Gun control UN style..

[Soonerjeepman]

so, even though there is a BI-PARTISAN SUPPORT to NOT sign this, Kerry says he will. Wow, thought the people were in charge~

Secretary of State John Kerry said Monday that the Obama administration would sign a controversial U.N. treaty on arms regulation, despite bipartisan resistance in Congress from members concerned it could lead to new gun control measures in the U.S.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/06/03/lawmakers-urge-obama-to-reject-un-arms-treaty-as-it-opens-for-signature/#ixzz2VCAqlHLp

[RUSH LIMBAUGH is my clone!]

What the Administration wants, the Administration gets, even if by hook or crook, as they say.:tyrannosaurus:

[Midtowner]

If you read the article,


The treaty would require countries that ratify it to establish national regulations to control the transfer of conventional arms and components and to regulate arms brokers, but it will not explicitly control the domestic use of weapons in any country.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2013/06/03/lawmakers-urge-obama-to-reject-un-arms-treaty-as-it-opens-for-signature/#ixzz2VCNUkYyy

How, exactly could anyone be against national regulations to control the transfer of conventional arms and components to regulate arms brokers? This doesn't open up the door for anything. It's regulation of something which needs more regulation. I can imagine the NRA is probably against regulating the sale of guns to Banana Republic wannabe dictators, but I'm fine with us losing our child soldier gun market share to the Russians.

[olevetonahill]

[QUOTE]If you read the article,


The article ya say?
Again I say
http://images.sodahead.com/profiles/0/0/2/1/4/0/4/3/0/Einstein-Retarded-57345424811.jpeg

[olevetonahill]

Heh, Chicago, New York City and Washington DC have some of the Most restrictive Gun Laws Yet the have the Worst Gun crime rates , I wonder why that is?

New York City sees surge in gun violence

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/york-city-sees-surge-gun-violence-213722082.html

[Curly Bill]

The Senate isn't going to approve this thing even if Kerry does sign it, but it does point out the arrogance of the current administration despite bipartisan opposition.

[Harry Beanbag]

Will Eric Holder comply with this?

[cleller]

Will Eric Holder comply with this?

As long as someone scratches his ears while he sits on their lap.

[Curly Bill]

Will Eric Holder comply with this?

You just got approved for having your phone and innerwebs tapped by the DOJ.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

You just got approved for having your phone and innerwebs tapped by the DOJ.

Congratulations?

[Curly Bill]

Congratulations?

Yup, it's the in thing to be on the wrong side of the DOJ these days. All the cool kids are doing it!

[Soonerjeepman]

Mid, AGAIN, you miss the POINT. This post by Curly might help your comprehension of my post. Ya know, for being a lawyer, sometimes ya don't see points in posts very well. Yes, I TOTALLY disagree with Kerry and the USA signing it...but the real issue is he is representing the USA, which is represented by Congress, who DO NOT SUPPORT THIS, which they represent the people ....get it?




The Senate isn't going to approve this thing even if Kerry does sign it, but it does point out the arrogance of the current administration despite bipartisan opposition.

[Midtowner]

Mid, AGAIN, you miss the POINT. This post by Curly might help your comprehension of my post. Ya know, for being a lawyer, sometimes ya don't see points in posts very well. Yes, I TOTALLY disagree with Kerry and the USA signing it...but the real issue is he is representing the USA, which is represented by Congress, who DO NOT SUPPORT THIS, which they represent the people ....get it?

Kerry represents the executive branch which agrees with this particular treaty. Additionally, I can't see a strong argument against this treaty. It's pretty common sense.

--but if you're in favor of arming child soldiers, whatever floats your boat...

[BigTip]

You just got approved for having your phone and innerwebs tapped by the DOJ.

And an IRS audit of course.

But that went without saying.

[Curly Bill]

And an IRS audit of course.

But that went without saying.

True, very true. And we by associating with him in this forum can likely expect the same.

[olevetonahill]

True, very true. And we by associating with him in this forum can likely expect the same.

matlock is safe tho, He likes to suck on obammy's and holders .

[Midtowner]

I know.. I fully expect the same wiretapping treatment whenever if ever a Republican gets elected.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

And that makes it okay?

[diverdog]

I am a whole lot less worried about the UN than the paranoid gun freaks who are hording ammo. They are destroying the shooting sports. I had to go to five different locations to find 20 gauge target ammo. #9 shot. Our scout camps have enough .22 ammo to last half of summer camp. You idiots (no one in particular) who think this is fine will lament the loss of your gun rights when we start raising generations of kids who never hunt or shoot. I am so pissed off about this situation it ain't even funny. And don't even think about blaming Obama. This is being driven by stupid internet rumors like the comming race war and blacks buying all the ammo to kill whitey or guns going to be confiscated en masse. It is nothing but ill founded paranoia and it will backfire because what these idiots are doing is instituting defacto gun control.
Now I am done with my rant.

[Midtowner]

And that makes it okay?

No, I'm very much NOT okay with the Patriot Act and any kind of warrantless search.

[TheHumanAlphabet]

I am a whole lot less worried about the UN than the paranoid gun freaks who are hording ammo. They are destroying the shooting sports. I had to go to five different locations to find 20 gauge target ammo. #9 shot. Our scout camps have enough .22 ammo to last half of summer camp. You idiots (no one in particular) who think this is fine will lament the loss of your gun rights when we start raising generations of kids who never hunt or shoot. I am so pissed off about this situation it ain't even funny. And don't even think about blaming Obama. This is being driven by stupid internet rumors like the comming race war and blacks buying all the ammo to kill whitey or guns going to be confiscated en masse. It is nothing but ill founded paranoia and it will backfire because what these idiots are doing is instituting defacto gun control.
Now I am done with my rant.

I have heard nothing of the sort. I have seen the government hoard ammo by huge purchases they cannot possibly use, ever, to manipulate the ammo market place...

[Harry Beanbag]

I am a whole lot less worried about the UN than the paranoid gun freaks who are hording ammo. They are destroying the shooting sports. I had to go to five different locations to find 20 gauge target ammo. #9 shot. Our scout camps have enough .22 ammo to last half of summer camp. You idiots (no one in particular) who think this is fine will lament the loss of your gun rights when we start raising generations of kids who never hunt or shoot. I am so pissed off about this situation it ain't even funny. And don't even think about blaming Obama. This is being driven by stupid internet rumors like the comming race war and blacks buying all the ammo to kill whitey or guns going to be confiscated en masse. It is nothing but ill founded paranoia and it will backfire because what these idiots are doing is instituting defacto gun control.
Now I am done with my rant.

Wow, talk about misplaced paranoia. I've never heard anything about race wars, but it is a proven fact the Feds are buying ammo by the billions of rounds.

[olevetonahill]

I am a whole lot less worried about the UN than the paranoid gun freaks who are hording ammo. They are destroying the shooting sports. I had to go to five different locations to find 20 gauge target ammo. #9 shot. Our scout camps have enough .22 ammo to last half of summer camp. You idiots (no one in particular) who think this is fine will lament the loss of your gun rights when we start raising generations of kids who never hunt or shoot. I am so pissed off about this situation it ain't even funny. And don't even think about blaming Obama. This is being driven by stupid internet rumors like the comming race war and blacks buying all the ammo to kill whitey or guns going to be confiscated en masse. It is nothing but ill founded paranoia and it will backfire because what these idiots are doing is instituting defacto gun control.
Now I am done with my rant.

Rumor has it that the Fed Govt. is the one buying up all the Ammo. making it scarce for the evrey day shooter.That and the Libs screaming for Gun control.

[diverdog]

Wow, talk about misplaced paranoia. I've never heard anything about race wars, but it is a proven fact the Feds are buying ammo by the billions of rounds.

And guess who started these rumors? Alex Jones of Info Wars.

Why would they stock .22 cal ammo or 20 gauge target shells...8&9 shot?

I know people who have bought in excess of 50,000 rounds of ammo and rarely shoot. Even when I shot competitively in skeet and sporting clays the most I shot in a year is 10,000 rounds.

The clerk in Walmart said he sees the same people every day and night checking on ammo. The only thing they have in stock are deer slugs and some 12 gauge upland loads....limit 3 boxes/customer/day.

[Soonerjeepman]

DD, c'mon man really? Honestly you place NO BLAME on the fed gov and this administration for anything. The fed gov have bought BILLIONS of rounds...and that has no effect. Right. I do feel for your scouts, that is the biggest thing at our camp. Boys love to shoot.

[diverdog]

DD, c'mon man really? Honestly you place NO BLAME on the fed gov and this administration for anything. The fed gov have bought BILLIONS of rounds...and that has no effect. Right. I do feel for your scouts, that is the biggest thing at our camp. Boys love to shoot.

Jeep the government buys billions of rounds each year. When both wars were cranking at a very high level we did not have this problem. DHS has authorization to buy up to 1.2 billion rounds over a five year period. Their ammo budget barely increased over a million dollars over FYI 2012. So they are not buying tons more of ammo. Your statement also does not account for the shortage in reloading components and most other ammo shortages. So the theory that this is being driven by government ammo purchases is just bull chit. Paranoia is driving this...period.

Here is an article for you:

http://www.gunnuts.net/2013/03/14/the-ammo-shortage-is-not-a-conspiracy/

and another:

http://www.americanrifleman.org/m-blogentry.aspx?id=5059&cid=25

And:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/ssabullets.asp


I will admit that the political climate is part of this but a lot of it is hoarding and speculation. All a Democrat has to do is fart gun control and the gun nuts go ape chit. Obama has to be laughing his azz off because the hoarding of ammo and guns has killed the recreational shooting community. Our local shooting range is dead because no one can get ammo for target practice. Check that, they cannot get reasonably priced ammo for target practice. I paid $70 for 500 rounds of .22 LR to plink. That is awfully expensive ammo.

Finall total federal tax receipts on bullet sales (which are dedicated to funding state wildlife conservation efforts, courtesy of the 1937 Pittman-Robertson Act) jumped 47 percent from 2011 to 2012, to nearly $2 billion. ( the government does not pay this tax).

[diverdog]

A good article on why restrictive gun laws do not work:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/06/04/new-jersey-gun-laws-dont-curb-violence-in-camden/2113737/

[olevetonahill]

A good article on why restrictive gun laws do not work:

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/06/04/new-jersey-gun-laws-dont-curb-violence-in-camden/2113737/


This part gets me
"I wanted to shoot people because that's what I saw growing up," said Baker, 20, a Camden native who spent four years in jail after being involved in several shootings. "When I was younger, I would see my boys and cousins going into jail and when they got out, all the girls wanted them. So, I wanted to go to jail. I wanted to be like America's Most Wanted. I wanted my name to be known on the streets."


AFTER being involved in several shootings? He only did 4 years????? 4 ****ing years? are you shatting me? 4 ****ing years for several shootings?

Enforce the God Damn laws we already have before screaming we need more!

[olevetonahill]

And DD I will agree with you mostly on the reasons for scarcity of Ammo.It is a fear of the Govt.
But you have to admit its Not "Gun Nuts" its anyone who wants to shoot. Plus the fact The Feds. are really wanting to get as much ammo off the market as they can.

Oh and would you please define in your opinion what constitutes a Gun Nut.

[diverdog]

And DD I will agree with you mostly on the reasons for scarcity of Ammo.It is a fear of the Govt.
But you have to admit its Not "Gun Nuts" its anyone who wants to shoot. Plus the fact The Feds. are really wanting to get as much ammo off the market as they can.

Oh and would you please define in your opinion what constitutes a Gun Nut.

I am probably using the wrong term. It is the anti government militia/prepper type person who is hoarding ammo for a race war or zombie invasion or to fight the government. So stupid chit like that.

I am a gun nut and like to hunt and shoot. I have a personal protection weapon, lots of shotguns, and I usually have 2000 rounds of ammo...mostly skeet rounds and .22 cal shells.

[olevetonahill]

I am probably using the wrong term. It is the anti government militia/prepper type person who is hoarding ammo for a race war or zombie invasion or to fight the government. So stupid chit like that.

I am a gun nut and like to hunt and shoot. I have a personal protection weapon, lots of shotguns, and I usually have 2000 rounds of ammo...mostly skeet rounds and .22 cal shells.

Actually its Not JUST those, Its anyone who loves to shoot.
See I havnt hoarded ammo. Years ago I bot enough to last me quite awhile. Ive shot up most of just blastin my hill.

Im almost positive the main reasonS we are seeing a shortage now is those who Didnt stock up to have some on hand are seeing the Govt. buying More . Plus the fact we have the Bloombergs, the Brady campaign,Obama in office along with Holder. and we ALL know or at least should know by now that the Anti gunners have realized they will never get the weapons so they are going to go after the next best thing AMMO. with out Ammo a Gun is just an unwieldy club.

Most Gun owners are afraid of THIS Govt. at this Time. I dont much blame em . Obama and his crew give us very little to hope for as long as they are in Office. I see this shortage continuing until we get another Conservative In office

[diverdog]

Actually its Not JUST those, Its anyone who loves to shoot.
See I havnt hoarded ammo. Years ago I bot enough to last me quite awhile. Ive shot up most of just blastin my hill.

Im almost positive the main reasonS we are seeing a shortage now is those who Didnt stock up to have some on hand are seeing the Govt. buying More . Plus the fact we have the Bloombergs, the Brady campaign,Obama in office along with Holder. and we ALL know or at least should know by now that the Anti gunners have realized they will never get the weapons so they are going to go after the next best thing AMMO. with out Ammo a Gun is just an unwieldy club.

Most Gun owners are afraid of THIS Govt. at this Time. I dont much blame em . Obama and his crew give us very little to hope for as long as they are in Office. I see this shortage continuing until we get another Conservative In office

Vet:

The facts do not bare out that the government is causing this shortage. They are not buying 410 primers or green dot powder or brass casings. Why would they buy 22-250 rounds or 32/20 rounds? The shortage is across the board.

I do not agree with Obama gun bans. Even if they were enacted there would be 3800 different guns available for sale. A lot of this is irrational fear. It is no different than the left saying the Keystone pipeline will destroy the planet.

People need to calm down and act rationally. The real threats to gun owners are a lack of places to shoot, limited hunting areas and an increasing cost for ammo. The number of gun owners and hunters is decreasing and I think that is sad.

Thank you for being civil. I love shooting and I am awfully discouraged. The ammo shortage really blindsided me.

[sappstuf]

Jeep the government buys billions of rounds each year. When both wars were cranking at a very high level we did not have this problem. DHS has authorization to buy up to 1.2 billion rounds over a five year period. Their ammo budget barely increased over a million dollars over FYI 2012. So they are not buying tons more of ammo. Your statement also does not account for the shortage in reloading components and most other ammo shortages. So the theory that this is being driven by government ammo purchases is just bull chit. Paranoia is driving this...period.

Here is an article for you:

http://www.gunnuts.net/2013/03/14/the-ammo-shortage-is-not-a-conspiracy/

and another:

http://www.americanrifleman.org/m-blogentry.aspx?id=5059&cid=25

And:

http://www.snopes.com/politics/guns/ssabullets.asp


I will admit that the political climate is part of this but a lot of it is hoarding and speculation. All a Democrat has to do is fart gun control and the gun nuts go ape chit. Obama has to be laughing his azz off because the hoarding of ammo and guns has killed the recreational shooting community. Our local shooting range is dead because no one can get ammo for target practice. Check that, they cannot get reasonably priced ammo for target practice. I paid $70 for 500 rounds of .22 LR to plink. That is awfully expensive ammo.

Finall total federal tax receipts on bullet sales (which are dedicated to funding state wildlife conservation efforts, courtesy of the 1937 Pittman-Robertson Act) jumped 47 percent from 2011 to 2012, to nearly $2 billion. ( the government does not pay this tax).

He should certainly be happy. It is the only segment of the economy he has actually improved in 4+ years....

[diverdog]

He should certainly be happy. It is the only segment of the economy he has actually improved in 4+ years....

Sadly you are probably right.

[olevetonahill]

Vet:

The facts do not bare out that the government is causing this shortage. They are not buying 410 primers or green dot powder or brass casings. Why would they buy 22-250 rounds or 32/20 rounds? The shortage is across the board.

I do not agree with Obama gun bans. Even if they were enacted there would be 3800 different guns available for sale. A lot of this is irrational fear. It is no different than the left saying the Keystone pipeline will destroy the planet.

People need to calm down and act rationally. The real threats to gun owners are a lack of places to shoot, limited hunting areas and an increasing cost for ammo. The number of gun owners and hunters is decreasing and I think that is sad.

Thank you for being civil. I love shooting and I am awfully discouraged. The ammo shortage really blindsided me.

Read My post again bro. The GOVT> IS causing this By all the fear they are instilling in the Gun owner population. Plus whether you believe it or They are buying more than usual also driving up prices.

Like I said this Fear (Rational or not) will not go away until Obama and Holder are gone and we get some one in there who respect our rights,

[Curly Bill]

Read My post again bro. The GOVT> IS causing this By all the fear they are instilling in the Gun owner population. Plus whether you believe it or They are buying more than usual also driving up prices.

Like I said this Fear (Rational or not) will not go away until Obama and Holder are gone and we get some one in there who respect our rights,


What this old fart said ^^^^^^!

[olevetonahill]

What this old fart said ^^^^^^!

Heh, Wait, WHAT? :pirate:

[rock on sooner]

This part gets me


AFTER being involved in several shootings? He only did 4 years????? 4 ****ing years? are you shatting me? 4 ****ing years for several shootings?

Enforce the God Damn laws we already have before screaming we need more!

Ya need to change the laws about juvenile offenders...he started at 13, busted
for the hard crimes at, looks like 15, out at 19 and back on the crime beat. His
adult influences and neighborhood surroundings...this kid had no chance, surprised
that he's alive to be interviewed....but, I agree, find a way to enforce what is on
the books and make em stick.

[olevetonahill]

Ya need to change the laws about juvenile offenders...he started at 13, busted
for the hard crimes at, looks like 15, out at 19 and back on the crime beat. His
adult influences and neighborhood surroundings...this kid had no chance, surprised
that he's alive to be interviewed....but, I agree, find a way to enforce what is on
the books and make em stick.

Bro in todays courts they are Trying Kids as young as 10 or 12 as an ADULT. I'd say after the 1st one Ya quit *****footin around with tha Lil Thug and lock his azs up
And yes he DID have a chance, He chose to go the thug route because it would get him laid.

[rock on sooner]

Bro in todays courts they are Trying Kids as young as 10 or 12 as an ADULT. I'd say after the 1st one Ya quit *****footin around with tha Lil Thug and lock his azs up
And yes he DID have a chance, He chose to go the thug route because it would get him laid.

Yup, yer right...'cept that's all he knew, because of his
environment. And, I think the one strike dealio is a good
idea. It'd take time, but would prolly clean up said environment.

[Soonerjeepman]

at least on dem...the one and only Harry Reid, secured 60 MILLION to build a really cool shooting range near Vegas.

DD, I agree, it is paranoia, but it's fueled by Obama and the left's crazy talk of gun laws and ammo restriction. Like Vet said, if ya can't get the guns for the ammo.

I know you shoot, we've discussed before. The whole point of THIS thread was to show that Kerry...and the admin are going against what congress who represents US wants to do with the UN.

[Midtowner]

at least on dem...the one and only Harry Reid, secured 60 MILLION to build a really cool shooting range near Vegas.

DD, I agree, it is paranoia, but it's fueled by Obama and the left's crazy talk of gun laws and ammo restriction. Like Vet said, if ya can't get the guns for the ammo.

I know you shoot, we've discussed before. The whole point of THIS thread was to show that Kerry...and the admin are going against what congress who represents US wants to do with the UN.

Crazy talk about things like background checks and limits for magazines. Oh TEH HORRORS!

[olevetonahill]

Crazy talk about things like background checks and limits for magazines. Oh TEH HORRORS!

WE already have Background checks, Why do we need more? What size magazines would you allow?

[Harry Beanbag]

The ammo shortage really blindsided me.

It shouldn't have. It was the same way four years ago. I'm not actively looking for ammo right now, I have enough for now, just not shooting much these days. I was at Walmart the other day getting a fishing license and just happened to notice they had a few boxes of .45 on the shelf so I took one as an impulse buy.

The way I look at it, people should be allowed to buy what they want, irrationally or otherwise. Your anecdotal evidence of 50,000 round hoarders aside, who cares? You have just as good a chance of buying it as they do, maybe they just work harder at it.

Call me a conspiracy theorist, but I don't really believe the supply and demand is causing the shortage any more than I believe the price of a barrel of oil or supply and demand is still causing high gas prices though.

[Harry Beanbag]

WE already have Background checks, Why do we need more? What size magazines would you allow?

Stop feeding the trolls!

[olevetonahill]

Stop feeding the trolls!

matlock a Troll? Color me shocked. I thot he was just a retard

[Midtowner]

WE already have Background checks, Why do we need more?

The better question is why not?

[olevetonahill]

The better question is why not?

No Dumas the Better question is Why dont you ever ANSWER a question? How would you Change the background checks? How many rounds would you be willing to allow in a Magazine? IF you had the power /Authority to regulate /change things?

[Midtowner]

If I had the power and authority to change things, I'd make the background checks very simple and required for ALL transfers of firearms including private sales. I'd require that all sales be performed by licensed individuals or through licensed brokers who would charge a small statutory fee, kind of like tag agents. I'd require 100% registration of all guns. I'd make it a felony to be a party to a transaction involving a firearm where no background check occurs. I'd make the background check instant and online and check for criminal status, mental health status, etc., and I'd make the check as inexpensive as possible, but expensive enough to fund the entire background check system.

--and the magazine thing was a dumb idea from the get go.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

And I'd make people get a background check before they spoke in public voicing issues of personal concern, attended church, read a newspaper, contributed to the press, received a trial from a jury composed of their peers, assembled publicly, petitioned the government, before their property and belongings were legally searched and/or seized, protected from double jeopardy and self-incrimination, and your right to due process and to confront one's accuser.

Background check it!

The other stuff will just have to slide.

[diverdog]

It shouldn't have. It was the same way four years ago. I'm not actively looking for ammo right now, I have enough for now, just not shooting much these days. I was at Walmart the other day getting a fishing license and just happened to notice they had a few boxes of .45 on the shelf so I took one as an impulse buy.

The way I look at it, people should be allowed to buy what they want, irrationally or otherwise. Your anecdotal evidence of 50,000 round hoarders aside, who cares? You have just as good a chance of buying it as they do, maybe they just work harder at it.

Call me a conspiracy theorist, but I don't really believe the supply and demand is causing the shortage any more than I believe the price of a barrel of oil or supply and demand is still causing high gas prices though.

The issue is there is very elasticity on the supply side and unlimited elasticity on the demand side. Not a good scenario.

Don't get me wrong I do not care how much ammo someone buys. The issue is when a fraction of the gun owning population hoards ammo they are killing sport shooting. The less people who shoot the less who care about the 2nd amendment.

I reload so I really did not notice the supply issue until I ran out of powder.

[diverdog]

at least on dem...the one and only Harry Reid, secured 60 MILLION to build a really cool shooting range near Vegas.

DD, I agree, it is paranoia, but it's fueled by Obama and the left's crazy talk of gun laws and ammo restriction. Like Vet said, if ya can't get the guns for the ammo.

I know you shoot, we've discussed before. The whole point of THIS thread was to show that Kerry...and the admin are going against what congress who represents US wants to do with the UN.

I do not worry about the UN. They are completely inept. **** em.

[sappstuf]

If I had the power and authority to change things, I'd make the background checks very simple and required for ALL transfers of firearms including private sales. I'd require that all sales be performed by licensed individuals or through licensed brokers who would charge a small statutory fee, kind of like tag agents. I'd require 100% registration of all guns. I'd make it a felony to be a party to a transaction involving a firearm where no background check occurs. I'd make the background check instant and online and check for criminal status, mental health status, etc., and I'd make the check as inexpensive as possible, but expensive enough to fund the entire background check system.

--and the magazine thing was a dumb idea from the get go.

And the criminals still wouldn't care....

[KABOOKIE]

And I'd make people get a background check before they spoke in public voicing issues of personal concern, attended church, read a newspaper, contributed to the press, received a trial from a jury composed of their peers, assembled publicly, petitioned the government, before their property and belongings were legally searched and/or seized, protected from double jeopardy and self-incrimination, and your right to due process and to confront one's accuser.

Background check it!

The other stuff will just have to slide.

Heh. Every time mid post he would have to be background checked, on his own dime of course. Sure it's just a small statutory fee of $375 (you know like the tag agency, wink wink, no gov't overreach into the cookie jar there)! Mid you owe the government $2625 in this thread alone! Don't worry mid, you can take a number at the Department of Guns and Ammo. I hear there's only a 3 hour wait.

[olevetonahill]

Crazy talk about things like background checks and
limits for magazines. Oh TEH HORRORS!


If I had the power and authority to change things, I'd make the background checks very simple and required for ALL transfers of firearms including private sales. I'd require that all sales be performed by licensed individuals or through licensed brokers who would charge a small statutory fee, kind of like tag agents. I'd require 100% registration of all guns. I'd make it a felony to be a party to a transaction involving a firearm where no background check occurs. I'd make the background check instant and online and check for criminal status, mental health status, etc., and I'd make the check as inexpensive as possible, but expensive enough to fund the entire background check system.

--
and the magazine thing was a dumb idea from the get go.


So your sayin you initially were in favor of a bad Idea? you are confusing

[MR2-Sooner86]

Crazy talk about things like background checks and limits for magazines. Oh TEH HORRORS!

"Waiting periods are only a step. Registration is only a step. The prohibition of private firearms is the goal." - Janet Reno - Clinton Administration Attorney General

"We're going to hammer guns on the anvil of relentless legislative strategy! We're going to beat guns into submission!" - Charles Schumer (b. 1950) - quoted on NBC, December 8, 1993

"I think you have to do it a step at a time and I think that is what the NRA is most concerned about, is that it will happen one very small step at a time, so that by the time people have "woken up" -- quote -- to what's happened, it's gone farther than what they feel the consensus of American citizens would be. But it does have to go one step at a time and the beginning of the banning of semi-assault military weapons, that are military weapons, not "household" weapons, is the first step." Barbara Fass - Stockton, CA Mayor - ABC News Special, Peter Jennings: Guns - 1991-04-11

"We're going to have to take one step at a time, and the first step is necessarily -- given the political realities -- going to be very modest. Of course, it's true that politicians will then go home and say, "This is a great law. The problem is solved." And it's also true that such statements will tend to defuse the gun-control issue for a time. So then we'll have to strengthen that law, and then again to strengthen the next law, and maybe again and again. Right now, though, we'd be satisfied not with a half a loaf but with a slice. Our ultimate goal -- total control of handguns in the United States -- is going to take time. My estimate is from seven to ten years. The problem is to slow down the increasing number of handguns sold in this country. The second problem is to get them all registered. And the final problem is to make the possession of *all* handguns and *all* handgun ammunition -- except for the military, policemen, licensed security guards, licensed sporting clubs, and licensed gun collectors -- totally illegal." - Nelson T. "Pete" Shields - "A Reporter At Large: Handguns", New Yorker, at 53, 58 - Chairman, Handgun Control, Inc. - 1976-07-26

"Gun violence won't be cured by one set of laws. It will require years of partial measures that will gradually tighten the requirements for gun ownership, and incrementally change expectations about the firepower that should be available to ordinary citizens." - New York Times - 1993-12-21

"A system of licensing and registration is the perfect device to deny gun ownership to the bourgeoisie." - Lenin (1870-1924) - "The Beginning of the Revolution in Russia"

"All we ask for is registration, just like we do for cars." - Charles Schumer - has sworn an oath to defend the U.S. Constitution

"I stand in support of this common sense legislation to license everyone who wishes to purchase a gun. I also believe that every new handgun sale or or transfer should be listed in a national registry, such as Chuck [Senator Schumer] is proposing." - Hillary Clinton - 2000

"All political power comes from the barrel of a gun. The communist party must command all the guns, that way, no guns can ever be used to command the party." - Mao Tse Tung - Problems of War and Strategy, Nov 6 1938

"The thought that average citizens will somehow be better able to successfully defend themselves more effectively than our nation's trained professionals is absurd." - Handgun Control, Inc. - Official statement from Handgun Control, Inc.

"My view of guns is simple. I hate guns and I cannot imagine why anyone would want to own one. If I had my way, guns for sport would be registered, and all other guns would be banned." - Deborah Prothrow-Stith (Dean of Harvard School of Public Health)

"We're bending the law as far as we can to ban an entirely new class of guns." - Rahm Emmanuel

"I don't believe anybody has a right to own any kind of a firearm. I believe in order to obtain a permit to own a firearm, that person should undergo an exhaustive criminal background check. In addition, an applicant should give up his right to privacy and submit his medical records for review to see if the person has ever had a problem with alcohol, drugs or mental illness... The Constitution doesn't count!" - John Silber - Speech before the Quequechan Club, MA., 8/16/1990

"Banning guns addresses a fundamental right of all Americans to feel safe." - Diane Feinstein (b. 1933) - Gun owner with concealed carry permit

"I don't care about crime, I just want to get the guns." - Howard Metzenbaum (1917-2008)

"I am one who believes that as a first step the U.S. should move expeditiously to disarm the civilian population, other than police and security officers, of all handguns, pistols and revolvers ...no one should have a right to anonymous ownership or use of a gun." - Dean Morris - Director, Law Enforcement Assistance Administration - Testimony to Congress

"One man with a gun can control 100 without one." - Lenin (1870-1924)

"There are some weapons that are just so dangerous that society has a right and the obligation even to take those weapons out of circulation." - Jim Florio

"There is little sense in gun registration. What we need to significantly enhance public safety is domestic disarmament . . . . Domestic disarmament entails the removal of arms from private hands . . . . Given the proper political support by the people who oppose the pro-gun lobby, legislation to remove the guns from private hands, acts like the legislation drafted by Senator John Chafee [to ban handguns], can be passed in short order." - signed by Henry Cisneros and Kurt Schmoke - Communitarian Network's The Case for Domestic Disarmament - HC is the Former Secretary of HUD, KS was Baltimore Mayor

"I do not believe in people owning guns. Guns should be owned only by the police and military. I am going to do everything I can to disarm this state." - Michael Dukakis

"If I could have gotten 51 votes in the Senate of the United States for an outright ban, picking up every one of them...'Mr. and Mrs. America, turn 'em all in,' I would have done it." - Diane Feinstein - 60 Minutes episode

"Why should America adopt a policy of near-zero tolerance for private gun ownership? Because it's the only alternative to the present insanity. Without both strict limits on access to new weapons and aggressive efforts to reduce the supply of existing weapons, no one can be safer. ... [W]ho can still argue compellingly that Americans can be trusted to handle guns safely? We think the time has come for America to tell the truth about guns. They are not for us. We cannot handle them." - Editorial, Taming The Monster: Get Rid of the Guns, Los Angeles Times, B6 - 1993-12-28

"Germans who wish to use firearms should join the SS or the SA - ordinary citizens don't need guns, as their having guns doesn't serve the State." - Heinrich Himmler (1900-1945)

"We protect aspirin bottles in this country better than we protect guns from accidents by children." - Gloria Estefan

"If I had my way, sporting guns would be strictly regulated, the rest would be confiscated." - Nancy Pelosi

"The national guard fulfills the the militia mentioned in the Second Amendment. Citizens no longer need to protect the states or themselves." - Dianne Feinstein - U.S. Senator (D-CA)

"We're here to tell the NRA their nightmare is true..." - Charles Schumer (b. 1950) - quoted on NBC, November 30, 1993

"I honestly think - and I am not an expert on the amendments - I think the only people in this nation who should be allowed to own guns are police officers. I don't care if you want to hunt, I don't care if you think it's your right. I say, 'Sorry. It is 1999, we have had enough as a nation. You are not allowed to own a gun and if you do own a gun, I think you should go to prison." - Rosie O'Donnell

"I want to make it as hard as possible. Gun owners would have to be evaluated by how they scored on written and firing tests, and have to pass the tests in order to own a gun. And I would tax the guns, bullets and the license itself very heavily." - Joycelyn Elders

"No, we're not looking at how to control criminals... we're talking about banning the AK-47 and semi-automatic guns." - Howard Metzenbaum

"I don't know why people carry guns. Guns kill people." - Michael Bloomberg - NYC Mayor

"Banning guns is an idea whose time has come." - Joseph Biden - quoted by AP - U.S. Senator - 1993-11-18

"Why are guns the only unregulated consumer products in America? We regulate toy guns and teddy bears, but we do not regulate a product that kills 4,600 children a year." - Marian Wright Edelman - Houston Chronicle, April 30, 1999

"What good does it do to ban some guns. All guns should be banned." - Howard Metzenbaum

"Any 18 year old can walk into a gun store, pawn shop or gun show and buy a handgun." - Al Gore - almost 30 years after the Gun Control Act of 1968 set the age to buy a handgun from a FFL at 21. - U.S. Vice President

"Repealing the Second Amendment is no cause for the faint-hearted, but it remains the only way for liberals to trigger an honest debate on the future of our bullet-plagued society. So what if anti-gun advocates have to devote the next 15 or 20 years to the struggle? The cause is worth the political pain. Failing to take bold action condemns all of us to spend our lives cringing in terror every time we hear a car backfire." Walter Shapiro - USA Today column - 1999-09-17

"The only way to discourage the gun culture is to remove the guns from the hands and shoulders of people who are not in the law enforcement business." - New York Times - 1975-09-24

"Nobody should be owning a gun which does not have a sporting purpose." - Janet Reno

"The goal of CSGV is the orderly elimination of most handguns and assault weapons from the United States. CSGV seeks to ban handguns and assault weapons from importation, manufacture, sale, transfer, ownership, posession and use by the general, American public. Reasonable exceptions would be made for the police, military, security officers, and gun clubs where the guns are secured on the club's premises. Gun dealers would also be permitted to trade in antique and collectable weapons kept and sold in inoperable condition. Hunting weapons, such as shotguns and rifles would un affected by these bans,as those weapons do not pose a large threat to the American public in comparason to handguns and assault weapons." - Coalition to Stop Gun Violence - Recruiting flyer

"If it was up to me, no one but law enforcement officers would own handguns..." - Richard Daley - Federal Gun Legislation Press Conference in Washington, D.C. - Chicago Mayor - 1998-11-13

"As you know, my position is we should ban all handguns, get rid of them, no manufacture, no sale, no importation, no transportation, no possession of a handgun." - John H. Chafee - U.S. Senator (R-RI)

"We have to start with a ban on the manufacturing and import of handguns. From there we register the guns which are currently owned, and follow that with additional bans and acquisitions of handguns and rifles with no sporting purpose." - Major Owens - Democrat Congressman

"If it were up to me we'd ban them all." - Mel Reynolds - Democrat Congressman - CNN's Crossfire, December 9, 1993

"We can't be so fixated on our desire to preserve the rights of ordinary Americans to legitimately own handguns and rifles...that we are unable to think about reality." - William Jefferson Clinton (or as I like to call him, "BJ BILL")

"Gun traffickers have found a new avenue for dealing guns to criminals, to the mentally ill, and the under-aged--the Internet. The firepower available on the Internet is chilling. Machine guns, assault weapons and cheaply made pistols are available in cyberspace for the taking. And they are available to those who could never buy a gun under the Brady law." - Charles Schumer - U.S. Senator - 1999-03-16

"...the NRA, which is an extremist organization...believe people should be allowed to have bazookas and tanks...(another statement during the same debate) "...the only people who use them [so-called assault weapons] are mass murderers..." - Charles Schumer - PBS debate with Bill McCollum - 1996

"You need the will to disarm the civilian population. If we can do it in Somalia, we can do it here." Mary McGrory - Liberal Journalist and Columnist - Arizona Daily Star, March 11, 1993 p. A16

"The semi-automatic weapons' menacing looks, coupled with the public's confusion over fully automatic machine guns versus semi-automatic assault weapons -- anything that looks like a machine gun is assumed to be a machine gun -- can only increase that chance of public support for restrictions on these weapons." - Josh Sugarman - 1988, Violence Policy Center

"Outside of the killings, Washington has one of the lowest crime rates in the country." - Mayor (and crackhead) Marion Barry, Washington, DC

"If it was up to me, no one but law enforcement officers would own hand guns..." Chicago Mayor Richard Daley, Federal Gun Legislation Press Conference in Washington, D.C., November 13, 1998.

"We recoil in horror and search for explanations, but we never face up to the obvious preventive measure: a ban on the handy killing machines that make crimes so easy." Josh Sugarmann, Executive Director of the Violence Policy Center, Seattle and Honolulu shootings more reasons to regulate guns, (1999).

"We must be able to arrest people before they commit crimes. By registering guns and knowing who has them we can do that. If they have guns they are pretty likely to commit a crime." -- Vermont State Senator Mary Ann Carlson

"Our main agenda is to have ALL guns banned. We must use whatever means possible. It doesn't matter if you have to distort facts or even lie. Our task of creating a socialist America can only succeed when those who would resist us have been totally disarmed." -- HCI President Sarah Brady to Senator Howard Metzenbaum, The National Educator, January 1994, p.3

"This administration has consistently favored the reinstitution of the [1994] Assault Weapons Ban. It is something that we think was useful in the past with regard to the reduction we've seen in crime, and certainly would have a positive impact on our relationship and the crime situation in Mexico." - Eric Holder - U.S. Attorney General - 2012-02-02 - Holder goes on to mention a current bill by Ms. Malloney that the administration feels is a good starting point for new gun legislation

“But the Second Amendment, the cornerstone of the NRA’s BS, is not relevant today. It was ratified in relation to state militias in 1791 and has no meaning in today’s world. The ‘right to keep and bear arms’ does not mean you can own a heat-seeking missile or a nuclear bomb, does it? . . . The redcoats are not coming. But the rednecks are. And when they say that the Second Amendment protects them from a ‘tyrannical’ federal government, they are more than delusional. The U.S. military is so big, Mitt Romney’s annual ‘income’ couldn’t buy lunch at the Pentagon, especially if Paul Ryan’s budget passes.” – John Watson, Wilkes-Barre (PA) Times Leader, Only thing to fear is NRA’s fear tactic itself

"Like flat earth fanatics, Second Amendment fanatics just don't get it. Facts are facts. The earth is not flat. And Constitutional law is Constitutional law. The Second Amendment is not absolute. It does not guarantee the mythical individual right to bear arms we will hear argued for today. The gun lobby and its friends in Congress can line up professors of history and law from here to NRA headquarters and back. They can all swear what they think the Second Amendment means, and how many angels can dance on a pinhead. But the settled law is flatly against them." - Charles Schumer - statement before the House Subcommittee on Crime - U.S. Representative (D-NY) - 1995-04-05

"I'm consistently on record and will continue to be on record as opposing concealed carry." - Barrack Obama - IL State Senator - 2004-04-27

"I think it's a scandal that this president (Bush) did not authorize a renewal of the assault weapons ban." - Barrack Obama - Illinois Senate Debate #3 - 2004-10-21

"I believe in keeping guns out of our inner cities and that our leaders must say so in the face of the gun manufacturers lobby." - Barrack Obama - The Audacity of Hope - Senator (D-IL) - 2006

"I just want you to know that we are working on it," [Sarah] Brady recalled the president telling them. "We have to go through a few processes, but under the radar." - Barrack Obama - meeting between Jay Carney, Jim Brady, Sarah Brady, and President Obama, quoted in the Washington Post, 2011-04-12

[Soonerjeepman]

I do not worry about the UN. They are completely inept. **** em.

until we have an admin that supports them and follows their guidelines...

[radio]

If I had the power and authority to change things, I'd make the background checks very simple and required for ALL transfers of firearms including private sales. I'd require that all sales be performed by licensed individuals or through licensed brokers who would charge a small statutory fee, kind of like tag agents. I'd require 100% registration of all guns. I'd make it a felony to be a party to a transaction involving a firearm where no background check occurs. I'd make the background check instant and online and check for criminal status, mental health status, etc., and I'd make the check as inexpensive as possible, but expensive enough to fund the entire background check system.

--and the magazine thing was a dumb idea from the get go.

Lawyers.... screwin up everything for everyone else, while making a new market to line pockets.

[cleller]

Whenever you talk about guns and crime, you hear all this crazy talk about what to do with the guns. Why can't we ever hear some crazy talk about what to do with the criminals?

You know, like hangings, floggings, people in stocks, etc?

[Midtowner]

What do you do with criminals? Rehabilitate the ones who can be helped and take the ones who can't be helped out of circulation permanently. The death penalty is too expensive.

[Tulsa_Fireman]

The death penalty is too expensive.

And why is that, oh wise one? Possibly the monkey humping of the process over the years?

I know I'll spring for a few bucks on my electric bill to fire up Ol' Sparky again so it damn sure isn't the cost of the actual act.