The Dems Ultimate Goal?

[FaninAma]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloward–Piven_strategy

i can't think of any other reason why they have such little regard for future generations and are willing to continue to add crippling debt to future generations. Of course I may be gving them too much credit. I think most of the spittle spewing liberals are actually quite intellectually impaired.

[badger]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloward–Piven_strategy

i can't think of any other reason why they have such little regard for future generations and are willing to continue to add crippling debt to future generations. Of course I may be gving them too much credit. I think most of the spittle spewing liberals are actually quite intellectually impaired.

People in general are more focused on the here and now rather than the future. It's one of the main reasons personal debt is so high.

I know that things look bad right now, but economies and politics are both cyclical --- one side rises only to later fall. In the mid-aughts, it was thought that the Republicans would never lose control of the government, then the 2006 midterms happened.

I'm not certain what this midterm holds, but I have heard reports that Democrats are doing poorly with fundraising and building warchests compared to Republicans. Booker's NJ Senate win was only by 11 points, compared with the 27 points he was originally favored by in an ultra liberal state (don't bother reminding me who the governor is --- you all know that Obama carried it by a wide margin in '12). Imagine what could happen with Koch and other Republican supports' money at midterm in '14.

In the meantime, if you are really worried, take personal responsibility for your own future and family's wellbeing. What does your emergency fund look like? Your emergency supplies? Is your food pantry full of canned goods, preferably ones that didn't expire several years ago? Do you know your neighbors and have their contact info? Are your largest assets insured, including your health?

[rock on sooner]

As to Booker and his victory margin, I think he thought he could coast
in the end and his opponent was far more motivated than first thought.
What will really be interesting to watch is the next full term election and
what Booker does.

[okie52]

Critics Say Christie Strategy Sealed Booker Victory
Thursday, 17 Oct 2013 09:53 AM
By John Gizzi

Although most pundits believe the easy win by Democrat Cory Booker in the New Jersey special Senate election Wednesday was a foregone conclusion, there's another theory: Had Republican Gov. Chris Christie handled the situation differently, the outcome might have been quite different.

"Had Gov. Christie appointed a moderate-conservative with a known name — say, [state Senate Republican Leader] Tom Kean Jr. — after [incumbent Frank] Lautenberg died, and then scheduled the Senate race for the same day as the race for governor, Booker might just have been defeated," a former Republican U.S. House member told Newsmax.

Christie did none of the above.

Following Lautenberg's death in June, the governor named fellow Republican and state Attorney General Jeff Chiesa to serve as senator for four months.

Chiesa would not run for a full term and, in a move that disappointed many fellow Republicans, the governor chose the unusual date of Oct. 16 — a Wednesday — rather than Nov. 5, for the special election.

Had he chosen the latter, the Republican Senate nominee would be on the ticket with Christie the same day of what is shaping up to be his landslide re-election over Democratic state Sen. Barbara Buono.

Instead, Republican Steve Lonegan was handily defeated Wednesday by Booker, who won 59 percent of the vote.

Critics of Christie's strategy sharply contrast his "hands-off" attitude on the race to that of the late Michigan Gov. George Romney when faced with a similar situation in 1966.

While running for re-election that year, the father of 2012 Republican presidential nominee Mitt Romney placed maximum priority on securing a full term for the Republican he had appointed to a Senate vacancy.

Following the death of Democratic Sen. Patrick McNamara on April 30, 1966, Romney appointed Republican Rep. Robert P. Griffin, who already was seeking the Republican Senate nod. Griffin was facing a stiff battle in the fall from former Democratic Gov. G. Mennen "Soapy" Williams.

"The governor started out the canvassing three weeks earlier than in 1964 and worked harder," wrote pundits Stephen Hess and David Broder in their classic 1967 book "The Republican Establishment." "He opened a joint headquarters in Detroit, an arrangement previously unheard of in a Romney campaign. On bus placards, billboards, brochures, and television, Romney and Griffin were paired as 'The Action Team for the Action State.'"

"The governor's speeches actually seemed to gloss over his own accomplishments in order to dwell at length on the need to elect Griffin," who Romney called "the ablest man Michigan has sent to the Senate since Arthur Vandenberg."

Bill Gnodtke, who worked on Griffin's campaign doing everything from licking stamps to driving the candidate, vividly recalled Romney's assistance.

"Gov. Romney really went all-out for Bob Griffin," Gnodtke, who would go on to become finance chairman and treasurer of the Michigan Republican Party, told Newsmax, "He did regional TV spots with him, marched with him at the Labor Day parade in Detroit, and had him on the campaign bus.

"When the governor spoke of a Romney 'Action Team,' he meant Bob Griffin, his running-mates for lieutenant governor, state attorney general, and secretary of state, and our legislative candidates," Gnodtke said.

"Sensational," is how Romney himself described the November results. In gaining the second-largest gubernatorial majority in Michigan history, he swept all but the largest and smallest of Michigan counties (Wayne and Keweenaw).

As Romney won by 527,047 votes, Griffin defeated Williams by 294,146 votes to become Michigan's first elected Republican senator in 14 years. The GOP won five contested U.S. House races in the state, took over the state senate, and scored a tie in the state House of Representatives.

With all 120 seats in the New Jersey legislature up for election on Nov. 5, Republicans need net gains of five to take control of the state Senate and nine to win the Assembly. With his eye on the White House, the governor might well consider what a Christie "Action Team" might do for New Jersey and for him.

John Gizzi is chief political columnist and White House correspondent for Newsmax.

Read Latest Breaking News from Newsmax.com http://www.newsmax.com/John-Gizzi/Christie-Booker-senate-election/2013/10/17/id/531562#ixzz2hzvEJgwE


Christie continues to disappoint...

[badger]

To Christie's credit, he's not a Republican Party puppet. I don't know what the future holds for him as far as being president or controlling his state Senate or whatever, but he's like our Coburn --- eff the critics, eff the party leaders, I'm doing what I think is best for my state and my country

[okie52]

To Christie's credit, he's not a Republican Party puppet. I don't know what the future holds for him as far as being president or controlling his state Senate or whatever, but he's like our Coburn --- eff the critics, eff the party leaders, I'm doing what I think is best for my state and my country

I disagree...I think Christie only does what he thinks is best for Christie.

[badger]

I disagree...I think Christie only does what he thinks is best for Christie.

We'll see how that's working out for him in November, won't we? Before he can think about president, he's gotta win New Jersey first!

[yermom]

i guess we'll see how it goes for the Swiss

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/04/us-swiss-pay-idUSBRE9930O620131004

[cleller]

Some things might work for the Swiss, but not America. I mean, 90% of your Swiss population gets up in the morning, sweeps their sidewalk, has some cocoa, then makes watches, shoes, or banks all day. They then have a nice sensible dinner, listen to some classical music and go to bed.

I'd pay people to live that way, too.

[okie52]

i guess we'll see how it goes for the Swiss

http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/04/us-swiss-pay-idUSBRE9930O620131004


A separate proposal to limit monthly executive pay to no more than what the company's lowest-paid staff earn in a year, the so-called 1:12 initiative, faces a popular vote on November 24.


Hmmm...that would be interesting...suicidal for businesses but interesting nonetheless.

[okie52]

We'll see how that's working out for him in November, won't we? Before he can think about president, he's gotta win New Jersey first!

He looks like a lock for governor...

[rock on sooner]

I disagree...I think Christie only does what he thinks is best for Christie.

Welp, I think yer on ta somethin' Look up the definition of politician
and yewl see a pic of Christie providing a caption of just what you describe...

[FaninAma]

To Christie's credit, he's not a Republican Party puppet. I don't know what the future holds for him
Open heart triple bypass surgery, most likely.

In all seriousness if Christie somehow manages towin the GOP nomination for Pres he will suffer the same fate as Romney. The. GOP bahe will stay home and the Democrat candidatewill eek out a 2 to 4% victory in the general election.

[FaninAma]

http://kff.org/medicaid/state-indicator/growth-in-medicaid-spending/
The average cost of Medicaid over the past 2 deacades has gone up 6.8% PER YEAR in this country. This is before 20+ million people are added to the medicaid rolls.

The Medicaid program was designed as a safety met for kids. Guess what is going to happen to that safety net? Whereis the extra money coming from? Are we raising taxes? Are we borrowing more of our kids' money? Are we going to take money from Medicare and seniors?

[badger]

Open heart triple bypass surgery, most likely.

In all seriousness if Christie somehow manages towin the GOP nomination for Pres he will suffer the same fate as Romney. The. GOP bahe will stay home and the Democrat candidatewill eek out a 2 to 4% victory in the general election.

Oh yeah, seeing people like him that clearly don't give a sh!t about their health motivates me to do another set of jump ropes twice a week :(

Since it relates to the discussion, we can see how seriously people take personal responsibility when we see how seriously people take their health. It is not a blanket view of everyone, as some people just have poor health through no fault of their own. I remember Michael Moore suddenly lost a ton of weight after he did his "Sicko" documentary. I guess he realized that his personal health was not something that the government could, nor would, ever be responsible for.

[diverdog]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloward–Piven_strategy

i can't think of any other reason why they have such little regard for future generations and are willing to continue to add crippling debt to future generations. Of course I may be gving them too much credit. I think most of the spittle spewing liberals are actually quite intellectually impaired.

Dick Cheney, Quote: You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter. We won the mid-term elections, this is our due. to Paul O'Neill, then Treasury Secretary

The right doesn't give a **** about it
either.

[SoonerProphet]

Dick Cheney, Quote: You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter. We won the mid-term elections, this is our due. to Paul O'Neill, then Treasury Secretary

The right doesn't give a **** about it
either.

No doubt about that, Reagan and Bush II are excellent examples of explosive deficit spending. Hell, we started two wars and told folks to light up their credit cards.

[Turd_Ferguson]

No doubt about that, Reagan and Bush II are excellent examples of explosive deficit spending. Hell, we started two wars and told folks to light up their credit cards.

Bull****...get your facts straight before coming in here running your ***** *** liberal mouth.

[SoonerProphet]

Bull****...get your facts straight before coming in here running your ***** *** liberal mouth.

snopes

http://www.snopes.com/politics/politicians/nationaldebt.asp

[olevetonahill]

snopes

http://www.snopes.com/politics/politicians/nationaldebt.asp

Please tell me you aint that ****ing stupid? Comparing Reagan's 8 years to Obammy's 3 ?

[yermom]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=cognitive+dissonance

[diverdog]

Please tell me you aint that ****ing stupid? Comparing Reagan's 8 years to Obammy's 3 ?

Vet,

if you adjust Reagans debts to 2012 dollars they would come in at $3 trillion dollars. Not as bad as Obama but still pretty ****ing bad. And Reagan did not have two wars or bank failures to deal with when he came into office. He spent like a drunken whore and was not much better than what we got today in spending terms. Still I would take Reagan over Obama.

[FaninAma]

Dick Cheney, Quote: You know, Paul, Reagan proved that deficits don't matter. We won the mid-term elections, this is our due. to Paul O'Neill, then Treasury Secretary

The establishment politicians of both partiesdon't give a **** about it
either.

FIFY. You're welcome.

[FaninAma]

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=cognitive+dissonance

Does that explain the conundrum the Democrat progressives find themselves in due to the fact that the more they increase government entitlements and government debt the wider the income gap between rich and poor becomes? Or are they even astute enough to see the correlation between the 2 trends?

[olevetonahill]

Vet,

if you adjust Reagans debts to 2012 dollars they would come in at $3 trillion dollars. Not as bad as Obama but still pretty ****ing bad. And Reagan did not have two wars or bank failures to deal with when he came into office. He spent like a drunken whore and was not much better than what we got today in spending terms. Still I would take Reagan over Obama.

Thats the thing Bro with stats like these they are always being "ADJUSTED" to suit some ones point.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

I disagree...I think Christie only does what he thinks is best for Christie.
^^this. Christy is a compete *******.

[diverdog]

Thats the thing Bro with stats like these they are always being "ADJUSTED" to suit some ones point.

Vet, if we are going to compare the two then the measurement should be apples to apples. My point is that both parties have a big spending problem. Neither of them should be immune to criticism. And yes Obama has been the worst of the lot.

[olevetonahill]

Vet, if we are going to compare the two then the measurement should be apples to apples. My point is that both parties have a big spending problem. Neither of them should be immune to criticism. And yes Obama has been the worst of the lot.

Thats cool Bro, Apples to Apples. But prophet seemed to be trying to use Reagan's 8 years and comparing only 3 of Obammy's

That aint Apples to Apples in my book.

I agree the Dems are the worst when it comes to spending :cocksure:

[yermom]

Does that explain the conundrum the Democrat progressives find themselves in due to the fact that the more they increase government entitlements and government debt the wider the income gap between rich and poor becomes? Or are they even astute enough to see the correlation between the 2 trends?

i've yet to see anyone on the R side give a crap about the income gap. their solution seems to be "don't be poor"

the seem to be just fine with harvesting the middle class for their corporate masters

[yermom]

Thats cool Bro, Apples to Apples. But prophet seemed to be trying to use Reagan's 8 years and comparing only 3 of Obammy's

That aint Apples to Apples in my book.

I agree the Dems are the worst when it comes to spending :cocksure:

still, St. Ronnie spent a ton of money we didn't have, and is revered by current right wingers, despite the fact that he would be a labeled a communist collaborator that hated America if he was in politics today

[Turd_Ferguson]

still, St. Ronnie spent a ton of money we didn't have, and is revered by current right wingers, despite the fact that he would be a labeled a communist collaborator that hated America if he was in politics today

Are you high....again?

[olevetonahill]

i've yet to see anyone on the R side give a crap about the income gap. their solution seems to be "don't be poor"

the seem to be just fine with harvesting the middle class for their corporate masters

Im very concerned about the "Income Gap" Bro. I just dont think we need to be playing ****in Robin Hood.

[FaninAma]

i've yet to see anyone on the R side give a crap about the income gap. their solution seems to be "don't be poor"

the seem to be just fine with harvesting the middle class for their corporate masters

If you don't care to address that dichotomy in Democrat policy how about the fact that they want to push immigration from a 3rd world country so those immigrants can compete with the lower wage earners in this country despite the fact that our lower wage earners' income has been stagnant for over a decade?

Doesn't make a lot of f'ing sense does it for the supposed party of the poor to want to encourage competition for our lower wage earners. And isn't it funny that Wall Street and corporate America are all for immigration reform? Why is that? It couldn't be because they want to lower their labor costs could it? Nah.

And what do the massive entitlement programs really do? They subsidize large corporations and allow them to continue to pay below subsistent wages and reap bigger profits once again proving we live in a fascist-corporate style of government with the Democratic party being the worst about propping up this style of government.

You are being manipulated emotionally by the fascists in the government and you continue to allow yourself to be manipulated because you refuse to understand who is really profiting from big government programs.

[yermom]

you don't have to push immigration. they are here. unless you are willing to shoot them en masse as they climb some wall, you have to do something other than the current way. it's not really working.

both sides are manipulated. i'm not really buying into anything, just that the radical extremes on either side are ****ing crazy. it's just that the crazies on the right are scarier.

[olevetonahill]

you don't have to push immigration. they are here. unless you are willing to shoot them en masse as they climb some wall, you have to do something other than the current way. it's not really working.

both sides are manipulated. i'm not really buying into anything, just that the radical extremes on either side are ****ing crazy. it's just that the crazies on the right are scarier.

Crazy is Crazy My friend. They both skeery!

[Since71ASooner4Life]

snopes

http://www.snopes.com/politics/politicians/nationaldebt.asp


percentages give one impression. How about absolute dollars/year, or inflation adjusted absolute dollars/year? Little different story.

[cleller]

I'm very concerned about the income gap. Obama sure doesn't seem to give a crap, though. He's all about propping up the rich bankers, and laying the burden on the working stiffs and later generations. Who has really prospered under Obama? The investor class, and the wealthy.

I express my concern about the wage gap by being incredulous at the steps the left has taken to increase poor's reliance on govt, vs learning to support yourself. It should be crystal clear to anyone who has seen poor communities firsthand that a critical concept is working and earning for yourself.
People who do not earn something don't appreciate it if its handed to them. Look at low income housing for starters.

[Since71ASooner4Life]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloward–Piven_strategy

i can't think of any other reason why they have such little regard for future generations and are willing to continue to add crippling debt to future generations. Of course I may be gving them too much credit. I think most of the spittle spewing liberals are actually quite intellectually impaired.


the key phrase in the article is Redistribution of Wealth. When you boil it all down, that is the fundamental make up of the soul of every liberal - believing it their right, on the basis of fairness which they are the judge of, to shamelessly reach into the pocket of their neighbor. Liberals aren't concerned about debt, because they feel zero personal attachment and responsibility toward it.

Sad to say, but barring another economic crisis which drives people to reach for drastic changes out of a sense of desperation, coinciding with the timing of a presidential election, we've seen our last conservative in the White House. Those who enjoy having Robin Hood reach into their neighbors pockets on their behalf now out number those having their pockets reached into. And the percentages/birth rates of those feeding at the government trough continue to swing further in Liberal Hood's favor each year. Waiting for the masses to start voting against their entitlements is like sitting with Linus in the pumpkin patch.

Raise your kids right and they'll do fine despite the liberal parasites around them

[Since71ASooner4Life]

i've yet to see anyone on the R side give a crap about the income gap. their solution seems to be "don't be poor"

the seem to be just fine with harvesting the middle class for their corporate masters


I don't like to see human suffering anywhere. But having traveled the world and been to places like Mexico City, Sao Paulo, Johannesburg, you come to realize poverty is a way of live for much more of the planet, than is prosperity a way of life. Why is that? I presume it's natural selection and the fact that all men aren't created equal from the shoulders up. The United States is young/underpopulated by comparison, so that eventuality in a society hasn't had time to play out yet, but it will.

Should the United States be exempt from having poverty and a sizable underclass? I guess is we lived in isolation from the rest of the world it could be possible to have such a socialist society. But the world has changed and everyone is competing against those around the world who do similar work. In a free economy, there is no more logical reason for unskilled people here to fare any better than those in the same boat in other countries. That is just the economic reality of supply and demand. The liberal ideology to prop them up by robbing the skilled class sounds compassionate, but its an unsustainable economic proposition.

Politically it's not nice to say what I've written and neither the left or right will ever admit such things. But it is a fact of human existence that that there is no such thing as a society without a poor class. During the Martin Luther King tribute which Obama turned into a democratic pep rally, he actually said one of the few practical statements I've ever heard him make - that globalization and technology had decimated economic prospects for the unskilled labor class. That is a fact. But unless you believe globalization and technology will reverse themselves, it's a fact that isn't going away.

So I guess it boils down to a question of do we want redistribution/socialism or free market capitalism? I prefer the latter - not because of the reality it entails for the poor class, but because I want better for my family then socialism offers. Like Margaret Thatcher said - socialism is great until other peoples money runs out. So I guess the Republicans offer good advice - don't be poor.

[Rogue]

Damn, they're onto our plan now, thanks to those do-gooder social workers. And I'd have gotten away with it too, if it wasn't for you meddling kids!

[TheHumanAlphabet]

Fan is right, its all a shell game to bring down the capitalist society and supplant it with a central govt. based model. The link by Fan is the whole game the Leftist is trying to implement. Valerie Jarret and the Chicago mob...The Leftist is too stupid to do this on his own... He has been groomed since early in college to get to be POTUS...

[diverdog]

If you don't care to address that dichotomy in Democrat policy how about the fact that they want to push immigration from a 3rd world country so those immigrants can compete with the lower wage earners in this country despite the fact that our lower wage earners' income has been stagnant for over a decade?

Doesn't make a lot of f'ing sense does it for the supposed party of the poor to want to encourage competition for our lower wage earners. And isn't it funny that Wall Street and corporate America are all for immigration reform? Why is that? It couldn't be because they want to lower their labor costs could it? Nah.

And what do the massive entitlement programs really do? They subsidize large corporations and allow them to continue to pay below subsistent wages and reap bigger profits once again proving we live in a fascist-corporate style of government with the Democratic party being the worst about propping up this style of government.

You are being manipulated emotionally by the fascists in the government and you continue to allow yourself to be manipulated because you refuse to understand who is really profiting from big government programs.

I heard something absolutely stunning on the BBC. Did you know we bring in 70,000 refugees a year from places like Yemen, Somalia, Nigeria, and other third world countries....ones that happen to hate us? And...get this.....because of the government shut down they were having a hard time enrolling in......wait for it......our welfare programs. I swear to god we give ourselves enough rope to string a big fat noose around our collective necks.

[FaninAma]

I heard something absolutely stunning on the BBC. Did you know we bring in 70,000 refugees a year from places like Yemen, Somalia, Nigeria, and other third world countries....ones that happen to hate us? And...get this.....because of the government shut down they were having a hard time enrolling in......wait for it......our welfare programs. I swear to god we give ourselves enough rope to string a big fat noose around our collective necks.

The useful idiots on the left buy into the Democrat mantra that this is all about helping the poor. No, it's all about enriching multinational corporations through direct redistribution of resources that go mainly to the top income earners via direct government payouts/contracts or indirectly through programs that allow the lower classes to buy trinkets, baubles and, yes, necessities from the Walmarts and Apples of the world as well as subsidizing the investment markets(i.e. QE 1,2,3and 4) which largely benefits the upper 1%.

In addition, the federal governmemt's programs result in a permanent underclass that will never break free of their dependency on handouts long enough to join the middle class. And lax enforcement of immigration laws and "free trade" legislation has decimated the blue collar middle class segment of this country so that now there is a narrowing spectrum of careers and jobs that will support a large middle class that has traditionally been the backbone of this nation.

[diverdog]

The useful idiots on the left buy into the Democrat mantra that this is all about helping the poor. No, it's all about enriching multinational corporations through direct redistribution of resources that go mainly to the top income earners via direct government payouts/contracts or indirectly through programs that allow the lower classes to buy trinkets, baubles and, yes, necessities from the Walmarts and Apples of the world as well as subsidizing the investment markets(i.e. QE 1,2,3and 4) which largely benefits the upper 1%.

In addition, the federal governmemt's programs result in a permanent underclass that will never break free of their dependency on handouts long enough to join the middle class. And lax enforcement of immigration laws and "free trade" legislation has decimated the blue collar middle class segment of this country so that now there is a narrowing spectrum of careers and jobs that will support a large middle class that has traditionally been the backbone of this nation.

fanin:

Thes are people that we give asylum to or actively bring into this nation for some political reason.....far outside of the scope of illegal immigration. Some of these folks especially from places like Yemen will wage jihad against us. This is far worse than allowing Mexicans into the US illegally. INMO. I really do not understand the end game here. I pray to god it isn't to get more votes. My suspicions is that it is good intention gone wildly bad.

[FaninAma]

Diver, do you really think terrorists haven't already taken advantage of this administration's lax enforcement of our immigration laws on our southern border?

[diverdog]

Diver, do you really think terrorists haven't already taken advantage of this administration's lax enforcement of our immigration laws on our southern border?

This has been ongoing for years. But yeah terrorist have come in. See 9/11.

[SoonerStormchaser]

Some things might work for the Swiss, but not America. I mean, 90% of your Swiss population gets up in the morning, sweeps their sidewalk, has some cocoa, then makes watches, shoes, or banks all day. They then have a nice sensible dinner, listen to some classical music and go to bed.

I'd pay people to live that way, too.
Dude, you ever even been to Switzerland? They hand out subsidies like they're going out of style...there's a reason why that country is the most expensive in continental Europe (outside Scandanavia).