't be surprised to see them abandoning these wells or at least skipping the stages where the earthquakes occurred. I laughed at the farmer since he will be getting very large revenue checks and he has to put up with small tremors. Ohio is a very active faulted area.

This was from the comments. He said it so well.

"An earthquake happens when the rock faces of opposing sides of a fault can no longer support the tension caused by the earth on the opposite sides of the fault moving in opposite directions.

The reason fracking causes earthquakes is the mixture pumped into the ground lubricates the rock faces of both sides of a fault, sort of like soapy water between two sheets of glass, and allows the fault to "slip" at a much lower point of tension.

Thus fracking relieves the tension along a fault line with smaller, minor, earthquakes and tremors instead of the tension building up to until there is a major adjustment to the "earth slip" on both sides of the fault.

Back in the '60's there were geologists who advocated doing exactly the same thing w/the San Andreas fault in California to prevent major earthquakes up to and including "the big one".

It would be amusing, because of the outcry, and highly desirable if fracking, by causing many small tremors, prevented major earthquakes that involved massive destruction and major loss of life.

It boils down to the old "not in my backyard" thing about wanting the benefits of a situation w/o having to live w/the inconvenience of the side effects or possibly not understanding the mechanics of an earthquake or just not having thought about the situation and simply reacting to those "side effects".

Bottom line? Fracking could be saving Billions in property destruction and major loss of life and many, many injuries.

I'm surprised the oil companies haven't hired a geologist to explain this to the news industry.

For an appropriate amount of money I would be happy to purchase an on-line degree in geology and be the front man for explaining this to the various news, political, and ecological organizations. :)"

[olevetonahill]

Sky, I understand the Depth issue, and Have stated it myself. But heres a thot i just had. Could the increased pressure underground at say 1an1/2 miles deep force downward pressure on other substrata? kinda like a Domino effect?

[Skysooner]

Sky, I understand the Depth issue, and Have stated it myself. But heres a thot i just had. Could the increased pressure underground at say 1an1/2 miles deep force downward pressure on other substrata? kinda like a Domino effect?

Not so much. Pressure in the earth is typically caused by the weight of fluids in the earth above it. If it is salt water, you are going to see roughly 1.0-1.15 psi/ft. This only applies if the strata are connected in some way. Pressure obviously then goes up linearly as you move down into the earth. Injecting water into a strata will only increase the pressure as a result of the thickness of the zone and the difference in density between the fluids. Since most fluid at depth is very salty typically we are injecting the same fluid. Notice though that the pressure in the injection zone would not only have to be higher than the zones below but significantly higher to overcome the tendency of fluids to flow from high pressure to low pressure. Mostly fluids would tend to flow up if there was a pathway, but they then equalize with the zone above. The faulted rock would have to be really close to the injection zone for this to happen. Obviously it can since there are documented cases of this. Simple solution is just move the water disposal wells. These wells receive many times the water level that fracked wells do.

One other thing though is that you will hear of geopressured zones which are those zones that have pressures higher than the water gradient. These zones have been sealed off and isolated from the regional water gradient, buried and squeezed. This isolates the pressure and allows it to be higher. This part has nothing to do with fracking but just for general knowledge.

[olevetonahill]

Thanks, Ill hank up and continue to read.

[okie52]

So, Sky, if many of the injection wells are on a gravity feed, could you substantially overpressure a zone that was only on a gravity feed?

[Skysooner]

So, Sky, if many of the injection wells are on a gravity feed, could you substantially overpressure a zone that was only on a gravity feed?


No since the gravity feed means that the pressure of the water in the well is higher than the pressure in the zone. Eventually this changes and when they equalize, it won't flow anymore. Remember also there are frictional forces in the pipe as well. Even if you are using a pressure pump on the surface at least part of that pressure is going to friction, the rest is going to get a high enough rate of injection into the formation so that it will enter. If you use too much pressure though, you can overpressure a zone and fracture it. That is basically what fracking is anyway. Once the pressure drops though the zone heals itself and generally won't allow flow since the rock above and below oil zones is pretty impermeable.

[okie52]

No since the gravity feed means that the pressure of the water in the well is higher than the pressure in the zone. Eventually this changes and when they equalize, it won't flow anymore. Remember also there are frictional forces in the pipe as well. Even if you are using a pressure pump on the surface at least part of that pressure is going to friction, the rest is going to get a high enough rate of injection into the formation so that it will enter. If you use too much pressure though, you can overpressure a zone and fracture it. That is basically what fracking is anyway. Once the pressure drops though the zone heals itself and generally won't allow flow since the rock above and below oil zones is pretty impermeable.

Muchas gracias.

[olevetonahill]

Muchas gracias.

Okie Is this what "Being Schooled" is all about? :wink:

[okie52]

Okie Is this what "Being Schooled" is all about? :wink:

Yes...but in a good way:wink:...fukn lemmings

[olevetonahill]

Yes...but in a good way:wink:...fukn lemmings

I Like Skuel !

[rock on sooner]

I Like Skuel !

I knew it! Yew were funnin' us all along!

[Skysooner]

Not to toot my own horn...well yes I do. I was out with my wife last night and ran into a climate change protester at a bar. We had an hour long conversation about climate change (I think it is happening), the XL pipeline (should be approved otherwise it will be by rail which is worse), thorium nuclear reaction, fracking and induced seismicity. By the end he agreed that the whole to do about fracking was just a bunch of bs. We disagreed on other things (like Canada's right to extract its own resources and sell them), but in general it felt good to have a good discussion with the "enemy" and come out the victor.