honest question about QB...

[OU_Sooners75]

We can all sit here and Monday quarterback what happened Saturday all we want. But if Blake Bell was clearly better dont you think Stoops would have named him the starter?

I haven't watched the game a second time yet, but what did I see live?

I saw some pretty bad play calling. I also saw some pretty bad pass protection.

Yes Knight had some pretty bad passes but he don't play that bad.

The first INT, was a very athletic play by the defender. Another 4-6 inches higher on the pass, it goes over the defender and maybe is a completed pass.

The second INT was a tipped ball. There were a couple other throws that should have been picked. But weren't.

IMO the game plan for any of the QBs needs to be more option plays. Be read option, triple option, whatever. Pass plays need to be more moving the pocket to give the QBs the option of pass or run.

Would like to see more rollouts, bubble screens, naked bootlegs, an d other pocket moving pass plays.

Anyway, I wouldn't make a QB controversy if I was Bob Stoops. I would start Knight. I would demand a different game plan. And if he cannot grasp it against Tulsa again. I would then replace him and keep him on the bench unless he is needed in the future.

Rumor is KT suppose to be back this week. If he is, maybe it will open up te competition again!

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Should White had started over Hybl to start the 2001 season? Should Bomar started over Thompson to start the 2005 season? Should have OU stuck with Thompson in the 2005 season given his solid performance to come in the 2006 season? The answers aren't relevant as it pertains to today, but the questions are, because it shows the coaching staff might not have made the correct decisions right out of the gate, but did correct them over time and with positive results.

The coaching staff made the right decision on Knight and probably those other guys based on what they did in practices, but that doesn't mean they are the right decisions in actual live games. Knight has not proven to be a gamer so far, so why not see if Bell perhaps is a gamer in a game that OU can win on defense and special teams alone against Tulsa? And if Bell doesn't prove to be a gamer either as the actual starter, then OU is foyked, but Bell has proven to be a gamer in limited action as the backup, so I hope he is afforded the opportunity.

[BoulderSooner79]

I think the question for me is who is the best Saturday player? I trust the coaches that TK won the job in practice and scrimmage, but he hasn't looked ready in 2 games against mediocre competition. That doesn't mean Bell would do any better. I had hoped that Bell would take over at half since TK was obviously dinged on that goal line play just before half. Then Bell could have played the regular offense for a full half with a close game on the line. He came in so late just to help drain the clock and preserve the win that it didn't show what he could do. I didn't detect any change in the team that others have claimed here - just a change in the crowd. My guess is that Knight will start again next week assuming the dings he received are not serious.

[NorthernIowaSooner]

Knight deserves some time to settle in but the learning curve is steep at this level. His predecessors did him no favors by putting up big numbers as freshman.

[OU_Sooners75]

Knight rushed for 103 yards ad passed for 3 TDs vs ULM and everyone was happy.

Knight has a very limited play selection makes a few mistakes and leads OU to 16 points in a win, and people think he sucks.

The kid had his hands tied. The offense I watched Saturdays does not fit Knight very well.

If Bell was better, why did he just hand the ball off, run just twice, and throw just once?

Apparently the coaching staff doesn't have to confidence in Bell to make the passes.

[Curly Bill]

Knight rushed for 103 yards ad passed for 3 TDs vs ULM and everyone was happy.

Knight has a very limited play selection makes a few mistakes and leads OU to 16 points in a win, and people think he sucks.

The kid had his hands tied. The offense I watched Saturdays does not fit Knight very well.

If Bell was better, why did he just hand the ball off, run just twice, and throw just once?

Apparently the coaching staff doesn't have to confidence in Bell to make the passes.

A lotta people didn't get to see that game, so any possible criticism was blocked.

The play calling was beyond lame IMO.

[Therealsouthsider]

...after the first series, I honestly thought the play calling reverted back to last year and Josh had TK running Landrys plays

ss

[JiminyChristmas]

Knight rushed for 103 yards ad passed for 3 TDs vs ULM and everyone was happy.

Knight has a very limited play selection makes a few mistakes and leads OU to 16 points in a win, and people think he sucks.

The kid had his hands tied. The offense I watched Saturdays does not fit Knight very well.

If Bell was better, why did he just hand the ball off, run just twice, and throw just once?

Apparently the coaching staff doesn't have to confidence in Bell to make the passes.

1) Everyone was not happy with the passing game after ULM.

2) The plays Bell ran were more indicative of game mgmt at that point (lead, clock, the way the D was playing) than about the confidence or lack thereof in Bell.

I think Knight will be a good player, but he isn't quite ready. Why not see what Bell can do? You can always go back to Knight if necessary. There is no reason to believe that one more game against Tulsa is going to result in huge improvement for Knight. Gradual improvement, yes, but we will need more than that to go beat ND. I see absolutely nothing to lose in giving Bell a shot to see how he performs. They may be close in practice, but the difference may be greater when the lights are on.

[BoulderSooner79]

A lotta people didn't get to see that game, so any possible criticism was blocked.

The play calling was beyond lame IMO.

I watched the full replay of the ULM game and Knight didn't look any better. He is a natural runner, but he's not seeing the defenders in the passing game. And his mechanics are off on short throws to open guys defeating any hope of yards after catch if it is caught. The receivers haven't helped either, but that are not getting many easily catchable balls.

[JiminyChristmas]

As for the play calling, if the coaches are in fact limiting the playbook early against inferior opponents in a measure of gamesmanship for future, tougher opponents (ND, Texas), then Knight should start again against Tulsa. If we've shown all there is, then it is time to give Bell a shot because we have not executed very well at all in the passing game.

I absolutely believe they normally try to show very little in the early part of the season if possible. I would bet they've done that in a lot of Stoops seasons leading up to Texas. There always seems to be something new that we spring against the Whorns.

[Curly Bill]

As for the play calling, if the coaches are in fact limiting the playbook early against inferior opponents in a measure of gamesmanship for future, tougher opponents (ND, Texas), then Knight should start again against Tulsa. If we've shown all there is, then it is time to give Bell a shot because we have not executed very well at all in the passing game.

I absolutely believe they normally try to show very little in the early part of the season if possible. I would bet they've done that in a lot of Stoops seasons leading up to Texas. There always seems to be something new that we spring against the Whorns.

I hope the something new this time is a quarterback that looks like he can handle the job!

[OU_Sooners75]

What worked against ILM wasn't even attempted against WVU.

Against WVU the read option was ran just twice that I can recall.

There was plenty of times where I thought, "man the zone read hand off has been over played on first down. Why not have Knight keep the ball and run a naked bootleg?"

We ran the bubble screen twice to Shepard. Once the ball was dropped and the other was caught. But Shepard caught a case of the Trey Franks and allowed the grass to tackle him. Both times the play was wide open and could have gone for very big plays.

We have two very explosive FBs that can devastate defenders on blocks. Why not use them to your advantage? Why not line them both up and run a power stacked I?

We have a QB that can run, and three very good RBs that can explode if given a chance. Why not run son triple option, even wishbone plays?

In a power run game why aren't TEs being utilized in the passing game? Last time I looked we have a few decent ones! Even have Millard!

Waggles and rollouts would suit Knight, and even Bell and KT very well. Why aren't we using them?

Why? Well out offensive coordinator has proven that he doesn't know what he is doing! You're correct the players have to execute. But it is the job of the OC and coaching staff to utilize the talents they have and frankly they didn't do that against WVU.

[OU_Sooners75]

A lotta people didn't get to see that game, so any possible criticism was blocked.

The play calling was beyond lame IMO.

I watched the full replay of the ULM game and Knight didn't look any better. He is a natural runner, but he's not seeing the defenders in the passing game. And his mechanics are off on short throws to open guys defeating any hope of yards after catch if it is caught. The receivers haven't helped either, but that are not getting many easily catchable balls.

Then you and I watched two separate games.

Knight wasnt perfect, but he was much better than yesterday thanks in part to the play calling.

[OU_Sooners75]

Holgorsen, was interviewed By OU radio before the game. And he said he was shocked at how much they revealed offensively against ULM.

So yes, they opened up the play book a little more against ULM than they did against WVU.

IMO if you play it vanilla the first few games, then you're just hurting development of the young players.

It's football. Let your players go do why they are comfortable doing. Stop hiding stuff! Stop limiting the plays!

[thecrimsoncrusader]

Knight rushed for 103 yards ad passed for 3 TDs vs ULM and everyone was happy.

That's because people had the logical assumption that his passing accuracy would improve greatly in his second game. His completion percentage did improve in the first half, but when he did miss, he missed badly. He has to be able to complete the simple passes. I want to be optimistic here and blame his second half performance on the injury because if a QB can't step into his throws, bad things are going to happen, but he hasn't shown that he is a gamer as of yet.

[SoonerorLater]

IMO Knight won the starting job because he was in the coaching staff's opinion a more accurate passer. I say this because I thought at first the reason might be a change of styles like a zone read type offense. That clearly isn't the case. I'm convinced that in practice Knight looked to be the better passer. Now in a real game situation Knight hasn't done as well.

[OU_Sooners75]

Knight rushed for 103 yards ad passed for 3 TDs vs ULM and everyone was happy.

That's because people had the logical assumption that his passing accuracy would improve greatly in his second game. His completion percentage did improve in the first half, but when he did miss, he missed badly. He has to be able to complete the simple passes. I want to be optimistic here and blame his second half performance on the injury because if a QB can't step into his throws, bad things are going to happen, but he hasn't shown that he is a gamer as of yet.

He was a 50% passer in high school.

He does have a nice pass, but his accuracy has always been a ?.

That said, limiting his ability while playing is doing him and the offense no good.

He is a running QB, not a pocket passer. Therefore move the pocket!

[OU_Sooners75]

IMO Knight won the starting job because he was in the coaching staff's opinion a more accurate passer. I say this because I thought at first the reason might be a change of styles like a zone read type offense. That clearly isn't the case. I'm convinced that in practice Knight looked to be the better passer. Now in a real game situation Knight hasn't done as well.

So you are saying he is the next Eric Moore?

[JiminyChristmas]

I'm not saying they aren't running most of their plays, but it could as subtle as disguising tendencies early on, or a different way of blocking up a play, or a new blitz package, etc.

For example, the read/option may be planned to have a much bigger role later, not wanting to show exactly how they are going to run the whole package until you have to.

Another example is the Belldozer formation. You don't just trash something that effective. We will see it in a big moment at some point, but why have everyone working it if you can avoid showing it until you have to. Maybe they still work on it just in case, but at least you haven't given them tape on it with this years personnel and scheme.

I think it is smart to do if you can get away with it. At ND, we will have to break out everything we've got. The only reason I brought that up was if TK has been handcuffed by it, then we shouldn't make the QB switch. I think we should switch though because TK has not executed the pass plays that have been there.

[OU_Sooners75]

I'm not saying they aren't running most of their plays, but it could as subtle as disguising tendencies early on, or a different way of blocking up a play, or a new blitz package, etc.

For example, the read/option may be planned to have a much bigger role later, not wanting to show exactly how they are going to run the whole package until you have to.

Another example is the Belldozer formation. You don't just trash something that effective. We will see it in a big moment at some point, but why have everyone working it if you can avoid showing it until you have to. Maybe they still work on it just in case, but at least you haven't given them tape on it with this years personnel and scheme.

I think it is smart to do if you can get away with it. At ND, we will have to break out everything we've got. The only reason I brought that up was if TK has been handcuffed by it, then we shouldn't make the QB switch. I think we should switch though because TK has not executed the pass plays that have been there.

Hiding and disguising your tendencies are something you do with an experienced QB. Not something you do with a QB that is making his second career start in as many games.

[JiminyChristmas]

You may be right. They may not be doing it this year.

But, bottom line, from what you've seen so far from TK, do you think we can beat ND in three weeks with him at QB? With one more game and an off week, can he make that much progress?

I think he can eventually, but no way in three weeks. Now, maybe we can't go win there with Bell either, but why not see what it looks like and see if there might be a better chance?

[S.PadreIsl.Sooner]

You may be right. They may not be doing it this year.

But, bottom line, from what you've seen so far from TK, do you think we can beat ND in three weeks with him at QB? With one more game and an off week, can he make that much progress?

I think he can eventually, but no way in three weeks. Now, maybe we can't go win there with Bell either, but why not see what it looks like and see if there might be a better chance?


Jiminymakes my point perfectly. No way we win at ND with TK. He's not adept enough at reading defenses during games.

[OU_Sooners75]

You may be right. They may not be doing it this year.

But, bottom line, from what you've seen so far from TK, do you think we can beat ND in three weeks with him at QB? With one more game and an off week, can he make that much progress?

I think he can eventually, but no way in three weeks. Now, maybe we can't go win there with Bell either, but why not see what it looks like and see if there might be a better chance?

I honestly think this team can beat any team on their schedule.

That said, I think the offensive coaches need to do a better job at planning and utilizing the talent they have on the field.

If TK is the guy, then they need to utilize his strengths, which is running. Allow him to roll out and scan the field and if nothing is available then tuck it and run.

They need to utilize the TE position more if they are going to stay more power rushing like that have te first two games.

They also need to allow for more down field passes. Even if they are over thrown and incomplete, it will make the defense to back off a little and play more honest.

TK is quite a bit shorter than his OL, so moving the pocket will help him see the field better as well. It will also allow you to cut the field in half. Instead of him trying to scan the entire field, he is scanning less than half of it.

I applaud the OU coaches In wanting to change to a new scheme offensively. But so far the OC hasn't been able to grasp any type of offense that he is calling.

JH = Greg Davis, the old Texas OC.

[OU_Sooners75]

You may be right. They may not be doing it this year.

But, bottom line, from what you've seen so far from TK, do you think we can beat ND in three weeks with him at QB? With one more game and an off week, can he make that much progress?

I think he can eventually, but no way in three weeks. Now, maybe we can't go win there with Bell either, but why not see what it looks like and see if there might be a better chance?


Jiminymakes my point perfectly. No way we win at ND with TK. He's not adept enough at reading defenses during games.

I disagree.

TK can win at ND if the coaches help him by utilizing his strengths and minimizing his weaknesses.

Yes TKs biggest weakness so far is the ability to scan defenses while trying to pass. Take that away and roll him out where he has an option of pass or run.

As it sits right now, apparently TK is the best option for OU to win. If it was Bell, he would have been named the starter before game 1.