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View Full Version : When is Enough, Enough, America? (A paper I had to write)



OU_Sooners75
2/23/2014, 03:32 PM
Let me know what you think. (be gentle this is the first draft of the paper. So I know there are going to be mistakes made.




According to Thomas Jefferson, the principal author of the Declaration of Independence, if the government is failing to fulfill its full purpose, then the people have the right to get rid of the government and elect others to fill the spots." We do not need to wait for the regular elections. We can demand referendums!

Many Americans feel our nation is under attack by our very own government. Others feel our government is not protecting our Constitutional rights as citizens. We all understand the difficulties we face as a nation from those that wish to do harm to our values and principles. But does this give our government the right to forego our Constitutional rights? Does our government, from Congress to the President, really have the right to infringe on these rights?

The United States Constitution is the law in this country. Many of our elected officials seem to have forgotten this. Since 9/11/2001, we have lost a lot of our rights as United States Citizens.

The Patriot Act has done a lot to erode the freedoms we have through the Bill of Rights and other amendments of the U.S. Constitution.

The First Amendment of the US Constitution states:

“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”



We all know, or should at least understand, that the First Amendment is one of the greatest rights we have in this country. But how is it being eroded?

The Patriot Act broadly expands the definition of terrorism. In doing so, any domestic group that engages in nonviolent civil disobedience can be labeled as terrorists. The government can now prosecute record keepers, such as librarians, if they reveal that the government has requested information on their clients or members in the course of an investigation. It has become a crime for these individuals to safeguard personal information and privacy, or to even tell you that you are under investigation.

Government agencies can now monitor the First Amendment protected activities of religion and political institutions. They can even infiltrate these organizations or groups with no suspicion of criminal activity. This is a return to domestic spying on law abiding religious and political groups.

You may now be subject to government investigation simply because of the political, activist, or advocacy groups you are involved in, or the statements you make within these groups.

Did you know there is a U.S. Department of Justice directive that actively encourages federal, state, and local officials to resist and/or limit access to government information through Freedom of Information Act requests?

Did you also know that the government has conducted immigration hearings in secret, behind closed doors? Once upon a time, these hearings were conducted while open to the public. Hundreds, if not thousands, of immigrants have already been deported in secret.

The last five paragraphs were just for the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution alone. Are you interested in knowing more?

The Fourth Amendment to the US Constitution states:
“The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.”



Law Enforcement authorities may now conduct secret searches and wiretaps in your home or office without showing “probable cause.” They need only to show that intelligence gathering is a significant purpose of their intrusion even if the primary goal is ordinary law enforcement. They may also monitor where and to whom you send and receive e-mail, or where you go on the Internet, recording every e-mail address and website you have been in contact with.

Law Enforcement may now demand any personal records held by any source including your doctor, employer, accountant, or library. All they have to do is claim that it is related to an investigation into terrorism. The record keepers may not reveal that your records were provided to the government.

Judicial oversight of secret searches, have been effectively minimized. The Patriot Act directs judges to consent to secret searches based only on the government’s assertion that a significant purpose of an investigation is gathering information related to terrorism, as the government defines it.

We have gone through just two rights that have been eroded. These rights are at the core of our principle and culture. Yet we are allowing our government to an unfettered amount of control over our rights.

Are you still not ready to say, “Enough is enough?”

The Fifth Amendment states:
“No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.”



Americans can now be jailed without formal charge and without the right to confront the witness or evidence against them. American citizens are now being held in military jails without charge and without a clear path of appeal for their indefinite confinement.

Hundreds of Arab, Muslim, and South Asian men were rounded up in the “Ashcroft raids" following September 11, 2001, and held for weeks without charges all were cleared of terrorism charges.

The Sixth Amendment states:

“In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defense.”



Since the Patriot Act was enacted, Hundreds of US Residents have been detained for months at a time, and denied access to the advice and advocacy of an attorney. The government may now monitor conversations between attorney and clients in federal jails.

The Bush Administration filed papers in court that arguing an American citizen held in a military jail without charge should be denied access to legal counsel because such access would interfere with the process of his interrogation.

The U.S. government may now jail its residents and citizens indefinitely without charge and without a public trial.

The Patriot Act doesn't stop there. There are more rights being infringed upon than those three amendments. So are you still not ready to say, “Enough is enough?” There are two more amendments I am going to share, and how the government has effectively taken them away from you.

The Eighth Amendment states:

“Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.”



The U.S. government has taken into custody individuals they identify as ‘material witnesses,’ transported them across the country, and held them for months in solitary confinement without charge or contact with their family.

According to the Justice Department’s own Inspector General, immigrant men rounded up in the “Ashcroft raids" following September 11, 2001 and held in the Metropolitan Detention Center in Brooklyn, NY were subject to a pattern of “physical and verbal abuse.”

The Fourteenth Amendment states:
“All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.”



Over 82,000 men from Arab, Muslim, and South Asian countries registered with the government under the Special Registration program. Over 13,000 are now in deportation proceedings. None have been charged with terrorism or any other crime.

As you can see, the Patriot Act, even if with good intentions, has eroded and infringed on the rights of Americans. Yet, the government has tried to erode more than what has been listed above.

The Second Amendment states:

“A well-regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a Free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”



Far too long has Americans been fighting the battle to keep the right to bear arms. If certain politicians had their way, the American Citizens would not have the right to own a gun, or knife, or any other tool that can be used to help protect themselves.

The Supreme Court has ruled on this matter quite a few times. Congress cannot take this right from the people, as long as they are law abiding citizens. However, this right is not an unlimited right.

The US Supreme court has ruled, “The right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose." See District of Columbia vs. Heller (2008).

While the second amendment right is something outside the scope of terrorism in general, it is a battle that American Conservatives are fighting on a regular basis.

These are just the rights being eroded or attacked by our very own government. There are more things wrong with this country. We have a government that is out of control when it comes to spending. Instead of fixing the actual problems, the government throws money at it, in hopes that that would cure the problem.

We also have a President that is out of control. The President is not a dictator. He is not a person that should have his cake and eat it too. He is a person that is elected by the People of the United States, to be the leader. He is supposed to uphold and defend the constitution, not trample all over it.

We have had a series of Presidents that felt trampling on our rights is the best policy. We have been struck by a series of Presidents that think they can give Executive Order on anything and everything that will not get past Congress.

We currently have a President that has weakened our image globally. No longer is the United States a respected or feared country. We are now a mocked country that even the Mullahs of Iran laugh at. We are a country that has the Afghanistan President testing us. We have been weakened by the very person we have placed in the Oval Office with our votes.

Our nation, our rights as citizens are under attack by our own government, the government that is supposed to work for the people, not against the people. Yes, terrorist attacks have scared people, but at what point does Americans come together and say, “Enough is enough, ‘We the People’ are taking back our government, and you’re fired?”

That time is now, America. I do not care if you are Democrat or Republican. I do not care if you are liberal or conservative. It is time to come together as a nation and demand accountability from our government. It is time to come together as a nation and get our nation back in order. It is time that we, as a nation, fires every single elected official and start fresh.

Every day Americans are expected to accept responsibility. We are expected to not spend more money than we have. We are expected to live within our means. So why is it hard for our government to live by the same expectations and standards?

Most Americans are hard workers. And for those that have their hands out wanting the government to take care of them. Be careful what you wish for. Do you honestly think that the government won’t expect something in return? They want your vote and obedience. They want you to not say a word when they tell you your rights are now forfeited.

If you are a democrat, a republican, a liberal, a conservative, or if you are in the middle, it is time that we take this nation to the heights that it has never seen before. It is time to take America back!

I am saying, “Enough is Enough!

FaninAma
2/24/2014, 09:11 AM
Good dissertation. I wasn't clear on the 14th amendment topic. Are those individuals here in the country legally and still being deported?

OU_Sooners75
2/24/2014, 10:10 AM
Good dissertation. I wasn't clear on the 14th amendment topic. Are those individuals here in the country legally and still being deported?

My understanding they were all here legally.

Soonerjeepman
2/24/2014, 01:05 PM
It really is crazy that so many people don't see it. Or accept it as "defending our freedoms". Did you see my post on the UN and children? We are headed that direction if clinton gets elected.

I've lost faith in ALL politicians.

kevpks
2/24/2014, 01:43 PM
Speaking as an English professor, this is a good working outline/first draft. How many sources are required in the essay? You make strong use of primary sources (The Constitution) but are secondary sources required (journals, scholarly websites, etc.)? That would help to solidify some of the claims you make. Ex. "Many Americans feel our nation is under attack by our very own government. Others feel our government is not protecting our Constitutional rights as citizens." Who are the people who think this? I'm not asking that to disagree with you but while statements like that are fine to frame the argument, the essay itself needs to unpack some of the meaning there.

I think the thesis could use some revision:
The Patriot Act has done a lot to erode the freedoms we have through the Bill of Rights and other amendments of the U.S. Constitution.

Whats do you mean by a lot? The thesis could be more specific by adding reasons to your claim. Ex. The Patriot Act has eroded the freedoms guaranteed through the Bill of Rights and other amendments of the U.S. Constitution by ________________________, ________________________, and _________________________. In the blanks, you tell us how. Rewriting your thesis like this would help frame the argument.

On structure, the essay is currently built around commentary on individual amendments. This gives the essay a clear progression but I am not sure how the assignment asks you to structure the essay. Many times, professors want students to build their essay around a thesis statement supported by paragraphs. That would mean incorporating the commentary on the amendments into paragraphs with clear topic sentences. The amendments themselves would then be included as an appendix or simply cited on a bibliography.

OU_Sooners75
2/24/2014, 02:04 PM
Speaking as an English professor, this is a good working outline/first draft. How many sources are required in the essay? You make strong use of primary sources (The Constitution) but are secondary sources required (journals, scholarly websites, etc.)? That would help to solidify some of the claims you make. Ex. "Many Americans feel our nation is under attack by our very own government. Others feel our government is not protecting our Constitutional rights as citizens." Who are the people who think this? I'm not asking that to disagree with you but while statements like that are fine to frame the argument, the essay itself needs to unpack some of the meaning there.

I think the thesis could use some revision:
The Patriot Act has done a lot to erode the freedoms we have through the Bill of Rights and other amendments of the U.S. Constitution.

Whats do you mean by a lot? The thesis could be more specific by adding reasons to your claim. Ex. The Patriot Act has eroded the freedoms guaranteed through the Bill of Rights and other amendments of the U.S. Constitution by ________________________, ________________________, and _________________________. In the blanks, you tell us how. Rewriting your thesis like this would help frame the argument.

On structure, the essay is currently built around commentary on individual amendments. This gives the essay a clear progression but I am not sure how the assignment asks you to structure the essay. Many times, professors want students to build their essay around a thesis statement supported by paragraphs. That would mean incorporating the commentary on the amendments into paragraphs with clear topic sentences. The amendments themselves would then be included as an appendix or simply cited on a bibliography.

Not really an assignment. Just something someone asked to debate in the form of writing, since we won't be seeing each other any time soon. I know that sounds weird, but just a little thing a friend and I do from time to time. This one was about "The Erosion of Our Constitutional Rights."

I will definitely look at writing it the way you suggested.

I have 2 main references, the U.S. Constitution and The Patriot Act. Ill definitely look at writing it in Thesis form. I think that could be something much better myself.

okie52
2/24/2014, 02:08 PM
My understanding they were all here legally.

See thread on illegals being represented in the US house and electoral votes.

kevpks
2/24/2014, 02:14 PM
Not really an assignment. Just something someone asked to debate in the form of writing, since we won't be seeing each other any time soon. I know that sounds weird, but just a little thing a friend and I do from time to time. This one was about "The Erosion of Our Constitutional Rights."

I will definitely look at writing it the way you suggested.

I have 2 main references, the U.S. Constitution and The Patriot Act. Ill definitely look at writing it in Thesis form. I think that could be something much better myself.

Very cool. I think that's great. I'm used to my students. Most will only write something if you make them :smile:

OU_Sooners75
2/24/2014, 02:51 PM
Very cool. I think that's great. I'm used to my students. Most will only write something if you make them :smile:

I am making corrections now. And I will post the second draft here.

If you wouldn't mind looking at the second draft for me, that would be awesome. I want it as close to grammatically correct as possible. God knows I am no grammar nazi...LOL

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/24/2014, 03:16 PM
If you wouldn't mind looking at the second draft for me, that would be awesome. I want it as close to grammatically correct as possible. God knows I am no grammar nazi...LOLSo, the word nazi here has a different meaning than when someone is called a nazi. "Grammar nazi" certainly doesn't have the evil associated with it that other uses of the word do....(FWIW, sometimes people us the word erroneously, calling one a nazi who is for the Constitution and believes as MLK did, that people should be judged by the content of their character, rather than the color of their skin, sexual orientation, gender etc., and/or capitalism and representative govt. vs authoritarian socialism) eg. a "right wing nazi"

yermom
2/24/2014, 03:20 PM
When is enough enough?

When boomers and their kids can't afford to drive SUVs, buy the newest big screen TV and text each other on the latest smart phone, someone might care enough to do something

At this point it is still someone else's problem for the most part

OU_Sooners75
2/24/2014, 03:47 PM
So, the word nazi here has a different meaning than when someone is called a nazi. "Grammar nazi" certainly doesn't have the evil associated with it that other uses of the word do....(FWIW, sometimes people us the word erroneously, calling one a nazi who is for the Constitution and believes as MLK did, that people should be judged by the content of their character, rather than the color of their skin, sexual orientation, gender etc., and/or capitalism and representative govt. vs authoritarian socialism) eg. a "right wing nazi"

Do you have a point to add to this conversation?

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/24/2014, 03:50 PM
Do you have a point to add to this conversation?Are you still a nazi for for Minimum Wage?

OU_Sooners75
2/24/2014, 03:51 PM
When is enough enough?

When boomers and their kids can't afford to drive SUVs, buy the newest big screen TV and text each other on the latest smart phone, someone might care enough to do something

At this point it is still someone else's problem for the most part

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/are-you-done.gif

OU_Sooners75
2/24/2014, 03:51 PM
Are you still a nazi for for Minimum Wage?


http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/boring.gif

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/24/2014, 03:58 PM
All threads undergo metamorphoses. You shouldn't be upset.

lexsooner
2/24/2014, 04:04 PM
I tend to agree with the English professor. Many of your statements are merely statements or broad opinions and are not supported by any accompanying facts or reasoning, which are needed to make this paper more persuasive and along the lines of a written "debate." Imagine being in a verbal debate with someone with differing views and then imagine making some of these statements and ask yourself whether a panel of judges (or in an informal context, your opponent) would be persuaded by these statements alone. My first take on your draft in the OP was it was meant to be an ad or rallying cry to a broad audience which already agrees with your views and does not need any persuading.

SoonerorLater
2/24/2014, 04:21 PM
You make strong use of primary sources (The Constitution) but are secondary sources required (journals, scholarly websites, etc.)?

I'm guessing you don't consider the SoonerFans Message Board as one of those scholarly websites to be referenced?

kevpks
2/24/2014, 04:27 PM
I'm guessing you don't consider the SoonerFans Message Board as one of those scholarly websites to be referenced?

It depends on the discipline. Soonerfans is an authority on OSU Failure Theory and has made great strides in Texas Sucks Studies.

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/24/2014, 04:30 PM
Like a meandering river...

Soonerjeepman
2/24/2014, 05:20 PM
osu fails and horns suck...HE!! ya!

yermom
2/24/2014, 08:36 PM
http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/are-you-done.gif

As long as someone can cash the checks the majority of the country is okay with it enough to only rant on the internet occasionally

OU_Sooners75
2/24/2014, 09:43 PM
Here is second draft...



The Erosion of American Civil Liberties
According to Thomas Jefferson, the principal author of the Declaration of Independence, if the government is failing to fulfill its full purpose, then the people have the right to get rid of the government and elect others to fill the spots.

Many Americans feel our nation is under attack by our very own government. Others feel our government is not protecting our Constitutional rights as citizens. We all understand the difficulties we face as a nation from those that wish to do harm to our values and principles. But does this give our government the right to forego our Constitutional rights? Does our government, from Congress to the President, really have the right to infringe on these rights?

The United States Constitution is the law in this country. Many of our elected officials seem to have forgotten this. Since 9/11/2001, we have lost a lot of our rights as United States Citizens.

“The Patriot Act is short for USA Patriot Act of 2001, which is an acronym that stands for Uniting and Strengthening America by Providing Appropriate Tools Required to Intercept and Obstruct Terrorism.

The Patriot Act was rushed through congress after the September 11, 2001 terrorist attacks and the 2001 Anthrax attacks. President Bush signed the Act into law on October 26, 2001.” – 1Wikipedia

The Patriot Act (The Act) has eroded the freedoms granted to us through the Bill of Rights and other amendments of the U.S. Constitution by limiting our access to government information, secretly spying on U.S. citizens and residents, and by confining U.S. citizens to solitary confinement for lengthy periods of time.

2The First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution states:

“Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.”


We all know, or should at least understand, that the First Amendment is one of the greatest rights we have in this country. But how is it being eroded?

If you were to read the USA Patriot Act of 2001 (Patriot Act) in its entirety, you would find that it broadly expands the definition of terrorism in this country. In doing so, any domestic group that demonstrates nonviolent civil disobedience can be labeled as a terrorist organization.
The government can now prosecute any keepers of personal information, such as librarians, doctors, accountants, etc. if they reveal the government has requested information about any of their clients or members in the course of an investigation. In other words it is now against the law for these individuals to safeguard personal information and privacy, or to even tell you that you are being investigated.

“Government agencies can now monitor the First Amendment protected activities of political and religious organizations. They can now spy on these organizations or groups without any suspicion of criminal activity. This is a return to domestic spying on law abiding citizens and organizations.” - 3New York Bill of Rights Defense Campaign

This First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution is supposed to protect us from government investigation based solely on political or religious views. But did you know, thanks to the Patriot Act, we can now be subject to investigation because of our political, religious, activist, or advocacy views? If you belong to any of those types of groups you what you believe or say while in such group can lead to an investigation by the U.S. government.

Did you also know, “there is a U.S. Department of Justice directive that actively encourages government officials to resist and limit access to government information through Freedom of Information Act requests?” - 3New York Bill of Rights Defense Campaign

Next, did you know that the government can now conduct immigration hearings in secret? Once upon a time, these hearings were conducted open to the public. “Hundreds, if not thousands, of immigrants have already been deported in secret.” - 3New York Bill of Rights Defense Campaign

The last six paragraphs were examples of the First Amendment of the U.S. Constitution being eroded. Are you interested in seeing what other rights have been canceled since the passing of the Patriot Act of 2001?

The Fourth Amendment of the US Constitution states:

“The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.”

Believe it or not, the reality that Uncle Sam can now conduct secret searches, seizures, and even wiretaps in your home and/or office is very real. The U.S. government can now legally enter your place of residence or your place of employment to spy on you without showing probable cause. “They need only to show that the intelligence gathering is a significant purpose of their intrusion, even if the primary goal is ordinary law enforcement.” - 3New York Bill of Rights Defense Campaign

Law Enforcement can now monitor your e-mails, what websites you go to while online, and record all this information without your knowledge
Law Enforcement as the ability to demand any of your personal records. They can now do to your doctor, employer, accountant, or even your librarian to obtain this information. All they need to do is claim that it is related to a terrorism investigation. It is against the law for the record keep to reveal to you that your records were provided to the government.

The abilities of judicial oversight for these secret searches have been effectively minimize due to the Patriot Act. The Act directs judges to consent to secret searches if the government shows that it is for an investigation into, the newly defined, terrorism.

Are you interested in more? We have gone through just two rights that have been eroded. These rights are at the core of our principle and culture. Yet we are allowing our government to an unfettered amount of control over our rights.

Are you still not ready to say, “Enough is enough?” Well then, keep reading there is more.

The Fifth Amendment states:

“No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.”


Under the Patriot Act, you, Americans, can be imprisoned without a writ of habeas corpus, the right to confront the witness, or evidence against you. Americans are being held in military jails without any charges being filed or a “clear path of appeal for their indefinite confinement.” - 3New York Bill of Rights Defense Campaign

Hundreds of men of Arab, Muslim and South Asian descent, or nationality, were rounded up during the “Ashcroft Raids” after September 11, 2001, and held for weeks without formal charges. All these men were cleared of terrorism charges.

The Sixth Amendment states:

“In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defense.”


Since the Patriot Act was enacted, hundreds of U.S. residents have been detained, by the federal government, for months at a time. They were also denied access to an attorney. “The government may now monitor and record conversations between attorney and clients in federal jails.” - 3New York Bill of Rights Defense Campaign

In fact, the Bush Administration filed papers in court arguing any American citizen held in a military jail without formal charges, should be denied legal counsel because it would interfere with the interrogation of the prisoner.

If the U.S. Government wants to jail an American citizen or resident indefinitely without charge or public trial, they can, in the name of fighting terrorism.

The Patriot Act doesn’t stop there. There are more rights being infringed upon than those three amendments. So are you still not ready to say, “Enough is enough?” There are two more amendments I am going to share, and how the government has effectively taken them away from you.

The Eighth Amendment states:

“Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.”


The U.S. Government has placed individuals in custody that they identified as “Material Witnesses.” They then transported these American citizens or residents across the country and held them in solitary confinement without charges or contact with family.

The Justice Department’s own Inspector General admitted the men that were rounded up during the “Ashcroft Raids” where held in the “Metropolitan Detention Center in Brooklyn, NY, where they were subject to physical and verbal abuse.” - 3New York Bill of Rights Defense Campaign

In November, 2002, then U.S. Attorney General John Ashcroft announced a new program that was part of the National Security Entry-Exit Registration System. This new program was called the Special Registration Program. – 4Migration Information Source

The Fourteenth Amendment states:

“All persons born or naturalized in the United States, and subject to the jurisdiction thereof, are citizens of the United States and of the state wherein they reside. No state shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States; nor shall any state deprive any person of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws.”


This Amendment expands further than just U.S. Citizens; it includes all people within the U.S. borders. In other words, not one person within the borders of the U.S. has the right to due process. It doesn’t matter if they are in the United States legally or illegally. - 5ACLU

With the U.S. Government using the Patriot Act, over 82,000 men from Arab, Muslim, and South Asian countries registered under the Special Registration Program. Nearly 13,000 of them are now facing deportation proceedings. None of these men have been charged with terrorism, much less any crime. - 3New York Bill of Rights Defense Campaign

As you can see, the Patriot Act, even if with good intentions, has eroded and infringed on the guaranteed rights of Americans. Yet the Patriot Act is not the only thing that has eroded or tried to erode the freedoms and rights of Americans.

The Second Amendment states:

“A well-regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a Free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.”
Far too long has Americans been fighting the battle to keep the right to bear arms. If certain politicians had their way, the American Citizens would not have the right to own a gun, or knife, or any other tool that can be used to help protect them.


The Supreme Court has ruled on this matter quite a few times. Congress cannot take this right from the people, as long as they are law abiding citizens. However, this law is not an unlimited law. The US Supreme court has ruled, “The right is not unlimited. It is not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose." 6See District of Columbia vs. Heller (2008).

While the second amendment right is something outside the scope of terrorism in general, it is a battle that American Conservatives are fighting on a regular basis.

These are just the rights being eroded. There are wide array of things wrong with this country. We have a government that is out of control when it comes to spending. We have a President that is out of control, thinking if he cannot get what he wants from Congress, he will apply "Executive Order" so it will go into effect anyway. We have a Congress that would rather take big money from lobbyists and interest groups than protect the rights of their delegates.

The President of the United States is not a dictator. He is a person that is elected by the People of the United States, to be the leader. He is supposed to uphold and defend the constitution. However, we have had a series of Presidents that felt trampling on our rights is the best policy.

We currently have a President that has weakened our stance globally. No longer is the United States a feared or respected country. We are now a mocked country that even the Mullahs of Iran laugh at. We have been weakened by the very people we have placed in office with our votes.

The United States of America has a constitution that guarantees each citizen and resident protections and liberties. Those guarantees are afforded to us through the Bill of Rights, which are the first 10 amendments of the U.S. Constitution. The Patriot Act is an opponent of those rights, as shown above.

The President and Congress of the United States are the responsible parties when it comes to the protection of our civil liberties. Both branches are failing to do their job.

diverdog
2/24/2014, 10:38 PM
I have a question. Terrorist rely heavily on modern communication to coordinate and launch attacks. If you get rid of the Patriot Act then how do you propose we defend this nation and disrupt terrorism?

By the way, I am just asking cause I do not know the answer. I know the Patriot Act has problems but I do not know if there is a better alternative.

OU_Sooners75
2/25/2014, 09:01 AM
I have a question. Terrorist rely heavily on modern communication to coordinate and launch attacks. If you get rid of the Patriot Act then how do you propose we defend this nation and disrupt terrorism?

By the way, I am just asking cause I do not know the answer. I know the Patriot Act has problems but I do not know if there is a better alternative.

Please read it before commenting or asking questions. It may not have all the answers, but it shows you my point in all this, that the USA Patriot Act of 2001 opened a flood gate for the government to violate and bypass the constitutional guarantees we are granted in this country.




edited: I edited it because it came across quite rude.

OU_Sooners75
2/25/2014, 09:21 AM
I have a question. Terrorist rely heavily on modern communication to coordinate and launch attacks. If you get rid of the Patriot Act then how do you propose we defend this nation and disrupt terrorism?

By the way, I am just asking cause I do not know the answer. I know the Patriot Act has problems but I do not know if there is a better alternative.

I wouldn't have a problem with the Patriot Act if it didn't allow the US Justice Department, the President, and the Defense department to violate our rights that are guaranteed by the Constitution.

If the US Government wants to say you are a terrorist, even without evidence, then they can and will tap your phone, invade your privacy, and they will place you into solitary confinement without being charged with any crime.

They will detain you without allowing you have the advice of an attorney or contact with your family.

If you are just a resident (non citizen), or here legally, they will deport you without evidence and without doing so in public.

You won't get a speedy trial. Hell, you may not even get a trial at all. You will be tried, convicted, and sentenced by some agent within the government. And you won't be given the chance to defend your self through arguing the charges (because there usually aren't any).

Anyway, what I wrote, kind of lays out some of that stuff. Maybe it isn't as detailed as it needs to be at this moment, but I think it will show my point.

As far as what can they do differently? I don't really know. I do know they can do their investigations and procedures without violating the rights of those legally in the U.S.

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/25/2014, 03:06 PM
I wouldn't have a problem with the Patriot Act if it didn't allow the US Justice Department, the President, and the Defense department to violate our rights that are guaranteed by the Constitution.

If the US Government wants to say you are a terrorist, even without evidence, then they can and will tap your phone, invade your privacy, and they will place you into solitary confinement without being charged with any crime.

They will detain you without allowing you have the advice of an attorney or contact with your family.

If you are just a resident (non citizen), or here legally, they will deport you without evidence and without doing so in public.

As far as what can they do differently? I don't really know. I do know they can do their investigations and procedures without violating the rights of those legally in the U.S.I think everybody gets that, but one should properly ID terrorism as a special situation, a true act of war upon the USA. IMO nearly everyone, myself included, realize that it is an act of war and consequently time is OF THE ESSENCE. Sticky problem indeed. I contend W didn't abuse the Patriot Act, but he could have. What should be done about terrorism in the USA? We ARE very vulnerable, due to the freedoms we still have.

OU_Sooners75
2/26/2014, 03:10 PM
I think everybody gets that, but one should properly ID terrorism as a special situation, a true act of war upon the USA. IMO nearly everyone, myself included, realize that it is an act of war and consequently time is OF THE ESSENCE. Sticky problem indeed. I contend W didn't abuse the Patriot Act, but he could have. What should be done about terrorism in the USA? We ARE very vulnerable, due to the freedoms we still have.


You know what is amazing? For decades, the US Government was more than a capable of doing proper investigation and intelligence gathering without eroding our guaranteed rights afforded to you and me from the Constitution of the United States. You do know that the Constitution is the supreme law of this nation, right?

The Bush Administration is the one that created the USA Patriot Act of 2001. He is the one that is ultimately accountable for how the Patriot Act infringes on our rights.

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/26/2014, 03:19 PM
911 was a severe blow to the USA, from foreign nationals in the USA. I'll ask again, how you propose dealing with terrorism in the USA, president Sooner75? Yeah, there are no easy answers. I'm no W apologist, but i'm not as sure as you seem to be that the Patriot Act was/is as bad as some of the nannystate things the government has done both while he was in office, and of course since Obeary has wrested control.

OU_Sooners75
2/26/2014, 03:41 PM
911 was a severe blow to the USA, from foreign nationals in the USA. I'll ask again, how you propose dealing with terrorism in the USA, president Sooner75? Yeah, there are no easy answers. I'm no W apologist, but i'm not as sure as you seem to be that the Patriot Act was/is as bad as some of the nannystate things the government has done both while he was in office, and of course since Obeary has wrested control.

But it wasn't the only blow to the US. We had Timothy McVeigh. He was a US National.

How would I deal with it? The way we dealt with it under Reagan or even Clinton.

No matter how much the government wants to believe they can completely stop it, they can't. They will never be able to completely stop terrorism here or abroad. So I would repeal the USA Patriot act, or at least modify it, because it is not all bad.

If I was to modify it, I would make it where they still have to go to the courts and be granted a warrant to wiretap or secretly investigate someone. The Justice Department would have to have overwhelming evidence in order for the courts to approve it.

I would make it illegal to round people up and detained for more than 48 hours without proper charges being filed. And when they are detained, it won't be in solitary confinement. And they will be granted the right to an attorney and Habeas Corpus.

Anyone that is here legally, will be given their day in court instead of being deported in secret.


Those are the starters. They can give those rights back to us and still accomplish their goals.


You know one thing I find ironic in this conversation with you? You are against the government setting a minimum wage, calling it fascism. Amazing how you are so against a National Minimum Wage, yet love for people to have constitutional rights taken away, or at least you are tolerant of it. SMH

yermom
2/26/2014, 03:54 PM
But it wasn't the only blow to the US. We had Timothy McVeigh. He was a US National.

How would I deal with it? The way we dealt with it under Reagan or even Clinton.

No matter how much the government wants to believe they can completely stop it, they can't. They will never be able to completely stop terrorism here or abroad. So I would repeal the USA Patriot act, or at least modify it, because it is not all bad.

If I was to modify it, I would make it where they still have to go to the courts and be granted a warrant to wiretap or secretly investigate someone. The Justice Department would have to have overwhelming evidence in order for the courts to approve it.

I would make it illegal to round people up and detained for more than 48 hours without proper charges being filed. And when they are detained, it won't be in solitary confinement. And they will be granted the right to an attorney and Habeas Corpus.

Anyone that is here legally, will be given their day in court instead of being deported in secret.


Those are the starters. They can give those rights back to us and still accomplish their goals.


You know one thing I find ironic in this conversation with you? You are against the government setting a minimum wage, calling it fascism. Amazing how you are so against a National Minimum Wage, yet love for people to have constitutional rights taken away, or at least you are tolerant of it. SMH

it's really hard to predict when you are going to agree with someone...

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/26/2014, 04:01 PM
You know one thing I find ironic in this conversation with you? You are against the government setting a minimum wage, calling it fascism. Amazing how you are so against a National Minimum Wage, yet love for people to have constitutional rights taken away, or at least you are tolerant of it. SMHI find an act of war(Terrorism)so different from minimum wage that I don't believe that is a proper comparison. Looks like you are stuck with believing in a govt. mandated minimum wage for the Private Sector, so be it. Whatever you and I think about it, and the Patriot Act as well, doesn't seem to matter much in the zenith of power.

OU_Sooners75
2/26/2014, 04:14 PM
I find an act of war(Terrorism)so different from minimum wage that I don't believe that is a proper comparison. Looks like you are stuck with believing in a govt. mandated minimum wage for the Private Sector, so be it. Whatever you and I think about it, and the Patriot Act as well, doesn't seem to matter much in the zenith of power.

See, you are going off what the Patriot Act redefined as terrorism.

You see, the real definition is exactly what the US Government has done to those that they called terrorists (without proof) and later let them go because they determined they weren't terrorists.

The real definition of terrorism:
the use of violence and threats to intimidate or coerce, especially for political purposes.

2.the state of fear (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/fear) and submission produced by terrorism or terrorization (http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/terrorize).




The Government's version of the definition?:
refers only to those violent acts that are intended to create fear (terror); are perpetrated for a religious, political, or ideological goal;

Hmmmmm......weeeeird

OU_Sooners75
2/26/2014, 04:17 PM
it's really hard to predict when you are going to agree with someone...

http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/as-if.gif

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/27/2014, 03:01 PM
http://townhall.com/political-cartoons/2014/02/27/116509

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/27/2014, 03:35 PM
You know what? The govt. should just go ahead and mandate that all businesses should hire people, until the employment rate is 100%. All businesses should be federally fined until everyone is employed.

yermom
2/27/2014, 08:42 PM
you are finally making sense

OU_Sooners75
2/28/2014, 08:00 PM
You know what? The govt. should just go ahead and mandate that all businesses should hire people, until the employment rate is 100%. All businesses should be federally fined until everyone is employed.

wow

RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!
2/28/2014, 08:52 PM
you ain't just a-whistling Dixie, either.