Would this be against NCAA rules?

[jkjsooner]

Let's say OU boosters pooled together a fund with the intent of giving each player who competes 4 years at OU (or is injured but remains at OU for 4 years) $100k once they complete their eligibility.

Let's say there is no formal promise of the money. The only promise is implied based on what has been received by others. Recruits only know of this implied promise through the grapevine.

Would this pass NCAA scrutiny? This could be a pretty huge recruiting draw. I don't know how big because too many 18 year old kids think they're going to the NFL and they don't really look four years down the line but it could sway a few.

It doesn't seem to me that the NCAA really looks too closely at what happens to players once they leave school. Some schools could have a relationship with boosters to give ex players sweet employment deals and the NCAA wouldn't really care. (Obviously you can't hold the former player accountable as they no longer have eligibility left but schools could possibly be held accountable.)


In either case, the more generous boosters can be towards ex players the better it is to our program. You don't get as much bang for your buck as direct payments to a guy who is still in high school but you can send a message that we'll take care of them. You might get more bang for your buck than spending that money on expanding the trophy cases.

[badger]

Would this pass NCAA scrutiny?

I assume we're just having fun here, so I'll take the bait.

The answer is no:


An individual loses amateur status and thus shall not be eligible for competition in a particular sport if the individual:

Accepts a promise of pay even if such pay is to be received following completion of intercollegiate athletics participation

Link (https://www.nmnathletics.com/pdf8/779383.pdf?DB_OEM_ID=1700)

And quite frankly, college programs are already inherently asking college players to accept money later instead of money now by virtue of their amateur status in college... and college players already seem to not like it, but accept it because they have to.

Colleges already generously offer athletes a free or reduced price degree after the completion of four years of study and sports and some athletes already reject this offer for whatever reason.

[jkjsooner]

I assume we're just having fun here, so I'll take the bait.

Yes, we are. I definitely don't have the means to contribute to such a fund.



The answer is no:


It would be hard to argue that the player accepted a promise for deferred payment when no explicit promise was every made. They key would be that such a scheme would have to be implied. Nobody in the athletic department would bring it up and the boosters would not make an explicit promise to anyone.

I could see the school paying a price for such a scheme but holding the player accountable for something he has never been promised (and quite honestly could argue he didn't know about) would be extreme.



Colleges already generously offer athletes a free or reduced price degree after the completion of four years of study and sports and some athletes already reject this offer for whatever reason.

This isn't about being generous to players. Nobody at SMU really cared about the well being of kids who played for them. It's about finding a loophole in the rules to bring the best players possible into your program.

[badger]

It would be hard to argue that the player accepted a promise for deferred payment when no explicit promise was every made. They key would be that such a scheme would have to be implied. Nobody in the athletic department would bring it up and the boosters would not make an explicit promise to anyone.

Well, if we're just going to look the other way as rules are broken, why not just do what the entire SEC (and possibly Vanderbilt too... no, I don't consider them an SEC team) does already? Why complicate things with an after-you're-done agreement? Just hand out stacks of cash and ask the kiddos not to tweet photos of it :P

[OU_Sooners75]

It would be direct violation of NCAA rules.

[8timechamps]

If there was never communication between the player and the boosters (or any one else on the subject), and the money was given after the player has left OU, then I can't see where the violation would be, and I think it would skirt the rules.

The reality is that nobody in their right mind (big money or not) would do that. Most people realize that more times than not the "hyped" recruit either doesn't end up being nearly as good as billed, or doesn't complete 4 years of eligibility. So, they'd be better off donating that same money to the football program.

[jkjsooner]

The reality is that nobody in their right mind (big money or not) would do that. Most people realize that more times than not the "hyped" recruit either doesn't end up being nearly as good as billed, or doesn't complete 4 years of eligibility. So, they'd be better off donating that same money to the football program.

True that the hyped recruit doesn't always pay off but the name of the game is getting as many of the guys you want in as possible. If you get enough of your top choice guys then the odds are many of them will pan out.

As for guys who don't complete 4 years, well, that just saves you money since you only reward guys who do.

Note that I said "guys you want" instead of "highly ranked guys." I don't want to get sidetracked by an argument on the merits of recruiting rankings.

[8timechamps]

True that the hyped recruit doesn't always pay off but the name of the game is getting as many of the guys you want in as possible. If you get enough of your top choice guys then the odds are many of them will pan out.

As for guys who don't complete 4 years, well, that just saves you money since you only reward guys who do.

Note that I said "guys you want" instead of "highly ranked guys." I don't want to get sidetracked by an argument on the merits of recruiting rankings.

I think you've uncovered the biggest issue, in order to make sure it would work out, the boosters would have to communicate with the coach, and that would imply the coach has knowledge of the "fund". Otherwise, boosters would be all over the board offering kids for positions the team may not even need.

Then there's the actual fundraising issue. I think it would be a really hard sell to get boosters to contribute to a fund that may or may not ever be used.

[jkjsooner]

I think you've uncovered the biggest issue, in order to make sure it would work out, the boosters would have to communicate with the coach, and that would imply the coach has knowledge of the "fund". Otherwise, boosters would be all over the board offering kids for positions the team may not even need.

Then there's the actual fundraising issue. I think it would be a really hard sell to get boosters to contribute to a fund that may or may not ever be used.

I think you might misunderstand something. The fund would be used. Every player who completed eligibility would be rewarded - 1 star or 5 star, bench rider or starter. Players wouldn't be identified at recruitment time to be eligible.

The coaches of course would have heard of this through the grapevine but they wouldn't have to announce it to recruits. The recruits would also hear it through the grapevine. "Hey, man, I went to OU and I can tell you they really look out for their own once they leave school. You should consider them."


I don't doubt that some less obvious things go on across the country. I imagine employer/boosters do help out former players by giving them jobs. Maybe it's not a grand scheme to spread the word to recruits but it probably doesn't hurt. It's probably good for your program if you don't have bitter former players who can't make a living telling recruits about how OU dumps the players on the street when their eligibility is up.

[8timechamps]

I think you might misunderstand something. The fund would be used. Every player who completed eligibility would be rewarded - 1 star or 5 star, bench rider or starter. Players wouldn't be identified at recruitment time to be eligible.

The coaches of course would have heard of this through the grapevine but they wouldn't have to announce it to recruits. The recruits would also hear it through the grapevine. "Hey, man, I went to OU and I can tell you they really look out for their own once they leave school. You should consider them."


I don't doubt that some less obvious things go on across the country. I imagine employer/boosters do help out former players by giving them jobs. Maybe it's not a grand scheme to spread the word to recruits but it probably doesn't hurt. It's probably good for your program if you don't have bitter former players who can't make a living telling recruits about how OU dumps the players on the street when their eligibility is up.

Gotcha, I was thinking it was only for certain players.

I agree, this already goes on in some aspects. I know OU talks to regional kids about the alumni network and connections they'll have once they graduate. Introducing money into the equation is interesting, and as you said it wouldn't surprise me to find something along the same lines already going on some places.

[Jacie]

Have none of you read the fine print on your degree? If not, get out a magnifying glass and look at that last line. It clearly states, "If this were chocolate, you could eat it."

[olevetonahill]

How about if We got together and Just threatened to Shoot the Players Family if they dont sign with us and Play hard all 4 years? would that werk?

[cvsooner]

Surely you can't think that the folks at the NCAA haven't considered this in the past. Or, for skirting it by giving stuff to the family of said player. Isn't that what got Reggie Bush into hot water?

If nobody cheated....well, that's never going to happen, either. Just way too much money and individual egos involved. Amazing what lengths people will go to preserve bragging rights.

[yermom]

back in the day, they were promised oilfield jobs after college, apparently

i remember reading it in that "Why Oklahoma is Unbeatable" SI article from right before we lost to ND :(

[Soonerfan88]

Coach instead of booster, and definitely not worth $100K, but Roy Williams got in trouble for something like this at KU. Not taking time to search for old stories, but I think he bought every graduating senior a very nice suit and watch.

[badger]

I think he bought every graduating senior a very nice suit and watch.

That's really cool, even if it's against NCAA rules. Since the NCAA allows bowl gifts, they should allow a graduation gift too.

Why not reward college players for graduating instead of (or in addition to)punishing schools for crappy graduation rates?

[jkjsooner]

That's really cool, even if it's against NCAA rules. Since the NCAA allows bowl gifts, they should allow a graduation gift too.

Why not reward college players for graduating instead of (or in addition to)punishing schools for crappy graduation rates?

Actually that's a great idea. Giving an athlete (in all sports) a graduation gift could hardly benefit one school over the other as long as such a gift had a limit on the monetary value. It would have to be something every athletic department could afford.

I know most AD's are in the red so that's an issue but this wouldn't be a huge amount of money and I believe this wouldn't affect their financial situation other than putting some downward pressure on the football and basketball's coaching salaries - which would be good IMO.

Edit: On second thought, I don't think every program being able to support it is that important. We're not talking a huge amount so it's not going to be a huge recruiting draw. Kids (who very likely aren't even thinking about graduating college) aren't going to be influenced by a $1500 suit given to them if they graduate. That's more of an incentive for the kid to stay in school and graduate than it would be to go to that school to begin with.

Now, $100k paid out if the kid completes eligibility (not necessarily graduating) is a different matter.

[LakeRat]

I would make them "poker" players. Kid sits down at river wind with 9 boosters, walks out two hands later with $2700 in chips!! everyone reloads, and next kid sits down, pushes and all players much hands. $2700 in chips. . .

[SoonerorLater]

You could concoct all sorts of schemes and if they aren't tacitly against the rules they soon would be. Here's one, how about all players conveniently find a dropped wallet stuffed with cash. They turn it in and when nobody is able to identify it then they will be able to claim the money.

[WA. Sooner]

Any recruit that is good enough for that offer is not staying 4 years