Right here in good ole okiehoma!!!!

[okie52]

Evangelicals Announce Ad Buy Urging GOP to Back Immigration Overhaul

Tuesday, 20 Aug 2013 06:57 PM

By Cathy Burke

Evangelical groups supporting immigration reform are funding a $400,000 advertising blitz on Christian radio stations in 14 states and 56 congressional districts.

The two-week ad buy by the Evangelical Immigration Table is the largest yet in the coalition's nearly million-dollar effort to back legislation that would grant citizenship to millions of undocumented immigrants, Roll Call reported Tuesday.

The ads will run in markets mostly represented by Republicans, said Barrett Duke, vice president for public policy and research at the Southern Baptist Ethics and Religious Liberty Commission.

"They’ll return to Washington knowing they have support at home for taking action on reform," Duke said.

Organizers said the ads will run primarily in Republican districts in Alabama, Arkansas, California, Colorado, Florida, Georgia, Illinois, Louisiana, Missouri, Oklahoma, North Carolina, South Carolina, Texas, and Wisconsin.

"This is not really hypothetical or even political," Mike McClenahan, a pastor in Solana Beach, Calif., told NBC News.

"This is personal because there are so many children in our community who are living in fear that their parents are going to be deported."

Evangelical groups have joined labor unions and immigrant groups in pushing for reform.

"Immigrants are part of the membership of all of our groups, and for that reason we care about immigration," said Glen Carey, vice president of government relations for the National Association of Evangelicals.

The issue is also humanitarian, said Felix Cabrera, pastor at the Quail Springs Baptist Church in Oklahoma City, where undocumented immigrants make up about half of his church's congregation.

"As a Hispanic pastor in the United States, I have to deal with the collateral damage that our broken immigration system brings to my people," he said. "The Bible doesn’t call me to judge the reasons why immigrants arrive to this country. The Bible calls me to love them and welcome them."

The last time Congress went home for August in the midst of an immigration debate was in 2006, but opponents succeeded in killing momentum for the legislation, Roll Call reported. Carey said this time around, "the pro-immigrant voice has been rather prominent in many of the town halls that we have observed."

The Senate passed a sweeping reform bill in June, but House leaders have declined to take up the comprehensive measure, instead favoring a step-by-step approach that focuses on border security, enforcement, and employer verification.

Republican Rep. Bob Goodlatte of Virginia, the chairman of the influential House Judiciary Committee, reiterated Monday that House leaders won’t take up the Senate bill and that his panel will not support a "special pathway to citizenship" for those in the country illegally.

"We’re not asking for a special path towards citizenship," Duke said. "We’re not asking for automatic citizenship. What we’re asking, simply, is that those who quality in the same way that anybody else would qualify could get in that line, and when they get in that line they get in line behind the folks who have already applied."

Read Latest Breaking News from Newsmax.com http://www.newsmax.com/Politics/evangelicals-ad-buy-immigration/2013/08/20/id/521403#ixzz2cYRIHSpG


Quail springs baptist church...pretty dam far north for this nonsense. The hispanic pastor...his people...I wonder how the rest of his congregation feels since they aren't his chosen ones?

I'll go dance on that ****in minister's church lawn if amnesty is defeated.

[Soonerjeepman]

This is not really hypothetical or even political," Mike McClenahan, a pastor in Solana Beach, Calif., told NBC News.

the hell it isn't...

[Tulsa_Fireman]

Let them eat cake.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

You mean not everybody in Oklahoma supports big gov't mining the border? Shocking really.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

legislation that would grant citizenship to millions of undocumented immigrants

Not quite accurate.

The Senate version would grant those eligible a temporary visa for 7 years, and if eligible at the end of that period, would allow them to apply for permanent residency. At the end of 5 years of permanent residency, they may be eligible to apply for citizenship. If all conditions are met, USCIS would grant them citizenship.

[TAFBSooner]

This is not really hypothetical or even political," Mike McClenahan, a pastor in Solana Beach, Calif., told NBC News.

the hell it isn't...

If the 11 million were offered permanent legal residency, as long as they were gainfully employed, but not a chance at citizenship, they wouldn't have the vote, which would remove the Democratic party's alleged motivation for championing their cause. But it wouldn't win over any of the folks on here who DREAM of deporting all of them, would it?

[rock on sooner]

You mean not everybody in Oklahoma supports big gov't mining the border? Shocking really.

Hey, we hashed this out months ago in another thread. We discussed
catapults, gators in moats, even the direction for the anti-personnel
mines. There was some argument about the direction for the catapults,
resolved, though, after it was determined who would operate the launchers,
so I think that's all settled!:devilish::peaceful::cocksure:

[okie52]

You mean not everybody in Oklahoma supports big gov't mining the border? Shocking really.

Yep, there are groveling doormats that would give the illegal invaders just about anything they wanted....but its still shocking to see.

[okie52]

If the 11 million were offered permanent legal residency, as long as they were gainfully employed, but not a chance at citizenship, they wouldn't have the vote, which would remove the Democratic party's alleged motivation for championing their cause. But it wouldn't win over any of the folks on here who DREAM of deporting all of them, would it?

Hope it wouldn't win over anyone although the mentally challenged may vulnerable to such thinking.

Permanent legal residency would allow for family reunification immigration that could bring millions more to the US to rejoin the illegals. And permanent legal residency would entitle them to benefits that they aren't entitled to as illegals. And, of course, they are breeders...by far the biggest breeders in the US right now and all of their children will be citizens automatically.

Temporary residency and that being conditional upon being employed would be the only legitimate compromise. Leave the country as soon as work is done. No family reunification, no benefits...but that would never satisfy the grovelers that think we owe the invaders citizenship and/or permanent residency.

[KantoSooner]

Not quite accurate.

The Senate version would grant those eligible a temporary visa for 7 years, and if eligible at the end of that period, would allow them to apply for permanent residency. At the end of 5 years of permanent residency, they may be eligible to apply for citizenship. If all conditions are met, USCIS would grant them citizenship.

You are one tricky guy. Imagine, just when there's a good rant a brewin' you come in and spoil it all with facts and objective reality.
Damn your eyes.

[FaninAma]

Did the "undocumented" immigrants break the law? Are we now allowing them to get away with breaking the law? If so, which other laws should not be enforced?

That is the crux of the problem. We are all told it is our duty to uphold laws we don't like especially the onerous tax laws yet we have a President and administration who picks and chooses which laws he enforces. Either we are a nation of law or we aren't. Don't give me this crap how it us inconvenient and unreasonable to follow certain laws. It is a very specious argument.

[FaninAma]

Let them eat cake.
So says the guy from a sanctuary city that has decided to ignore a federal law unilaterally.

[okie52]

"We’re not asking for a special path towards citizenship," Duke said. "We’re not asking for automatic citizenship. What we’re asking, simply, is that those who quality in the same way that anybody else would qualify could get in that line, and when they get in that line they get in line behind the folks who have already applied."

You most certainly are asking for a special path towards citizenship. You are here...NOW!!! Other LEGAL IMMIGRANTS applied for the right to immigrate to the US. They didn't just cross the border because it suited their purposes or overstay their visas.

[okie52]

You are one tricky guy. Imagine, just when there's a good rant a brewin' you come in and spoil it all with facts and objective reality.
Damn your eyes.

Still granting them a path to citizenship, isn't it?

[okie52]

I'll bet landmines on the border would do a lot better than the Senate's hoped for 90% border security...and a lot cheaper too.

[KantoSooner]

Some of them, eventually, it would seem. (to be utterly fair, we don't know what will come up for a vote, or if anything will come up for a vote. I think it's entirely possible that, as Obama gets further and further tar babied by foreign policy and then the ACA implementation, and then mid-term elections, immigration reform will die a quiet death. Just as Bush's effort (almost identical to the ideas being tossed around now) did).

[KantoSooner]

FAnin, I hear where you're coming from on enforcement of laws, but we've got all sorts of laws we don't enforce. Here are a few:

1. Drinking and driving. We have parking lots at tarverns. Many cars are driven by one single person. 100% incidence of drinking and driving. Allowed 24 hours a day across our great nation.

2. Pot laws. Holder announced yesterday that the feds would ignore federal law and let the states make up their minds. In essence.

3. Sodomy laws. Blow jobs are illegal in several states. Seen any 'enforcement' of late.

There are a lot of laws that are simply not enforced for a whole raft of reasons. Is this right, good or productive of social order? Some probably yes, overall it's more likely a sign of a society that is not honest with itself and elects morons who pass laws that are neither respected nor desired by the people they govern.

The mere fact that a law is being ignored, however, is along the lines of 'dog bites man'. Not newsworthy.

[okie52]

Some of them, eventually, it would seem. (to be utterly fair, we don't know what will come up for a vote, or if anything will come up for a vote. I think it's entirely possible that, as Obama gets further and further tar babied by foreign policy and then the ACA implementation, and then mid-term elections, immigration reform will die a quiet death. Just as Bush's effort (almost identical to the ideas being tossed around now) did).

Actually Bush's reform really did even less on Border security than this version...just another proposed amnesty 20 years later than Reagan's version...which, of course, McCain fully supported and sponsored then, too.

I am hopeful the bill dies a quiet death but I think pubs in the house will feel compelled to put something out there...it just may not include a path to citizenship which will be unacceptable to the senate, McCain, Grahamnesty, Rubio and Obama.

[KantoSooner]

That's certainly the way it looks now. But Obama is going to increasingly need a victory to put some air under his wings. If the pubs sense real weakness as we roll into 2014, they might not care to make even that gesture.

I'm sensing that the national party has pretty much written the latino vote off for good and will try to retrench into the rural South and the mid-west and just give up on urban areas, and the coasts where the message is simply not playing. The only question is how to hold on to Texas. Not a problem now, but in 10-12 years? Texas is a blue state then.

[FaninAma]

FAnin, I hear where you're coming from on enforcement of laws, but we've got all sorts of laws we don't enforce. Here are a few:

1. Drinking and driving. We have parking lots at tarverns. Many cars are driven by one single person. 100% incidence of drinking and driving. Allowed 24 hours a day across our great nation.

2. Pot laws. Holder announced yesterday that the feds would ignore federal law and let the states make up their minds. In essence.

3. Sodomy laws. Blow jobs are illegal in several states. Seen any 'enforcement' of late.

There are a lot of laws that are simply not enforced for a whole raft of reasons. Is this right, good or productive of social order? Some probably yes, overall it's more likely a sign of a society that is not honest with itself and elects morons who pass laws that are neither respected nor desired by the people they govern.

The mere fact that a law is being ignored, however, is along the lines of 'dog bites man'. Not newsworthy.

All of those examples are state laws except the pot law. Which Federal laws are we ignoring besides the ones Obama chooses to ignore?(i.e. the pot law) You sort of made my point for me.

And the drinking and driving la isn't ignored...it is selectively enforced due to lack of manpower to stop and check every car that leaves a bar. I suspect at some point there will be an alcohol detection device mandated on all cars.

[KantoSooner]

Federal laws are likewise sleectively ignored, but tend to be more technical in nature. It always made me chuckle that murder was largely a matter for the states whereas import duties on carnations was a Federal matter. Repayment of aid and loans would be one prime area where, repayment being mandated by law, certain countries simply walk on their debts to the US and US citizens and the fedeeral gov does zippo.

My point is that our failure to send Dick Tracy to every latino's door is not particularly outside the norm. We don't enforce lots of laws.

[okie52]

That's certainly the way it looks now. But Obama is going to increasingly need a victory to put some air under his wings. If the pubs sense real weakness as we roll into 2014, they might not care to make even that gesture.

I'm sensing that the national party has pretty much written the latino vote off for good and will try to retrench into the rural South and the mid-west and just give up on urban areas, and the coasts where the message is simply not playing. The only question is how to hold on to Texas. Not a problem now, but in 10-12 years? Texas is a blue state then.

I think the national repub elite are trying everything they can to get the immigration issue behind them. They believe that they can only make inroads to the hispanic vote once the issue has been laid to rest by granting some form of residency even if it isn't a path to citizenship...simply because they can't persuade the pub base to vote for amnesty/citizenship. Now the pubs that are house reps know they face a much greater backlash by passing amnesty in their home districts than by opposing it...so that is the problem that the pub leadership will continue to face. And, for pubs like myself, those pubs that do support the senate bill or some form of amnesty will be dead to us on any national or statewide elections.

Another issue is timing. The pub elite (like McCain, Priebus) want this issue resolved before year's end otherwise it would be a front and center issue in the 2014 election cycle and would have almost no chance of passing then...not that a number of pubs who supported wouldn't be primaried if it did pass this year.

Texas demographically is certainly trending towards a larger hispanic base. The way those suckers breed is astounding. Right now Texas is 44% white and 38% hispanic although I could never find a source that indicated what % of the hispanic 38% were illegal. You would think that would spell doom for the pubs in the next 20 years but voting is greatly reduced in the hispanic community vs that of the white community. Still, all those white conservatives in Texas better keep gerrymandering districts if the illegals and their offspring continue to grow at the present rate.

[Bourbon St Sooner]

Hey, we hashed this out months ago in another thread. We discussed
catapults, gators in moats, even the direction for the anti-personnel
mines. There was some argument about the direction for the catapults,
resolved, though, after it was determined who would operate the launchers,
so I think that's all settled!:devilish::peaceful::cocksure:

Wouldn't they use the catapults to throw people over the fence? Or would be use them to throw the people back over when they try to tunnel in?

My only question about the mines is do cows that blown themselves up still make good steaks?

[FaninAma]

Federal laws are likewise sleectively ignored, but tend to be more technical in nature. It always made me chuckle that murder was largely a matter for the states whereas import duties on carnations was a Federal matter. Repayment of aid and loans would be one prime area where, repayment being mandated by law, certain countries simply walk on their debts to the US and US citizens and the fedeeral gov does zippo.

My point is that our failure to send Dick Tracy to every latino's door is not particularly outside the norm. We don't enforce lots of laws.

Nobody is saying to send Dick Tracy to round up all illegals. But we don't need to reward their lawlessness. Employers need to be fined heavily for employing illegals. The border needs to be made much more secure. If you do these two things the problem will take care of itself.

Federal laws should be enforced within our own borders. The President and his chief law enforcement officer should not be selectively enforcing laws. It undermines the rule of law in the country.

[KantoSooner]

Undoubtedly it undermines the rule of law. But it's been done for generations and doesn't seem to toppled the republic yet. In my view we need to repeal lots of laws. But you don't get your name in the paper as a pol for doing that. We simply have too many laws now and many are utterly outmoded. They are rightly ignored by law enforcement and that opens the door to ignoring others that arguably should be enforced.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

Still granting them a path to citizenship, isn't it?

Okie, you understand the distinction.

The law goes not give drivers licenses to people merely because they turn 16 years old. The law says 16 year olds become eligible for a drivers license. Conceptually these are quite different.

Likewise, granting citizenship and constructing a path of eligibility for citizenship are quite different. I was pointing out that the bill does not grant citizenship.

But of course it's NewsMax, for which false statements are routine.

[FaninAma]

I haven't noticed that Latin families have huge numbers of kids. What I have noticed while working in Ft. Worth ERs is that there are a huge amount of people who cannot speak English which tells me they probably aren't in this country legally. They all are able to get signed up for Medicaid,however.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

I haven't noticed that Latin families have huge numbers of kids. What I have noticed while working in Ft. Worth ERs is that there are a huge amount of people who cannot speak English which tells me they probably aren't in this country legally. They all are able to get signed up for Medicaid,however.


Typically, those granted permanent residence by a family petition have not yet lived in the U.S. So, if they are from a non-English speaking country, they may not speak English. While some knowledge of English is required for citizenship, it is not required for legal residency.

If they come here young enough to go to school, they will learn English - although it may take a couple of years.

If they are over school age, they may not learn English unless their job requires it - or they marry an English speaker.

[FaninAma]

When you are here in this country for an extended period of time without the ability to speak English you can be nothing but a burden on the social safety net. You are essentially unemployable except for menial minimum wage jobs. Your children are at a severe disadvantage for making any progress for social and economic improvement. You are, in essence, one of the many wagon-riders that Obama and the Democrats love so much.

[SanJoaquinSooner]

When you are here in this country for an extended period of time without the ability to speak English you can be nothing but a burden on the social safety net. You are essentially unemployable except for menial minimum wage jobs. Your children are at a severe disadvantage for making any progress for social and economic improvement. You are, in essence, one of the many wagon-riders that Obama and the Democrats love so much.

Of course it is to one's advantage to learn English. Many more options in life. I was pointing out your misconception that "...they probably aren't in this country legally."


On the employability factor, ... well it depends. Maria's sister works for her as a tailor. She learned English, motivated by interacting with English-speaking customers. That, and her younger of two daughters never learned Spanish. Her husband, on the other hand has been here 30 years but never learned English. Worked in the fields as a teen and young adult but never went to school in the U.S. Now he works for a door manufacturer, but never interacts with customers.

They both have second, part-time jobs and are essentially employable enough to pay a mortgage on a $235,000 home. They both are private sector employees. But maybe menial in your eyes.

Their severely disadvantaged children have both gone to college, one just finished her masters at Fresno State. The other is going to a community college and plans to attend either a CSU or UC school next year.

The GOP needs to hire you as a recruiter, Fanin.

[FaninAma]

SJS, do you deny that children raised in this country in a home where Englush is not spoken are at a significant disadvantage in school and other socio-economic challenges?

iIf nothing else, non-Englush speaking oarenrs in this country should learn the language to help their kids out.

[okiewaker]

Schools in foreign countries will require you not only take a course in English, but also take a course in Spanish to keep up with the ever changing USA.