Serious question RE: injuries

[Sooner Sig Ep]

I'm sure this has been discussed ad nauseum at some point in the past but this has just been gnawing at me for a few years. Being a hoops player/coach I'm not familiar with offseason training and potential causes for football injuries, so I'm hoping some of you folks with more specific football experience can provide some insight.
I understand that injuries are just part of the nature of the game, but it seems like we are plagued with them them every year. The injury list this year alone is ridiculous! Go back the last few years and it seems we are always facing the injury bug in a BIG way. So, here are my questions:

1. Does OU have about the same injury rate vs other teams? I admit my focus on OU might be blinding me here, so just looking for some objectivity.

2. What should we be doing better to protect against injuries, if anything? BTW, this is not intended to be a fire Schmitty thread, just looking for some perspective.

I would just love to see us at full strength for a season!

[Snrinhouston]

2. What should we be doing better to protect against injuries, if anything? BTW, this is not intended to be a fire Schmitty thread, just looking for some perspective.

Obviously, many injuries are just unavoidable consequences of a violent game. But, IMO, you sure don't help your chances sticking your most valuable offensive players on kickoff and punt return; the single most violent plays in any game.

[5noubus]

I have wondered this myself.
One thing I think is worth noting is the teams that have little to no injuries are usually the ones that have had an easy schedule.
If baylors schedule was turned around playing osewe , Texas and us then the cream puffs how different could it have looked ?
I think guys get hurt pushing themselves too hard or playing beyond their ability.
Does bama have any injuries ?

[TheUnnamedSooner]

I have wondered this myself.
One thing I think is worth noting is the teams that have little to no injuries are usually the ones that have had an easy schedule.
If baylors schedule was turned around playing osewe , Texas and us then the cream puffs how different could it have looked ?
I think guys get hurt pushing themselves too hard or playing beyond their ability.
Does bama have any injuries ?

Yes. I dont remember who is hurt but I was reading an article and Saban was discussing all their injuries. I want to say olinemen but I could be wrong.

[BoulderSooner79]

I have wondered this myself.
One thing I think is worth noting is the teams that have little to no injuries are usually the ones that have had an easy schedule.
If baylors schedule was turned around playing osewe , Texas and us then the cream puffs how different could it have looked ?
I think guys get hurt pushing themselves too hard or playing beyond their ability.
Does bama have any injuries ?

Having an easy schedule or just being really good (making most games easy), allows your starters and even 2 deep players to play less snaps. Just the statistics of that will add up. Baylor probably rested their starters more than any other team until the last 5 games. But there are no guarantees as players can get hurt in practice or tear ACLs jumping up and down celebrating a score.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Kickoff coverage is normally the biggest culprit and we've been hammered there this year. In the past we've lost Ronnell Lewis, Gutierez (in the same game he rushed for 200 yards). This year we lost Milard and Keith Ford on 2 consecutive kickoffs.

Kickoff Returns hasn't been as bad with the exception of running backs. Losing DeMarco there in 2008 sucked.

Running back in general has been plagued by injuries since Stoops got here (1999 we lost like 3 running backs).

OL has been hit or miss (as it normally is). This year has been bad because we had a back in Williams who liked to run up on the back of linemen. That tends to get guys rolled up on.


The only real injuries that you might lay on S&C are the back injuries and the torn bicep/pec muscles that we've had over the years. If they occur because of lack of flexibility then that is on the staff, but they may just be accidents. It is just that these torn pec/bicep injuries are rare in the Pros (like one per year in the league) and we seem to lose players to these every year. The counter to this is that we rarely ever have hamstring injuries which are common as rain in the Pros.

[BoulderSooner79]

Kickoff Returns hasn't been as bad with the exception of running backs. Losing DeMarco there in 2008 sucked.


But oh, what a painful exception. That's similar to saying "besides that, Mrs. Lincoln, how was the play?"

[Jacie]

1. Does OU have about the same injury rate vs other teams? I admit my focus on OU might be blinding me here, so just looking for some objectivity.

Losing starters to injury was the reason cited for Florida's demise this year.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Yes. I dont remember who is hurt but I was reading an article and Saban was discussing all their injuries. I want to say olinemen but I could be wrong.

Bama's current injuries (I'm too lazy to confirm, which ones are actually relevant. sorry):

[CB] 12/08/2013 - Bradley Sylve "?" Thursday vs. Oklahoma ( Ankle )
[OL] 12/08/2013 - Ryan Kelly "?" Thursday vs. Oklahoma ( Knee )
[DL] 10/24/2013 - LaMichael Fanning out indefinitely ( Suspension )
[S] 10/21/2013 - Vinnie Sunseri out for season ( Knee )
[DL] 10/02/2013 - Dakota Ball out indefinitely ( Undisclosed )
[DB] 09/25/2013 - Nick Perry out indefinitely ( Shoulder )
[DL] 09/09/2013 - Dalvin Tomlinson out for season ( Knee )
[WR] 09/04/2013 - Kenny Bell has left the team ( Personal )


Of course, I don't count suspensions as those aren't bad luck and things that can be controlled. It's all about the player being responsible. It's the same story on why Snoop Minnis didn't matter in the 2000 season Orange Bowl. He wasn't injured, he was ineligible and that was on him and he probably played in games in the regular season that he probably shouldn't have been playing in either.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Having an easy schedule or just being really good (making most games easy), allows your starters and even 2 deep players to play less snaps. Just the statistics of that will add up. Baylor probably rested their starters more than any other team until the last 5 games. But there are no guarantees as players can get hurt in practice or tear ACLs jumping up and down celebrating a score.

Baylor finally started getting injuries late in the season when their schedule got tougher. Imagine that.

[thecrimsoncrusader]

I don't think OU's injury situations are all that different from anyone else. What has seemed to happen though is OU has had very bad luck with the injuries always being "key" starters as opposed to just starters. Examples this year would be Phillips, Nelson and Millard.

Those guys aren't exactly easily replaceable in terms of either experience, capability or both. Phillips was definitely the biggest loss, but Wade is getting better, but it still plagued with inconsistency. Not uncommon at all for a redshirt freshman NT/DT though.

[jkjsooner]

The only real injuries that you might lay on S&C are the back injuries and the torn bicep/pec muscles that we've had over the years. If they occur because of lack of flexibility then that is on the staff, but they may just be accidents. It is just that these torn pec/bicep injuries are rare in the Pros (like one per year in the league) and we seem to lose players to these every year. The counter to this is that we rarely ever have hamstring injuries which are common as rain in the Pros.

These are more common among people using steroids. Obviously pros have a really stringent steroid policy and you see guys who make it through college without a failed test subsequently fail multiple tests in the pros.

Please don't jump on me. I'm not making any sort of claim here. Just stating that this might be the reason you see more of these in college than the pros. And I'm sure every team has a guy who two who try to skirt the rules on this. As long as it's not a systemic problem then it's just part of the problems you face trying to run a football program.

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

These are more common among people using steroids. Obviously pros have a really stringent steroid policy and you see guys who make it through college without a failed test subsequently fail multiple tests in the pros.

Please don't jump on me. I'm not making any sort of claim here. Just stating that this might be the reason you see more of these in college than the pros. And I'm sure every team has a guy who two who try to skirt the rules on this. As long as it's not a systemic problem then it's just part of the problems you face trying to run a football program.

I'm not jumping on you, if they are using that is on your S&C staff as well.

[Soonerjeepman]

Anyone know who we might get back for the bowl game? and who's out?

Obviously the career/season ending ones..but I know we had 2 olineman out Sat..and then TK. I think Shannon made it back in..

[jkm, the stolen pifwafwi]

Anyone know who we might get back for the bowl game? and who's out?

Obviously the career/season ending ones..but I know we had 2 olineman out Sat..and then TK. I think Shannon made it back in..

Yeah Shannon made it back in. That guy is almost the human cast at this point. Gastelum didn't do poorly but he is really small (I'm assuming he is a walkon?)

[cvsooner]

Shannon, Knight and Colvin are all banged up. How ready they can/will be in three weeks, I dunno. Stoops mentioned Colvin has bad turf toe in his presser? That was news. And of course, Shead and Thompson (Tyrus) didn't play either.

Hit the ice pool and the massage tables, boys. Quick.

[opksooner]

The other side of the coin, fortunately or unfortunately, is that several underclassmen were plugged into the holes caused by injury and in most cases they performed pretty well...or better, IIRC. This bodes well for the next few years. Let's hope coachs Montgomery and Bedenbaugh will create some depth on the OL and DL .......soon.

[8timechamps]

I have no idea if OU is any different than any other team, but the injuries that occurred this year are all pretty common to football.

Corey Nelson - Just caught in an awkward position on Boykin, and tried to make a play from a really bad angle.

Trey Millard - Got rolled up on special teams, again just bad luck.

Jordan Phillips - This one is the only "non-football" injury of the big three. Degenerative disk in his back, so it was going to happen sooner or later.

Some of the more "minor" injuries:

Frank Shannon - Hurt early in the season, has been able to play through it though.

Aaron Colvin - Originally heard it was a shoulder issue, but Stoops said (post OSU) that he's been dealing with a pretty bad case of turf toe...it's amazing to me that he's played as much as he has.

Tryus Thompson/Adam Shead - both have dealt with injuries since getting to Norman, so I suspect they had similar issues in high school. Linemen are prone to injuries.

Keith Ford - Injured ankle on special teams. Is said to be "healthy" now. He played on ST against OSU, but no carries at RB.


I don't think it's the number of injuries this year (as it's probably right in line with most teams), however, the injuries (like '09) hit a few starters, and cost them their seasons. That made it seem worse.

[8timechamps]

Yeah Shannon made it back in. That guy is almost the human cast at this point. Gastelum didn't do poorly but he is really small (I'm assuming he is a walkon?)

Yeah, Gastelum is a walk-on. Just shows how thin we are at LB.

I thought he did a good job of making his calls and being in position, but he was just physically outmatched. Had Shannon not been able to return, I think the game would have gone a much different direction. OSU immediately targeted Gastelum with the run, and scored while he was in.

[JiminyChristmas]

Mike Stoops said on the playback show that Jordan Evans and Torrea Peterson would be back.

Problem is it doesn't appear that Adam Shead or Tyrus Thompson will be back on the OL. I had time to rewatch the 1st half of the game and Farniok really struggled. Just about any successful run play we had went away from him to the right side. He also had trouble getting bull rushed in pass protection and missed picking up at least one stunt. If those guys aren't going to get back, I hope Farniok can make some good strides between now and the bowl game.

[8timechamps]

Mike Stoops said on the playback show that Jordan Evans and Torrea Peterson would be back.

Problem is it doesn't appear that Adam Shead or Tyrus Thompson will be back on the OL. I had time to rewatch the 1st half of the game and Farniok really struggled. Just about any successful run play we had went away from him to the right side. He also had trouble getting bull rushed in pass protection and missed picking up at least one stunt. If those guys aren't going to get back, I hope Farniok can make some good strides between now and the bowl game.


That's not going to be a good thing if Shead/Thompson are out. I really like the potential that Farniok has, but I agree, he was in over his head. I do think playing the whole game was a big benefit to him, and he really did settle down in the second half.

[BoulderSooner79]

Yes, Farniok struggled noticeably and he has the blind side protection (unless we go with KT). The coaches should have time to do position shuffling on the OL, if that produces better results.

[8timechamps]

Yes, Farniok struggled noticeably and he has the blind side protection (unless we go with KT). The coaches should have time to do position shuffling on the OL, if that produces better results.

There were a couple of times they put Green or Rip outside him to help, that worked better, but you lose a guy in the passing game. Farniok has such great size, I really hope his technique can catch up.

[Scott D]

Losing starters to injury was the reason cited for Florida's demise this year.

Florida took 52 Scholarship players to their game @ South Carolina this year.

[BoulderSooner79]

Florida took 52 Scholarship players to their game @ South Carolina this year.

Florida and UGA were both decimated by injuries this year. They must have uber-Schmittys on staff.

[Ruf/Nek7]

I think a potential factor is weight training at a young age. I am a middle school coach and in charge of the weight lifting program during the offseason. All we focus on at this age are squats, bench, and power cleans. Everything else is cardio based and non weight baring.

My point is this, alot of coaches at this age can neglect proper technique. We do one essential lift a day so that i can make sure they are doing it right. You see a ton of players with toes pointed out instead of forward or their knees are not over their toes. That puts more stress on the ACL. It wont effect them immediately but does add up later.

[Scott D]

Florida and UGA were both decimated by injuries this year. They must have uber-Schmittys on staff.

Florida's injuries were more across the board. Georgia's injuries were mainly to key skill position players.

[Scott D]

I think a potential factor is weight training at a young age. I am a middle school coach and in charge of the weight lifting program during the offseason. All we focus on at this age are squats, bench, and power cleans. Everything else is cardio based and non weight baring.

My point is this, alot of coaches at this age can neglect proper technique. We do one essential lift a day so that i can make sure they are doing it right. You see a ton of players with toes pointed out instead of forward or their knees are not over their toes. That puts more stress on the ACL. It wont effect them immediately but does add up later.

Fire Ruf/Nek7!!! ;)

[BoulderSooner79]

Florida's injuries were more across the board. Georgia's injuries were mainly to key skill position players.

And UGA's strength was mostly based on key skill position players. I thought Murray did an incredible job given that he didn't know who he would throw to week to week. And then even Murray went down to a torn ACL. Terrible luck for a guy heading into the draft. Damn-u UGA Schmitty!

[Eielson]

These are more common among people using steroids. Obviously pros have a really stringent steroid policy and you see guys who make it through college without a failed test subsequently fail multiple tests in the pros.

Please don't jump on me. I'm not making any sort of claim here. Just stating that this might be the reason you see more of these in college than the pros. And I'm sure every team has a guy who two who try to skirt the rules on this. As long as it's not a systemic problem then it's just part of the problems you face trying to run a football program.

You really think that steroids aren't common in the NFL?

[OkieThunderLion]

Yeah Shannon made it back in. That guy is almost the human cast at this point. Gastelum didn't do poorly but he is really small (I'm assuming he is a walkon?)

They had the 99-yard drive when Gastelum was in. I think FS's return was mandatory!