Who Is Best Known For The Following Quote?

[FaninAma]

"I saw nothing! I know nothing!"

a. Sgt. Schultz on Hogan's Heroes or



http://www.hawaiireporter.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/sgt-schultz.png

[FaninAma]

BTW, if a Republican Prez had rolled out a program as disasterous as Obamacare his/her approval rating would be in the low 30% range right now as it dropped to the low 20's.

Obama, OTOH, could be caught fornicating with a German Shepherd on Pennsyllvania Avenue and would stay at 40% or above. The fact that he is not held to any degree of competency by those who voted for him is truly depressing and the reason why a lot of us in the middle class are "weeping and whining and talking about leaving the country."

[yermom]

Well, bye

[FaninAma]

Well, bye
Some day, maybe. At least I have that option especially if those of your ilk continue to sell your vote to the highest bidder.

[yermom]

That's a laugh seeing that that the Koch bros have bought yours. Or are you still ignoring that?

And you want to lump me in with some group because I call out BS? I haven't even come out in support of ACA for the most part or Obama

Are you and Rush sharing a playbook now?

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Well, bye

Leftist hack

What about Soros? Hmm? You and your Koch bros. Go find another and real demon. Soros is more evil that Koch family ever was...

[lexsooner]

Some day, maybe. At least I have that option especially if those of your ilk continue to sell your vote to the highest bidder.

Ireland, of all places, if I recall correctly. I can't quite figure that one out. It's one of the most socialist countries in Europe, and the standard of living and quality of life are not near the levels of this country. There's a reason Irish have been emigrating out of Ireland for centuries. Don't get me wrong, I have visited and it is a beautiful country and the people are lovely, but I wouldn't dream of wanting to live there. What does Ireland offer which this country does not? Also, why not stay and fight for your causes instead of talking about leaving?

[yermom]

Leftist hack

What about Soros? Hmm? You and your Koch bros. Go find another and real demon. Soros is more evil that Koch family ever was...

And Soros has anything to do with me because?

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

That's a laugh seeing that that the Koch bros have bought yours. Or are you still ignoring that?

And you want to lump me in with some group because I call out BS? I haven't even come out in support of ACA for the most part or Obama

Are you and Rush sharing a playbook now?haha. We get it. Nonleftist = stupid.

[yermom]

haha. i get it disagree with circlejerk = leftist

[8timechamps]

Well, bye

http://images1.wikia.nocookie.net/__cb20130611112751/villains/images/f/f6/612capture_tombstone03.jpg

[lexsooner]

Slan go foill.

[FaninAma]

Ireland, of all places, if I recall correctly. I can't quite figure that one out. It's one of the most socialist countries in Europe, and the standard of living and quality of life are not near the levels of this country. There's a reason Irish have been emigrating out of Ireland for centuries. Don't get me wrong, I have visited and it is a beautiful country and the people are lovely, but I wouldn't dream of wanting to live there. What does Ireland offer which this country does not? Also, why not stay and fight for your causes instead of talking about leaving?
I have Irish citizenship and an Irish passport. That does give me pretty good access to 27 other countries in the EU. Like I said, I will see how things play out here with the buy-a-vote crowd. I am not optimistic.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

And Soros has anything to do with me because?
figured this would be the response from a Leftist hack... You mentioned one name, I mentioned another more vicious,vile and evil than the one you mentioned.
Are you a student of Alinsky?

[BetterSoonerThanLater]

why are people ok with their leaders lying to them? it baffles me to no end. If i did this kind of **** at my work, i'd have been fired without hesitation, but with these ****ing politicians--most notably the commander in chief-- they get a ****ing pass. what makes Obama so ****ing special that he can outright lie to Americans regarding something like healthcare--not once or twice, but 19 ****ing times--get voted in, take away your ****ing liberties and freedoms, and people are just ok with it.....grow some ****ing balls America!


you voted this bitch into office, hold his *** accountable!!! he works for you.....he's not there to tell you how to live your life, what to eat, how to choose what car to buy, and definately not how to pick your ****ing insurance! we live in a country full of pussies!!! willing to roll over, get pushed around, and treated like ****ing babies, so that they might get some free ****....****ing ridiculous. every Male--and some females-- in my family have fought for this country, only to have half it's people act like whiney ****ing babies. act like adults. Act like Americans! You liberals out there that are still defending this asshat look like pansies. if you were to admit that Obama is wrong, and want him held accountable, rather than trying to rationalize and make excuses for him, I might actually have some respect for you. As it stands, those of you trying to make what he's done seem OK just look pathetic. I have nothing but contempt for you. The days of self responsibility, and holding our country to a higher standard are over. Thank you Liberal America. Lets all go hug some trees, give our money to the fake ****ing greeen initiatives, and phoney ACA, so that we might get some free phones, and sense of entitlement. Give up your freedoms so you can proclaim how fucxking special you are to be part of an America that is turning into just another Socialist country.

Give me a ****ing break. If we had more people willing to be responsible and self reliant, rather than expecting the government to run their lives, we'd be a lot better off.


Rant over. God Bless America, Boomer Sooner!

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

"No, I don't want any of your quiche, Lorraine" -Burford.

[FaninAma]

"Negotiating with Obama is like playing chess with a pigeon.
The pigeon knocks over all the pieces, #$%$ on the board, and then struts around like it won the game!"

----Vladimir Putin




Actually he didn't. But it sounds like him.

[rock on sooner]

Leftist hack

What about Soros? Hmm? You and your Koch bros. Go find another and real demon. Soros is more evil that Koch family ever was...

Big, big money on both sides....Soros isn't even # 1 for Dems and the
Koch Bros aren't for the Pubs...both just happen to be more out front
than other donors.

[yermom]

figured this would be the response from a Leftist hack... You mentioned one name, I mentioned another more vicious,vile and evil than the one you mentioned.
Are you a student of Alinsky?

this is the difference. i don't align with anyone because they are all out for themselves anyway. i don't think anyone represents me, but the popular Republicans seem to be moving further away from anything i would agree with.

[FaninAma]

this is the difference. i don't align with anyone because they are all out for themselves anyway. i don't think anyone represents me, but the popular Republicans seem to be moving further away from anything i would agree with.

What are the top 3 things you disagree with the GOP about.

The top 3 things I disagree with the Dems about:
1. The deficit.
2. They buy votes with taxpayer money
3. Progressives are as bad or worse as any group of religious fanatics at trying to impose their ethical and moral beliefs on the rest of the population. Unlike religious zealots the progressives use the government as their "church" making their impositions hard to ignore.

[KantoSooner]

And the current gaggle of Republicans?

1. Are 99% as bad on the deficit
2. Buy votes with tax dollars
3. Are the religious zealots. And seek to write their faith into generally applicable laws.

seriously, a pox on both their houses. A little less on 'pubs out of respect for what that party once was.

[FaninAma]

And the current gaggle of Republicans?

1. Are 99% as bad on the deficit
2. Buy votes with tax dollars
3. Are the religious zealots. And seek to write their faith into generally applicable laws.

seriously, a pox on both their houses. A little less on 'pubs out of respect for what that party once was.

The GOP support for a balanced budget amendment and non-support for raising the deficit limit are very, very irresponsible.

I take it you are counting tax reductions the same as direct government payouts so letting me keep my own money is the same thing as getting a redistributed handout from another taxpayer. Got it.

I am a libertarian. I don't support religious fanatics of any persuasion even those who worship at the Holy Secular Federal Church.( http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Journalism/2013/11/06/NYT-no-religious-exemption-ENDA ) My pro-life views were developed from 25 years of taking care of kids including 25+ week premature infants.

At least the pubs have some members who are serious about reigning in spending. The Dems demagogue the issue and call for raising taxes that they would turn around and spend instead of applying the new revenue to reducing the budget deficit.

BTW, what are the big differences you see between today's GOP and the GOP of yesteryear?

[KantoSooner]

Fanin,
In defense, I tend to try and look at actions as much as words. Today's deficits, debt and culture of entitlement are only slightly less the product of Republican admins than that of Dems. As far as who gains (and it's always instructive to see who gets the money in the end), I'm seeing a lot of major corporate players getting money from the government and not just in the form of 'tax relief', either. The pork is slathered on by both parties, though their targetted audiences are distinct. (Except in the case of Wall Street. Those lads seem to get paid no matter who's in office.) And one need only look to the continued jihad waged by mostly Republican pols on 'social issues' to see that the 'religious zealot' charge is pretty much made to order.

The Republican Party of today differs from that of old in a couple of big ways. One is that it is far more devoted to and beholden to large financial interests. The 'main street wing' of the party, strong in the first half of the last century has been replaced by bought and paid for shills. (not that the Dems offer anything more palatable, they are simply bought and paid for by a different group of people.) Another is that the party of old was a much more libertarian place and this philosophy was not only spoken about but, to some extent at least, taken as binding upon the speakers. There was a respect for personal liberty, and an understanding that this meant restraint of governmental ambition, that has gone out of the party.
In some ways the change has been one of culture: earlier generations of pols seemed to have had an actual devotion to public service and to operating the government in the common interest. Today's pols seem eager to destroy and tear down far more than to build and sustain. It's partially stylistic, but there's substance there as well.

In other ways, the change is quite simply one of education. Earlier generations of Republican representatives and senators were classically educated men (and a few women). Their decisions and actions were informed by an understanding of history and a reading of political philosophy. The current crop of movers and shakers in the party can not be bothered with hard or boring things, preferring the shiny and momentarily fashionable. They are, in the main, a gaggle of beetle browed, low IQ shoe clerks.

And I apologize to shoe clerks everywhere, that was a nasty shot.

Finally, the party of old had leaders. Look at figures like Henry Cabot Lodge, Goldwater, Ford, even Reagan. These were people who understood big issues and could lead a great nation. The stuffed suits we have today? They can't lead because they don't understand issues, big or small, well enough to articulate policies to themselves much less to the nation as a whole.

Those are some of the things that are different with the Republican Party of today.

[rock on sooner]

Fanin,
In defense, I tend to try and look at actions as much as words. Today's deficits, debt and culture of entitlement are only slightly less the product of Republican admins than that of Dems. As far as who gains (and it's always instructive to see who gets the money in the end), I'm seeing a lot of major corporate players getting money from the government and not just in the form of 'tax relief', either. The pork is slathered on by both parties, though their targetted audiences are distinct. (Except in the case of Wall Street. Those lads seem to get paid no matter who's in office.) And one need only look to the continued jihad waged by mostly Republican pols on 'social issues' to see that the 'religious zealot' charge is pretty much made to order.

The Republican Party of today differs from that of old in a couple of big ways. One is that it is far more devoted to and beholden to large financial interests. The 'main street wing' of the party, strong in the first half of the last century has been replaced by bought and paid for shills. (not that the Dems offer anything more palatable, they are simply bought and paid for by a different group of people.) Another is that the party of old was a much more libertarian place and this philosophy was not only spoken about but, to some extent at least, taken as binding upon the speakers. There was a respect for personal liberty, and an understanding that this meant restraint of governmental ambition, that has gone out of the party.
In some ways the change has been one of culture: earlier generations of pols seemed to have had an actual devotion to public service and to operating the government in the common interest. Today's pols seem eager to destroy and tear down far more than to build and sustain. It's partially stylistic, but there's substance there as well.

In other ways, the change is quite simply one of education. Earlier generations of Republican representatives and senators were classically educated men (and a few women). Their decisions and actions were informed by an understanding of history and a reading of political philosophy. The current crop of movers and shakers in the party can not be bothered with hard or boring things, preferring the shiny and momentarily fashionable. They are, in the main, a gaggle of beetle browed, low IQ shoe clerks.

And I apologize to shoe clerks everywhere, that was a nasty shot.

Finally, the party of old had leaders. Look at figures like Henry Cabot Lodge, Goldwater, Ford, even Reagan. These were people who understood big issues and could lead a great nation. The stuffed suits we have today? They can't lead because they don't understand issues, big or small, well enough to articulate policies to themselves much less to the nation as a whole.

Those are some of the things that are different with the Republican Party of today.

Very nicely stated and well thought out. I would add that Ike, Reagan
and Ford were very much into "let's see where we can get together and
fix this"....Nixon, not so much, a really paranoid man...

Dems back then had good intentions but went about it a little differently..
Kennedy never really had the time, Johnson got a lot of good things through
but was tormented by Vietnam. (Johnson was probably the best back room
politician of the 20th century, imo). After Reagan, the shift you described
began to take hold. Clinton, with all his warts, was adept at taking GOP stuff
and making it his own. Bush the Elder was well intended, Bush the Younger
listened to the wrong advisors, imo....

[FaninAma]

Kanto, the old guard Republican party were compromisers.......compromisers of their principles. That is how we arrived at this point where entitlement programs started by Democrats are chewing through our kids' futures. Compromise is what allowed Tip O'Neil to negotiate with Reagan to get a large tax hike but never follow through with spending cuts. Same thing with Bush I and Bush II.

Republicans are considered statesmen by the media and progressive rabble when they compromise their principles. Never do the critics of the non-compromisers look at the long term consequences of the failure to stand behind principle.

ROS is a perfect example of refusing to look at the consequences of government actions. He actually thinks LBJ did a lot of good things. What a crock of ****. The Great Society, along with FDR's social programs, have brought this country to the precipice of bankruptcy, destroyed entire segments of our society by making the members of those segments dependent on handouts while destroying the fundamental family unit that made their communities strong.

Individuals like him will refuse to see the consequences of these ill-conceived actions even as our economy crashes and burns under the weight of the debt accumulated by these programs and the cohesive strength of strong families is torn apart by a culture of entitlement dependency and avoidance of self-responsibility as poor personal choices are rewarded over and over again.

Social-fascism has been tried many times throughout history as a means to keep a political-corporate elite in control of a society. It has never, ever worked. Ever.

Taking from one person to give to another person according to the value system of the person redistributing the wealth is doomed to failure regardless of how noble you or I may feel about their goals.

And again, the super wealthy are the ones who benefit most from entitlements in a social-fascist system. The poor are just the excuse the government puppets use to seize wealth from current and future generations to funnel it through the entitlement programs in the name of justice and fairness where it eventually ends up in the bank accounts of the Walmarts and JP Morgans of the world.

BTW, aside from the recent Tea Party movement I don't think the GOP has really changed that much. The party that has changed tremendously over the past generation are the Democrats who have thrown aside any pretense that they are anything other than big government desciples who feel that government, along with their big corporate partners, must control every facet of enterprise in our society.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

Republicans are considered statesmen by the media and progressive rabble when they compromise their principles. Never do the critics of the non-compromisers look at the long term consequences of the failure to stand behind principle.

ROS is a perfect example of refusing to look at the consequences of government actions. He actually thinks LBJ did a lot of good things. What a crock of ****. The Great Society, along with FDR's social programs, have brought this country to the precipice of bankruptcy, destroyed entire segments of our society by making the members of those segments dependent on handouts while destroying the fundamental family unit that made their communities strong.

Individuals like him will refuse to see the consequences of these ill-conceived actions even as our economy crashes and burns under the weight of the debt accumulated by these programs and the cohesive strength of strong families is torn apart by a culture of entitlement dependency and avoidance of self-responsibility as poor personal choices are rewarded over and over again.

Social-fascism has been tried many times throughout history as a means to keep a political-corporate elite in control of a society. It has never, ever worked. Ever. (never helped to bring about prosperity)

Taking from one person to give to another person according to the value system of the person redistributing the wealth is doomed to failure regardless of how noble you or I may feel about their goals.

And again, the super wealthy are the ones who benefit most from entitlements in a social-fascist system. The poor are just the excuse the government puppets use to seize wealth from current and future generations to funnel it through the entitlement programs in the name of justice and fairness where it eventually ends up in the bank accounts of the Walmarts and JP Morgans of the world.

BTW, aside from the recent Tea Party movement I don't think the GOP has really changed that much. The party that has changed tremendously over the past generation are the Democrats who have thrown aside any pretense that they are anything other than big government disciples who feel that government, along with their big corporate partners, must control every facet of enterprise in our society.good. Walmart does more good than bad, however, but any American government that usurps its lawful powers is certainly bad for the country. Punitive taxation rates are as well.

The "govt. puppets" are much more than puppets IMHO. They are the people with police powers who enact the confiscation and redistribution. Their pockets become lined as well. Last, but not least are the MSM, Public Schools(and some private schools too), and Entertainment industry, who mostly side with those who are transforming the country, and are causing it to happen.

[KantoSooner]

Fanin,
I think ROS was probably referring to terrible things that LBJ did like the Voting Rights Act. And I'm being facetious when I call it 'terrible'. Just to be clear.

Having principles is necessary. Note the passage in my little screed when I lament the intellectual vacuum that our current crop of politicians represent. It is also necessary, however, as a mature mind, to recognize that even among those who agree with you, there will be variations in opinion on both theory and application. Failure to recognize this is the first step down the road to dogmatic orthodoxy and the authoritarianism that is its inevitable companion. A leader (and all of our politicians, in a representative democracy/republic must be leaders first and foremost) absolutely must understand the principles he or she holds dear so completely that compromises can be reached without damaging those principles fatally.

To fail in this and fall back on a blind, unreasoning orthodoxy is to demand 'my way or the highway'; which position is indistinguishable from dictatorship.

Protestations that the principles of our founders are so fragile that any deviation from a singular path will doom them are ridiculous. The crowning glory of our revolution, our constitution and the thing that made and continues to make this country a turning point in the history of mankind is the rugged flexibility of the enterprise.

Does Barack Obama hold views regarding the role of a citizen and government that I find repugnant or even silly? I believe he does, in some cases. Is he a leftist/socialist/communist? Not unless the accepted definitions of those belief systems has been changed beyond all recognition. He's a bit left of center within the arc of American political thought. And that arc is a small range, placed a bit right of center, in the larger range of political thinking globally.

The last century of American political debate has been overshadowed by Keynes and the school of economic/political thought that he fathered. He was, in turn, the product of a largely European response to our revolution. It took the Europeans a bit longer than it took us to 'get it'. They had to go through the French revolution (which mimicked ours in the way a cartoon mimics fine art) and a dog's breakfast of attempts to think through how you ordered a society once you got rid of feudalism and the medieval church. It is at Keynes' feet that deficit spending and steroidal government must be laid.

That said, we will achieve no lasting victory over Keynes and the many social ills he wrought until such time as we convince the overwhelming majority of citizens that there is a better way forward. (I personally believe that von Hayek provides the architecture of this better way, but I'm aware that I'm in a small minority in naming him as the designer.) And I do not anticipate that we will achieve this shift in conviction or in practice in a single jump. There will be a long process of incremental steps and lots of hard thinking to be done. I believe that considerations of how we make provision for healthcare is one major part of a desireable society that will have to be thought through and I fully anticipate that we will make many adjustments as we go.

None of those adjustments will be evidence that the enterprise is lost. There will undoutedly be unfairnesses along the way. It's a human enterprise, anyway, those things are bound to happen no matter the best intentions. And compromise is an essential mechanism for achieving forward motion. Embrace it.

[FaninAma]

Any country that has such poor economic discipline that they spend the money of future generations at an ever increasing rate is doomed for the ash heap of history.

You can argue about social policy all you want but it isn't nearly as important as the economic policies of a governement. You simply do not mortgage your children's futures for your own selfish interests. It is unethical and immoral.

You do not reward behavior that breaks down the structure of the family.

Nuancing these issues has been the establishment GOP's biggest sin. The Democrats have sold their souls to these policies because they understand that buying votes is the easiest way to stay in power. They are counting on a total lack of discipline from the people who vote for them.

A politician should leave the country's economy and finances in better shape when they leave office.......not stealing their inheritance for their own greedy gains.

Rush, Walmart does zero good in this country unless you count maximizing profits at the expense of local businesses and communities as good.

[KantoSooner]

Walmart has shaved approximately 0.5% inflation off of the national average each year for the last 35-40. Consumer prices would be approximately double what they are now without that one company.
Efficiency in economics is almost never a bad thing.
Why should crappy sourcing and logistics be subsidized by, in essence, a tax on each and every American?

[FaninAma]

Consumer prices would be double? I think that is a bit of an overstatement.

Study after study has revealed Walmart sucks way more out of local economies than they put back in.

http://www.businessnewsdaily.com/2405-real-cost-walmart.html

[KantoSooner]

And common sense realizes that services that were necessary in each and every hamlet when the travel time between OKC and Norman, for example, was the better part of half a day are now no longer necessary....and can be provided far more efficiently in more centralized locations serving far larger audiences.

Buggy whip manufacturers went away without a great deal of angst. I think the demise of the "C. R. Anthony" store on the main street of each county seat in Oklahoma is much the same thing.

And it may well be that the little towns in question no longer have a rationale for their existence, either. Sucks if you like small towns, but life is not Disneyland: without a reason for being, they'll die out.

If you don't like them, don't shop there. It's not like there's no option. You clearly have access to a computer, go to The Internet!

[FaninAma]

And common sense realizes that services that were necessary in each and every hamlet when the travel time between OKC and Norman, for example, was the better part of half a day are now no longer necessary....and can be provided far more efficiently in more centralized locations serving far larger audiences.

Buggy whip manufacturers went away without a great deal of angst. I think the demise of the "C. R. Anthony" store on the main street of each county seat in Oklahoma is much the same thing.

And it may well be that the little towns in question no longer have a rationale for their existence, either. Sucks if you like small towns, but life is not Disneyland: without a reason for being, they'll die out.

If you don't like them, don't shop there. It's not like there's no option. You clearly have access to a computer, go to The Internet!

Henry Potter, is that you? You really need to give the money back you stole back from the Bailey Savings and Loan. Bedford Falls sucked. Pottersville is a much better place to live because I can buy cheap **** at Walmart.

I never shop at Walmart.

[KantoSooner]

I'm glad you never comparison shop. I have a couple of bottles of barbecue sauce I'll give you for the low price of $55 each. Then we can move on early Mercedes for 3X your annual income. Don't pay attention to that Ford guy. We support Craftsmen, after all.

good for you.

Can your fellow citizens be granted the same freedom of choice?

[diverdog]

And common sense realizes that services that were necessary in each and every hamlet when the travel time between OKC and Norman, for example, was the better part of half a day are now no longer necessary....and can be provided far more efficiently in more centralized locations serving far larger audiences.

Buggy whip manufacturers went away without a great deal of angst. I think the demise of the "C. R. Anthony" store on the main street of each county seat in Oklahoma is much the same thing.

And it may well be that the little towns in question no longer have a rationale for their existence, either. Sucks if you like small towns, but life is not Disneyland: without a reason for being, they'll die out.

If you don't like them, don't shop there. It's not like there's no option. You clearly have access to a computer, go to The Internet!

You will be happy to know the buggy whip bidness is alive and well in these parts with all the Amish that live around here.

[FaninAma]

I'm glad you never comparison shop. I have a couple of bottles of barbecue sauce I'll give you for the low price of $55 each. Then we can move on early Mercedes for 3X your annual income. Don't pay attention to that Ford guy. We support Craftsmen, after all.

good for you.

Can your fellow citizens be granted the same freedom of choice?

I'm just giving you a hard time. I guess the sense of family and community that were the backbone of this country are things of the past. Large cities dominate the economic and political landscape now. I still enjoy living in a small town even if I have to commute to the place where I work.

Of course everybody should be given the freedom of choice just like they are given the freedom to have kids out of wedlock while expecting strangers to support them. Being married and able to support yourself and your family before having kids seems to be an out-dated principle in this society, too.


Being a member of a flourishing society carries some responsibilities....not just perks.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

jut perks.free jaw jobs?

[KantoSooner]

Fanin, as a former PTA officer (and that, if you've never done it, is the definition of politics), worker at every neighborhood holiday bazaar, canoe-ist down rivers picker up of garbage, loyal farmers market shopper and local diner diner, I get it. I love me my 'hood...both in big cities and in small towns where I lived. And I understand that it has to supported to persist.

Hell, I probably 'get it' more than most because I grew up in ex-pat communities overseas and whatever 'American community-ness' we had had to be carefully nurtured by getting very high percentage involvement going.

But I don't want that to be mandatory. And I strongly believe in the power of market economics to make things better long term. So, I'm in favor of things like PikePass, even though it reduces toll taker jobs; I like ATMs though they cuts teller jobs and I will shop at Walmart (for some stuff) and get coffee at Starbucks sometimes, even though neither one is a bastion of service/neighborhood/local economy etc.

All of that said, I must admit to confusion over a link between shopping at Walmart and having kids out of wedlock with the demonic intent of foisting their care onto one's neighbors. Perhaps Kingfisher's own Mr. Sam had a dark side we haven't heard enough about...

[FaninAma]

Fanin, as a former PTA officer (and that, if you've never done it, is the definition of politics), worker at every neighborhood holiday bazaar, canoe-ist down rivers picker up of garbage, loyal farmers market shopper and local diner diner, I get it. I love me my 'hood...both in big cities and in small towns where I lived. And I understand that it has to supported to persist.

Hell, I probably 'get it' more than most because I grew up in ex-pat communities overseas and whatever 'American community-ness' we had had to be carefully nurtured by getting very high percentage involvement going.

But I don't want that to be mandatory. And I strongly believe in the power of market economics to make things better long term. So, I'm in favor of things like PikePass, even though it reduces toll taker jobs; I like ATMs though they cuts teller jobs and I will shop at Walmart (for some stuff) and get coffee at Starbucks sometimes, even though neither one is a bastion of service/neighborhood/local economy etc.

All of that said, I must admit to confusion over a link between shopping at Walmart and having kids out of wedlock with the demonic intent of foisting their care onto one's neighbors. Perhaps Kingfisher's own Mr. Sam had a dark side we haven't heard enough about...

The connection? Think about the consequences of your actions. Have some semblance of priorities in your life like what is best for family and community. Think about how you would like to be treated by the community you live in. If I were a local businessman I would like to think that my loyalty and service to the community mattered more than how cheap you could buy imported stuff from China at a big box retailer who sends their profits out of town.

[KantoSooner]

The connection? Think about the consequences of your actions. Have some semblance of priorities in your life like what is best for family and community. Think about how you would like to be treated by the community you live in. If I were a local businessman I would like to think that my loyalty and service to the community mattered more than how cheap you could buy imported stuff from China at a big box retailer who sends their profits out of town.

I'll alert the tailors and shoemakers of your town and tell them not to fret, that you'll be by shortly to get fitted for the one suit of clothes you'll be able to afford this year.

By the way, my neighbor is feeling poorly; I'm assuming that, as an old country doctor, you do housecalls on weekends. PM me your landland phone number and I'll tell you where to come. Note: you'll be paid in chickens and good will. I'm sure that won't be a problem for as civic natured a man as you seem to be.

[KantoSooner]

Here's another useful concept:

The Luddites were 19th-century English textile artisans who protested against newly developed labour-saving machinery from 1811 to 1817. The stocking frames, spinning frames and power looms introduced during the Industrial Revolution threatened to replace the artisans with less-skilled, low-wage labourers, leaving them without work.

Although the origin of the name Luddite (/ˈlʌd.aɪt/) is uncertain, a popular theory is that the movement was named after Ned Ludd, a youth who allegedly smashed two stocking frames in 1779, and whose name had become emblematic of machine destroyers.[1][2][3] The name evolved into the imaginary General Ludd or King Ludd, a figure who, like Robin Hood, was reputed to live in Sherwood Forest.[4][a]

[FaninAma]

Kanto, it is very entertaining to watch you construct all of these straw men and then knock the stuffing out of them. I wished OU's OL had hit Baylor with such ferocity.

Walmart and the other big box retail stores haven't done anything to advance technology or developed any new, more efficient manufacturing models. They are experts in lining up cheap vendors(usually from 3rd world countries), using predatory pricing against local competition and paying employees as little as they can get away with. If all the Walmart's, Home Depots and Costcos went out of business tomorrow they wouldn't be missed.

[rock on sooner]

Kanto, it is very entertaining to watch you construct all of these straw men and then knock the stuffing out of them. I wished OU's OL had hit Baylor with such ferocity.

Walmart and the other big box retail stores haven't done anything to advance technology or developed any new, more efficient manufacturing models. They are experts in lining up cheap vendors(usually from 3rd world countries), using predatory pricing against local competition and paying employees as little as they can get away with. If all the Walmart's, Home Depots and Costcos went out of business tomorrow they wouldn't be missed.

I agree with about cheap vendors (actually, brow beaten vendors is more like it),
predatory pricing is a sound business model, and paying employees as little as they
can is also a sound business model. I find that reprehensible as an individual, but
as a 40+ year veteran of retail business, it is a no brainer.

As far as advancing technology, bar coding comes from these guys. That means
accurate product sales tracking, FIFO product, remarkably accurate product sales
projections, which behind that is accurate restocking...almost perfect best seller
availability and nut busting product control, translating into higher profits. Nope,
my friend, to say that Walmart and other big box folks haven't contributed is way
off base.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

Besides, I love me some cheap chinese crap.

[KantoSooner]

Fanin, you can misuse the term 'strawman' all you want. You're welcome to it. What I find a bit odd, to be frank, is your supposed devotion to freedom, liberty, a mystical 'American Way', capitalism and all that good stuff...at the same time you seem to favor some kind of .... what? ....control? over the economic sphere of life to foment the outbreak of wise behavior and family values.
I can understand the near rage you demonstrate in many of your posts. It is terribly frustrating to attempt to make cohesive opposed principles. Particularly if you don't understand them to be opposed. Unless your board persona is a complete fiction, however, you did complete med school and that is no mean intellectual feat. I am assuming that that course of study and the subsequent years spent pursuing a medical career left little time for reading or consideration of thinkers such as Aristotle, Marx, Jesus, Plato, Burke, Mill, Rawls, etc. Absence of that foundation would logically result in precisely the type of incoherence your arguments demonstrate.

[diverdog]

Kanto, it is very entertaining to watch you construct all of these straw men and then knock the stuffing out of them. I wished OU's OL had hit Baylor with such ferocity.

Walmart and the other big box retail stores haven't done anything to advance technology or developed any new, more efficient manufacturing models. They are experts in lining up cheap vendors(usually from 3rd world countries), using predatory pricing against local competition and paying employees as little as they can get away with. If all the Walmart's, Home Depots and Costcos went out of business tomorrow they wouldn't be missed.

Fanin:

I am not a big fan of Walmart but I do have to weigh in here. You may not see it but Walmart is a remarkable company and they are extremely innovative on moving large quantities of merchandise and getting it to market. There was a great doco on CNBC about their supply systems, software and infrastructure. What they do is extremely hard to replicate. They are masters along with Home Depot and Lowes on keeping inventory at almost the exact level that they need to carry on business but not have an over capacity.

I think the real problem with Walmart is that they are not really a philanthropical company and that started with Sam Walton who really did not believe in charity from what I have been told. He felt giving families the lowest possible prices was the best way to help them. It would be nice if they could pay a living wage though.

[Turd_Ferguson]

Fanin:

I am not a big fan of Walmart but I do have to weigh in here. You may not see it but Walmart is a remarkable company and they are extremely innovative on moving large quantities of merchandise and getting it to market. There was a great doco on CNBC about their supply systems, software and infrastructure. What they do is extremely hard to replicate. They are masters along with Home Depot and Lowes on keeping inventory at almost the exact level that they need to carry on business but not have an over capacity.

I think the real problem with Walmart is that they are not really a philanthropical company and that started with Sam Walton who really did not believe in charity from what I have been told. He felt giving families the lowest possible prices was the best way to help them. It would be nice if they could pay a living wage though.

and yet...thousands of people decide to take a job at an unlivable wage. Weird.

[yermom]

and yet...thousands of people decide to take a job at an unlivable wage. Weird.

i guess it works out since they are still poor enough to be on Medicaid:

http://democrats.edworkforce.house.gov/sites/democrats.edworkforce.house.gov/files/documents/WalMartReport-May2013.pdf

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

i guess it works out since they are still poor enough to be on Medicaid:

http://democrats.edworkforce.house.gov/sites/democrats.edworkforce.house.gov/files/documents/WalMartReport-May2013.pdfThey could qualify for Medicaid and receive it, or Walmart could charge more for their stuff, and drive up the cost of consumer products. Walmart's competition could behave the same as Walmart. I don't know which of them do, and which don't. In order to compete with Walmart, the smart firms would keep their costs down. The consumer benefits from lower prices. Meanwhile, government JUST MIGHT be able to find some ways to cut fat and waste, besides just the ways Anti-Capitalists suggest.

[FaninAma]

They could qualify for Medicaid and receive it, or Walmart could charge more for their stuff, and drive up the cost of consumer products. Walmart's competition could behave the same as Walmart. I don't know which of them do, and which don't. In order to compete with Walmart, the smart firms would keep their costs down. .

So, do you think it is okay for taxpayers to subsidize big corporations like Walmart and their competitors through entitlement programs like Medicaid and the SNAP program? If so would you be so kind as to give me your definition of corporate fascism?

Who is credited with the following quote? :


“ The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism — ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. ”

It is quite ironic actually because this is the same person who helped launch the process of centralizing power in this country that has made it easier for powerful private interests to gain access to and control the use of that power.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

“ The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism — ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. ”

Rodney Dangerfield

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

So, do you think it is okay for taxpayers to subsidize big corporations like Walmart and their competitors through entitlement programs like Medicaid and the SNAP program? If so would you be so kind as to give me your definition of corporate fascism?

Who is credited with the following quote? :


“ The first truth is that the liberty of a democracy is not safe if the people tolerate the growth of private power to a point where it becomes stronger than their democratic state itself. That, in its essence, is fascism — ownership of government by an individual, by a group, or by any other controlling private power. ”

It is quite ironic actually because this is the same person who helped launch the process of centralizing power in this country that has made it easier for powerful private interests to gain access to and control the use of that power.Is it the job of government to require a business to provide health care to its employees? Of course it isn't. It's also not the responsibility of government to provide free health care to its citizens, IMHO. No more a responsibility than it is to provide food or housing.

[FaninAma]

Is it the job of government to require a business to provide health care to its employees? Of course it isn't. It's also not the responsibility of government to provide free health care to its citizens, IMHO. No more a responsibility than it is to provide food or housing.

i agree. My criticism is soley reserved for those individuals who shop at Walmart indicating their priority of buying cheap, imported **** outweighs any sense of community.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

As far as I know, Walmart does offer the lowest prices on most of the things they sell, and it make sense to me to pay the lowest prices for comparable stuff. Who said "a penny saved is a penny earned"?

[FaninAma]

I disagree. The well-being of my family and my community should have a higher priority than saving a few pennies on **** made in China and Indonesia.

If people keep having priorites that cause them to shop at Walmart over local merchamts then they deserve to have their kids being forced to work for companies like Walmart.

[yermom]

and it's not even comparable crap. quality keeps getting diluted with Chinese junk that falls apart. even from brands that used to be quality are now made in China and lots of what you buy from Walmart only lasts after a short time before you have to just buy it again. does that even really save anyone money?

[KantoSooner]

Just a brief note on quality.

I worked for a while for a company that manufactured in Minneapolis, Colorado Springs, Penang and Nagano. Every last item that came out of our Minneapolis facility that we sold in Asia had to be remanufactured upon arrival. It was utter junk. We finally had to sign contracts with our Asian customers ensuring that they would not ever receive anything from our USA plants. The quality was just too unreliable for use in mondern production llines.

"American-Made" is no guarantee of quality.

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

and it's not even comparable crap. quality keeps getting diluted with Chinese junk that falls apart. even from brands that used to be quality are now made in China and lots of what you buy from Walmart only lasts after a short time before you have to just buy it again. does that even really save anyone money?Haha, shop elsewhere, or make your own widget rotator-processor. Boycott Walmart and any other company that doesn't provide healthcare to its employees...oh, wait...haha.

[yermom]

Haha, shop elsewhere, or make your own widget rotator-processor. Boycott Walmart and any other company that doesn't provide healthcare to its employees...oh, wait...haha.

well, now that is the standard thanks to them and similar retailers. good luck finding much else

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

well, now that is the standard thanks to them and similar retailers. good luck finding much elsegood luck to us all, whilst we wait for Obamacare to fully encompass...

[FaninAma]

Fanin, you can misuse the term 'strawman' all you want. You're welcome to it. What I find a bit odd, to be frank, is your supposed devotion to freedom, liberty, a mystical 'American Way', capitalism and all that good stuff...at the same time you seem to favor some kind of .... what? ....control? over the economic sphere of life to foment the outbreak of wise behavior and family values.
I can understand the near rage you demonstrate in many of your posts. It is terribly frustrating to attempt to make cohesive opposed principles. Particularly if you don't understand them to be opposed. Unless your board persona is a complete fiction, however, you did complete med school and that is no mean intellectual feat. I am assuming that that course of study and the subsequent years spent pursuing a medical career left little time for reading or consideration of thinkers such as Aristotle, Marx, Jesus, Plato, Burke, Mill, Rawls, etc. Absence of that foundation would logically result in precisely the type of incoherence your arguments demonstrate.

Strawmen and hyperbole! Wow! Is it possible to carry on an exchange of opinion without you trying to pigeon hole the individual you are conversing with?

[KantoSooner]

I was trying to figure out the basis for your argument. Once I figured out that it was based on mutually exclusive premises, the source of your anger and frustration became clear. As did the pointlessness of addressing the argument itself. Cheers and Happy Turkey Day.

[FaninAma]

I was trying to figure out the basis for your argument. Once I figured out that it was based on mutually exclusive premises, the source of your anger and frustration became clear. As did the pointlessness of addressing the argument itself. Cheers and Happy Turkey Day.

All assumptions on your part. I have several assumptions about you. I just prefer to keep them out of the conversation because they really serve no purpose in promoting a civil exchange. Happy Thanksgiving to you, too.